#alfred beagle

[batman-polls]

Do you consider Alfred Beagle and Alfred Pennyworth to be separate characters?

Yes

No

Other/Results

Voting ended onMay 3

[flashfuture]

(Batman 1940 #16)

I love that the original Alfred was just him showing up and saying "I'm your butler now :)" and Bruce and Dick were like "uhhhh please leave??"

[batbaffle]

whoever wrote this was a comedic genius

[evilhorse]

And a dim memory slowly burns bright…

(Wonder Woman #295)

[winnienora14]

Batman Sirius and Alfred Remus

Anyone?no just me?ok.

[violentdick]

-source: Detective Comics #82-

Weapon of Choice: I was just thinking how dare the Weather Wizard had the audacity to wear a V-neck head high collared romper and go out in public, and then I see this. And everyone now must see this.

[cantsayidont]

April-May 1943. In the modern Batman comics and most modern Batman media, Bruce Wayne grew up with butler Alfred Pennyworth, who became his surrogate father, but originally, Alfred arrived well after Bruce was an adult. In his first appearance in BATMAN #16 (above), Alfred was a former English musical hall comedy actor whose father Jarvis had once been the Wayne butler. Arriving in America, Alfred essentially bluffs and browbeats Bruce into giving him a job. Before Bruce can send him away, Alfred, who fancies himself an amateur detective, accidentally stumbles upon the entrance to the Batcave, just as Dick had feared. Later:

Alfred was probably loosely modeled on, and certainly inspired by, Arthur Treacher, an English actor who had been a music hall star before finding his niche in movies as the quintessential English butler, playing P.G. Wodehouse's immortal Jeeves and various other butler roles. In DETECTIVE COMICS #83, Alfred spends his vacation "at a health resort, cultivatin' a new figure," returning in his now-familiar skinny, mustached form, which was modeled on William Austin, the actor who played Alfred in the 1943 BATMAN serial.

In 1957, a story in BATMAN #110 presented a new version of how Alfred was originally hired:

Note that in this version, Alfred already has his more familiar appearance when he's first hired; the original version was later attributed to Earth-2. (As this story eventually reveals, "Noyes" is actually Bruce Wayne in disguise, testing if Alfred can be trusted.)

The 1980 miniseries THE UNTOLD LEGEND OF THE BATMAN, intended as the definitive Bronze Age account of Batman's origins, presents a hybrid version of these two stories, referencing Alfred's previous music hall career and Jarvis Pennyworth having previously worked for the Wayne family, but retaining the 1957 story's version of how Alfred learned his employers' secret. (I think that's too bad, as the original version with Alfred stumbling onto the secret by accident and then pretending to have deduced it is really very funny, but by 1980, Alfred was no longer being treated as comic relief.)

From whence the idea that Alfred raised Bruce? For that you may thank Frank Miller, as first seen in THE DARK KNIGHT RETURNS in 1986 and then incorporated into "Batman: Year One" in BATMAN #404–407.

In any case, when reading older appearances of Alfred, including his apparent demise in 1964 and his ludicrous resurrection in 1966, it bears keeping in mind that he's really just Bruce and Dick's employee, and is absolutely, unquestionably not getting paid enough.

[tzigone]

Bruce, Alfred and Dick - trust and closeness

A while back someone (I cannot recall who, and could not remember exact phrase for search) on cbr commented on the shift in relationships between Bruce and Dick and Bruce and Alfred. I think it was a reference to a bronze age issue, but wouldn't swear to it.  But in that one Alfred something along the lines of the knowing Bruce better than anyone except Dick or being closer to Bruce than anyone except Dick.  And the poster commented on the change in relationship and how that caveat would not be used today.

Here is an old thread about who Bruce trusts most. First post says "Alfred is obviously far and away at number 1 so we don't need to include him.“ But, of course, that wasn't always true.  Just reading older stories and Batman #40 (from 1947) made me think of it. In that issue, Bruce fakes his death. Dick is in on the secret, and Alfred isn't.  Obviously, that is a very old example.

But when do you think the shift from Dick as the person Bruce is closest to and trust the most to Alfred in that position happened?

I must admit, the more I think on it, the more Alfred supplanting Dick’s place as first in the family and most trusted and so forth bugs me.