#cannibalisticskittles

[mohntilyet]

i read the wigmaker job recently and there’s an idea that really stuck with me, which may well have been discussed before, but it’s really been itching at me. it came from this exchange near the end –

“i don't want to quit.” / illario sat back. the distance between them suddenly felt much wider than a table. / “even if it kills you,” illario whispered. / “death is my calling,” lucanis stated, matter-of-fact. “just as yours is to become first talon.”

(the bits before and after this give important context, too, but these specific lines are what gnaw at me)

i. really wonder if this conversation – and the long-standing beliefs held by both of them that it’s indicative of – contributed to giving lucanis to zara.

like, illario coming to terms with the fact that lucanis really just will. not. stop. for ANYTHING. his cousin WILL get himself killed doing this and lucanis won’t have any regrets. he’ll leave illario to go this alone. (no one to follow after anymore.) combined with the envy of knowing that lucanis is and always will be caterina’s favorite, and she will likely pick lucanis to be first talon even tho lucanis does not want this At All…

i wonder if he thought that, well, if lucanis is going to die anyway… maybe it’s better to have it happen sooner, rather than later. why put off the inevitable? especially if this is the one thing that could shift caterina’s gaze to illario and give him what he’s wanted – what he’s earned.

lucanis wouldn’t be happy as first talon anyway (honestly, illario seems to see that what lucanis is NOW isn’t so much ‘happy’ as it is ‘obedient and content to accept the scraps that gives him’), and he’s GOING to get himself killed doing this, anyway… and sure, they COULD wait it out. wait for lucanis to do something foolish enough that he can't just walk away from it. maybe he’ll even last long enough to be made first talon (if caterina can ever bear to loosen her grip from the title) and be miserable for a while. years even, maybe. before he, again, does something he can’t walk away from.

OR. or. or illario could cut through all the pointless waiting and get right to the point. go straight to where this was always going to end up.

(and maybe part of it is an extension of anticipated grief, too – the loss will be agony. if illario controls when and how it happens, he can control his grief. …except he hasn’t accepted the inevitability of lucanis’ death quite as well as he’d thought and when he gets sloshed at the wake, real grief seeps through the cracks)

i dunno. something about both of them viewing lucanis’ death as a foregone conclusion and how illario Might have had that shape his decisions.

YEAH . YEAHHHHH. i do also think the “to reason” exchange is what solidifies it in illario’s mind. lucanis is like 'this has been a productive if tense talk with my cousin. surely he sees sense now.' and illario is like ‘what the fuck. i think he wants to die’ <- okay im exaggerating a bit but i do absolutely see the end of wigmaker’s job as the start of lucanis-illario’s downward spiral. there’s a reason that it’s something lucanis is stuck on during inner demons, and the exchange that you have very nicely broken down is what he hears echoes of, this is where he knows it started to go wrong

probably the worst part is lucanis WOULD have worked himself to death and it takes the series of events in veilguard for lucanis to see other options for his life, and still he ends up being shoehorned into first talon by the end of the quest. i thought his quest would parallel iron bull’s, in that rook shows them that living outside and away from crow influence is possible, and that he is much more than the weapon they turned him into, but it ofc doesn’t go through like that. it’s genuinely a bit heartbreaking that lucanis finally has support and like. FRIENDS. but with the way the game ends he’s pulled back into the crows and to a life that will be about protecting a cousin that the organisation he runs hates, and for as long as caterina lives, unable to say no to her. and meanwhile after lucanis has made connections outside of the crows, illario has absolutely nothing left (prison of his own making i get it but i still want to get his ass out of there. 😭) so the codependency that they used to share is gone as well. maybe lucanis has a foot out the door but i genuinely have no idea how illario goes on after this

[brekkie-e]

i’m going to go full ‘charlie kelly conspiracy corkboard’ over mourn watch rook, i swear. i already wondered where “ingellvar” came from – was it safety pinned to their little swaddling clothes or otherwise had some indication that this was their name before being left? or, probably more likely, was it given to them AFTER they were found? and if so, by what method? is ingellvar a standard bastard and/or orphan name in nevarra? or just a common name they thought would fit? or the name of one of the watchers that cared for them? or the name of someone interred in the crypt where they were found, like a posthumous adoption?

and then, of course, there’s the implications of that skeleton. ‘stumbling’ and ‘too late to cry’ implies a tragedy, possibly a wound – was the (now) skeleton injured by whatever left them a caretaker to baby ingellvar, or just extremely shaken by it? (tho the fact that there’s no mention of knowing more about their origins than that they were left there would fit more with this person dying before divulging any information, so my guess is wounded.) someone traveling with ingellvar’s parents(s)??

and – what exactly happened? was it a targeted attack?? was it happenstance????

there’s so many possibilities and they’re all WILD

Oh, same! It's definitely one of the things drawing me in more than anything else roleplay wise at the moment.

I've been wondering about the name as well! Personally, I'm partial to the idea it was assigned by the Mourn Watcher's when they decided to keep them. Not necessarily because there's much from the game to suggest either way, but because it works with the little narrative I've been cooking up. The idea of there being a standard bastard name à la ASOIAF style is kind of fun. With the way Nevarra handles their dead though, I could see there being default "common" names so people who don't have noble bloodlines can be easily buried together. All the Necropolis content that I've seen only discusses old rich families when it comes to specific crypts, and it's made me wonder what happens to the random Nevarran baker who doesn't come from a notable bloodline. Or is that where the supply of janitor skeletons come from?

Total headcanon territory now, but it'd be cool if there were regional common names that determine what part of the Necropolis someone unimportant ends up and Ingellvar is one. Though maybe the whole "what happens to normal folk" is discussed and I've just not seen it yet cause I still am working my way through a first playthrough.

Circling back though, I have so many questions too!! Part of me almost wishes they'd left it completely untouched because more room for headcanons? Where as with the wounded skeleton dialogue it let's you know there definitely IS a story there, you just don't know it. I agree the caretaker sounded injured, and I'm assuming they died before any information was divulged. It does beg so many questions cause what exactly caused them to flee into the depths of the Necropolis for safety?? Theyre not exactly easy to access for those who aren't in the club. I'd assume if a violent altercation of any note happened just a few blocks away and an infant was found with an injured dead person the next day- two and two would have been put together. But it doesnt seem like there's anything your character has been given to go off of.

Personally, I am enjoying playing with headcanons here. One I'm gravitating a bit to is Ward was an elf-blooded bastard that needed to be done away with. Possibly a Pentaghast because why not. The fact that their caretaker died getting them to safety puts a bit of a dent in my plan for her to have died and been posessed by a spirit before being found. I really wanted her to have a bit of "one foot in the beyond and one foot with the living" dynamic.

THOUGH. I will say this regardless of headcanons or canon story. I think there should be way more roleplay-ability due to the fact your character is either a parentless orphan or a victim of abandonment (something they genuinely dont know the answer to.) I found on more than one occasion playing through Taash quests this insane level of "my character is probably attending the first family dinner of her life and is probably insanely envious of Taash for having a mom that wants them and unfortunately would not understand Taash's grievances in this moment." Like the way the game makes it hard to believably play an older experienced character makes it feel like there's missing "let my character be a young person who desperately doesnt understand normal family drama and feels at odds with many of the companion traumas because of it." Origins let's you establish how Mahariel feels about their mom abandoning them. HOW COME ORIGINS CAN DO IT AND NOT VEILGAURD?

[elvhenmage]

everything i have to say abt davrin lacks the extra nuance that i assume one gets from his romance scenes, but i still find him fascinating – that drive for Purpose that made him join the gray wardens, and yet, the pursuit of that Purpose often framing him in… sort of insignificant ways? ways that de-center him?

finding and caring for the griffins is important, but his way of speaking about it tends to position him as just The Guy Who This Task Falls To – the bodyguard, not as important as the actual trainers who died. (which shifts a bit over time, but initially……)

and like, being the one to slay the archdemon and die in the process is in no way insignificant, but it's not JUST that – he considers ALL the wardens that died in weisshaupt heroes, and thus, there’s that sense that he failed by not fighting till the bitter end like they did. even if he didn't die to the archdemon, and just fell to the army of darkspawn, he would have Fulfilled That Purpose still.

and he DOES take pride in a lot of the things he’s been able to do since joining the gray wardens, but even then, those sort of heroics seem to often be framed as A Gray Warden Thing (sweeping thru a town beset by darkspawn and saving the townsfolk) rather than… something that he, As Davrin, has done.

(wish i remembered more of the phrasing he uses when talking abt his monster carvings – done for a very noble purpose, and is more obviously something that he can do because of HIS specific experiences with monsters and HIS skills with woodcarving/whittling, but even so, i think what he says still decenteres him from the act a bit)

SO. that sense of loss and failure he has to grapple with… the guilt that comes with LIVING………. thinking you’ve found Your Purpose and then having to grapple with not fulfilling that and eventually finding A New Purpose………. and then facing the possibility of dying nobly anyway OR watching a friend carry out that last noble sacrifice in your place???? much and more could – and likely has – been said about him by those more eloquent that me but even so. even so…

this got so long LOL i'll put it under a readmore. also i hope i managed to stay at least sort of on topic, i kinda got carried away 😭

well as far as i've been able to tell, outside of locking in the romance during the feeding the halla quest, you only get the one extra scene near the end if he's been romanced, so 🤡 but i've only played his romance so far so idk what exactly is exclusive and what isn't. i won't get started on all That though bc i have a whole other set of complaints about his romance

but he absolutely is de-centered in a lot of his own story, which is a huge shame because at the beginning it seemed like it was setting up to BE something. one of the first real convos you have with him at the lighthouse is about how he feels about suddenly being a caretaker and not just a bodyguard. his role has completely shifted from "stand guard while someone else parents the griffons" to "i'm the one who has to make sure assan is properly cared for." and then he applies that logic to assan and the griffons: "these animals live to fight - but i wonder if there's another path for them?" at which point you can say yeah, everyone can find a new path. but then they don't deliver on that For Him specifically, it's just always about the griffons

like it just feels like it wasn't tied together properly. because there is so much to examine wrt how he feels/acts after weisshaupt and how he's had his main purpose in life ripped away from him. and i think you're right in that it is often framed as A Grey Warden Thing but i also think that could've been, like... part of his issue, yk? because he says in one of his journals that basically he felt like he had to prove himself to his clan when he left and he acknowledges that he was being bullheaded and has since chosen to stay distant. so i think him not allowing himself to be The Hero so to speak could be attributed to him trying to make being a warden MEAN something. if that makes sense. it's just that there's no satisfying follow up to any of it because the writing cares primarily for assan/the griffons

he just has so much potential. obvs we've had warden stories before and it's nothing new that a lot of them feel like they have one singular purpose in life, but this is the only one where he tries to fulfill that purpose and fails. the HOF didn't fail because they knew they weren't going to die if they did the dark ritual. but davrin fully expects to die! and there's no weight to it! they bring up the fact that wardens die killing archdemons as party banter for christ's sake - i sat through the first part of weisshaupt going "so is anyone gonna talk about this, or ???" only for him to have like two lines about it that you as the player can't even choose how to respond to iirc. and then he finds a new purpose after weisshaupt where he wants to live because he sees a future for the first time, and that can still be taken away from him. but all anybody ever wants to talk about is oh poor assan!! if davrin dies so does he so i guess i'll save davrin so the poor little baby griffon doesn't die too! and it's like HELLO?? what are you people even talking about. there is so much potential in davrin and his life and thoughts and feelings and how he could be swayed more towards the wardens or the dalish in the exact same way the griffons are but he's consistently ignored by both the narrative and fans.

and actually i will circle back to the romance point in the first paragraph - i don't know if it's romance-specific but during the final check in at the lighthouse after the point of no return, you get this very brief convo:

DAVRIN: wonder what my old dalish clan would think if they could see me now. ROOK: no reason you can't visit them after this is over. DAVRIN: yeah. i could. DAVRIN: (chuckles) and i'd definitely bring assan.

and it's just, like. MADDENING to me. to me, it feels like there's no real moment where you get to further press on the "everyone can find a new path" dialogue and his "was i born a monster hunter, destined to do this job, or did i have a choice?" journal entry to actually dig into how he feels about what he feels like he should be doing. you can't help him through the internal struggle of his warden duties vs his dalish identity even though it is a DIRECT PARALLEL to what do to with the griffons. like i guess the subtext is that whatever you choose with the griffons is also you choosing what his future will be like but they don't SHOW that. his final line isn't even about him!! it's only about the griffons!!

i dunno man. i feel like an insane person sometimes because i don't know if maybe i'm missing something or misunderstanding or not remembering or whatever. it just doesn't feel like he got the respect the rest of the companions did with their personal quests and it sucks because you can see the glimmers of potential in his storyline and how perfectly he parallels the fate of the griffons. they just didn't spotlight him enough for it to feel like his issues were resolved imo. which is exactly what so many people were afraid of as promo material was coming out, and now here we are, having to deal with people saying the final choice is "harding vs assan" and ignoring davrin completely.

but anyway!!! that's all i have time for because my lunch break is over and my boss is already on my case. thanks for the ask and for letting me ramble though <3

[majorpepperidge]

i’m just so. soooooo. mad about it lmao i’m contemplating writing a whole-ass fix-it fic now, god damn it, there's no way i can be content with leaving things like this

Canon fucking SUCKS bro we give this idiot jock the nuanced character insight he deserves

[spetura]

ink you’re famous on reddit

hell yeah it's pretty exciting! and i saw your comment and it made me very happy too!!

[fenharelsregret]

hi! just wanted to pop in to say thank you for finding, uploading, and transcribing all those audio files you’ve posted, it’s very much appreciated!! i love n’iymah, too, she’s super fun to read about and her color palette is GORGEOUS. (also i’d like to commend you on your excellent taste in characters; i feel you abt unromanceable vatnir, it’s TRULY a tragedy but it’s also nice to find others who feel that way, too)

🖤🖤🖤!! thank you so much!!

i know mostly everyone is here for the bg3 datamining but i love my OCs and i put a lot of time and effort into them so you will all be subjected to their content kjhgfdjkghdfd

also lmfao i’m glad!! vatnir-lovers are a small amount (that i’ve seen) but i’m always delighted to know there are other people with FUCKING TASTE out there

[infini-tree]

addendum: their entire CLASS went to SPACE, and now there's TWO villains turning people into the monster of the week

[cheaphalloweencostume]

lars i’ve never watched or read asoiaf but i’ve imprinted on brienne of tarth like a duckling after seeing a handful of quotes from the books, do you think it would be worth it/at all comprehensible to just skim the books until i get to chapters that involve her?

mmmmmmaybe. she doesnt get an awful lot of book time compared to the show iirc? and the books are AWFULLY rough on her, i mean, not like the show isnt, but she gets thrashed for real. still if youve got the books and feel like skipping around a bit you might try