Phew, so that episode was quite the ride. Overall as an episode I really loved it. Were there some things I feel a bit conflicted about? Yes, but for the most part I thought it was an epic finale to the season, also I am pretty sure I cried my way through about 70% of this episode. Fair warning I have a lot of thoughts so this is another fairly long post, sorry bout that. So lets get into the episode.
Spaghetti Loops
The episode starts off exactly where we left off at the end of ep 5 and this is one of the very few predictions I made that actually came true, Loki just kept going back and trying it again and again trying to do it faster and poor Victor got spaghettified over and over. Now don't judge me ok, but I just found this whole sequence hilarious. Loki getting more and more exasperated every time it fails. Also the way everyone was looking at him like he had gone completely mad and being confused when he keeps saying again and faster this time because for them this is the first and only time its happened. I also loved when Loki gets the loom model out and says 'Mobius you're in luck. It looks like Mobius but its actually Victor Timely' about the little figurine. Loved the call back to the argument they had in ep 4.
Another moment that had me cackling like a mad woman was when after asking OB how long it would take to learn everything to know about mechanics, physics and engineering, and Victor answering centuries, it comes up with the centuries later text screen. This guy legit spent centuries learning everything he needed to know to make that multiplier faster, he's dedicated that's for sure.
A concept I did like about this sequence was how Loki would take all the things that go wrong each time and then ensure they don't happen the next time, like making sure Victor's suit is taped in all the right spots, that his visor is locked properly, that he doesn't trip on the first step, that he doesn't put down the multiplier so it won't roll off the gang way. Eventually he is able to guide Victor through a successful attempt. Well successful in the sense that he is able to get the multiplier to connect to the loom and make it back. I'll admit when they were celebrating and for a moment it looked like it had worked, my first instinct was nah this is too good to be true, it is way too early in the episode for this to be fixed. Which is when we learn that actually the Loom is impossible to fix.
A Looming Problem.
I felt so bad for Loki in that moment when they realise that the Loom can never be fixed because you can't scale for infinite. I mean he looked so damn relieved and happy when it seemed as if it had worked, poor Loki had done that scenario and watched it fail who knows how many times and for a moment it finally seems like its going to be ok but then you realise the terrible truth that all your efforts will always be futile.
I do feel like the whole sequence before that was played off in a very comedic way despite the scenario actually being rather dark, Loki has to watch Timely and his friends die over and over. But I do think choosing to give it this comedic tone was a genius move on the writers' and producers' part as it puts the audience in a good mood, so when the moment when both the characters and we the audience learn the Loom melting down is always doomed to happen, its even more of a gut punch. It really puts you in Loki's shoes, like him you're on a high and then you just get dragged right down with this drastic tonal shift.
Sylvie saying that as soon as the timeline branched this was doomed to happen gives Loki the idea to go back and try to stop her from killing HWR. I loved the scenes that took place in the citadel particularly the conversation between Loki and HWR. I loved how it seemed like once again HWR is the one in control and in the know. He reveals to Loki that the time slipping, Victor and the Loom were all part of his plan too. That the Loom was actually a fail safe to protect the sacred timeline and a way to ensure his own resurrection. It also explains why everyone was sent to their branches when the Loom exploded. HWR says that the TVA was collateral and easy to rebuild, so the Loom resets everyone and then HWR just goes around and collects them all and on and on it goes.
I love when Loki stops time and its revealed that actually Loki is the one that is a step ahead of HWR and has already had that conversation with him. I really loved that moment. When HWR tells Loki that the equation always has the same outcome, loki loses, Loki decides to 'change the equation'. This reminded me so much of the end of ep 5 when he says he'll rewrite the story. His plan is to just break the loom. I think it is interesting that HWR actually looks surprised by this. He immediately starts trying to manipulate Loki into not doing that. In episode 4 Sylvie wonders if HWR was scared when she killed him and she just didn't notice, well I can't help but wonder the same now, is HWR scared in this moment, is he scared because he knows that Loki could destroy the Loom and if he does then all of HWR's plans come crumbling down, Sylvie will kill him and with no Loom there's no failsafe, no resurrection.
HWR's response to this is to try and scare Loki into doing what HWR wants. Its like what Loki said in 1x01, its an illusion conjured by the weak to inspire fear. The illusion being this threat, if you destroy the loom there will be a war that will kill and destroy everyone and everything. Now I don't think he's lying about all of it. I do think with HWR gone there will end up being a multiversal war between his variants but do I think this war will kill everyone and destroy every timeline? Nope! This is a superhero franchise so obviously our heroes are going to band together and save the day.
Before the episode was released I made a prediction post, well there was one thought that crossed my mind that I didn't put in that post because it was more of a deep fear than a prediction and I didn't want to accidently manifest it into being. That unwritten prediction (fear) was that as a last, nothing else has worked so this is the only option left, move Loki would go back to the citadel and kill Sylvie. So you can imagine my distress when we first have Sylvie, repeatedly, saying you'll have to kill me. Then HWR says Loki has two options, destroy the Loom and unleash a war that destroys everything, or kill Sylvie and protect what you can, ie the TVA and the sacred timeline.
My immediate reaction to this was something along the lines of, no, no, NO, NOO! Not going to lie they had me going, I really thought they were going to go through with it and have Loki sacrifice Sylvie to protect everyone else. Especially when he goes back to speak to her in timeline OB's workshop. And I will come back to that scene in a moment but first I want to talk about how great the transition was between the scene where HWR lays out the two options and you see Loki looking at Sylvie as he slowly approaches her and then you hear Mobius asking 'What are you going to do?' and then we're back to when Loki was first arrested and interrogated by Mobius.
What is really interesting about this scene is that looking back at it now they give us the answer to the question here, they tell us what Loki is going to do, past Loki tells us himself, when Mobius asked what he was going to do he replies, 'Finish what I started... Claim my throne.' Then when Mobius asks if he wants to be king, Loki responds 'I don't want to be. I was born to be." Throughout the whole franchise this idea has been pushed that Loki was born to be a king, he says it multiple times himself, but Odin also tells him as a child that even though only one of his sons could sit on the Asgardian throne they were both born to be kings. Come the end of this finale Loki is now on his throne. There is also this idea of Loki being burdened with glorious purpose that's repeated throughout the franchise and that is something else we see him find in this episode. I just find it funny that they told us all the way back in 1x1 what choice Loki was going to make in the season 2 finale. One little detail I like is that both ep 1x1 and ep 2x6 have the same title 'Glorious Purpose.' It's a neat way of bringing it all full circle.
The story Mobius tells about the hunter and the 8 year old boy he couldn't prune was also really interesting to me. Firstly because it reveals that Mobius, like Renslayer, was once a hunter before he became an analyst. Also that Renslayer was his partner which explains their bond. I do wonder if the reason why Mobius couldn't prune this boy was because he was just a kid playing with his brother and maybe subconsciously it reminded him of his own boys and even though he didn't remember them, some protective instinct kicked in and stopped him from pruning the boy.
I also feel like this story about the boy is supposed to be a mirror to Sylvie's own story. They were both kids who were minding their own business playing, when the TVA showed up and destroyed their realities. In the boy's case he was pruned to boot. In both instances it was Renslayer who was the responding hunter. I think its fascinating that Loki is trying to make this impossible decision on whether he should kill Sylvie and in that moment he is told a story that has to have reminded him of Sylvie and how she was a little girl who had everything ripped away from her.
Whilst they told us in that scene with Mobius what Loki would ultimately decide to do, obviously whilst watching the episode I hadn't figured that out yet, so when Loki went to see Sylvie right after this scene, the moment in timeline OB's workshop that I promised I'd come back to, I was filled with dread. To me at first it seemed like a goodbye scene and like he had gone there to kind of explain why he was going to have to kill her. I am not ashamed to admit that I did tear up at that moment, the mere thought that they might go through with having him kill her for 'the greater good' was heartbreaking to me.
But once I had pulled myself together I rewatched that scene and what is really interesting about it is how it parallels and links to their pie room scene. In the pie room scene you had Sylvie saying that it would be easier to destroy the TVA and start from scratch and Loki saying fixing things is hard, hope is hard. Here in this conversation those two ideas combine and meet. You have Sylvie explaining to Loki that growing up in apocalypses taught her that sometimes its ok to destroy something and that's when Loki realises and finishes for her 'if there is a hope that thing can be replaced by something better.' Loki is being asked to make the hard choice and here Sylvie is asking him to have hope that destroying the loom will lead to something better which links back to what Loki said in the pie room, hope is the hard choice and therefore the choice he chooses.
King of Time
Sylvie asks Loki some really good and deep questions in this scene as well which I think influences the decision he makes. She asks him what kind of god he wants to be, whether he really wants to be the kind that takes away people's free will, aka the god he was in the first Avengers film. She also kind of points out that he is asking the wrong questions. He's asking what good is free will if everyone is dead and she's asking but who are you and what right do you have to make that decision for everyone. They have the right to chose to die trying, fighting for something better. I just think its a really interesting debate.
Another little clever detail that I noticed is that after making his decision when he timeslips into the loom room the aura reader announces 'welcome he who remains.' Loki is about to become the kind of new HWR and it's almost like they are announcing it in that moment.
So now we get to the hard part, and yes I did bawl like a baby during this whole scene. Loki heads down into the Loom and looking back to where Sylvie and Mobius are behind the locked doors he says. 'I know what I want. I know what kind of god I need to be. For you. For all of us.' Again I think this is a parallel back to the bar scene between Sylki where she asks him what he wants and also the scene in this episode where she asks what kind of god he wants to be. I know there is some debate over whether Loki was speaking to Sylvie or Mobius or both here when he said 'for you.' Personally while I do think it was partly to both I do think it was mostly directed towards Sylvie. My reasoning being that it was a reference to those conversations he had with Sylvie alone.
The scene where he was walking down the gangway and his clothes turn into his new King of Time outfit was stunning, like breathtakingly so. Him breaking the loom and setting the timelines free was also really beautiful imagery. There's a moment when Loki reaches for one of the blackened branches and tries to bring it to life with his magic but the moment he lets go it begins to die again and that's when he realises that he is going to have to weave the branches and hold them stable himself. It's such a bittersweet moment as he takes one last look back at the ones he loves and cares for before making the hard, the impossible choice to isolate himself at the end of time. Again the scene where he is weaving those branches together and the way what once was HWR chair turns into a pure golden throne that Loki takes his seat in, stunning, visually it was stunning.
Yggdrasil
Just when I thought nothing could be more stunning than that sequence the camera panned out and showed us that the timelines were now woven together in the form of a breathtakingly gorgeous tree. I mean it was such a stunning image that I want to get a copy to frame and put on my wall.
But I am sure I am not the only one who saw it and instantly thought of Yggdrasil, the world tree of Norse Mythology. So here I have, well I don't know if I would call it a theory or not, but a thought at the very least.
So something that I think is really interesting that I think might possibly have some significance later on, maybe, is that in some versions of the myths around Yggdrasil (there are different and varying accounts and sources) the tree has three main roots. One is rooted in Midgard, the realm of men. The second is rooted in Jotunheim, the land of the giants and the third is rooted in Hel, the underworld.
I think these three roots are symbolic of Loki, Sylvie and Mobius. Mobius would represent Midgard, he's a human who had a life on Midgard. Sylvie would represent Jotunheim, as a Loki variant she would have been born on Jotunheim and is a frost giant. Then Loki would represent the root for Hel, he's currently at the end of time and in season one to get there you had to go through the void and when Loki first woke up there he asks if its Hel, it definitely has that imagery or symbolism of an underworld.
I don't know exactly what this could mean going forward but I think the three of them are going to be the key to keeping the tree together and protecting it. Or I could be looking too much into it.
Sylki
So anyone who has seen any of my previous posts will know that I am huge sylki fan, so obviously I have to talk about them in this review, feel free to skip over this section if you aren't a fan of sylki.
But anyway, before this episode I was of the opinion that if we didn't get a kiss or at least a scene where they talked about their feelings and cleared the air, then I would be really disappointed, and whilst yeah it would have been nice to get those scenes I am surprisingly not disappointed because in my opinion what we got might have been even better, or at the least just as good. After this episode I am in no doubt that these guys love each other, Loki was particularly obvious about it.
I've said in previous posts that in my opinion everything Loki has done this season has been for Sylvie. His motivation was simple, what he wanted was simple, he wanted Sylvie to be ok. This episode is no different it only further reinforces that this is Loki's desire.
He is faced with this impossible choice kill Sylvie and save everyone else, or risk everything by protecting the free will Sylvie gave everyone, that she fought for. Give her the chance to live a life. HWR I think thought Loki would choose himself, would choose to sacrifice Sylvie to ensure he wouldn't be alone and so that he could get a throne. But I think HWR underestimated the love Loki felt for Sylvie. I mean he replayed that citadel fight over and over because he was not willing to hurt Sylvie even to stop her from killing HWR. Again it all circles back to what Loki said in 1x6, he doesn't want to hurt her, he doesn't want a throne he wants her to be ok, and this is something HWR doesn't understand and that is why he loses.
The moment when Loki chooses to sacrifice himself for her is so heartbreaking, the way Sylvie immediately followed him down to the loom and how she desperately said she had to get in there when she realised what he was doing. There is also a moment when the portal thingy opens to the end of time and Loki knows what he has to do, he looks back to Sylvie and she shakes her head at him, he just gives her this sad smile and does what he needs to do. It reminded me so much of the moment in 1x5 when Sylvie says they need a distraction for Alioth and Loki puts a hand on her shoulder, Sylvie shakes her head because she doesn't want him in danger. It was clear how deeply she cared about and loved him, it was just so bittersweet.
Sylki's romance in season 1 was very different from season 2, last season they were very flirty and cute whereas this season has been mostly angst thanks to the fall out after the citadel in 1x6. But I still think it was still a romance in season 2. Loki sacrificed his own happiness for Sylvie, there are so many quotes out there about sacrifice being the purest form of love and I think that is what they were going for here. Loki choosing to sit at the end of time and hold the timelines together was the burden he chose to carry for her, what's more romantic than that? I mean it hurts and it sucks and makes me want to cry, but its still the epitome of romance.
Also I couldn't help but see the parallel between Thor choosing to destroy the bridge and therefore separating himself from Jane for the greater good and Loki choosing to trap himself at the end of time away from Sylvie to protect her and his friends, as well as the greater good. Both brothers end up away from the women they love in an act of heroism. The glimmer of hope for me is that Jane searches for Thor, eventually they are reunited. I'm just saying Sylvie still has that tempad. I would love if we get to see these characters again in a season 3 or other Marvel project, if we find out that Sylvie has been searching for a way to free Loki but still keep the branches stable. Maybe she could even team up with thor and mobius. Or she could seek out Wanda or Dr strange to get more magical knowledge. The possibilities are endless.
After
So lets talk about the ending and where everyone ends up starting with B-15, Casey and OB. So I like that they all stayed at the TVA and that B-15 seems to be kind of running the show. I also loved that OB wrote another TVA guidebook edition 2, I feel like it might be a bestseller. I also love that it is yellow as that colour symbolises optimism and the promise of a positive future which I think will be good for the TVA going forward. Another thing of note and which I really loved was that when they show the new TVA with its new 'growing together' propaganda posters, everyone look really happy and content, like they've got this new purpose and its one they feel good about.
Well everyone looks happy but Mobius. Both his and Sylvie's endings were left very, very open. I do get the sense that they are both feeling lost now that Loki is gone. That could be why Sylvie seeks Mobius out, she knows he too feels lost without Loki. When asked what she's going to do now Sylvie shrugs because she doesn't know, which is interesting to me because if she is happy on her branch like she has been saying all season, why wouldn't she just say she's going back to her life there? Unless Marvel have other plans for her character. Same with Mobius we don't know what he's going to do next. Though the door for him to return to the TVA has been left open with B-15's offer that there is always a seat for him if he wants it.
Ok so let's talk about Loki. Now can I appreciate the character development of Loki going from the selfish, narcissistic god who wanted a throne and who tried to take away people's free will, to a hero who sacrifices himself for the greater good and to ensure people get to keep their free will. Yes. Do I think it was hella romantic that he chose this path because he couldn't bear to hurt Sylvie? Oh yes that was some real romantic stuff right there. Do I think his arc was well written? It was, beautifully so. Am ok with Loki ending up trapped at the end time alone, something he feared? ABSOLUTELY-FRIGGEN-NOT!!! What the hell marvel! Honestly if this is the end of the story for this character then Marvel and I are going to have issues going forward.
A Glimmer of Hope?
The first thing I did this morning was hop onto google to see if there was any information on whether we'll get a season 3 because I had seen alot of talk about season 2 wrapping up the story and I was met with a little spark of hope. There are several articles out covering an interview from producer Kevin Wright where he says this about a potential season 3:
We take it season by season, and there are certainly things that Tom and I and other casts have talked about of where we see this going, and I know there’s some excitement for that internally, but just from a storytelling standpoint, I think we always conceived of seasons 1 and 2 as a whole."
The producer went on to describe both of the Tom Hiddleston-led seasons as "two chapters of the same book," but admitted that there are "other stories" or "new books" to be told:
"That these are two chapters of the same book, and that season two is finishing that book, and there are other stories to be told there, but I think they would be new books, if that’s not too coy."
"It was similar to Season 1 in we wanted to tell this story and tell it well, but even in Season 1, we obviously were thinking about where we were going. I would say Season 1 and Season 2 were developed and created as, like, kind of two chapters of the same book. We felt pretty strongly, all of us involved, that Season 2 was about closing that book but that there are many other books on the shelf for this character and for this world. But this felt like it wanted to be the conclusion of these great things that we set up in Season 1. We don't want to constantly leave people with drastic cliffhangers for our finales."
So it seems like all the talk about closing the story was actually just in relation to the storylines they had set up in season one and that this isn't intended to be the end of these characters' stories full stop.
A few of the articles also talked about Marvel's plans for their tv shows going forward:
Contributing Loki's Season 3 odds is Marvel Studios' new direction for its Disney+ shows since, via The Hollywood Reporter, Marvel is reportedly "leaning into the idea of multiseason serialized TV" a la Loki instead of the "limited-series format:"
"And just as 'Loki,' which returned Oct. 5, marked Marvel’s first season two of a series (out of nine TV shows to date), the studio plans on leaning into the idea of multiseason serialized TV, stepping away from the limited-series format that has defined it. Marvel wants to create shows that run several seasons, where characters can take time to develop relationships with the audience rather than feeling as if they are there as a setup for a big crossover event."
So if they are going to be leaning more into multiseason shows it would make sense to me for them to make Loki one of them as it is one of, if not the most, popular shows they've done so far. So I would expect that they would monopolise on that.
So I do think there's a good chance that we'll potentially get a season 3, I for one would love to see where they take these characters next. And that is all the thoughts I have on the finale, sorry this got so long but if you did read all the way to the end thank you.
wow. alright. just got through loki season two last night. here are my thoughts
alright so first and foremost. the ending was bullshit.
something something pretty imagery pain and suffering godlike potential and he wants to be a good god. i just. gods there are so many other ways you could've done that in a way that didn't reaffirm that loki would suffer alone forever. that he would be burdened with a glorious purpose til the end of time. he doesn't deserve that. loki has been through enough and finally deserves something akin to peace and happiness.
don't get me wrong as a norse mythology nerd the imagery in this episode was nice. some concepts were lovely. the time travel tie together of a lot of stuff at the end i appreciated it. but loki didn't and doesn't deserve pain and suffering. one of the points of the show is that you are not tethered to fate and that you can try and make your own choices and destiny and is fighting back against the predetermined.
i will also be bitter that we as a fandom got queerbaited. again. don't come over to me crying but serena a romance subplot would've been rushed it wouldn't logically have worked, oh serena not everything has to have romance. well sure. i know. but i also call bullshit. if the writers can cram in a drawn out uncomfortable ai x romance scene then i'm pretty certain that they can make two characters who already have chemistry kiss. it could be like. a five second scene. a quick kiss on the cheek. anything to confirm that they. were actually together. it wouldn't have taken much considering the characters already have chemistry unlike some which they somehow managed to squeeze in there [coughing sylki cough coughing]
queerbaiting in the fact that we as a fandom were robbed of our potential loki genderfluid representation, along with barely given the Concept of him being bisexual before instantly forced into a seemingly straight relationship that resembled a selfcest fic. [the scene where loki said if he won't come back and was going to say something to mobius before time slipping was queerbaiting and you can fight me on that]
loki using he/him in the mcu is why i am primarily using those pronouns for him. pronouns don't equal gender, he can still be genderfluid and use only he/him pronouns. or if his character were to come out and prefer different terms those pronouns would be used. either way i'd be thrilled because finally genderfluid rep
okay um flashes mythology nerd badge lets get into some imagery that i enjoyed despite not. like. enjoying the end of the finale.
yggdrasil. in the norse mythology is a giant tree that all of the nine realms exist upon. this giant tree is ruled over and protected. okay yeah most people who know anything can see that imagery in the end of the show. this matters even more but i'll get to that soon.
the imagery of the throne reminds me of odin's throne in norse mythology. it was a grand all seeing throne that no one else but the king of gods was allowed to touch [that didn't stop of lot of people though]. and while my memory of this is a bit fuzzy it does remind me a lot of the throne used.
it even more reminds me of the punishment that was used against loki in norse mythology where the god was chained to a rock with a snake dripping burning venom of their face
alright back to yggdrasil imagery. the branches of multiverse and the like are pretty obvious meanings. but what really stuck out to me was rather the fact that in the first captain america movie with the red skull, the tesseract was found in a carving of yggdrasil.
loki then proceeds to fight over and chase after this tesseract desperately as one of his motives. only to end up in the tva. and for fate to have destine for him to destroy the loom and basically restore yggdrasil.
do i like this ending ? no not one bit loki deserves so much better. do i think the imagery is pretty ? sure i do i appreciate the touches but i do think it could've just as been as meaningful without loki being sent to eternal suffering.
don't get me wrong the show to me was enjoyable. i was excited for it each week, but it was hard to watch due to a lot of wasted potential, unneeded moments, scenes that made no sense, and so forth. and also the fact that it feels like they don't seem to care about a lot of the characters ? maybe that's just me but yk
6) The trailer was misleading advertising. Marvel’s done it in the past with little to no backlash:
Iron Man 3 presenting the Mandarin as the ultimate foe for Tony to defeat, only to find out he’s a charlatan in a minor role.
Falcon and Winter Soldier was presented as a light-hearted buddy adventure, only to tackle darker themes about nationalism and racism. (Not saying that those themes were bad, just that the TFAWS’s trailer was not truthful to the story).
In the case of Loki, the trailer presented the plot as Loki making time-traveling shenanigans and being captured for breaking the timeline. They included the D.B Cooper clip, and the scenes of Loki in New York and as king in Asgard. These clips never show up in season 1. The D.B Cooper scene was a off-the-cuff moment, and the highly-anticipated (imo) President Loki was around for five minutes.
The trailer shows the storyline being about Loki breaking the timeline, with Mobius saying in a voiceover, “You picked up the tesseract, breaking reality. I want you to help us fix it.”
Marvel’s publicity team knew what story we would want to see from the character. And that’s not what we got: it was a mix of Loki tagging along with Sylvie to take down the Timekeepers, and detective-esque scenes of trying to overthrow the TimeKeepers.
It was never about Loki having an adventure, breaking the timeline, and having to fix it.
There’s a difference between having scenes that don’t make it into the final product, between not revealing enough of the story to spoil plot twists...and deliberately choosing certain scenes and quotes to present a false version of the story.
I guess Marvel was worried that no one would watch it if they showed us the real product.
7) Loki’s powers were wildly inconsistent, especially compared to what we’ve seen before.
In the past, we’ve seen Loki do illusions, duplication casting and in Thor 2, some very light telekinesis. After hearing of his mother’s death, he throws several pieces of furniture in into the cell walls with his mind. This is after losing the person who probably mattered most to him at the time, and feeling responsible for her death--it’s a powerful move showing his magical capabilities.
In the show, in Episode 3 we see him pull a Roomba towards himself in order to use it as a shield during a fight--pretty in-line with what we saw in the Dark World.
One episode later, an entire flipping tower is falling towards them, and he reverses it with his mind alone.
It was in the face of death, you say. Of course he was going to pull some cool new magical move.
Sure. In the face of death, I could see him jumping from throwing chairs to something heavier, like maybe a crumbling wall or a fruit stand.
BUT A TOWER?
WHY?
HOW??
He’s never done anything on that scale magically. In episode 2, he got tossed around by a (human) Alabama man. Why would he not use that move to bring the roof crumbling down if he was fighting for his life then?
So he’s got massive telepathic power when a building is falling but can’t use it in a fight against regular people.... okay?
Honestly, due to the fact that they’ve weakened him so much, and when Loki said, “I think we’re stronger than we realize”, I’m betting Season 2 will include Loki discovering the extent of his magical powers.
I don’t like this idea because again, it contradicts the previous canon. In Thor 1, Hogun literally calls Loki a “master of magic”. He went toe-to-toe with Thor and the Avengers and now can’t beat regular humans. A thousand+ year old being unaware of his own untapped potential doesn’t seem correct (yeah, they did that with Thor in Ragnarok, I know).
This Loki’s power levels jump up and down according to the plot, trying to make us believe that due to his spoiled past, Loki needs to apply himself to learn more about his powers.
8) Loki was out of character.
His lying and scheming was way too obvious. I was incredibly confused the first couple of episodes because it would be strange how he would be a pathetic buffoon one minute and yet The only moment I was sold on his competence as a liar was episode 2 at the renaissance fair where he attempts to fool the TVA. He was actually competent for once, but he gets caught, and goes into apologizing and sucking up 30 seconds later.
He gets drunk when they’re on the mission on Lamentis. This didn’t make sense--when he was trying to conquer Earth, he had the opportunity to also goof off and he’s always been shown to take things seriously, with the exception of Ragnarok.
The “I’m a narcissist” scene. While Loki is the type to crave attention--in Avengers, Tony calls him a diva who wants his name plastered to the skies--it comes from a place of feeling overshadowed, never able to match his brother Thor. Which we can see has some basis:
In Thor 1, his adopted parents raised him to hate his race,
lied to him about it,
and when he was hanging over an wormhole, his father finally rejected him.
In Avengers, Thor tells him in that his slights are “imagined”.
Thor 2, his adopted father told him his “birthright was to die”.
While it doesn’t excuse his actions in Thor and Avengers, it’s pretty clear that his family, particularly his father, have let him down.
So to make him experience character development and understand why he does what he does...the writers took him back to Asgard, and had Sif beat him up repeatedly until he admits he does terrible things because he’s a...narcissist.
It was pretty hard to watch that scene, especially because I related to Loki as someone who felt overshadowed and overlooked. He tried too hard to be what his family wanted, to show that he was “the worthy son”.
But here in the fantastic year of 2021, this show decided to throw away all of that emotional nuance away.
9) The costumes were bad.
The brown variant jacket with its ugly orange block letters.
The guard suit on Lamentis looked like a cross between a purple sweater and a plague doctor mask. honestly makes me shuder to see it
Loki’s green-and-gold costumes are some of the most distinct, instantly recognizable outfits of the MCU. And he almost immediately loses it in the first episode. It ends being given to Sylvie, (like most of Loki’s better characteristics) and he stays in a detective skinny-tie suit instead. The costume is okay, but it lacks the flair and style he’s had previously, and he never gains it back.
10) The season finale really did showcase this show in the best way-- ig hype followed by disappointment.
For five episodes, we rushed towards the ultimate villain, the mastermind behind it all. Episode 6 was like...being handed a pack of bubble wrap, swinging your hand hard, expecting that satisfying pop! only to have it slowly putter out with a sad little sound.
First, Kang looked like he got his costume from Party City. The purple cape isn’t doing him any favors. Then, the man sat there and monologued for forty minutes, making jokes, telling us how he set the plot up, and how the multiverse worked.
I know Marvel gets flack for there always being an CGI climactic action scene, but…they had 6 episodes leading up to the Big Bad, and for it to end that anticlimactically with a man in a Party City purple cape was a letdown. The finale had no menace, no teeth. In the words of Mobius, it was just…talkie-talkie.
All in all, this show really suffered from ignoring Loki’s past, where he would realistically be emotionally-wise, and a lack of focus on its title character’s development. Settings and costumes being better/unique would be also be nice, especially given its popularity. At the end of the day, I don’t see the character I empathized so strongly with in this show.
i feel like maybe someone on the writing team for the loki series attempted to read agent of asgard. but they didnt understand it bc wtf was that line about “have you ever seen a female/woman loki?” as if sylvie being a woman is what sets her apart from the other loki.
thats like if you skipped to the climax and conclusion of agent of asgard without any context abt the representation of loki’s gender identity in earlier issues and titles. and then you’d think the only reason the good aoa loki beat ikol/evil loki was bc of their shapeshifting genders?? what??
and then u just decide to go do a bunch of interviews on how you put time and care into “representing” these aspects of the character, (which, yeah, i’ll give it to you, have only been marvel canon in the past decade) when really the only way the show explores gender is stating that loki’s sex is fluid and featuring an alternate version of loki that presents and presumably identifies as a woman full time, stating that she’s the ONLY FEMALE/WOMAN LOKI IN ALL TIME and just
thats insane. how can you read the source material and adapt it that way. im genuinely curious as to what happened in the minds of the writers who wrote this and crew members who’re praising it in interviews. did we read the same book? do they know what a genderfluid person is? im so lost with this show.
[The following is an exact transcription of Twitter user @/diolesbian ‘s thread linked here . They gave me permission to cross-post their thread on my Tumblr. Keep in mind that this review is fairly long and quite critical of the series. I agree with this review wholeheartedly, and would be welcome to discuss it with anyone else.]
Loki is a character who has died many times, but his own series may be his most brutal character assassination yet.
1. Loki’s role in the series. Instead of tackling Loki's most villainous state of mind in Avengers 1, the series literally speedran through his development in the subsequent films, after which they almost entirely halted his character progression.
Because this series was set right after Avengers 1 it had the responsibility of developing Loki further in place of The Dark World and Ragnarok. In Episode 1, this development was kicked off by having Loki watch a reel of some of his defining moments in the MCU, allowing him to see his future all the way up to his death in Infinity War. Sadly, this scene ended up being the most development he received in the entire series. And arguably, this isn’t even true development but more like a speedrun of his character up until that point, serving as a simple tactic to explain why he wouldn’t be acting all dictatorial and murderous during his own series. As soon as he had been made “good” (read: docile) enough to follow along with the plot, his agency was completely thrown out. From that point on, the series wasn’t about Loki making things happen but about things happening to Loki.
Loki was supposed to be the main character, but he wasn't the protagonist in this story. In fact, he was more of a side character than we’ve ever seen him be in the MCU before, perhaps excepting IW and Endgame.
A protagonist is by definition someone whose important decisions affect the plot, whose development is followed most closely by the audience, and who is opposed by an antagonist. Loki exhibited none of these traits in this series. Especially the latter half of the story, he was reduced to simply reacting to the revelations around him, such as the reveal that the TVA members were all variants and that Kang was the true mastermind behind everything. He never truly involved himself or acted based on any of these plot points, and hardly played a key role in what was supposed to be his own story. Even in the films, where Loki is a side character, he makes choices which impact the plot to a larger extent. He almost seems more like a background character in the role of protagonist than in the parts he plays in the films.
2. The antagonist. The TVA could have worked as the perfect setting for Loki to have a new arc. It’s a thematic antithesis to who we know Loki to be. But when this Loki turns out to not be who the audience thought he was the TVA’s thematic significance falls apart as well.
In Episode 1, the TVA’s Agent Mobius enlists the help of Loki the Variant to pin down a greater foe who we are told is another, more malicious version of Loki. Order and chaos meeting in the middle, teaming up to take down an enemy, who even happens to be the protagonists’ literal evil self: that works, it sounds promising. But this dynamic is soon undermined when Loki leaves with Sylvie. Still, the benefit of the doubt is easy to grant here: a story about tricksters is bound to contain twists. But by Episode 3 the series is halfway done and the TVA has been appointed as the main antagonist again: we’ve now established villains three different times. And then the Cloud Monster At The End Of Time is introduced, and finally Kang. In other words, the Loki series has no consistent antagonist, no one to pit its main character against. And this is where we once again miss out on an enormous aspect of Loki’s potential characterization.
Protagonists are always defined by an antagonist, whether a purple Titan, a flat tire, or themself. Loki is not given anything to define his morals, motivations, or development in opposition to and this is a huge oversight. Especially given the fact that Loki has taken on the villain’s role in the past: how is the audience supposed to know that the “bad guy” is now a “good guy” if there’s no “even worse guy” to stand up against?
3. The plot. A plot should show off its MC’s strengths and match their personality. The Loki plot hardly relied on his presence at all, he didn't play a key role. The story had so little to do with Loki that it seemed as though he has barely any impact on “his” narrative.
One of the most central conflicts in the Loki series doesn’t involve him at all: it’s between Sylvie and the TVA. This plotline was a good concept overall, but its main problem is that it’s practically the only conflict in the series. Loki himself, as mentioned before, isn’t set in opposition to anything or anyone. And thanks to his relationships with Sylvie and Mobius being weakened by conflicting storytelling devices, he appears to be in a bubble by himself away from the rest of the cast for much of the story. First he follows Mobius around, then Sylvie, then he wanders aimlessly in the void before following Sylvie once again and learning that Kang is a Really Bad Guy who he should be opposed to even though by this point he has interacted so little with the story unfolding around him that the audience doesn’t even understand why he should be choosing to play the hero.
The plot and the characters both suffer by being so incredibly unrelated to each other. A series, especially an MCU one, should tell an overarching narrative through the perspective of its main character.
In the beginning of the series, when Loki was still getting his bearings in the TVA, this lack of decision-making was more understandable, especially since some of his skills were still being shown-- he discovered Sylvie was hiding in nexus events, and he made the choice to leave Mobius and follow her. But by the latter half of the series he still hasn’t had much impact on the story or taken any actions of his own, and simply allows plot points to happen to him. Just because the Loki series had to introduce the TVA and Kang didn’t mean it had to forgo telling a story about its protagonist. If Loki’s story had been intrinsically tied to the overarching plot points, if his choices had been some of the primary factors determining how events ended up taking place, the series would have succeeded in every aspect. But instead Loki is pushed aside by the plot of his own series, a plot which subsequently ends up coming across as largely hollow and pointless due to its lack of character drive.
4. Loki’s arc. One of the main reasons MCU Loki is loved is for his excellent character development across his films. TVA Loki was extremely lacking in that aspect and chances to take his character in interesting new self-aware directions were thrown away without much thought.
Throughout the MCU, Loki is on a journey with many highs and lows. He goes from a bitter and disheartened prince standing in the shadow of his brother, to a self-loathing Jotun bent on destroying his own people in a desperate attempt to win his father’s love, to a half-mad partially mind-controlled dictator with delusions of grandeur fueled by his own insecurity, to a prisoner wondering what there is left for him to lose, to a savior of Asgard’s people finally coming to accept his place in what is left of his family, to a tragic sacrificial victim who knew he had to die so the true hero might live on. That’s a hell of a journey, incidentally shown in less than TWO HOURS of screen time, and the prospect of TVA Loki embarking on an equally stimulating one, this time told over the course of over four hours and shown from his own perspective the entire way through, was exciting. But as it turned out, this relatively simple expectation went completely unmet.
For a story trying to say so much about individuality and self-acceptance, the Loki series seemed to pass by every obvious opportunity to tackle those questions.
Sylvie’s introduction seemed like a good idea at first: Loki would be able to literally bond with himself and learn to accept who he is that way, and forays could be made to explore what Loki’s personality could have been like if he grew up under different circumstances! But aside from a scene or two in Episode 3, this was not how things ended up going. Loki didn’t come to any grand or important conclusions about his identity, he didn’t choose to act differently, all that happened was a vaguely-worded confession of pseudo-romantic feelings which was cut off in the middle, made no sense, and weakened the narrative in a whole host of other ways explained elsewhere. Loki’s encounter with other versions of themself in the Void was similarly meaningless: Loki didn’t end up expressing or demonstrating a single thing he learned from meeting all of those alternate selves, despite the fact that there was potential for massive self-discovery there.
Less than 2 hours of MCU screen time portrayed Loki more coherently than this entire series. Loki is loved because of how much he changes, and it felt like he didn’t in this series. He started off lost and stayed that way throughout the entire plot.
By the end of the series, it was impossible to identify who Loki had become. He said he didn’t want a throne, but it was not obvious why not. He looked sad to be betrayed by Sylvie, but never expressed what that meant to him. He seemed afraid once Kang was unleashed, but why? Why did he care about the Sacred Timeline? What were his motivations? Throughout the series the answers to these questions became less and less obvious, culminating in the final episode which ended without a single moment of reflection or explanation as to who Loki had become. He wasn’t a villain, but only because he wasn’t murdering people. He was in some capacity a hero, for… being against Kang, probably, but once again with no explanation as to why Loki had decided to feel that way. He never seemed self-assured in his heroism, as if he hadn’t chosen the role for himself. Again, making one’s own choices that shape the narrative are what differentiates a protagonist from a side character, but Loki did not do that in this series.
5. Loki and Sylvie’s relationship. Loki and Sylvie had the potential to be a powerful duo representing the process of self-acceptance but instead they were reduced to a strange pseudo-romance.
Despite Loki’s many developments in the films, he never truly liked himself. He has been known to act extremely confident and self-righteous at times, but this is merely the opposite side of the coin containing his self-loathing and insecurity. Having him literally meet and subsequently befriend himself in Episode 3 was a move towards developing this aspect of him and potentially teaching him to finally accept himself as he truly is, but this buildup was all shattered in Episode 4 when the relationship is portrayed to have romantic undertones. Instead of a powerful struggle to accept oneself, the relationship between Loki and Sylvie becomes a twisted thing which is memeable at best (selfcest LOL amirite?) and outright damaging to both characters and the very concept of loving oneself at worst.
Ultimately, Loki and Sylvie's relationship didn’t add anything to either character’s development and actively detracted from what could have been a touching story.
Romantic love is extremely different from self love; romantic love has connotations including dating conventions and sexuality which are impossible to ignore and in this case serve as a distraction. And on top of ruining a potentially powerful storyline, this strange relationship makes both Loki and Sylvie seem out of character. Loki is once again one thousand years old and he has never even had a true friend, so why would he possibly fall for someone after knowing them for only two days? Meanwhile in Sylvie’s case, Loki’s “feelings” for her cause the audience to pay more attention to her romantic life and gestures rather than her actual character and motivations.
6. Loki’s Sexuality and Gender Fluidity. Loki’s sexuality and gender has been shown in several comic runs, and the series was advertised as featuring this representation as well. But due to several fundamental errors and problematic storytelling this also fell flat.
Sylvie’s introduction filled many fans with hope regarding the portrayal of Loki’s identity. In the MCU neither of their LGBT identities had ever been touched upon, while the series introduced a female variant of Loki and explicitly stated their sexuality. But this portrayal soon unraveled, most notably in Episode 5, in which many other Loki variants were shown but not a single one besides Sylvie was non-male. On top of that, when TVA Loki mentioned Sylvie and referred to her as “a woman Variant of us”, the other Lokis agreed that that sounded “terrifying”. Why should a genderfluid being be afraid of a version of themselves presenting as a different gender? It read as both fluidphobic not to mention strangely sexist.
The pseudo-romance between Loki and Sylvie only aggravated the situation. Not only did the nature of the “relationship” seem to follow heteronormative storytelling tropes (falling in love after a couple days of knowing each other, one party being reduced to a love interest, valuing romantic love above any other type, etc) but it also seemed distressing and offensive to many genderfluid people. A romance between a male and a female Loki, one of which doesn’t even call herself by that name, seems to be implying that an individual becomes someone else when merely presenting as a different gender, which of course isn’t at all the case. The writing wasn’t necessarily malicious here, but it was certainly ignorant and potentially even harmful. The opportunity was there to translate Loki’s powerful comic representation into the framework of the MCU, but this attempt did not succeed.
7. Loki’s characterization. Loki is a chameleon, but there are certain traits fundamental to his character. These traits were either ignored or actively mocked in the series. The audience already knew “what makes a Loki a Loki", but the series threw that knowledge away.
Episode 1’s premise of stripping Loki of everything he is used to was an intriguing setup to ensure the discovery of the core of who Loki truly is. The only problem was that this truth didn’t end up being found at all. Mobius made fun of Loki’s most defining traits, such as his habits of lying to manipulate people and acting out of a place of insecurity, which seemed to be a signal for the narrative to forbid Loki from exhibiting any of those traits from that point on in any way. This reduction in Loki’s character was reflected in everything, from his lack of humor (in the films he’s even funny while he’s taking over the world!), the underpowered way in which he fought against Sylvie (he’ll use magic to dry his clothes, but fight with a damn vacuum cleaner?) to the way that he wore the same boring outfit in every single episode-- it may sound shallow, but clothes are important when presenting a character. Every one of Loki’s looks in the films said something about him and his state of mind, and sadly that bland TVA outfit seemed to convey that Loki really was nothing more than a subservient pawn in what was supposed to be his own story. Ironically, the writing stripped Loki of everything that made him Loki, and left us with nothing but a Jotun-shaped void to be swayed by the whims and wills of the characters and plot devices surrounding him.
8. Loki’s past and abilities. This series could have elaborated on aspects of his character which had been teased at in the films and theorized about by fans, but ended up being a disappointment in this aspect as well.
Aside from Loki’s characterization and development, something else the series ignores is much of his canon story in the films. Since Thor 1, a truth that always overshadowed Loki was his Jotun heritage. He struggled with it up until the time of his death, clearly visible in his relationship with his foster family. It’s understandable that Loki was supposed to be independent from Thor in his series, but that’s no excuse for completely ignoring this central part of who Loki is. It doesn’t matter how much he goes through or how much his circumstances change, this feeling of unbelonging sits deep in Loki’s core and should have been both explored and explicitly discussed in the series. A series all about Loki was the perfect opportunity for him to finally confront and explain his relationship with his heritage, and potentially come to terms with it as well. And this isn’t even to say how cool some more insight on Loki’s Jotun inheritance could have been-- hypotheticals aren’t the point of this review, but it would have been fascinating to see Loki reacting adversely to heat like he has been hinted to in the past or even using his ice powers like he did in Thor 1.
Loki's magic was tragically underused. It felt like he was stripped of all of his magical powers even after his TVA chains had been removed, and this was never explained.
A second huge oversight is his magic. His powers are all over the place in this series. They were always a bit vague in the films, but this series was the opportunity to set that right and explain exactly what Loki was capable of as a sorcerer, especially now that the MCU has embraced magic more than it had ten years ago. But instead, Loki showcased an inexplicable lack of magic use-- again, the vacuum cleaner fight can be presented as evidence. There is a single scene in which Loki says that he learned his magic from Frigga, but no information is given as to how much he learned or why he doesn’t always favor spells. His power levels are incredibly inconsistent (he forgoes using magic when first confronted by the TVA, but is later shown using telekinesis to save himself from being literally crushed to death). And, strangest of all, there is a scene in which he tells Sylvie that he “can’t” enchant living beings. Loki, the millennium year old Trickster sorcerer god, who can hold an Infinity Stone with his bare hands, reanimate Surtur in the Eternal Flame, and trick the average person using illusions with ease, can’t cast a little enchantment? And if so, why not? The series offered precious few explanations concerning Loki’s magical abilities and instead only raised more questions. And in this way, Loki is once again relegated into the background and left with not a single shred of any new characterization or development.
Loki contains multitudes, but the series reduced him to two dimensions.
This isn’t to mention every other facet of Loki’s story that could have potentially been explored to great success in this series-- his torture and subsequent partial mental influence at the hands of Thanos just before the events of Avengers 1 is one obvious example, as is his youth on Asgard, as are his suicidal tendencies (people don’t tend to survive falling off the Bifrost, and he knew that when he threw himself off of it), plus infinite other facets of him. Of course, it was both necessary and more interesting for this series to be its own story rather than one which lingered on past films-- but that’s not to say that none of these plot points should have come back, at least subtly, to play a role in this story. Plot points exist to be brought back later, not completely ignored. Otherwise a story may as well be written about a completely original character.
If Disney+ and Marvel Studios' latest standalone effort 'Loki' continues the momentum of its first two episodes, we are in for a treat—and a show that defies genre and expectations.
