#tenor talks

[infernaltenor]

one more niki analysis.

for now.

ok this one technically i've had in mind for MONTHS but couldn't figure out how to word it until just now because i a) read hot limit about three months ago and it hasn't left my head since b) the idol exploration event.

anyway. the actual crux of this is: niki's character is specifically written to be content, not happy. these often get confused imo. the second part of this is his contentedness isn't natural, it's forced. the third part of this is no one fucking notices, except for one rinne amagi, because of course he does. by no one, i'm talking specifically character-wise here; niki in game tends to get written off as childish or otherwise doing well, and that comes directly from his other unit members.

side note: i'm fairly confident in my own reading of "niki will pretend to not be bothered by anything, ever" and this is bolstered by a few different things; a) the honeycomb summer lyrics in my last post where there's a part of the intro, "hidden the true feelings out of habit / and now you're regretting it" (rinne amagi you slick bastard) b) hot limit. like the entire story. mostly because he was being troubled by multiple different things throughout it (work, idol activities, and his family last name/father's scandal) and the only person who noticed was rinne, and that's probably because he knew the damn guy for five years c) also in hot limit, the exploration into niki seeing himself as a burden because of his illness. why did they add this into his character and then not elaborate further? i don't know. if it never gets elaboration, i'll implode. anyway, it's a part of his character that he usually doesn't show, but he references it as "not wanting to inconvenience the people around him" REGARDLESS of if the people in question don't mind him inconveniencing them (rinne). in general, the only thing he makes a fuss about is food, likely because of his metabolism and the fact that he does become more of a danger to people when extremely hungry (he has bitten hiiro before.); i.e. the inconvenience for everyone else is a 19-20yro trying to bite them, not complaining that he's hungry.

i digress.

niki has referenced himself as being content with certain things before. for instance, in hot limit, it's phrased distinctly as "just getting to eat every day is a bliss to me - i need to be satisfied with that", which comes up again in his letter from the idol exploration:

"it feels like happiness is there to fill my stomach, too!" oh, is it? is it niki? is it now?

basically, what i'm getting at is niki's expectations for life are so incredibly low, so he's satisfied with getting to eat every day. that's it. just satisfied. side note: this is why i went insane when survival was added to his profile; the way he lives/talks about living, he's been surviving more than living. this is also why i think rinne and niki work so well as a pair, rinne's into living and niki's busy surviving. though, to be fair, rinne and niki's relationship is built on this crux anyway. rinne intends (hopes, maybe? his goal?) is to help niki with what he has identified as a problem. thank you rinne amagi.

(for the record, right after i read this, my live reaction was "WHAT IF I KILLED MYSELF". that's quite dramatic, and i won't, but i figured someone might get a laugh out of that.)

this isn't the first time that rinne has referred to niki (well, more so implied) as "not happy", as it happens in hot limit, too.

"that's why i'll grant his wish and make him happy" oh ok i see.

anyway. niki's fascinating, because this forced contentedness vs happiness is so interesting to me, because beyond rinne's own read of niki, it's easily bought by everyone else he knows. most notably, kohaku and himeru, as their impressions come off of reading niki quite differently to rinne's:

(i grabbed these screenshots after i finished the event for the time being. rinne's i grabbed before LMAO)

both of them appreciate and even look up to niki in certain ways, and they both like his focus on food. but what's interesting is how both of them see him vastly different from rinne; where rinne focuses on his low self impression, himeru thinks niki's perspective of the world is interesting, as well as i think he gives credence to niki being selfless, which kohaku sees him as both childish and reckless. i'm pretty sure both himeru and kohaku see him as more naive than themselves, which is a fair read. this also does line up with what happens in hot limit; while rinne is aware of the troubles niki's going through, himeru and kohaku are both surprised at the end.

niki's own effort, i think, to convince himself of being satisfied and content pays off, because the only person who notices otherwise is rinne. which, imo, is a whole other source of depth to their relationship; rinne probably saw niki working that out. he was 14 when they met, and likely the shiina parents leaving was recent (side note: i'm a certified niki's parents hater. i know we don't have much info on them, but i don't trust them after that burden thing), which is something i've mostly extrapolated by the contact he seems to have at 14 vs at 19, where they're pretty much never mentioned. yes, i know, niki chose to stay in japan. i just don't think you get through your parents leaving you in your native country at 14 while they gallivant around the globe and your communication with them steadily dwindles results in anything good.

ok. i'm sorry for the parent hating.

but unless proven otherwise i'm expecting them to be the source of these problems.

[timelyquantums]

tribbie characterization and my own personal grievances

these are purely based off of what ive seen floating around, but i digress. its been super annoying to me to see the way her character gets misconstrued. first things first to establish, however, is that tribbie's character tropes combines a lot of strange concepts; she's both multiple entities and one entity, as well as being simultaneously older and younger than the whole cast (and also, in this case, i'm not going to debate the anime trope of "younger characters who are actually older," simply because that's not what this is here for), and so, in general, i think it's good to pin down.

my main points are, of course: tribbie, trianne, and triannon are simultaneously the same entity, while also being different entities and the question of pronouns; the question of tribios; and tribbie is the oldest chrysos heir, but her younger stature makes sense with the information given in amphoreus so far.

to start off with tribbie, trianne, and triannon; i've seen a lot of posts refer to them as sisters or triplets. this isn't necessarily correct to the actual aspect: for one, tribbie, trianne, and triannon typically refer to themselves as "us/we" when in first person. additionally, there is explicit evidence in the book (unlocked at the end of the first section of the quest) that they are part of the original larger whole of tribios, someone who was split into a lot more pieces than the three we know (this lines up with a quote from phainon, who states that "tribbie has given a lot up for amphoreus," albeit this is a paraphrased quote from my memory), meaning that, by all technicalities, the three are simply aspects of a larger soul. for this reason, i refuse to refer to them as sisters - primarily because they aren't. additionally, getting to the question of pronouns; there's no reason to maintain using they/them when talking about tribbie herself. the reason i state this is because the use of "us/we" from the three, when talking to one directly, they are completely fine with being referred to as she/her. additionally, as a factor that i feel is likely easily missed, occasionally tribbie herself (and this is specifially tribbie, as i have not seen this happen when trianne or triannon speak) will drop the "us/we" and refer to herself with the pronoun of "i". this is something im tying into my next point:

the closest to the original entity of tribios is tribbie. this seems like it should be a no brainer - tribbie's name is the closest to tribios, afterall, contrarily to trianne or triannon - and when combined with tribbie occasionally dropping an "i" instead of "us/we", it's something to keep in mind. additionally, shown in tribbies original drip, as well as one of her eidolons, trianne and triannon are showcased as plushies. not to mention that tribbie is shown preference in who is named for the actual playable character: why skip trianne and triannon in the name, if not for tribbie being the closest to the original person of tribios?

my last point is tribbie as the first chrysos heir. this isn't easy to miss in the slightest, in my opinion, (although i have seen people completely miss it on instagram), what with every other chrysos heir we've met so far not only showing deference to her, but referring to her as "teacher". bringing back to the point of phainon saying that "tribbie has given a lot up for amphoreus," and that we already know tribbie has janus' coreflame, it's likely the coreflame itself caused the split in the entity of tribios. i don't think it's impossible that the split also caused a regression, which is why tribbie's age is in such a weird area: she clearly has knowledge that transcends the rest of the chrysos heirs, but commonly is childish because she is, in her current state, a child. i cannot stress enough that this seems to have been used in a way to specifically showcase that of what she gave up. this leaves out the parts from the book that we know were lost prior to arriving at amphoreus, meaning that a lot of tribbie's character ends up being tied very specifically into the concept of "losing yourself."

"why write this post, tenor?" well you see, tribbie happens to have instantly become one of my favorite characters from the entire amphoreus quest, and seeing her characterization get missed has been incredibly annoying, so i guess the main goal was just to make a little short stop to understand the character better. another big reason for this is a personal grievance of my own: the parentification of the relationships tribbie has, either with characters she actually knows (mostly, i've seen it with mydei) or that of the (what i presume to be a joke, but it grates on me nonetheless) constant pairings with argenti due to their red hair. lore wise, i cannot stress enough how much i fucking hate this bit: tribbie is from amphoreus, a planet which you cannot find without a member of the garden of recollection - and thus if argenti shows up during amphoreus' plot at all i might actually throw something - meaning that there is literally no way for tribbie to even know argenti at all. speaking generally, taken as a legitimate headcanon of a parent and child, this does a disservice to both characters; not to mention that there is feasibly no way for them to interact at all. this is ignoring that she's likely older than every character currently in game (or, well, it's pointing towards that. amphoreus' timeline is confusing at best, which works in setting, but is super annoying when i have a headache), which makes me feel that parentifiying any relationship tribbie has with, quite frankly anyone, does a disservice to her character as a whole, especially because it ignores the complexities in her character and relationships with everyone else (i use tribbie here, but i'm talking about all three - trianne and triannon do have different personalities and seem to have slightly different relationships with the people of okhema and the chrysos heirs - but i digress), and ultimately even taking it as the joke its likely to be read as is downright insulting to her character as a whole.

[infernaltenor]

honeycomb summer and niki shiina

"didnt you say the last post was your last analysis" yeah, well, i lied.

hot limit is much less a story from niki and more a story about niki. this distinction will carry throughout this post, as i think it says not only a lot about niki himself, but also the relationship between niki and rinne, which i think is a vital part of both their characterizations.

i mean, oddly enough, niki doesn't even show up much in his own center event! this is because, of course, he's trying to juggle three different things (work/cooking opportunities, idol activities, and his family name), but it does show a decent amount into his characterization. namely, niki's reluctance to ask for help (rinne acts of his own accord in hot limit, not because he's prompted), his low self esteem, and the way his illness actually affects him in his day to day life. i think its worth it to note that his low self esteem is intertwined with his chronic illness, as he specifically references himself as a buden and having to be thankful he's lasted as long as he has. (side note: the new profile for niki having survival in his skills is both aggravating and justifying to me in equal measure. he would look at his 20 years of life and go "wild how i survived that huh!" and then move on.)

ultimately, though, i think the most important part of hot limit is niki and rinne. they're central to the narrative, but more than that, hot limit makes it clear what their relationship is. there's a heavy level of devotion in their relationship, but what's particularly interesting to me is rinne's perspective about niki. not only does rinne want to fundamentally "change fate", as he absolutely hates the perspective niki currently has, but he interestingly refuses to be clear about it, except for at the end of hot limit, when he outright states it to himeru and kohaku.

ive been sitting on this screenshot for months. they make me so ill.

anyway. that's not the point, my point is to talk about honeycomb summer, the song that came out with hot limit. because much in the way that hot limit is a story about niki, honeycomb summer is a song talking to niki.

there's two places in particular in the lyrics that standout as direct lines that are attempts from rinne to talk to niki. this is more than likely part of his campaign to "change fate".

niki fucking hates talking about his issues (see: hot limit) so the first part makes sense. basically, hes a master at deflecting. laugh, smile, move on, don't elaborate further. help him.

the second part is a bit more interesting, because it's both a typical crazy:b lyric and a typical rinne amagi-ism. but under the lens of honeycomb summer, and particularly the quote at the end of hot limit, this is a direct fucking plea to niki shiina. you can want more than just to survive. it's okay to be greedy.

[infernaltenor]

been losing my mind reading hsr posts online again so you get a jade analysis 👍

yes i KNOW evil woman. we're not going down that path rn. i know shes morally dubious and all shades of suspicious and works for the fucking ipc. i KNOW.

i'm here because i believe she has been misattributed like crazy.

a) the aventurine relationship. we already know this one. any good analysis on them will tell you clearly that aventurine made both the bet and the deal. what happens after is between two adults. (and yes, i'll give points that jade is a manipulative bastard, but so is aventurine. he works for the same fucking company. they do the same assignments.) anyway, i'm not really in the mood to rehash jade and aventurine's misinterpreted relationship beyond this: aventurine made the choice to make a deal with jade and start working for the ipc. in fact he wanted to meet with diamond, but didn't, which is a fascinating little tidbit. i digress. it's easy to say "jade manipulated aventurine into working as a stoneheart" but reanalyzing the scene will make it clear that she distinctly both didn't manipulate him (into that, anyway), and made a direct deal with his gamble. honestly, they both have similar strategies. hey, i wonder if this will come up later 🤔

b) the topaz relationship. i'm sorry, but there is absolutely no way jade singlehandedly made sure topaz didn't see any atrocities committed by the ipc in her entire life. are you fucking insane? topaz grew up on an ipc controlled planet, likely surrounded by ipc propaganda the whole time. along with this, topaz has nine other colleagues in the stonehearts (eight if you don't count jade) and more than likely hundreds or thousands of coworkers. this cannot fall solely on jade's shoulders as to why topaz doesn't fucking know the scope of the ipc. this falls onto "topaz grew up on a planet controlled by them, and more importantly, a planet surviving by the ipc." you can even contrast this with aventurine, who grew up on a planet with ipc agents; but unlike topaz, aventurine's planet had a vastly different result, including the massacre of his people. both of these are facts that have very little to do with jade. her having introduced and directly hired topaz and aventurine into the stonehearts is a different fucking issue, don't go confusing them. you will not survive the winter. i will kill you. ok. that wasn't necessary. i apologize.

c) so why is jade the way that she is? well, i'm delving into theory territory here but i have two main strands. one, all of the stonehearts have similar stories, something i cannot confirm without more of them, but i am of the opinion that all of them distinctly are "something that they don't want to be." two, i think i know who jade was before she was jade. ok let's get into this.

the stonehearts being "something that they don't want to be." well, this is obvious with aventurine, as he is actively working for the ipc. there's a lot to be attributed with his self destruct personality and tendency to gamble everything ever, but i'm really not an aventurine fan so i'm not here to overanalyze him. plus, i'm confident it's been said before (side note: if you're interested in a decent aventurine analysis that looks at misinformation, i found this one pretty good). topaz is another pretty obvious idea, seen as everyone is confident she doesn't know the scope of the ipc's atrocities. i cannot fact check this but i vaguely remember her introductory event, so i'll concede that point. topaz distinctly doesn't know what she's getting into, meaning that i'm characterizing her as "a good person, naive, hasn't had her world shattered" or something along those lines. and now you ask the question: but tenor, what about jade? she CAN'T be like that, haven't you seen her manipulate the shit out of people?

well. now i give you who i think jade WAS. in jade's character stories, there's a jewelry merchant from a failing system who goes to the bonajade exchange. interestingly, jade isn't mentioned at all in her first character story, as it focuses on the merchant. even stranger, the deal ends with the jewelry merchant being contractually obligated to work for the ipc, for life (this section ends with "give your everything to the ipc" <- paraphrased, but still). essentially, for the hope that her system will be saved, the merchant gives her everything. the second story is where jade shows up. i believe the original owner of the bonajade exchange would have been diamond. i also believe that jade didn't originally have the snake. as jade only shows up in her second character story, it's my opinion that jade is that jewelry merchant. her system is, incidentally, destroyed, as it hadn't survived, something that is also mentioned in her character stories. this wouldn't matter if it didn't have something to do with her. another trait that i feel doesn't line up with popular interpretations is, well, her lightcone. "yet hope is priceless," being the name and the image/description describes her (implied) common visits/donations to an orphanage. she is actively making sure the orphanage stays afloat. jade distinctly makes deals with adults and, more importantly, gives them directly what the owe, yet doesn't discourage them from making deals with her. i believe she doesn't expand this to children, especially not the ones she's fucking donating to the orphanage for. more so, jade's lightcone name, "yet hope is priceless," makes no fucking sense with her character, someone who typically puts a price on everything. the only way it makes sense is if she had hope at one point or another. if she was the jewelry merchant, bargaining to save her home (this also lines up, imo, with jade's heavy focus on jewelry motifs. i believe she has that because she used to sell it; which would also make sense why she has "a planet" as a bracelet, though i'm of the opinion that that's a metaphor).

ok so how does that connect with the first point. weeeeeeeell, if we're going off of "jade is the jewelry merchant, and the jewelry merchant made a deal to work for the ipc to save her home system," this is very distinctly a deal that didn't work. i do think that jade inherited the bonajade exchange and the snake from someone else. i also think that jade originally had hopes similar to say, aventurine or topaz, when she joined. jade, in my opinion, is a character who joined originally to help people ("yet hope is priceless"), yet lost herself in her work, culminating in the manipulative bastard we see now. i don't think this end point was where she wanted to be. given the fact that, if this is true, all three stonehearts we've seen in game occupy similar stories, i wouldn't be surprised if this pattern keeps up. it's literally the classic "live long enough to see yourself become the villain." topaz and aventurine get so victimized in analyses that people do not take the time to compare them with jade, and yet all three are more similar than people want to admit.

ok well, that was a lot of theory writing. to tell you the truth, i think this is way more interesting than simply writing jade off as "completely evil woman," which i'm not sorry about. she's an interesting character! it's just that she owns her employment to the ipc in a vastly different way to topaz and aventurine, meaning that she's easier to look at as distinctly evil. not to mention, her theming being very "snake in the garden of eden." but i digress. this was a lot more than what i intended to write LMAO if you read this far i'm kissing you on the mouth or whatever.

[infernaltenor]

hihi!! i'm unemployed over the summer, and will likely be opening commissions for the foreseeable future <3

options listed here are available; prices aren't set fully in stone for stuff like backgrounds and additional characters. payment is through paypal, and further questions can be sent through dms!

[infernaltenor]

the niki shiina analysis post i heavily procrastinated on, also known as "niki shiina is stupid on purpose"

"as opposed to stupid on accident?" yes.

this goes hand in hand with my other niki shiina analysis, otherwise known as niki "why in gods name would i think about my problems" shiina.

where is this particular opinion coming from? oh well. his parents. see, the thing is, he never mentions them. we know niki's parents are out of the country and have been for at least 5 years, as during hot limit, niki's already living on his own despite being 14. while theyre mentioned by eichi in the main story, its nothing else aside from that niki's father was knocked off the air by idols, resulting in them leaving. i just think its really interesting how niki deliberately doesn't bring them up. hell, he's not opposed to other people's problems, expressing concern for rinne in the main story and kohaku during the ss arc.

another aspect of this is the "casual putting of himself down" which kohaku noted enough to comment on. it's something i think factors into what niki hopes to have others perception of him be, mostly because its his own; that he's an idiot, especially considering his lower level of education from other characters in the game (not that it matters much in his unit, considering himeru is probably the only member who got close to finishing school), but he has a few weird lines where (imo) hes pushing the idea that hes an idiot, and not that he actually is one.

for instance, in both ss and hot limit, he makes references to how he "isnt paying attention" and has "no interest" when overcomplicated idol conversations come up, meaning that it has little to do with his actual comprehension of the situations and a lot more to do with his lack of interest. even more interesting to me is when in date plan, he says that he "wants" to only think about cooking, not his usual quote that he does only think about cooking. this makes me think that niki puts up a deliberate front of being an idiot, like hes pushing for being to be underestimated.

[infernaltenor]

lowkey best thing about the alex rider show has been the exploration of characters imo; giving tom and kyra such important roles is such fun to watch,,,,,

[infernaltenor]

maybe im just a super salty person bc its 5am and im Still not sleepingn and Still thinking about it but i cant help but feel that qtubbo fans are some of the most hypocritial people ive ever seen. this is like. full of generalizations and just observations ive made as a crow and im. typically defensive and salty so im gonna try to be objective but at the very least im not trying to neg on the characters or the ccs, since im directing this towards the fans. its also like a solid two months of build up .so. oops?

but uh. how to start explaining this. well for one im taking this as a recent fan who is a phil watcher pretty much only. but i tend to chronically read posts about other characters since when im into things i like to be informed on all cases (idk constant instinct i have lol). like i said im gonna focus on qtubbo here, if i go into qphil stuff its purely as a comparison point. i cant speak much on interactions with other fanbases since i simply am Not informed enough but yknow.

for one, i think both tubbo and phil ahve similar things when remembering lore that is Not their own. not a neg on either one, since i dont expect them to remember it, but both have forgotten major stuff recently, ie. fred's kidnapping (phil) and the birdhouse (tubbo). both things happened before purgatoryand the subsequent forgetting happened after so even in character it makes sense (they had more to worry about), but i also think reactions in character tends to fuck with audience perception. ie, tubbos very visceral reaction to the ill timed fred joke phil had made (and it was ill timed, and thats all that i feel was criminal about it. tubbo and phils friendship is very much based on banter and friendly barbs, lots of teasing from either side. phil simply shot back on a smilar level as tubbo had originally, making his joke about "phil and who?". other people have spoken on that so im not gonna rehash about whos comment was worse, since imo they were both just shy of being insensitive, had tubbo not been dealing with freds presumed death at the time. im not gonna talk about the funeral, becasue if i do i'll get mad.). likewise, when tubbo forgot birdhouse phils reaction was much less outwards. he just said a birdhouse wouldnt be slaying- given the imprisionment he had, it makes sense that phil would associate it negatively, especially since it catalzyed all of his future derealization episodes. both of these are simply ooc things imo, from their original standpoint. i dont think either is in the wrong for forgetting. but what annoys me is the fandom perception.

this is a problem im going to link back heavily to purgatory. im not sure if it was present beforehand, as i only really got into qsmp the last two-three weeks in october (bad timing) and had only really been watching vods in order to catch up. that being said, i think the bolas and soulfire rivalry had widened the gap between the fans, which in turn affects negative perception. later weeks in november had full bad faith interpretations of phil because he was critical of tubbos choices or simply didnt understand sunnys character perfectly. and there were. a lot of those. purgatory had happened just a few weeks prior, so i liken it to that. maybe it is just my expierence, but the phrasing of a lot of character crit and analysis between the two has wildly different interpretations of a character (to wildly different results)

you can get qphil fans explaining against a bad faith interpretaiton, and people will (and have) called them excuses to defend against character analysis. i have noticed, however, when qtubbo fans do the same thing (and they have) it seems to be more of a matter of adding context to the conversation. thats.... exactly what qphil fans are doing however? when talking critically about qtubbo not communicating with other parents and friends both his and sunny insecurities, its all that hes younger and in a bad mental state. but you have something about phil not understanding sunnys character perfectly, and hes a cruel stepmother and such; and when an explanation is added to why hes not a bad father nor a good father, just an imperfect one trying his best, its simply a "mindless defense against a crit of his character". are these not the same things? providing context to a percieved bad faith interpretation? idk. i cant tell if its the age or the percieved roles theyre supposed to take, but why is tubbo allowed to be imperfect and doused in outward angst, especially when interacting with other characters (ramon had to take the initiative to communicate with tubbo. and yet. age age age.) phils just as complex and imperfect and unwell. all of qsmp is unwell. it is an explanation, not an excuse.

anyway. i think i was thinking about this because of the flightless bird/ostrich dna joke. ill timed, just like the fred one. but phils reaction speaks volumes doesnt it? if its an age one maybe he'll overdramaticize, but he laughs it off mostly. theres a lot he laughs off. he doesnt. "if your kid wasnt here id kill you". tubbo doesnt know about phils failed flight. he probably wont for a while (i cant help but think qphil is embarassed. he was knocked unconcious from hitting the water too hard. and he knows how to fly? fuck, man). i think its wild, however, that one fred joke gets the entire fanbase ready to deface and mischaracterize the whole character. but one wing joke gets maybe shocked laughter and about two posts complaining? idk. maybe im just complaining about nothing, im tired as fuck.

tldr is that tubbo fans are so wildly hypocritical that they cant see when theyre doing the same thing as everyone else. im sure im being hypocritical in this post, its human. but its annoying as fuck when its everywhere, and i think purgatory made it worse.