How the Overlords are the Cheap Imitator Wannabes of the Sins
So here’s an interesting thought I’ve been mulling over since rewatching Hazbin Hotel and Helluva Boss: What if the Sinner Overlords end up representing foils to the Seven Sins we’re meeting in both Hazbin Hotel and Helluva Boss? Specifically in that the overlords are pale imitators and wannabes of the Kings of Sin?
Like I think it’s pretty easy to look at Angel Dust and Valentino and see parallels and foils to Fizzerolli and both Asmodeus and Mammon. Basically Valentino has the sexual and ‘romantic’ (BIG air-quotes there) angle of Asmodeus and the cruel and exploitative angle of Mammon.
But just looking at Valentino during his first appearance in Hazbin, I think we can already see another interesting contrast: We see Valentino throwing a big petty tantrum simply because Angel Dust has started living somewhere else. The mere prospect of Angel Dust being anywhere but completely under his thumb causes Val to pitch a complete hissy fit and needs to be reminded by Vox that Angel still works for him and that this change really doesn’t mean anything.
And I think this makes an interesting contrast to what we see from Mammon, who I think it’s pretty clear basically never cared one bit about WHAT Fizzarolli was doing so long as he was still working for Mammon and promoting his brand. He didn’t seem to have any kind of issue with Fizz working with Ozzie, living with Ozzie or being in a relationship with Ozzie, so long as Fizz still worked for HIM. Heck, even when Fizz straight up calls Mammon a pieces of SHIT, in front of a packed audience, Mammon stews and grumbles but still keeps quiet. It’s ONLY when Fizzarolli announces that he’s quitting that Mammon actually flips out.
And I think that might be one of the big ways that the Overlords act as a foil to the Sins: Whereas the Sins are completely self-assured and comfortable in their position, the Overlords generally are massively insecure and will flip out at the slightest challenge to their position. Obviously we see this trend in much more than just Valentino:
Vox, Alastor, Velvette, and even Carmilla ALL likewise display varying levels of deep-seated insecurities in one way or another. Obviously, Vox’s and Alastor’s hangups and insecurities have been EXTREMELY well-documented at this point, and while we may not have directly seen Velvette’s insecurities on display just yet, the fact that she clearly has a major chip on her shoulder regarding the other Overlords and a LOT to prove as seen in Episode 3 implies that she almost certainly has some major personal hangups of her own. Even Carmilla, despite being one of the more well-established and secure Overlords, clearly has her own personal hangups as we likewise see in Episode 3 when getting challenged by an ‘upstart’ like Velvette.
Which all contrasts heavily with how generally comfortable, secure and self-assured the Kings of Sin have come off as. As I’ve discussed in a number of HB posts, the Sins seem to occupy this really interesting position of being these big, wacky, over-the-top and carefree celebrity personalities who ALSO happen to be these monstrously powerful and ancient beings. They never act like they have something to prove because they really DON’T. The Sins are THE top of the chain in Hell, so why should they worry about what anyone thinks of them? Nobody is going to challenge them because nobody CAN challenge them, short of Lucifer, Lilith (or Charlie…) or the forces of Heaven*
Whereas the Overlords all seem to have something to prove in one way or another, the Sins clearly have nothing to prove. Again going back to Episode 2, just look at how Valentino needs people like Vox and Velvette to manage his tantrums and keep him from doing something stupid, whereas even Mammon clearly doesn’t need that kind of babysitting.
And on top of all of this, what if some of the more prominent Overlords we’ve seen are meant to be direct contrasts, foils or even imitators of the Sins?
Like I think it’s already pretty easy to see Alastor being presented as a foil to Lucifer, particularly in how they embody Pride. Lucifer, much like Ozzie and Bee, could be seen as displaying the positive potential of ‘Pride’, ie; self-confidence and self-assuredness. So much of Lucifer’s personality comes off as this total dorky, cringefail loser, yet he clearly has zero shame about this and seems to care little for how most people think of him. It’s clear that basically the ONLY person whose opinion he really cares about is his daughter’s.
And by contrast, I think it’s pretty clear that Alastor is/will be a PERFECT representation of the negatives of Pride: Deeply insecure, obsessed with power, status and attention from others, and absolutely TERRIFIED of people discovering his secret shames.
Then we have Valentino, who I think could have some very interesting contrasts to Asmodeus. Obviously we have the very sharp contrast between the demon lord who decries love potions as ‘artificial bullshit’ and makes a staunch point about how “lust shouldn’t be about force”, and the human sinner who routinely sexually abuses and assaults those under his control and runs what clearly seems to be a VERY exploitative business.
More than that however, I think there are some very interesting thematic contrasts in how these two represent the idea of ‘Lust’, namely that Valentino represents a very narrow and limited aspect of lust. Basically, Valentino represents lust as nothing more than one-sided objectification and exploitation. He’s ‘all take and no give’.
On the flipside, Asmodeus is a true embodiment of Lust in ALL its forms. He sees it as an experience to be enjoyed by all participants. He’s ‘give’ and ‘take’ (or perhaps ‘receive’) in EQUAL measure.
I think there’s actually a great point of symbolic contrast in how Valentino runs his porn business and Asmodeus runs his nightclub: Both of these are centered on lust as a performance, but consider how Valentino is always the one behind the camera. Meanwhile, Ozzie isn’t just the proprietor of his nightclub, he also seems to be the star attraction, what with how he doesn’t hesitate to jump up on stage to put on his own song number alongside Fizzarolli. Whereas Valentino merely lusts after others, Asmodeus seems to enjoy lusting after and being lusted after in equal measure.
Finally, has anyone else noticed a bit of visual similarity between these two? A few people have already pointed out that Valentino’s outfit design has some similarities to Asmodeus’s ‘mini-form’ we briefly see in his debut episode and again in the midseason special. Even going back as far as the Addict music video, does anyone else notice some similar designs between Valentino’s club that Angel and Cherri burn down and Ozzie’s own nightclub we see in Helluva Boss?
Well, what if these similarities are intentional? As in, what if Valentino has deliberately tried to style himself and his brand after Asmodeus? Which of course would make Valentino nothing but a half-baked, didn’t-even-get-the-point, imitator of the TRUE Embodiment of Lust.
And then we have Vox, who I’m thinking might actually contrast Mammon. Now obviously, unlike with the previous two cases, this ISN’T a contrast of one showing a ‘positive’ interpretation of Greed. Instead, I think the point of contrast is in their effectiveness.
As scummy and shitty as he might be, there’s no denying that Mammon is really good at marketing his brand, and has been for a LONG time. Just look at how even before getting Fizz as his ‘brand baby’, he was still selling out packed stadiums for his shows. Between Fizzarolli, Loo-Loo Land and likely any number of other ventures, it’s clear that Mammon has a keen eye for what people like and how to market it to them. I mean for as run-down and sketchy as Loo-Loo Land was, it also seems to have been successful for a long time, given that went there as a kid.
Vox meanwhile, seems to be much more of a trend-chaser, and generally seems quite a bit more insecure. Like we see him seemingly running this multimedia empire, but that really feels more like he’s just trying to cover as many bases as he can. See also, the fact that he clearly relies on help from Valentino and Velvette FAR more than he wants to admit.
And perhaps most notably, consider how it seems like he at least sometimes uses some form of hypnotic suggestion to get people to watch his shows and buy his products. Essentially, he needs to prop up his business with his actual powers as an Overlord. Something we don’t really see Mammon doing.
And as far as being a direct imitator goes, we’ve all recognized how both Val and Vox use what are clearly Robo-Fizzerollis, but consider this:
What if the ‘Kitties’ aren’t actually modified Robo-Fizz’s, but rather a bootleg/knockoff of Robo-Fizz created by Vox? Which would get even more interesting if the events of Hazbin take place AFTER what we’ve seen in Helluva, ie; after Fizz quit working for Mammon who we know from The Full Moon is now done with Robo-Fizzes. What if the ‘Kitties’ are nothing but repackaged, bootleg Robo-Fizzes that Vox is passing off as his own? Just chasing the trends and coattails of the Sin of Greed.
And as an aside, I think the existence of these robots is a hint that Hazbin does in fact take place AFTER Helluva Boss, or at least everything we’ve seen thus far. As in, I think the only way Vox is getting away with hocking clear knockoffs of Robo-Fizz without invoking the ire of the Embodiment of Greed is if said embodiment doesn’t want anything to do with Robo-Fizzes anymore.
Now admittedly, after Vox the specific points of contrast for the other Overlords to Sins get a bit harder to pin down. Like it’s a bit hard to pin either Velvette or Carmilla as a foil to Beelzebub, let alone any of the Sins we haven’t met yet.
That being said, we are due to meet Satan, as well as possibly Leviathan, by the end of this season, so we may find more parallels with them. Like we do know that Leviathan seems to run Hell’s social media, which could make her a foil to what we’ve seen from Velvette.
Now admittedly, given that we are unlikely to get real Hazbin-Helluva crossover anytime soon, I can’t imagine all this will be especially relevant to the narratives of either show.
Obviously, the Sins couldn’t care less about a bunch of sinner Overlords, and if they WERE given a reason to care, it likely would NOT end well for the latter. Like if Vox was making his ‘Kittie’-bots before the events of Mammon’s Musical Special, then as soon as the big Aussie Pine-Tree Spider found out, Vox would have maybe five seconds before Mammon portals up to Pride, squashes him like a bug so hard even sinner immortality isn’t putting him back together, obliterates his base of operation, takes over his production and rebrands the ‘Kittie-bots’ as a new Robo-Fizz spinoff and maybe squashes Valentino and/or Velvette on his way out.
Now on the other hand, we could see this idea explored in a one-sided capacity as we explore more and more of the Overlords’ character. Like if we ever explore Valentino’s background, that would be a nature place to put something like him wanting to emulate Asmodeus, the Embodiment of Lust. And of course, there is the dynamic between Alastor and Lucifer that we see in Hazbin proper.
Basically, I see all of this as being more part of just the Overlords’ character than anything that would end up directly involving any of the Sins.
*And even then, I imagine it’s only the higher ranks of angels that could pose a serious threat to the Sins. Given how Lucifer handled Adam in the finale (and given that Charlie is clearly nowhere near her full potential yet), I think it’s fair to assume that Ozzie, Bee, Mam or any of the others probably could have kicked Adam’s ass with similar ease.
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