Hello! My name is Bri, and this is my ASOIAF blog! This is my side blog, so If you follow me and I don’f follow you back, I’m probably already following you on there
About me:
1) I stan the Starks. All of them, although Arya is my favorite. She’s also my fave from the whole universe
2) I am Team Green. Read the book if you don’t understand why. Short version, he’s not a rapist or child fighting pit frequent in the books, that was a disgusting change to make. All he wanted to do was protect his family
3) I also stan Alicent and Aegon ii
4) As a whole, I am Anti Targaryen. I like a few of them, but their dynasty is built on evil
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when u point out Dany having the power of god x3 to destroy any city she doesn't like might be a bad thing and probably won't be rewarded by the narrative
targies: noooo it will be fine because Dany would NEVER do that she's just too fundamentally GOOD to ever be corrupted by unlimited power 🙃 source: trust me bro
apparently the theme of asoiaf is absolute power is good, actually, we just need to make sure the *right* people have it 😇
Aemond murdered Lucerys. Otto and Alicent were both horrified that he killed Lucerys. What part of that tells you they were planning to murder her children? And yes, Aegon threw a feast for Aemond, but mostly because he won Baratheon support for him. How do I know? Because later in the book, Aegon has the chance to kill one of her children, he refuses to
And the Greens thought that the Blacks would kill Aegon because:
1) Rhaenyra wanted Aemond tortured as a child
2) Married to Daemon, who is proven murderous, and tormented Aegon and his brothers their whole lives
3) Rhaenyra is also murderous, she kills Vaemond for calling her bastards bastards
You can’t take canon Green fears and motivations and apply to the Blacks, especially when it has no basis in canon
Lol and Rhaenyra is just supposed to trust that when her son was murdered, and the King of the Greens declared the whole situation a “good start” and threw a feast in celebration, that this was a one time thing and the rest of her kids will be perfectly safe in the Greens hands?
Who said all that? I’m saying before the war started, which is what you said in your post, the Greens were not planning on killing her children. The examples you gave were null because it was one person’s actions that most of the Greens condemned him for. Fearing for her children was never stated to be Rhaenyra’s motivation. It is directly stated to be Aegon’s and the Greens. This is why I say you took Green motivations and applied it to the Blacks
Aemond murdered Lucerys. Otto and Alicent were both horrified that he killed Lucerys. What part of that tells you they were planning to murder her children? And yes, Aegon threw a feast for Aemond, but mostly because he won Baratheon support for him. How do I know? Because later in the book, Aegon has the chance to kill one of her children, he refuses to
And the Greens thought that the Blacks would kill Aegon because:
1) Rhaenyra wanted Aemond tortured as a child
2) Married to Daemon, who is proven murderous, and tormented Aegon and his brothers their whole lives
3) Rhaenyra is also murderous, she kills Vaemond for calling her bastards bastards
You can’t take canon Green fears and motivations and apply to the Blacks, especially when it has no basis in canon
I’m so happy that George defended the Greens, particularly Helaena, on his blog from the show runners. Now no one can say he hates the Greens, or that the book is maester propaganda
I’m even more terrified for season 3 though. Why do I feel the toxic butterflies are Daeron being a bastard and Sunfyre being dead?
2) yes, and i interpret it in this way. him comparing book aegon with show aegon, also bc show aegon for me can hardly be see as a villain. to me it only seems as a child who grows un in a cold environment (he kinda fucked up with dyana, tom made a beautiful interview where he said that aegon didn't think that his family loves him, so the only love he can have is the one he takes)
3) i didn't remember, sorry
4) if u mean kill, i think she's reluctant in part because of her religion and in part bc killing her would have been a very hard task. bc you can't just kill rhaenyra, you had to kill her, daemon, all of their children (baela and rhaena included) which mean war with house velaryon. and aegon would have seen as a maegor 2.0, especially if you take into account that at that moment rhaenyra was pregnant. my point is that alicent always put her wish above aegon's (and his safety) , since she put that enormous burden right above him, she should have at least the decency of preparing him. but she didn't worry of that, cause she wanted to rule through him
1) You’re welcome!
2) I mean, that’s just not how interpret it. Aegon was definitely portrayed as a villain in season 1: he bullies Aemond, he assaults Dyana and possibly raped her, he went to child fighting pits, he is portrayed without a single good trait. He’s written very one note in season 1 vs season 2 where, while not perfect, is a lot closer to his book counterpart. And I don’t think George would phrase it as the actor bringing Aegon alive in ways not seen before if he meant in contrast to the book so we may just have to agree to disagree on this point
3) 👍 its fine!
4) I do agree that Alicent favors ambition over all and killing Rhaenyra would be hard. I just don’t see her as evil though and think she’s in a very tricky situation because if she does nothing, she’s as good as sentencing her children to death. Even if you believe Rhaenyra wouldn’t put them to the sword to secure her claim, Daemon definitely would. There’s no situation where Aemond, Helaena, Daeron, and especially Aegon are completely safe, so going with the route where you have allies of other powerful houses AND get the power you want is the best route
1) There cannot be two heirs for one seat. Rhaenyra is the heir by law while aegon is, in a way, supported by precedent in a patriarchy society, but that's not make him heir. precedent =/ law
2) meanwhile i agree that not everyone in tb or tg are completely bad or completely good, grrm write in his blog complimenting hotd for how they write aegon, in particular he said that this version of him is more deep than the villain he created. he used this exact word, villain.
3) how strange is that the story written by two master describe an half hightower king prevail as bittersweet. the only bittersweet thing that happened was jaehaera, an innocent, died by the hand of an ambitious man who want his blood on the throne. just as alicent and otto they condemned their children / grandchildren
4) a mother's fears is not funny, but in this case is hilarious cause there was literally no scenario where this could work, none. so the options are 1 alicent is a totally idiot (and she is not) 2 she puts her ambitious above the safety of her children, most likely. she also insulted rhaenyra's death children when her daughter was litterally in the red keep (im not saying haelena should be punish for this or something similar, just that it was a stupid thing to say in regard of her safety)
1) Fair point
2) Are you talking about this?
Because he doesn’t mean book Aegon is a villain. He’a talking about Aegon’s portrayal in season 1 (straight up villain) vs season 2 where he was portrayed like an actual human, that’s why he says he was, “brought alive in ways we haven’t seen before” by the actor. He’s talking about the shit portrayal in season 1 vs the amazing one in season 2
3) This quote is from The Princess and the Queen, which has no sources. It is just written by George R R Martin
4) I agree Alicent puts her ambitious above all, but she also genuinely wanted to keep them safe and have the realm at peace. If it was purely ambition, why not just kill Rhaenyra rather than send peace terms?
Westeros, as grrm said, is an absolute monarchy and the definition of it is =a form of monarchy in which the sovereign is the sole source of political power, unconstrained by constitutions, legislatures or other checks on their authority. Not to mention that viserys in the book made a decree where he said that rhaenyra was his heir, so it's litterally write into the law that she is the rightful heir to the throne. if aegon was the rightful ruler, i assure you that grrm "my books are full of characters that made bad things and get repaid with the saim coin like jaime loosing the hand he used to push bran or tywin being killed by the child he neglected and abused" wouldn't kill the greens entirely bloodline (on the throne). aegon himself said in the screen you posted the throne was Rhaenyra's birthright so what's the point of deny it?
and the part where alicent say she fears for the life of her children is the funniest 😂
i fear for my children so let's torment the king's heir, and put the crown on my son (that DID NOT want it) and consequently start a war where i send my teenager children to fight (daeron was litterally 13 and aegon 19) on dragonback!!! everything will go ok, cause rhaenys the conqueror wasn't killed by an arrow even tho she had a big dragon in the conquest of dorne and jaehaerys' oldest son wasn't subject to same fate! what can possible go wrong??
1) The point of the Dance is that they both have a claim. Neither can be considered the Sole heir because Viserys named Rhaenyra heir, but by every law Aegon is heir. That’s one of the reasons the Dance happens. I’m not denying Rhaenyra is Heir, I’m saying Aegon is also Heir and that’s how we got in this mess
2) The Greens are not the villains. Both sides have good and bad people on it. George said he likes that people argue and debate who are the heroes and who are the villains when it comes to the Dance because neither side is totally in the right and neither side is totally in the wrong
3) If Rhaenyra wasn’t meant to be looked at as villainous, George wouldn’t write that Aegon’s victory is bittersweet in the Princess and the Queen
This is not the writing of someone who is a villain. What happens to Aegon is a tragedy, George treats it and writes it as such. And “narrative punishment” doesn’t really work here because Aegon was doomed from the start and like I said, he is written as a walking tragedy. If you want to talk about “narrative punishment” talk about Rhaenyra getting eaten by Sunfyre and how what comes next for House Targaryen through her bloodline is near total extinction
4) Ah yes. Fearing for your family’s life is SO funny! Also, she didn’t torment Rhaenyra. The book says there was tension between them, not that Alicent was terrible to her. And no, calling bastards bastards isn’t torment. Alicent is no saint, but she was never evil like you all make her out to be. She put the crown on Aegon’s head because she thought that would save from him from Rhaenyra and Daemon’s wrath if they were to be crowned, as she says, and than is one of the people who helps write peace terms. We, as the audience, know how misguided this is, but Alicent thought she protecting her children
friendly reminder that even when arya has been mocked and reprimanded by women and bullied by girls for failing at tasks that were deemed traditionally feminine, she has never hated and/or resented other women and girls for excelling at those same tasks.
do you ever get reminded that some awful shitheads took book!arya's "the woman is important too" attitude and somehow it got translated to show!arya's "most girls are idiots" attitude and you die a little bit inside? yeah me too.
or maybe we're tb cause rhaenyra was the rightful heir and she was usurped only because of her gender? 😁😁
“Rhaenyra was usurped only because of her gender”
Read the highlighted text. That is incorrect. By the laws of the 7 Kingdoms, Aegon is also the Heir to the throne, and they were fearful of their lives should Rhaenyra and Daemon rule
Something interesting: most Targaryen stans are Team Black while most Targaryen antis are Team Green. I din’t know why but I find this fascinating and want to look into why this is
Targ stans lean towards Rhaenyra probably because:
- They project Daenerys onto her (even though they are nothing alike)
- She represents all Targs stans for: strength through dragons, burning/killing all enemies, and has many dragons on her side that she utilizes
- She is “pure, true” Targaryen
Why anti Targs lean more towards the Greens:
- Supporting another house over the Targs
- Sympathize with Aegon and his oppression in his own family as not a pure Targ (his siblings experience too, to a lesser extent)
if you could write and produce any show about a great or minor house in the seven kingdoms (excluding the targs), which one would it be and why?
I was going to say the Starks because I love them so much, but I’d be lying if I said the show I want most is a Robert’s Rebellion show, which would be Baratheon focused. Especially because the shows worship the Targaryens so much, this show would be solely about the 7 Kingdoms fighting back against their oppressors, and winning
Most people don’t understand that the Targaryens are the villains of ASOIAF. They conquered the 7 Kingdoms in a violent, horrific way, inbreed to keep their blood pure which makes them blood supremacists, and the majority of them were evil, cruel rulers/people. Watching the people rebel against the people torturing them for hundreds of years would be so satisfying to watch
But then again, I also don’t trust HBO to ever paint the Targaryens as villains. They would probably rewrite GOT history to make Robert the villain and the Targaryens the victims. The proof is the way they’re treating the Dance. That is also about the people rebelling against their oppressors and largely succeeding (not 100% though). And yet they are painting the Greens/Hightowers as the villains and Rhaenyra/the Blacks as the victims and heroes
So yeah, maybe we should just go with a Stark show
You do realise that every house was trying to conquer the Seven Kingdoms right? And that every house is inbred right? And that every house is a blood supremacist right?
Also, Robert's Rebellion is not about the people rebelling, it's about the lords rebelling. The smallfolk liked Aerys well enough.
“You do realize that every house was trying to conquer the Seven Kingdoms right?” Not the same as foreign invaders coming, slaughtering anyone who won’t kneel to them, and taking over completely. And using their dragons as weapons of mass destruction and tools of oppression to make the 7 kingdoms fear them. There’s a reason we support Robb and the Northern cause to let the North be independent and it’s not JUST because “Lannister bad, Joffrey bad, they kill Ned.” It’s because the North is finally breaking free of the Iron Throne and non-Northerners ruling them
“Every house is a blood supremacist.” How so? Cause only the Targaryens go around spewing about their pure *dragon* blood
Robert’s Rebellion would have failed if it was only the Lords rebelling. Trying to imply the smallfolk weren’t afraid of Aerys is the most insane Targaryen stan take I have ever seen. Not for nothing is he known as the Mad King by all
Also in your tags:
Calling the Hightowers greedy as if the Targaryens weren’t greedy and lusting for power by invading Westeros. I will always support people FROM Westeros over the people who invaded and conquered it violently
And also saying the Targaryens did more good than any other House I- 😵💫
Literally all the Targaryens did was conquer Westeros and rule over people they saw as inferior with their tools of oppression and fear and, in the case of the worst rulers, torture the people of Westeros for 100s of years. These are your heroes and best House?
The Andals and the First Men aren't native of Westeros, they aren't FROM Westeros anymore than the Targaryens are. That's without mentioning the fact that they commited genocide over an entire race and are actual colonizers, which is something the Targaryens aren't and haven't done.
The Targaryens had already lived for a hundred years in Westeros before they conquered it. They are FROM Westeros.
If any other house had dragons they would have done the same thing the Targaryens did.
Every house goes "my blood is from the First Men/Andal" Robb Stark said that Jeyne's blood was better than the Frey's because she was a Westerling.
In the main series the smallfolk quite literally say that they prefer Aerys over Robert or Joffrey. I wouldn't say they weren't afraid of him, but he didn't bankrupt the kingdom, unlike the non-Targaryen rulers.
The Targaryen ended the tradition of the First Night.
Built roads.
Gave rights to the smallfolk (this was later undone by Tywin Lannister)
And gave them more years of peace that every before.
To your first point, yeah. Disgusting and not defendable, but this post explains really well why, in relation to you mocking my negative opinion on Targaryens as ironic cause I love the Starks, is null
Well no other House has dragons, so you can’t say that for sure. “I just think they would.” Is not a valid argument. And the point is that they DON’T. They are completely defenseless against them, and the Targs use them to keep them on their knees
Yes and again, while gross and undefendable, is not the same as the Targs saying they have The Blood of the Dragon and Only They Can Claim Them so no one else has access to the dragons and the use them as tools of oppression. If you don’t see how just saying something shitty is not as bad as action to oppress in relation to your blood, I can’t help you
As you yourself say, that doesn’t mean they weren’t afraid of him
Funny how 3/4 of the good things you list were done by one person. And they happened because of the evils of Aegon the Conqueror. But this is why I say not literally every Targ is a villain. But the majority of them are mass murdering maniacs
That post literally makes no sense, because yeah, the Starks are one of the most ancient of the FM houses so obviously their ancestors had a place in the genocide of the natives of Westeros if not as much as the Andals and their religion who pretty much ended them.
Was Tyrion a bully for using wildfire? Is Stannis a bully for using Melisandre and her magic? Is one house a bully for using bigger armies and more men? Are the Stark kids bullies for using their direwolves in fights?
Each used what they could, and this is a fantasy series so the Targaryens were simply lucky to have better weapons. But no, it's not comparable, because is a fantasy series. And the Targaryens didn't have dragons since the Dance, so it no longer applies.
Dude, normal people can't tame dragons. If they could, they would've, because no one can really control the dragons and in Dragonstone they flew freely. Anyone could have claimed a dragon in Dragonstone with the right amount of planning, but no one did because they didn't have what was necessary. And claiming dragons is more than just the blood, but the blood is necessary. Not valyrian blood, but rather blood of a dragonlord. Is like the warging and greenseers thing, only those with blood of the FM can do that. You don't seem to be complaining about that.
"the evils of Aegon the Conqueror" What evils are you referring to? The killing? He gave them a choice and every house kills and exterminates others if they can.
Majority of them are not mass murdering maniacs, there are a few, but not majority.
The difference between Tyrion using wildfire, Stannis and the magic of Melisandre, and the Starks with the direwolves is that they don’t claim only they can use them. Anyone can have access to similar weapons if they choose. And nothing you listed is even close to the destruction dragons cause
If that were true, explain very clearly to me how Nettles claimed Sheepstealer. Different than warging which is magic that very few people have
“He gave them a choice” Submit to me or die isn’t a choice
Targaryens that are mass murdering maniacs:
- Aegon the Conqueror
- Visenya Targaryen
- Rhaenys Targaryen
- Maegor the Cruel
- Aemond Targaryen
- Rhaenyra Targaryen
- Daemon Targaryen
- Mad King Aerys
And that’s JUST off the top of my head. And not including all the Targs that did other evils
if you could write and produce any show about a great or minor house in the seven kingdoms (excluding the targs), which one would it be and why?
I was going to say the Starks because I love them so much, but I’d be lying if I said the show I want most is a Robert’s Rebellion show, which would be Baratheon focused. Especially because the shows worship the Targaryens so much, this show would be solely about the 7 Kingdoms fighting back against their oppressors, and winning
Most people don’t understand that the Targaryens are the villains of ASOIAF. They conquered the 7 Kingdoms in a violent, horrific way, inbreed to keep their blood pure which makes them blood supremacists, and the majority of them were evil, cruel rulers/people. Watching the people rebel against the people torturing them for hundreds of years would be so satisfying to watch
But then again, I also don’t trust HBO to ever paint the Targaryens as villains. They would probably rewrite GOT history to make Robert the villain and the Targaryens the victims. The proof is the way they’re treating the Dance. That is also about the people rebelling against their oppressors and largely succeeding (not 100% though). And yet they are painting the Greens/Hightowers as the villains and Rhaenyra/the Blacks as the victims and heroes
So yeah, maybe we should just go with a Stark show
You do realise that every house was trying to conquer the Seven Kingdoms right? And that every house is inbred right? And that every house is a blood supremacist right?
Also, Robert's Rebellion is not about the people rebelling, it's about the lords rebelling. The smallfolk liked Aerys well enough.
“You do realize that every house was trying to conquer the Seven Kingdoms right?” Not the same as foreign invaders coming, slaughtering anyone who won’t kneel to them, and taking over completely. And using their dragons as weapons of mass destruction and tools of oppression to make the 7 kingdoms fear them. There’s a reason we support Robb and the Northern cause to let the North be independent and it’s not JUST because “Lannister bad, Joffrey bad, they kill Ned.” It’s because the North is finally breaking free of the Iron Throne and non-Northerners ruling them
“Every house is a blood supremacist.” How so? Cause only the Targaryens go around spewing about their pure *dragon* blood
Robert’s Rebellion would have failed if it was only the Lords rebelling. Trying to imply the smallfolk weren’t afraid of Aerys is the most insane Targaryen stan take I have ever seen. Not for nothing is he known as the Mad King by all
Also in your tags:
Calling the Hightowers greedy as if the Targaryens weren’t greedy and lusting for power by invading Westeros. I will always support people FROM Westeros over the people who invaded and conquered it violently
And also saying the Targaryens did more good than any other House I- 😵💫
Literally all the Targaryens did was conquer Westeros and rule over people they saw as inferior with their tools of oppression and fear and, in the case of the worst rulers, torture the people of Westeros for 100s of years. These are your heroes and best House?
The Andals and the First Men aren't native of Westeros, they aren't FROM Westeros anymore than the Targaryens are. That's without mentioning the fact that they commited genocide over an entire race and are actual colonizers, which is something the Targaryens aren't and haven't done.
The Targaryens had already lived for a hundred years in Westeros before they conquered it. They are FROM Westeros.
If any other house had dragons they would have done the same thing the Targaryens did.
Every house goes "my blood is from the First Men/Andal" Robb Stark said that Jeyne's blood was better than the Frey's because she was a Westerling.
In the main series the smallfolk quite literally say that they prefer Aerys over Robert or Joffrey. I wouldn't say they weren't afraid of him, but he didn't bankrupt the kingdom, unlike the non-Targaryen rulers.
The Targaryen ended the tradition of the First Night.
Built roads.
Gave rights to the smallfolk (this was later undone by Tywin Lannister)
And gave them more years of peace that every before.
To your first point, yeah. Disgusting and not defendable, but this post explains really well why, in relation to you mocking my negative opinion on Targaryens as ironic cause I love the Starks, is null
Well no other House has dragons, so you can’t say that for sure. “I just think they would.” Is not a valid argument. And the point is that they DON’T. They are completely defenseless against them, and the Targs use them to keep them on their knees
Yes and again, while gross and undefendable, is not the same as the Targs saying they have The Blood of the Dragon and Only They Can Claim Them so no one else has access to the dragons and the use them as tools of oppression. If you don’t see how just saying something shitty is not as bad as action to oppress in relation to your blood, I can’t help you
As you yourself say, that doesn’t mean they weren’t afraid of him
Funny how 3/4 of the good things you list were done by one person. And they happened because of the evils of Aegon the Conqueror. But this is why I say not literally every Targ is a villain. But the majority of them are mass murdering maniacs
A Knight if the Seven Kingdoms: The Hedge Knight Review
Just read it for the first time!
Thoughts:
- Another ASOIAF book, the more Targaryens for me to love to hate
- Not you, Egg and Daeron. Congrats you two! You have joined the ranks of the handful of Targs I like!
- I, Unfortunately, went in knowing Egg was an escapes Targaryen prince, but it really did provide quite the experience watching him desperately hide from them in King’s Landing. And I just knew Aerion must have done Some Shit for his little brother to be cheering for his death in the tourney
- Dunk fighting back against Aerion hurting the puppeteers was so good, and than the very end where he gets support from knights because he did what was right got a little emo
- Speaking of Aerion, what a delightful little villain. And the way Dunk was shocked that the King himself and his Kingsguard were fighting in the Trial by 7, honey these are who the Targaryens are
- Also, very interesting how Dunk turned down Maekar’s offer even though it was all he dreamed of days ago but now it frightened him gets me excited for exploring this gen of Targs’ cruelty
