I'm transferring everything over to a new primary blog, because the sideblog limitations are annoying me. This means:
-Links will be broken until tomorrow when the new URL is properly set up.
-Some formatting stuff might change in the transfer. Hopefully I will make things better.
-There will be a weird period of time where I'm either... responding to asks on here and then reblogging them onto the new blog, or screenshotting them and responding that way. Haven't decided which, yet.
I'll pin an update here with links to the new blog when it's ready! Thanks for your patience!
I'm transferring everything over to a new primary blog, because the sideblog limitations are annoying me. This means:
-Links will be broken until tomorrow when the new URL is properly set up.
-Some formatting stuff might change in the transfer. Hopefully I will make things better.
-There will be a weird period of time where I'm either... responding to asks on here and then reblogging them onto the new blog, or screenshotting them and responding that way. Haven't decided which, yet.
I'll pin an update here with links to the new blog when it's ready! Thanks for your patience!
in case you hadn't noticed, wawlt is written entirely in a horrendous mixed tense that I would imagine is roughly as maddening to read as it is to write. I say that as if I will be more careful not to write like that going forward, and I probably won't, but what the fuck was I thinking?
I think it's a processing delay. Like, R! is narrating what's actually happening and then they realize something that happened a moment ago or the context of what happened a moment ago a beat too late, so it switches to past tense while they explain that and then back again to present tense.
It, once again, boils down to WAWLT!R being Autistic.
in case you hadn't noticed, wawlt is written entirely in a horrendous mixed tense that I would imagine is roughly as maddening to read as it is to write. I say that as if I will be more careful not to write like that going forward, and I probably won't, but what the fuck was I thinking?
I think it's a processing delay. Like, R! is narrating what's actually happening and then they realize something that happened a moment ago or the context of what happened a moment ago a beat too late, so it switches to past tense while they explain that and then back again to present tense.
It, once again, boils down to WAWLT!R being Autistic.
in case you hadn't noticed, wawlt is written entirely in a horrendous mixed tense that I would imagine is roughly as maddening to read as it is to write. I say that as if I will be more careful not to write like that going forward, and I probably won't, but what the fuck was I thinking?
I think it's a processing delay. Like, R! is narrating what's actually happening and then they realize something that happened a moment ago or the context of what happened a moment ago a beat too late, so it switches to past tense while they explain that and then back again to present tense.
It, once again, boils down to WAWLT!R being Autistic.
I have another question about writing! (if it isn't an issue for you, if yes just ignore or take your take I don't mind)
So like, it's not only the way you narrate that gives life to the story, but also your dialogues which feel like they actually contribute to the vibes just right and are so in character, i often struggle with coming up with dialogue that doesn't feel like awkward small talk/bland or like it's there at the wrong time, how do you manage to make characters interact in meaningful ways through dialogue without them feeling or sounding like the same person? Thank you soso much again
So, I always feel insecure about my dialogue unfortunately so this advice might all be garbage, I apologize.
As far as avoiding characters all feeling or sounding like the same person, I think that reading dialogue out loud helps me a lot with this. Getting an understanding of the rhythm of a character's speech is tricky on paper, but if you figure it out outloud and then edit what you have (change around words, add punctuation (including bonus expletives), etc) you end up with something more solid. The conscious choice to give characters, especially side characters, certain verbal quirks can help too! Picking a few pieces of slang or speech habits a character has can help set their dialogue apart and make it feel unique.
I also think that dialogue tags are a big part of making dialogue interesting and flow right. People get so stuck on the "always use said" vs "keep a thesaurus open" debate and I honestly don't love either take. Whenever possible, I use some form of action description and, if necessary, a basic tag (often said/says but sometimes a specific word to clarify tone). Not only does this make for a more interesting flow, but physically moving the scene along with action makes it feel less awkward when a conversation just... ends or has a weird break. If there isn't any action or description that can happen and who is speaking can easily be assumed, I always cut the tag off entirely. If my character is conversing so quickly that they aren't noting ANYTHING about the setting or the person they're talking to or having any internal monologue, it means that I want the flow of a spitfire back and forth conversation that you can only really achieve with the absence of a tag.
As far as small talk and 'boring conversations'... I think it goes one of three ways:
Your character enjoys small talk. Simple, polite conversations are meaningful to them and they will have thoughts and feelings about those conversation that either helps them expand beyond small talk or can be reflected on in their internal monologue. This type of character is probably friendly, sociable, and caring. When we see them enjoy these kinds of conversations we learn a lot about them.
Your character does not enjoy small talk. It should feel awkward, because they hate it and do not want to do it. They might have internal monologue about how much they hate small talk or how dumb they feel this conversation is. When we see how uncomfortable or irritated your character is, we learn things about who they are and what is important to them, as well as how they deal with awkwardness or conflict
If the conversation is going to reveal nothing about the characters (who they are, what they feel, how they navigate the world)... don't write it. Write about something else. Skip that part. Write about what they do care about. Even if they are actively having that conversation, make it the background intentionally.
I don't think I've ever written WAWLT!R doing small talk (except maybe with Hobie. But Hobie would have been carrying)... because they simply wouldn't. And I'm going to whip up a fake scenario for it as an example of how I would handle that type of situation. Hang tight with me real quick:
--
"Hey." Hobie grabs your attention at the same time that he grabs your hand. You're starting to wish you'd stapled yourself to this wall. That way he couldn't pry you off of it like he clearly intends to do.
You lace your fingers with him and try to counter his pull with your own. Bringing him closer to your safe zone to distract him from pulling you out of it.
"Come with me," he pleads, "I wanna introduce you to this band. They're cool, I promise."
You glance from side to side. No visible escape. Plus, it does seem like this matters to him. Who are you to say no. You can handle it.
"Okay."
You soak up the way his smile brightens. He keeps hold of your hand, dragging you through the sea of people. When he stops, it's in front of a group of six people, all in their own circle chatting.
"Hobie!" One of them, a short blue haired kid with an empty drink in one hand and a fresh one in the other, cheers when they see you.
"I lived!" he gives your hand a reassuring squeeze, "This is Y/N, my partner and the Spiderband's visual artist."
"Heya." You raise your free hand in an awkward not-wave.
Fuck, you are so glad to have Hobie here with you. You are not made for this whole conversation thing. With the band, you get by okay. Usually because everyone else is talking so much that you get away with only chiming in when you actually have something to say. When that fails, Hobie or Kam are around to cover for you. In cases of extreme emergency, everyone understands that sometimes you just... don't talk. But without people who know you, and without Hobie to explain it in that carefree way he always does, you get stuck speechless every time.
"It must be nice to have someone to handle all of the art and merch and shit," the person on Hobie's other side notes, "we're running out of magazines to cut up and make flyers out of. 'sides, people are starting to realize it's not a style choice and we just can't draw for shit!"
Hobie laughs. It makes you wish you were at home with him instead of here. "They're great. We're lucky to have 'em."
"You looking for extra work, Y/N? We could pay you in expired coupons and eternal devotion!"
Your eyes snap up from the floor when you hear your name. Only, not fast enough to track the voice until after it's stopped. You look around for an expectant face as a clue, but all six of them look at you like they're waiting for your answer. You're truly lost.
"Hey now," Hobie pouts, "I thought we were friends! What're you doing trying to steal my guy?"
--
I was able to, in that blurb, really do all three of those things. Hobie lives for the small talk the casual banter is in his soul and his love for it is part of what makes his dialogue distinct. That's what all the little quips are. He's more than happy to have that kind of conversation, which makes it interesting and meaningful. R! does not feel that way AT ALL. I started showing that by letting them be awkward, because they would be awkward. Then, they internally comment on how awkward it was and how much they hate it. I don't show any more of the conversation until it matters to them again, but dialogue amongst the other characters could 100% be happening while R! is thinking about how much they hate these kinds of convos. We don't see it because it isn't important to them. If it doesn't matter to my characters, it isn't in my story. If I was writing from Hobie's POV, I would probably write it differently. It's highly likely that while R! was ruminating on how uncomfortable they felt, Hobie was intently listening to people around him... and probably also having his own internal monologue about how uncomfortable R! looks.
You could write a whole chapter without dialogue. Or, at minimum, with your narrator not verbalizing at all. I just finished reading You Weren't Meant to Be Human by Andrew Joseph White, which features a nonverbal Autistic character who only directly communicates with others maybe fifty times in the whole novel (disclaimer: I did not count). 90% of the dialogue is between other characters or simply not present. Instead, we get LOTS of internal dialogue. The character and their relationships don't feel flat, though, because verbally communicating with others isn't important to them. They don't want to do it, so why would they?
Same goes for your characters. If you feel like what your character is saying is awkward and awkward isn't your goal, they probably should be saying something different or nothing at all. Refocus on what they're doing or noticing and only have them speak when they're ready. If you can't figure out how to push forward from that point, I'd reevaluate the portion of your story you're writing and consider jumping right into the "action" of a situation vs the exposition/lead up.
I hope that this is helpful! I wanna add that this is just my style and my methods. There are so many resources out there that may be better and/or disagree with me completely. Either way, my inbox is always open if you have further/clarifying questions!
I have another question about writing! (if it isn't an issue for you, if yes just ignore or take your take I don't mind)
So like, it's not only the way you narrate that gives life to the story, but also your dialogues which feel like they actually contribute to the vibes just right and are so in character, i often struggle with coming up with dialogue that doesn't feel like awkward small talk/bland or like it's there at the wrong time, how do you manage to make characters interact in meaningful ways through dialogue without them feeling or sounding like the same person? Thank you soso much again
So, I always feel insecure about my dialogue unfortunately so this advice might all be garbage, I apologize.
As far as avoiding characters all feeling or sounding like the same person, I think that reading dialogue out loud helps me a lot with this. Getting an understanding of the rhythm of a character's speech is tricky on paper, but if you figure it out outloud and then edit what you have (change around words, add punctuation (including bonus expletives), etc) you end up with something more solid. The conscious choice to give characters, especially side characters, certain verbal quirks can help too! Picking a few pieces of slang or speech habits a character has can help set their dialogue apart and make it feel unique.
I also think that dialogue tags are a big part of making dialogue interesting and flow right. People get so stuck on the "always use said" vs "keep a thesaurus open" debate and I honestly don't love either take. Whenever possible, I use some form of action description and, if necessary, a basic tag (often said/says but sometimes a specific word to clarify tone). Not only does this make for a more interesting flow, but physically moving the scene along with action makes it feel less awkward when a conversation just... ends or has a weird break. If there isn't any action or description that can happen and who is speaking can easily be assumed, I always cut the tag off entirely. If my character is conversing so quickly that they aren't noting ANYTHING about the setting or the person they're talking to or having any internal monologue, it means that I want the flow of a spitfire back and forth conversation that you can only really achieve with the absence of a tag.
As far as small talk and 'boring conversations'... I think it goes one of three ways:
Your character enjoys small talk. Simple, polite conversations are meaningful to them and they will have thoughts and feelings about those conversation that either helps them expand beyond small talk or can be reflected on in their internal monologue. This type of character is probably friendly, sociable, and caring. When we see them enjoy these kinds of conversations we learn a lot about them.
Your character does not enjoy small talk. It should feel awkward, because they hate it and do not want to do it. They might have internal monologue about how much they hate small talk or how dumb they feel this conversation is. When we see how uncomfortable or irritated your character is, we learn things about who they are and what is important to them, as well as how they deal with awkwardness or conflict
If the conversation is going to reveal nothing about the characters (who they are, what they feel, how they navigate the world)... don't write it. Write about something else. Skip that part. Write about what they do care about. Even if they are actively having that conversation, make it the background intentionally.
I don't think I've ever written WAWLT!R doing small talk (except maybe with Hobie. But Hobie would have been carrying)... because they simply wouldn't. And I'm going to whip up a fake scenario for it as an example of how I would handle that type of situation. Hang tight with me real quick:
--
"Hey." Hobie grabs your attention at the same time that he grabs your hand. You're starting to wish you'd stapled yourself to this wall. That way he couldn't pry you off of it like he clearly intends to do.
You lace your fingers with him and try to counter his pull with your own. Bringing him closer to your safe zone to distract him from pulling you out of it.
"Come with me," he pleads, "I wanna introduce you to this band. They're cool, I promise."
You glance from side to side. No visible escape. Plus, it does seem like this matters to him. Who are you to say no. You can handle it.
"Okay."
You soak up the way his smile brightens. He keeps hold of your hand, dragging you through the sea of people. When he stops, it's in front of a group of six people, all in their own circle chatting.
"Hobie!" One of them, a short blue haired kid with an empty drink in one hand and a fresh one in the other, cheers when they see you.
"I lived!" he gives your hand a reassuring squeeze, "This is Y/N, my partner and the Spiderband's visual artist."
"Heya." You raise your free hand in an awkward not-wave.
Fuck, you are so glad to have Hobie here with you. You are not made for this whole conversation thing. With the band, you get by okay. Usually because everyone else is talking so much that you get away with only chiming in when you actually have something to say. When that fails, Hobie or Kam are around to cover for you. In cases of extreme emergency, everyone understands that sometimes you just... don't talk. But without people who know you, and without Hobie to explain it in that carefree way he always does, you get stuck speechless every time.
"It must be nice to have someone to handle all of the art and merch and shit," the person on Hobie's other side notes, "we're running out of magazines to cut up and make flyers out of. 'sides, people are starting to realize it's not a style choice and we just can't draw for shit!"
Hobie laughs. It makes you wish you were at home with him instead of here. "They're great. We're lucky to have 'em."
"You looking for extra work, Y/N? We could pay you in expired coupons and eternal devotion!"
Your eyes snap up from the floor when you hear your name. Only, not fast enough to track the voice until after it's stopped. You look around for an expectant face as a clue, but all six of them look at you like they're waiting for your answer. You're truly lost.
"Hey now," Hobie pouts, "I thought we were friends! What're you doing trying to steal my guy?"
--
I was able to, in that blurb, really do all three of those things. Hobie lives for the small talk the casual banter is in his soul and his love for it is part of what makes his dialogue distinct. That's what all the little quips are. He's more than happy to have that kind of conversation, which makes it interesting and meaningful. R! does not feel that way AT ALL. I started showing that by letting them be awkward, because they would be awkward. Then, they internally comment on how awkward it was and how much they hate it. I don't show any more of the conversation until it matters to them again, but dialogue amongst the other characters could 100% be happening while R! is thinking about how much they hate these kinds of convos. We don't see it because it isn't important to them. If it doesn't matter to my characters, it isn't in my story. If I was writing from Hobie's POV, I would probably write it differently. It's highly likely that while R! was ruminating on how uncomfortable they felt, Hobie was intently listening to people around him... and probably also having his own internal monologue about how uncomfortable R! looks.
You could write a whole chapter without dialogue. Or, at minimum, with your narrator not verbalizing at all. I just finished reading You Weren't Meant to Be Human by Andrew Joseph White, which features a nonverbal Autistic character who only directly communicates with others maybe fifty times in the whole novel (disclaimer: I did not count). 90% of the dialogue is between other characters or simply not present. Instead, we get LOTS of internal dialogue. The character and their relationships don't feel flat, though, because verbally communicating with others isn't important to them. They don't want to do it, so why would they?
Same goes for your characters. If you feel like what your character is saying is awkward and awkward isn't your goal, they probably should be saying something different or nothing at all. Refocus on what they're doing or noticing and only have them speak when they're ready. If you can't figure out how to push forward from that point, I'd reevaluate the portion of your story you're writing and consider jumping right into the "action" of a situation vs the exposition/lead up.
I hope that this is helpful! I wanna add that this is just my style and my methods. There are so many resources out there that may be better and/or disagree with me completely. Either way, my inbox is always open if you have further/clarifying questions!
in case you hadn't noticed, wawlt is written entirely in a horrendous mixed tense that I would imagine is roughly as maddening to read as it is to write. I say that as if I will be more careful not to write like that going forward, and I probably won't, but what the fuck was I thinking?
in case you hadn't noticed, wawlt is written entirely in a horrendous mixed tense that I would imagine is roughly as maddening to read as it is to write. I say that as if I will be more careful not to write like that going forward, and I probably won't, but what the fuck was I thinking?
@hobiesdump i think the bass needs some thumb tacks to straighten him out, but if my surgeon found out i was standing on my bed reaching above my head to pin things to my ceiling i think he'd kill me.... so it must wait.
Genuine question!!!!!! I love the way you write and I wanna start too buy i struggle to get scenes out of my mind in a way that gives them life or doesn't sound like a check-list... how do you know when to add dialogue to make it feel realistic, and narrate showing characters' feelings without them explicitly saying them? Do you know any resources or tips for structuring your writing? Thank u!!!!
CONTAINS WAWLT SPOILERS!!!!!!!
THIS ENDED UP SO LONG. Writing is my passion and my special interest so I kind of got carried away. I hope that at least some of this is helpful, and I apologize as I know it is way more than you actually asked for.
TL;DR: Get to know your characters, focus on vibe not reality, don't be scared to write something shitty and beef it up/rip it apart later. It's art, not science, the process can be messy. No one will get hurt and no one will know how many tries it took.
Okay so first of all, tysm, you are so sweet.
Unfortunately the next piece of news is less than wonderful and it's that I've been 'seriously writing' (as in taking time to write fiction, receive feedback, refine the story, etc.) and been involved in writers groups and such for like 10 years (about half of my lifetime...). So much of what I'm able to do as far as writing these days is truly just what I've learned over time and it has come with writing absolute garbage and then turning it slowly into something workable. Some of the most consistent feedback I got as a young writer was writing 'too big' or 'too small', exactly like you're describing.
The good news is... while a lot of the solution is just time and practice and a bit of banging your head against the wall until it comes out how you like, I do have a handful of tips.
You don't need to write chronologically. The first scene you sit down to write absolutely does not have to be the first scene that will take place in your story. If I have an idea that I'm excited about but it can't come at the beginning of a chapter/piece... I just write the exciting part first and then fill in the blanks. It's really easy to get stuck and struggle as you try to get a story going. But you are the only person who will see the order in which you wrote things, so it doesn't matter at all. Momentum is so key to getting your ideas out, just start with the easy part. You might even discover that starting with the easy/exciting part gives you a 'soft start' that makes your story feel really interesting from the get-go.
2. Which brings me to SCALE. I used to (and still do!!) get really stuck on telling the "whole story", but you don't always need to. People are smart and they will pick up context as you go if you sprinkle it in. Having a soft start or leaving out details that your narration mentions later also can make your narrator feel a lot more real, like you're hearing a story from a friend and they keep remembering things they forgot to mention. My favorite way to write is to pull together really specific moments in time. If you look at my stuff, most of my scenes could easily take place in under 15 minutes of real-life time. WAWLT, in my mind, spans across probably three or four months for the characters in it. But each section you read is typically a single conversation or interaction. The sense of time passing comes from the page breaks and the chapters, as well as how the characters casually reference their own sense of time in the story. If you go into a story trying to write about like, a full school year, it's easy to get lost and overwhelmed and feel like you need more to fill in all the time... so don't do that. Write about Monday and create the sense of time by referencing that event in a later chapter.
3. I don't know what to call this but I think of it as Gardening Writing and it has two pieces. Piece number one is "xmas tree writing" (I hate relating things to xmas but I think the imagery helps, so... sorry.), the gist is, if what you have feels like a checklist... write it down. Then, start at the top and make it a little more descriptive than it was the first time you wrote it. Add some internal or external dialogue, add some extra details about a character or the setting. Maybe have your character over explain themself or add a detail that they would find important. Go down your "list" and do it over and over again until it feels a little more full. When you start to feel like it's full, you then get the joy of...
3.5. fucking slashing that shit to pieces!!!!! My sticky notes are FULL of lines, paragraphs, and entire chapters of fics that I wasn't sure were actually necessary, so I cut them but held onto them just in case.
These are just what I STILL have saved in my stickies. If you look, some of them are from WAWLT and made it into final cuts, others are from things you've never seen because I scrapped them entirely.
I don't think I've ever cut something and then put the whole thing back, because 80% of the time... less is more. I aim for at least 1k words per chapter/fic but sometimes the fact that a piece is only a few hundred words is what makes it hit right (see: WAWLT ch 17). When that's the case, I add that concern to my list of requests from my proof readers (pronounced: my two long distance besties who I beg to read my shit) and they tell me either "No, the length is perfect" or "yeah, it could use a little more." Often, I sit there worrying about not having the word count I want and realize, to my dismay, that what I do have is mostly meaningless details I hate and don't need. But when I cut them, everything flows better and that's what's important.
4. Vibes based narration. Writing fiction isn't about neatly documenting everything that happened in a situation. It's about guiding your reader to understand how your character is processing and experiencing the story. This means that you can add in and leave out things as your narrator would. You can even twist or misrepresent things based on how your narrator would think of them.
As an example, it's really important to WAWLT!R! whether or not Hobie pays attention to them. That includes whether he's facing them, how long he takes to respond to them, the amount of physical space between them, et cetera. If you look at Ch 6, there are moments with description between dialogue where R! notes Hobie's tone, the direction he's facing, or what he's doing. They also mention things about the room; the sound of the A/C, the distance from one piece of furniture to another. There's other chunks though where they mention none of this and it's just back and forth dialogue.
That's because when they're knee deep in this argument, they only have the capacity or desire to notice the things that impact them emotionally. They notice that Hobie won't look at them when they're feeling insecure. They notice how loud the A/C is when there's periods of long silence. They think about people in neighboring rooms hearing the argument when they're sick and tired of the shouting. All of these conditions exist even when they aren't mentioned, but they are mentioned when they're important to convey meaning. When I write it like this, it tells you as the reader that things are intense. It shows you when there is gaps in the conversation that give R! the time to think. It gives you subtext to help describe what is actually important to the characters in the scene.
So when you're stuck with a "telling instead of showing" incident, you might try thinking of the specific things your character would think of or notice as opposed to the literal thing they're doing. Once again, writing it like you're the character telling a story to a friend is a good place to start. It doesn't need to be exact, but it does need to get the point across as far as vibe.
5. Read your shit out loud. This can be really embarrassing, especially if you're like me and you often write at work. But, sometimes to work out the specifics of what a character is doing or saying I do have to read my work outloud and/or 'act out' what the character is doing. Sometimes this means making sad faces in your bedroom until you figure out how to describe a sad face.
This also means having a good feel for your character and what they would do. I know you've likely heard this before... but "they were sad" ONLY tells me that they were sad.
Bringing WAWLT as an example again, a lot of the story is told through how related the experiences of fear, anger, and sadness are for R! . From the very first chapter, Hobie hurts their G!ddamn feelings when he cuts things off short because it's showtime. Within seconds they are both fantasizing about strangling him and saying (internally) "He needs to get his shit together or leave you the fuck alone". What I can't show well by only saying it is that in that moment they aren't just feeling sad. They're also feeling like they're being abandoned and like they're setting themself up to keep getting hurt. And even if I did say "they feel sad, hurt, and like this is going to keep happening" it wouldn't do the same job of establishing the pattern of behavior that is so important to R!'s role in the story. When R! feels hurt or insecure, they get angry and lash out, when they lash out they feel guilty, and then they run.
At the same time, throughout WAWLT, Hobie freezes and stops everything he's doing the moment conflict arises. For the first half of the series, his response to R!'s instinct to run is 'fine. leave!'. It's only in Ch 8 when R! tries to resolve the fight from the last few chapters that this changes. And even then! Hobie's first reaction is to freeze and go silent. He does his irritated monosyllabic thing all the way up to the end of R!'s apology. When they apologize, he feels more like he's meeting them in the middle than chasing them. It's the first time that, as a pair, they stop for each other and work through it. That moment where he unfreezes, gives an extensive explanation of his POV, and makes space for what R! was feeling is the basis of resolution to every conflict we see after that. After this, even though it isn't stated outright, we see R! a little bit more likely to stay in a situation long enough to explain what's wrong and we see Hobie start to directly ask them what they're upset about when they lash out. It's another set of patterns that can't be covered by explaining how they feel in 'feeling words' because the important part isn't the emotion, it's the behavior.
Conclusion: This is already so much information and I'm not sure how helpful any of it is. But if you have any other questions, anon, please feel free to send more asks and DM me! I would really love to read whatever you end up writing, even if you don't post it!
Thank y'all for dealing with my info dump!! Happy writing!
@hobiesdump i think the bass needs some thumb tacks to straighten him out, but if my surgeon found out i was standing on my bed reaching above my head to pin things to my ceiling i think he'd kill me.... so it must wait.
Oh yeah obligatory... "Give No Flowers" poster is mine (happy to send the file to anyone who wants it!!), Love & Rage poster by Hometown Go, Bass Hobie by @hobiesdump, and everything else is official art!
@hobiesdump i think the bass needs some thumb tacks to straighten him out, but if my surgeon found out i was standing on my bed reaching above my head to pin things to my ceiling i think he'd kill me.... so it must wait.
