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@storkmuffin
You can find the master list of YEAR ONE of my kpop musings here.
It got too long, so I began a Year Two Masterlist because that is a totally sane and normal way to live in fandom.
Please block #storkhousekeeping so as to not have my updates clog your Tumblr scroll
i can’t even express my feelings into words rn
It doesn’t sound like your version of Yunho particularly likes your version of Mingi at all. Incredible work.
Madam, I regret to inform you that you are unable to read. Seriously. You have no reading comprehension skills. This is a problem and not one I can help you fix, but you must fix it. We are in a global emergency situation right now. Billionaires are trying to enslave us all to AI. I'm going to be fine, but based on this comment, it's really clear you are completely fucked. I am not joking. My diagnosis is sincere. YOU MUST LEARN TO READ. You are worrying me.
happy eri day!🎂🎈🎉🥳 for @lesserafimis
I know you've talked about Ateez's contract negotiations several times over the last year but your headcanon about Yunho being pro-Daddy KQ is interesting since he appeared to be one of the last holdouts. Your other headcanons make sense - particularly WooSanHwa since they often seem to be moving in similar directions and usually seem to be pretty aligned on how they feel about things for whatever reason - but your Yunho headcanon is an interesting one. I wonder if maybe one of the reasons Mingi was ready to burn some things down was because even though Yunho was one of the last holdouts, Yunho had an easier time negotiating because of his pro-Daddy KQ alignment? And Mingi did not have that relationship to leverage or fall back on?
Idk. Sorry to bring contract negotiation drama back onto your dash if you're tired of talking about it. But it will continue to be interesting to me because 1) I'm nosy and 2) For a long time, it appeared to be the messiest of the four main 4th gen boy groups. Obviously Enhypen's far more public messiness has now surpassed Ateez's very private messiness but....
In my fiction that I am making up about the contract negotiations as I go, in which I do not bother to look back on what other fiction I made up months ago for fun and don't take seriously either, and therefore may contradict things I've said before, I am making up the following as of right now:
Yunho wanted accommodations as to schedule, and perhaps some additional support, paperwork (I dunno- accounting? tax? whatever?) wise about his acting aspirations.
This is I think easier to do than what I am making up that Mingi wanted, which was to be paid as a song-maker, not only for the songs to come going forward for Ateez but for songs in the past. He also wanted to not have to share with KQ things that KQ did not help him hunt down and kill, even if KQ was going to argue, not unreasonably, that the fundamental reason Mingi the Star had any opportunities at all was because of the high-risk investment that KQ made with its capital in his Ateez career.
Mingi came out much richer OR with a clearer path of getting much richer, than Yunho in the post negotiation period, is my way of thinking.
Now comes detailed fiction about Yunho:
Yunho for his part got his Apple commercial short-movie made, and he had other acting opportunities where he got to experience (from totally unverified accounts from people who allegedly worked on those productions that made it into fandom) how cold and difficult it is to start from the bottom of the pyramid in an entertainment field, but this time on his own. This would make him appreciative of what KQ has done and can do for him, compared to Mingi.
AND YET (and now comes what should be familiar to fanfic people) Yungi are more or less the same person. They are. They're exactly as dorky as each other and as perfectionist, and have this weird same-brain-different-printout situation, in an identical twins except one is right handed and the other is left handed type of deal. The way I see it, if Mingi is fighting tooth and nail and holding out for stuff he really, really wants, Yunho is no more capable of going, Ah screw you, and signing up first, than Mingi is able to not be entranced when Yunho breathes around him. And if we're doing Dark Yunho, then Mingi being the evident black sheep would be useful for him to use as the gauge for looking cooperative by comparison, and having a smoother, less confrontational meeting to get what he himself wanted.
Oh and sidebar on Enhypen - I didn't experience Enhypen's situation as messiness actually. Like, it was a mess, sure, but most of the mess was made by the fandom being very young and having the thing I'm experiencing on this blog writ large - children are often very scared of money, and absolutely terrified of adult level fights about money. Heeseung wanted a solo career, so he actually made a really clean cut to get out of being in the group. It was violently, crudely done, but it wasn't messy. Enhypen6 got their shit together 1000% immediately, as well. And honestly, other than the abrupt nature of Heeseung's departure, neither the group itself nor the company has looked messy to me.
you make a great point about mingi! i’d like to add to my headcanon, if i may: he asked for autonomy and lots of money hahaha
the reason i don’t think he asked for much is because he’s seen what the company can do for him and found it lacking. i think he’s since employed his own people to help him with his solo career — which isn’t new mingi behavior, necessarily. he’s had his own production team and a personal stylist independent from kq, but i believe something else has shifted behind the scenes since he’s been busy all year
his collaboration with mcm, to me, has been very indicative of this change. after the less than stellar output of his birthday pop-up last year, i can only imagine how happy mingi is now that he’s partnered with a brand that can back him up financially and isn’t plagued by constant stock issues
we unfortunately agree that there are members who see themselves as the ceo’s sons, but i’d even add hongjoong to that list. an unpopular opinion, i know! i can see him mediating between the members and the company, but not necessarily rebelling
Anon, before I get to your actual points, I am going to make a public announcement aimed at everyone else:
I think that some people are having a hard time understanding that what I am writing here about the contract negotiations and everyone's behavior is FICTION. I make a point to be clear about the fictional nature of my speculations, and I've tried various ways of doing this - disclaimers, declaring that it's fiction, explaining what fiction is (you know, it's made up by me) - but the difficulty remains for some people.
One more time for everyone who doesn't understand, you are reading fanfiction by Storkmuffin about the contract negotiations.
Using two things that Mingi has actually done in public as my cues, I imagine that he demanded lots of money and held out for what he judged, with insider knowledge of the company itself, to be the maximum available payout. First is, when he appeared on that variety show hosted by Tablo and with Yeosang and Hongjoong, he asked the Epik High guys exactly what their royalty deal was. They didn't answer, but I posit that if he was going to ask that on camera, he definitely had no qualms asking people about it off camera and in his free time. Second are the lyrics to Dinero and the fact that he called the goddamn song DINERO.
There's a variety of ways his sudden uptick in solitary merchandising activity can be explained:
He got lots of dinero from KQ, allowing him to hire his own staff out of pocket without breaking a sweat.
KQ is partially shouldering the costs of Mingi hiring his own dedicated people for a share of the intake.
He worked out a deal where IF he doesn't involve KQ staff or resources, he doesn't have to share a cut with KQ of these external merchandising deals, which would probably be highly motivating in trying to do as many as possible in a short amount of time.
Oh, and some responses I'm getting indicate that there are mental and emotional children reading this blog who think that I'm trying to put Mingi in a bad light or portray him as a bad person in my fiction. To me, Mingi being able to get any of the above is a story of triumph and admirable entrepreneurial acumen. I want to think of him (and other Idols) as capable of actually having a business relationship as partners with the agency that was in this very bizarre in loco parentis yet actual employer of unacknowledged child laborers situation with them from when they were very young, that all kpop entertainment companies have with Idols and Trainees. I am imagining ways to admire Mingi when I think about these things.
What did you think of the concept trailer? I liked it. It was minimalist as well but very atmospheric. The concept itself wasn’t new but it was shot quite artistically I thought. There was also some discussion that screenshots from the trailer were superior to the actual concept photos we got in the first round. And I agree. Which would then put this dissatisfaction more on the photographer’s shoulders than anyone else.
I'm not a lore-tiny, for one. For another, I'm a very simpleton level visual stan, and it's a problem that I hate the make up. Sorry to keep repeating this, but I hate the make up so much.
TXT and SKZ have also made very portentous, artsy concept trailers that were shown at the end of a concert, but at minimum, everyone in them looked pretty to me. The fact that Ateez don't look pretty in the concept trailer irks me, and Yunho looking like Wednesday Addams and the Thin Man somehow had a Korean baby does not help.
Hello,
Adding to the Atiny Bulletin Board.
Thank you for sharing the IPO details. That’s kind of the reason why I’ve been a little skeptical about this comeback, and the quality we’ll see compared to February’s release of GH4.
I was taken aback that the album release was happening the Friday before the group would be set to go to London for this Hyde Park festival. Just timing it out, how would that leave any room to film the typical music show appearances, before they would have to hop on a plane to the UK?
Who picked this date?
Then I took a closer look at the calendar. The Q2 FY closes the Monday after the Comeback. Not a bad way for KQ to get some very last minute earnings on the books.
All this to say, I was skeptical about this being a quick money-grab comeback just based on calendar dates before I started seeing the promos. This looks like what a small, dedicated team is putting together with a truncated timeline.
I love this KQ corporate watch thread we have going on. Thank you for your posting!!
The need to maximize preorders might by part of why Seonghwa and Mingi have both said on their separate TokToq broadcasts that the title track is a Major Ateez Classic, in a way they didn't do for the Lemon Drop, IYF or Adrenaline comebacks.
The other possibility is of course they just really like and are proud of the song. But there was a very tiny slight artificial tinge to Mingi and Seonghwa overlappingly saying the same thing, when their public personas really don't have that much in common, that stayed with me, you know?
oh my god i'm so glad i'm not the only one who disliked the first set of concept photos. it genuinely shocked me, how bad they were, to the point i just decided to pretend they didn't even exist. I don't consider myself as having an artistic eye, but after perusing the Stray Kids concept photos, this feeling was very much vindicated.
(Personally i love the other photos, they're camp, cute and reminiscent of the cyberpunk era, but anyway~ ^.^)
It's bizarre because on one hand it seems that Ateez is trying to be more Serious and Classy (reeling in big brand collaborations, splurging out on Wanteez production value, better filming in logbooks), while on the other, they still put out things like that first set of concept photos.
I wonder if there's someone higher up in KQ who has just decided, 'look, our performances, live vocals and boisterous idol personas are Our Things. Fans will still buy the products, even if they're not top quality, and we have multiple other means of reeling new fans in anyway. We can cut corners in this area. If there are boxes to tick because of the industry's standard content output, then fine we'll tick them and nothing else.'
it's just so frustrating because you want to be proud of the work your ult group puts out, to see the underdogs excel, but then the output is so inconsistent in terms of quality. It's perpetual whiplash for Atiny.
i also just wanted to express again how much i appreciate your blog: you've fostered a space where people can treat K-pop like any other form of entertainment, subject to the same scrutiny as any other genre of media.
My little corner of Ateez fandom is one of the few areas in all of Kpop where there might be actual alignment between domestic and international fans of a Kpop group! This way you personified and then gave an inner dialogue to KQ is exactly how K-atiny describe KQ, when they personify the company and give it an inner dialogue. United in dissatisfaction! (laugh/cry)
Thank you for the nice note at the end. :D I'm proud you think so.
Lmao not Daddy KQ alleging their contracts were signed "early." For like 6 months last year, I was wondering when the hell they were going to announce the renewal and briefly wondered if they weren't going to since it seemed to be taking so long. Unfortunately, Stray Kids did it so early and they were the first big 4th gen boy group (to my knowledge) to renew so they really set the tone and everyone seemed to assume the other three - Ateez, TXT, Enhypen - would do things similarly. They really only announced like 3? 4? months early because their contract would have been over in October last year. Meanwhile, Stray Kids renewed like more than a year in advance or something like that. Idk how long they renewed for but that's besides the point.
Side note - do you know how long Stray Kids renewed for??
Anyways, I feel like KQ really needs to get their asses up and start making waves for Xikers. Ateez are basically going to be defunct in a year or two, and Xikers will be their only money makers unless they debut another group in the next year or so. And idk that KQ has the capacity to manage three groups since they sometimes seem to struggle managing two. I have a personal conspiracy theory that KQ is banking on Atinys coming through like they usually do and supporting Xikers in Ateez's absence.
I do not know for how long Stray Kids renewed, but in the health content they recently did, the members asked Changbin where he saw himself in 5 years and he said, "Wouldn't we be talking about renewal and stuff?" while half asleep on anesthesia.
But more importantly - Ateez is going to be defunct in a year or two made my heart stop for a second, but then I remembered that 5 of them are all 1999ers and they're only a year younger than Matz. So yeah, their enlistment silence will be quite major.
Let's see about Xikers. I don't know them, but I thought they were really charming as the opening act in L.A.
Jumping in to your discussion with word-vomiting anon (lol what a name) - I think one of the reasons they seem to do way more for end-of-year awards is because they have (or at least are thought to have) a greater ability to entice new fans since Ateez are performing in front of multiple fandoms and there are always moments going viral from those shows. I haven't really had any major issues with the concept photos - they aren't breaking any barriers for sure but I rarely see any concept photos from any group where I am like WHAAAAAT. I think the last time I did a double take was when that one group was like bound up in BDSM gear. I don't think they are ever truly going to stop doing the whole mafia vibe because it is single-handedly the only reason that they made any major headway in South Korea. And tbf, that really was mostly just San.
Unfortunately, I think part of the issue is that like you have mentioned before (I think) Ateez can sometimes feel like a group of soloists who should not necessarily work/fit together but THEY DO (and that is part of the draw, at least for me). So I feel like different concepts suit the members to a far more disparate degree than they maybe do for other groups. Like I could look at San doing his little eyebrow raise in a mafia-type suit all day long and I don't know that I will ever get 100% bored of it. But it doesn't suit other members as much. Just like I feel like brighter concepts (a la Wave and Eternal Sunshine) don't suit San quite as much.
Budget, staff capacity, etc. all influence these things, too, of course but I do think part of the issue is how different the members are and how they don't (or can't or won't or whatever) always fit into the chosen concepts like other idols from other groups are able to do on a more regular basis.
Idk if any of that made sense. Hope you don't mind me using your ask box as a bulletin board. Just wanted to put in my two cents because I found the topic interesting.
I agree with what you said about San - if neon San was the first one I saw, I'm not sure I would've gotten on board, but I discovered this group in with IOMT San Era. But I also think that there are longstanding Atiny who find people like me the ones who don't 'get' OG and true-blue Ateez, so there's also that.
the suits didn't move me (i mean they look nice ig?? but that has more to do with them being good looking then anything), the crazy form electric bongaloo was okay (from the preview pic it'll probably be my favorite of this cb)....but now with the duos the psychedelic bandaids take me out of the immersion so bad T-T
literally the only one i think is fine is the san and jongho one! because they gave jongho only that tiny blue star that blends in!!!
I do not understand the green bandaids but I am also very out of touch and boring to begin with. What is the bandaid across the nose supposed to signify, exactly? And I have to admit, sometimes, with narrow ones not in an obnoxious color, it can actually look good for some reason. Not sure about the neon green ones in the pair shots, and I really, really, really REAAAAAAAAAAAAALLY dislike the make up.
what’s that comment “exo chanyeol is what yunho is but for straight couple” referencing to?? I’m not that deep into ateez and their inside jokes but it got my curiosity peeking 👀 pls elaborate
Oh, the Atiny of longer standing will have to augment this, especially on the Woosan front BUT - there was something of a longstanding joke that whenever two other members were engaging in yaoi-provoking activity, sus, shipping etc, somehow Yunho was always in the photo in the same frame, either between the two or just off to the side, looking either at the camera with some sort of... expression or at the pair themselves. He was referred to a lot as "Steve" in the memes I saw before I was a Hotteok. Do with that what you will.
girl youre not better than everyone just because you dont use tiktok
yes i am
hi! i wanted to ask… was there a yungi divorce era during contract renegotiation? my impression is that yunho saw how mingi was moving and teamed up with him, and they very much navigated the whole ordeal together. whatever the case, i’m convinced mingi signed last. he has shown again and again that he’s very loyal to ateez but i think he also wanted to see how much he could push the company. i don’t think he asked for a lot, necessarily, just a sense of autonomy that he didn’t have before (which can be a lot depending on how you look at it)
I think there was a Yungi divorce era, and you disagree, and I think the most either of us can really say is, We don't know.
We agree that Mingi signed last, but we disagree again on what Mingi asked for - I think he asked for the Sun and Moon and Stars and was really bloody insistent about it, to the point of possibly breaking up the group, and got most of what he demanded. I'm basing this on how I interpret his verse in Dinero, and you probably have your own reasons for your reading. I think Mingi separates business and personal relationships in a strict fashion (he's very perfectionist, actually, Mingi, and very extremely a LOT interested in money).
Since we're doing fanfic anyway: in my personal made-up fictional headcanon, these are the sons of Daddy KQ: Seonghwa, Wooyoung, Yunho and San. On the other hand, Hongjoong, Jongho, Yeosang and Mingi, most of all, are very much in the Fuck you, you're not my real dad camp.
Oh god I think tumblr ate (??) a paragraph from the last ask! I also meant to say:
“I really wanted to convince myself that it can’t be about the money since KQ seems to be doing pretty good? Not big-label-good maybe, but I never had the feeling they were struggling financially per se. (Although a personal experience is not a good point of reference) But ofc, production also costs a lot of money and it IS a business, so at the end of the day it is about making money. I still lament how better visual production could bring them financial gain and make the fans happy and proud. “
(Could be that I accidentally edited it out? So weirded out by that lol)
I completely agree with you on that KQ staff wants to do a good job! The end of the year shows are really good and well made, I frequently go back to look at them because they are such a blast. And the music videos have been well made and thought out on the grand scheme. I think this shows how the creatives in the team do know how to make amazing stuff, so it is not about the lack of know-how, but maybe indeed a structural and internal company problem. I think the same phenomenon can also be seen in many other industries, for example animation and videogame. The creatives in these studios are passionate and want to give their best, but then usually there is an excec who decides something regarding the big picture that takes so much away from the end product that the creatives worked so hard on. I am kinda feeling the same vibe here, but to what extent I can’t say. And this is all based on vibes so not maybe the most solid take. And also it gives a feeling that the staff is juggling many things at once for extended periods of time and that easily leads to mishaps of all kind. (But that’s the k-pop industry for us)
This is probably why I feel the internal tug-of-war between understanding a difficult situation and really wishing to they could be, as you said, consistent with the work they put out.
I guess I might as well say a public announcement in line with your ask: If you're going to write a whole long something on tumblr, in whatever format, try to do it on a different drafting app because the posting results on this platform are a touch unpredictable, fyi.
The reason I think it's about profitability for KQ (as in, they need positive numerals on their RETURN on investment rather than trying to maximize reach) is because of this article:
Basically- KQ wants to do an IPO because Daddy KQ wants to be JYP and Bang Sihyuk and so on. He wants to be a peer with those people.
Daddy KQ announced that he's going for an IPO 5 days ago, you see.
There's a little line in there that says operating profit (영업이익) exceeds 100억 (10 billion) Won which I think is about USD$ 6.5M (I am dyscalculaic so all these numbers are likely entirely wrong). Not an IPO lawyer or anything but there is a baseline capital amount that you need in order to actually get your company to go public on the KOSDAQ or wherever, you know, and in order to do that you need to both rake in the cash and also KEEP it.
Daddy KQ candidly says he's directly doing it off of Ateez's backs, that it's because KQ has managed to raise its concert revenue by 200% (compared to what, I'm not sure).
KQ wants to be a role model for independent Kpop companies. And they're kind of fluffing it with this article: KQ ensured continuity of its core IP by entering into a new contract with all 8 members of Ateez "early."
Errrr, no, they didn't. The impression that me and mine have had the whole time during the negotiation process for renewal was that there was a LOT of fighting (there was a Yungi divorce era, even) and the sheer length of the thing (a 7 year second contract!) was surprising to people to boot.
Word-vomiting Anon here (god what a nickname I can only blame myself)
This is purely my opinion but if I would prefer KQ to make one stellar concept per comeback and use that as the material, than make 3 bad/mediocre different ones (if that would be better for their budget.) But I also realise many fans are already SO BORED and used to getting something new all the time, so they cannot entertain themselves for long. So I presume KQ is appeasing the fans by giving them lots of new and mediocre stuff to look at instead of one good thing. I get certain things are an industry standard but Ateez has done things their way before too, so why not with this? And I honestly can’t see the benefits of releasing half baked visuals, it just creates a bad impression
I really struggle sometimes with the balance of being understanding of KQ’s situation and just purely being fed up. Unfortunately Ateez is my hyper focus so my suffering persists
I mean, I understand where you're coming from, i really do. Also I don't know how long you've been in kpop fandom (my own engagement with it is VERY short) and how widely you cast your net - but my lasting impression is that KQ isn't actually trying to do a bad or mediocre job. Most of the people involved in most of the steps have appeared to me to be trying in earnest to actually do a good job, and maybe even come up with something great, it's just that they don't... actually... get there when it's something that requires forethought, planning, a decent budget. Things like, I don't know - booking the most skilled Idol photographer or getting in line early enough to get the better studio or the best make up team, you know?
Because for certain things, like their participation in the end of year televised Kpop shows, they DO book the talented designers to embroider the intricate silver dragons and stuff onto black velvet jackets and so on, you know? My frustration has been that they don't seem to do this consistently. Is the cash flow a problem? Do they not reward the workers who land the deals? What gives??
