Losing my mind rn and I need to share it with someone because I stumbled on some dialouge where rudy says jokingly that if angore wants to go to prom woth him he should just ask. Like I have spent several years thinking that asgore x rudy is just a silly ship based on the whole bouquet of roses thing BUT THEN RUDY SAYS THAT??? LIKE BRO YOURE MARRIED??? Like I dont think theyre gonna get together in canon still but now im convinced that this weird semiromantic bond does indeed exist after years of denying it
It's just very intresting to me, how hometown has these vibes of a this stringent religious town without showing any of the bad things that happens in those type of towns
Like kris has the vibes of a closeted trans kid (massive sweater, not taking care of themselves, "you can wear anything you want" in the dark world) Despite diegetically kris is out and transphobia doesnt exist in hometown
Rudy's and asgore's thing really feels like how historically there were many queer and gay men with wives but still dated men in secret and how that sort of cheating would cause issues later down the line, but obviously homophobia doesn't actually exist in hometown, and rudy isn't actually cheating on his wife, yet that tension remains
Sane with alphys and undyne not being together, something about this town is just stifling despite no actual dietetic bigotry existing within it
And berdly's behaviour being very intentionally written to mirror the average misogynistic gamer (THIS IS NOT ME HATING ON HIM I LOVE HIM), he isn't actually misogynistic as the game tells us, but the vibes are intentionally there, similairly to how obsessed he is with romance and how he mistakes friendliness for romantic attraction, which is very amanormative (which is why people, myself included, headcanon him as aromantic in denial) despite us having no reason to belive that hometown is an amanormative society
Similairly the snowgrave route using so much romantic language and marriage symbolism to allude to the idea of forcing these two queer kids into a comphet marriage feels very important (not saying kriselle is a straight ship obviously, just that in the showgrave route they're being forced into cishet roles)
It's a very clever thing, I feel. It allows deltarune to discuss these problems without showing them or having them exist in the story? This allows the story to maintain its lighter tone (in the normal route) and avoids allianeting its audience. It's all just very clever use of metaphor and coding, and I like it a lot
Sorry for the ramble I originally planned to only bring up the rudy quote and leave but this ask got away from me 😔
First off anon, please do not apologise for rambling! I really dig the energy and enthusiasm, love seeing people get really animated about stuff they're into! It's great, and you're great for expressing it :)
And yeah! The whole Rudy and Asgore thing is really interesting! There does seem to be this frisson of something between them - not necessarily romantic/sexual in nature, but this sense that these two people are actually Really Important to each other in ways that can't easily be expressed by the limited ways that society at large sees love and friendship. Take the prom example - very much considered to be a thing for boys or girls to take the person they Like(romantically) to have a good time and show off and all that stuff. But take that societal expectation away, and what's to say you can't take someone you love and appreciate platonically, exhibit the deep care and commitment you have with that person to others, and just have a fun time together? And I honestly feel that both Asgore and Rudy would love to be able to do that openly. And maybe they'd hook up, maybe they'd express their love for each other physically, but that almost kind of doesn't matter when you look at it this way.
And you're entirely right, technically there's no outward stigma around these non-heteronormative displays of affection in Hometown - hell, even the central religion of the Angel doesn't have a concept of sin according to its own priest! And YET, there is still this strange shroud drawn over it all, this kind of veneer or performance of "normalcy", for lack of a better term. Or perhaps more accurately, the people of Hometown are in many ways acting in ways they feel they Ought to behave, even though everyone there's actually really chill and non-judgmental about these things (that we know of anyhow).
Berdly stands out most to me here, for two reasons - the first is, we already know he's playing up to an aspect of his character, his intelligence. But the moment that veneer's stripped from him, he immediately adopts another, playing to his supposed idiocy instead. And I feel this parallels his broader MLG-Redditor-esque personality that's been established throughout Chapter 2 - he acts that way because he FEELS like he OUGHT to act that way, based on the common popular portrayal of such people. So of Course he sees Noelle's friendship as evidence of a deeper crush she has for him, and of Course he sees Susie trying to comfort him as evidence of there being a romantic spark blossoming between them, and he says himself he's chosen Susie's route as though his life is a visual novel, because that's what the role he's playing demands of him. And as we've seen with his smart-stupid persona shift, he's not quite ready to let that performance go yet, he still needs external validation to tell him how he ought to be, rather than trusting in who he actually is, and trusting that others will accept his genuine, aromantic self. (yeah, it makes too much sense for him not to be aro at this stage, lmao)
And it's like - what if ALL of Hometown is like Berdly? What if they're just performing roles that they think other people expect them to perform, instead of trusting that they can be authentic? What if Asriel's belief that he has sinned when he sacrifices Yoshi to jump higher in the game is an extension of his performance as a Good Boy, despite the Angel's religion having no concept of sin? What if the "wink-wink nugde-nugde" gestures between Asgore and Rudy, and to a lesser extent the Royal Guards (just bros hanging out by the lake, anyone?) is not a subversion of their performance but instead a continuation of it? Like, people Know, it's Obvious to anyone who cares to look, but it's all part of the performance of "normalcy" so it gets a pass.
What if Susie performs the role of bully because it's easier than trying to be geuninely vulnerable and asking for help? And what if people don't challenge her on her behaviour not because they're scared to, but because at this point it's just what's Expected of her?
What if Noelle liking scary things (and by extension Susie) isn't a way to break free from her strict upbringing, but instead a way to let her continue being the model student and all-around good girl while having a "subversive" outlet that isn't actually all that subversive?
And what if Kris dresses down, acts weird and hides all their stuff because they've in some way grown accustomed to their role as the ""outcast"", the weird human who doesn't "belong", who was largely accepted as human and non-binary, and yet feels like they are still not quite of Hometown in the same way the monsters are?
The people of hometown seem to cling to normality like it's a life-raft or a security blanket, too afraid to let go of the roles they've agreed to perform for each other's benefit to be fully, outwardly themselves. I think people like to know that the role they play confirms their identity in the eyes of others - by being witnessed playing that role, they earn "approval" from their peers, and so they continue to play that role, iterating upon it as time goes on. Even if that role is portrayed negatively, the sense of identity one derives from it can still provide comfort and security in the face of an uncertain world. It can be scary to let that go and to try and reinvent yourself, even if the role you're playing no longer serves you like it used to.
And, continuing in this vein, what if Snowgrave is the idea of people playing these roles taken to its logical, violent endpoint, and far from being a subversion of the narrative, it's actually a warning of conforming too much to the role you're expected to play? Kris and Noelle are old friends who drifted apart but still care for each other in ways that can't easily be quantified. Even Noelle doesn't quite know how to define their relationship, and her assertion that they're friends, and the comfort she derived from that, is more relief that this nebulous Thing they have has been Quantified, put into a neat box.
But the incredibly performative nature of Snowgrave speaks to its falsehood. It's like a caricature of romance in lieu of there being any actual romantic feelings there, like kids mimicking the gestures of their parents without understanding the significance of those gestures. You make Noelle wear a ring because that's what People In A Romantic Relationship Do. You make Noelle stronger because that's What You Do in video games, but also because you're meant to Support Your Romantic Partner and Give Guidance to them - you're Helping her. You call for Noelle to help you against Spamton NEO and she comes running - because that is what you are Supposed To Do, drop everything and help out the One Person who you totally Belong to and who Belongs to you. That's Just What You Do, and you Don't Question It.
...I have gone quite a ways off-piste, it would seem! But man, you really made me think about this, and it was so fun to think about everything through this lens. Thank you so much for rambling to me, please don't ever hesitate to do so again, should the mood strike you!
(also, now I kinda want to see Rudy and Asgore curled up on the couch watching TV together and stroking each other's hair. That's the kind of energy I feel their friendship/qpr thingy would have for some reason, haha!)
...godammit I fucking love this fandom. It hurts that you can't talk about this nearly this much in most other areas of the internet without mass hate or shutdown. I live for discussions like this.
