#succession asks

[pynkhues]

I read your meta about kendall's vulnerability/dishonesty. I'm so curious as to how he was able to remain vulnerable despite presumably being punished for it at every turn by Logan. why don't we see him with more closed-off defense mechanisms like Roman and Shiv?

Mmm, I don't know if I think that Kendall was punished for it at every turn by Logan?

He was punished, of course, the show makes no secret of that, but we also see Kendall being both rewarded for it and coddled over it - the immediate aftermath of Doddy's death being the most obvious example, of course, but I tend to believe that Logan's worry in 1.08 and his tenderness with Kendall in 2.04 is genuinely (albeit a loaded) love and care too.

One of the things that I love about the show is that I think it really understands that family violence is rarely uniform across members of said family, and in many ways I think that the juxtaposition between Roman's character as someone who can be honest without being vulnerable, and Kendall's as someone who can be vulnerable without being honest, is an embodiment of that. Their treatment by their father, the way they experienced both love and violence at the hands of him, is inherently different, just as it is with Shiv and Connor too, which is a major factor in why the four of them can never entirely come together. They're each experts in their own abuse, and while there's overlap and shared experiences, their personal relationships to their father are just that - personal - and I think that compounds and manifests in different ways.

In terms of Kendall, I do think a part of his vulnerability and emotional state is just him - a cocktail of genes, a bipolar-or-autism-or-both-or-adjacent-condition, being the groomed and favoured son, and a who-knows-how-many-nannies-raised upbringing. After all, on a scale of 1-10, he operates at 11 90% of the time, and the result of that is generally emotional spillage.

I do tend to think too though that there's a degree to which Kendall both consciously and unconsciously understands that his ability to be vulnerable gets him places. Kendall's manipulative! With everyone! And while I do think that his emotional state is usually honest (even if he's not being honest about why he's in that state), he's also pretty well-documented in using his state (or trying to use it) to get his way. Interestingly enough, I think Connor tends to share this with him, because he's absolutely emotionally manipulative too.

I think Roman and Shiv are in really different positions when it comes to being allowed that degree of vulnerability - Shiv's the only girl, which means for her any sort of vulnerability will see her diminished and written off, and I think Roman as the youngest son closing that part of himself off - as you put it so well! - is in some ways the same story. He has to differentiate himself from Connor and Kendall to gain any sort of traction with his father, but also being perceived as 'other' or 'having something wrong with him' because he's not sleeping with women, existing in these environments of being sent away and coming back, having a degree of adult 'freedom' that was never extended to Kendall until the last seasons of the show, indicate different relationships and yeah, again, I think their abuse probably manifested fairly differently a lot of the time.

It's an interesting area to think about!

[sigurdjarlson]

Can u imagine if Greg catches Tom indisputably checking out his ass and absolutely drags him for it

This ask immediately made me think of the interview where Matthew gets asked “if you could check any characters ass and use that to further the relationship who would it be?” And he says “Greg. Gotta be Greg. *mimes looking* hey Greg you been working out?”

Okay but I’m not sure if he’d call him on it right away because Tom would absolutely deny it.

Hehjdjd he bends over to pick something up he dropped but he can see Tom in the reflection of something and notices he is quite clearly staring

And he’s like ??? Is Tom checking out my ass? Holy shit? Is he seeing things or misinterpreting this? Or is he really just.. he proceeds to test this theory a hilarious amount of times?

Oh no I dropped my pencil owo let me just bend over and yep every time Tom is like 👀 somehow he doesn’t realize Greg is doing this on purpose yet

He literally looks like such a slut tho and their coworkers are watching this all unfold like a nature documentary on animal mating rituals

Oh no he needs to reach across the table to grab some hint and he’s like “subtly” doing shit like (pool players are wild)

It’s awful. It’s terrible. Tom is two seconds away from snapping and railing him. Greg is having the time of his life frustrating him.

He pulls something like this at the dinner table with the Roys one night and again Tom’s eyes are glued to his ass

Roman notices and starts laughing so hard he inhales his food and almost chokes to death. Kendall has to slap him on the back. Shiv somehow doesn’t notice her husband’s fixation. Willa is giggling uncontrollably. Connor doesn’t understand why. Logan calls Roman a slur

[alittledizzy]

Hi if you'd like feel free to yell about what's going on in the romangerri fandom. I am the dad looking in your room asking are you winning son meme

You are the best kind of friend. Really I'm just flailing incoherently because of how ridiculous and fond of each other and slightly horny both J and Kieran are when it comes to each other. I love how they put that specific mark into their characters on such a serious, depressing show too. Like... confirmed that Roman and Gerri came about because J and Kieran were just slightly hot for each other on set and it played well to the camera. The chemistry is ridiculous and hilarious and beautiful and seeing them interact irl in an absolutely uncensored way is a joy I didn't know I needed until I saw it unfold in real time.

[pynkhues]

I don't know if you still answer succession questions or what kind of questions to ask I'm new to Tumblr and to the succession fandom 😭 but i was wondering why do you think that logan took kendall to see the waiter's family ?

Hey! Welcome to both tumblr and the Succession fandom! How exciting!

I think for me Logan taking Kendall to Dodds' family house was two-fold. On the one hand, I think it was a means of pulling the leash - after all, Kendall's relationship with Naomi at that point in the story was not only offering him emotional support and connection outside of the family/Logan specifically, but was also seeing him regain a sense of autonomy that had been successfully snuffed out by the combination of Dodds' death, the trauma of the accident, and Logan exchanging his care and protection for Kendall bowing out of the bear hug.

Logan was only able to disarm Kendall as a result of what happened, and I think that was something he knew all too well - after all, we saw Logan's panic in 1.10 after the bearhug letter was delivered - and as a result, I think he believed that his control over Kendall had to be absolute in order to maintain his authority / power both professionally and personally.

On the other hand, I don't think it was all strategic. I think there was an emotional undercurrent to the choice on a few different levels. I do think Logan's always been the most possessive of Kendall and interestingly, Kendall's the only one we've ever seen Logan deliberately sever personal relationships with in not just Naomi but Jennifer too, and Logan's love is I think felt most accutely in possession.

Emotionally speaking though too, I think there was a childish kneejerk reaction to it as well. Logan's had to clean up Kendall's mess, and is about to have to go and deal with the uncomfortable, emotional, very public collateral damage of it all, and Kendall's talking about going to the zoo with his new girlfriend? Who happens to be the niece of one of your biggest professional and political rivals? Lowkey I'd be pissed too, haha. The way he handles it is cruel and punishing, but Logan can be cruel and punishing, and he often is reacting more emotionally than people can think.

So yeah, in that moment, I think it was both strategic and nakedly emotional.

What do you think?

[pynkhues]

So I started watching Succession somewhere between s2 n s3 and till yesterday, I was under the impression Rava Roy(?) is supposed to be of Indian descent (though why someone would name her after food idk) but then I saw some bts of s4 with the actress and I'm sure she's white or not idk 😂 Point is, can you tell if the kids are supposed to be adopted? (That's what was suggested in an article) like I'm so confused??? Are they biracial? Is her ethnicity ambiguous? I feel like maybe you might have the answer for me 😅

It's never explicitly stated, anon, but I'm pretty sure Rava is supposed to be Jewish.

Natalie Gold, the actress who plays her, is Jewish herself, and the name Rava actually has Hebrew origins dating back to around the year 300CE. Interestingly enough, it's actually traditionally a boy's name in Hebrew meaning a father, which feels pretty deliberate given the nature of the show. I think too that her being Jewish makes sense given the tension between her and Logan, and Kendall's hyper-sensitivity to Logan's anti-semitism, most notably in 3.04 which happened pretty quickly timeline-wise after Kendall retreated to (and took over) Rava's apartment when he didn't have anywhere else to go.

In that sense, I do think we're supposed to understand that Sophie is adopted, yes. I've talked about it on here before, but I tend to think that Iverson is biological, and it's that, plus him being a boy and white, that causes Logan to simultaneously dote on, weaponise and abuse Iverson more directly and visibly on screen than he does Sophie. As far as Logan's concerned, Iverson is the only heir beyond his children, and it's pretty clear that he's been found wanting. What that means for Sophie who is, of course, just as much Kendall and Rava's child, is open to speculation, but I think the show is deliberate in the way it focuses on Iverson and forces Sophie aside.

[pynkhues]

this is a bit out of the blue, but do you think that logan having nicknames for shiv (pinky) and roman (romulus) but not for connor and kendall holds any significance? as in, they're the little ones who were never taken into consideration for the top job, but also there's an inherent tenderness to it, and connor and kendall don't have that

Yeah, I do think there's something to it. It kinda makes me think of the expression 'the heir, the spare, and then one for mum,' which I think checks out both with the nicknames and Logan's treatment of Shiv and Roman, but also the distinction in Caroline's relationship with Kendall versus Roman and Shiv (especially when you consider that Kendall's the only one who straddles the line of being both the heir and the spare).

I'm kind of perpetually fascinated too by how different the nicknames are and the fact that in many ways, they're double-edged. Both are affectionate and doting on the one side, but on the other, Pinky is, of course, infantilising and gendered, and Romulus can certainly be read as patronising - provoking Roman's complex relationship with his own masculinity with the comparison to the founder of the Roman Empire, while also baiting out the competitiveness between Roman and Kendall - after all, Romulus only ascended after he killed his brother.

Letting Connor and Kendall's names stand alone like his own does feel in that sense like a part of his particular grooming of them as the first potential heirs, but it's also interesting in the context of Connor being so far removed from any sort of ascension and still failing to cross into that particular form of affection. I don't know if that indicates emotional distance necessarily (at least not any more distance than is typical of Logan with the kids), especially as the last season made it seem like Logan shared a lot more with Connor of his own vulnerabilities and plans for his death than he did with the other three.

Then again, that's often something more common with eldest children in general, and Logan has less of a vested interest in appearing immortal to Connor as Connor's not a threat to him professionally.

This has veered off course, haha, but yeah! I think you're right that the nicknames have significance in the sense of how Logan felt about the kids and what he'd planned for them, at least when they were young enough for nicknames to stick.

[pynkhues]

I saw someone mention the Golden Trio’s “pedigree breeding” made them less close to Logan as a result since they were held to a higher standard then Connor

And like, thinking of it that way, that the way Logan treats the Trio as tho they are supposed to be “show dogs” with certain exceptions of the “breed” like look, temperament, intelligence, trainable, etc and how they all fail to measure up or perform to expectations despite the harsh training he gives them

vs Connor, who is a “mutt” and therefore he’s just a “pet” and he can do things like chew on the furniture and Logan just rolls his eyes and shoos him to the backyard rather then actually disciplining him

And so the Trio (and sometimes Connor) sees the attention they get from Logan means they are more important, but they live in the kennels and Connor gets to live in the house. The Trio goes to dog shows with Logan to be paraded around and judged and Connor gets left home with a dog sitter coming by 2x a day to feed him, but when Logan is around Connor can hang out on the couch with him.

(Except, you know, they are people and it’s all fucked up lol)

That's a really interesting theory. It actually reminds me a bit of my aunt and uncle who live in a worker's cottage on somebody else's farm. There are quite a lot of working dogs on the property - Australian Shepherds and Border Collies and Jack Russells (Jack Russells are snake hunters, which is something I didn't know until my aunt and uncle moved to this place), and its a similar thing there with the showdogs you're talking about. The family has a Labrador, which is the dog and is allowed inside, while all the working dogs are really basically staff.

It's been a really interesting thing for my aunt to observe, especially as she's gotten very close with one of the older Australian Shepherds, because while these dogs guard the cattle at night from snakes and dingoes, it doesn't always work out. One of the dogs was killed by a dingo a few months ago, another chased a cow onto the road and was hit by a car, and the family feels this, but there is a degree of separation. An understanding that these dogs are loved and cared for, but they're not family.

It makes for an interesting point of consideration, because we know that Noah and his wife had cattle themselves, and I don't think it's a stretch to imagine that they had working dogs. What that means for how Logan was raised is anyone's guess, but I think it's an interesting thing to consider in his domestic sphere. There's this sense of Roman growing up with a hard, distorted parody of a family - not a mother and a father and a family dog, but an aunt and an uncle with perhaps a working dog. No love that isn't conditional, an enforced sort of distance, a 'yes, but' to what should be the most fundamental of relationships. Not a mother, but, not a father, but, not a dog, but.

With the way this show treats people like dogs too - - yeah. I think there's something there.

[sigurdjarlson]

Tom could learn about his gay dad and rib him so hard that it makes him break down. That's like the only subject that I've seen that seems to be sore for him

Ooooooh yes. Especially if we’re going with the assumption he’s into Tom and so this makes the fact it’s Tom making fun of him for all this even worse for him.

And it’s a combination of so many things. Being in the closet in the worst environment ever, wanting a married man (is he becoming his father he wonders?), Tom making fun of him for something that so deeply damaged him (and his mother) and just everything that’s happened since he showed up on Logan’s bday

And Tom doesn’t notice at first that Greg is reacting differently to this line of teasing. He’s getting increasingly more tense, there’s genuine anger on his face, he’s balling his hand up into a fist like he kind of really wants to take a swing at him (he doesn’t)

It’s just too far. It’s too much. His eyes are watering before he knows what to do with himself and he can’t even remember the last time he last cried honestly? But he’s walking away from Tom before he they can fall because he’s not only furious but so very hurt by this.

And Greg doesn’t usually respond in extremes to his teasing? There’s been a few times he gets snippy or sulky but they usually bounce back quickly enough. He’s never turned around and slammed the door in his face though. Greg doesn’t even look at him when he calls for him to get his ass back there.

And Tom is starting to realize he may have crossed a line. (No shit Sherlock) and on second thought maybe it wasn’t particularly cool of him to rag on him about his gay deadbeat dad. :(

He’s realizing it’s clearly a very sore subject for him.

And maybe..he should go fix this. So, he heads to Greg’s office, expecting Greg to be a bit pissy with him or giving him some kind of bratty silent treatment.

He doesn’t expect Greg to have his face in his hands when he opens the door and he definitely doesn’t expect his shoulders to shake while he lets out a sound that is undeniably a sob.

“Oh, Greg.” And then Greg is glaring at him, cheeks wet with tears and telling him to get the fuck out. Fuck you, fuck off, I don’t need your shit right now Tom.

He’s lashing out like a wounded animal trying to protect themselves while at their most vulnerable and Tom is panicking a little because he’s terrified he’s broken something between them that can’t be fixed. He’s panicking because he’s realizing with no small amount of horror he’s never seen Greg cry.

He’s seen Greg panic, get angry, get solemn and sad but never cry.

He didn’t cry during Boar in the Floor, when he thought he was going to prison, or when his grandfather disinherited him..

But he’s crying now.

Because of Tom

And he feels like a fucking monster. “Buddy I didn’t..”

He isn’t sure what to do so he marches over and hugs him. Greg is a big guy but he’s not particularly strong not when compared to atom so his attempts to wiggle out his sudden embrace are pathetic at best.

Or maybe he thinks as Greg finally just slumps against him, Greg doesn’t actually want to fight it at all.

“I’m sorry.” He just keeps repeating it and Greg lets out the saddest little sob against his neck, clinging to him now like a lifeline. “I didn’t- that..that was too far. I’m so fucking sorry, Sporus.”

That line always perks Greg up at least but now it just makes him cry harder and he’s kind of tearing up himself because he’s never fucking seen Greg cry and he knows one thing. He never wants to see Greg cry ever again.

It should probably scare him the things he’d do to make sure he doesn’t ever hear these broken little sobs against his shoulder as he trembles against him again.

Some sick part does enjoy how Greg is clinging to him though, it’s telling him despite whatever damage he’s done Greg still needs him. Greg isn’t going to toss him aside because he needs him. It’s reassuring. That even when he’s the one inflicting the pain Greg also relies on him to relieve it.

And god knows what’s coming of his mouth as he’s trying to soothe him. Probably things he shouldn’t say but he doesn’t really fucking care because Greg is starting to calm down.

They have a heart to heart later that night when Tom invites himself over Greg’s place to properly apology. Greg telling him things, about his childhood, about himself, and the fact that even after what happened earlier he’s trusting Tom with this knowledge feels like a gift to Tom.

But there is this faint hint of desperation, the way he looks at him almost imploringly, as if silently asking ‘Please don’t use this against me. I’m trusting you.’

Tom can be a terrible prick but he gets the message loud and clear.

Roman makes a crack about Greg’s gay dad one day and Tom all but chases Roman out of the room with his viciously goes after him for it. And the look of gratitude on Greg’s face makes it 100% worth the weird looks he’s getting from everyone else.