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EVERYTHING

[indirigo]

“The four lords”

Btw I have the explanation and my thoughts behind this fanart in the post caption on my insta:) if someone is interested🌷

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How Dungeon Meshi Fixes Fantasy Races

Writing about all the issue with fantasy racism, I cannot help but come back to one thing. The one piece of Fantasy media that did fantasy races, and did them right. And it is not a western book, or show, or game. No, it is an manga. And this manga is Dungeon Meshi, or Delicious in Dungeon.

Frankly, till I read this manga, I did not think that anyone would actually fix the issue of fantasy races. I did not think that it was actually possible. But in comes Rui, and just does that. And I am still bloody amazed by it.

So, let's talk about how Dungeon Meshi fixes Fantasy Racism.

Human Means "two arms, two legs, sentient"

The first noticable way in which Dungeon Meshi distinguishes its worldbuilding from pretty much any other piece of fantasy media that involves races, is in its use of language. Elves are still elves, dwarves are still dwarves, but human in this world is the word for all the species that are in the vaguest sense humanoid. Everything that has by default two arms, two legs, and is sentient in the way it uses language, is a human. The race that in other media is called "human" is called "tallmen" in this fantasy world. And this single change actually changes a whole lot.

Anyone who has ever written for a fantasy setting with different races probably knows this issue: you write a sentence. And then you stop and look at it. You just used the word "human". To describe people. Only problem: humans are not the only people in this world. In fact, the person speaking is an elf. They are describing their halfling friend. Neither of them is a human. So why did they say, that this one kind of behavior is just very human? It is not. Because in this world, they are other. In this world, there is just no word to describe all the people who are generally humanoid and think and speak and walk and err and whatever.

Meanwhile there is the world of Dungeon Meshi. Where in fact "too err is human". Because elves, and dwarves, and halffoots, and kobolds, and ogers, and gnomes, and tallmen, and all the other races are all human. All of them. The language allows the people in the world to use terms that describe them all, without othering any one group, or making one group the default.

And this is incredible in the way it makes the people think about the world - but also in how it shapes fandom discussion. Because language shapes how we think about anything. And if we do not have a collective word to describe all those different kind of people, then we do not see them as the same.

And I will openly admit: while I know this last fact... never have I ever considered the solution of just using the word "human" to describe them all, and give what normally would be considered "human" a different name.

Not just Humans Plus/Minus

The way Kui constructed the world with humans being the one overarching term is not just the only aspect in which the Dungeon Meshi world differs. There is another big aspect to this.

Because most fantasy does use one thing for worldbuilding that is another big issue. Every humanoid but non-human race is defined by their difference to humans. This is most notable in pretty much all RPGs, especially TTRPGs, where it is usual to have humans to just get the "standard stat block". So humans will just have normal stats, while everyone else then gets either a + or a -. So for examples elves with often get a bonus on charisma, but a malus on stamina. And dwarves will have a bonus on stamina, but a malus on wits. And orcs will have a malus in charisma, but a bonus on strength. The important aspect of this is: humans are the standard. Everyone else tends to be measured in how much they differ from the humans.

This again is also a thing in which the way we tend to portray fantasy very much mirrors the way we frame fantasy is very similar to how we interact with the real world. While obviously generally everyone tends to think of their own culture and ethnicity as "normal", the fact that western imperialism has changed the world so much often forces people from non-western cultures to still be familiar with the western view onto the world as it is often standard in many books - especially in school and academia. Framing white people, and also the Christian worldview as the "normative" one that everyone else has to compare to. And this is what we reflect here into fantasy. (The same with how often fantasy cultures will also be defined by the ways in which they differ from ours. Things that are the same we expect in reality we often do not consider worth mention.)

Dungeon Meshi does not do this. It does not portray the tall-men as the standard, and the other races as the the different ones. This is accomplished by actually centering non-tall-men perspectives, showing us that everyone just considers themselves as the normal standard. This shows the most in the chapter in which the characters get transformed by the changelings into races other than their own, and everyone describes - naturally - the difference from the perspective of their own way of looking at it being the "normal" one.

This is what I have talked about in terms of Dragon Age as well. The issue being less in how different races are portrayed but that the human perspective is featured as the "normal" one.

There is Cultural Diversity

In comparison to a lot of other high fantasy media, Dungeon Meshi has a very limited setting, given everything that happens is actually happening on a fairly small island. So, we do not have the usual LotR inspired "we travel along the entire continent". And still, we do see a lot more about different cultures in this world, because we see a bunch of characters who have come to the island as adventurers and who come from different cultures and carry stuff from their respective cultures with them.

We see this most, of course, through the perspective of food. Whenever the protagonist group interacts with other adventurers, we get little bits and pieces about their respective cuisine and food traditions. This is most notable of course with the meeting between Laiois' group and Shuro's group, but otherwise still is a running theme of the series.

Most notably though: these cultural lines are not drawn among race lines, but indeed along cultural ones. Sure, everyone of the races do also have specific flavors of any local culture. Because yes, the elves certainly do their own specific thing, and the gnomes as well, and yet whenever you go into the different places in this world, whereever the races are living integrated, we see cultures that do have some specific elvish thing, and a specific tall-men thing, and so on.

This is all made even more clear in the Adventuring Bible, where Kui spends some time going into some differences between different elves living in different parts of the world. It makes clear the one thing that I always group so frustrated with in other fantasy: even with elves, who live so very long, their culture would still be somewhat shaped by their specific environments. Yes, the elves living in colder climates will dress differently, than the elves living in warmer climates.

And more than that: in the end every elf, every half-foot, every tall-man, and every dwarf is an individuum. Meaning that this entire idea of bio-essencialism is pretty much absent.

While, again, we do not see that much of the other cultures as a whole due to the setting being limited to the dungeon, we do see some of it in flashbacks of different characters, and in the interaction between characters. One interaction that I also found so speaking is the interactions between Namari and Senshi. While Dungeon Meshi dwarves are less of the "drunken Scotsman" stereotype, they still are very much known for blacksmithing. Only that Senshi, our main dwarf, does not cave a flying fuck about blacksmithing, and Namari, who takes great pride in the fact that dwarves are good smiths, is outright acting insulted because of Senshi's carelessness about those topics.

This is an interaction I definitely have seen between people of real world cultures, where one takes pride in a thing their culture is known for, while the other does not care. And it showed so much, that in the end here the races are cultural, not inherently biological.

Understanding Time

In a lot of fantasy media, especially when it comes to games, a lot of the things about races come down to stats differences. Humans are the standard with being incredibly average. Dwarves are bulky and tend to have more constitution or HP. Elves often have more dexterity, and maybe speed, or maybe wisdom or intelligence. Orcs have more strength. Halflings usually also get more dexterity. You get the idea. You probably have played at least one TTRPG where you can think of some.

The issue with this is, of course, that this once more adds to this idea of bioessentialism. Saying: "there is very physical differences between races, and one of them are stronger and others more intelligent by default". Which is again so problematic, because there is so much in here where it is quite often clear that the fantasy races do tie in with real life racism, and many times the fantasy races even then paralleling ideas about real life identities.

Those ideas very much exist as well in the world of Dungeon Meshi, but for the most part a lot of the differences between the races here is once more not as much biological, than cultural. This does not stop the fact that people often have prejudice about this, sure, but the story interacts with this to actually show us how much of it is prejudice and culture.

However, there is one very strong biological difference between the races in Dungeon Meshi, which is put in as the biggest factor for anything else: the life span.

Without spoiling too much for people who have not read the manga: the main conflict in the end is very much related to how different the life spans of the different races are. Generally the world often distinguishes between the long lived races (elves, gnomes, and dwarves) and the short lived races (tall-men, oni, kobolds, half-foots, and orcs). And in this Dungeon Meshi understands a thing that a lot of fantasy struggles with: what time actually means.

This entire little series of entries have been brought up, of course, by Dragon Age. And Dragon Age is very much an example of this. 7000 years is such a long time to a species with normal life spans that culture would have changed so, so much over those years, that it is insane to imagine that after 7000 years of elves being seperated there, there would even be a unified elven culture in Thedas. And in so many other fantasy worlds, cultures all tend to be so strangely stable in how they develop. No matter how the life spans in that story are.

Meanwhile in Dungeon Meshi, the life spans are what makes among the biggest difference. Because indeed, the general cultures of longer lived races are a lot more stable. Sure, they are influenced by cultural changes of the shorter lived races, but still... a person who lives 200 to 400 years, will just experience those changes differently, and think about the changing of those cultures from a different perspective.

Which is also why the main cuts we see between the races for the most part are between the long lived and the short lived. In many places the elves do in fact do their own thing, because they just live about 7 times as long as a human, and 8 times as long as half-foot. So, for so many reasons, it makes sense that often they do not really interact as much with the shorter lived races. Just as it makes sense that while of course there are prejudices between the races, nowhere do we see those as strongly as between the longer lived races. Elves and gnomes are most notably, as their general philosophies about magic are often opposed to each other, and with people being around longer, they have a lot more chances to meet one of the other and hold a grudge. Meanwhile both do push back against dwarves as well, as dwarves, who did in fact often live apart from the other races, often did not think as highly about magic.

The world of Dungeon Meshi also addresses one thing related the long life spans that usually get ignored: longer lives usually tend people to get stuck in specific ways of thinking. Realistically speaking quite many elves would not be those wise, thoughful folks to give you guidance, but more... your conservative old uncle on steroids. Because their worldview would just entrench itself over the years.

And the fact that this is actually something that plays so much more into the relations between the races than anything else. It shows them more in a way that makes sense, rather than being more mythical about it.

Food is the Ideal Lens

Another thing that has to be acknowledged with Dungeon Meshi is, that food is possibly one of the bests lenses to explore culture through, because it is one of the aspects of different cultures that is easily experienced and more easily understood. Sure, you might not know what possible religious reasons another culture might have to use a specific spice or so, but you can see it, you can use it, you can taste it, you can see how it differentiates the dishes from that culture from that of others.

I talked in this blog more than once about how I generally have issues with how a lot of worldbuilding focuses on big topics, but does not waste a thought to everyday things, like food, hair style, songs and stories (that are not actually mythological).

And Dungeon Meshi has obviously the leg up in this, because the primary lens through which the audience gets to know about this world is indeed food. Food is the framing device employed by Kui to let us see the characters and the cultures as well.

They do it really good as well. Because it is brought up in very natural ways. Obviously the things Senshi cooks for everyone in the dungeon is mostly based on what they can hunt and scavenge in the dungeon, but throughout it we always see characters compare the dungeon food to food common in their homes.

We also get some sense in this, how yes, the different races do have differences in their food, but in general the race specific food preferences tend to come second place to general cultural ones, based on where someone is living and the local culture. Which again, shows us that culture is influenced by the races, sure, but the race of someone is not the only defining factor in their culture and behavior.

There also is the factor that here the food is not purely functional, but definitely has also cultural vibes in it. Something that is partially related to the issue a lot of other fantasy runs into: "Say, what did the people in the middle ages eat?"

While, admittedly, Kui's framing of food in some instances does indeed somewhat shrug of some factors that definitely are limiting factors in reality (if you have ever cooked over an open flame, you will know what I am talking about), it still moves away of many clichés that fantasy uses in terms of depicting cuisine in their worlds. And that is another important aspect of making her worldbuilding more believable.

Worldbuilding vs Fairy Tales

If you ask me, the issue what got lost in fantasy settings inspired by Lord of the Rings, is, that in the end Tolkien actually wanted to create more of a mythology. Yes, he did a ton of worldbuilding for Middle Earth, but in the end to him the idea that it would feel mythic was more important to him, than the world being somehow a super internally consistent working world. Which is why he on one hand has all this really explicit conlanging, but at the same time somehow the completely isolated hobbits from the Shire, who are so isolated in fact that most of the world thinks of them as a myth, if they know about them at all, do speak the same language as the people in Minas Tirith and Rohan. Because in the end Lord of the Rings is very much still more about themes, than it is about realism.

This kind of thought got lost though when others mirrored Middle Earth in their own words, copying a lot of attributes from it, but putting it in a new environment that would have asked for a less mythical and more realistic framing.

This creates an environment where basically all those fantasy settings are having a conversation with Lord of the Rings. And this often happens via the depiction of the races. TV Tropes has a bunch of tropes under this: Our Elves Are Different, Our Orcs Are Different, Our Dwarves Are All The Same.

Ironically, of course, Dungeon Meshi is still very much in this conversation - but also does understand maybe more than a lot of other worlds the mythical idea. This does show especially with how the series deals with the elves. Because yes, as I said, the longer lived races tend to be a bit more distanced in many places from the shorter lived ones. This is most true for the elves. A lot of elves do stay among their own, barely interacting with others. They have different cultures, yes, but also... they try to have their own thing. And because of that a lot of people in this world do think of elves as wise and mystical. Because many of the other humans never once in their life encountered an elf. This is also why some people believe that dark elves are a thing. Because many have this mythical idea o the wise elves, and then when people encounter the elves that are often quite shitty due to their worldview, people will go: "Oh, that cannot have been a real elf. There must be Dark Elves here!"

The main difference really comes down to this: a lot of fantasy media does on one hand enjoy the Tolkienesque archetypes, but also does not fully dare to move away from it or question what the changes they push for would actually mean within their universe. And in so many fantasy settings we see what this leads to. Because let's face it: a ton of fantasy settings that go for "Our Elves Are Different", still look of the idea of elves as wise, and nature loving, and end up... with the noble savage stereotype. Some go from this and explicitly, half-hazardly try to make the elves into some sort of indigenous metaphor, only to not interact with that, others meanwhile just do not interact with it at all. And this is where it tends to fall apart.

The irony in some ways is, that actually... yeah, even the Middle Earth elves - who very much are NOT an indigenous stand-in - are actually if you look at it from the perspective of the other races in Middle Earth a bit off assholes. Heck, the text does in fact point this out a bunch of times, with other character challenging the elves on some philosophical points. But exactly that idea is something a lot of fantasy writers clearly did not really like. And Dungeon Meshi now... Dungeon Meshi does come back to it. Because it does make sense. Elves, who live so long, will just have different priorities, and it would create a culture or rather cultures for them, that often will clash with the ideals and cultures of the shorter lived groups. And this does in the very end feel a lot more consistent and satisfying than whatever might be going on with the elves in franchises like Dragon Age, Divinity, or even my beloved Witcher franchise.

[room-surprise]

New Ryoko Kui interview dropped!!!

食事も、人間関係も、「苦手なもの」だったから『ダンジョン飯』を描けた。ゲームの影響と共に掘り下げる、九井諒子の「好きと嫌いの活かし方」とは【ゲーム世代の作家たち】

「苦手なもの」への興味と好奇心が生み出した、作品と世界。あの「奥深さ」をどう作られたのか九井先生に直接聞きました

(This is a quick and dirty translation made using machine translation, and which I've lightly edited to add clarity. I'm not fluent in Japanese so I may have gotten things wrong. I'm sure others will do a better job later.

ADDITIONAL CONTEXT: This article is from a Japanese gaming magazine, like the previous interview in Famitsu, so they focus on video games and don't discuss other influences, even though they do get mentioned and are clearly pretty major.)

Kui was able to write "Dungeon Meshi" because she was not good at eating food and participating in human relationships. In this interview, we dig deeper into the influence of games, and how Ryoko Kui focuses on things she likes and dislikes while writing. [Writers of the Gaming Generation]

Dungeon Meshi.

This manga is attractive for its unique theme of "dungeons, defeating monsters in the labyrinth, and cooking them," as well as the unique characters, detailed human relationships, and deep worldview depicted in the labyrinth. It is currently being made into an anime, and adventurers from all over the world are fascinated by the world of "Dungeon Meshi."

So I thought , "I wonder if this work was drawn by someone who loves food and people." The depiction of such delicious-looking food and the construction of delicate human relationships and characters. Surely, it must have been drawn by someone who absolutely loves it.

However, in reality, the author, Kui Ryoko, says that she "is not good at either food or relationships."

So why was he able to continue drawing things she was not good at?

During the roughly 10 years of serialization, Kui has continued to confront "things she dislikes." This interview delves into Kui's unique creative techniques... and at the same time, it also delves into her "favorite things."

That's the "game"!

Those who are familiar with the subject may already know this, but Kui is also a big gamer. And it seems that "Dungeon Meshi" is heavily influenced by RPGs such as "Wizardry."

As a result, this interview turned out to be "I asked Kui a lot about her likes and dislikes." Likes and dislikes. They are the source of all interests and curiosity.

So how do we use this knowledge in our creative endeavors? How does this knowledge manifest itself in Dungeon Meshi?

How were those charming characters and the deep world created? We spoke to the original author, Kui Ryoko, and the editor, Masaru Hiroi, about things they could only talk about after the series was completed.

This is a game with the volume of a great labyrinth. I hope you will explore it all the way to the final floor!

Dungeon food. It's eat or be eaten. There is no superior or inferior, to eat food is simply a privilege of the living. Dungeon food. Ah, dungeon food.

First, I want to ask about how Kui first encountered video games.

--What are some influences from games in Dungeon Meshi? What was your first game, Ms. Kui?

Ryoko Kui (hereinafter referred to as Kui): I played traditional RPGs such as [blank?] and "Final Fantasy."

I think the first game console I ever played was a Famicom, which my parents won in a lottery . So before I knew it, we had a Famicom at home. I think my parents bought me the Super Famicom and PS1 after that...

After that, I took a break from games for a bit around the time of the PS2, but around the time of the PS4, I was finally able to buy games with the money I had earned myself .

--Why were you able to stay away from games around the time of the PS2?

Kui: I was too busy with exams, so I thought, "Well, I shouldn't be playing games," and left. When I started living alone after that, I couldn't play games because I didn't have a TV. My computer was also a Mac. [Macs aren't compatible with many games.]

--What was the trigger that made you think, "I want to play games" again?

Kui: I think the biggest thing was starting the serialization of "Dungeon Meshi."

Fantasy stories all have different settings, but at the same time, there are also things they share in common. For example, if you want to create a fantasy work, but you only know "Dragon Quest," it will end up resembling "Dragon Quest." It's scary to copy the setting of only one work.

So I just wanted to play a ton of different fantasy games and get an idea of ​​what the most common general understanding of fantasy is.

--Did you start playing it while you were still developing the concept for Dungeon Meal?

Kui: That's right. If I'm going to talk about "eating food," I have to play a game that has a system for eating food .

So I was interested in "Dungeon Master." However, at the time there was no easy way to play "Dungeon Master" on a real machine, so I played "Legend of Grimrock", which can also be played on a Mac.

["Dungeon Master," is a computer RPG released in 1987. Time passes each time you take an action in the dungeon, such as moving, fighting, or resting, so its biggest feature is that the game progresses in real time according to the player's actions. "Legend of Grimrock," is an action RPG released in 2012. It has a game design similar to "Dungeon Master."]

Until then, I had felt that overseas games and games played on PC were too difficult, but I felt like I had overcome one obstacle there. I thought, "Oh, this is pretty easy," and started playing a lot of different games.

-- Those two games are quite heavy even among RPGs, I think, so did you actually have that much difficulty with them?

Kui: No...I would say that my impression is more that best-selling games are easy to play (laughs).

I'm not that good at games myself, so I usually play games that allow you to adjust the difficulty on a super easy setting. So, games that allow you to lower the difficulty are always a lifesaver.

-- I've heard that apart from RPGs , you also like games such as "13 Sentinels: Aegis Rim" and "Paranomasite FILE23: The Seven Mysteries of Honjo ." Do you have a favorite genre, Mr. Kui?

Kui: I guess I'm just not very good at games that require you to use your brain through trial and error.

But in RPGs, if you just level up and keep tapping, you can win and progress in the game. Also, in novel-type games, if you read the text, you can progress. By this process of elimination, I quite like RPGs and text-based games .

Personally, I like games like Disco Elysium the most, which are text-heavy, top-down, and have maps to explore.

...Even I think that's a pretty negative reason (laughs).

Everyone: (laughs).

Hiroi Masaru (hereinafter referred to as Hiroi): But, Ms. Kui, you have really played quite a lot of games, haven't you?

Kui: No, the reason I'm able to play so much is because I play in a pretty callous way ...

I often buy a game, play it, and then just don't play it. So there aren't that many games I complete... I only complete a few a year. I play around 40 games, and if I complete 5 or 6, that's good.

When I asked if I could draw at Comitia, I got scolded.

-- Have you had any exposure to fantasy outside of digital RPGs?

Kui: I think it's not just games, but also the fact that I've always loved foreign fantasy novels . I was given books like "The Neverending Story," "The Lord of the Rings," and "The Chronicles of Narnia."

-- Dungeon Meshi gives off an atmosphere of Western fantasy like gamebooks or tabletop RPGs, rather than the typical Japanese fantasy games like Dragon Quest.

Hiroi: I think I went to Kui's house before the series started. At that time, we were discussing the name of a sci-fi manga called "Drawing Inside the Brain," which I had rejected many times.

Ms. Kui said she wanted to serialize this sci-fi manga... and when he was on the fourth draft, he said, "No, this isn't going to work," and when I looked at the scribbled notes next to her desk, she had already drawn the original version of "Dungeon Meshi" ! (laughs)

Kui: ……………No, I don't remember much (laughs).

Everyone: (laughs).

Kui: But I had wanted to draw a manga about exploring a dark dungeon, like Wizardry .

Since I was in elementary school, the manga I drew in pencil in my notebooks were all fantasy stories about swords and magic, so I had always wanted to draw a proper fantasy manga. However, there weren't as many fantasy manga in bookstores at the time as there are now, so I wondered, "Maybe fantasy doesn't sell."

Hiroi: At the time, there were a lot of people in their teens and twenties posting fantasy illustrations on online communities for artists, such as pixiv, and Kui was one of them.

I thought, there are so many people who want to write fantasy, so if she writes a fantasy aimed at this generation, it might sell.

And when I saw Kui's notes, I thought to myself, "Let's make a straight-forward fantasy manga, without making it weirdly twisted."

Kui: I originally thought of making this "dungeon exploration manga" as just a hobby... When I asked Hiroi if I could draw it at Comitia first, he got angry.

[Comitia is a comics convention in Japan for original self-published comics.]

Everyone: (laughs).

Hiroi: I said, "If you're going to draw at Comitia, then make sure you draw it as a proper serialization!" (laughs)

However, at that time, Kui had already published two collections of short stories, and they were being reprinted. In other words, she had a certain number of fans even before the serialization began.

So I decided, if Kui creates a pure fantasy for those fans, we can't fail badly. If it doesn't work, we'll just learn that fantasy is difficult to sell after all.

--By the way, were there any discussions between you and Ms. Kui about the fact that fantasy doesn't sell?

Kui: I remember vaguely talking about how fantasy manga doesn't sell well and how difficult it seems. I don't know much about light novels, so that might have been there for a while.

However, since a lot of fantasy manga were coming out around the same time, it was probably a "transitional period ." Maybe it was just when people started to feel more and more like they wanted to draw and read fantasy.

Not everyone is that interested in the things I like

-- I feel that "Dungeon Meshi" is a title that has breathed new life into the fantasy genre. How did you go about creating the setting and world when dealing with fantasy?

Kui: I try to think, "Not everyone is that interested in the things I like."

I like to think about pointless settings endlessly, but there are times when I think , "When this setting is actually made into a manga, people probably won't be interested in this story." So I try to include things that will make people interested, and cut out things that will distract people as much as possible.

For example, in "Dungeon Meshi" I initially wanted everyone to speak various languages. On top of that, I wanted to make the characters "only able to communicate with each other in one language"... but Mr. Hiroi said "Don't do that" (laughs).

Everyone: (laughs).

Kui: Even when I'm drawing it myself, I think, "It takes more than six panels to explain this setting...", and if I explain the setting more than necessary, it slows down the pace of the story.

Moreover, since "Dungeon Meshi" was a monthly serialization, unlike a weekly series, there wasn't much time for extraneous stories. Specifically, I had to draw one episode of about 30 pages per month.

In that case, there was no time to add in settings like "Actually, he was thinking about this behind the scenes" or "Actually, he can speak two languages." So, rather than there being any clear choices, there were quite a few times when "there was no time to do things normally." If it had been a weekly serialization, I might have included more.

--Does the scene where Chilchuck yells insults in his own language feel rather "forced"?

Kui: That's right (laughs).I thought, this only takes one frame...it's my chance [to include information about language]!

--So you haven't thought through all of these "fictional languages" yet?

Kui: If Dungeon Meshi were to be my life's work and I were to spend my whole life creating this world, I think it would be more fun to think about it...but initially, I thought that Dungeon Meshi would end in a few years.

Hiroi: Initially, I said, "It'd be nice if it continued for about five volumes" (laughs).

However, Kui's first draft really had a lot of material... so the editors cut out a lot of it. I understand that it's the parts the readers want to read, but I cut out the parts that deviate from the main story. So it's a battle between the "author who doesn't want to be cut" and the "editor who wants to cut."

--By the way, what kind of discussion took place between the "parts you want to cut" and the "parts you don't want to cut"?

Kui: There were a lot of them every time, but I can't remember them specifically now...it was just small, unimportant details that got cut.

In the scene where the hams made by the Red Dragon go back into the pool of blood, I remember saying, "You don't need these," and they were about to cut them off, but I remember desperately stopping them by saying, "We'll need them later!" I'm glad they weren't cut off.

But once I think of the setting, I want to include things, and then they get cut out, so at first I didn't want to expand the world too much.

I also wanted to complete the story within the dungeon. I didn't want to reveal the name of the country, and I didn't want to give the characters surnames. But in the second half, Hiroi-san told me, "The world is too small, so you should make it bigger," and I was like, "Are you sure?"

--Mr. Hiroi, why did you say that?

Hiroi: As the story progressed, it became clear that "Dungeon Meshi" was no longer just about saving a sister in a dungeon. So I decided that it would be unconvincing if the story had no involvement with the outside world, since what was happening in the dungeon was something that would affect the fate of the whole world.

For example, in real life companies, the more important a decision you make, the higher your superior's rank becomes, right? When I thought about it that way, I felt something was off about the idea of ​​Laios and his friends deciding the fate of the world on their own. "How can they make that decision without anyone knowing about it?"

The fact that the Canary Team was there meant that there must have been a system of reporting, contacting, and consulting here, because that's how "society" and "organizations" work.

In short, I think we were thinking about the situation and asking, "If an organization were to get involved in saving the world, how persuasive could they make it given the society that exists in the story?"

Kui: Well, the plot hasn't changed at all.

From the beginning, I had intended to write a story about saving the world, but I also thought it was possible for the world to be saved by only a select few people in the dungeon who knew the circumstances. Changing it was what Hiroi-san thought would make it more persuasive.

When I was drawing the first half, Hiroi told me, "You don't have to decide anything yet." I was in a hurry to move the story forward and explain the world and story setting, but he told me, "It's better to limit it to introducing the four main characters until about the fourth volume." But in the second half, he said, "Introduce more people and expand the world."

Everyone: (laughs).

Hiroi: Kui-san was like , "That's not what you said originally!" (laughs) But both had meaning...

Kui: I was the one saying, "If we expand the world there, the story will never end, right...?"

After drawing it through to the end, I realized that the balance between holding back and expanding didn't work the way I had expected. I think this is one of the reasons why the serialization of "Dungeon Meshi" took so long.

-- But there are a lot of characters in "Dungeon Meshi," and the relationships between them are complicated. I heard that you also created the relationship diagram for "Taikaishu" [※3] ...

Kui: No, I haven't made one [I didn't do that?]!

[Taikaishu is a full-color web comic by Funako Tsukasa that began serialization on a website in 2005 and is still ongoing. Its unique worldview has earned it a loyal fanbase, especially on the Internet.]

-- Eh? Is that not the case?

Kui: To be precise, I just created an account on the fan wiki.

When I started reading "Taikaishu," I struggled with the complex setting and the large number of characters...and I thought "it would be easier to read if there was an explanation or a list of characters."

So I searched for a bulletin board where readers were sharing their thoughts and asked if there was a summary, but they said there wasn't. So I thought, "Maybe if there was a place where someone with more knowledge could summarize it," and I just made a wiki account.

So I didn't actually edit it. It seems like I've been given credit for someone else's work, and I'm sorry about that...

Dungeon Meshi was created from a sense of guilt about food?

-- "Dungeon Meshi" started off with the catchy theme of "cooking monsters," but little by little the darker aspects and deeper world were revealed. Was the structure of "little by little revealing the darker side" something you had in mind from the beginning?

Kui: I thought I needed a theme to serialize it so I thought I'd try "food education." There were a lot of gourmet manga at the time, but I felt like there weren't many that focused on food education.

-- Considering that the theme is "food education," it makes sense that the nutritional value of the dishes in the story is clearly written down.

Kui: With the theme of "food education," I also thought up a rough outline of the story. Rescue the kidnapped princess, defeat the evil wizard, defeat the final boss, and become king... the framework is pretty simple.

But when I actually tried to proceed with the plan, I realized, "No, this story can't be done so lightly..." At first, I thought I could draw it in a more light-hearted manner.

Hiroi: At first, you were trying to finish the fight against the Red Dragon in one episode, right? I was like, "is that possible?" (laughs).

Everyone: (laughs).

Kui: When I tried to actually tell it in one episode, it ended up feeling like a very brief summary... In order to tell the story I wanted to tell, I had to tell it more thoroughly than I originally thought.

-- Did you have any special thoughts about the theme of "food"?

Kui: No... well... if I had to choose, I'd say I have a strong grudge against food.

Since I was a child, I was a very picky eater, and mealtimes were a pain for me. I hated eating in front of other people, and there was a time when I hated seeing other people eating, so I would look for toilets that were rarely used and eat my meals in the toilet.

When I was doing it, the word "toilet meal" didn't exist, so when the term actually appeared in society I was so happy, thinking "everyone was doing it!"

[Toilet Meals are a social phenomenon in Japan.]

Everyone: (laughs).

Kui: I was thinking, "This is so terrible, right...?" but it was a relief to realize that other people were doing the same thing.

--So what made you choose the theme of "food education"?

Kui: My parents, who were struggling with my picky eating, taught me many things, including the "triple eating" method, but it was no use and I continued to be a picky eater into adulthood. My parents had instilled knowledge about food education in me, but I was not able to put it into practice.

[Kui might be talking about Triangular Eating but I'm not sure.]

So the only thing that remains is that I feel an enormous amount of guilt when it comes to food and eating...

Hiroi: If you think about it objectively, the series starts off on a very negative note.

Kui: But now I've gotten over the habit of eating with other people... or rather, I've come to like it. My editor takes me to lots of delicious places.

--When I was a student, I was trying to leave my udon bowl at school, but my teacher found out and made me eat the packet of udon by myself. There was no soup, and it was really hard to eat the udon by itself.

Kui: It must be tough. I tried to hide it, but my teacher found out and I got really angry.

Hiroi: I've tried to hide it in a drawer before. Then, something dried up came out of the drawer... (laughs bitterly).

How can I draw things I hate?

-- Or rather, is it the fact that you're not good at it that gives you a higher level of insight into the food?

Kui: I think it's because you're interested in it that you either like it or dislike it. Inevitably, you spend a lot of time thinking about it.

Since "Dungeon Meshi" depicts a lot of food, one might think "Do I like eating?", but in fact there are many times when I draw it because I dislike something .

--Aside from food, do you also draw things that you dislike?

Kui: Maybe. For example, human relationships, modern times, fashion...?

-- Perhaps the relationships between the characters in "Dungeon Food" are portrayed so delicately because the author is not good at dealing with human relationships?

Kui: I've always been very curious about things like, "(This person is usually so cold, but has such a charming smile in front of other people)" ...

I feel the same way, but I think people are different in the way they show their true colors. I think it's strange that it stands out to me...

-- I have a simple question. When you draw something you hate, how do you feel? No matter how much you hate something, do you find it fun to draw it?

Kui: The events in the manga don't directly involve me, so I don't dislike the things I'm drawing as much. Also, when I draw while looking for the good parts, it can lead to new discoveries.

Also, I think it's scary to draw only what I like.

In my work, the important thing is "what to capture with the camera," and there's no need to go out of your way to capture filthy things, but at the same time, I think the world will look bigger if you keep in mind that "there are a lot of inconvenient, dirty, and unpleasant things outside the camera." That's the feeling I have when I paint/create manga.

When playing a game, if I have to choose between a game where I only feel like I'm in the world inside the game screen, and a game where I feel like there are lots of people living on the other side of the screen, and that the people in that world could travel anywhere they wanted, I think the latter is more fun to play.

I'm always thinking about how to express that "sense of the vastness of the world" ...and I personally like games that have "a world" to them.

-- Do you ever incorporate elements from the game into your manga?

Kui: On the contrary, I think that is a part that cannot be adopted .

The best thing about games is that each person has a different experience. Games that have lots of endings are also a result screen for what you've done up until that point. When I see something like that, I think, "That's so cool."

Personally, I think that's the game's greatest appeal, and something that could never be replicated in a manga that doesn't have players.

If you're so busy, when do you play games?

-- I'm personally curious, how do you find the time to play games? Even though you're busy with your work as a manga artist, you play quite a lot of games.

Kui: I often use the Steam Deck before going to bed or during breaks between writing manuscripts. In fact, I almost only use the Steam Deck now. I keep it by my pillow, so I can take it and play before going to sleep, or during breaks...

--Is Steam Deck really that convenient?

Kui: I recommend it. The screen is small, but it can run Cyberpunk 2077 .

Also, personally, I've gotten tired of having to turn on my PC to start up a game...with Steam Deck, I can just turn it on and it starts up instantly, even when I'm lying down. How do you writers usually play games? There are times when you have to play games for work, aren't there?

--When it comes to work, I calculate backwards how long I'll be playing before I start playing...If it's a game that can be completed in about 60 hours, I usually estimate that I'll play for 3 hours a day and complete it for 20 days in a row.

Hiroi: It's a lot of work!

Kui: That's amazing... You really are a gamer.

I've always thought that I have a talent for playing games ... but I'm not really good at that. If I'm given a game that's a little difficult, I get tired of it right away, and I'm not very good at trial and error. The range of things I can enjoy is very narrow.

I wonder if game developers around the world are also struggling with the question of "Should I make my games accessible to a wide range of people, even those who aren't particularly gamers?" or "Should I make games that are challenging and can be played deeply?" The same problem exists with manga, too.

When there's a game that I can't play well, I feel happy because it means the creator decided that there's no need to pander to people who can't keep up.

-- By the way, when you play games, do you do it as a normal "hobby"? Or do you play more often to find material for your manga?

Kui: Of course, a big part of it is that I play games as a hobby, but it is alleviated by the fact that playing games might be useful for my work (laughs).

Even if I'm not that interested in a game, if I think "it might be useful for work," I'll find the courage to buy it, and no matter how expensive a gaming PC is, I can still buy it if I think of it as a work tool. So the hurdles for many things related to games are lowered for the reason that it's "for work."

--So, when you read manga, do you feel like you're reading it for work?

Kui: In my case, manga has become my job, so when I read it I can't help but think of work.

However, I still enjoy gaming as a hobby . That's why I don't want to lose this hobby... and I don't think I'll be able to enjoy it as much if I get involved in games as a job, so I don't take on any games-related jobs.

Does the depth of the world come from the fact that it is "not decided"?

-- I heard in advance that "Dungeon Meshi" was written with a clear awareness of "what should be explained" and "what shouldn't be explained," so could you tell me more about that?

Kui: Having read a variety of fantasy novels and games, I thought that the "moment of discouragement" was the "repeated use of foreign words." When you write something like "XX of XX of XX," if there are three or more katakana characters, there is a high chance that it will be skipped over by Japanese readers.

That's why I try to refer to town names as "the neighboring town" whenever possible, and refer to characters who appear in flashbacks as "uncle" rather than by their full names, so that readers can understand without having needing exposition.

The magic used during battles in "Dungeon Meshi" is depicted in such a way that you can "understand what kind of magic it is just by looking at the picture."

-- What other aspects of Dungeon Meshi are there that you deliberately left out of its concrete settings?

Kui: Numbers and language are the settings I avoided touching. For example, just by deciding the month of birth, it is first determined that there is a moon in this world. From there, it is also determined that there is gravity.

What's more, just the concept of a "birthday" means that there is a division into a "year" and that the world is determined to have a 365-day cycle. It quickly becomes complicated.

But on the other hand, if I were to set the details and make it something like "This country's currency is 1 gold, which is worth 5 yen," it would be a burden on the reader. When reading the work, the reader would be forced to convert it into "1 gold = 5 yen" in their minds every time. That's why I try to write it with "readability as a priority" as much as possible.

However, if you're creating a "fantasy" in the truest sense of the word, it would be better to create something that corresponds to that world's calendar or metric system in order to really immerse yourself in that world, so it's difficult to get the balance right...

-- I think that style of "deliberately not giving explanations" is quite amazing.

Hiroi: I think that 's definitely partly because "Dungeon Meshi" is a silly title.

The "mindset" of the reader is a little different...I think that from the very beginning, the reader is made to recognize that "this work isn't going to say anything too difficult."

Kui: Also, we had to give a bit of thought to coming up with the character names.

For example, the main characters in Wizardry are given names that correspond to their professions, such as "Warrior" or "Wizard." The "Senshi" in Dungeon Meshi was taken from that ... I named him after thinking, "I want that person to play an active role."

That's why I wanted the overseas version of Senshi's name to be "Fighter", but I was worried that overseas readers would be like, "What does that mean...!?" so I kept it in my head.

--The character names in "Dungeon Meshi" tend to be around 3 or 4 letters long and fit nicely.

Kui: If the name gets too long, it won't fit in the speech bubble...It's generally said that a line in a speech bubble should be about 7 to 8 characters long to be easy to read.

So "Chillchuck" is really long... I actually thought that the abbreviation "Chill" could be used more, so I named it that way, but it didn't work out so well, so in the end I just kept calling it "Chillchuck". Even I was thinking "that's long" while drawing it (laughs).

Everyone: (laughs).

Kui: Anyway, there are quite a few manga-like circumstances where "maybe four characters would be enough."

--By the way, are there any rules for naming the characters in "Dungeon Meshi"?

Kui: It's not detailed, but there are "settings within the story" and "meta-settings that are just for my own enjoyment."

For example, [if Dungeon Meshi was a game] the Shuro party has names that would be given by a certain type of player. When playing a games, some people give their characters themed names that follow self-imposed rules. In that sense, meta-wise, the Shuro party is played by a player who names their characters with a plant-based restriction.

Also, since the player likes girls, the party members are all girls, and so on... (laughs).

Hiroi: Oh, I didn't know that!

Kuon: ...While it's fun for myself, I also create characters by asking questions like, "Why is the party mainly made up of women?" or "Why do they all have similar names?"

However, even if I revealed these settings in the story, it wouldn't have made the story any more interesting, so they are merely "settings that only exist in my own mind."

-- What are some specific examples of "settings that you deliberately didn't reveal"?

Hiroi: I still remember when I said, "I want you to depict the elven kingdom in more detail," Kui replied, "That's going too far."

The dwarven country was depicted quite a bit, so I personally thought it could have been shown a little more...

Kui: I felt that if I depicted that, it would limit the reader's imagination.

There are definitely "lines that suggest something might happen," and when it comes to parts that are better left to the reader's imagination, I often choose not to draw them.

Also, even when we present settings that readers think they can just skim through, they often try hard to remember them...

It all started with the manga "Eating soba through your nose."

--Let's go back to the topic a little. How did Ms. Kui and Mr. Hiroi meet?

Hiroi: I think we scouted her.

I saw a short story that Kui had posted on Pixiv and sent him an email asking if I would like to draw a manga. I remember that he had a really funny four-frame manga called "Eating soba noodles through your nose ." It was about a character eating soba noodles through his nose and crying out in pain... I think I was drawn to his drawing ability, which made me feel like "Wow, that looks painful" when I saw it (laughs).

And from that point on, we have come to this point.

[This may not be the exact comic that Hiroi is talking about, but it's a comic Kui posted on her blog about someone eating soba through their nose.]

Kui: Oh, is that so? Isn't it something like "Shugaku Tenshi" [※4] ?

Hiroi: No, that's not true! The manga about eating soba noodles through the nose was made before "Shingaku Tenshi". By the way, that manga was planned to be published in "Rakugakihon" , but when I asked Kui-san "Can I publish this?", she was very against it...

Kui: No, that's fine, but... I didn't think other people would find it that interesting.

Everyone: (laughs).

Hiroi: But that was more than 10 years ago...

--By the way, was Mr. Hiroi the first publisher to contact you?

Kui: Before that, an editor at East Press had contacted me. I was originally publishing fantasy manga that I had drawn as a hobby on my personal website. I compiled them into a self-published original comic and exhibited it at Comitia, and they asked me, "Would you like to publish this long manga as a book?"

However, after the editor asked around to various people, it seems he was told that "this will be hard to sell"... so the plan was dropped. Instead, it was decided to release a "short story collection" of short manga that had been published at the same time . This is "The Dragon's School is on the Mountain: A Collection of Works by Ryoko Kui" published by East Press.

I was contacted by a few other people as well, but the two people I still keep in contact with are Mr. Hiroi and the editor at East Press.

-- When you went from drawing short stories and web comics to starting a commercial serialization, did you study anything like "how to draw a serialized work"?

Kui: I learned almost everything about how to draw manga from Mr. Hiroi and the editors and writers at Harta .

I had absolutely no understanding of whether panel layout was good or bad, so up until the middle of the serialization, I would rearrange the storyboards one panel at a time, and I would get lectured like "Don't put a panel like this here."

I was also impressed when I was shown original manuscripts by other artists. They look beautiful in print, but the real thing is even more impressive. This is what it means to be good at drawing manga.

It didn't finish as I expected

-- Speaking of "serialization," you mentioned earlier that you initially intended to end it at about volume 5. Did "Dungeon Meshi" continue longer than you had anticipated, Ms. Kui?

Kui: First of all, I didn't really understand what a "serialized" comic meant, so I didn't even know how much of a story I could get done in how many pages. So, I thought I could wrap up the story nicely in about five years, in five volumes.

But I never quite got around to finishing it. It was so hard... (laughs).

Hiroi: To be honest, when I first heard "Volume 5,"I thought to myself, "(Are you kidding me...?)" I didn't say it out loud though (laughs).

--Honestly, even as a reader, around the time of the fight with the Red Dragon in volumes 4 and 5 I was starting to feel like, "Huh? It seems like it's coming to an end soon..."

Kui: From the beginning, my goal was to "defeat the Red Dragon at the halfway point." However, I was supposed to fight the Red Dragon in Volume 4, even though it was supposed to be 5 volumes. So I thought, "Huh? It's not over yet," and I gradually lost interest.

By the time I got to around volume 10, I felt like no matter how much I drew, it would never end. I didn't want to drag it out, but no matter how much I drew, it just never seemed to finish.

Hiroi: Even from an editor's perspective, it seemed like Kui was getting very anxious from around volume 10 onwards.

-- Having finished the long-running serialization of "Dungeon Meshi," did you experience any changes in your mindset?

Kui: I think it was great to have the experience of learning that it would take 10 years to draw a story of this scale. And when I think about my lifespan and how many more works I can draw... it makes me dizzy.

Hiroi: I feel like I'm constantly fainting...

-- Ms. Kui, are there still any works you want to draw in your mind?

Kui: Not that much. But I love drawing manga, so I want to draw a lot. I don't know if I'll have the stamina to continue for another 10 volumes, but I want to continue working as a manga artist somehow.

But maybe... I don't think it will sell that well next time...

Hiroi: Stop! Don't say that!

Everyone: (laughs).

Kui: In that respect, "Dungeon Meshi" sold well, so I was able to draw what I had imagined to the end. Next time, I think it would be better to consider the opposite scenario of "if it doesn't sell" and make it shorter.

That's the next new challenge.

-- In addition to the expectations for your next work, do you feel any pressure?

Kui: In my case, the first collection of short stories I published was fairly well received. For a manga I drew for the first time, that's about it.

That was a relief, but at the same time, I felt that "Ideally, the reputation of my next work will also steadily increase, but there will definitely be ups and downs." If the reputation of the next work is bad, will I be able to continue drawing without getting discouraged? I realized that the "battle with myself" had just begun , and I was terrified when I read the first volume.

What game has cute illustrations, in your opinion?

Kui: This is a completely different topic, but you 've played SaGa Frontier 2 , haven't you? Aren't the pixel art in SaGa Frontier 2 really cute?

--The pixel art in SaGa Frontier 2 is...the best!

Kui: The illustrations in "SaGa Frontier 2" have such exquisite balance... if you try to express that in a picture, you can't reproduce that cuteness. It's like "exquisite head-to-body ratio."

-- In your opinion, Ms. Kui, are there any games that have cute illustrations?

Kui: The first one that comes to mind is definitely SaGa Frontier 2. Also, I still remember how cute the character designs were in Final Fantasy Tactics.

But back in the day, I used to trace characters from FF7 . I thought, "There are so many cool designs in the world..." (laughs).

Hiroi: Nomura (Tetsuya)'s drawings are amazing, aren't they?

Kui: I traced Cloud and Aerith on tracing paper and quietly said to myself, "So cool..." and got really excited. I noticed something while I was working on the "Dungeon Meshi" anime...basically, games and anime are made by many people, aren't they? So I always thought, "Many people must be giving various opinions to make them."

But when I got involved, I realized that one person's power is quite large. This was quite surprising. I thought that there were multiple people who wrote the script and storyboards, and that each person had their own responsibility, but... the power of one person is quite large.

──No matter how much the work is divided up, it's important to have a director or supervisor who brings it all together.

Kui: Yes, in the end, it depends on the power of the person who takes the lead ...

However, at the same time, I think that the division of labor between scriptwriting and storyboarding is something that would never be possible with manga. In the end, you have to create everything in one person's mind, so "bias" inevitably arises. So personally, I don't like the idea of ​​it becoming a "world created in one person's mind."

Hiroi: However, not only in manga but also in novels, the individual author's personality is strongly expressed. I wouldn't go so far as to say "ideology"... but the person's way of thinking is strongly expressed.

Kui: Speaking of which, people who create games alone, such as indie games, are amazing.

It's often said that manga artists "come up with everything, from the art to the story, all by themselves," but I don't think they can compete with independent game creators who create the music, programming, and art all by themselves.

Moreover, even more than manga, no one can give their opinion until the game is completed. If you think about it that way, making a game by yourself is really a "one-man battle." At the same time, what I like about games is that there are quite a few "works that are not made with much consideration for cost" ... I enjoy it a little bit.

-- Do you ever think, "I want to make a game?"

Kui: I once bought RPG Maker , but it ended up being a complete failure... (laughs).

Everyone: (laughs).

Love for "classic RPGs" was a major influence on "Dungeon Meshi"

-- I'd like to ask you, Ms. Kui, since you play a lot of titles on Steam and other platforms, have you ever had any problems playing a game?

Kui: Simply put, a "game that doesn't work" is a problem (laughs).

This sometimes happens with games made by individuals on Steam... they don't have any reviews, so there's no way to deal with it other than contacting them directly. There have been a few times when I've been stuck and wondered, "What should I do?"

Other times, I'll buy a title that just happens to pop up at the top of Steam's rankings. Sometimes I'll play it thinking, "The graphics are kind of cute, so I'll give it a try," only to find that it's incomplete beyond the framework.

--So now people are playing titles that aren't that major.

Kui: Also, when I played Planescape: Torment, which is said to have influenced Disco Elysium.

While playing, I came across a character who was suffering from a terrible curse that made his whole body smell and become sticky. A quest was triggered to ask the NPC who had cast the curse to lift it, but when I asked them to lift the curse, I ended up being cursed with a curse that made me have constant hiccups ...

So when I was walking around the town, the "hiccup" dialogue started popping up all the time. What's more, every time it happened, I would freeze up for about 0.1 seconds. All the dialogue was filled with "hiccups." Anyway, it was a troubling curse.

I had no idea how to deal with this either, so I decided to just kill the NPC who had put the curse on me. The NPC also challenged me by saying, "Maybe if you kill me, the curse will be lifted?", so I tried killing him, but... it didn't lift the curse at all (laughs).

Everyone: (laughs).

Kui: I thought maybe the quest would progress in other places, so I walked around here and there, but the curse was not lifted after all. I was really curious, so I looked back at overseas information exchange thread online, and I found someone had written a lecture that said "You know what happens if you kill an important NPC without thinking about it, right?"

So I realized that this curse can never be lifted again. Even if I wanted to rewind, it was an auto-save, so I had to go back almost to the beginning... I was really... in trouble!

-- But "Planescape: Torment" hits a pretty impressive spot. Was it something that just happened to catch your eye while you were browsing Steam?

Kui: I originally liked games in the same genre as Baldur's Gate, so I think that's how I got into Planescape.

Also, I saw information that a huge amount of text in Planescape was translated by one person... I'm not very good at English, and games like Planescape have a lot of text to begin with, so I'm at a loss if it's not translated into Japanese .

However, when extraordinary people like those who make Planescape use their precious time from their lives to accomplish great things, I feel very grateful.

-- So, Ms. Kui, do you prefer games that are closer to the classics?

Kui: That's right. The first game I played was The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim, and it was so much fun that I searched for "games similar to Skyrim" and played a lot of the games that came up.

All of them were completely different games from Skyrim, but they were fun. However, I don't like "old games". I think that newer games are generally more polished and well-made.

-- Wizardry, which influenced Dungeon Meshi, is also a classic work.

Kui: When I was a child, I saw my father playing Wizardry V : The Heart of the Maelstrom. As time passed, I remembered that there was a game called Wizardry. The game I played at that time was Wizardry VI: Forbidden Pencil.

I also played Wizardry V , but it was hard to see the map unless I chanted a spell. I was directionally challenged, so even though I had a guidebook at hand, I couldn't progress.

--By the way, were you more interested in making a manga out of "Wizardry" than the tabletop RPG "D&D" ?

Kui: When I was researching fantasy, "D&D" was often mentioned... but I had never even heard of "TRPG" before. First of all, you can't play it without friends, and I was shocked to find out that lots of people have friends they can play with like this...!?

Everyone: (laughs).

Kui: So when I looked up TRPGs on Wikipedia, I couldn't imagine that people actually played this kind of game. I was more confused and thought, "How can people really role-play in front of other people?"

After that, I watched replay videos on YouTube and it was only then that I understood how games like D&D worked.

Games, manga, novels. What is the purpose of all creative works?

-- What was the last game you played?

Kui: Recently I played a school management game called "Let's School." It's made by a Chinese company that also made "My Time at Sandrock."

Hiroi: You really like that kind of game, don't you? (laughs) Oh? Haven't you played "FF7 Rebirth" ?

Kui: I'm thinking about playing the remake of FF7 once it's completed.

Hiroi: No, no, if we don't do it now, we'll never finish it! It'll be a long time before we do it!

--Honestly, I also thought it would take about 10 years for FF7 Rebirth to be released.

Hiroi: I thought it would take about that long too... I really wanted it to be completed while I could still see. So, please do it!

Kui: Once it's finished...I want to play it all at once (laughs).

--Do you and Ms. Kui often talk about games?

Hiroi: Ms. Kui sometimes says, "I want to talk about this game, so I want you to play it." I played "Red Dead Redemption" because of that. Also, a long time ago, Ms. Kui recommended "13 Sentinels: Aegis Rim."

Kui: Whenever there's a game I want to discuss with someone, I always recommend it to Hiroi.

But maybe I haven't been playing games as much lately. Until now, I've been playing games because I thought of it as "for work," but now that the serialization of Dungeon Meshi has ended, I've been playing less games.

Moreover, I'm not the type of person who gets that into one game...I don't generally play through a game in repeated playthroughs, and I'm usually satisfied once I've finished the story.

Hiroi: Then we have to start [a new ] serialization soon.

Everyone: (laughs).

-- I'd like to ask you personally, do you have any "recommended indie games"?

Kui: I highly recommend "Papers, Please" and "Return of the Obra Dinn."

First of all, "Papers, Please" is a simple "spot the difference" game, so I didn't have high expectations at first. But when I played it, I felt like there was a proper "world" to it . Also, I was curious to see how the story continued.

And "Return of the Obra Dinn" had a great atmosphere. There were hints to solving the puzzles if you looked closely, but there was also a good balance of being able to force your way through, and the music and production were cool.

Hiroi: Come to think of it, you read quite a bit of the novel after the serialization ended, didn't you?

Kui: Ah, you mean "1984" by George Orwell? That was good...

I've always thought that creativity isn't necessary for life... It's entertainment, so it's not essential to life. But after reading "1984," I thought, "I guess creativity is necessary after all."

Humans need stories to experience things that should never come true, to prepare for bad things, and to prepare for understanding other people... You might think, "You should have already learned that when you were younger," but I was deeply moved by this realization.

Anyway, I feel that it would be great if people could learn things they didn't know before through this work.

Hiroi: ...Overall, it just felt like we had a fun time talking about games (laughs).

Kui: We just used the interview as an excuse to talk about the game (laughs).

-- No no, thank you very much for sharing your valuable story! (End)

I think I can understand a little bit about being interested in things you hate.

It's easy to analyze "why do you like something?" when you like it, but it's surprisingly difficult to analyze "why do you dislike something?" When you understand the reason, it seems that "why do you dislike it" is often more meaningful.

Perhaps creative works exist in part to help us understand the things we dislike.

I was able to hear a lot of deep "creation stories" that made me think about such things. Also, Ms. Kui is a huge gamer. Mr. Hiroi also likes games quite a bit. Since serious talk and game discussions alternated, the content may have been emotionally confusing. But I feel like "Dungeon Meshi" has a similar atmosphere.

If you haven't read "Dungeon Meshi," please take this opportunity to read it. It depicts a fun adventure. On top of that, it may help you prepare for difficult things that might happen in your life someday. Of course, it's also extremely interesting as a manga. I think it's definitely one of the best "entertainment" of our time.

Why does the body want to live? What does the mind want?

This is because we have a "desire" to pursue what we like and dislike. In fact, "things we dislike" are just as important as "things we like." By understanding our own "likes and dislikes" through creative works and entertainment, humans can prepare for things that happen in their future lives. Food and creative works are equally important for human growth.

...That said, I'm not sure if it has a nice punchline, or maybe not.

To eat. To experience creative works. These are truly the privileges of life. In order to live, we must continue to eat.

Now it's time to eat. What shall we eat today?

[setzeri]

Thinking about Dungeon Meshi opening.

[dunmeshistash]

Ryoko Kui Exhibition & "Delicious in Dungeon" Exhibition

Kui's published mangas, descriptions from the exhibition english pamphlet

The dragon's school is on top of the mountain

This is Ryoko Kui's debut work, and her first collected volume of works. Published in 2011, it collects seven of her stories previously published on her website and in doujinshi (self-published works), as well as two new stories. It includes a trilogy of tales which may have taken place behind the scenes of the heroes' adventures in a Role-Playing Game; and which follow the conventions of an RPG. These are "Kikyō" (Return home), which portrays the sorrow of a hero having returned to his hometown after defeating the Demon King; "Mao" (The demon king), which tells the tale of the Demon King from his birth to his downfall; and "Maō jō mondai" (The problem of the demon king castle), which depicts the course of events surrounding the demon castle having lost its master. The story "Gendai shinwa" (Modern myths) depicts the daily lives of coexisting horsepeople (centaurs) and ape-people (homo sapiens), told from the perspectives of a centaur and homo sapien married couple, and a female homo sapien company employee and her junior male centaur. It comically depicts real-life issues such as anti-labor regulation demonstrations, and the disparity between retirement benefits and life expectancy, and as such can be considered satire of the diverse issues faced by modern society. The title story "The dragon's school is on top of the mountain" is set in a university that has the only "Faculty of Dragons" in Japan. It depicts the members of the dragon research society who seek out ways to use dragons, which apparently have no demand in modern society. They explore uses for dragons, such as for food, as pets, and as advertising media. Other highlights include Kui's sad love stories, told from unique perspectives, such as the fairytale-esque "Daikon yama no yome sagashi" (A bride for Daikon mountain) which tells the tale of a man's efforts to marry a female god in order to bring fortune to his poor village, and "Shingaku tenshi" (School-going angel) which depicts the woes of a high school girl with angel wings.

Seven Little Sons of the Dragon

This collection of short stories includes self-published works and short stories published in KADOKAWA publishing's magazine Fellows! throughout 2011 and 2012. The collected volume was published in 2012. The stories are set in different countries and time periods, featuring supernatural beings such as dragons, mermaids, gods, and werewolves. "Ryū no Shōtō” (The dragon turret) is set in two neighboring mountains and sea kingdoms. A dragon builds a nest and lays eggs on the border at the only crossroad connecting two warring nations. The nations declare a ceasefire in fear of the dragon, but as peddlers are also unable to come and go, supplies become scarce. A Sea Kingdom soldier who was taken as a prisoner of war by the Mountain Kingdom is tasked with transporting supplies between the kingdoms, and in time he becomes close with a girl of the mountain Kingdom. But the time for the dragons to leave their nest is approaching, meaning that the war will begin again. “Ōkami wa uso wo tsukanai" (Wolves don't lie) starts out with the premise of being a parenting manga by a manga artist whose son has "werewolf syndrome", then suddenly turns into a story told from the perspective of the son, who is a werewolf. The feudal drama "Kane nashi Byakuroku" (Byakuroku the penniless) tells the story of an elderly gifted artist who always leaves out one eye because otherwise his creatures come to life and pop out of the paper. He is deceived by his apprentice and left penniless, so paints both eyes into the only work remaining, counterfeit picture of a samurai. He enlists the somewhat incompetent fake samurai who has come to life, to help him raise money, and misadventures ensue. Each of these precious seven stories depict the bond between parents and children, family members, and loved ones. While humorous, they are also emotionally stirring.

Terrarium in Drawer

This is a collection of short stories that were published in the literary web magazine MATOGROSSO (EAST PRESS), as well as the cat anthology “Nyansolo” (EAST PRESS), Aoharu (Shueisha) and doujinshi. The story “Ryū no gekirin" (Wrath of the dragon) portrays the process of cooking dragon cuisine from preparation to seasoning with trivia about the ingredients. "Kigō wo taberu" (Eating symbols) depicts unique ways of cooking symbols such as circles being fied whole, while squares are sliced thinly and served with sashimi soy sauce. A motif that is also common in "Delicious in Dungeon" can be found in these stories. Other chapters include “Kawaiku naritai" (I want to be cute) which depicts the makeup techniques of a cat who wants to be beautiful; "Shōtoshōto no shujinkō" (A short, short story's protagonist) which is a meta perspective comedy while having many twists and turns; and "Yume no aru hanashi" (A dreamy story) set in a Santa Claus temping agency during the busy season. You can enjoy 33 diverse stories with creative perspectives and approaches, ranging from science fiction to fantasy and fairy tales. Another charming aspect of this book is the wide variety of styles it showcases, from shojo manga, to horror, gekiga, and even a simple touch of experience-based manga. The homages to famous authors and their works are also quietly amusing. In 2013, this collected volume won the 17th Manga Division Excellence Award of the Japan Media Arts Festival, organized by the Agency for Cultural Affairs, which is awarded to outstanding works of art and entertainment.

Delicious in Dungeon

This is Ryoko Kui's first long-running series. It began serialization in Harta published by KADOKAWA from February 2014 to 2023, spanning a total of 14 book volumes. The story is set in an expansive labyrinth that suddenly appeared on an island one day. The main character Laios is an adventurer whose sister Falin is devoured by a Red Dragon while exploring the labyrinth. Falin casts a final magic spell which lets Laios and the rest of his companions escape the labyrinth, but they return to rescue and resurrect Falin. However, having lost their equipment and supplies, the group decides to become "self-sufficient” by cooking and eating the monsters they defeat along their way, as they adventure deeper into the labyrinth. Grounded in the familiarity of classic fantasy RPG elements, the series adds its own unique settings and meticulous world building. Its monster cooking scenes are illustrated alongside detailed cooking instructions, making it a never-before-seen labyrinth gourmet manga, which has become an overnight sensation. According to Kui, the motif of "cooking monsters" was born from an idea she had of wanting to depict what falls between the lines of adventures, such as meals and camping, which are typically not depicted in roleplaying games*. The manga has been adapted as a television anime series to run for two seasons from January to June 2024. A second series has also been announced. The series was produced by TRIGGER inc., who also produced and animated a commercial for the manga in 2019.

[applepiips]

“I think we just found our lunch.”

Ep. 1: “Hot Pot/Tart,” Delicious in Dungeon (ダンジョン飯)