Under The Mountain: An ACOTAR Podcast

A comedic, critical (and costumed) look at the best-selling romantasy series A Court of Thorns and Roses. 18+!!

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Hiya!

We're a Podcast / Youtube series doing a chapter by chapter read through of ACOTAR. Critical analysis, roasting, bad cosplay.

Do we love ACOTAR or hate ACOTAR? The answer is yes. We have complicated feelings.

We definitely won’t be for you if:

You HATE Tamlin, LOVE Feyre and don’t want to hear otherwise. Click away!

You love the series sooooo much and want to hear nary a word against it. Goodbye!

You cannot handle jokes at the character's or series expense. Farewell! 

You do not like people sexualizing the characters and horny crackshipping. Adieu!

Otherwise, come hang out!! 🌹✨

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Frank and I have both been struck by the parasite (suspected, still waiting on tests) the last two weeks and next week's episode may have to go up a few days late and I'm really upset about it because I haven't missed a podcast upload day since we started doing this three years agooooooo

UGH!!!!!

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It's SO weird to be doing such a slow and close reading of ACOTAR right now and see just how often the common, accepted "facts" of the story by the broader fandom are just factually incorrect.

And it's stuff where I get it.. it's tiny details that are super easy to forget. But people just loudly proclaim things that are wrong because they support whatever emotional narrative they want to believe (ie.. Tamlin is a bad guy lol).

And these aren't like interpretation things. It's just facts about what someone said or how a plot point literally happened.

I feel like I am constantly just having to "Actually, no, that's not the truth, Ellen" people to even be able to have a basic conversation lol.

BUT LIKE HOW CAN I DISCUSS THIS WITH YOU AND OFFER MY POV IF YOU WON'T EVEN ACCEPT THE FACTS THAT WERE WRITTEN ON THE PAGE I'M BASING MY THOUGHT ON?? 😩😩

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Okay, going to just keep reblogging this post to add on things as I see them. The newest one I've seen multiple times this week..

"Rhysand didn't hurt Feyre on purpose during the bargain scene UTM. He was just pulling out the bone to heal her!"

There are two stages to the bone situation. The second and final part IS Rhysand pulling the bone to remove it, yes.

But BEFORE that, he twists the bone shard in her arm to intimidate her into agreeing to his bargain. We proceed further into the scene to him actually removing the bone.. which suggests he couldn't or didn't remove it the first time, right?

I don't know if I am missing something or if people are just combining those two moments into one because it makes Rhysand seem more palatable in retrospect...

But my reading of the scene very much feels like the first one was a "do what I want cause it's for your own good!" action.. the second portion was the actual "help".

I'm open to hearing out a different thought process.. but imo this is, AT BEST, up for interpretation. But it is NOT a cut and dry "Whaaaat? He just pulled it out to heal her!" description in the actual scene.

[mischievoustempest]

Tentatively slides another over to y’all

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The way people feel the need to moralize why the ship they like is the "good" ship and wax poetic about how it shows that they have a superior spirit... should I start doing that with my ships?

I like Tamcien because I actually care about gay rights and feel men who are abused by their families of birth should be able to find a safe space to truly love one another and really be SEEN.

Those of you who like Lucien with anyone else actually don't care about familial abuse, it's easy to see. And if you ship him with a woman, I think you're likely homophobic, which is sad. Maybe you just don't understand how morally superior I am for centering Lucien's trauma when I decided who to ship him with. This is really good of me.

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↳ Rhysand Goes TOO FAR | ACOTAR Chapters 37 + 38

Feyre is forced into a terrible bargain by the High Lord of the Night Court…

What exactly IS Amarantha so busy with down here? Does Rhysand actually NEED a bargain to help Feyre? Why IS the Lady of Autumn so hot? And why DOES the bargain tattoo have FLOWERS? All this and more... 🌹✨

Frank and Lauren discuss Chapters 37 + 38 of A Court of Thorns and Roses by Sarah J. Maas.

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Hi! What are y’all thoughts on Throne of Glass? It’s my favorite of SJMs books so I’m curious if you would ever consider doing content about it (no pressure obvi)

Also I’m a huge fan of your podcast please keep doing what you’re doing!!

You are sooooo sweet - thank you so much! It means everything to hear you guys like the podcast!!

Neither of us have read it but I am super curious to go through it and compare it to ACOTAR. Whenever I hear people talking about it about half the time I think "okay, I feeL like I'd definitely prefer this series" and the other half of the time I think "actually I might dislike this even more than ACOTAR" hahaha. So I have NO idea what to expect!

We'd definitely like to do content about it and we're playing with the idea of taking some books and chunking them out so we cover a lot more chapters - so the book would only take 5-6 episodes to get through.

It makes us a little sad because we really like going through super slow - I feel like a lot of our analysis and parallels pop up because we're doing it that way (and a lot of our stupid jokes lol). But the flip side to that is that we realistically won't get to a lot of other series at all if we always do chapter by chapter reads.

Surprisingly I think Fourth Wing has been our most requested branch out series lol. So that and ToG are our big considerations for trying out a faster style read through!

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Sorry if y’all have already answered this but what are your thoughts on the next book being a tower of Dawn like Novella from a Mor or Feyre/ Rhys pov? It’s sounds terrible to me but I’ve seen a lot of people argue that it’s going happen :(

I haven't read any ToG (yet!) so I don't have too much context for how likely this is. Is Tower of Dawn generally not well liked?

What I can say is that I'll be bummed if Book 7 isn't either: Elain POV or at least multi character POV. I'd love a Lucien POV (I suppose that could be Book 6?) but I don't know if that's realistic or not.

I am not the biggest fan of Mor so that would be disappointing. I could see her potentially throwing in a Feyre/Rhys short(ish) book in there to feed the Feysand stans before embarking on the "big story" from other people's POVs.

HMMMmmmm.. I am soooo curious to see how this all shakes out!!

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Heya <3 do both of you use this account or is it primarily run by one of you? Just interested !

Hi!! :)! This is almost exclusively run by Lauren (as is all of our social media) .. although Frank has his own accounts that he comments on Tiktok and Youtube a lot with.

But he is very "in the know" in terms of what I repost and discourse and drama and questions (because we talk too much)

And if anyone wants a Frank specific take or answer to a question feel free to specify and I will hand the keyboard over to him lol

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Watching the podcast while trying to give my old barbies a dnd makeover (going badly lol). I love that as soon as Tamlin and Lucien show up in the story and say like 2 sentences to each other both of you immediately go "oh are there stories of them together on ao3??" 👀 and then immediately check the number of fanfictions ahaha same! As soon as Tamlin growled "Behave, Lucien" i was like oh i see you 😏

Sorry but I need to know more about these dnd Barbies. Are they based on your character(s) or are you they just generally dnd themed?? Can I see a picture when they're done?

Hahahaha WELL! These two guys are just hanging around, living together and he hits him with a "BEHAVE"???

My brain is not capable of not running with that setup..... I'm so glad you understand though. I'm still surprised this fandom isn't more overrun with Tamcien and Tamsand and Bat Boy orgy content...

[beedreamscape]

This is just ridiculous. How can a 500 year old man pass judgement onto a trio of girls with max three years of difference between them? They should equally be vulnerable and young to him, while he should admit his bias has nothing to do with their age but his attraction to Feyre.

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Snog, Marry, Avoid, Smack

Thank you for the tag @my-maasverse !! These are super fun lol

For Bat Boys + Tamlin:

Snog: Rhysand... but he has to pretend to be in bad guy mode and talk me through it

Marry: Tamlin (and I'm gunning for a Lucien throuple)

Avoid: Azriel, idk.. the torture and all. I can't trust this man.

Smack: Cassian. He just annoys me sometimes.

For Archeron sisters + Vassa:

Snog: Vassa. I don't really know her like that yet, but her fanart looks attractive.

Marry: NESTA. I could make her happy, I just know I could.

Avoid: Elain. I really don't even want to avoid you, but I simply must marry your sister.

Smack: Feyre, for sure.

Bonus! Lucien, Eris, Mor, and Amren:

Snog: Eris. Mean Vanserra brother? I'm in.

Marry: Lucien. He's already bundled into my Tamlin throuple plans.

Avoid: Mor... she rubs me the wrong way.

Smack: Amren 100%

[acourtofaudacity]

Tamlin was traumatised too.

Tamlin had been preyed on since he was a child by Aramantha. We don't know if she did anything to him. She might have.

Tamlin was still and didn't move under the mountain because if he did, everyone could die or be tortured. He was constantly watched. If he helped Feyre she could have been killed.

But right drugging someone so they can't remember and putting paint on them which corrects itself if you touch it (meaning you could be groping them and they'd have no idea because it only stays smudged if it's not you) while making them lap dance on you every night for months wearing barely anything is so much better.

Twisting someone's broken arm so they agree to a bargain is so much better than staying still and doing nothing. Right ok.

Tamlin and Feyre literally agreed not to talk about their trauma. No Tamlin wasn't ignoring Feyre's vomiting in the mornings while he slept through the night.

Feyre wasn't the only one with trauma. You understand that with Rhys. You see his nightmares. Just because it's not on page doesn't mean it's not happening.

(Please don't make this post political I'm unable to be political online)

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Asking us NOT to consider Tamlin's context and trauma is so wild from a storytelling perspective after revolving the first book around it.

You want me to read a whole story where our big reveal is that this man has been carrying this absurdly large burden and then not consider any of the implications of that? I guess you can say we do "consider" it a la "and that's what makes him a BAD MAN".. but it feels cheap.

To me it feels like there's absolutely no interest narratively in thinking through the psychological intensity of that entire ordeal. And not even just "being UTM".. but the entire leadup, being forced to kill his friends, being forced to lie to a human girl and feel like he's being his father, knowing that Amarantha was targeting HIM specifically and has been since he was a child and feeling responsible for all of Prythian being captured...

Tamlin was in a situation where he was going to feel unbearable guilt literally no matter which option he picked. Every single choice he had lead him to misery. Which is pretty tragic. Does it not seem worth exploring how emotionally complex the scenario you created for him was?

Instead it just gets kind of handwaved and rolled into "domestic abuse bad and actually I think maybe he was ALWAYS going to be bad independent of that whole situation cause he's like a hypermasculine jock or something idk... lets go have fun with this guy heeheeheehee"

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[janeyis]

Inner Circle ACOTAR fans discussing Nesta Archeron.

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Am I crazy for not really getting "MY SHIP WILL BE REAL" style ship wars when BOTH couples are clearly being hinted at by the author...?

Like, isn't the idea here to make you think "omg! Both seem like an option! Will they or won't they? There are clues being set up for BOTH COUPLES!"

Idk...... isn't that the point? That you can make an argument for both cases because we're intentionally setting it up so our FMC is standing upon two equally forking paths? To create discourse and a cliff hanger so you have to read the next book to find out?

I don't really get sticking a firm flag in the sand because your side has evidence.. when the other side has just as much evidence. Intentionally so!

It's like walking into a room that has a wall with half purple polka dots and half green and it's like "Tomorrow, we're going to put ONE MORE DOT! We won't tell you which color yet, it'll be a surprise!" and people keep crowding in to point at their preferred color and go "No but, you see, there's a purple dot here so that's how I know TOMORROW they will place ANOTHER purple dot!" and we're just ignoring the 50% of green dots lol.

Even when "purple" or "green" inevitably wins, the other side wasn't crazy for noticing there were, in fact, intentionally placed clues for the other couple. The other color existed too! SHE WANTS YOU TO NOT BE SURE! IT MAKES FOR MORE EXCITEMENT!

I get rooting for your side and explaining what is more compelling or appealing about that couple, for sure. But the insistence that the other side of the ship is stupid for getting attached to seemingly very REAL elements that were included intentionally to show another potential path the story might take feels kind of silly to me.

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Bruh the way I am so tired of every ACOTAR criticism conversation devolving into "Wait but I'm confused.. how can you say that when SJM *wanted* you to feel XYZ? So therefore that IS what it means and how could you NOT feel that way and since she said it, it's good and there's nothing to criticize."

Like girl I don't caaaaaaare what she WANTED me to feel! It didn't make me feel that way and I don't think it made any sense or felt earned! THAT'S THE CRITICISM!

I mean, don't get me wrong there are a ton of conversations where establishing what we think the author's motivations were is actually really helpful for interpreting things and for the context of the discussion. I do it all the time and it's helpful in analyzing the text.

It just isn't a good "STOP YOUR CRITICISM!" cudgel lol. It offers us context.. and usually that context allows me even MORE reason to expand upon where "what she wanted" and "how I felt due to these writing choices" failed to match up together.