Hello love! This has probably been asked before but I'm late to the party. What do you think Rio's immediate thoughts were when Beth said she was pregnant? (S3 E3) I have so many feels about it.
I could've sworn I'd already answered that question but I went back through my 3.03 tag and apparently I haven't—at least not his immediate thoughts.
I'm not sure I could articulate what I think his thoughts are in that exact moment as I don't think he was thinking very logically. He came into the scene fueled by rage and vengeance, and he likely exited it feeling a combination of rage and doubt. I'd imagine his thoughts to be very jumbled and chaotic, then.
I will say that I don't think he believed her when the words first came out of her mouth, and I suspect he pretty immediately assumed that she was lying to save her own life. I can imagine that he was pretty infuriated not only because she ruined his plan, but because she was only able to do so because she knew him well enough to know that her announcement was the only thing that could stop him in his tracks.
On top of that, he was still healing physically, had shut down emotionally, and then was thrust into remembering the intimacy which amplified his quest for vengeance in the first place. I think this was a moment where Beth made Rio feel incredibly vulnerable, and that was probably exacerbated by the fact that he'd planned this moment to demonstrate the absoluteness of his power: he literally came back from the dead. And here she was, presenting life, thwarting him.
It's a really interesting scene in terms of how it's all about life and death, power and impotence, real and metaphorical, fabricated and cultivated.
I think that's a lot to untangle, and ultimately that's why it takes Rio a few weeks to really process and decide what comes next. He believes her and he doesn't. He hates her and he doesn't. He's capable of killing her and he's not.
Despite all the confusion of feelings, though, I don't think he ever had a moment where the thought of having a baby with Beth was anything other than a nightmare.
Why do you think Rhea saved Beth? Do you think it was an act of betrayal towards Rio? do you think he would feel that way? I also wonder if she knew what really happened between Rio and Beth that night and if her decision would still be the same? I think her helping Beth was more about Rhea and her feelings and Marcus than actually looking out for Beth if that makes sense but what do you think?
I think Rhea saved Beth because she didn't want to be complicit in her murder. The show suggests that Rhea knows Rio well enough to trust Beth when she shares at soccer practice that she's both not pregnant and that if Rio knows, he will kill her, and the moment that happens, Rhea has two choices: she could either do nothing and allow Beth to get killed, or do the bare minimum and her own conscious could be clean. She chose the latter, and that makes sense to me because I think the show demonstrated that Rhea's world looks a lot more like Beth's former picture of suburbia than it does Beth and Rio's current entanglements in crime, guns, pills, and counterfeit cash. She's not part of that world, nor does it seem she wants to be, and I think she makes it fairly clear in the final scene where Beth chases after her and Marcus that she wants no further involvement—she got Beth spared, and it was up to Beth to figure it out from there. Simply put, I think most normal people walking down the street would have a hard time doing nothing if they knew that it meant that a real person—one that they cared for in any capacity at one point, even if the circumstances of that were revealed to be false—would be murdered as a result of that inaction.
The question of whether or not its a betrayal towards Rio is complicated, but my instinct is that overall, no, it's not.
First, I believe that canon suggests that Rio's intention to kill Beth is very real, but not truly what he wants, and ultimately he would have regretted it had he gone through with his original plan. In just one episode between 3.03 and 3.04 he learns that there's no baby, and he doesn't have the same drive he had upon their initial meeting. The cocktail of feelings and motivations driving his decisions, then, weren't something he could sustain, and I think it would be too 'black-and-white' to label it purely as a betrayal when that reality is factored in. I don't think Rhea necessarily foresaw that, but I do think Rio wouldn't hold onto it or categorize it as a betrayal in the long run if he knew.
Secondly, I simply don't believe Rhea thinks she owes Rio her complicity in his choice to commit violence, even if its in reaction to violence committed against him, which means I don't necessarily think Rhea would consider it a betrayal, either. Once she was dragged into their mess—entirely against her will, in all instances!—her action or inaction had real consequences that she would have to live with. I think ultimately she wishes she didn't have the problem dropped in her lap, but once it was there, I don't think she believed she owed Rio her participation in aiding his plans for murder.
I actually think Rhea's decision would be the same regardless of how much she knew about what happened in the loft. In the end, Rio was alive, and so Rhea and Marcus didn't actually lose him or have their own sense or desire for that type of revenge. I think she lost all respect for Beth and wanted nothing to do with her from that point forward, but I don't think that meant Rhea wanted her blood on her hands.
I think the more complicated part of a betrayal existing between Rhea and Rio is Rhea allowing Rio to believe that Beth is pregnant with his child more than doing what she can to spare Beth. However, the pregnancy lie is resolved so quickly that I'm not sure anyone would hold onto that betrayal for too long, particularly since Rhea couldn't reveal the truth without also further making herself complicit in Beth's death.
Do you think Rio's in love with Beth? I feel like he must be because of how he reacted to the shooting, imo he would've killed her pretty quickly if he just liked her.
I do think he’s in love with Beth, yes. I don’t think he wants to be, but I think he knows it and it irritates him. I read Rio as someone who is in tune with his emotions and that acts with an awareness of what they are, someone who is generally honest but that masks that with ambiguity, limited information, and behavior that’s intended to hurt and punish.
I think those feelings really started taking root sometime around 2.07, even if wasn’t ready to engage with them. The fact that Beth had put herself in danger seemed to trigger something in him, and despite what he said, he couldn’t stop himself from checking for Jane and then from retrieving and then returning the blanket—for no other reason than he could, for no other reason than it was important to her (even though it likely came with professional consequences since I believe that kind of move signaled weakness to either his enemies or his own boys). Notably, Rio did not have Beth meet him or come outside for that exchange, nor did he alert her that he was leaving it in her mailbox—like he couldn’t face her in the moment to reveal what he’d done for her.
In 2.08, then, we see Rio at his most relaxed and open. Teasing, playful, loose. He offers to help her with no specified strings attached (or clear benefit to himself), gives her uncharacteristically open and clear advice about a turf war, and backs off with little more than a warning when she expresses that she wants to handle it herself. I think this moment is pretty powerful in showing what their dynamic might look like at its best, and Rio seems like someone that’s willing to protect, guide, and support her when things are good between them. I don’t think any of these things are things he gives away easily, and they signal very much how he feels about her.
Then, in 2.09, I think he was still taken aback by what the kiss unleashed. His reaction to the two first soft, tentative kisses look as if he’s just had an epiphany. He cedes all the games and fully seems to embrace letting her know how he feels, breaking to finally kiss her the way he wants to kiss her, without any apparent hurry to move onto the next step. Afterward, he looks comfortable and at ease in her bed, and we’re given access to his private reaction when Beth leaves him in her bed: blindsided and hurt.
In 2.10, he reveals that he still sees her (“they suck your soul out yet, or what?”) and that he’s bothered by her trying to cut him out of her life (“damn, that’s cold”) which is followed-up when he adamantly refuses to field her phone calls in 2.12 as payback—not to mention that during this time, he entertains Annie and Ruby and doesn’t touch them when they fail and fuck up the pill run, instead using it as an opportunity to get Beth back in business. This is really a juncture where Rio could have a clean break from Beth; the secret shopper scheme and the dealership have both imploded and the FBI is hot on her trail. Still, he ropes her back in, and he specifically aims to hurt her like she’s hurt him when he tells her that she’s “work” (I’ve said before that I think Beth’s reveal of the Boomer lie was one that impacted him significantly, particularly since their sexual relationship was jump started when he gave her the keys to the kingdom as a reward for handling Boomer, and made him think she was capable of surviving in his world). This, of course, results in him trying to push Beth—or rather drag her down in the dirt with him—in 2.13, only we know how that goes.
I still think he’s in love with her in season 3. First, at the height of his rage, he charges ahead with his plan to murder her, but he’s rattled when she tells him she’s pregnant. He lies low, processing the news, then takes her to a clinic—the same one he visited when his ex was pregnant with his son—where he’s sure he’ll catch her in the lie. Instead, what actually happens is that the doctor asks about the date of conception, triggering both of their memories of 2.09, and she then confirms that they supposedly made a baby that day.
By the time Beth confesses that there is no baby (through more deceit, pretending that she’d “lost” it), that he has no reason to kill her anymore—Rio doesn’t seem to want to. There’s technically no barrier anymore—the reason he was keeping her alive is now irrelevant—but he struggles with what he has to do, taking a shot for liquid courage just to be able to muster up the strength to do it. Only then... Beth asks him how much it would cost for her life, and he puts on a show that he won’t even entertain the proposition, but then he does.
Could Rio use the money? Sure! His pill business and counterfeit operation has been imploded—by her—but do I think he actually felt that 100K was a sufficient price for her life, even temporarily? Not at all. Not considering how severe her betrayal was, not considering what it put at risk for him, and not considering how we saw how he handled Eddy in S1 or how much we saw him charge her to retrieve “Boomer’s” body. Also, correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t ever remember actually seeing Beth pay him this money—the debt seemed to be erased once he decided he “needed [her] alive” at the end of the episode and took her business out from underneath her instead.
I think taking over Beth’s operations benefitted him, absolutely. But I don’t actually think he needed her, that he’d have been in an absolutely impossible bind without her. It was convenient, yes. It was beneficial, yes. But enough to keep her alive? I don’t personally think so, not without feelings steering the ship of his decisions, at least.
That was actually a moment where a lot of people did come out and say that they didn’t understand Rio’s decision here, and I think the show came back in 3.05 to really reiterate the true motive when the script had Dean announce: “He won’t kill something he loves.” The way the entire Lucy situation goes down is interesting, because I actually think Lucy was the most valuable person (able to continually reproduce passable counterfeit artwork) even if she was the weakest link. Beth, Annie, and Ruby all share the same knowledge about the process, yet they all remain untouched—Rio refuses to cross a line he knows he can’t uncross with Beth. It’s interesting, because you’d think that he’d feel the same way about the shooting—that Beth couldn’t come back from that—but it doesn’t seem to be the case? He doesn’t let it go, no, but he seems determined to address it (“that ship sailed when you put three slugs in me,” “maybe you’re right, I’m the problem,” and “next time, empty the clip”) at the same time that he continues to refuse to physically harm her, despite the fact that she’s still uncontrollable, which she proves when she steals from him. He basically admits to her that his threats are empty, too, when he tells her that he can’t incentivize her with a “gun to [her] head.”
I don’t think Rio wants to go off riding into the sunset with her, or even necessarily that he wants to be with her. But he seems to feel something for her that he can’t control and which influences his decisions, often making it so that she’s the exception rather than the rule in terms of how he chooses to handle her.
When the doctor confirm to Rio that beth is pregnant I always thought for second split when Beth smile at Rio that she actually thought about having Rio baby it what it would be like of sharing that experience with him but maybe I’m would 🤷🏽♀️
It’s definitely an ambiguous smile that can be interpreted in several ways!
My read of it has always been that she’s apologizing for hurting him—he was banking on her not being pregnant and he looks so wounded when he looks at her that because for a moment, he believes it. That’s such a heavy, terrible thing between them because she needed the lie to be real to save her life but now that he thinks it, it means the wound of what they were and the moment that they “created” this baby has been ripped open between them and it hurts. Both their looks—his shock, her smile—feel like they are full of grief to me.
I don’t personally get that vibe from Beth because I don’t actually think she’s ever had enough time and space to consider that type of relationship with Rio and because I think the show has spent so much time with Beth exploring other aspects of fulfillment than motherhood, but that’s really just one interpretation of many for that scene 😊
Do you think beth and dean will more Intimate scenes? Because I hope not I don't want to see that again 🤢
I think it can’t be ruled out since they are married and Beth is currently fighting to save their marriage, however, I will say that the intimate scenes have always served a narrative purpose so I don’t think we’re about to get them “just because.” I also think that we have gotten 4 intimate scenes in 38 episodes and they have all been in direct response to Rio:
Beth sleeps with him in 2.06 after being turned on by Rio and she imagines Rio during the encounter. Narrative purpose: Contrast the connection between Beth and Dean with Beth and Rio; show Dean discovering the “affair” to set up Dean hiring the baby hitmen.
Beth tried to use Dean to get pregnant in 3.03 after lying to Rio to spare her life. Narrative purpose: Sets up that Dean is still tempted to cheat even when Beth and Dean are at their “best,” showing Dean hasn’t grown that much. Shows the extent of Beth’s desperation and how emotionally dishonest Beth is with Dean and how she will use him for her own purposes.
Dean kisses Beth in 3.04 right after telling her “we were so good with [Rio] gone.” Narrative purpose: Shows that Dean fundamentally misunderstands his relationship with Beth and the impact Rio has on that relationship; contrasts against the money-making scene with Rio showing there’s more spark in her antagonistic relationship than in her marriage; sets up Dean’s jealousy being a major issue in season 3
Beth attempts to seduce Dean in 3.07 after successfully stealing from Rio; Dean explicitly expresses surprise that she’s initiating sex now that Rio is back. Narrative purpose: Shows Beth enjoying the cat and mouse game that she and Rio used to play which sets up her attempt to play off his attraction to her in 3.08; parallel shots call back to 2.04 mirror shots in the bathroom; costuming in the robe calls back to 2.09, which ultimately compares to 2.06 as her connection and dynamic with Rio still does more to turn her on than her own husband.
Even the more minor forms of intimacy have been connected to Rio. Beth reached for Dean and seeks comfort in a hug after shooting Rio in 2.13, tear-stained and numb, showing how she’d been affected by the event and setting up that Dean offers her a sense of security, stability, and familiarity in the wake of that trauma. Beth breaks down sobbing and Dean hugs her in 3.06 after Beth has to dig up Lucy’s body in order to save Max, and even when she and Rio are at their lowest point, Beth still doesn’t confide in Dean about what’s really going on. When Dean snuggles against Beth at the end of 4.02, it’s right before he’s arrested for Beth’s crimes that she’s secretly committing with Rio.
So while I think it’s a possibility that we see it again, I think it will continue to fit into a pattern of revealing the degradation of Beth and Dean’s relationship at the same time that it demonstrates how present Rio is in Beth’s thoughts.
I rewatched the s3 bar scene where Beth tells Rio she lost the baby. Omg I didn't remember how emotional he seemed in this moment !! What do you think of then in this scene (love your analysis) and also do you think he believes her about being pregnant and the miscarriage ?
I LOVE THAT SCENE SO MUCH!!!!!!!!!
I think it is wide open for interpretation, but I’m inclined to think that in the end, he did believe her—but barely.
I think if he disbelieved her entirely, he would’ve killed her in 3.03, but there was just enough doubt for him to hold off. Personally, I headcanon that he spent those 2-3 weeks stewing and ramping himself back up, and Rhea suggested that he take her to get an ultrasound and arranged the appointment herself after Beth saw her at soccer practice.
in the clinic scene, I think Rio’s convinced himself that she’s absolutely lying and that he’s going to catch her in it (and her fearful behavior confirms it) and it will finally be over. I think he’s giddy because he’s certain that he’s right and then the doctor’s confirmation of the pregnancy pulls the rug out from underneath him. Since Rhea helped him make the appointment, and Beth genuinely didn’t seem to know about it, I think he’s shocked enough to believe that it’s true (but he’s furious about it and isn’t entirely convinced its his, hence “paternity test”).
When she shows up and confesses that there’s no baby, I think he probably concedes that there maybe never was, but I think he had believed her just enough to have to grapple with his feelings for her—past and present—and I think the time dulled his rage and exhausted him. I sort of read his, “When?” And Beth’s, “Does it matter?” as some sort of acknowledgment that he doesn’t even have the energy to press her on the lie, because he realizes, no, it doesn’t—because now she’s here, and now he has no reason not to kill her. So he takes a shot of tequila to give himself liquid courage because he thinks he still has to do it but he doesn’t want to.
When Beth asks what happens next and Rio says, “Nothin’ good,” I don’t think he just means for her. I think he knows the toll it’s going to take on him. The emotion that rolls of Rio in that scene to me is resignation. She’s dangerous to him and Rio can’t and won’t give her the power of reversing his decision on his own—it would reveal far too much.
So he lets her give her pitch, and he rejects it at first (“yeah, you don’t know my interests” and “you couldn’t afford it”) to maintain the illusion that he is disinterested in an alternate path, but he concedes at the promise of money, firming up Beth’s belief that that’s what he loves most in the world. Through a combination of tunnel vision, desperation, confusion, and repression, she never even stops to think that in this case, I think money has very little—maybe even nothing—to do with it.
Hey girl first I want to thank you for being so awesome ! Love how your brain works and your analysis!
I’m just being a “lilobsessd” with GG right now and I’m wondering why on S3E3 they’ve made the scene where Rio shows up at Beth’s house to take her to the OBGYN is so fuzzy and cute?! With the music, lightening, “hey now” and all? What they where trying to say with that scene? You would think that Rio would be PISSED and not trying to hide it ! Why is the scene so “gentle” ?
Ahh, thank you! You're so nice!
I think that scene is part of Rio's pattern of "honey trapping" Beth, where he lulls her into a false sense of security before he breaks the spell. It's similar to him brushing her hair back and reassuring her right before he shoots Dean. In this scene, the second Beth doesn't comply with his expectations, he shifts and snaps at her to "get in the car, Elizabeth" with no room for argument, so the gentleness is definitely a mask that he takes off when he finds it is not accomplishing his goals. On a deeper level, though, with the music and lightening, I think season 3 was very intentionally keeping their intimate history present. It never wanted us to forget that it was there, just under the surface, coloring all their behaviors and interactions with each other—which I think was important both in understanding Rio's actions in particular throughout the season, but also the way his feelings developed and grew from that point as well into what we saw them become in season 4.
Do you think Rhea knew that Beth almost. Killed Rio? How much do you think Rio told Rhea about what happened?
I think Rhea knows a lot and that Rio was honest but probably not particularly detailed? For instance, I think Rio told her that Beth shot him and left him to die, but probably didn’t tell about the surrounding circumstances that led to it—that he’d kidnapped her or that he was trying to force her to murder someone. Then I think he also told her about the pregnancy.
I think this because:
Rhea avoids Beth and pulls Marcus from soccer, which makes me think Rhea feels betrayed by Beth attempting to befriend her
Rhea agrees to duplicitously lure Beth to the bar so that Rio can surprise her, which makes me think Rhea agrees Beth has done something bad enough to warrant that bait and switch rather than pushing Rio to confront Beth in a different manner
Rhea seems surprised to learn that the pregnancy is fake, but not that the pregnancy existed, which makes me think that Rio recapped what happened at the bar with her
Rhea believes Beth that Rio will kill her if he finds out the pregnancy isn’t real, which makes me think that Rhea understands her transgression is severe enough that Rio would be willing to do this despite the intimate relationship she knows that Beth and Rio shared
It’s possible that Rio was tight-lipped about what happened and merely summed it up as Beth being the reason that Rio had to disappear again for two months, but Rhea seems to know exactly what Rio does for a living. Because Rhea had a relationship with Beth, I think she would want to know the details, and I think Rio had no real reason to hide his history with Beth from Rhea, so he probably told her.
