Joel can literally die for Midge and ya'll would hate him for it
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@joel-maisel
Joel can literally die for Midge and ya'll would hate him for it
Joel is probably my favorite character on the show.
Also, I really liked Rachel in the church scene and started liking Midge again. At least, for a bit.
(The video call-in was touching.)
A synagogue is not a church.
Michael Zegen as Joel Maisel in THE MARVELOUS MRS. MAISEL 5x03 “Typos and Torsos”
To be continued? Apparently so.
In defense of Joel Maisel
Yes, Joel starts out the series as a dirtbag who cheats on his wife, and leaves her for his secretary, and is not very good at his job.
But.
Everyone overlooks all of his good qualities, and how much he has grown over the seasons. He always supports Midge's career, and always belives that Suzie knows best when it comes to Midge's career. He always protects Midge, and while she'll say that she doesn't need protection, she has a tendency to get into trouble, and Joel is quick to protects. He always defended Midge, and is always there for her no matter what. He is the only man who is always there for Midge, and has her back. He is the only person who fits into every aspect of her life. Lenny Only fits into the part of her that is a comic, but not the other parts. Lenny is also an addict who won't get better, and dies in 1966, so him and Midge are essentially doomed. He also never Stays in her life for too long. And then there is Benjamin, who wasn't it for Midge. He was amused by her career, but didn't understand it. Joel however, does understand those aspects of Midge that the other men don't.
He becomes a successful business owner, was supportive of Mei being a doctor, and supportive of Midge's career as a comic. He is above everything else, a doting father.
He is a product of his time, but he puts his kids first. He is a more present father than most men would be in that time. The reason he's in prison in the flashforward is probably him protecting Midge, or taking the fall for.
He's not a perfect. He's very flawed, but so is Midge, yet we still root for her.
Joel is nothing like Christopher from Gilmore Girls.
Joel and Midge have one supporter on this site and that is me.
I know we are very unpopular in this fandom, but I love Joel and Midge. Seriously—I adore them. And I know Joel was an insecure ass who cheated and hurt our girl, but his development over the last five seasons means a lot to me. He’s not perfect—at all. And growth is never linear. I don’t agree with all of his choices. What I do love, though, is that he has taken ownership for his mistakes. Joel knows he fucked up. He REALLY fucked up. But I love that he’s become so protective of Midge, and is adamant about protecting her. Midge Maisel needs no man to look “after” her, but she has her blind spots (big ones), and Joel knows that, too. He loves her. And most of the time, he doesn’t deserve her. Even I’m not convinced he deserves her now. But he understands her. And she understands him. There is a respect there that wasn’t there before—one that comes with healing. And if the flash forward tells me anything, it’s that Joel is the longest and most consistent relationship Midge has ever had—failed marriages; the tear between her and Susie; her children…Joel is a constant. They’re not together in the traditional sense, but they will always fold into each other, and I think that’s that story ASP has been trying to cement since the beginning. I remember reading somewhere that ASP said something along the lines of how Midge will get everything she wants, but she’ll remember the day before Joel left her as the happiest day of her life (if someone can source this that would be great!). Joel represents a time of her life that was the epitome of stability and comfort. With all her fame; her glory—I don’t think anyone on this show was destined for a happy ending, and the crux of this is what happens when you step beyond the confines of expectation. Its an empowering story, and Midge was always destined for greatness, but this greatness comes with tremendous loneliness—one that Midge never reconciles with.
THE MARVELOUS MRS. MAISEL 4.01 Rumble on the Wonder Wheel
*clenches fist* its about the foreshadowing
So, I did a thing
Joel the Cheater
I’m not gonna get too deep into a discussion about cheating because there’s no way to tackle the whole of human relationships and experiences, and what “discourse” exists is pretty un-nuanced: cheaters are the worst and they can fuck off while the cheatee deals with long-lasting trust issues.
Pretty decent generalization for monogamous relationships, although it is very much for the perspective of the person who was cheated on. What don’t really know what happens to the cheater, not do we usually care. They fucked off. They are an archetype whose purpose is to spur growth in the cheatee.
So, let’s talk about Joel Maisel. The silver spoon-fed boy. The insecure coward. The self-flagellating cheater. The man who did not fuck off.
This post is obviously Joel-centric but it’s really about our general attitude towards cheaters in films/shows (and maybe real-life?). I guess I’m just tired of people writing off cheaters so broadly that they’re entire identity is erased.
Let’s get this this out of the way: We know what he did before/during season 1 was wrong, and he lied about a bunch of important things and blah blah blah he sucked. Joel betrayed his wife. He threw their whole life into chaos not only because he lied, but because he let his insecurities consume him.
If you’re not into Joel it’s completely fair to dislike his scenes, but I don’t think it’s fair to dismiss him as trash forever because of his past behavior, including his cheating. I still see people really hating on him for that, and it’s fine, it’s just my personal take that characters should be allowed to bounce back from transgressions like cheating.
I’m interested in Joel’s trajectory because when it comes to “redeeming” himself, Joel doesn’t know what the fuck to do and it’s kind of fascinating. (I love it when people have no idea what to do cause like, it me.) In season 1 he tried to lean into it and stay with Penny, but he wasn’t happy. He could’ve been, but he chose not to because he was still so, SO indecisive. He still wore his wedding ring!
It is clear that he wanted Midge and their old life, but he couldn’t have them because the one thing he stuck by is his own fragility. Season 2 begins with him rejecting Midge because he knows he couldn’t take her comedy. That’s kind of revelatory because he has the self-awareness to know what he can handle in a relationship.
Joel set up boundaries that he doesn’t want to cross in a relationship, which is healthy. And I think by season 3 he’s been good at managing his issue… So much so that he tries to stop his best friend from going down the same road. This is for a couple of reasons, but the point is that there is some kind of quiet redemption going on for Joel and it’s largely internal. I don’t think redemption in his case involves some grand epiphany or gesture.
That stems the question of what redemption looks like for a cheater, narratively or in real life. Redemption in stories usually involves Fighting for Justice or Bouncing Back from Failure, but when it comes to intimate, complex human relationships (with the added layer of marriage), growth is often invisible and sometimes imperceptible to outsiders. Frankly, esp. in real life, they don’t owe us outsiders “proof” of such growth.
It’s probably really difficult to start a story with a cheater and have him not go away. I feel like most shows/movies we watch featuring cheaters are usually from the POV of the cheatee, and the best outcomes between the two are either that the cheater fucks off forever, or, they make peace with each other and then the cheater fucks off (both valid, by the way). So watching Joel Maisel exist and try to come back from his truly ugly transgressions is pretty compelling to me. There’s not one way to redeem someone like that, and frankly as the audience, it’s understandable that we don’t always know how to feel about such a character.
You know who else has no guidance? Joel. Like, there’s no blueprint on how to come back from that, or how to atone, or who you owe.
This is all to say that yes, it does still feel a little weird for me to reblog/post about Joel Maisel and tag it with stuff like “#boi LOVES her” and “#he precious!” because his cheating and lying ‘taints’ him. Like it’s hard to straight-up “stan” him. But I really don’t think he should be forever hated for it.
I’m posting this because there are a lot of cheaters on-screen but usually singular, broad ways of looking at them. Because the stories usually aren’t about them, we don’t see their interiority. I argue that Maisel gives us a great opportunity so dive into another viewpoint regarding someone who’s cheated. It reminds us that humans can turn around shitty behaviors, and that life really does go on for both people in a broken relationship.
It’s so fascinating to me how I cannot deny that no one will love/understand Midge more than Joel, and vice versa. It’s so beautiful and sad at the same time.
“You meet a girl. Maybe she’s pretty, maybe she’s smart, maybe she’s funny. Maybe your parents like her. Maybe you get really lucky, and she’s one or two of those things. I got them all with you.”
— Joel Maisel, The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel, S01E08
My plans
2020
50 amazing color photos capture street senes of New York in the 1960s.
HOW is Michael Zegen 41!?!?!??!
It's not a fake Google birthday, he is 41.