Have never watched the original of which “A Time Called You” is adapted from, so have no idea what is the difference between the versions in terms of characterisation/portrayal, but the way Min Ju is portrayed in the Korean version breaks my heart. Her character trajectory is understandable from the POV of a highly introverted, emotionally-intense, “anxious-depressive” and socially awkward girl who is trying to make her “dreams” come true vis-a-vis her long-time crush, ignoring the fact of imminent dangers forewarned.
It is tragic yet so realistic in its depiction of a young person’s - in her case in particular but of course issues which happen across ages - distorted outlook in life. Han Jun Hee is a confident, outgoing working professional in her 30s (her brighter personality notwithstanding, the life experiences between a teen and a woman in her 30s touched by grief is unimaginably large), and the contrast between an insecure teen and her is a wide gulf.
In a sense, I assume the age difference in the characters themselves between the Taiwanese and Korean versions would be noticeable in how the tone of the characters and narrative would be set. From a fan comment, I suppose the vibes/moods and portrayals between the versions differ, which is simply natural, and I would state, desirable. No point in making an exact copy of an already fantastic existing work (which is not really achievable either).
It is actually wonderful to be given different interpretations and portrayals of the same basic premise. It just means there is more to enjoy, and perhaps a/another favourite.
Jeon Yeo Been really performed both roles brilliantly, especially in the final last episodes. Both characters are easily recognizable from each other, and my heart just breaks for Min Ju and her misguided naivety and desperation. I took a peek of the finale and expect the ending would not be tragic, but I truly hope Min Ju gets her HE. She truly does deserve the world even if she did not feel she does.
Because by the end, I am much more invested in the “love story” between Min Ju and In Gyu than Jun Hee and Si Heon. 😅😆
Edit after completing the show: I enjoyed the ending but certainly wished we got a bit more updates on what happened to the characters, especially Min Ju and In Gyu. I suppose there is always headcanons.
So. due to having a long and fun talk about Baccano at MCM Manchester, I felt like rewatching the anime and OH BOY I forgot how the first episode goes, so I decided I might as well do (spoilery) commentary on here as I rewatch. Don’t expect anything written nicely or concisely, I do the numberwang, not the wordidoo.
This is the first 3 episodes and because I ramble like hell and I do reference the books, it’s a “Read More”. I apologize in advance, but “Short Form” has never been a thing I can manage. This is me essentially writing down what I say to myself while watching it.
I added the formatting later, but I want to keep the rambling as in tact as possible, partly out of laziness and partly out of interest in looking back later and seeing what was going through my head.
Episode 1
I forgot just how much time is spent with the discussion between (Christ me, you literally saw this half an hour ago, how have you already forgotten her name!?) *Carol* (Thanks Baccano wiki, and by extension most likely thanks Rev) and Gustav St Germain. Looking back after reading the books, I like the fact that they used the paper explosion scene and would have loved to see that reappear later had they continued the anime. That would’ve been a nice scene of the anime doing a foreshadow of a scene to come while not making it blatantly so, and that final context would’ve probably put an extra spin on things. (Oh boy, it’s really clear I can’t write short sentences…)
The scenes foreshadowing Book 6 (Was it? I lose track. Either way, the Mist Wall book.) really hurt me. I’d have loved to see Christopher, Adele, (Heck, ALL THE HOMUNCULI) and Maria, along with seeing Ronnie just be Ronnie and fuckin’ be extra as hell with the help of essentially Omnipotent powers.
The sequence initially showing Firo... Y'know, I remember this properly, but I have to say I prefer the book version? In the books, it’s before he becomes immortal and he avoids getting hit by the knife in the first place. I feel that while how this scene was rewritten means it’s good for revealing his immortality, the books help show that he is rather suspicious as a character, which works well considering his discomfort from the fact that even after becoming immortal he is careful due to the knowledge that there *is* a way to kill him. Then again, I’m not a literary master and the change probably works considering the more carefree Firo you see in the show.
I like the setup for the Flying Pussyfoot (even if I’m sad the stuff being called in doesn’t pay off due to them not using Vino in the 1932 arc that *should* be Drugs and Dominoes). What you know from the first episode is:
that the train’s been swapped out do to an “accident”
there’s an assassin on there,
there’s immortals on there,
there’s bombs on there,
a bunch of corpses and a murderous guy with no arm and a woman he’s talking of killing litter the tracks (On an off hand note, I thought that Ladd actually killed Lua there when I initially watched Baccano),
and that the people that are leaving the train are the thieves mentioned earlier (who if you pay attention are probably immortal),
the immortal child (Funny how early it’s revealed that Czes is immortal in comparison to the books),
and a group of people of which the middle one seems to be in great pain.
You also know of an unknown figure reading an unknown message about finding someone, but that’s rather late in the story.
Point is, you are swiftly shown a lot of information you probably won’t piece everything together from, but will help give you one specific idea: Something bad happened on the Flying Pussyfoot and that (probably) included the supernatural.
Episode 2
Okay, I’ll now be writing as things happen, so I might remember names this time! And before I start, let me say this at least once. “Hah! Flying Pussyfoot is a silly name!”
I like the fact they left in the couple where the woman just calls stuff in advance.
I have to say, I am love with Isaac and Miria’s logic. “If we mine, we’re stealing from the earth!”. Along with that, the story of them being shouted at for panning for gold in other people’s land is something I want to hear more about. I’m being reminded that I damn well wish I knew more about Japanese Mythology to be able to directly pinpoint where Isaac went wrong.
Oh, and the letter from Ennis. I like how this directly implies than Ennis is not actually human without going “SHE’S A HUMONCULUS, NOT HUMAN” and then quickly makes you forget about that by having I&M start talking about this clearly means she wants a brother, rather than there having been previous people before her who were destroyed before she was created.
(Oh shit, this is gonna get looooooooong, I haven’t got past the I&M scene yet). This is followed by perfectly showing what I&M are like, by having them figure out how do to a train robbery. i.e not how you actually do one. And then I&M go to the train station, move past the Lemures, and then as they talk about the “Orchestra”, the camera zooms in on Rachel. If only the Dub hadn’t specified Vino’s gender, people might’ve thought she was Vino, that’s how the books spun it anyway. And then we get to Claire, who starts talking before coming on screen and has a conversation with Tony just before Tony gets murdered. It would have been nice if the other conductor got a couple lines here, but this does set up Claire’s anger at Tony being dead later on nicely.
Meanwhile, best panicking wreck of a leader, Jacuzzi Splot, explains what his group are doing on the train, namely stealing something. Then the anime moves focus from Nice to Czes, nicely implying that their aims/jobs are related. I’ll stop listing what happens now, but OH JEEZ I LOVE THE CUTS AND PANS AND FOCUS CHANGES. I don’t know much about cinematography, but this feels good to me.
So to abridge a conversation: Nice: Why don’t you ask them? You might make some new friends. Jacuzzi: (Panics a bit) I don’t wanna. Nice then persuades Jacuzzi to go talk to Isaac and Miria. Not much meaning, but I just wanted to say, SAAAAAAME Jacuzzi. If not for @thingsarenotwholesome taking the place of Nice, I wouldn’t talk to a lot of people. but yeah, then Jacuzzi starts crying because he thinks he’s nothing but some delinquent. Props to I&M for supporting him in the only way they know: By being lovely, funny and acting ridiculously.
Some day Narita, I’d like to see how much of this is them faking it to avoid a bad topic and how much of it is their own joy in insanity. I just can’t accept “They’re a bit mad” with no other details, because even if Isaac routinely gets stuff wrong, he’s weirdly well read. I also love the fact that Jon and Fang spend their time calling out bullshit and commenting on what’s happening. It gives a nice contrast of the straight man, while not overpowering I&M and also properly showing what their influence on Jacuzzi is.
I like that the voice acting makes it clear that Czes struggled to say his own name. Clearly from the immortal thing. Good Dub there.
The Lemures in general feel much cultier than when I was reading the books. Perhaps because in the books the individual greed for immortality in the members is made clear before the operation starts, whereas this has them speak of their unwavering loyalty (yeah fucking right) to Huey Laforet, while the Conductor preaches about how this is all for the sake of freeing their “Glorious Leader”. Shame there’s a Claire on board.
Episode 3
And we start with poor Eve Genoard looking for Dallas, too bad some other poor person has him. [Edit Note: Look, you can’t expect me to remember every detail of the books perfectly, I barely remember what I had to eat most days]
I love the Daily Days and their information based business model. The Runorata Goons just got to experience information based capitalism.
Well, I might have to source the music playing while Lua and Ladd are dancing. This is also the first scene where Lua doesn’t seem to only be some poor girl who was forced into something by Ladd, but someone who actually wants to be with Ladd.
I love Randy and Pecho, those glove burning fools. I’m also starting to realise how damn good this show is at giving you information in off-hand comments. From their short conversation we know they’re friends with Firo and that there’ll be a party, while also starting the fire that kickstarts the events of the Rolling Bootlegs.
Similarly, the anime then goes on to show that Firo is joining the Camorra as a Capo and that I&M are in town at the time. This is also why I’m writing so much, BECAUSE THEY MAKE SUCH GOOD USE OF THE TIME GIVEN. This reminds me though. Narratively, in the books, the hobo attempting to stab Firo happens just before the hat shop. I damn well wish we could properly place that scene somewhere chronologically in the show. It could literally any time still during the depression after Firo becomes immortal.
The fight between Firo and Dallas' Gang really does show the fighting talent Firo has in an impressive way, which again makes Firo getting cut in episode 1 more frustrating.
And here is the first big change to Rolling Bootlegs! Firo does not have the time nor the bottles to swap about his wine with the immortality potion for the heck of it. I'm not sure how I feel about this change, but I will commend the 2016 Manga for keeping to the books on this.
And then Jacuzzi finds the two corpses in the Conductors Wagon, which is surprising when you’re first watching considering we *know* the murderous conductor was using a gun, not sawing off people's faces.(Goddammit it Claire, kill cleaner) You could explain the second corpse as being the white suit we see get the uniform in the second episode, but if you’re looking at the corpses, the body with the face torn off is the one that looks like the Young Conductor, not the Lemure Conductor. This isn’t exactly important considering it’s revealed later, but i like that the detail can be seen. Hey, this anime is doing a better job at the Mystery genre than BBC’s Sherlock!
And at the end, with the faceoff in the Dinner Wagon, I'm calling it a night.
Well, I'll be posting this in the morning evening after as I'll be doing some formatting at my PC tomorrow, but it's midnight and I'm rather tired after MCM Manchester.
I'll start off by saying I've never played the Last of Us games. I've never watched the show, either. I do have some remote curiosity because of Pedro Pascal, which is how I came upon a Polygon article critical of S2.
The writer of the article was very mad about the second season and its portrayal of Ellie, the protagonist. Patricia Hernandez felt that show!Ellie was an entirely different animal from game!Ellie and that while some reinterpretation is expected and even welcome, the way the show went about things undermined the meaning of the character.
That seems like a pretty standard refrain any time one medium makes a jump to another. Book to movie, comic to TV, even animation to live action. The translation often can't be 1:1 and the core audience of the original medium is going to be very critical of any changes made. I've certainly been annoyed, myself. However, there have also been times where I saw, say, a movie based on a comic book I haven't read and enjoyed the movie while the fans of the comic felt betrayed by the changes made. It's a fine line to walk, especially when the Money Men are insisting that changes be made in order to appeal to a wider audience and/or to avoid certain "politics."
According to Ms. Hernandez, a big part of her grievance is that in S2 the show made Ellie a less competent and more impulsive character, which is a stark contrast to what she saw in the game. Show!Ellie is more of a detriment to those around her rather than being the efficient killing machine she was in the games.
Speaking as an outsider I can say that yeah, if that's an accurate interpretation, I'd be mad, too. It would also speak to an ongoing issue in Hollywood that basically boils down to misogyny. Gotta downplay the "badass" aspect of the ladies in order to make them more "appealing" to men. Or at least men who are easily threatened by women being competent and terrifying.
There's one thing that stuck out for me in the article. Craig Mazin, the co-creator, writer, and exec producer of the show said of a particular scene that a physical struggle "wouldn't go well" because the male character Ellie is fighting is significantly taller than she is. He also says that her taking on two (bigger) opponents at one would be "unrealistic."
Yeah, because having a young woman be an efficient killer in a show full of WALKING CORPSES stretches the imagination too far. Also, may not know self-defense (I wish I did), but I do know that implying Ellie couldn't take someone down just because they're taller is bullshit. Learning to fight against a taller/larger opponent is one of the core things they teach. There's a whole subgenre about Tiny Powerhouses overcoming bigger foes. Saying that [short character] wouldn't be able to take down [tall character] is frankly a bit insulting, especially when the shorter character is a woman.
Let's look at Luke Skywalker for a minute. In the OT era he's frequently considered to be a thin wisp of nothing, just going on physical appearance. But that doesn't make him powerless.
In particular there's a scene in Mandalorian S1 where Luke shows up and carves his way through a corridor full of large hulking killing machines. He barely even breaks a sweat. And sure, you can excuse it as "laser sword" and "the Force," but those are just excuses. When Ms. Hernandez mentioned Ellie being "basically an assassin" in the games and that Joel (her father figure) "was the type of man who could mow down an entire hospital full of soldiers, even after starting that chapter of the game unarmed" that's where my mind went: Luke vs. the Death Troopers.
Of course you don't need to bring Luke into things: if Ellie was able to accomplish feats in the game she should still be able to accomplish them in a show. Why, then, is it suddenly considered "unrealistic?" What aspect makes it acceptable in a game but not a tv show? I know the real answer, of course, but I'd like to know what, specifically, Mazin meant by that, and if it's something he actually believes or if it was enforced by the Money Men. TBH I wouldn't be surprised if it was "both."
Need another example of men being allowed to do things that women aren't? Tom Cruise. Famously short. Famously an action powerhouse. His character in Mission Impossible is, AFAIK, Just a Man, and yet he's somehow capable of performing superhuman feats of dexterity and strength. Imagine if the producers decided that nah, Ethan Hunt wouldn't be able to jump between two airplanes without dying, or do a motorcycle HALO jump, or scale a glass building, or any of the rest of it. Imagine if action movies in general were expected to be "realistic."
Making Ellie less effective at killing seems less like "the translation from the game wouldn't physically work in reality without a lot of expensive equipment" and more like "females aren't strong enough to do that and even if they were, men in the audience wouldn't like it."
There's also apparently a lot of stuff about pregnancy and family which is just. Exhausting. Sure, women can be badass and still want family, but in my experience when Hollywood gets involved it becomes less about trying to strike a balance between the two concepts and more about trying to "soften" the hard edges of tough women in the only way they think exists: babies. Because ALL women eventually dream of being a mommy, unless there's something wrong with them. /sarcasm
From the sound of the article, TLOU is just another example of Hollywood's misogyny problem, which is really society's problem. There's every chance that the article is unfairly biased (it is an opinion piece after all), but it doesn't change that this shit is happening all over the place. Even if it was biased, though, a lot of fans in the replies on Blusky seemed to agree with Ms. Hernandez's take.
The funny thing is that I've gotten this far and haven't even mentioned the the comment Pedro Pascal made that started me on this soapbox.
Neil Druckman, who helps produce the show and also created the original game, was trying to give some direction to Pascal and an apparently frustrated Pascal asked him, "do you like art?"
A lot of people in the comments cheered at Pascal for saying this, but one person took umbrage, pointing out the hubris of questioning the guy who created your character.
This is a huge and sprawling topic on its own, but for me what I think it boils down to is that both the writer and the actor should have some say in a character's depiction. The writer may have final authority, but if an actor comes to them and says, "I don't think my character would say/do this," then a writer should step back to think about it. Writers create characters, but actors are the ones who breathe life into the words. Sometimes a writer will indeed get things wrong. Sometimes the actor will. You have to work together to find a way forward. And of course, it isn't always about what's best/most true for a character, it's about what fits in the time, budget, politics, etc.
Without knowing any context it's hard to say if Pascal was out of line, but I don't think that actors, in general, should simply accept everything handed to them without question. If something seems off, they should feel comfortable asking about it. The creative process isn't linear and isn't controlled by a single entity. At least not in cases like this.
If you haven't read chapter 14 of The Lost and the Caged... what are you waiting for godoitnow. Then and only then may you come back and listen to my half-coherent ramblings about it. :D
(Just my rambling- feel free to ignore it if you wish! This is just for anyone who wants my personal thoughts on the chapter/a bit of behind-the-scenes...)
I did the commentary as an audio this time! Do you guys prefer this or the textual commentaries?
(I think that I ramble even more in audio than text......)
One of my favorite things about this ordeal are the voicemails people leave.
I'm paraphrasing of course:
"Hey Steve, it's 4:30am and I'm outside your house."
Hey rando, it's 4:30am and you're outside of a house....how long until Steve showed up to meet you?
Hey, what are you even doing at 4:30am? What is going on? What happens before the sun rises?
Hey, when Steve didn't answer and you were waiting so long, did you throw pebbles at his window until he opened it? That would have been cute.
Hey, when Steve did show up were you like, "didn't you get my message?" and Steve was all like, "no...you called?" and you were like, "totes my goats, i called! left a message" and steve was like, "huh, that's weird...wonder what happened to my phone?" That didn't happen? Color me disappointed.
"Hey Steve, I texted you earlier....call me back."
Hey you, isn't it like super weird that every time you text him you get a reply but when you call Steve he never answers.
Hey, isn't it weird that if someone does answer the call, it's a female who is decidedly not Steve Maroney.
Hey, couldn't there be a mixup?
"Hey Steve, just wanna touch bases with you."
Hey, touch bases? What does that mean? How many bases does Steve have?
Hey, are these the "bases"...like tell me more? Did you get very far?
Hey, does touch bases mean you have a really long list to go over and you just want Steve to be prepared to have a lengthy conversation?
