#anti-jon

[reinermariarilke]

TMA: Look! I’ve made Jon reciprocate Martin’s feelings!

Me: You ruined a perfectly good protagonist is what you did! Look at him! He’s become boring!

[bechdeldaensa]

A lion raised by wolf and dragon

Jon Snow is an idiot like most other men and Daenerys and Sansa soon learn that perhaps they put their trust in the wrong person. Disappointed by Jon’s lack of communication and short-sightedness, Daenerys and Sansa both move forward without him and with each other.

After a tumultuous start with the Great War and then that against Cersei, the two women become the Queens of Ice and Fire. The North had hard-earned their independence and is given their freedom, Arya Stark, the Queen in the North.

Sansa at the summon of Daenerys is called to Kingslanding to help Daenerys rule justly and efficiently by the standards of what Westeros needs and not just what Daenerys believes is right. 

Cersei, who has been captured is kept alive until the birth of her child. It is not Daenerys or Sansa that end her days but her brother Jaime on his final goodbye to his sister and lover. Afterward, hoping to find some final redemption for everything he has done. Jaime Lannister hangs himself.

Together, Daenerys and Sansa raise Cersei’s daughter as their own. 

[boleynns]

Me and Dany after this episode

[asherlockstudy]

One thing to remember though is that WE are invested in Braime, but almost no one else is! Among my friends NOBODY believes in Braime. they are focused on Jon Dany Sansa Cersei. They ship Brienne with Tormund. They love the Starks and Targs. Happy Braime would be a huge surprise! Also I wouldn't pay too much attention to interviews, pos or negative. After all it's their job to be ambiguous. Of course if there's a consistent trend, like Nik validating Jaime's love, then that's more reliable.

I knoooooooooooooow… don’t even get me started with the illogical popularity of some ships and characters. I’m tempted to rant now. Jon and Dany would be so nice to have a baby and rule but Cersei and Jaime are sick weirdos. Cersei is a bitch but Dany kicks ass because she burns people with style. Jaime tried to kill a child to save three of his own and his sister and he must be burnt in hell for life but Arya being a child happily feeding to a man his own sons for vengence is awesome cause she’s our baby killer. Jon is young, pretty and melancholic, of course everyone wants him for a king,  even though he didn’t have one single interesting line in 8 seasons. Ned kills a man he knew was telling the truth in the first scene and he killed Arthur Dayne who was backstabbed by his friend whereas Jaime kills a mass murderer tyrant who everyone hated and spared Ned’s life when he was backstabbed because it would be dishonourable to kill him but Jaime is the monster because he walks around with a smug smile and a golden armour. Sansa is still hated after all those years despite her character development and the fact that she is the only compelling Stark. And of course

Tormund is the soft hearted bear who should have the clearly repelled Brienne because why on earth would arrogant rich incestuous AND HANDSOME Jaime want someone like her when he can have his lunatic dangerous BUT BEAUTIFUL sister. 

Targaryens, the most boring characters… and the fan favourites just because we liked them in the first episode. It’s amazing what first impressions do. I honestly prefer to see Podrick on the throne, no exaggeration. 

*Just saying, I love Tormund and Ned and Arya is cool too. I also don’t claim that Jaime was on the right of course or that Ned was a bad man. I’m just saying I hate double standards. 

Anyway, Braime is real.

[thewestfold]

I love jonsa but it’s pissing me off that Jon gets to keep whining about Sansa trusting him and yet again let the GA think Sansa is the bad guy/unsupportive family member to poor, poor Jon. If Pol!Jon is real, then he knows that at face value, all everyone sees is that he once again gave the North away, even if it did help his cause.

(Of course, it speaks ill of Dani that Jon felt the need to bend the knee when the dead is EVERYONE’s problem, though arguably Jon shouldn’t have done it since at the end of S7 Dani already had her own beef with TNK because of Viserion’s death. But we’re talking about Jon here.)

I get Jon wants Sansa to trust him, but he hasn’t given her enough reason to trust his political acumen yet. He wouldn’t listen to her before BotB and he didn’t listen to her about going to Dragonstone. What is she supposed to think? Love, respect, and faith in someone can only go so far before your experiences of a person begin to clue you in on what you might expect from them next.

TL;DR Jon, can you stop whining and fill Sansa in on ALL the details? You gotta trust her completely if you want the same trust from her. :/

[goodyfourpaws]

Daenerys was always who she said she was- she would take what was hers with fire and blood. She was a conqueror, born to birth dragons and end oppressive reigns, whatever the means. Jon, hiding behind righteousness, stabbed the woman who loved him while she embraced him, while she exposed her heart to him. Betraying the person who loves you is a stain on the soul that will never wash away. Snapping under pressure (when one’s entire support system has been taken from them piece by piece) is something we all do. Whose was the greater sin?

—i’ll never be guilty of betraying those i love and neither will daenerys

[khaleesi-in-the-north]

Why on earth are you shipping Drogo and Dany? It's a perfect case of stockholm syndrome! Drogo is a rapist and a barbarian! Dany deserves honorable Jon! And why are you shipping Sansa and Margaery? They are better off with Jon. Jon is the rightful king and he deserves all the girls for himself alone!!!!!!!!!

For about half a second, I thought we could have a meaningful dialogue about the intricacies of shipping, real world violence, redemption, and “honor”. Then you brought up Sansa and Margaery for absolutely no reason and everything your Jon-loving ass said went to shit.

Because you left me two lovely messages, I’m going to answer both here, and I’ll do something else with the other one. We’ll go in ascending order from plausible issues to “I want to troll this chick with the most ridiculous comments”

1) Drogo is a savage

Dothraki culture is a very brutal culture indeed. Khals are revered for conquering and killing. It is not as refined a lifestyle as the princes in the land of Westeros have. Hell, they are afraid of boats and the ocean. Yet, they are not without moral code. The Dothraki hold their traditions dear. They have a clear societal ranking and all khals and their khaleesis are shown immense respect. They do not allow weapons in their sacred city.

Drogo represents the Dothraki way of life. He’s large, strong, and vicious. He cuts out men’s tongues. He permits his men to sexually abuse women from conquered lands. There’s no denying that. What we see, however, is that Daenerys’s relationship with him changes him. He prevents his men from raping Mri Mazz. He remains relatively patient with Viserys until he threatens his unborn child and Daenerys’s lives. He shows a willingness to learn about Daenerys and her interests when he swears to cross the sea. Drogo shows progress, which is more than you can say about other “savages” in the series.

2) Drogo is a rapist

In the show, yes. Even if you say Drogo did not understand the real meaning of “No” in common tongue, it’s obvious from her body language that she does not want to have sex. In the books, it’s less clear. He does not touch her until she gives consent. She is initially reluctant and feels pressured into the marriage. Does Drogo understand these pressures? Probably not. He may have thought little about what Daenerys feels leading up to the marriage. In the end, it is not desire that matters in rape, but consent. Drogo, in the books, received that consent. In the show he did not. Show Drogo is a rapist.

As awful as that is, it does not happen again. He never touches her without consent again. Does that forgive the initial act? No. It is a character progression. In a show and novel series about truly awful people who also murder, rape, and steal what makes Drogo’s redemption less meaningful than Jaime Lannister’s? Jaime, who fathers three children by committing adultery with his sister, murders the Mad King, murders his own cousin while imprisoned, lies to Tyrion about Tyrion’s wife being a whore which leads to her multiple rapes and Tyrion’s disillusionment, and of course pushes a young boy out a window. He’s granted redemption, so why not Drogo who makes just as many life changes as Jaime does in his journey?

3) Jon DESERVES all the girls for himself alone

Let’s get the first two pairing problems out of the way: Jonerys is incest. Jonsa is incest and they still THINK they are siblings.

Now that we have that settled, Why the hell does Jon deserve any woman, to begin with? What makes him entitled to having not one, not  two, but every single damn woman?

Jon may not be my favorite character, but I like him. There is nothing aout Jon inherently bad. There is nothing that makes him godlike either. A man who hangs a boy for doing what he believes is right in defense of his brotherhood and family is not particularly honorable. And those vows of honor went out the window when he got it on with Ygritte, sorry to say. An honorable man would account for all advice given. He wouldn’t discount any aid because it came from HIS SISTER (battle of the bastards). His damn lone wolf attitude should have led to him being executed in the first book. How he even had friends, I’m not sure because he was a cocky tool to the boys from King’s Landing then too. He’s a lucky bastard! That’s it!

For all that, Jon is still one of the true good guys of the series. That means nothing in terms of deserving any woman. That phrasing diminishes the value of three of the strongest female characters in the series. They are boxed in as prizes for a man to earn the right to.

No character deserves any other character. That’s not how love and relationships work. I’m pretty sure Robert felt he deserved Lyanna. That doesn’t entitle him to shit.

4) Sansa and Margaery

I have no idea why you brought them up. I’m not even going to argue why Sansa should not be with “Ramsay or Baelish or even that whore Shae” and other “creeps” or why Margaery should not be with “Joffrey or Cersei or Viserys” and “psychos” of similar mind. That is self explanatory.

You did ask why I ship them, and though I’m fairly certain it was to mock me and make an ass of yourself, I will explain my reasoning.

Margaery is kind to Sansa. Genuinely kind. Not that manipulation bs. Befriending Sansa puts Margaery at risk. She’s openly treating a known traitor with kindness. The positive aspects of this relationship are more obvious in the show. Margaery comforts Sansa after the announcement of her wedding to Tyrion. She goes on walks with her and tells her about the beauties of other places just to get Sansa’s mind off of King’s Landing.

And Sansa is one of the few people in King’s Landing who are genuine with Margaery in return. She warns her about Joffrey. She talks to her like an equal, not like a social climber. It’s genuine friendship that is hinted at being so much more.

I would raise other points with these responses, but I actually have a mid term to study for and really want to get on to making the next post. Drop another ask when you want to a) have a meaningful conversation with depth beyond “Jon is a stud and all the ladies should fall at his feet” or b) drop another ask that unnecessarily veers off of the original topic.

[lexi2024]

If GoT ends with a shitty reverse WW thing with Dany dying all "I can save today. You can save the world" to Jon, I'm rioting