the greek goddess herself

comes with a free subscription to anxiety, depression, and PTSD. also marvel, writing, anything greek, and music.

[greekgoddess458]

can we all agree that

women in suits.

[biggest-gaudiest-poltergeist]

you know how some parents do that toxic thing where they don’t notice or reward kids for improving their behavior, but every screw-up gets remarked upon and used to inflict shame? so you’re stuck in that awful cycle where there are no rewards, only the inevitability of eventual punishment?

[biggest-gaudiest-poltergeist]

and how that makes it extremely hard to judge your own actions or grow into a better person, because there’s no one to confirm that you actually are doing better, and are capable of improving, and are not doomed to forever be a terrible person incapable of growth?

[biggest-gaudiest-poltergeist]

ok so: I don’t know how to explain to you that we’ve built a social media culture that treats people the same way. with the same abusive cycle.

[tomboyjessie13]

That sounds like cancel culture

[biggest-gaudiest-poltergeist]

I don’t know what to call it anymore. people get heated about terms like “purity” or “cancel” or “call out” culture, or can’t seem to agree on a meaning. I’m not talking about like. no longer supporting rich and powerful celebrities when their abusive actions come to light. I’m not talking about holding people accountable, or warning people about active abusers. but I am seriously concerned about how we treat social media users once they get even a small amount of attention, even in small niche spaces.

I am concerned about this culture of combing through years of people’s social media accounts, looking for “problematic” shit they’ve done. I am concerned with the whole culture of using “call outs” as a tool to harass and ostracize users large and small. I am concerned about the malice we spread behind people’s backs, in screenshots and posts they aren’t able to see. I am concerned with this culture of demanding apologies for things said years ago, things already outgrown and regretted, and of ignoring those apologies even while pilling on more censure. I’m concerned about this whole culture of accusation and misinformation, where the most outrageous claims and holier-than-thou performances are rewarded with notes and views, even as facts are ignored and context removed. I am concerned about the lack of accountability, the way the accused is given no opportunity to defend themselves from the onslaught, the way their responses and explanations go ignored, the way any charge can be made at any time on any evidence, with no ability to appeal or exonerate. I’m concerned about the way this culture targets minority users and turns their own communities against them. I’m concerned about the actually harmful and predatory behavior that gets lost in the bog, and how we have lost the ability to distinguish between shades of gray with any level of sanity. And I am concerned by the sheer number of people who fail to realize they are perpetuating bullying and harassment.

I am enormously concerned with the way people who are “called out” are never forgiven, never allowed to make amends, never allowed to grow, how their efforts to learn and do better are ignored even while strangers callously repeat and reblog and retweet the same criticisms ad nauseam.

And I see this everywhere, happening to anyone. And yes, this applies to larger accounts and youtubers and “influencers,” and a bunch of content creators who may or may not be making a decent living off of their work, but who are certainly not “rich and powerful celebrities.” (Because apparently we spend so much time in online microcosms that ya’ll can’t tell the difference???) Christ, my blog isn’t nearly as large as some people seem to think, it’s obscure by most measures, and still I’ve been the target of mass harassment for years. I’ve seen bad and watched others go through worse, seen users with far larger and far smaller followings driven off of this and other platforms—driven off with a violence and bloodthirst that had nothing to do with making a community safer and everything to do with a toxic culture gone wrong. Fucking fix this already.

Abuse is still abuse when it happens online, when done by strangers, when done en masse, when sanctioned by a community, and when done with “good” intentions. Do BETTER.

[biggest-gaudiest-poltergeist]

oh, and to anyone who has reblogged this and similar posts I’ve written with the “Heartbreaking: The Worst Person You Know Just Made A Great Point” meme? that is literally an example of the behavior this post is criticizing. you are literally just punishing good behavior instead of allowing people to grow and do better. I’ve been the subject of smear campaigns for years, and I’ve lost track of the number of times someone has added that meme to one of my most carefully worded, thought-out, sincere and earnest posts, posts on serious social and mental health issues. It’s exhausting, it’s not helpful, and guess what? It’s just plain bullying. Do better, and allow others to do better too. 

[starredforlife]

new quiz y'all! worked on this until 4 am lol. reblog and tell me, what kind of supervillain are you?

[spones-in-my-bones]

[aeondeug]

My girlfriend would be hot as fuck as the big bad, honestly, so sure let’s do this thing.

[hotvampireadjacent]

[sunnibits]

👀

[greekgoddess458]

welp guess im a good guy now

[greekgoddess458]

i wanna go home.

not to my house, but to my home.

[furiousgoldfish]

It is likely you will feel the worst of your trauma only after you’re safely away from your abusers. A lot of you need to hear this and be prepared. Even if you didn’t have a strong reaction to trauma while it was going on, even if you felt like you were fine, and even if you can manage your symptoms now, once you’re safe (as in, abusers physically can’t get to you), the absolute worst of trauma will hit you because it will be finally, for the first time in your life, safe to feel it. This can mean exhaustion like you’ve never felt before, because it’s the first time you’re allowed to rest, and you don’t have to expect a sneak attack like you normally would. It can mean more panic attacks, more breakdowns, flashbacks, nightmares, feelings of terror, re-living past, feeling frozen in trauma, paralyzing, shaking, crying, having your entire body hurt and ache, your chest feeling like it’s tearing in pieces. You might experience bursts of rage and feel so irritated and restless you’ll want to jump out of your body. Your fear of the abuser will increase thousandfold and you will feel like you’d rather die than spend one additional second in their presence after what they did to you. It will become completely insane to you that you were able to live in their presence ever before.

This post-trauma effect isn’t irrational or exaggerating, if you feel this it’s because this is how horrible the trauma really was, but your were not able to feel it in the moment for several reasons; one of them is that it was unsafe to feel those things in front of abusers, they have already taught you that you will be punished for displaying trauma symptoms in front of them. To be additionally hurt in the middle of such pain would be unsurvivable. The other is that it would have killed you to feel all that as a kid. Keeping all that repressed to feel later is your body’s strategy of survival, you can only feel it now because you’re still alive in order to do it.

What you’re going thru is extreme and something nobody on the earth should be put thru. No matter what you do, do not blame yourself for your symptoms, because it’s impossible for you to cause this to yourself. Know that whoever caused this to you did it on purpose, and is absolutely evil for it. You did not deserve this. Go easy on yourself and allow yourself more comfort, more rest, more ease than ever, you do not need any additional stress, grief or self hatred in this time of your life. It is awful, and extreme, but it will get better. It wouldn’t be happening if your body didn’t estimate that you can survive it. It will come in waves, so don’t despair if you get a little better and then worse, it’s designed to allow your body a little rest before the next wave hits it, again in order to be survivable. Trust your body to know what to do, because it already pulled you thru so much trauma alive. And do not trust anyone who doesn’t think you should be safe from people who have done this to you.

[octopuscato]

I can’t believe “You need to tag whether or not your fic has a sad ending or else you’re untrustworthy/being a dick!” is a legitimate demand in fandom these days. I just. No. No no no. Good grief. I’m so glad AO3 doesn’t actually require any of this.

There is a level of “manage all my emotions for me!” that I find deeply disturbing, and this belongs into that category.

Now excuse me while I make love to ao3’s default and only actually required tag, “author chose not to use archive warnings”.

[greekgoddess458]

hey, as someone with severe complex ptsd and as someone that can go into an episode from things with no trigger warnings, i just wanna say one thing.

fuck you.

[octopuscato]

How is it my responsibility to micromanage your mental health? I tag everything that is required to tag. If that is not to your taste, don’t read my fics. You are not my target audience, and you are not entitled to being my target audience. Essentially, our conversation boils down to: Me: “I’m doing fandom this [perfectly legitimate by the standards of the platform I post on ] way, because I really don’t like that other way.” You: “Fuck you for using Ao3 the way you’re entitled to, I should be able to lay the burden of my mental health on your shoulders.” Ridiculous.

[greekgoddess458]

i dont read your fics, and where did i say that i should lay the burden of my mental health on your shoulders??

all im sayings is that trigger warning are EXTREMELY helpful, and youre bashing them because they offend you??

i dont care who youre target audience is, but if there is sensitive content in your fics then fucking put a trigger warning on there

having trigger warning helps people like me (and trust me, there are a lot of us) not have to go through terrible mental health things. why are you so against that??

having trigger warnings has saved me from episodes countless times

what’s funny to me is you say im laying the burden of my mental health on your shoulders, and you say youre entitled to shred my mental health by not taking an extra step and helping to protect people

its fucking pathetic, and its sad.

how am i supposed to know if the contents of your fics are sensitive or not if there are no trigger warnings?

[octopuscato]

all im sayings is that trigger warning are EXTREMELY helpful, and youre bashing them because they offend you?? 

No. Warnings don’t offend me. I’m expressing my distaste for the fact that people demand authors put tags like “sad ending” on their fic or else they’re evil, morally deficient people. As it clearly says in my OP. This kind of demand combined with moral judgment offends me.

having trigger warning helps people like me (and trust me, there are a lot of us)

I know. I’m one of us :) 

you say youre entitled to shred my mental health

No. I’m saying the burden of deciding whether or not to read something, and thereby their mental health, lies on the shoulders of the readers. I can’t do anything to your mental health with my fic - except if I were to mistag. Mistagging is a dick move and I don’t condone that, plus it can be reported. But using the default tag of the site is not mistagging.

how am i supposed to know if the contents of your fics are sensitive or not if there are no trigger warnings?

If you read on Ao3, which is what my op was about, then authors are required to put up one of the following five:

Clearly, all of those are trigger warnings. Yes, even “choose not to use Archive warnings”, since it tells you that the author opted out of the whole warning business, meaning you need to avoid their fic if you’re not cool with surprise!sensitive content that might be in there. And this is entirely YOUR CHOICE and YOUR RESPONSIBILITY.

i dont care who youre target audience is, but if there is sensitive content in your fics then fucking put a trigger warning on there

My target audience is people who are fine with being surprised, which is why I use “choose not to warn”. Everyone who informed themselves properly about Ao3 knows that it means “beware, here be dragons”.

If a reader chooses to ignore that, it’s their fault.

[greekgoddess458]

my problem is not everyone knows that there could be sensitive content with no trigger warnings–that happened to me

and if you are one of us, why does it bother you to put those trigger warnings?? i just genuinely dont understand if youre in the mental state where they are extremely helpful

i agree it shouldnt be enforced, but that doesnt mean that it shouldnt happen. im not demanding anything, but trust me, people who arent triggered arent going to be offended by trigger warnings.

why not help the people who need the warnings instead of being offended that some people are demanding it

(p.s., im not demanding you to put trigger warnings, i just really, really think its a good choice)

[octopuscato]

my problem is not everyone knows that there could be sensitive content with no trigger warnings–that happened to me

Then you need to inform yourself about the website you’re reading on and their warning system. This is something that is entirely on the readers, and also easy to do.

and if you are one of us, why does it bother you to put those trigger warnings?

The concept of putting in trigger warnings in general doesn’t bother me. I used to warn much more. But what bothers me is bowing to demands that tell me: “If you do this thing that you are actually allowed to do and which is perfectly fine, then you are an arsehole and a morally bad person.” I’m 100% bristling at that demand, for my own personal reasons that are not for internet users to know. I can’t do it. So I chose to only use CNTUAW. Which is absolutely valid.

why not help the people who need the warnings

Frankly? My own mental health is more important to me than your (general your) ability to read my fic. My ability to participate in fandom the way I need it trumps your (general your) wish to be able to access my fic.

[greekgoddess458]

i never said i wanted to access your fic, i just want to protect the people who come across it not expecting sensitive content

i understand not liking the demand, and i dont do well with demands either, which is why im not demanding anything

just know that some readers dont know what theyre getting into, and even if its their fault, they shouldnt have to suffer through shit because of that

so go ahead, participate in the fandom the way you want, but know that the people who get triggered because you didnt put warnings because you got offended by some people’s demands (like i said, i get it, but there is a time where they have a point) might get mad at you for that, so be prepared

just a warning, αγάπη

[octopuscato]

i never said i wanted to access your fic

Jesus Christ. Generic you - please read this link.

i just want to protect the people who come across it not expecting sensitive content

If it’s warned for - and “choose not to warn” IS a warning that is EXPLAINED on Ao3 - then they need to expect it. What is so hard about this?

just know that some readers dont know what theyre getting into, and even if its their fault, they shouldnt have to suffer through shit because of that

We disagree. if it’s their fault, it’s their fault, and that’s that. I’ve done my part - if they can’t do theirs, I’m sorry, but it’s not my problem. Putting other people’s burden’s on one’s shoulders when there is absolutely no sense to it is not healthy.

but know that the people who get triggered because you didnt put warnings because you got offended by some people’s demands […] might get mad at you for that, so be prepared

I’m quivering in my boots. If they read my fics despite seeing the “choose not to warn” tag, that is, again entirely their own problem. They didn’t get triggered because of my warning policies, they got triggered because of their own choices. If they want to come and tell me how mad they are. I’ll tell them the following:

just a warning

Don’t worry. I’m a big enby, I’ve been in fandom for 17 years. I can cope.

αγάπη

 So what is it now? “fuck you” or “αγάπη“?

[greekgoddess458]

who says it cant be both? condescending is a thing, you do know that, right?? or do i have to explain that to you, too???

have fun being a “big enby” when youre really just a jackass willing to trample all over people’s trauma because youre butthurt about being told what to do

im not telling you to do shit, im just trying to defend people like me.

you say youre like me, that youre like us, but if you were as severe, you would get what im saying

im not trying to trample over what you say youre entitled to do, im just explaining that you dont have to bash people who do put trigger warnings, because thats fucked up

no one is saying to manage our emotions or take over the burden of our mental health. we’re asking to be considerate. same as wearing a mask during covid. same as holding the door open for people. its really not a hard concept to grasp.

you do whatever you think is right for you, but dont invalidate people when they come to you about it, or youre just being a douchebag. i dont believe that everyones feelings should be OVERLY protected, but episodes have made me suicidal before

so yeah, “quiver in your boots,” because if you cant grasp a concept this fucking simple, then youre going to have a rough life, αγάπη

[octopuscato]

who says it cant be both? condescending is a thing, you do know that, right?? or do i have to explain that to you, too???

What are you even referring to? Also, so far you’ve explained nothing but how I’m somehow responsible for readers making decisions that are bad to them. And it wasn’t a very good explanation, let me tell you that. By the way, that quote up there, by you? That’s pretty condescending. Huh.

have fun being a “big enby” when youre really just a jackass willing to trample all over people’s trauma because youre butthurt about being told what to do

Once again, it all boils down to: “People are entitled to reading your fics, and if you don’t make them accessible to them the way they want it, then you’re an arsehole. Fuck you and your fandom needs, only I am right, my way is the only way, and you need to bow down to people screaming about their trauma the loudest.”

you say youre like me, that youre like us, but if you were as severe, you would get what im saying

Know what? FUCK YOU, YOUR ENTITLEMENT, AND THE TRAUMA OLYMPICS HORSE YOU RODE IN ON. I’m not obligated to reveal anything to you, and you have no way of judging my life or mental health based on some opinion about fanfic. You’re completely off your rocker if you think this.

im not trying to trample over what you say youre entitled to do

*LOL*

you dont have to bash people who do put trigger warnings

I sincerely have to ask: Can you read? Are you stupid? Because I never said I had anything against people who do use trigger warnings on their fics. On the contrary. I said, twice, that I have nothing against trigger warnings - everyone can use them to their heart’s content. BUT I, PERSONALLY, AM ONLY USING ONE GENERIC ONE. There is a fucking difference. This is the third time I’m explaining this. 

we’re asking to be considerate

I am. I’m putting a trigger warning on my fics. It’s “Choose not to use Archive Warnings” and it warns people like you to STAY THE FUCK AWAY from my fics. That’s not a hard concept to grasp.

but dont invalidate people when they come to you about it, or youre just being a douchebag.

You were the douchebag who came to me, told me “fuck you” and tried to invalidate me - my way to participate in fandom as well as what I said about my mental health. So kindly look in a fucking mirror and STFU.

but episodes have made me suicidal before

I’m sorry to hear that. I hope that won’t happen in the future, and that you neither stumble upon mistagged fics nor go reading fics that are clearly tagged as not suitable for you.

so yeah, “quiver in your boots,” because if you cant grasp a concept this fucking simple, then youre going to have a rough life

Almost 40 years on this planet, and I get surprised by people’s stupidity time and time again. I really am giving y’all way too much credit.

[mariposakitten]

“Creator Chose Not To Warn” IS a trigger warning. It is warning that the work may well contain triggers, and if so, they may take you by surprise. If, after reading that trigger warning, you choose to read the fic, you are consenting to potentially be exposed to surprise triggers. Sometimes, for some people, that’s fun! But if it’s not going to be fun for you, if you have triggers strong enough that, even forewarned like this, it might wreck your mental health, then LISTEN TO THE WARNING, THAT’S WHAT IT’S THERE FOR.

@greekgoddess458 your argument seems to be that you or someone like you might see that trigger warning and ignore it or disbelieve it or misunderstand it or not notice it, and therefore be harmed, and… that sucks, it does. But it’s not the fault of the person who correctly and appropriately tagged their fic. They told you what risks you might be taking; they can’t read it or understand it FOR you.

There’s a lot of emotionally-charged language and distraction (including accusing OP of saying things that were never said or even implied) going on in this thread, but none of it changes the fact that “Chose Not To Warn” is a valid warning in and of itself. If what it implies makes you uncomfortable, then you should probably, for your own peace of mind, treat it as the warning it is and not read fics tagged that way.

The beauty of AO3 is that people who don’t want to add more warnings, and people who enjoy reading fics with minimal warnings, can post and read the things that make them happy, AND AT THE SAME TIME authors who want to include a myriad of tags and readers who prefer clear warnings and expectations can also find each other and read and write what they enjoy, and neither way is bad or wrong, just different and meant for different people.

[greekgoddess458]

look, i just wanna apologize. i came out swinging because i got offended, and im sorry for that. i try to protect people like me and i take it too far.

i was being a douchebag, and i apologize for that. it was at night, i was exhausted, and i had been feeling anxious all day. i know my mental health isnt an excuse for my actions, but i am sorry.

i never wanted to invalidate anyone, and i realize now that i misunderstood. the explanation above really helped me.

i just hope we can come together as a community and support mental health in a way that doesnt offend anyone, but sadly, people are jerks (including me)

i really am sorry, i misunderstood. i got angry and focused on the bad bits instead of truly hearing your argument out @lordhellebore

i do still stand for trigger warnings, but saying you choose to not put them is different. im sorry i misunderstood

[octopuscato]

It’s okay. It was like 2am at night for me and I was tired as well. Thanks for the apology. I agree that trigger warnings are great, and everyone should absolutely use them on their fics or put “Choose Not to Use Archive Warnings” – the result should be that no reader is unwillingly caught by surprise by anything. I think that last thing is what we can definitely agree on.

[greekgoddess458]

yes, definitely. my main thing is wanting to make sure the readers dont get surprised by sensitive content, and if you put “Choose Not to Use Archive Warnings” it shows there is a possibility, because it doesnt say there are none

[octopuscato]

my main thing is wanting to make sure the readers dont get surprised by sensitive content

  Yes, I agree with that :) I’m glad we could both sleep over it, sometimes that helps already.

[greekgoddess458]

fr. junior year of high school is kicking my ass, and i have to see the man who SAd me every single day so my mental health is stretched a little thin

[octopuscato]

I can’t believe “You need to tag whether or not your fic has a sad ending or else you’re untrustworthy/being a dick!” is a legitimate demand in fandom these days. I just. No. No no no. Good grief. I’m so glad AO3 doesn’t actually require any of this.

There is a level of “manage all my emotions for me!” that I find deeply disturbing, and this belongs into that category.

Now excuse me while I make love to ao3’s default and only actually required tag, “author chose not to use archive warnings”.

[greekgoddess458]

hey, as someone with severe complex ptsd and as someone that can go into an episode from things with no trigger warnings, i just wanna say one thing.

fuck you.

[octopuscato]

How is it my responsibility to micromanage your mental health? I tag everything that is required to tag. If that is not to your taste, don’t read my fics. You are not my target audience, and you are not entitled to being my target audience. Essentially, our conversation boils down to: Me: “I’m doing fandom this [perfectly legitimate by the standards of the platform I post on ] way, because I really don’t like that other way.” You: “Fuck you for using Ao3 the way you’re entitled to, I should be able to lay the burden of my mental health on your shoulders.” Ridiculous.

[greekgoddess458]

i dont read your fics, and where did i say that i should lay the burden of my mental health on your shoulders??

all im sayings is that trigger warning are EXTREMELY helpful, and youre bashing them because they offend you??

i dont care who youre target audience is, but if there is sensitive content in your fics then fucking put a trigger warning on there

having trigger warning helps people like me (and trust me, there are a lot of us) not have to go through terrible mental health things. why are you so against that??

having trigger warnings has saved me from episodes countless times

what’s funny to me is you say im laying the burden of my mental health on your shoulders, and you say youre entitled to shred my mental health by not taking an extra step and helping to protect people

its fucking pathetic, and its sad.

how am i supposed to know if the contents of your fics are sensitive or not if there are no trigger warnings?

[octopuscato]

all im sayings is that trigger warning are EXTREMELY helpful, and youre bashing them because they offend you?? 

No. Warnings don’t offend me. I’m expressing my distaste for the fact that people demand authors put tags like “sad ending” on their fic or else they’re evil, morally deficient people. As it clearly says in my OP. This kind of demand combined with moral judgment offends me.

having trigger warning helps people like me (and trust me, there are a lot of us)

I know. I’m one of us :) 

you say youre entitled to shred my mental health

No. I’m saying the burden of deciding whether or not to read something, and thereby their mental health, lies on the shoulders of the readers. I can’t do anything to your mental health with my fic - except if I were to mistag. Mistagging is a dick move and I don’t condone that, plus it can be reported. But using the default tag of the site is not mistagging.

how am i supposed to know if the contents of your fics are sensitive or not if there are no trigger warnings?

If you read on Ao3, which is what my op was about, then authors are required to put up one of the following five:

Clearly, all of those are trigger warnings. Yes, even “choose not to use Archive warnings”, since it tells you that the author opted out of the whole warning business, meaning you need to avoid their fic if you’re not cool with surprise!sensitive content that might be in there. And this is entirely YOUR CHOICE and YOUR RESPONSIBILITY.

i dont care who youre target audience is, but if there is sensitive content in your fics then fucking put a trigger warning on there

My target audience is people who are fine with being surprised, which is why I use “choose not to warn”. Everyone who informed themselves properly about Ao3 knows that it means “beware, here be dragons”.

If a reader chooses to ignore that, it’s their fault.

[greekgoddess458]

my problem is not everyone knows that there could be sensitive content with no trigger warnings–that happened to me

and if you are one of us, why does it bother you to put those trigger warnings?? i just genuinely dont understand if youre in the mental state where they are extremely helpful

i agree it shouldnt be enforced, but that doesnt mean that it shouldnt happen. im not demanding anything, but trust me, people who arent triggered arent going to be offended by trigger warnings.

why not help the people who need the warnings instead of being offended that some people are demanding it

(p.s., im not demanding you to put trigger warnings, i just really, really think its a good choice)

[octopuscato]

my problem is not everyone knows that there could be sensitive content with no trigger warnings–that happened to me

Then you need to inform yourself about the website you’re reading on and their warning system. This is something that is entirely on the readers, and also easy to do.

and if you are one of us, why does it bother you to put those trigger warnings?

The concept of putting in trigger warnings in general doesn’t bother me. I used to warn much more. But what bothers me is bowing to demands that tell me: “If you do this thing that you are actually allowed to do and which is perfectly fine, then you are an arsehole and a morally bad person.” I’m 100% bristling at that demand, for my own personal reasons that are not for internet users to know. I can’t do it. So I chose to only use CNTUAW. Which is absolutely valid.

why not help the people who need the warnings

Frankly? My own mental health is more important to me than your (general your) ability to read my fic. My ability to participate in fandom the way I need it trumps your (general your) wish to be able to access my fic.

[greekgoddess458]

i never said i wanted to access your fic, i just want to protect the people who come across it not expecting sensitive content

i understand not liking the demand, and i dont do well with demands either, which is why im not demanding anything

just know that some readers dont know what theyre getting into, and even if its their fault, they shouldnt have to suffer through shit because of that

so go ahead, participate in the fandom the way you want, but know that the people who get triggered because you didnt put warnings because you got offended by some people’s demands (like i said, i get it, but there is a time where they have a point) might get mad at you for that, so be prepared

just a warning, αγάπη

[octopuscato]

i never said i wanted to access your fic

Jesus Christ. Generic you - please read this link.

i just want to protect the people who come across it not expecting sensitive content

If it’s warned for - and “choose not to warn” IS a warning that is EXPLAINED on Ao3 - then they need to expect it. What is so hard about this?

just know that some readers dont know what theyre getting into, and even if its their fault, they shouldnt have to suffer through shit because of that

We disagree. if it’s their fault, it’s their fault, and that’s that. I’ve done my part - if they can’t do theirs, I’m sorry, but it’s not my problem. Putting other people’s burden’s on one’s shoulders when there is absolutely no sense to it is not healthy.

but know that the people who get triggered because you didnt put warnings because you got offended by some people’s demands […] might get mad at you for that, so be prepared

I’m quivering in my boots. If they read my fics despite seeing the “choose not to warn” tag, that is, again entirely their own problem. They didn’t get triggered because of my warning policies, they got triggered because of their own choices. If they want to come and tell me how mad they are. I’ll tell them the following:

just a warning

Don’t worry. I’m a big enby, I’ve been in fandom for 17 years. I can cope.

αγάπη

 So what is it now? “fuck you” or “αγάπη“?

[greekgoddess458]

who says it cant be both? condescending is a thing, you do know that, right?? or do i have to explain that to you, too???

have fun being a “big enby” when youre really just a jackass willing to trample all over people’s trauma because youre butthurt about being told what to do

im not telling you to do shit, im just trying to defend people like me.

you say youre like me, that youre like us, but if you were as severe, you would get what im saying

im not trying to trample over what you say youre entitled to do, im just explaining that you dont have to bash people who do put trigger warnings, because thats fucked up

no one is saying to manage our emotions or take over the burden of our mental health. we’re asking to be considerate. same as wearing a mask during covid. same as holding the door open for people. its really not a hard concept to grasp.

you do whatever you think is right for you, but dont invalidate people when they come to you about it, or youre just being a douchebag. i dont believe that everyones feelings should be OVERLY protected, but episodes have made me suicidal before

so yeah, “quiver in your boots,” because if you cant grasp a concept this fucking simple, then youre going to have a rough life, αγάπη

[octopuscato]

who says it cant be both? condescending is a thing, you do know that, right?? or do i have to explain that to you, too???

What are you even referring to? Also, so far you’ve explained nothing but how I’m somehow responsible for readers making decisions that are bad to them. And it wasn’t a very good explanation, let me tell you that. By the way, that quote up there, by you? That’s pretty condescending. Huh.

have fun being a “big enby” when youre really just a jackass willing to trample all over people’s trauma because youre butthurt about being told what to do

Once again, it all boils down to: “People are entitled to reading your fics, and if you don’t make them accessible to them the way they want it, then you’re an arsehole. Fuck you and your fandom needs, only I am right, my way is the only way, and you need to bow down to people screaming about their trauma the loudest.”

you say youre like me, that youre like us, but if you were as severe, you would get what im saying

Know what? FUCK YOU, YOUR ENTITLEMENT, AND THE TRAUMA OLYMPICS HORSE YOU RODE IN ON. I’m not obligated to reveal anything to you, and you have no way of judging my life or mental health based on some opinion about fanfic. You’re completely off your rocker if you think this.

im not trying to trample over what you say youre entitled to do

*LOL*

you dont have to bash people who do put trigger warnings

I sincerely have to ask: Can you read? Are you stupid? Because I never said I had anything against people who do use trigger warnings on their fics. On the contrary. I said, twice, that I have nothing against trigger warnings - everyone can use them to their heart’s content. BUT I, PERSONALLY, AM ONLY USING ONE GENERIC ONE. There is a fucking difference. This is the third time I’m explaining this. 

we’re asking to be considerate

I am. I’m putting a trigger warning on my fics. It’s “Choose not to use Archive Warnings” and it warns people like you to STAY THE FUCK AWAY from my fics. That’s not a hard concept to grasp.

but dont invalidate people when they come to you about it, or youre just being a douchebag.

You were the douchebag who came to me, told me “fuck you” and tried to invalidate me - my way to participate in fandom as well as what I said about my mental health. So kindly look in a fucking mirror and STFU.

but episodes have made me suicidal before

I’m sorry to hear that. I hope that won’t happen in the future, and that you neither stumble upon mistagged fics nor go reading fics that are clearly tagged as not suitable for you.

so yeah, “quiver in your boots,” because if you cant grasp a concept this fucking simple, then youre going to have a rough life

Almost 40 years on this planet, and I get surprised by people’s stupidity time and time again. I really am giving y’all way too much credit.

[mariposakitten]

“Creator Chose Not To Warn” IS a trigger warning. It is warning that the work may well contain triggers, and if so, they may take you by surprise. If, after reading that trigger warning, you choose to read the fic, you are consenting to potentially be exposed to surprise triggers. Sometimes, for some people, that’s fun! But if it’s not going to be fun for you, if you have triggers strong enough that, even forewarned like this, it might wreck your mental health, then LISTEN TO THE WARNING, THAT’S WHAT IT’S THERE FOR.

@greekgoddess458 your argument seems to be that you or someone like you might see that trigger warning and ignore it or disbelieve it or misunderstand it or not notice it, and therefore be harmed, and… that sucks, it does. But it’s not the fault of the person who correctly and appropriately tagged their fic. They told you what risks you might be taking; they can’t read it or understand it FOR you.

There’s a lot of emotionally-charged language and distraction (including accusing OP of saying things that were never said or even implied) going on in this thread, but none of it changes the fact that “Chose Not To Warn” is a valid warning in and of itself. If what it implies makes you uncomfortable, then you should probably, for your own peace of mind, treat it as the warning it is and not read fics tagged that way.

The beauty of AO3 is that people who don’t want to add more warnings, and people who enjoy reading fics with minimal warnings, can post and read the things that make them happy, AND AT THE SAME TIME authors who want to include a myriad of tags and readers who prefer clear warnings and expectations can also find each other and read and write what they enjoy, and neither way is bad or wrong, just different and meant for different people.

[greekgoddess458]

look, i just wanna apologize. i came out swinging because i got offended, and im sorry for that. i try to protect people like me and i take it too far.

i was being a douchebag, and i apologize for that. it was at night, i was exhausted, and i had been feeling anxious all day. i know my mental health isnt an excuse for my actions, but i am sorry.

i never wanted to invalidate anyone, and i realize now that i misunderstood. the explanation above really helped me.

i just hope we can come together as a community and support mental health in a way that doesnt offend anyone, but sadly, people are jerks (including me)

i really am sorry, i misunderstood. i got angry and focused on the bad bits instead of truly hearing your argument out @lordhellebore

i do still stand for trigger warnings, but saying you choose to not put them is different. im sorry i misunderstood

[octopuscato]

It’s okay. It was like 2am at night for me and I was tired as well. Thanks for the apology. I agree that trigger warnings are great, and everyone should absolutely use them on their fics or put “Choose Not to Use Archive Warnings” – the result should be that no reader is unwillingly caught by surprise by anything. I think that last thing is what we can definitely agree on.

[greekgoddess458]

yes, definitely. my main thing is wanting to make sure the readers dont get surprised by sensitive content, and if you put “Choose Not to Use Archive Warnings” it shows there is a possibility, because it doesnt say there are none

[greekgoddess458]

are u ever just chilling and then you realize that youre actually a bitch. a bad bitch, perhaps, but a bitch nontheless??

bc i dont

[octopuscato]

I can’t believe “You need to tag whether or not your fic has a sad ending or else you’re untrustworthy/being a dick!” is a legitimate demand in fandom these days. I just. No. No no no. Good grief. I’m so glad AO3 doesn’t actually require any of this.

There is a level of “manage all my emotions for me!” that I find deeply disturbing, and this belongs into that category.

Now excuse me while I make love to ao3’s default and only actually required tag, “author chose not to use archive warnings”.

[greekgoddess458]

hey, as someone with severe complex ptsd and as someone that can go into an episode from things with no trigger warnings, i just wanna say one thing.

fuck you.

[octopuscato]

How is it my responsibility to micromanage your mental health? I tag everything that is required to tag. If that is not to your taste, don’t read my fics. You are not my target audience, and you are not entitled to being my target audience. Essentially, our conversation boils down to: Me: “I’m doing fandom this [perfectly legitimate by the standards of the platform I post on ] way, because I really don’t like that other way.” You: “Fuck you for using Ao3 the way you’re entitled to, I should be able to lay the burden of my mental health on your shoulders.” Ridiculous.

[greekgoddess458]

i dont read your fics, and where did i say that i should lay the burden of my mental health on your shoulders??

all im sayings is that trigger warning are EXTREMELY helpful, and youre bashing them because they offend you??

i dont care who youre target audience is, but if there is sensitive content in your fics then fucking put a trigger warning on there

having trigger warning helps people like me (and trust me, there are a lot of us) not have to go through terrible mental health things. why are you so against that??

having trigger warnings has saved me from episodes countless times

what’s funny to me is you say im laying the burden of my mental health on your shoulders, and you say youre entitled to shred my mental health by not taking an extra step and helping to protect people

its fucking pathetic, and its sad.

how am i supposed to know if the contents of your fics are sensitive or not if there are no trigger warnings?

[octopuscato]

all im sayings is that trigger warning are EXTREMELY helpful, and youre bashing them because they offend you?? 

No. Warnings don’t offend me. I’m expressing my distaste for the fact that people demand authors put tags like “sad ending” on their fic or else they’re evil, morally deficient people. As it clearly says in my OP. This kind of demand combined with moral judgment offends me.

having trigger warning helps people like me (and trust me, there are a lot of us)

I know. I’m one of us :) 

you say youre entitled to shred my mental health

No. I’m saying the burden of deciding whether or not to read something, and thereby their mental health, lies on the shoulders of the readers. I can’t do anything to your mental health with my fic - except if I were to mistag. Mistagging is a dick move and I don’t condone that, plus it can be reported. But using the default tag of the site is not mistagging.

how am i supposed to know if the contents of your fics are sensitive or not if there are no trigger warnings?

If you read on Ao3, which is what my op was about, then authors are required to put up one of the following five:

Clearly, all of those are trigger warnings. Yes, even “choose not to use Archive warnings”, since it tells you that the author opted out of the whole warning business, meaning you need to avoid their fic if you’re not cool with surprise!sensitive content that might be in there. And this is entirely YOUR CHOICE and YOUR RESPONSIBILITY.

i dont care who youre target audience is, but if there is sensitive content in your fics then fucking put a trigger warning on there

My target audience is people who are fine with being surprised, which is why I use “choose not to warn”. Everyone who informed themselves properly about Ao3 knows that it means “beware, here be dragons”.

If a reader chooses to ignore that, it’s their fault.

[greekgoddess458]

my problem is not everyone knows that there could be sensitive content with no trigger warnings–that happened to me

and if you are one of us, why does it bother you to put those trigger warnings?? i just genuinely dont understand if youre in the mental state where they are extremely helpful

i agree it shouldnt be enforced, but that doesnt mean that it shouldnt happen. im not demanding anything, but trust me, people who arent triggered arent going to be offended by trigger warnings.

why not help the people who need the warnings instead of being offended that some people are demanding it

(p.s., im not demanding you to put trigger warnings, i just really, really think its a good choice)

[octopuscato]

my problem is not everyone knows that there could be sensitive content with no trigger warnings–that happened to me

Then you need to inform yourself about the website you’re reading on and their warning system. This is something that is entirely on the readers, and also easy to do.

and if you are one of us, why does it bother you to put those trigger warnings?

The concept of putting in trigger warnings in general doesn’t bother me. I used to warn much more. But what bothers me is bowing to demands that tell me: “If you do this thing that you are actually allowed to do and which is perfectly fine, then you are an arsehole and a morally bad person.” I’m 100% bristling at that demand, for my own personal reasons that are not for internet users to know. I can’t do it. So I chose to only use CNTUAW. Which is absolutely valid.

why not help the people who need the warnings

Frankly? My own mental health is more important to me than your (general your) ability to read my fic. My ability to participate in fandom the way I need it trumps your (general your) wish to be able to access my fic.

[greekgoddess458]

i never said i wanted to access your fic, i just want to protect the people who come across it not expecting sensitive content

i understand not liking the demand, and i dont do well with demands either, which is why im not demanding anything

just know that some readers dont know what theyre getting into, and even if its their fault, they shouldnt have to suffer through shit because of that

so go ahead, participate in the fandom the way you want, but know that the people who get triggered because you didnt put warnings because you got offended by some people’s demands (like i said, i get it, but there is a time where they have a point) might get mad at you for that, so be prepared

just a warning, αγάπη

[octopuscato]

i never said i wanted to access your fic

Jesus Christ. Generic you - please read this link.

i just want to protect the people who come across it not expecting sensitive content

If it’s warned for - and “choose not to warn” IS a warning that is EXPLAINED on Ao3 - then they need to expect it. What is so hard about this?

just know that some readers dont know what theyre getting into, and even if its their fault, they shouldnt have to suffer through shit because of that

We disagree. if it’s their fault, it’s their fault, and that’s that. I’ve done my part - if they can’t do theirs, I’m sorry, but it’s not my problem. Putting other people’s burden’s on one’s shoulders when there is absolutely no sense to it is not healthy.

but know that the people who get triggered because you didnt put warnings because you got offended by some people’s demands […] might get mad at you for that, so be prepared

I’m quivering in my boots. If they read my fics despite seeing the “choose not to warn” tag, that is, again entirely their own problem. They didn’t get triggered because of my warning policies, they got triggered because of their own choices. If they want to come and tell me how mad they are. I’ll tell them the following:

just a warning

Don’t worry. I’m a big enby, I’ve been in fandom for 17 years. I can cope.

αγάπη

 So what is it now? “fuck you” or “αγάπη“?

[greekgoddess458]

who says it cant be both? condescending is a thing, you do know that, right?? or do i have to explain that to you, too???

have fun being a “big enby” when youre really just a jackass willing to trample all over people’s trauma because youre butthurt about being told what to do

im not telling you to do shit, im just trying to defend people like me.

you say youre like me, that youre like us, but if you were as severe, you would get what im saying

im not trying to trample over what you say youre entitled to do, im just explaining that you dont have to bash people who do put trigger warnings, because thats fucked up

no one is saying to manage our emotions or take over the burden of our mental health. we’re asking to be considerate. same as wearing a mask during covid. same as holding the door open for people. its really not a hard concept to grasp.

you do whatever you think is right for you, but dont invalidate people when they come to you about it, or youre just being a douchebag. i dont believe that everyones feelings should be OVERLY protected, but episodes have made me suicidal before

so yeah, “quiver in your boots,” because if you cant grasp a concept this fucking simple, then youre going to have a rough life, αγάπη

[octopuscato]

who says it cant be both? condescending is a thing, you do know that, right?? or do i have to explain that to you, too???

What are you even referring to? Also, so far you’ve explained nothing but how I’m somehow responsible for readers making decisions that are bad to them. And it wasn’t a very good explanation, let me tell you that. By the way, that quote up there, by you? That’s pretty condescending. Huh.

have fun being a “big enby” when youre really just a jackass willing to trample all over people’s trauma because youre butthurt about being told what to do

Once again, it all boils down to: “People are entitled to reading your fics, and if you don’t make them accessible to them the way they want it, then you’re an arsehole. Fuck you and your fandom needs, only I am right, my way is the only way, and you need to bow down to people screaming about their trauma the loudest.”

you say youre like me, that youre like us, but if you were as severe, you would get what im saying

Know what? FUCK YOU, YOUR ENTITLEMENT, AND THE TRAUMA OLYMPICS HORSE YOU RODE IN ON. I’m not obligated to reveal anything to you, and you have no way of judging my life or mental health based on some opinion about fanfic. You’re completely off your rocker if you think this.

im not trying to trample over what you say youre entitled to do

*LOL*

you dont have to bash people who do put trigger warnings

I sincerely have to ask: Can you read? Are you stupid? Because I never said I had anything against people who do use trigger warnings on their fics. On the contrary. I said, twice, that I have nothing against trigger warnings - everyone can use them to their heart’s content. BUT I, PERSONALLY, AM ONLY USING ONE GENERIC ONE. There is a fucking difference. This is the third time I’m explaining this. 

we’re asking to be considerate

I am. I’m putting a trigger warning on my fics. It’s “Choose not to use Archive Warnings” and it warns people like you to STAY THE FUCK AWAY from my fics. That’s not a hard concept to grasp.

but dont invalidate people when they come to you about it, or youre just being a douchebag.

You were the douchebag who came to me, told me “fuck you” and tried to invalidate me - my way to participate in fandom as well as what I said about my mental health. So kindly look in a fucking mirror and STFU.

but episodes have made me suicidal before

I’m sorry to hear that. I hope that won’t happen in the future, and that you neither stumble upon mistagged fics nor go reading fics that are clearly tagged as not suitable for you.

so yeah, “quiver in your boots,” because if you cant grasp a concept this fucking simple, then youre going to have a rough life

Almost 40 years on this planet, and I get surprised by people’s stupidity time and time again. I really am giving y’all way too much credit.

[mariposakitten]

“Creator Chose Not To Warn” IS a trigger warning. It is warning that the work may well contain triggers, and if so, they may take you by surprise. If, after reading that trigger warning, you choose to read the fic, you are consenting to potentially be exposed to surprise triggers. Sometimes, for some people, that’s fun! But if it’s not going to be fun for you, if you have triggers strong enough that, even forewarned like this, it might wreck your mental health, then LISTEN TO THE WARNING, THAT’S WHAT IT’S THERE FOR.

@greekgoddess458 your argument seems to be that you or someone like you might see that trigger warning and ignore it or disbelieve it or misunderstand it or not notice it, and therefore be harmed, and… that sucks, it does. But it’s not the fault of the person who correctly and appropriately tagged their fic. They told you what risks you might be taking; they can’t read it or understand it FOR you.

There’s a lot of emotionally-charged language and distraction (including accusing OP of saying things that were never said or even implied) going on in this thread, but none of it changes the fact that “Chose Not To Warn” is a valid warning in and of itself. If what it implies makes you uncomfortable, then you should probably, for your own peace of mind, treat it as the warning it is and not read fics tagged that way.

The beauty of AO3 is that people who don’t want to add more warnings, and people who enjoy reading fics with minimal warnings, can post and read the things that make them happy, AND AT THE SAME TIME authors who want to include a myriad of tags and readers who prefer clear warnings and expectations can also find each other and read and write what they enjoy, and neither way is bad or wrong, just different and meant for different people.

[greekgoddess458]

look, i just wanna apologize. i came out swinging because i got offended, and im sorry for that. i try to protect people like me and i take it too far.

i was being a douchebag, and i apologize for that. it was at night, i was exhausted, and i had been feeling anxious all day. i know my mental health isnt an excuse for my actions, but i am sorry.

i never wanted to invalidate anyone, and i realize now that i misunderstood. the explanation above really helped me.

i just hope we can come together as a community and support mental health in a way that doesnt offend anyone, but sadly, people are jerks (including me)

i really am sorry, i misunderstood. i got angry and focused on the bad bits instead of truly hearing your argument out @lordhellebore

i do still stand for trigger warnings, but saying you choose to not put them is different. im sorry i misunderstood

[octopuscato]

I can’t believe “You need to tag whether or not your fic has a sad ending or else you’re untrustworthy/being a dick!” is a legitimate demand in fandom these days. I just. No. No no no. Good grief. I’m so glad AO3 doesn’t actually require any of this.

There is a level of “manage all my emotions for me!” that I find deeply disturbing, and this belongs into that category.

Now excuse me while I make love to ao3’s default and only actually required tag, “author chose not to use archive warnings”.

[greekgoddess458]

hey, as someone with severe complex ptsd and as someone that can go into an episode from things with no trigger warnings, i just wanna say one thing.

fuck you.

[octopuscato]

How is it my responsibility to micromanage your mental health? I tag everything that is required to tag. If that is not to your taste, don’t read my fics. You are not my target audience, and you are not entitled to being my target audience. Essentially, our conversation boils down to: Me: “I’m doing fandom this [perfectly legitimate by the standards of the platform I post on ] way, because I really don’t like that other way.” You: “Fuck you for using Ao3 the way you’re entitled to, I should be able to lay the burden of my mental health on your shoulders.” Ridiculous.

[greekgoddess458]

i dont read your fics, and where did i say that i should lay the burden of my mental health on your shoulders??

all im sayings is that trigger warning are EXTREMELY helpful, and youre bashing them because they offend you??

i dont care who youre target audience is, but if there is sensitive content in your fics then fucking put a trigger warning on there

having trigger warning helps people like me (and trust me, there are a lot of us) not have to go through terrible mental health things. why are you so against that??

having trigger warnings has saved me from episodes countless times

what’s funny to me is you say im laying the burden of my mental health on your shoulders, and you say youre entitled to shred my mental health by not taking an extra step and helping to protect people

its fucking pathetic, and its sad.

how am i supposed to know if the contents of your fics are sensitive or not if there are no trigger warnings?

[octopuscato]

all im sayings is that trigger warning are EXTREMELY helpful, and youre bashing them because they offend you?? 

No. Warnings don’t offend me. I’m expressing my distaste for the fact that people demand authors put tags like “sad ending” on their fic or else they’re evil, morally deficient people. As it clearly says in my OP. This kind of demand combined with moral judgment offends me.

having trigger warning helps people like me (and trust me, there are a lot of us)

I know. I’m one of us :) 

you say youre entitled to shred my mental health

No. I’m saying the burden of deciding whether or not to read something, and thereby their mental health, lies on the shoulders of the readers. I can’t do anything to your mental health with my fic - except if I were to mistag. Mistagging is a dick move and I don’t condone that, plus it can be reported. But using the default tag of the site is not mistagging.

how am i supposed to know if the contents of your fics are sensitive or not if there are no trigger warnings?

If you read on Ao3, which is what my op was about, then authors are required to put up one of the following five:

Clearly, all of those are trigger warnings. Yes, even “choose not to use Archive warnings”, since it tells you that the author opted out of the whole warning business, meaning you need to avoid their fic if you’re not cool with surprise!sensitive content that might be in there. And this is entirely YOUR CHOICE and YOUR RESPONSIBILITY.

i dont care who youre target audience is, but if there is sensitive content in your fics then fucking put a trigger warning on there

My target audience is people who are fine with being surprised, which is why I use “choose not to warn”. Everyone who informed themselves properly about Ao3 knows that it means “beware, here be dragons”.

If a reader chooses to ignore that, it’s their fault.

[greekgoddess458]

my problem is not everyone knows that there could be sensitive content with no trigger warnings–that happened to me

and if you are one of us, why does it bother you to put those trigger warnings?? i just genuinely dont understand if youre in the mental state where they are extremely helpful

i agree it shouldnt be enforced, but that doesnt mean that it shouldnt happen. im not demanding anything, but trust me, people who arent triggered arent going to be offended by trigger warnings.

why not help the people who need the warnings instead of being offended that some people are demanding it

(p.s., im not demanding you to put trigger warnings, i just really, really think its a good choice)

[octopuscato]

my problem is not everyone knows that there could be sensitive content with no trigger warnings–that happened to me

Then you need to inform yourself about the website you’re reading on and their warning system. This is something that is entirely on the readers, and also easy to do.

and if you are one of us, why does it bother you to put those trigger warnings?

The concept of putting in trigger warnings in general doesn’t bother me. I used to warn much more. But what bothers me is bowing to demands that tell me: “If you do this thing that you are actually allowed to do and which is perfectly fine, then you are an arsehole and a morally bad person.” I’m 100% bristling at that demand, for my own personal reasons that are not for internet users to know. I can’t do it. So I chose to only use CNTUAW. Which is absolutely valid.

why not help the people who need the warnings

Frankly? My own mental health is more important to me than your (general your) ability to read my fic. My ability to participate in fandom the way I need it trumps your (general your) wish to be able to access my fic.

[greekgoddess458]

i never said i wanted to access your fic, i just want to protect the people who come across it not expecting sensitive content

i understand not liking the demand, and i dont do well with demands either, which is why im not demanding anything

just know that some readers dont know what theyre getting into, and even if its their fault, they shouldnt have to suffer through shit because of that

so go ahead, participate in the fandom the way you want, but know that the people who get triggered because you didnt put warnings because you got offended by some people’s demands (like i said, i get it, but there is a time where they have a point) might get mad at you for that, so be prepared

just a warning, αγάπη

[octopuscato]

i never said i wanted to access your fic

Jesus Christ. Generic you - please read this link.

i just want to protect the people who come across it not expecting sensitive content

If it’s warned for - and “choose not to warn” IS a warning that is EXPLAINED on Ao3 - then they need to expect it. What is so hard about this?

just know that some readers dont know what theyre getting into, and even if its their fault, they shouldnt have to suffer through shit because of that

We disagree. if it’s their fault, it’s their fault, and that’s that. I’ve done my part - if they can’t do theirs, I’m sorry, but it’s not my problem. Putting other people’s burden’s on one’s shoulders when there is absolutely no sense to it is not healthy.

but know that the people who get triggered because you didnt put warnings because you got offended by some people’s demands […] might get mad at you for that, so be prepared

I’m quivering in my boots. If they read my fics despite seeing the “choose not to warn” tag, that is, again entirely their own problem. They didn’t get triggered because of my warning policies, they got triggered because of their own choices. If they want to come and tell me how mad they are. I’ll tell them the following:

just a warning

Don’t worry. I’m a big enby, I’ve been in fandom for 17 years. I can cope.

αγάπη

 So what is it now? “fuck you” or “αγάπη“?

[greekgoddess458]

who says it cant be both? condescending is a thing, you do know that, right?? or do i have to explain that to you, too???

have fun being a "big enby" when youre really just a jackass willing to trample all over people's trauma because youre butthurt about being told what to do

im not telling you to do shit, im just trying to defend people like me.

you say youre like me, that youre like us, but if you were as severe, you would get what im saying

im not trying to trample over what you say youre entitled to do, im just explaining that you dont have to bash people who do put trigger warnings, because thats fucked up

no one is saying to manage our emotions or take over the burden of our mental health. we're asking to be considerate. same as wearing a mask during covid. same as holding the door open for people. its really not a hard concept to grasp.

you do whatever you think is right for you, but dont invalidate people when they come to you about it, or youre just being a douchebag. i dont believe that everyones feelings should be OVERLY protected, but episodes have made me suicidal before

so yeah, "quiver in your boots," because if you cant grasp a concept this fucking simple, then youre going to have a rough life, αγάπη

[octopuscato]

I can’t believe “You need to tag whether or not your fic has a sad ending or else you’re untrustworthy/being a dick!” is a legitimate demand in fandom these days. I just. No. No no no. Good grief. I’m so glad AO3 doesn’t actually require any of this.

There is a level of “manage all my emotions for me!” that I find deeply disturbing, and this belongs into that category.

Now excuse me while I make love to ao3’s default and only actually required tag, “author chose not to use archive warnings”.

[greekgoddess458]

hey, as someone with severe complex ptsd and as someone that can go into an episode from things with no trigger warnings, i just wanna say one thing.

fuck you.

[octopuscato]

How is it my responsibility to micromanage your mental health? I tag everything that is required to tag. If that is not to your taste, don’t read my fics. You are not my target audience, and you are not entitled to being my target audience. Essentially, our conversation boils down to: Me: “I’m doing fandom this [perfectly legitimate by the standards of the platform I post on ] way, because I really don’t like that other way.” You: “Fuck you for using Ao3 the way you’re entitled to, I should be able to lay the burden of my mental health on your shoulders.” Ridiculous.

[greekgoddess458]

i dont read your fics, and where did i say that i should lay the burden of my mental health on your shoulders??

all im sayings is that trigger warning are EXTREMELY helpful, and youre bashing them because they offend you??

i dont care who youre target audience is, but if there is sensitive content in your fics then fucking put a trigger warning on there

having trigger warning helps people like me (and trust me, there are a lot of us) not have to go through terrible mental health things. why are you so against that??

having trigger warnings has saved me from episodes countless times

what’s funny to me is you say im laying the burden of my mental health on your shoulders, and you say youre entitled to shred my mental health by not taking an extra step and helping to protect people

its fucking pathetic, and its sad.

how am i supposed to know if the contents of your fics are sensitive or not if there are no trigger warnings?

[octopuscato]

all im sayings is that trigger warning are EXTREMELY helpful, and youre bashing them because they offend you?? 

No. Warnings don’t offend me. I’m expressing my distaste for the fact that people demand authors put tags like “sad ending” on their fic or else they’re evil, morally deficient people. As it clearly says in my OP. This kind of demand combined with moral judgment offends me.

having trigger warning helps people like me (and trust me, there are a lot of us)

I know. I’m one of us :) 

you say youre entitled to shred my mental health

No. I’m saying the burden of deciding whether or not to read something, and thereby their mental health, lies on the shoulders of the readers. I can’t do anything to your mental health with my fic - except if I were to mistag. Mistagging is a dick move and I don’t condone that, plus it can be reported. But using the default tag of the site is not mistagging.

how am i supposed to know if the contents of your fics are sensitive or not if there are no trigger warnings?

If you read on Ao3, which is what my op was about, then authors are required to put up one of the following five:

Clearly, all of those are trigger warnings. Yes, even “choose not to use Archive warnings”, since it tells you that the author opted out of the whole warning business, meaning you need to avoid their fic if you’re not cool with surprise!sensitive content that might be in there. And this is entirely YOUR CHOICE and YOUR RESPONSIBILITY.

i dont care who youre target audience is, but if there is sensitive content in your fics then fucking put a trigger warning on there

My target audience is people who are fine with being surprised, which is why I use “choose not to warn”. Everyone who informed themselves properly about Ao3 knows that it means “beware, here be dragons”.

If a reader chooses to ignore that, it’s their fault.

[greekgoddess458]

my problem is not everyone knows that there could be sensitive content with no trigger warnings–that happened to me

and if you are one of us, why does it bother you to put those trigger warnings?? i just genuinely dont understand if youre in the mental state where they are extremely helpful

i agree it shouldnt be enforced, but that doesnt mean that it shouldnt happen. im not demanding anything, but trust me, people who arent triggered arent going to be offended by trigger warnings.

why not help the people who need the warnings instead of being offended that some people are demanding it

(p.s., im not demanding you to put trigger warnings, i just really, really think its a good choice)

[octopuscato]

my problem is not everyone knows that there could be sensitive content with no trigger warnings–that happened to me

Then you need to inform yourself about the website you’re reading on and their warning system. This is something that is entirely on the readers, and also easy to do.

and if you are one of us, why does it bother you to put those trigger warnings?

The concept of putting in trigger warnings in general doesn’t bother me. I used to warn much more. But what bothers me is bowing to demands that tell me: “If you do this thing that you are actually allowed to do and which is perfectly fine, then you are an arsehole and a morally bad person.” I’m 100% bristling at that demand, for my own personal reasons that are not for internet users to know. I can’t do it. So I chose to only use CNTUAW. Which is absolutely valid.

why not help the people who need the warnings

Frankly? My own mental health is more important to me than your (general your) ability to read my fic. My ability to participate in fandom the way I need it trumps your (general your) wish to be able to access my fic.

[greekgoddess458]

i never said i wanted to access your fic, i just want to protect the people who come across it not expecting sensitive content

i understand not liking the demand, and i dont do well with demands either, which is why im not demanding anything

just know that some readers dont know what theyre getting into, and even if its their fault, they shouldnt have to suffer through shit because of that

so go ahead, participate in the fandom the way you want, but know that the people who get triggered because you didnt put warnings because you got offended by some people's demands (like i said, i get it, but there is a time where they have a point) might get mad at you for that, so be prepared

just a warning, αγάπη

[octopuscato]

I can’t believe “You need to tag whether or not your fic has a sad ending or else you’re untrustworthy/being a dick!” is a legitimate demand in fandom these days. I just. No. No no no. Good grief. I’m so glad AO3 doesn’t actually require any of this.

There is a level of “manage all my emotions for me!” that I find deeply disturbing, and this belongs into that category.

Now excuse me while I make love to ao3’s default and only actually required tag, “author chose not to use archive warnings”.

[greekgoddess458]

hey, as someone with severe complex ptsd and as someone that can go into an episode from things with no trigger warnings, i just wanna say one thing.

fuck you.

[octopuscato]

How is it my responsibility to micromanage your mental health? I tag everything that is required to tag. If that is not to your taste, don’t read my fics. You are not my target audience, and you are not entitled to being my target audience. Essentially, our conversation boils down to: Me: “I’m doing fandom this [perfectly legitimate by the standards of the platform I post on ] way, because I really don’t like that other way.” You: “Fuck you for using Ao3 the way you’re entitled to, I should be able to lay the burden of my mental health on your shoulders.” Ridiculous.

[greekgoddess458]

i dont read your fics, and where did i say that i should lay the burden of my mental health on your shoulders??

all im sayings is that trigger warning are EXTREMELY helpful, and youre bashing them because they offend you??

i dont care who youre target audience is, but if there is sensitive content in your fics then fucking put a trigger warning on there

having trigger warning helps people like me (and trust me, there are a lot of us) not have to go through terrible mental health things. why are you so against that??

having trigger warnings has saved me from episodes countless times

what’s funny to me is you say im laying the burden of my mental health on your shoulders, and you say youre entitled to shred my mental health by not taking an extra step and helping to protect people

its fucking pathetic, and its sad.

how am i supposed to know if the contents of your fics are sensitive or not if there are no trigger warnings?

[octopuscato]

all im sayings is that trigger warning are EXTREMELY helpful, and youre bashing them because they offend you?? 

No. Warnings don’t offend me. I’m expressing my distaste for the fact that people demand authors put tags like “sad ending” on their fic or else they’re evil, morally deficient people. As it clearly says in my OP. This kind of demand combined with moral judgment offends me.

having trigger warning helps people like me (and trust me, there are a lot of us)

I know. I’m one of us :) 

you say youre entitled to shred my mental health

No. I’m saying the burden of deciding whether or not to read something, and thereby their mental health, lies on the shoulders of the readers. I can’t do anything to your mental health with my fic - except if I were to mistag. Mistagging is a dick move and I don’t condone that, plus it can be reported. But using the default tag of the site is not mistagging.

how am i supposed to know if the contents of your fics are sensitive or not if there are no trigger warnings?

If you read on Ao3, which is what my op was about, then authors are required to put up one of the following five:

Clearly, all of those are trigger warnings. Yes, even “choose not to use Archive warnings”, since it tells you that the author opted out of the whole warning business, meaning you need to avoid their fic if you’re not cool with surprise!sensitive content that might be in there. And this is entirely YOUR CHOICE and YOUR RESPONSIBILITY.

i dont care who youre target audience is, but if there is sensitive content in your fics then fucking put a trigger warning on there

My target audience is people who are fine with being surprised, which is why I use “choose not to warn”. Everyone who informed themselves properly about Ao3 knows that it means “beware, here be dragons”.

If a reader chooses to ignore that, it’s their fault.

[greekgoddess458]

my problem is not everyone knows that there could be sensitive content with no trigger warnings--that happened to me

and if you are one of us, why does it bother you to put those trigger warnings?? i just genuinely dont understand if youre in the mental state where they are extremely helpful

i agree it shouldnt be enforced, but that doesnt mean that it shouldnt happen. im not demanding anything, but trust me, people who arent triggered arent going to be offended by trigger warnings.

why not help the people who need the warnings instead of being offended that some people are demanding it

(p.s., im not demanding you to put trigger warnings, i just really, really think its a good choice)

[octopuscato]

I can’t believe “You need to tag whether or not your fic has a sad ending or else you’re untrustworthy/being a dick!” is a legitimate demand in fandom these days. I just. No. No no no. Good grief. I’m so glad AO3 doesn’t actually require any of this.

There is a level of “manage all my emotions for me!” that I find deeply disturbing, and this belongs into that category.

Now excuse me while I make love to ao3’s default and only actually required tag, “author chose not to use archive warnings”.

[greekgoddess458]

hey, as someone with severe complex ptsd and as someone that can go into an episode from things with no trigger warnings, i just wanna say one thing.

fuck you.

[octopuscato]

How is it my responsibility to micromanage your mental health? I tag everything that is required to tag. If that is not to your taste, don’t read my fics. You are not my target audience, and you are not entitled to being my target audience. Essentially, our conversation boils down to: Me: “I’m doing fandom this [perfectly legitimate by the standards of the platform I post on ] way, because I really don’t like that other way.” You: “Fuck you for using Ao3 the way you’re entitled to, I should be able to lay the burden of my mental health on your shoulders.” Ridiculous.

[greekgoddess458]

i dont read your fics, and where did i say that i should lay the burden of my mental health on your shoulders??

all im sayings is that trigger warning are EXTREMELY helpful, and youre bashing them because they offend you??

i dont care who youre target audience is, but if there is sensitive content in your fics then fucking put a trigger warning on there

having trigger warning helps people like me (and trust me, there are a lot of us) not have to go through terrible mental health things. why are you so against that??

having trigger warnings has saved me from episodes countless times

what's funny to me is you say im laying the burden of my mental health on your shoulders, and you say youre entitled to shred my mental health by not taking an extra step and helping to protect people

its fucking pathetic, and its sad.

how am i supposed to know if the contents of your fics are sensitive or not if there are no trigger warnings?

[octopuscato]

I can’t believe “You need to tag whether or not your fic has a sad ending or else you’re untrustworthy/being a dick!” is a legitimate demand in fandom these days. I just. No. No no no. Good grief. I’m so glad AO3 doesn’t actually require any of this.

There is a level of “manage all my emotions for me!” that I find deeply disturbing, and this belongs into that category.

Now excuse me while I make love to ao3’s default and only actually required tag, “author chose not to use archive warnings”.

[greekgoddess458]

hey, as someone with severe complex ptsd and as someone that can go into an episode from things with no trigger warnings, i just wanna say one thing.

fuck you.

[greekgoddess458]

hey op saw the asvab post imma start checking on u to make sure the military dont drag you by the hair to join them

welp at least THEY want me. appreciate the concern tho <3 :)

[greekgoddess458]

SO I GOT A 92 ON THE ASVAB

(Armed Services Vocational Aptitude Battery; a military test, basically, it's as big as the ACT and a 100 is a perfect score)

AND THE MILITARY WONT STOP CALLING ME BECAUSE THEY WANT TO RECRUIT ME AND I GOT A RANDOM CALL YESTERDAY AND I ANSWERED,

"Roadkill cafe, you kill 'em we grill 'em, how may I help you?"

AND THERE WAS A PAUSE AND A WOMAN'S VOICE SAID "I'm sorry, I think I have the wrong number."

I SAID "Roadkill cafe, you kill 'em we grill 'em, how may I help you?" TO THE MOTHERFUCKING UNITED STATES MILITARY WHAT HAVE I DONE

[greekgoddess458]

me jumping from happy to sad to horny to sad to angry to happy to horny to angry to sad