Character analysis (or at least my vision on him, if you believe my reasoning)
What do we know about Spy? He's a disguise mastermind. He can pretend to be anyone in order to infiltrate into the scene to do his job - quite literally, stab people on the back. But when he's not in the battle, what is he to his teammates? A suave Frenchman, a gentleman with taste, somewhat a leader.
At least, that's the persona he prefers to show. But is he really..?
What if I tell you that this person never drops his disguise?
For a man who always wears a mask and who's identity being secret is a sacred part of his role in this job, isn't this persona too much to show if it is real? Frenchman, rich, ladykiller... Wouldn't it be too easy to decipher his identity with so much clues provided? Wouldn't it be dangerous?
While Miss Pauling and the Administrator definitely know Spy's real identity, hiding it is a major thing for whatever reason. One could assume it might be because of Scout (obvious guess) but I doubt he's a sole reason. Spy very much enjoys being the Spy all by himself. Do what's the deal?
Let's start from the beginning.
Why did Spy join Mann Co. in the first place?
Let's take this assumption as a fact: people come here out of desperation. They are professionals in their field, yet in their past/casual life there is a pattern of them having difficulties that push them into joining this service. I don't see why Spy would be an exception.
The reason for joining is usually money. Some people question why Spy, a wealthy man from higher society, would join Mann Co. if he has it all already.
Well, probably because he really does not.
Have you ever met an aristocrat? Wealthy people don't get so protective about their expensive suits, they can afford cleaning or a new one. Regardless, rich people don't usually get stingy about material goods, especially if they're mass produced.
At least, not those who were born into wealth.
Spy's defensiveness about his "wealthy stuff", his pomp-ness, disgust and arrogance towards "plebs" gives off a man who knows what it means to live in poverty and who doesn't want to be associated with it ever again.
(Not even talking about his own filthy habits such as not washing his mask and pissing on walls? Jesus Christ)
Dare I even guess that he might be not French at all? His French is so broken. (Although, so is Medic's German, but at least he uses his language much more frequently and in more complex sentences, while Spy only uses French to say some basic expressions, occasionally confusing them with other languages). Definitely not a native.
If anything, he's not giving "rich man" at all, he's giving con man. And that fits my picture perfectly.
So, poor upbringing. How old is Spy? If he's Scout's father (and he was young when he was conceived), I'd say he's no less than 20 years older than him. I'd give him a few more years actually. So, approximately Spy is around 50 at the events of the game (1968-1972). Let's assume he was born somewhere in the 1910s.
Even if he's not French, I still agree that he's probably European. Hmm, what was happening in Europe at the time Spy was a kid?
Oh yeah. The Great Depression.
See my picture: imagine, a child from a lower class family during the Great Depression, his parents were most likely to not take good care about him (both because of the economical situation AND as an echo to Spy's struggles with his own fatherhood). He has to run away from home early and start to make money. Any way possible.
Unavoidably, it leads to crime.
Petty theft, blackmail, scams. Changing identities. Selling low quality products and services. Changing identities again. When older, seducing rich women to stay at their homes overnight, be fed and supported. Running away from the police. Walking into a trap of the mafia, and then joining them as their goon.
In this nightmare of a life he just had to keep pretending to be someone else, someone better and stronger, in order to his ego to not completely shutter. He had to imagine he was an invincible mastermind trickster of some sort, not just a poor boo-hoo victim of poverty who has never knew normal life and care.
And if you pretend for long enough, you become your role eventually... Right?
His true self was long lost forgotten under many layers of new identities. Worse, his true self was never known. And he didn't want it to be known in its ugly and disgusting vulnerability. Narcissism became his lifeline.
It's so much better to be Spy. To be rich and elegant and respected. His ego rebuilt.
She's a character we know extremely little about, however when you stop to consider the IMPLICATIONS of what little we DO know, things start to get interesting:
1. She lives in the roughest part of Boston ("if you were from where I was from, you'd be dead") but dresses quite elegantly.
2. She had 8 boys, all of whom she raised BY HERSELF, and yet somehow she finds the time to maintain this impeccable appearance.
3. Scout clearly loves and admires her to a point where it's one of the few things he'll drop his "tough guy" act for, and dialogue in the comics like "Ma's gonna kill me if she finds out" implies he also still fears her disapproval, despite being a fully autonomous adult.
4. Spy, despite what he likes to pretend, is clearly head-over-heels for her. He even had her likeness engraved on his fanciest gun! (Note the distinct hairband & hoop earrings) For a man who avoids attachment to the point where he never lets anyone see his face, that's an unusual degree of infatuation.
5. None of Scout's brothers left Boston while he was growing up, despite a few of them presumably being adults by then. Not only this, they were still all getting into fights together, implying they were both continuing to live with or near their mother and brothers, AND had reasons to brawl with others beyond just some adolescent street scuffle.
My Theory:
Scout's Ma is the matriarch of a Boston-based crime family.
It explains her elegant appearance, how she and Spy were able to meet, why their bond clearly goes beyond a one-off fling, why she was able to be in Scout's life so much despite the financial burdens of being a single mother of 8, and why all of said 8 were continuing to get into fights with other locals. They weren't just some street gang, they were enforcers. It also explains why/how Scout got into mercenary work, his many mafia-themed weapons, and why he continues to fear her ire even as an adult.
Plus, take a look at this unused angle of the last photo from Meet The Spy:
You'd THINK a single mother from the rough side of Boston wouldn't appear so in-her-element on a fancy date with The Spy, and yet her appearance and demeanour here just SCREAM "confident and in control."
Scout's Ma is Boston's Godmother, and I desperately wish to see someone draw her as such.
My own personal favorite answer to the still-unanswered question of 'why the hell are there two 'Team Fortress' both populated with seemingly identical people living seemingly identical lives' is still probably the idea that the Administrator hired 9 mercenaries and then cloned them to fill out both the RED and BLU team.
Like, yeah, I fully admit that it raises a few of it's own unanswered questions (For how long did that cloning technology exist? Did Team Fortress Classic went through the same procedure? What happened to the extra 4.5 mercenaries of each team once Mann vs. Machine and the Comics era happen? Did the Administrator just had them disposed while Gray Mann was on the move for the sake of protecting yet another one of her secrets?) but I also feel like it ties very well thematically with the point of the Administrator's scheme in "The Days Have Worn Away". The most vital part of her revenge is making sure RED and BLU are forever evenly-matched, and that's important enough that she will invest in secret cloning technology and however much shenanigans it takes to ensure neither the mercs nor any of their loved ones realize there's two of each of them running around for the sake of the teams being truly identical.
Also, yeah, it does mean that, like, either the Mercenaries had some sort of Dramatic Clone Reveal that happened totally off-screen at some point during the MvM or Comic-Era and we the readers just totally missed it (Even if all of the Comic-Era Mercs are the originals, realizing that you've spent years of your life fighting your own clone and that they've been also living 50% of your time off with your family is pretty fucked-up) .... or that the Mercs just went on living their lives and never put the pieces together there was some Secret Clone Scheme in the first place...
...But honestly, I think both the idea of Team Fortress never figuring out about the clones, and the idea of Team Fortress figuring it out but getting over it so comically quickly it never comes up again in their misadventures feel so very hilariously in-character for me that I count it as a point in favor of the theory in a way.
Y'know, the idea of the Administrator secretly running both teams was also originally framed as a Mind-Blowing Secret That She Must Keep Secret from the Mercs
And by the end of the comics, the Team either straight up never came to the realization that their old 'enemies' were working for the same employer.... or the realized it at some point during the MvM/Comic Era but it mattered so little to them it never came up on-screen.
And also, I think it's kinda hilarious to think about the concept of like, Merasmus being roommates with the RED Solider
Until he probably got of tired of his shit off-screen and moved to a new apartment............. only to end up with the BLU Solider
And then he moved again.............................. only to find himself with the RED Solider again
I am pretty sure Merasmus is the only person in the TF2 Universe outside of the Administrator and Pauling to know there are two of each Mercenary running around. But he's not bothered by the ethical or philosophical implications of this clone scheme, he is just eternally tormented by the existence of Double Solider.
I love dates in the tf2 lore. I love knowing exactly when stuff happened. Which makes THIS THING I JUST FOUND a BEAUTIFUL MIRACLE
You've seen this image before, but have you noticed the dates on the prison card thingies? Presumably this is written the American Way (the writers are so american they make Scout and Sniper both call their mothers "mom" despite preferring "ma" and "mum" respectively, as shown previously SEVERal times), so Spy and Scout were arrested on
The 7th of September, 1972.
We can do a lot with this information.
Mann Co was taken over by Grey and Olivia half a month before this: roughly the 23rd of August
Contrary to popular belief, most of the comics have to take place in 1973! Seeing as 6 months after late August is late February.
This also means Scout had to have been born in 1946/7. Not sure about Sniper, I have yet to overanalyse the New Zealand timeline paragraph. I'll get to it eventually.
Medic implies in comic 6 that our mercs have worked together for "at least eight years", while talking about the lore breaking Demo eyeball halloween thing. Assuming the "at least" confusion is over the 1972 Halloween they missed while not working together, the Teufort Nine were hired in 1964.
(I've almost mentally rationalised the lore breaking eyeball as a thing they do at like 4am after regular Scream Fortress shenanigans. Almost.)
Scout claims he has known Ms Pauling for six years. During the War! update, Demoman is unfamiliar with Ms Pauling (he knows she works for the administrator, but thats it), so we can assume that is the point she started working more closely with the mercs, and also 1966/7
I really need to go back to actively working on my timeline instead of passively wondering at 11pm "hey what time of year is it in the comics" and going down a rabbit hole.
Uh if you want to build off this, feel free to, but tell society twas I, the great and nobel Jevil_Owo, who first conceptualised all this.
UPDATE! This post seems to be picking up reblog steam again, so now is a good time to say I was WRONG about the mercs being hired around 1964.
This blog post from 2009 claims the WAR update took place in 1962, meaning the mercs have to have been hired in early 1962 at the latest.
Seeing as Scout would have been 15/16 in 1962, and as that's kind of the youngest one can be hired for just about anything, I'd assume it actually is 1962 they were hired. Ok thats enough I just felt it was my duty as Person Timelining to update people on this Discovery.
SECOND UPDATE!!
Okay this is lowkey blowing up again and I just wanted to add that Valve themselves are not aware of the comics taking place in 1973. Idiots! This is why "7 years later" is 1979 instead of 1980 like it should be. Sigh.
I had already figured that out from a few other things (see the timeline in my pinned post, I point it out a couple of times), but this solidified it lmao.
To be honest, when Issue 7 first came out I mostly was just shocked and glazed on every small detail it was popping out like cool beautiful shots or unmasked spy or family... It was kind of scary to go back because one of my feelings was frustration that they made a "the part comes out 7 years later bc there's a 7 years time skip IN COMIC" thing. So anyway
A few things to say,
This mansion is not in Australia (tf2 universe). This is PROBABLY in the close area to Tuefort. Australia in period 1850 to 1890 already looked futuristic.
I have questions like
In first image there's already a "mercenaries welcome" sign. The whole fighting ALWAYS was in Tuefort. AND they started hiring JUST BEFORE Zepheniah Mann died. And they were hired with help of the administrator, obviously. Which baffles me a little, why would she continue providing these two materials and men to fight?
Sidenote! Zepheniah Mann also died 40 years ago. Can death of Z. Mann and Australians' magnificent life be connected? As if Hale's family provides more australium to people?
End of sidenote.
She doesn't YET knows about australium's ability to give life...
Or does she?
What I think is interesting
The australium isn't raw. It's in bullion, not ores. And stacked and hidden to herself.
She KNEW the australium can do more. She KNEW there's a way to,, live some more? She probably seen how it affects Australians these past 40 years.
But what else? The Gray Fuck Mann. The Gray "let me pour australium in veins" Mann. Wasn't eaten by eagles. From whom admin got the idea of prolonging life. And looks barely 20, probably been pouring australium in every day,,
But my own problem is I don't understand when it happened. From 1850 to 1890 Helen BARELY changes.
And why it can be doubtful - Helen's grey hair. It's comes and goes around the same time Z. Mann dies.
And what I think? Gray's visit is probably happened around the same time Radigan was invited to work for BLU.
It would be really convenient for plot if Radigan and Gray worked together, DID build a machine that can prolonge life, but Gray knew it's actually the australium that gives life and he ran away with it. That would explain why Radigan agreed to work for BLU and later agreed to build more such machines. He got a chance to work with australium. Or work for Helen? Who can provide with all needs, including australium? Especially australium.
Would he build same machine for her? Would she keep Conaghers working for her specifically? When they know how to build these machines?
The moment Blutarch handed over Radigan's blueprints, Engineer knew he will make the same for the administrator. He wasn't scared of Blutarch and he wasn't disloyal, he just had an employer above Blutarch.
I remember people saying Engineer was free once Pauling let Helen die. And yes,,, but he could've "become free" a little before that, if Blutarch didn't get Radigan's blueprints.
TF2 Backstab Models and What They Mean for the Mercs
In my travels in the TF2 meta, I've noticed that when using an Australium or ice themed weapon, such as the Spy-cicle, each Merc has a few different models for their "frozen backstab" pose. I thought this was interesting and decided to take it upon myself to document the different models and extrapolate what that might mean for each merc as a character. Keep in mind the "canon" of TF2 and the characterization of the mercs is very much up to interpretation but I think this can give us some insight at least into what Valve thinks of each character and how they react to injury, particularly the backstab.
Let's get into it.
SCOUT
Scout with his quicker speed assumedly has a faster reaction time compared to a lot of the other mercs, so it tracks that in many of his poses he is almost completely turned around/facing back. I don't think he necessarily expects to be back stabbed but his fast reflexes makes it so that he is one of the mercs who is closer to actually catching the Spy before the stab. Clearly he isn't always fast enough if he gets stabbed though. On a side note I personally find his poses to be some of the most unnerving ones.
SOLDIER
Clearly Soldier's slow speed catches up with him when it comes to backstabs. Being one of the slower classes in the game, and one of the more burly/stocky characters, it makes sense that he would have trouble catching a Spy before a stab. In a few poses you can see that he reaches behind himself, but you never see him trying to turn his torso or head around to catch his attacker. It's also interesting to note how he reaches to his lower back, either because of how he holds his rocket launcher on his shoulder, or because of his lack of physical flexibility,
PYRO
Pyro's poses are all rather similar, so I don't find that I have much to say about them. Given what little we do know of Pyro, it's reasonable to assume that they probably don't notice Spy's through their pyro-vision very well, so it would make sense that they wouldn't be prepared for a backstab. They also don't need a particularly fast reaction time for their weapon/attack style so they don't show the same reflexes as Scout or Demo. Pyro just be silly with their pose.
DEMOMAN
Demo is very dramatic to say the least. I find it very interesting how he seems to be very close to actually grabbing the knife/Spy relative to some of the other mercs like Solly, Medic, or Pyro. This supports my personal theory that Demo plays up his drunkenness on the battle field/in general. He clearly has a good degree of flexibility as well looking at the curve of his spine, and a reasonable amount of balance shown by his repeated "one toe on the ground" style stance.
HEAVY
Unfortunately I wasn't able to get many screencaps of Heavy, but all his poses are essentially this with little variance. He is probably one of the least flexible out of all the mercs, which makes sense given his body type and how built up his shoulder/back muscles must be from carrying a 300 lbs gun around all the time every day. You can see that he probably doesn't expect a backstab and has a slower reaction time than others, which is in line with his in game movement speed.
ENGINEER
This man really just always be on his knees. I would assume that this is due to the fact that most of the time you would see an Engie crouching behind a sentry or dispenser, in game and in the character sense. It also reinforces Valve's mocking of his VERY NORMAL AND AVERAGE height. I also like to think Spy kicks his knees out from behind as he stabs. The models also tend to have effed up hands for Engie for some reason which I find very funny. Arguably his right hand tends to be the more messed up one, which is also his mechanical hand/Gunslinger. Food for thought, perhaps a mechanical malfunction/short when he dies?
MEDIC
Medic's poses are all very similar as well unfortunately. What stands out to me the most is how INCREDIBLY TALL Medic is compared to all the other mercs. You can see that he also doesn't work to turn around or even reach behind him to any large degree, which I think shows how unexpected a backstab is for Medic. He's usually busy chasing some screaming Scout or hiding behind a corner to pocket a Heavy so it would make sense he wouldn't expect a backstab as he usually has some power class with him to protect him. We stand with our Medic's though, no hate only love. Stay strong Medic army.
SNIPER
Sniper is the most interesting to examine for me, as he and Spy tend to have a rivalry in every sense, from the Spy v. Sniper update/event released by Valve way back when, to in game play, to in the comics/canon media we have of the mercs. It's clear he is the most prepared for a back stab most of the time, and arguably the closest to actually stopping Spy. I think he generally has an average reaction time if the in game movement speed is anything to go off of, but the fact he is so close to stopping the attack just shows how used to the backstab he is. He also has a higher degree of flexibility on par with Scout and Demo.
SPY
And finally, we come to the man of the hour. The tl;dr is he's a drama queen who's holier than thou attitude and cockiness causes him to not expect or prepare for another Spy's backstab, which ends up being his ultimate downfall. The long version of it is that he is a drama queen who's holier than thou attitude and cockiness causes him to not expect or prepare for another Spy's backstab, which makes him a little bitch boy who's pride gets hurt more than the actual pain of the stab. All of his poses are pretty similar, showing he has a good amount of flexibility but a piss poor reaction speed if he's able to get beat at his own game.
ANYWAY, if you've made it this far in the post thank you very much for reading it all and indulging my TF2 brain rot. I have no idea if any of this deeper reading was intended by the devs or Valve, but I think it's interesting to explore what little we get in regards to any hints about the mercs as characters and what they might be like on and off the battle field in a story sense. Would love to have more discussion in the comments and if anyone has any other niche requests for me to overanalyze TF2 game play/lore please let me know and I'm sure I will find more than expected to talk about.
Ok, so... I didn't saw that anyone talked about it, so i'll share with you my theory
Ahem...
FRED IS NOT ENGINEER'S FATHER
Now, that i've caught your attention, let me explain everything
So, as we know, our tf2 Engie, Dell Conagher, are grandson of Radigan Conagher.
Radigan was involved if not into the gravel war itself, but in systems behind it. Yes, we're talking about immortality machine here, which is working on Australium, which was provided to Radigan by Administrator.
So, Dell's grandad was working with australium and he should know how this thing works, right?
And we also know that Dell's father is Team Fortress Classic Engineer, due to this photo from Engie update
(I didn't saw a proper confirmation to this tho, but everyone knows it, so maybe it's just me missing something...)
And now here's the thing. Dell's family has been working for Admin for who-knows-how-long, so his father should too, and he should know about Australium, what and how it works too.
Now, in this part we introduced to the Classic team.
They all looked really different from their apperances in the "Catch-up" comic.
Ok, you might say that it was a long time ago and they could just change through time, which is.. ok, but listen! Here things getting really interesting
When C!Heavy asked Fred (Presumably the original classic Engineer, aka Dell's father) to figure out and make more immortality machines, what does Fred says?
EXACTLY! He has NO IDEA what this thing is and how to work with it. I'm gonna remind you, that Conaghers are working for admin for a really long time and each of them should know how to deal with her model of immortality machine, to keep her alive.
(She even says "your FAMILY")
It means that Fred, if he really was the Conagher, he should've known how to deal with all this stuff!
And with all these things said and shown I think this theory is got a chance to live
Unless Valve actually intended for Fred Conagher to be the real thing, but forgot about the details and accidentally created another plot hole. However, I still really want to believe that this was all planned and that Fred really is just another engineer, and Dell's father is just some other unnamed Conagher
WHAT IF the reason for "australia in 1890" + TFC looking more 'modern' is because the atomic bomb had a much larger impact for some reason so in like 1945 everybody was blasted back a couple years, so tech regressed enough that technology had to re-evolve a little...
Also that advancement is all due to australium... so much of which had likely been pilfered by that point that tech could not reach that level again so quickly in its absence. [Which those who, not naming names, possessed the australium took full advantage of that for sure.]
^^^ Takes place in 1930 and they look like *that* [I know it's bc Team Fortress lore was a make-it-up-as-we-go situation but shhhh let me cope and overrationalize]
Anyways the details of what went down in 1945?? no idea. Maybe more countries developed nuclear weapons at this time? maybe they mixed australium and the atomic bomb and that went real pear-shaped? I like that idea actually... it kind of goes with my Respawn Machine ideas where they used australium originally to make it work, but started losing access as it kept getting stockpiled/used up so the machine catastrophically failed and they had to remake it from the ground up with nuclear energy instead... (Part of it is I think australium doesn't play nice with other such substances)
