Hi I just discovered your content and I was so immediately delighted and excited to see your cc tagged with transmasc/transfemme frames inclusive. I do mostly historical queer sims story and I’ve downloaded so many amazing historical masc outfits and break my own heart a bit when I realize that they won’t show up for my main character enby sim. I just wanted to drop by and say thank you and I am so excited to download your cc!
Thank you for this lovely message. We're glad you like our system! I've been sitting on this ask because it makes me smile every time I see it. But, since TDOV is coming, seems like a good time to address it!
Trans inclusion is a big deal for us. We have multiple gnc Sims, and we want them to have as many options as they can. But, the body system is flawed. Not all meshes work seamlessly, and some items distort on trans sims. I figure the least we can do is mark them, so folks can decide with all the info. Transparency is key!
Granted, we don't always tag things perfectly. I forget Sims like Nys and Lady Catherine, stuck with cis frames due to their time periods, and that can mean they end up excluded by accident. But we try our best, and will continue to do so. <3
Hi Xan hope your week is well !! I've been heavily referencing your guide to making clothes for trans sims and it's really helpful ! But I'm having issues with the pants specifically T_T I made my leggings for both fem and masc frames and followed your recommended flags and I'm having gaps on the waistband for both FTM and MTF sims :pensive: unsure if it's a mesh issue or a flag issue for me honestly :( thank u in advance !!
Hey there @suzukipc! Pants are tricky. Accessory leggings/tights don't have a mesh, so they shouldn't have any gender-issues--they're just smacked on the body--but leggings as pants do. I'd have to see your files to be sure, but if you mean Skin Tight Pants (Leggings in S4S), that might be a mesh issue, due to the way they're made--but tagging can factor in? Let me put something together...
(4 hours later) ...Okay. In trying to figure out how to help, my answer turned into...a tutorial. Sorry about that! So, here we go:
Troubleshooting: Tagging Trans Sim Bottoms
So. These leggings are from Discover University, made for AF Frame. (Note the Age & Gender flag, set to Female. That's the base they were built on, not who can use them. I'll get back to what this does.)
I've made 3 copies, and tagged them all different ways to show what would happen. Dragging Carmen and Erik back into this, guest-starring Roxie as cis control:
Roxie's fine either way, because her frame and gender match. Carmen is okay-ish, but Erik is...not. AF-Frame meshes break on trans-masc Sims, essentially shoving their hip-bones into their ribs. We saw that in the tutorial, so no surprise there.
For science, let's do the same thing with the AM version of this same mesh, with Henry as control this time.
Generally okay? Carmen's hips are in AM position, which looks fine. Erik really never win with pants, but that's the best we get most times. At least his torso is intact! (This is why I recommend using AM Frame if there aren't meshes for each Frame. It works well enough.)
I've gone over all this before--but there is one thing I didn't cover. Remember the Age & Gender tags I mentioned earlier? Some creators check both genders here, and the results are...not great if the mesh is based on the body, which is the case with leggings. The game (best as I can tell) tries to enforce the mesh's original Frame, with weird results for everyone. Here's what happens when you toggle both genders under A&G: AF Mesh, and AM Mesh.
So, AF mesh: Carmen now has a bubble butt, love-handles, and weirdly skinny AF-Frame legs. Erik's waist is cracked, again. (Sorry, Erik.) AM Mesh: Erik has AM-Frame legs and hips--and Carmen has become a magician's assistant. (Sorry, Carmen.) Note that Roxie and Henry are fine, because their gender and frame match the meshes. Can't break something made for them.
But if it's not for them? It'll break them too.
It's even worse on fullbody meshes...but that's an aside, and I'll post about it another time. I feel compelled.
If you see your problem here, hopefully you have your answer! If not, that's okay. Just send us another message and I'll have a look at the files for you, if you like. (I promise not to send you another tutorial. ;B)
To everyone else: if this helped you, remember to share. Never know who might need the info. Thanks for reading, and Happy Simming. :3
based on your tips and tricks for dressing trans sims, do you think it's theoretically possible to make some sort of S4S batch fix that could make all clothing compatible with trans sims?
In theory, I guess it's possible? Since some batch fixes are just a matter of mass checking/unchecking boxes. But--disclaimer: not a programmer--I imagine with how fussy things can get (i.e. masc-frame Sims can use this mesh, not that one, etc.), it might be complicated to implement. Unless they added an 'allow for all frames and genders' options. I love the idea though! Imagine the time that would save!
Hi! Your post on cc clothes for trans sims is so incredibly helpful to me, but I was wondering: if you want masc-frame and fem-frame male sims to be able wear skirts, should you still gender lock them? I'm fairly new to cc myself and a lot of ts4's 'masc frame/fem frame' stuff is really complicated!
Howdy! The best thing to do in that case is to unlock it for both gender and frame. That way, it’ll show for everyone. :3 (Also it’s good to make sure that both ‘Male’ and ‘Female’ have preview swatches, so you can find them. The default Sim preview is not helpful most times.)
Do you think that EA should remake the custom gender settings so that mtf Sims can have breasts by default, and that ftm Sims can have top surgery scars?
Btw, thanks for your guide! ☺️
I think EA did the best they could with what they had, and I appreciate that trans Sims look like they're trans. It would've been nice if it was clearer how it worked, and it's not perfect, but it's still more options than we usually get.
Trans-femme Sims do start with breasts, but I think it would be nice to toggle that off or on, since not everyone is at that stage in transition, or even wants to be. But EA adding the option for top surgery scars would be awesome. Can always use more options!
I have a few actually. A lot of which revolve around sleepovers :/
BUT A LOT OF THOSE ARE SUPER BITTERSWEET SO. Probably just... last year’s production. It was wild. There was supposed to be a major reveal that there’s no meaning to life and it’s hidden behind a door and a few of the kids just hung a lemon on some fishing wire and dangled it on the other side.... just a whole lot of other shit. It started out awful, like, people were panicking and screaming and disappearing but. It was generally just so amazing and I’m glad it turned into such a shit-show.
