If it's not too late, may I request an artistic rendition of Episode 62 where Mary and Gertrude are chatting/ verbally sparring? Just two old eldritch ladies shooting the shit over (rejected) tea 😅
Bro why're you even here if you won't have some tea as you spill it.
Re-listening to MAG62 - First Edition (the statement of Mary Keay regarding her 1st Leitner (yes, it's THAT book)), and I have a theory relating to TMAGP.
Spoilers for TMA and TMAGP S1 below
Ok, so in MAG62, Mary Keay is talking about Leitner, and basically, how she met him and his library before her statement going into the beginning of her statement. She mentions that Leitner's library burned down.
In TMAGP, there is the Protocol, which probably is why the Institute was burned down, and in MAGP19: Hard Reset, the case mentions how the Protocol should be enacted against Issac Newton and his expirments (which have to do woth the Fears). According to legend, Newton's works on Alchemy, Biblical prophecy, and the Apocalypse were destroyed when his dog (who was featured in a statement) knocked over a candle.
With that information, I think it supports the theory that Newton will have a role similar to Leitner and Smirke - classfying the Fears and experimenting with them. It's also possible that in TMA, Leitner's Library burned down because of the TMA!Protocol. Then again, it could have just been Gertrude.
oh lord this one was creepy. what psychopatic child sees a magic murder book and goes "is for me? 👉👈 🥺" no- just- what the hell. i live in fear of mary keay
So I've compiled a short list of the known recordings where Gertrude took live statement (which were not written and read out by her):
Episode 53- Walter Heller telling the story (in 1997) where he found an Archivist and an Archive in Alexanderia during WWII. A few months later there was an explosion in the vicinity, presumably by Gertrude's hands.
Episode 62- Mary Keay visiting Gertrude in July 3, 2008 to give her a 'gift' (Eric Delano's page) and a statement about the skin book and how she acquired it when she was young.
Episode 130- Lucia Wright in December 2008 telling her story of her encounter with a Flesh ritual run by Tom Haan (throwing truckloads of meat into a huge pit in Istanbul) that was stopped by an explosion caused once again by Gertrude.
Episode 145- Arthur Nolan pays Gertrude a visit in February 2009 and she out plays him and extracts a statement from him about raising Agnes Montague.
Episode 154- Eric Delano's ghost in July 21, 2008 telling her how to quit the institute and his story with Mary Keay.
It seems that for the most part, other than those who came to her to actively give a statement like Mary and Arthur, Gertrude tended not to take live statements.
Unless she had a very specific goal in mind of course.
With Eric, once she realized it was him, she mainly talked to him to get his secret on how to quit the archives. He asked her to take a statement as payment. With Lucia she wanted to make sure no survivor witnessed her sabotaging the Flesh ritual. And with Walter she wanted his help in locating an ancient archive and confirming her theory of the Archivist as a consistent Beholding role throughout history.
My theory is that she wanted to take a live statement from Lucia and Walter for an additional, very specific reason. She could have let them give her a written statement to get the information it seems she needed, since they have the same truth telling effect that talking does. With Lucia all she needed was for her to see Gertrude's face and recognize her and Walter was still unsure of the location even while talking to her so writing it down and then going over the maps with her as he did later would have yielded the same results.
She knew what live statements do. How they cause long term effects of nightmares both for them and for her. She didn't need to condemn them to such fate if that's all she took from them.
Unless getting those dreams was her main purpose. Imagine her appearing in Walter's dreams, walking with him through Alexanderia's alleys and knowing the location she needed to explode through first person sight. Imagine her standing next to Lucia as she carried meat from the trucks to the pits, knowing exactly who she saw and if Gertrude was actually seen by her.
Gertrude was calculative to the extreme and did everything for a reason. My theory is that she took these live statements because they gave her the dreams, because the dream were extremely useful in finding out that extra bit of reliable information she needed.
Just like with her assistants, she was willing to sacrifice her own humanity when she felt she had no other choice.
Oh, I’d totally forgotten this statement but IT IS SO GOOD!!! There is so much here, so much foreshadowing, so many little things you won’t get listening the first time round. It’s definitely worth a re-listen.
Anyway, here are some of my thoughts/feelings/ideas about this episode. Please be warned there will be spoilers for other later episodes of TMA.
Mary is such a little bitch towards Gertrude; her low key snark and clear disdain for what Gertrude does is palpable right from the start. And I love it.
And we have Beholding Pun #1 - “ I know the Institute and me haven’t always seen eye-to-eye...” - Perfect. Flawless. Amazing.
I love how Mary refers to what Leitner did as having “stamped them (the books) with his mark...” I just adore how this parallels what Elias later says about Jon having been marked by the fears. It’s almost as if Leitner hoped that by marking the books he is able beat the fears at their own game. Well, look how that turned out...
Also love Mary opening up the question as to what happened to the books prior to Leitner - what adventures these terrible tomes got up to before they were found and placed in his library? Did others try and collect them?
Interesting how Mary comments on Leitner being too slow, gentle and boring- you get the impression she did not feel he was worthy of having so many books within his possession. I like how it mirrors Gerry’s only interaction with Leitner, when he stopped beating him because he couldn’t believe such a pathetic man could be THE Jurgen Leitner.
SO MUCH FORESHADOWING! - “ You… don’t really go out and look for yourself “ and “They don’t understand up there. They don’t know what this place is.”
Mary’s attempts to get Gertrude to reveal how much she knows - “You do, though, don’t you?” And Gertrude’s answer is just to play completely dumb and act like she has no idea what Mary is talking about. Hahah.
Also “We’re on the same side, really” creeps me out so much. Because in some ways Gertrude and Mary are really similar - strong, independent women, who know what they want and will do anything to get it, no matter what the cost. If Gertrude had rather focused on gaining control of her abilities and becoming “The Archivist” she could have very easily become something quite similar to Mary. On this note, interesting how Gerry finds an almost motherly figure in Gertrude.
SHE WAS NINE YEARS OLD! WTF!?
Mary talks about her mother’s poor pay - I hope Jonah has realised that you can’t pay people sixpence for a day’s work anymore!
From the information we get here, it seems like was Mary’s mother who was from the von Closen line, rather than her father. Given the timeline, I’m going to say that Mary’s mother was also Mary (given in Mag 023 Jon states Mary Keay was born in 1924, when here it’s very clear this Mary was born in 1946.)
Just having fun imaging a young Mary creeping out all the local shopkeepers while looking for something strange and dark to catch her eye.
“...Slavish devotion to you and your patron...” - Jon what on earth do you think she meant by this!? I love that he just ignores all these strange little comments, weren’t you a researcher before moving to the Archives?
People’s different relationships with the fears just fascinate me. We have those using them to gain Power (Elias/Jonah), those who worship them like Gods (The Lukas Family), those who just want to have some fun (Jude Perry), those who give themselves to a power to save themselves (Mike Crew), those who get dragged into it against their will (John, Jane, Oliver.) And then you have the Keay’s who believe these primal fear Gods are somehow watching over them. Also Mary what does that even mean
Jewish Keays anyone?
“...a scent like wet dirt rolling through the building and settling in my chest..” - maybe grave dirt?
I wonder, how Tellison obtained the books I wonder? And how did she learn how to use them? Mary, had some knowledge about the fears beforehand from her family, how did Tellison discover what the book did? Did she have any idea how the books fit into the bigger picture?
Mary’s whole sense of superiority is chilling.
“My inclinations, predictably, were more toward watching than doing the deed myself.” - hahaha. This is so fucking creepy and so clever.
“After a lifetime, I know all its secrets, save one. And I have a pretty good idea about how to find that.” - Except she fucked it up 2 months later.
Also love how we get more hints that the fears are not just a British thing but rather seem to be present in diifferent cultures i.e. the mention that both books are written in Sanskrit. Seriously, where did this doctor get these damn books?
“I could never truly serve it – I just don’t find death that interesting. But I’ve always found a singular devotion far too restrictive.” - I know that Mary couldn’t complete the ritual fully cause of the blood loss but I do wonder if this didn’t have something to do with failure as well.
“Just a bit of viscera” - Hahah. She’s so fucking dismissive. I definitely get the feeling that everyone else looks down on the Flesh as a lower rate entity.
“...though it came back to me after the attack.” How!?
“He’s not exactly big on action though, is he.” THE FUCKING FORESHADOWING! !
“....though, I do rather hate the smell of burning skin.” Funny how both Jon and I didn’t find this a strange thing for Gertrude to say. Definitely the words of a sweet old grandmotherly archivist who definitely does not go around blowing shit up and killing avatars.
“...odd relationship with death is the least interesting part of it” Really John!? Really!? Like I know you’re paranoid but,,,REALLY!?
“The Magnus Institute is not what it appears to be, and until I know what it is, and what it’s for..” - oh sweety! *proceeds to grossly sob*
No strange skin page. - I hope this means that Gertrude destroyed Eric’s page and let him rest.
