Allie's hyperfixations

[automaticdreamlandkid]

“MILATHOS SCENE” Another thing that bothers me (no surprise) about S3

Okay, I was going to start writing about why Athos’ arc makes no sense but first another detail about that scene that makes little sense to me.

Most of the fans have been focused on the chocking and the fact he wouldn’t attack her at all, or he wouldn’t attack her before knowing for sure she did something wrong, or he should just believe her cause he had no reason not to, or that he would have attack her anyway cause he would never believe-trust her. And hence all the discussion arises about why after everything that happened in the second half of season 2 he would not believing her.

But I’m gonna take a step back.

Right before the chocking, he accuses her (implies with his question) that she hurt You Know Who. She is obviously angry (and hurt) by the accusation,  so her reaction is to spat at him “what does it matter to you if she’ s alive or dead?”, she is being ambigious, she doesn’t firmly deny the accusation, but that is her reaction (justified or not).

Then, possible due to her lack of a straight answer, we have the chocking (out of proportion, justified, completely unacceptable, inexcusable, OC, non out of character, whatever) that is his reaction (justified or not).

In this brief dialogue there is much miscommunication between them which is not at all OC  for me (its obvious in their tavern conversation in 2x8) because they are both selfish and proud and self indulged (him more than her) and that’s just fine cause we all love them…

But all this takes place in the form of action-reaction and to a degree, given the fact they are having two different conversations, understandable.

What I can’t understand is his initial (supposed) “reaction” at the beginning of this miscommunication, aka his accusation.

Her action, right before his “reaction”, is to say You Know Who’s name. There is nothing aggressive in her tone, nothing suspicious or taunting or ambiguous, her voice is low, she sounds nothing but a little shocked. So what’s the base for his reaction? Why does he accuse her right away?

This, which sets in motion the further reactions, for me is worse (chocking aside) then not believing her aftewords. He just accuses her out of nowhere, like the first thing he thinks about her is she did something bad! Why?

After respecting her, finally facing the truth about Thomas, believing her, having her confirm, whatever trust he has showed her, by helping them in the last two episodes of season 2 and admitting he wanted to be with her (even with him being late at the crossroads)?

For all they both know this is where they left with each other, they haven’t seen each other for years but nothing happened between them to change that dynamic. I mean of course they have trust issues, but was this what he really thought about the woman he was about to start a life with last time they were to meet?

So nothing has changed between them but maybe he has changed? (well the showrunners definitely have!).

I am stepping on dangerous territory right now (Athos’ arc-changes) but I am really trying to understand in order to understand what his storyline was about. Because I hated that soryline and in order to demolish it I have to understand it. I’ve read some very thoughtful memes by fans who supported that storyline and from what I can sum up is war-brutalized-burned out, raw instinct? Is this his instinctual reaction to her? Thinking the worse and not trusting her? I can almost say OK, but I just feel there are so many contradictions and plot holes in his arc.

Anyway, whatever the base for his reaction, the thing is I don’t see this being about You Know Who at all, I mean not his treatment of Milady, not the fact that he wanted to get rid of her (he had dumped the new girl in previous ep., although he later had that vision of her while hallucinating-THAT I AM REALLY MAD ABOUT!) I don’t even think the chocking was because of how worried he was about her (I mean if Milady hasn’t shaken him off with the words she spat at his face-BLESS HER- he would still be there chocking his wife and who cares what happens elsewhere…). I can almost see a parallel here with the flashback in 2x5, then Thomas was dead but it was all about him (“did you ever love me ?”-“you must die”) now the new girl may be in danger but is all about her (“what did you do?”-let me chock you).

Okay, maybe I am exaggerating a little, I mean he was obviously worried and wanted her save, hence when he left, he run and looked for her (but why he really walked out that door I’m not so sure about…haha). So maybe I am biased (OK totally am, but I can back it up) but I can’t see this as rejection of Milady for the new girl. (although I can see it as rejection generally)

Why?

Once again I don’t know if it was just bad writing, bad delivery or if even the writers intended for us to see it like that.

Because that kind of rejection could have been easily made crystal clear, if they just didn’t go for that (not so understandable) reaction-accusation from Athos I mentioned above. She says the new girl’s name, they are both relatively calm, nothing aggressive passed between them yet, she gives him the perfect cue (narrative wise) to turn to her and say “Yes, it’s her. You know it’s been 4 years, I’ve been through war and it was awful, and that’s what I needed and it’s something good and she is really nice…and I that’s what I want” and if he wanted to be nice he could add “I really thought I was never going to see you again” and there you have your “we missed our chance” – “slipped away”. I know sounds like a fairy tale (well, they did go for that this season). And maybe this kind of talk doesn’t sound fitting for these two but he could have said it, and then maybe Hell would break loose and she would kill him…

Even right before that when he told her to go and she said “that’s not what you want” his answer is in a negative form (a bit deadpan) “you don’t know what”, but again he doesn’t actually that tells her what he wants (no: “There’ s someone else and I want her”) cause frankly I don’t think he knows either.

I would really like to hear your thoughts about all this mess.

Lastly, I don’t know if anyone has seen the full episodes and not the edited ones, I saw a twitter about them and someone said something about a cut scene of Milady before she sees Athos and the whole talk was about the cut scenes explaining some things better? I have my suspicions, afraid it can’t be anything good.

“*���D

[automaticdreamlandkid]

Athos S3, no redemption whatsoever!

Let me get something out of the way first. I, for one, don’t think Athos needed a new storyline in season 3 because he already had a wonderful one to follow through. The fact his previous storyline got left incomplete aka he got no redemption and we got no catharsis left me so bitter, due to mostly the fact that that particular storyline was so greatly written and presented that really affected me emotionally to the point that catharsis was absolutely necessary!

Furthermore, did I find the new storyline fitting for Athos’ character as we knew him in the first 2 seasons? Absolutely not!  

But whatever I’ll rant about the above point in another post.

So if managed to follow Athos’ storyline in season 3 (war-brutalized-burnt out) you’ll find many things he should redeem for (violent, jerky behaviour, neglectance of duties e.t.c.). (Ok to be fair, about neglecting his duties, partially I think there is a point around ep. 7 maybe where he gets some grip but at the end and in the midst of war he abandons his duty again and runs for the hills! So no!!!)

Now did the character take us with him to that journey, did we actually see (and feel) him suffer, realizing his mistakes, know better, fight against himself to make it right, make amends? No!

As the wonderful atatrum said (I don’t know how to commit to her post, sorry) we just see him suddenly get his shit together and that’s it. Great, but not convincing!

Now there is a scene in ep. 8 which I’m sure many loved and were moved by it, and I’ve seen commented as significant for his arc. Personally, it left me so disappointed and hollow because all I could see was the writers’ attempt to play with the viewers emotions and spoonfeed them a crumb of redemption arc, a redemption for which they seemed to care nothing about the whole season and wasn’t even about their storyline.

I am referring to the scene in which Athos saves his new girl from the Red Guards. And of course it follows his meeting with Milady, cause, you know, it is a convenient moment to remind us that character exists so we get the comparison. (plus we can bring that character down a little more, so great!).

What comparison?

Well, he didn’t cut down Milady to save her when he should and that was his original sin and also the character’s downfall but lets be “economical” and have him save some other girl and he is all redeemed and heroic again, right? Sorry, not even close!  

Yeah, they didn’t even follow through their own storyline! (which I can totally understand cause it wasn’t worth it!). Actually, after that scene is like Athos character just jumps to his happy end no development invovled, no redemption earned no catharsis accomplice. And I leave the worst part for the end of the post cause it’s something that completely drowns the character (whichever storyline you follow).

What I think they tried to do was present us with a scene that implied redemption for his original sin but for me it felt out of place and failed miserably exactly because of the mentioned above comparison.

Why? So many reasons…     

Trying to revisit o crucial for a character’s arc event by simply mimicking the external elements of a scene but taking away all the essence of it does not serve character development!

How is the essence missing?

Let’s review the original scene, aka Milady’s hanging:

1.   In that scene, her suffering (and potential death) along with everything that followed for both characters, was a straight result of Athos’ actions, Athos’ choice, Athos’ bad judgment, which were driven by Athos’ character flaws (ego, pride, anger, impulsiveness). And it is that character’ s action that sets in motion all the events that followed.

So here we have such an important and basic element of drama (tragedy). It’s called “hamartia” in ancient Greek tragedies, aka a character’ flaw and mistake.

(The word originally meant missing your target, aka mistake, and later on and to this day it means sin).

2.   Is that scene milestone to the character’s story? Hell yeah! Why? Because it represents the character’s downfall and the dramatic reversal of his fortune from good to bad (no more frolicking in the fields, heavy drinking and brooding).

Now that said reversal of fortune, it’ s called “peripeteia” and is also a basic element in every tragedy.

Now let’s see what Aristotle thinks (I think he knew a thing or two) about these tragedy elements:

The reversal of fortune must be caused by the tragic hero's hamartia

The reversal is the inevitable but unforeseen result of some action taken by the hero

The misfortune is brought about not by [general] vice or depravity, but by some [particular] error or frailty

 Good, we have all the above checked so we have good tragedy.

Now let’s see if we could potentially apply those elements in ep. 8 scene.

We do have this woman who is connected to the character (well she is not his wife, but she is his girl … oh wait, not exactly, he kind of dumped her in the previous ep. and like some eps. before that, but let’s be fair that’s a technicallity, there was something between them, I mean it wasn’t just sex right? well from what we’seen so far…, come on he’not that kind of a jerk! well this season he kind of is …., but whatever SHE IS A WOMAN HE HAS SPEND TIME WITH- I mean didn’t the writers make it clear to you, why would they have her be literally everywhere he went?)  

She is a woman who is about to suffer although she did nothing wrong (well I mean it’s the authorities that took her so maybe she did something … no she is good).

So she is connected to the character and suffering and if she died it would cause another dramatic reversal of fortune for our character aka “peripeteia”, right?  Dramatic reverse? Well, he isn’t exactly frolicking in fields at this point with war going on and given their connection as described above I can’t see him brooding for years over her (especially if you consider the new S3 Athos is all smiles with the boys and kind of a sex animal). So no I don’t see it causing Athos’ downfall. But let me give you that just for reading this far. Happy?

Now go back above and reread about the original scene because you missed the first condition-element aka “hamartia”.  Because her suffering isn’t the result of Athos’ actions or choices (or his character’s flaws). But it would be sad and if you can see Athos’s downfall in it I’ll even give you a word for it. Back to Aristotle: “if a character’s downfall is brought about by an external cause, this is an misadventure and not a tragedy”. So sorry, misadventure but not tragedy!

But that is not even what matters here we are talking about his redemption and the possibility that this scene represented that. I mean wouldn’t it be great if in all this mess there was a glimpse of catharsis for us? Sorry, but I’m afraid any chance of that has simply “slipped away”…..

Whatever the similarities or the differences in those two scenes, what really stands out of course is that in the second scene he does save the girl and “the hell with the law!”.  

So maybe (even if we didn’t see any kind of relevant redemption arc play out in previous episodes) he had evolved and learned something? Because didn’t he say to D’Art about his action in the original scene that he had to “uphold the law?”.

Yeah, he did, right before he added: “I clung to the belief that I had no choice”.

And why the need to “clung” to that belief? Because he knew what his action was really all about and so do we!!!

IT WAS NEVER ABOUT THE LAW!!!

It was about his pain because he felt betrayed and lied to, his hurt pride because he felt tricked, his bruised ego because he felt unloved and his inability to control his anger because of his impulsiveness.(yeah he was impulsive then-hence s1x8 right before the alley kiss when D’Art rants that he can hold back cause he’ not like him, and he goes “you are, more than you know…”).  

I mean it was made pretty clear in S2x5 when Thomas is lying dead and all he cares about is if she loved him and then again when Catherine wonders what Milady’s real crime was in his eyes.

YES IT WAS PERSONAL AND HIS CRIME WAS MURDER

REVENGE MURDER – THAT’S HIS ORIGINAL SIN

And there, we are back to his flaws and his original sin.

So if someone is happy about the fact he finally yelled “damn the law” and thought that was a sign for his character’s development for me isn’t only missing the key element of his personal tragedy but also wasn’t watching the same show with me. I mean you want to talk about Athos’  respect for the law: the guy was accomplice to Aramis’ high treason with the Queen! Not to mention all the times he let a “criminal” aka Milady ran around doing her thing (even in season 1). Now I am not saying that Athos isn’t an honorable man because for me he very much is, but he is still a flawed man and the strict and narrow idea of the law (not justice) isn’t something as crucial to him as one might think.

I just think the idea of upholding the law was the alibi he found for himself because he couldn’t face the consequences of his action. I even think he joined the Musketeers in order to maintain that image of himself as a lawful man. (cause they are the good guys, fighting for law and honor).  

So yes he saves the girl but doing that he didn’t show us that he was wiser, he didn’t need to rise above his flaws or fight against them and against himself (as he would have to do in order to save Milady). All he had to disregard the law and fight the Red Guards, who by the way are his known enemies!

Now some would say, ok, so saving the new girl wasn’t that much of a personal struggle for him (he was good to someone who was good to him) but by saving her he did chose his feelings for her over the law. Yeah he did, he chose his feelings, and that’s exactly what he did  the first time around.

No, they mean he chose “love”, so isn’t that something? OK, I’m not going to waste any energy trying to explain why I never saw that “love” up that point or even after that to be honest, but for the sake of discussion let’s go with the option of redemption through love, cause it can happen.

In classic tragedies redemption is the spiritual journey of the character to rise above his original sin, it requires suffering, knowledge of his sin, fight to rise above it, leading him to be wiser, do better, make amends.

Can love be redemptive? Yes it can, by positively affecting that character in a way that helps him on that spiritual journey (which still needs to happen by the character) and make him want to be a better person. But the act of loving someone itself alone isn’t redemption (because to quote Dumas “love is the most selfish of emotions”).

So in that case the saving scene would just represent the declaration of that love, which would either: a.) already have led the character to rise above his original sin and be that better person or b.) set him on the path to redemption by motioning him to make that spiritual journey. 

But sadly we never got to see that journey or even be presented that redeemed, better character neither before or after that scene.

And to make matters worse, by the way everything was presented they even “managed” to deprive him of all his development in seasons 1&2. I mean where we left him in S2 he had made progress, seemed wiser, had realized some mistakes, faced some truths rather than blindly denying them and at least deep down had some knowledge of his original sin.

For me it only takes viewing just 2 scenes, one before and one after, to realize that not only was he not redeemed but also been deprived of all his previous development.

The first one of course is the milathos scene, which given the characters connection not only to each other but also to the original tragedy would have been ideal for presenting his improvement. But all we saw was an “economical” presentation of  all character’s flaws relevant to his original sin (ego, pride, anger, impulsiveness) plus violence.

The second one (minutes before the happy ending) is the killing of Grimaud, who of course deserved death, but the way it was presented? It was too physical, so brutal! Again he just used his hands, chocking and drowning him and it seemed to go on forever. And of course as they went after him, Athos had to clarify to D’Artagnan: “Grimaud is mine”  because you know REVENGE MURDER!!!

OH, BUT WAIT, WASN’T THAT HIS ORIGINAL SIN???

Oh, I give up….

���^~��

 ���K��

[youcallthatakisssweetheart]

I know another post about this but JUST SO ANGRY

back then when I knew nothing about season 3 and Maimie’s pregnancy I was hoping season 3 would go along lines

“we are deep in shit and milady knows crucial things about it let’s go find her”

and she would maybe be buddies with the musketeers like at the end of season 2 but remaining the “antagonist” like

“why did you have to kill him?!”

“he was in the way”

“oh my gOD”

oh god I am so pissed and disappointed and sad about the treatment of both Milady AND Athos and this entire relationship I’M FOREVER BITTER ABOUT THIS

*ANGRILY OPENING AO3*

[myriadnarratives]

BBC The Musketeers 2x09 changed the game for me in terms of Milathos. I speedwatched all three seasons first, and at the end thought that Milady was lying about Thomas’s assault, so I was all for Sylvathos. But 2x09 on my rewatch; man, that changed everything for me.

So we have a woman who was assaulted, and because of her shady background, was not believed, and she had to rely on her shady background to survive a world that was hostile to women. All throughout the seasons, she’s shamed for doing what she needs to to survive, whether it’s using her criminal background to keep an income going, or whether it’s becoming the king’s mistress to have some measure of security.

And it’s not just her who’s treated negatively just because she’s trying to survive a very patriarchal world; Constance’s storyline with D’artagnan constantly brings up the idea that if Constance chooses to be with D’art and he dies, Constance would be left with nothing. Constance is even painted in a negative light for holding off on getting with D’art after her husband’s death. D’art says that it’s him she wants because he can give her adventure, but he doesn’t address her very real concerns of security and social acceptance.

In the entire show, do we even see any man be sympathetic and understanding to any woman in this type of situation? We had an episode with Ninon, a woman who is for the education of women, and she loses all her riches because the Cardinal wants her estate. Even the queen is persecuted and put in danger for an act that assuaged her needs in: 1) a social context (she needs an heir to secure her and France’s position); 2) a personal context (she is outright said to be lonely in a marriage where her husband does not care for her).

And if anything, it’s the women’s relationships with each other that help the women individually, and that help is hinged mostly on the female character with the most power: the Queen. “I’ll receive you both at court and no one will dare gossip,” says the Queen to Constance. But she can only do so much, and even she has her own problems in the show’s very patriarchal world.

Gosh, if anyone has a more thorough analysis of how the show treats its women, their relationships with each other, and their relationships with the men, send them my way pls.

[creativepromptsforwriting]

To all the writers who haven't written in a while. May the right words come to you and may they actually get written down.

[allie-reeves]

chapter 5 posted

https://archiveofourown.org/works/89266386/chapters/237025801

Persephone's secret:

The Eye is every magicians dream. But is it really a dream or a nightmare?The more time Henley Reeves spends in hiding the more her instincts are telling her: something's wrong here. She discovers the corruption of the Eye and decides to take down the group.But nothing is as easy as it seems. She has to quit, fake a story to continue her search, hoping that the end, the other Horsemen will believe in her.But the question is: will they?

[allthingswhumpyandangsty]

reminder that ao3 does not recommend typing directly onto their site. the site doesn’t automatically save works for you. if the site crashes, if your wifi gets disconnected, if you lose power, if there’s a glitch, you risk losing everything you’ve typed down. type your work elsewhere. safe your work elsewhere. then copy and paste it onto ao3

[allie-reeves]

bas x taggie

https://archiveofourown.org/works/90185786

[allie-reeves]

chapter 3 posted

Have fun!

https://archiveofourown.org/works/89266386/chapters/237025801

[allie-reeves]

Soy Luna writers: How do we spice up this season? Let's recreate the og love triangle!

Sharon = Luna

Bernie = Simón

Lili = Ámbar

And while we are doing this let's make them look like unbearable people, except Ámbar.

Simón, not caring that he inserts himself in the middle of a family, that had already a hard time to reunite and Luna not caring about her cousins feelings after how hard it was for them to find that love is completely out of character for them and makes them look like jerks.

Although it's interesting that Luna is more like Sharon in the situation, it's still an awful story.

[mariasgirlblogger]

Do I just go back to the same shows cause I like them or is it because I miss that part of my life and myself that doesn’t exist anymore…?

[allie-reeves]

chapter 2 posted

An Archive of Our Own, a project of the Organization for Transformative Works

[bookishbabe07]

ok i’m watching gilmore girls while i’m getting work done and i notice that when dean is asking rory to skip dinner for their three month anniversary he says that their actual anniversary is saturday, not friday, but he doesn’t want to take off work, so he would rather her skip a family commitment. i just- i hate him sm, especially because it’s this event that he says he loves her, and yet he considers her less important than a work shift he could move, but him more important than her family commitments. sir tf 🤨….

[thefirst3chapters]

Another unbelievably specific Literati parallel is that they both have scenes where their only responsible parental figure, who has since rejected them, shows up when they're trying to work and kicks them when they're down. The disparaging remarks about their jobs and (completely opposite) homes are so alike.

The obvious sources of pain for everyone involved are left unsaid, but what is talked about is each kid's mother's upcoming wedding. Jess tries to resist being dragged into yet another ceremony, so Luke guilt-trips him, and Rory is hurt by being excluded from her mom's first wedding, so Lorelai throws it back on her, but Rory and Jess have to shove their feelings aside and get back to work. They've both forced themselves to accept their new lives despite clear signs of despondency, and it's even mentioned they've both changed their phone numbers during this time. They won't be accepted by their parental figures until they make the first move by doing something they want, but neither Luke nor Lorelai's decisions yield the intended results. Jess never goes back on what Luke rejected him for; he presumably doesn't finish traditional high school and continues to focus on work instead, and his life only gets better after Luke takes a kinder approach with him. Rory ultimately wants to go back to Yale for herself and thrives there, but she decides that without any involvement from Lorelai.

There's even a cross-section of how Luke and Lorelai talk to each other's kids. Lorelai went out of her way to scold Jess over Luke's feelings in S4, while Luke knows how hurt Lorelai is in S6 but chooses to be kind to Rory. This season he is also open-minded and sincere when he visits Jess at Truncheon, even though he doesn't understand it and quite possibly would've mocked him for working there just a couple of years earlier, which is perhaps a mindset shift he gained from developing a relationship with April.

I've talked before about how I feel that the ways Rory matures over the years would be just as important for a successful relationship in the future as the ways Jess matures, but it especially seems like this Rory, who had to attend a disciplinary meeting immediately after starting community service, who hoped for a placement at the zoo despite not loving the idea because it offered double shifts to help accumulate more hours, and who was mocked by her mom while cleaning up the side of a highway, would be a lot more inclined to approach Jess getting caught up with work over a weekend or having a day that ends in "I'm not ready to talk about it yet" from a place of equal partnership instead of jumping to the worst conclusion provided he can do the same. It's more than likely there's plenty of those days ahead in her career, too.

(Hopefully this doesn't come across as too harsh on Luke and Lorelai, because I love them! It just seems clear in the story that what they did here, regardless of whether viewers agree with their choices or feel their kids deserved what happened, was completely counterintuitive. The same applies to Lorelai and Lane's lives, too.)

[allie-reeves]

Multi chapter Danley fic Apparently spending weeks in the hospital gives you ideas you just can't get out of your head

Persephone's secret

The Eye is every magicians dream. But is it really a dream or a nightmare? The more time Henley Reeves spends in hiding the more her instincts are telling her: something's wrong here. She discovers the corruption of the Eye and decides to take down the group. But nothing is as easy as it seems. She has to quit, fake a story to continue her search, hoping that the end, the other Horsemen will believe in her. But the question is: will they?

An Archive of Our Own, a project of the Organization for Transformative Works

[afilmbymaja]

can we talk about the fact that henley reeves was a skilled acrobat, gymnast, circus performer, escape artist, computer hacker, tech handyman, could outrun the guys in her stilettos, was talented in math and physics (taking measurements with just her hands, the chair thing) and was also very clearly a shakespeare reader (quoted him when she found the white rose in their first group scene)? Renaissance Woman Fr!

[starshollowconfessions]