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@tinky-dinky
I will never understand why some Rhaenyra stans insist on trying to make her a victim of Viserys' bad parenting too. Is it meant to get her sympathy? To make the Greens less sympathetic?
Regardless, it's baffling and infuriating. Viserys did not treat Rhaenyra badly. Fuck that bullshit.
aegon was being called ‘aegon the conqueror babe, second of his name’ at two by the lords of one of the most powerful houses in the realm (hobert hightower) and viserys didn’t do a goddamn thing but smile. i will never understand how people watched this and did not find not find his affirmations of rhaenyra’s children’s legitimacy to be horrifyingly too little too late when he allowed this shit so easily for long enough to cause irreparable damage to her claim. and this is the kid that he actually likes.
I cannot put into words how much I hate this post.
From the complaining that Viserys dared to pay more attention to Aegon than Rhaenyra on Aegon's birthday to claiming Viserys' affirmation of Rhaenyra's children's legitimacy was horrifying because it was too little too late when a) it's pretty clearly implied he's been enforcing the lie about her children being trueborn since Jacaerys' birth, b) the horrifying part is actually the king using his power to enable his daughter and grandson's theft of inheritance that does not belong to them and c) worst of all, he was more interested in affirming her bastards' 'legitimacy' than his son's bleeding, mutilated face to the idiocy of claiming that Viserys did irreparable damage to Rhaenyra's claim instead of it being her who damage by a) having three obvious bastards, b) marrying the man she was named heir to keep off the throne, c) publicly asking for a ten year old to be tortured and d) sitting on her ass in Dragonstone instead of doing anything to help her cause.
I am always baffled by those who claim Viserys was a bad father to Rhaenyra. You want her to be a victim so badly.
I am utterly baffled by this fandom’s insistence that Jaehaerys raped and/or forced Alysanne into having as many children as they did.
There is absolutely nothing in Fire and Blood to indicate that anything like happened. It goes against literally everything else said about Jaehaerys. It’s just baffling.
I know this fandom loves to portray Jaehaerys as the biggest misogynist to ever exist, because they’re incapable of understanding nuance, but this is ridiculous even under that belief.
All The Stupid Decisions That Caused The Driftmark Incident
I’m feeling salty about the Driftmark Incident again so let’s run through all of the decisions that caused it.
1) Jacaerys, Lucerys, Baela and Rhaena’s decision to believe that someone had stolen Vhagar, even though a moment of thought would have made them realise that that’s not possible. Ignoring the obvious- that Vhagar is a massive, ill tempered dragon and wouldn’t allow anyone to steal her- there’s also that only three people in the castle could have claimed her, and very basic logic would have told them it was Aemond. Rhaena’s there with them and Viserys is too sick and already had a dragon before.
2) Their decision to go after this supposed thief by themselves, instead of fetching adults. Even though they know this person has just gotten control of a massive ill tempered dragon.
3) Their decision to continue with the confrontation even after they see it’s Aemond. The girls are under the incredibly stupid belief that dragons are hereditary, even though their father’s dragon is their maternal great grandfather’s and Vhagar was their paternal grandfather’s before she was their mother’s. God only knows why Jacaerys and Lucerys go along with it. Repeated cranial impacts with flagstones in their infancy, probably.
4) Baela and Rhaena’s decision to escalate the verbal fight into a physical one.
5) Jacaerys and Lucerys’ decision to join in with beating Aemond, a cowardly thing to do when he was already outnumbered and there was no reason to do it, instead of fetching an adult to stop the fight.
6) Their decision to not run away when Aemond is briefly blinded by sand. They could have left and ended the fight with everyone only sustaining minor bumps and bruises.
7) Jacaerys’ decision to take out the knife. This is cowardly and disgusting, honestly, pulling a knife on a unarmed boy they’d already attacked four on one.
8) Lucerys’ decision to pick up the knife. Again this is cowardly and disgusting.
9) And, of course, the stupidest and most disgusting decision of all: Lucerys deciding to slash Aemond’s face. Not just his face, his eye. Lucerys didn’t stab him in the cheek, no, he went for the eye where it would do the most damage. If that knife had gone just a little bit deeper, it could have penetrated Aemond’s brain and given him brain damage or killed him. Hell, it’s damn lucky he didn’t die of blood loss or shock or infection.
Nine moments when any of them could have made a different decision and Aemond wouldn’t have been left disabled and mutilated for life and the Dance would have been very different.
The amount of adults that I see trying to say that the children didn't do anything wrong is insane. Yes they are young but even at that age they know what cruel words can do to someone. They also knew to some extent to not get another adult and help out the situation. Those children went to confront aemond on their own. I never understood the argument of "bu- bu- but aemond STOLE vhagar " ummm no he didn't? Vhager CHOOSE aemond that day. which means rhaena would have been rejected BY VHAGAR if she tried to claim her. Aemond tells her this in the scene, " well then you should have claimed her" basically saying that it would have been fine to him if she at least tried but she didn't. I understand that they were blinded by grief though they are children but this is not the first time a targ a took a dragon days/ hours after another Dragon riders death? I understand that he did insult the children (even though it's true) and he shouldn't have done that. But was it really that insulting to take out his eye? And don't forget the fact that rhaenyra told her father that Aemond needed to be sharply questioned, RIGHT AFTER HE WAS MAIMED. (which in the books it was made clear that that usually means interrogated/ACCUSING a criminal) I think people forget that she was in the HEAVILY in the wrong. Before anyone says anything like "b- bu- but rhaenyra is just worried about her sons safety🥹" omg who's fault is that? But secondly, this would not be the first time someone has questioned their heredity??? So it's not like aemond is the first person to question whether or not those children are really their fathers children?? What I'm trying to get at is that the whole situation could have been handled much better and the children are in the wrong as well! I'm not saying that they deserve to get punished (like them getting their eyes taken out) But something should have still been done because they should have never done that and by that age they knew better than to take a knife to the fight. And I also don't like how people try to say how aemond was going to crush jaces head in. WHEN AT THE TIME HE WAS PICKING UP A ROCK BECAUSE HE WAS GETTING JUMPED BY FOUR PEOPLE AND YOU CAN ACTUALLY SEE HIM PUTTING DOWN THE ROCK BECAUSE HE WAS SCARING THEM. It was luce who pulled out the freaking knife.
I absolutely agree with everything you say here.
I would like to add one thing, though. You mention that Aemond insulted them, but he only insulted Rhaena after she stormed up to him and said ‘That’s my mother’s dragon!”, implicitly accusing him of stealing Vhagar, and he doesn’t insult the boys until after they attacked him. So I don’t count that as wrong.
Aemond did nothing wrong on Driftmark, in my opinion.
All The Stupid Decisions That Caused The Driftmark Incident
I’m feeling salty about the Driftmark Incident again so let’s run through all of the decisions that caused it.
1) Jacaerys, Lucerys, Baela and Rhaena’s decision to believe that someone had stolen Vhagar, even though a moment of thought would have made them realise that that’s not possible. Ignoring the obvious- that Vhagar is a massive, ill tempered dragon and wouldn’t allow anyone to steal her- there’s also that only three people in the castle could have claimed her, and very basic logic would have told them it was Aemond. Rhaena’s there with them and Viserys is too sick and already had a dragon before.
2) Their decision to go after this supposed thief by themselves, instead of fetching adults. Even though they know this person has just gotten control of a massive ill tempered dragon.
3) Their decision to continue with the confrontation even after they see it’s Aemond. The girls are under the incredibly stupid belief that dragons are hereditary, even though their father’s dragon is their maternal great grandfather’s and Vhagar was their paternal grandfather’s before she was their mother’s. God only knows why Jacaerys and Lucerys go along with it. Repeated cranial impacts with flagstones in their infancy, probably.
4) Baela and Rhaena’s decision to escalate the verbal fight into a physical one.
5) Jacaerys and Lucerys’ decision to join in with beating Aemond, a cowardly thing to do when he was already outnumbered and there was no reason to do it, instead of fetching an adult to stop the fight.
6) Their decision to not run away when Aemond is briefly blinded by sand. They could have left and ended the fight with everyone only sustaining minor bumps and bruises.
7) Jacaerys’ decision to take out the knife. This is cowardly and disgusting, honestly, pulling a knife on a unarmed boy they’d already attacked four on one.
8) Lucerys’ decision to pick up the knife. Again this is cowardly and disgusting.
9) And, of course, the stupidest and most disgusting decision of all: Lucerys deciding to slash Aemond’s face. Not just his face, his eye. Lucerys didn’t stab him in the cheek, no, he went for the eye where it would do the most damage. If that knife had gone just a little bit deeper, it could have penetrated Aemond’s brain and given him brain damage or killed him. Hell, it’s damn lucky he didn’t die of blood loss or shock or infection.
Nine moments when any of them could have made a different decision and Aemond wouldn’t have been left disabled and mutilated for life and the Dance would have been very different.
Lucerys haunting the fuck out of Aemond at Harrenhall please i'm begging you
Aemond not giving a single solitary fuck about the bastard who took part in bullying him, disabled and mutilated him, never apologised or showed any guilt or remorse over it and instead laughed in his face and was actively recruiting people to go to war with Aemond's family, please I'm begging you.
Im struggling to understand Jaceryes’s beef with being a bastard like i get its dishonourable and all that but regardless who his father is or what colour his hair is he is Rhaenyras true-born son. He’s a Targaryen by birth because she is his mother, the Targaryen royal. I feel like there shouldn’t be anything to dispute yk he literally came out of her.
It’s really not hard to understand.
It does not matter that Rhaenyra is indisputably his mother. Her husband was not his father, therefore he and his brothers are bastards and cannot legally inherit anything.
It is not misogyny. It is the opposite of misogyny, as a prince’s bastards would never be in this position in the first place. Most princesses’ bastards wouldn’t either, but Viserys cannot ever punish the only child he cares about for breaking the law.
He's also not a Targaryen. He's claimed to be a Velaryon, but in reality as he's an unclaimed bastard, he has no last name. At most he could be Jacaerys Waters if Rhaenyra acknowledged him as her bastard.
The only way to explain the decisions almost all of the adult cast of HOTD make is if there was an outbreak of infantile cranio-flagstone impact syndrome in the sixty or so years prior to the Dance.
jaehaerys' old lazy ass not even showing up at the great council his circus his monkeys and yet he couldn't bother
....He was elderly and had dementia. And the whole point of the council was for the lords to make the decision, not Jaehaerys. He didn't need to be there and his presence would have made it harder.
Please read the book properly and use basic common sense.
Why did Harwin agree to be Rhaenyra’s lover? And to father her sons?
He had to have known that doing that would only put himself in danger, and possibly his father and brother too. There is no positive outcome here.
He grew up in Harrenhal, so he almost certainly knew what happened to the Harroways (Maegor believed that Alys Harroway, one of his wives, cheated on him and passed off a bastard as his child and murdered her and her entire family) and he also definitely would have known about Lusty Lucamore Strong (A kingsguard who married and had kids in secret and was executed for it).
So why then would he agree to being Rhaenyra’s lover, when the consequences if they were caught could be so terrible and almost certainly would be focused on him and his family? Rhaenyra wouldn’t be punished.
Either Harwin’s a complete moron (unlikely given his father and brother were both pretty clever) or Rhaenyra forced him. Those are the only two options I can come up with.
not to mention show luke is looks and was a minor when he filmed. it is disgusting to sexualize and ship with a grown man!!
Yeah that’s also a factor I suppose, but I don’t think much of it.
Show!Aemond, despite being played by a grown adult, is actually only 16 and therefore is only two years older than Lucerys. So their ages are pretty irrelevant here.
Sexualizing the actor, Elliot Grihault, is pretty gross though. Anyone who does that is fucked up.
It was never about who the father of Jace, Luke, and Joffrey was. From the moment Aegon was born, they planned to take the throne. The issue, plain and simple, is because Rhaenyra was a woman.
....yes, because that's what the law, precedent and tradition says.
Rhaenyra isn't special. She's no different from Visenya, Rhaena and Daenerys- those other Targaryen women who didn't get the throne because they had younger brothers. And every other noble woman who didn't inherit because she had a younger brother.
She doesn't get to flout the law. She has to follow it, like everyone else, and the law says it's the firstborn son who inherits. Sucks, but that's the law.
Rhaenyra was only the heir in the first place to keep Daemon, the heir by precedent, off the throne. What is the point of keeping her as heir, flouting the law, when there’s another lawful option?
Her father, the King, named her his heir and never changed his decision. Viserys had lords across the realm swear oaths to her. Yes, he had multiple sons, and i do understand the point you’re making. However, Viserys should have cleared it up if he wanted Aegon to be King without any opposition.
Still doesn’t change that the law says sons come before daughters.
They swore oaths before Viserys had three sons. Those oaths became meaningless the moment Aegon was born.
What Viserys said or wanted is irrelevant. It does not change the law.
I will never understand how or why anyone could ship Lucemond or Rhaenicent.
Lucerys permanently disabled and mutilated Aemond and never even apologised. He never showed a single shred of remorse or guilt. Why in the hell would you ship Aemond with that?
Rhaenyra implicitly threatened Aegon on his second birthday, asked for Aemond to be tortured and wants all of Alicent’s sons (and her father and brother too most likely) dead. Why in the hell would you ship that?
Don’t you want Aemond and Alicent to be happy? With people who haven’t hurt them or their children?
I would love a fic where Baelor and Maekar somehow travel back to just before the Dance and are utterly appalled by the fuckery going on.
Just Baelor absolutely losing it on Rhaenyra, because he, who sacrificed his life for the protection of an innocent, would be disgusted by her willingness to sacrifice many innocents for her own selfish entitlement and her belief that she is above the law.
Maekar being infuriated both by Alicent’s abuse of Aegon and the lack of justice for Aemond’s eye. Him shouting at Viserys, asking why the fuck did he have so many children if he wasn’t going to care for them all?!
Don’t even get me started on their reactions to Rhaenyra putting her obvious bastards in the line of inheritance. That hits their trauma buttons hard.
I would absolutely love it.
(the question is, would they claim dragons? and which ones? I’m tempted to suggest Vermithor and Silverwing, as they’re married couple goals.)
Reblogging to add onto this because I have more thoughts.
Maekar sees Aemond, a hot tempered ultra-Targ boy with a bit of a tendency towards violence, but with the intelligence to be smart about it, and immediately adopts him as his new baby boy. He’s Aerion but not overly cruel or infuriatingly stupid.
Then he meets Helaena. Female!Daeron without the alcoholism? Happy days for Maekar.
(Maekar loves all of his children, regardless of their issues, to be clear. This is all happening when he’s accepted he’s in this new time and won’t see his children again. His new babies are not loved more than his old babies.)
Baelor, he’s adopted Daeron, the good boy. Is Maekar slightly annoyed that even in a new time with new children Baelor’s new son is still the only well behaved normal one? Yes.
Aegon…well, neither brother thinks much of him at first. Yes, he as an alcoholic sad boy reminds them of Daeron, but still. They’re not keen on him.
Then they claim Vermithor and Silverwing and need to learn Dragon Riding 101. Aegon volunteers to teach them and they’re skeptical. What does this drunken fool know of dragons?
Joke’s on them there, because Aegon is the best of the Greens’ dragonriders, and probably better than any Blacks too. He has the closest bond with his beloved Sunny and the two of them are ridiculously in sync.
This makes Maekar and Baelor realise there’s a lot more to Aegon, especially when they see how happy he gets when they compliment his dragon riding skills. Clearly this poor boy is in need of much love and affection.
Now Maekar may not be the best dad around, but if any Targ dad knows how to smother his children with love it is him. He is in full mother hen dad mode, locked in. Aegon will be loved, dammit.
Neither of them give any kind of fuck about Rhaenyra’s children. Maekar already fucked up once by ignoring Aerion being cruel to his siblings. He will not allow cruel sadistic brats around his new children, so Rhaenyra’s bastards stay the fuck away.
Baelor has some fellow feeling for Rhaenyra’s bastards because he too has been scorned for not having the Targ look, but the difference there is that he looks like his mother and is legitimate. Rhaenyra’s sons are bastards and look like their mother’s extremely ill chosen lover.
He’s also appalled by their unprovoked and vicious attack on Aemond and their complete lack of any remorse, guilt or apology for it. He does not care what Aemond said- it does not justify permanent mutilation and a life long disability.
So, yeah, Baelor and Maekar coparent the Green kids and teach Aegon- through love and affection and compassion, all things he didn’t get from his absentee father and abusive mother and grandfather- how to be a good king.
They also use their battle experience and considerable strategic skill to thoroughly thrash the Blacks when Rhaenyra still tries to claim the throne she has no right to. Their dragons help too.
It was never about who the father of Jace, Luke, and Joffrey was. From the moment Aegon was born, they planned to take the throne. The issue, plain and simple, is because Rhaenyra was a woman.
....yes, because that's what the law, precedent and tradition says.
Rhaenyra isn't special. She's no different from Visenya, Rhaena and Daenerys- those other Targaryen women who didn't get the throne because they had younger brothers. And every other noble woman who didn't inherit because she had a younger brother.
She doesn't get to flout the law. She has to follow it, like everyone else, and the law says it's the firstborn son who inherits. Sucks, but that's the law.
Rhaenyra was only the heir in the first place to keep Daemon, the heir by precedent, off the throne. What is the point of keeping her as heir, flouting the law, when there’s another lawful option?
Why are Viserys's kids with a brunette all silver-haired, but Rhaenyra's aren't? Is there a canonical reason?
Book!Alicent is implied to be a blonde, not a brunette. Jaehaerys mistakes her for his daughter, Saera, who was a blonde, and the only two Hightower ladies whose hair colour we know, Alerie (Margaery and Loras’ mum) and Lynesse (Jorah’s wife) are silvery blondes.
So of course two blondes would have all blonde children.
The showrunners made Alicent a brunette/redhead, presumably to contrast her with Rhaenyra and make things less confusing for the audience, and didn’t think through the genetic implications for her children.
Hey, yo, Clone Wars, what the FRICK was up with those slavery episodes?
I mean this on every possible level. Why did they send Anakin (former slave) and Ahsoka (a child) to impersonate a slaver and a slave? Why didn't they send LITERALLY ANYONE ELSE?! (I can understand why they couldn't like send Yoda but I'm staring VERY pointedly at Mace Windu) Why was there so much torture and murder and a SHOWN SUICIDE?! This is a show for like 8-10 year olds wholy crap bro what is going on. Y'all said these got dark but WOW this is definitely getting filed under "how did they get away with playing this on kid's television?"
The entire show was about slavery.
Anakin didn’t give a fuck about the enslaved child soldiers he happily led to their deaths, so why would the council think he’d care about any other slavery?
