Hi! I had a question about what Mollis and Virago covered cuz the wording in their respective carrds confused me a bit.
So Virago is masc women 4 fem men, and fem women 4 fem men, and Masc women for masc, that's masc men 4 masc women and butch4butch woman correct?
And Similarly Mollis is fem men4 masc women, and fem men for fems ( so fem men 4 fem men and the fem men 4 fem woman), does it also include masc men 4 masc woman?
I know this is probably silly but i wanted to make sure i was understanding the terms correctly,
Yes!
But just so we're clear:
HetGNC, Virago and Mollis operate as both/either a gender status and sexuality depending if you're GNC or GC. (GC being Feminine Woman, Masculine Man)
So being a Masculine Mollis would mean you only perfer Masculine people/Masculine Men. Being a Feminine Virago, you'd only perfer Feminine people/Femnine Men.
If you're GNC, it's basically Mollis4Mollis (FemManxFemMan), Virago4Virago (MascWomXMascWom), and Mollis4Virago (MascWomXFemMan).
After some thought, I'll be taking a break from receiving additonal asks for my mental health. If you have any questions, refer to the #faq tag or direct message this blog.
I'm a GC bi girl, only attracted to GNC women and GC men. Am I Virago?
No.
Now I know that may sound crazy since there's room for GC women to like feminine men. That's particularly because it focuses on same allinity attraction away from traditional dynamics of MascxFem. Same for GC Mollis. This label focuses highly on the unique experiences of GNC sexuality and dynamics.
We'd also like to say to refrain for calling virago/mollis and hetgnc people mogai or 'contradictory' because of the same reason the other anon said: we're onky thought of in theory, despite us existing. I'm glad for our framework and I'd love for people to use what we've built for ourselves other than 500 mogai groups trying to speak for us (not you, just in general). I thank @viragoposting for actually taking time to think critically about GNC political theory. Thank you for your support so far!
Yeah I think I had accidentally added the ‘contradictory labels’ tag on the last reblog since it’s set as like a ‘default’ tag for this blog 😅
I’ll be more careful in the future!
Just to make sure and not to offend anyone;
Would discrimination towards hetgnc people be considered anti subtliden? I would personally consider it towards gnc people as a whole to be (since people consider gnc individuals to be ‘contradictory’) but I just want to make sure!
Also yes! I have come across @/viragoposting by looking through the tags! It seems like a really nice blog!
Hi! I talk about things sometimes, and I'm just slowly getting used to being talked about this way, haha. I think what you're doing here is pretty sweet!
Currently, we've been working out specific definitions of our own groups of people, and working outwards to expand greater understanding of GNC people overall. So... not yet.
Discrimination against GNC people so far has been called GNCphobia for ease of communication. Now, we also have Gynarchophobia (masc/gnc women) and Cuphobia (masc/gnc men).
I think the previous anon touched on how many blogs similar to yours attempted to coin terms for communities they spend little time curating/caring for. We have many contenders with definitions that don't match lived experiences or propose decent sociopolitical analysis, Which is why you see us hesitant to adopt a certain way of thinking or external label.
We're a building, diverse set of people and I love how discussions have matched our variety.
im sorry that acknowledging this issue doesnt help you, that still doesnt mean its no help to others
and anyway, studies have shown that gender nonconforming people are treated differently than trans people, based on their identity. if the same person claims to be a gc trans person or a gnc cis person, queerphobes will go out of their way to misgender them in either direction
Subscription and open access journals from Sage, the world's leading independent academic publisher.
if a gc trans person claims to be their real gender, theyre intentionally misgendered as an insult. if a gnc cis person claims to be their agab, theyre intentionally misgendered as an insult. trans gnc people get misgendered regularly by both the lgbt and the gc/cishet communities regardless
its almost like these are two different groups that can overlap. both are treated in shitty ways, and claiming that the discrimination gnc people experience is just misdirected homophobia/transphobia is still denying its existence and protecting it from criticism
to deny gncphobia is also claiming that gnc trans people arent oppressed "because theyre following the gender roles assigned to them at birth", which is ridiculous as well, because a)
- every gnc trans person i know grew up presenting as a gnc cis person (ie tomboys that grew into fem trans men and femboys that grew into butch trans women)
and b)
- even trans gnc people that never changed their presentation still spent most of their life being misgendered
gnc people of all kinds face oppression that is connected to but not the same as transphobia or homophobia. gnc cis people have distinct experiences that gc cis people dont have, and gnc trans people have distinct experiences that passing/gc trans people dont have, and so on. this is not a microlabel, this is a massive issue that effects a wide array of people and shouldnt be discounted or overlooked
please learn about intersectionality and do not tag things as virago if you do not support gnc rights
Gnc Trans man here. What Finnu is saying is not only right, but is exactly what we as GNC-trans people have been trying to stop GC Trans people from saying about us. If you want a GNC-Trans voice, it's all here.
Not all trans people are GNC, and we face significant targetting in and out of out community for Gender Non Conformity and being Trans. Check my page if you want a taste of screenshots, asks, and personal experiences backing that up.
Saying "we're all genderfreaks" is vastly simplifying a broader issue GNC Trans people face that GC Trans people do not. It's actual marginalization caused by how people think. What causes people to think this way is lack of knowledge, terminology, or being educated on our specific experiences as being both GNC Trans. To call our lived experience manifested as language "microlabeling" is missing the point of our community being a pillar for GNC people as a class, I exist as a intersection of being both GNC and Trans. Calling all trans persons "GNC" simply for the act of changing their gender disregards my existence as a feminine man who happens to be trans.
We still transiton. We still take horomones. We still need the same rights. Yet, within our communities we have to fight for our respect. Why? We have to fight hard to prove our own existence to people who should understand us. Why? We have to explain the concept of an androgynous person, masculine women, feminine men as GNC, but Trans-GNCs are all of a sudden 'detrans' 'pooners' 'hefabs' Why? Why are we treated so differently when "we're all genderfucks" ?
It's no secret that Trans GNC people are the main target when the community shakes.
Any idea what Molline Virago & Viragine Mollis are? Saw it pop up under the virago and mollis tags posted by liomogai but an unsure what they mean?
I've been getting asks and proposals about the combination of the two terms for a bit now. Whatever they coined is unrelated to me, and there's no community I know of with a definition posted.
Gc people by sheer numbers aren't attracted to gnc people. This applies to straight people especially, since their "desires" is often a fantasy for corrective action against our allinity, not the actual being.
Kind of why hetgnc is it's own queer sexuality. Only straight by technicallity rather than traditional practice.
I'm not claiming that there's no queer discourse in my country or anywhere else, but why does it seem like most chronically online and hateful exclusionism comes from USAmericans? (Specially white queer people?) Specially in the "fight" between trans women and trans men, it seems to be mainly in the US? (My perception could be totally wrong; but at least in other countries, specially those with worse conditions for queer people, they seem to be less focused on ridiculous discourse and be more united)
Pray tell how a gnc man has more privilege than a trans woman? Let's take the most extreme case where they look exactly the same.
The answer is simple: The discrimination ensuing for the simple fact of being trans. Trans women have always existed, so have GNC men. Yet and still, only one recieves hate from all cis people because of deviating from associating class structure assigned to them.
For those taking this out of context, this is comparative. There's differing (yet similar) consequences for being Cis GNC, vs Trans and GNC. Once again, this doesn't mean society hates one group more. It's to drive the point home that trans people as a whole are often unsafe in established cis-dominant GNC spaces.
Pray tell how a gnc man has more privilege than a trans woman? Let's take the most extreme case where they look exactly the same.
The answer is simple: The discrimination ensuing for the simple fact of being trans. Trans women have always existed, so have GNC men. Yet and still, only one recieves hate from all cis people because of deviating from associating class structure assigned to them, including GNC men who use transphobia as a tool to lighten bigotry they face.
prguitarman
blakekathryn
ellievsbear
tangentwithtanner
romaincrisis
kianamaiart
yousharknotpass
gummygunk
