Crystalizing Uranium since 1986

just a humble art blog and a home for my works "On-the-line" and I mostly focus on fanart for games I like. @DarkStarCore‘s partner in angst (you can’t disown me forever!) Stay for a while and have a good time! I’m largely inactive here so don’t get too comfortable haha (he/him for anyone who’s confused by my pfp). 22 year old dude with a big love for game design and fandom.

[redcat117]

replied to someone on a post and kinda realized i could totally make it a post

intersectionality is not "add your identities together and get oppression points." i personally like to think of it kind of like a phase graph from chem to help visualize and understand, idk how to explain that visualization best some chemistry nerd can probably explain, it just works for me

a transfeminized person experiences misogyny and experiences transphobia. but the hatred she faces isn't just misogyny + transphobia. the predator stereotype, the pervert stereotype, the bathroom panic, the specific ways trans women's bodies are hypersexualized and also extremely policed are not things that happen to cis women with some extra transphobia added on top. it's a unique discrimination that happens to transfems that is specific and inseperable. so transmisogyny is the intersection of transphobia and misogyny because you can't separate the misogyny from the transphobia and still accurately describe the way the discrimination, violence, and hatred functions.

this is part of why transandrophobia doesn't work.

for transandrophobia to be real, you would need to to show that there is a meaningfully distinct form of oppression experienced by transmascs/men that is from being both trans and being men. not transphobia that targets transmascs. not misogyny that catches people perceived as female. not just someone being uncomfortable around men. a specific, inseperable hatred of transmascs/men as transmascs/men.

for an example if a cis woman and a transmasc are both denied an abortion by the same law, under the same logic, by the same system, then it is not "transandrophobia," it's an example of reproductive misogyny. the transmasc/man is experiencing it as a trans person with a uterus. the cis woman is experiencing it as a cis person with a uterus. it's not happening because a trans man is a man, it's happening because the govt views people with the ability to give birth as incubators and those who cannot as failures.

there is no oppression that men face to intersect with transphobia and the misogyny that transmascs/men can get hit with isn't inseperable from the transphobia, those layers could be peeled back and the hatred and discrimination can still be discussed and described accurately.

[transfemme-shelterdog]

> transfem

> trying to tell trans men and transmascs that their oppression isn't real

Your opinion on this issue isn't relevant. You're not allowed to dictate who faces what oppression when you're not part of that group.

Also, how the *fuck* can you be ST4T and also go around saying that trans men and transmascs don't face hardships?

"I'll fuck you, but I don't care about your rights or oppression" holy hell

[crystaluranium]

Oh hey. So this user made this post in response to a comment I left.

Firstly, here’s the post I was responding to:

And here was my response, which prompted this OOP’s post here:

“hey so two things. Firstly, if a cis lesbian is correctively raped in an attempt to get her pregnant and 'make her straight', then according to this logic that's just misogyny and not lesbophobia, since just about any cis women can be forcefully impregnated. With this logic, the corrective rape/forced pregnancy lesbian cis women face is not lesbophobia or homophobia, its just misogyny. BC yk, the system doesn't see them as a lesbian, just someone who can and should give birth, right? It's not like in this scenario, she's being explicitly targeted for being a lesbian, right? In this case, calling it lesbophobia would be "but it happened to me because I'm gay which makes it special" which would devalue misogyny, right? Its not a unique oppression if it also happens to cis straight women, right? If you think this is wrong then idk reevaluate your position bc I'm literally just taking your logic to its natural conclusion here. Secondly. I'm sorry, but until the action of getting someone pregnant has the possibility of forcing you to undergo irreversible body changes that potentially result in permanent disability or death, then I just don't think that being forced to impregnate is the same level of harm as being forcefully impregnated. Being forced to impregnate does not inherently have the chance to literally kill you the same way that being impregnated does.”

And so, in response, OOP made the post above. And also forgot to include this bit here which she left out:

So here’s my response to all that (edited some for clarity/better formatting):

“Firstly, I never claimed that’s how intersectionality works. Secondly, if a trans man is correctively raped because he is attempting to transition to be a man/his aggressor wants to detransition him, and is specifically targeted for his identity, is that not an intersectional experience? A trans man is a man because he is trans, and is trans because he is a man. You can’t separate the two, just like how you can’t separate a lesbian (cis or trans) either from her sexuality or gender, both are at play. Thirdly, considering that trans men have the second highest rates of rape and sexual assault in the community, with AFAB NBs coming in first, higher than trans women and much higher than cis women, I’d say that’s material evidence enough to call it a distinct form of oppression. If it were just misogyny that just targeted people perceived as women, then the rates wouldn’t be as high as they are compared to both trans and cis women. Fourthly, trans men routinely have the worst medical outcomes of the trans community, are the most likely to be denied healthcare (trans related healthcare or not), are the most likely to report experiencing negative issues with health professionals, and are the most likely to avoid medical treatment. Yes, this is also much worse than what cis women experience. This discrepancy cannot be addressed by misogyny or transphobia alone. Fifthly, If you have problems with me in good faith using an analogy to try and describe the flaws in your rationale, then I’m sorry but I don’t think you should be attempting discourse if you can’t handle even basic pushback. Also out of the both of us, I’m the one who’s gay here, not that I even think it matters. What does me bringing up lesbians as an analogy have to do with you personally?”

And to round it out with my response to the stuff OOP did not list in this post:

“Sixley, You’re the one trying to rank oppressions here, not me. That being said, I just don’t think you understand the scope of things here. Trans men are the second most likely to be targeted by rape and sexual assault, with AFAB nbs coming in first. In addition, I’m not saying that being forced to impregnate isn’t traumatic, it often is extremely so. But you have to understand that like. Yes. Trans women may become suicidal *if* they’re forced to detransition. But. Trans men, if they’re impregnated, will *by necessity* be forced to detransition, as you are *required* to stop any and all medical transition while pregnant, along with the medical complications and full body feminization of pregnancy, while additionally suffering from the worst medical treatment outcomes in the community. Trans men are experiencing all that you mentioned trans women experience, but with added dangers. I’m not trying to invalidate how traumatic it can be for trans women to be forced to impregnate someone, but crucially this is a unique form of forced and dangerous detransition that trans women aren’t targeted for, and do not experience to the degree that trans men do. Trans women should both be vocal about how traumatic being forced to inseminate someone is, while respecting trans men when they say that they face a unique form of reproductive oppression. To add on and just make my position clear once more, I never once said that trans women don’t understand reproductive oppression, and I especially never said that they’re male, you’re putting words in my mouth. By virtue of being trans, all trans people experience it. What I am saying though is just that when it comes to this *one particular instance*, trans men do face this unique injustice more readily and suffer from more dangerous consequences.”

So yeah that’s it for now. Here’s all the context if you want. Normally I’m not petty enough to do these sorts of long responses, but honestly I’m just tired of this shit being deliberately mischaracterized and misunderstood.

[therapatical]

I think before you're allowed to argue about whether trans people who can get pregnant are vulnerable to state-sanctioned violence in ways that trans people who can't get pregnant are exempt from (even if they are vulnerable to different forms of violence! they are still exempt from this one thing), you should be required to watch a vaginal delivery as well as a cesarean delivery. on video. full video. there are plenty of educational videos online where you can do so. if you have never seen a birth, I do not want to hear about how trivial of a violence you think it is. I really don't.

[transfemme-shelterdog]

Also the permanent changes it can cause to your body.

Like yeah, body hair for transfems for some is INCREDIBLY dysphoria inducing. Now imagine if a transfem was banned from ever shaving anything ever, and was forced to have a beard and shag carpet of chest hair. Would make you wanna die right? Now imagine how trans guys who are dysphoric around their hips and waist and chest feel when they're forced to become *more* feminine looking and permanently unlike being able to shave. You can't shave off those changes.

[insomnia-cat]

Also I know it’s not the popular viewpoint, but stretch marks related to pregnancy are Also Permanent, for most people. I thought for the longest time that I was a bad person bc I didn’t feel empowered by my “tiger stripes” or my “battle scars” or however cis people try to paint the physical signs your body carried a baby. I genuinely thought I was monstrous bc whenever I look at the stretch marks I specifically gained from pregnancy I experience plummeting, horrible feelings in my stomach. But like. Birth for me was traumatizing. It wasn’t easy or magical or fun. I had an emergency c-section for my first child and thought I was going to die. Trauma + dysphoria + social shaming means this is the first time I’m talking publicly about how it feels to have marks on my body that won’t ever go away unless I elect to have expensive surgery, and if I have that surgery I am immediately ostracized and painted as shallow for not being able to overcome my trauma/dysphoria bc “girl power” or whatever (and no, saying “well I’m not a girl” does not stop this behavior.)

Birth for people who can have it but are dysphoric about it, can be a permanent trauma on their body in so many ways. It’s okay to acknowledge that and it doesn’t make a person bad for feeling those things and it doesn’t make us ungrateful when we do feel dysphoric over it.

(Obviously neither of you were saying that, but I have seen many who do and it’s always terrible when I do.)

[therapatical]

oh 1000%, it's also things like loose skin that can become a genuinely disabling issue for some people. one of my formative childhood experiences was watching Kate Plus Eight and her showing what pregnancy did to her body and how many problems it gave her. it was genuinely very sad and I felt bad for her (even if Kate herself had abajillion problems and is a truly deplorable human being. the original Karen). the amount of extra skin she had was to such a point that it interfered with her ability to do basic things like exercise at all, do laundry, etc. basically any physical activity. I wanna say she was also getting yeast skin infections due to there being so many folds and creases that would trap sweat and moisture etc.. and obviously she's an extreme case, but even a standard pregnancy is going to change your body in some pretty dramatic ways.

one of the most infuratingly sanitized phrases in the English language is, imho, "the miracle of life". it's said as if it's some sort of wonder and awe about the fact that we can create new life. and to some degree, that's part of it, sure. but the other side of it is that human beings being able to survive childbirth is truly a miracle. we shouldn't be able survive that. that amount of physical bodily trauma? that doesn't seem survivable. the fact that we can and routinely do survive it, is a full fucking miracle. it doesn't make sense that we can be literally ripped apart from the inside and be (for the most part) fine. the amount of blood loss, too. obviously people do die but modern medicine is such a miracle itself

[transmascmarypoppins]

why is this post completely broken in every way imaginable

[cecilsrandomeverything]

Broken notes… deactivated account… removed image….

Finally, we have them all.

[spacefinch]

In addition: OP’s name is just… gone. No “[insert username]-deactivated[insert a bunch of numbers]” as is the standard for deactivated blogs.

Just the world “deactivated.” Look upon their post, ye mighty, and despair.

[chatblancofficial]

It’ll be almost impossible to find this post unless it wanders across your dash.

[huewrite]

It wandered across mine. I shall help it travel forward.

[gossamermouse]

this is not a place of honor

[jackviator]

[dinosaurana]

Oh hey post of Ozymandius, good to see you again standing on your feet in a desert where no one remembers you

[purplepoisonpuppets]

ITS BACK AGAIN????????

[genderkoolaid]

the transandrophobia Wikipedia page is not being deleted (good work!) but I wanted to share the exchange that went to down.

I saw these screenshots in the notes ~2m after it was decided:

I just took these of the project page:

& looking in the edit history, I see this:

Nice to see this get defeated so quickly.

[fishtank-thinktank]

Also, I feel like it’s important to mention! That if the issue around the page is mainly the word transandrophobia, it should also be stated that the word is used two times in the entire article!



Twice, one in the intro alongside other words used to describe the oppression that trans men face in this way, the other one being a restatement of that fact: “is sometimes referred to as anti-transmasculinity,[1] transandrophobia,[2] or transmisandry” “The discrimination experienced by transgender men has been described using various words, but none have seen widespread use. Terms used include anti-transmasculinity and transandrophobia.”

The word transandrophobia is used twice in the article, both times referring to the different words that are used to describe trans men’s oppression.

[genderkoolaid]

the funniest thing about this is that transandrophobia deniers want to make anti-transmasculinity theory out to be some terminally online niche internet discourse thing soooo bad. they clearly want to present it as something completely outside the realm of legitimate theory, something no "reasonable adult" or "feminist" would ever buy into because its just so obviously wrong.

but then you have something like this. where it is just so painfully obvious they are on the same side of history as aphobes and biphobes. when you have people who 1) are not personally invested in transandrophobia not being a legitimate term, and 2) are actually looking at the academic and statistical sources given for transmasculine oppression, it becomes pretty obvious that this resistance is motivated by personal discomfort with the term.

notably, in my experience, people are super willing to come out swinging against transandrophobia, all confident in their rejection of the concept, until you respond with numerous cited sources on material transmasculine oppression and back it up with widely accepted feminist theory. then suddenly they ghost. so much anti-transmasculinity thrives as a direct result of people's refusal to acknowledge the reality of transmasc oppression, and when you can't do that because its a Wikipedia page with extensive sources, you have to fall back on petty defensive cruelty, because that was what was at the heart of this uproar all along.

keep talking about transandrophobia and/or anti-transmasculinity. use those terms. don't be embarrassed about it. if trans-rad-feminism gets to be slowly mainstreamed in queer spaces, why can't transunitism?

[genderkoolaid]

the discrimination against trans men Wikipedia page is not being deleted (good work!) but I wanted to share the exchange that went to down.

I saw these screenshots in the notes ~2m after it was decided:

I just took these of the project page:

& looking in the edit history, I see this:

Nice to see this get defeated so quickly.

[fitey777]

Interesting to note that the Connie of ConnieC420 is likely the same Connie of rin-tezuka/rin-tezuuka, know infighting shitstirrer. By searching the ConnieC420 name, we can find a backloggd account using the name Connie, the ConnieC420 username, and the icon the tumblr account used.

Connie has had zero problems throwing transphobic bullshit around to any trans person that doesn't agree with her, so I fully believe she meant it and only erased it when she realized that wikipedia actually doles out consequences for misconduct.

[malwareproductions]

hey. you have to love your trans brothers of color okay. and your trans sisters of color. and your nonbinary siblings of color. you have to okay. its simply non-optional

[transmen4tmapeople]

“The authors find that, following transition, a statistically significant earnings decrease is experienced by MTFs (-11%) while there are no significant changes to the earnings of FTMs.”

Geijtenbeek and Plug (2018)

“They found that there was a statistically significant decrease of -12% in earnings following MTFs transitioning from male-to-female and an insignificant increase of +7.5% for FTMs following their transition from female-to-male.”

Schilt and Wiswall (2008)

“these papers provide evidence consistent with a traditional cisgender pay gap, with ‘maleness’ enjoying an earnings premium over ‘femaleness’ in the workplace. These findings also jibe with qualitative research on FTMs experiences of transitioning while in the workplace, where they report feeling more respected and their human capital more highly valued following transition to male”

Connel (2010), Dozier (2005), Schilt (2006).

“The wider social science literature has documented greater negative feelings and prejudice against MTFs compared with FTMs, particularly by cisgender men.”

“The incomes of MTFs who begin living full-time as female at a younger age are lower than those who wait, while the incomes of FTMs who begin living full-time as male at a younger age are higher. These findings are consistent with the wider research on the differences in labour market returns experienced by cisgender men and women.”

Matthew Shannon (2022)

[razortouched]

These are all important studies! They also all have their flaws, and some are being misrepresented within the context of this post.

For example, the Schilt and Wiswal 2008 study only consists of 18 MtF workers and 25 FtM workers. This is an incredibly small sample size that cannot be used as representative of larger trends.

In the Geijtenbeek and Plug 2018 study, they find that "FTM workers earn significantly less than other men and MTF workers earn significantly more than other women." This contradicts other wage pay studies that show trans people of all genders earn less than cis people.

Also, important to note that this study only observes, "those transsexual individuals who go through hormone replacement therapy, sex reassignment surgery, and the legal process of changing one’s administrative gender." This is absolutely not representative of trans people in general. Particuarly in a country such as The Netherlands - where this study takes place - and where medical and legal transition is more accessible than in many other countries.

Your third paragraph is a quote of a paraphrase, making it hard to determine where exactly it came from.

The Matthew Shannon 2022 study I feel is the most misrepresented within the context of this post. The quote you gave is accurate, but the same paper says, "those who were assigned female at birth have significantly lower incomes and are more likely to work part-time than those assigned male at birth." So even with the advantages gained by transitioning young for FTMs, the overall trend is still that they earn less than those assigned male at birth.

These studies do show some interesting patterns! It's undeniable that being legally male and being percieved as male in the workplace has its benefits, and that includes for some FTM workers. But the context with which you presented these studies was dishonest, making it appear as is this is a trend that applies to trans people more broadly, when in reality is applies to much more particular groups. It also leaves out the fact that trans men are still disadvantaged in comparison to cis men.

[intersexcat-tboy]

I recognized the Matthew Shannon one and remembered I had a screenshot showcasing some of the data

The weighted average yearly income of trans women in this study was $53,550 and $38,130 for trans men

Researchers found that their first hypothesis in "Cultural and Personally Endorsed Stereotypes of Transgender Men and Transgender Women: Notable Correspondence or Disjunction?" (Link)— that "the cultural stereotype of transgender women was expected to be significantly more negative than that of transgender men based on previous research[…] was not supported." Instead, they note that "transgender men were found to be subject to a more strongly negative cultural stereotype than were trans women." It also notes that there are studies that found trans women face more prejudice, while another had found no difference. The second hypothesis, the theory that participants personal endorsement of stereotypes against trans women would be stronger, was also not supported by the data. However, there is an overrepresentation of cis women in the sample (75%)

[therapatical]

oh hey this mirrors some similar results found in the National Transgender Discrimination Survey

crunching the numbers (with a few variations; obviously since we don't have the raw data we can't 100% rely on these estimates, but there are still certain conclusions that are mathematically impossible. I just took the low and high ends of each category. the distribution might look totally different, but based on one of the tables towards the beginning that shows the full income breakdowns, it seems like every category skewed to the lower ends in a fairly even way, so I don't think this kind of estimating is going to be dramatically inaccurate. just don't take these numbers as gospel. which you shouldn't be doing anyways)

some other notable income-related parts:

[genderkoolaid]

May I add that cis feminists have been obsessed with transitioning and how it affects ones (typically middle class white collar) job because most trans-inclusive cisfeminism only sees trans people as a tool to prove cis people's gender relations?

Cis feminists LOVE an ancedote about a trans woman losing pay while a trans man gains it, because it slots perfectly into their pre-existing & cissexist understanding of gender oppression. Its the idea that cis women should include trans people, not as trans people, but as additional evidence that misogyny as it affects cis women and male privilege as it affects cis men is real.

Feminism that actually integrates trans position under patriarchy into its theory would recognize & discuss far more often how trans people are more affected by the gender pay gap and neglect in medical research than cis women, and would talk more about how nonbinary people, crossdressers, and other GNC-but-not-binary-trans people are affected by exorsexism & misandrogyny. But many cisfeminists, both cis and trans individuals, prefer to lean heavily on a cissexist ways of understanding transphobia that encourage trans people to think of ourselves as "cis people with extra steps" instead of talking about transphobia, exorsexism, oppositional sexism, and pushing feminism to go where it desperately needs to.

[razortouched]

Do I even need to say anything about how wildly wrong and dangerous this rhetoric is...?

Just in case...

1.) That's not what materialism is. "Making things better for people" is literally idealism by definition. Materialism refers to the actual material ways you can improve people's lives.

2.) Bodily autonomy, justice, [legal] equality, etc, are all broad concepts but can be established in ways that will materially improve people's lives.

3.) I'm sure I'll be accused of rape jacketing but holy shit how is this not just explicitly pro-rape rhetoric.

4.) Claiming to be a materialist but not valuing bodily autonomy, which is ome of the major examples of material conditions (ownership over one's actual material fucking form) is absolutely unconsciousnable

[transfemme-shelterdog]

> communist pfp

> parroting LITERAL fascist rhetoric

I Suggest Transfeminism? More like I Suggest Volk ohne Raum

[trans-bastard-dogboy]

op is right, this is some rape-y stuff, even if it wasn’t like, meant that way, that’s just how that ends.

bet this mf also would be mad if you violated their autonomy for whatever reason. tends to be the case.

[crystaluranium]

Should be clear that she’s been on some bullshit for a while tbh

[learn-how-to-love]

I found out today that there was a (thankfully very ill-fated) attempt to have the entire Wikipedia article on discrimination against transgender men deleted. At first I thought the perpetrator was yet another bargain bin transphobe/TERF act of disruption but apparently not so, she is a trans woman. The user in question had been disputing the use of transandrophobia in the article as being inappropriate, but as other editors pointed out, the way in which it was used was as to be expected (basically saying “hey this term is being used commonly right now in places to describe this phenomena”). When attempts to get the article edited to remove any mention of the term failed, this user instead decided to just nominate the whole article for deletion instead. She even went as far as to say “you will never be a man” to the editors disputing this, though it was quickly deleted. It’s the actions of only a single person, but I find this indicative of how the chronic devaluing and othering of transmasculine people and voices in faux-transfeminist spaces leads to action basically indistinguishable from cis transphobes. Resorting to attempted vandalism of an online resource and blatant transphobia is a symptom of this trend that deserves absolutely no patience at this point.

[professorfcknmoriarty]

[crystaluranium]

Reblog this version it includes more than mine

[learn-how-to-love]

I found out today that there was a (thankfully very ill-fated) attempt to have the entire Wikipedia article on discrimination against transgender men deleted. At first I thought the perpetrator was yet another bargain bin transphobe/TERF act of disruption but apparently not so, she is a trans woman. The user in question had been disputing the use of transandrophobia in the article as being inappropriate, but as other editors pointed out, the way in which it was used was as to be expected (basically saying “hey this term is being used commonly right now in places to describe this phenomena”). When attempts to get the article edited to remove any mention of the term failed, this user instead decided to just nominate the whole article for deletion instead. She even went as far as to say “you will never be a man” to the editors disputing this, though it was quickly deleted. It’s the actions of only a single person, but I find this indicative of how the chronic devaluing and othering of transmasculine people and voices in faux-transfeminist spaces leads to action basically indistinguishable from cis transphobes. Resorting to attempted vandalism of an online resource and blatant transphobia is a symptom of this trend that deserves absolutely no patience at this point.

[crystaluranium]

Doing my due diligence to include a screencap just in case, but for now it should all be public record in the article itself

[velvetvexations]

The amount of lying that gets slung at trans men on Tumblr is just kinna ridiculous lol, it's like watching Fox News. The idea that the random dentransitioner Nazi "popularized" the term transandrophobia is so stupid even separate from the illiterate fucks who started spreading that she coined it.

In what way did she popularize it? How many notes did her posts get? Who followed her? Can you find anyone who reblogs from her, or did reblog from her? Prove that she was an influential figure in any way whatsoever.

[lonelydesolate]

oh look! something approaching actual thoughtful analysis on anti-transmasculinity from a popular transfeminist. i wonder if -

oh okay. oppression specific to trans men can manifest sometimes as them being thought of as childish deluded unserious and in need of correction. ANYWAY here's why these loony whiny corny stupid liberal tboys dont know what theyre talking about and need me to give them a Real Term to talk about their own oppression.

[therapatical]

fun reminder that tara was the main one who came up with a nickname to mock me for being a victim of SA. and then spread it to her friends. and all her friends kept calling me that nickname containing the word "rape" as a play on words for my username. to literally make fun of me for being a victim. and when confronted on this, she basically refused to confirm nor deny it but instead misgendered me in her response. :)

[therapatical]

side note, when people like this do the first screenshot (exhibiting that they fully understand transmasc issues with no problem), I think we need to start taking that as evidence that these people know what they're doing. stop giving her--and everyone else doing the same thing--benefit of the doubt.

"she's so close! she's right there! why doesn't she understand!" she does, though. she just demonstrated to you that she understands it fully. she doesn't care. she wants to be fucking evil and transphobic about it all. she wants the dopamine hit of telling internet strangers that she's better than them and superior to them. all of these assholes who act like this are the same way. stop assuming they're misunderstanding everything. when they demonstrate that they know what other people deal with, and then pivot hard to all the little radfem games they wanna play, that is an admission that the whole thing is a grifty farce.

she knows what she's doing. she is exactly as cruel as you think that would carry you to conclude based on those actions. she is not mistaken or misinformed, she is deliberately cruel and a bad fucking person. she enjoys seeing the way people fall for her bullshit and she enjoys other people's suffering. that's why she made an AI generated FBI photo and spread it online, knowing it would scare a bunch of other trans people shitless. she wants attention, good or bad, and doesn't care who gets hurt in the process.

stop assuming bigoted people are lacking agency in their bigotry. stop infantilizing radfems. for one, that's kinda misogynistic in and of itself. but ik many of us want to assume the best in people, and don't want to face the reality that some of these online figures are flat out evil. stop trying to inadvertently defend these people when they could not give a rat's ass whether you lived or died. trolls know what they're doing and they enjoy doing it.

[stop-lying-about-trans-men]

anyone who stands behind this sexist transphobic lying shitstain needs to get punched in the face. same as doomersis same as that circle of fashy little douchebags. just a bunch of wastes of oxygen who lie and lie to maintain the ridicule and infantilization of trans men.

imagine, fucking IMAGINE, a trans man saying this exact same thing word for word. imagine him saying ANYTHING shown in this thread that she is praised for saying. imagine the flaming vitriol, imagine how the narrative surrounding him would instantly (and correctly) overwrite anything else he did to focus on what a raging transphobic sexist he was.

but hating trans men is acceptable. anyone who still stands behind tara is a shitstain on a shoe. and they track that smell wherever they go.

[crystaluranium]

I find it really really *interesting* that she specifically said "sex" and not "gender". Benefit of the doubt she meant something like "trans males" (derogatory), but my intuition is telling me it was meant more along the lines of "females" (derogatory, misogynistic, and transphobic).

Idk, I've seen enough transphobic dog whistles to get an idea of how these things tend to come about. And also. She's a writer, she writes for a living. Surely of all people someone like her would understand the importance of word choice. Makes you think.

[redlipstickresurrected]

Youran Tang aka Sleell11 (Chinese, based Chaoyang District, Beijing, China) - 思绪 (Thoughts), 2022, Paintings: Digital Art

[that-grassbro]

Ok, let me know if i'm missing something here.

But a common criticism/insult towards transmascs is that they are all 'uwu fandom hitlerites', right?

But now transmascphobes are complaining that transmasc hcs and fics dominate ao3?

Like wasn't there a tumblr poll recently which showed that 80% of transmascs write/have written fanfic compared to like 30% transfems. Of course transmascs write about themselves.

[crunchbuttsteak]

Yeah… I wonder why there are so few transfems in fandom spaces…

It’s a real fuckin mystery.

[that-grassbro]

I'll need to find that poll again to get that exact number but i'm pretty sure transfems were third most likely to write fanfic with cis queer women beating them by 5~%.

While transmisogyny and transfem inclusion in fandom spaces is a good topic to talk about its not particularly relevant to what I'm talking about right now which is the devaluation of anything transmascs like, and once it becomes popular, the scrutinisation of it.

Transmasculine domination in fandom has often been used as a thing to mock them for, but nobody ever points it out as a positive. When people are currently pretending that transmascs 'have no culture beyond ukelele music', bringing up how much they've contributed to fandom spaces is important.

The stereotype of the 'pooner' or fujoshi transmasc who keeps trying to make every character trans, or is obsessed with writing porn originates from the fact that transmascs genuinely have written, drawn and contributed more than most other groups.

Transmasc interests are always something to devalue them for, but once wider society likes their art suddenly its 'well why dont you do it for everyone else as well??'

[heseemstobeeatingsomething]

it's real interesting how trans communities that are mostly transfem isn't an issue but trans communities that are mostly transmasc somehow is.

[raingardening]

i think there is a phenomenon where sometimes a trans person will go “hmm. i am treated as a man when it is convenient for others, and a woman when it is convenient for others, and often as a freakish third thing excluded from the advantages of both. surely, because of the gender binary, the Other Type of trans person experiences the opposite: they reap the benefits of maleness and femaleness at once.” like babes no they can do it twice

[sqbr]

This applies to a bunch of other subgroups of the queer community too. Asexuals are made to feel like freaks for not being sexual enough by the same society that makes everyone else feel like freaks for being too sexual. Lesbians feel pressured to be bi even while bi women feel like they'd be more accepted if they were lesbian. Butches, femmes, and wlw who are neither are all made to feel like they're doing it wrong. PLUS unique facets of shittiness for every shade of non binary PLUS different attitudes towards mlm and wlw PLUS divisions within mlm spaces etc etc etc. And these frictions and differing needs and experiences are absolutely worth discussing, but every time we decide the problem is just that Those Other Queers have it easy we are making the actual problem worse.

[grison-in-space]

Hilariously, it also happens within the asexual community as a function of even smaller identity microcosms; I grew up watching waves of this crash back and forth on AVEN back in the day.

Babes. They can always do it twice.

[hestia-and-the-court]

The only people who benefit from crabs fighting each other in the bucket are the people looking to have crab for dinner. So stop beating each other up over whether or not crabs with bigger claws have more privilege than the ones with more segments in their legs or whatever, and get ready to team up and fight as one when someone reaches into the bucket to eat someone. -Diana

[hi-fi-planetoid]

The "ugh trans men really are men" reaction that some people apparently have when they have a shitty interpersonal experience with a trans man is so blatantly transphobic and dehumanizing. Especially if that comment is coming from someone who was previously in an intimate relationship with that trans man.

What that statement tells me is that in the mind of the speaker, trans men's manhood is up for debate. That before a trans man engages in a negative action that this person sees as "man behavior", the trans man isn't "really a man". People look at us and expect us to be more sensitive, more emotionally mature, they expect us to be therapists for free, they expect us to take abuse and say nothing they expect us to so everything women are expected to do with none of the social support. They do this because they see us as having an inherent connection to femininity because they assume we were afab, and they associate these things with women. We're automatically put under an inhuman level of scrutiny, so when we inevitably show that we're actually human beings and have flaws, that's when "we really are men". The bias underneath that statement is actually "I see poor behavior as men's behavior and kind behavior as women's behavior". When we "behave" we're mentally slotted into this position where we're not really men in the minds of people with these mindsets and they'll treat us like ticking time bombs if we take up any space.

If you can't stand to be around trans men unless we're perfect silent stress toys, you're not a trans ally.

If you're a trans man and your partner only affirms your gender in a negative context, you deserve better.

[therapatical]

it's a very classic, almost textbook perfect example of Ultimate Attribution Error

[luckynein]

If you aren’t already aware, Health & Wellbeing - Findings from the 2022 U.S. Trans Survey was released recently. I wanted to make a post focusing on when it talks about trans men but I fully recommend yall look at the thing fully as well.

When it comes to healthcare, trans men are among the most likely to avoid care because of mistreatment and were among the highest to have negative experiences with healthcare providers.

When it comes to hormone and transition related surgery denials, trans men are among the highest.

Presented without comment. (And acknowledging this is not separated by gender and those other than trans men are included in this bit)

Lastly I wanted to illustrate the huge disparity between trans people of any gender at all and cis people wrt serious psychological distress.

[nixisverytired]

Not to derail but I think it would be useful if people also took note of the nonbinary stats here, since exorsexism is running rampant in this discourse as well.

Trans men, transmascs, and nonbinary people in general are suffering right now, and sometimes it feels like the rest of the community is either ignoring our oppression or actively perpetuating it.

[randomramblesofaraven]

Another bump because as someone who works in healthcare, I have seen this multiple times.

Transmascs and nonbinary people are the ones who come in latest, with the most severe health conditions.

Transmascs and nonbinary people are the ones who neglect their healthcare because they have faced so much heinous transphobic medical abuse.

All trans folks suffer in healthcare, but it's transmascs and nonbinary people I have seen in particular, over and over again, dealing with serious and life-altering/life-threatening complications specifically because they have been abused so consistently and awfully by the medical system, in a way targeted DIRECTLY at their transmasculinity or transneutrality, that they have let otherwise treatable conditions progress to a point where they are actually dangerous.*

We need to talk about that. Transmascs and nonbinary folks need to be able to talk about that, without being shouted down by people who are not transmasc and nonbinary, who consistently downplay and dismiss their very real and dangerous suffering.

If you cannot accept that a different minority group may, in fact, suffer comparably - or even more than you - in specific ways, you are, in fact, the problem. This is your wake-up call - it's time to do some soul searching. It is NOT GOOD PRAXIS to argue endlessly with transmascs and nonbinary people about what language they are 'allowed' to use. Start campaigning to support your trans brothers and siblings, rather than trying to shut them down when they discuss the very real oppression they face.

*Intersex people also fall into this category. They weren't even included in this study - which, really, tells you everything you need to know about the atrocious state of intersexism in our society.

[ceanothusspinosus]

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