Responding to the TADC post, I disagree that the characters have been stripped of humanity. To me humanity is more easily understood as personhood (and being flesh and blood human is the least important part of it). The characters were never human in the first place but that doesn't remove their personhood. I'd say Cain and other sapient constructs are people too, and their minds aren't even patterned after humans.
I think the cast being fine with the situation they're in is fine for the story. They have each other and are now in control of their surroundings. The circus is no more fake than the physical world. The characters don't need to be physically human or have every human trait to be people in the way that actually matters.
Obviously characters need human characteristics for fiction to work, that's a very basic way of generating empathy in the public that watches.
But the question is not if they are alive, but if they are human, or what does it mean to be.
We cannot ignore the premise of TADC and the predecessors it is based on (like IHNMAIMS) and the references it makes (like the Truman Show)
The first thing we learn about the people that enter the circus is that they lose their name, that's inhumane, that's literally taking away something from you that gives you an identity as a person, that gives you a space in a community. Not only do they forget their own names, but also the names of the people they knew. It erases a big part of their social connections outside the circus which makes them feel even more trapped, and also, less human.
Taking away someone's name is something that has been done to people in history: sex workers, slaves, war hostages. And it's done to make them feel less like people.
You cannot ignore the implications of something like that if it's gonna be a big deal in your series.
It's clear that we as external expectators know and recognise the humanity in the characters, the question at hand is if they can recognise that themselves.
Being stripped of your human form, being able to feel hurt but not having the scars to justify being affected by it, and also, not being able to die (at least not in the way that we are used to) makes you feel less.
I think it was Alexandre Kojève the one that said that one of the things that makes us human is wanting to be recognised, so, how can you feel human when you can't even recognise yourself?
The “they were never human in the first place” just reinforces my point, because you are questioning their humanity right there because of the situation they were put in.
But to continue that point, they kinda were humans. They are copies of the people outside, but it can also be interpreted as if their lives were divided in two simultaneous experiences, they have the memories and they can feel, but the circumstances kinda stripped of their humanity, just like you implied with that comment.
The humanity thing goes further than emotions and feelings. It’s about being able to feel human and how much you can change your circumstances until you don't feel like a person anymore.
So thats why im saying they didnt answer in a way that feels satisfactory because that wasn't the focus. That's why I'm questioning why put them in that situation if that wasn't the question you wanted to answer.
I didn't think they were gonna give us another ending because of the little time that they used to give us the story, so it kinda works for the kinda rushed series we got. But im questioning that also, why not make a longer series when it was clearly needed.
You say that they have each other now, but for how long?
We know abstractions are caused by emotional distress, and the people there aren’t in the best situation mentally, they never were.
That's like the whole point of showing us all the characters struggles, and those issues don't go away just like that, most of them are traumatized, that's like the point of the series. (Like, Gangle threw themselves to oncoming traffic)
But also i dont think any human is prepared for a situation like that on top of everything else that life brings you.
Also, we are social beings, anyone that doesn't follow that is a situation out of the norm. You can be on the internet 24/7 and that's still interaction and stimulation. We need that, there is only so much that you can do with 6 people for eternity. We need change and struggles.
Also, they probably had people outside apart from the people that hurt them, people that they cared for. That aspect is also kinda just ignored.
Having absolute control of your surroundings is also unnatural and affects the way the brain is stimulated, that's just another thing that doesn't really work with the eternity factor (or for the rest of your life even). Reminds me of the rat paradise experiment.
The circus is not more fake than the physical world? I made the matrix example exactly because of that. Living in ignorance in a simulation is not real life, and living inside a digital circus with a sentient ai is not real either. It's like a dream, it can feel as real as you like but it's still a dream, it's still fake.
I remember when they made a Truman show reference in a thumbnail, and I think it's a big reference to make, a lot of responsibility. Especially considering that the movie is about a dude who’s whole life is fake and it's broadcasted live for people to watch. Very similar to the series, except Truman chooses to escape because it doesn't matter that that was his whole life, it was fake.
Also reminds me of the case of the movie Labyrinth with David Bowie, because in the original ending (spoilers) Sarah was supposed to stay with Jareth, but the director decided against it because he felt that Sarah needed to reject the fantasy and be responsible.
All these questions are fine and dandy if it wasn't for the fact that the series doesn't want you to question it and wants you to view it as something possible and positive.
I respect the attempt at writing something against the status quo, but it has been this way for a reason, it feels kinda wrong. And if you are going to do it, you need to justify it really well since you’re almost alone on this one. But it wasn't justified well and it wasn’t even the focus. Why make it such a fundamental part of the story? (why make it a part of the story at all tbh. I think I said in another answer that I feel like the author really didn't wanna let go of the ihnmaims setting and references and it ended up affecting them. I kinda get it, i wouldnt wanna let go of Caines design either)
One thing that it's said sometimes during the series is something like “why don’t we try not thinking about it”. And I feel like that's what they wanted us to do during the ending, or maybe the whole series idk. (also that advice is super inconsequential)
I enjoyed the ending when I saw it in theaters, it was fun. But I'm not going to tell you it's good just because I liked it. That also applies to the entire show tbh.
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