since we’re bound to be something by @aflashofgreen
Jon/Sansa (ASoIaF/GoT), one-shot, future fic, love confessions, marriage proposal
They embrace with both their joy and their grief. This is the way it was meant.

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@aflashofgreen
since we’re bound to be something by @aflashofgreen
Jon/Sansa (ASoIaF/GoT), one-shot, future fic, love confessions, marriage proposal
They embrace with both their joy and their grief. This is the way it was meant.
Alex listening to Perrie's debut album (x)
Hello! I was wondering about your general take on Jeor Mormont. I mean, are we supposed to like him? One thing that always bothered me a lot was his answer to Jon about Craster, saying his daughter-wives should take the axe he gifted Craster and kill him. Even by Westerosi standards (not even starting with the existence of a thing called trauma), that seems like a massive cop out. He basically says that they should commit Kinslaying.
I think the author's intention here is that we see Jeor Mormont as a fundamentally reasonable leader, who nevertheless has some serious limitations. Whatever else was going on, there's this speech to Jon Snow:
"We've seen the dead come back, you and me, and it's not something I care to see again. [...] Your brother is in the field with all the power of the north behind him. Any one of his lords bannermen commands more swords than you'll find in all the Night's Watch. Why do you imagine that they need your help? Are you such a mighty warrior, or do you carry a grumkin in your pocket to magic up your sword?" Jon IX, AGoT
It's an important speech on two levels. One, the zombies are front and centre. Mormont appreciates the threat of the White Walkers like few leaders in the series do. Two, it's a much-needed lecture to Jon about how the real world (of the story) works. It's a formative moment in getting to the Jon of ADWD who's in his office negotiating loans instead of gallivanting around with a sword like his show counterpart.
These are both critically important things about the series' messages - Jeor's got the point about prioritising the real society-wide threats and the need to work as part of a team to meet those threats. Whatever else, Jeor got those two very big things right, and passed the lessons on to someone who does a hell of a lot more with those ideas than he does.
I say this because Jeor is also a traditionalist at a time when traditionalism is keeping the Night's Watch within its accelerating death spiral. A lot of it boils down to how Jeor sees and maintains the noble-commoner distinction in his own ranks - he wants more noble recruits, rather than making use of the recruits he has. Nor is he flexible enough to make use of unconvential recruits like Sam Tarly, and his lack of flexibility nearly got Sam killed in training before Jon and Aemon stepped in.
And that's what comes out with Craster. Jeor's not a virulent bigot, but the way the Watch has dealt with Craster is the way they've always dealt with Craster, and Jeor's set in his ways about such things. Ditch the guy who's dealing with and sacrificing infants to the White Walkers (Jon II and III, ACoK) and start negotiating with the new Free Folk leadership? Too radical for Jeor. Not too radical for Jon Snow, come ADWD. And that lack of imagination helps perpetuate Craster's cruelty to the women and children who live in Craster's house.
Honestly my biggest problem with Jeor and the axe is that he and his men didn't spare Craster's victims the trouble and trauma of killing him themselves earlier. The Watch - Jeor included - knew what Craster was up to and enabled it for a long, long time. It's true, as Jon discovers, that leadership means compromises, some of them ugly. But Craster is literally trading with the enemies of all humanity, and the Watch can't deal with that because of their now-traditional atttitudes to the threat of the Free Folk.
The situation has changed. Jeor Mormont has the core elements of the right idea, but not the vision needed to execute the necessary changes. One of those changes should have been stop giving fucking Craster new axes and talk to the Free Folk like they might know something about the threats north of the Wall.
#something something bella finally becoming aware of things #about how reckless she’s been acting lately #she almost died #and someone died for real #thinking about harry’s death and the pain leah and seth must be feeling #LEAH IS MY AGE #leah is so young and going through all that and she will never get her father or her life back #but bella can #bella can learn how to leave the past behind and start living #bella thinking about telling jake everything #bella thinking about moving on with jake because she knows he can help her do that #bella having character development #bella thinking about healing and moving forward #and then all of that flying out the window when alice returns
Hello! Do you think that Jon would have handled differently sending Sam to Oldtown if he understood the context of why that was so traumatic for him? I wonder if he would have still sent him anyway but maybe less brusquely.
So here's the progression from Jon's PoV. Jon doesn't start the conversation brusquely and gets thrown for a loop (quotes from Jon II ADWD unless marked otherwise):
This is not going as I had hoped. He had known Gilly would be hard, but he had assumed Sam would be glad to trade the dangers of the Wall for the warmth of Oldtown.
The change in tack is a result of Jon quickly coming to understand that he's dealing with trauma rather than malingering. Before the coldest part of his speech:
Kill the boy, Jon thought. The boy in you, and the one in him. Kill the both of them, you bloody bastard.
Jon knows enough context to realise that whatever the shock to Jon personally, this is actually difficult for Sam - and because Westeros sucks, he thinks the appropriate way to deal with trauma is a verbal kick in the rear. It's not sensitive, it's not trauma-informed, but it's the tool Jon's culture has given to him. It hurts Jon too not to approach this with compassion and patience. It hurts him because he knows that this hurts Sam.
And so Jon's little speech to Sam finishes with this:
"And here's another order. From this day forth, you will not call yourself a craven. You've faced more things this past year than most men face in a lifetime. You can face the Citadel, but you'll face it as a Sworn Brother of the Night's Watch. I can't command you to be brave, but I can command you to hide your fears."
Jon does not want to hurt Sam. On the contrary, Jon wants to see Sam recover from the hurts Sam's father inflicted on him. Jon has no idea how to do this while also appropriately handling Sam's trauma, and that's how we end up with Jon acting like, and Sam perceiving, this -
Jon, he'd said, but Jon was gone. It was Lord Snow who faced him now, grey eyes as hard as ice. Sam I, AFFC
-instead of a concerned friend.
It's a long way to say yes, Jon would have sent Sam, and he would have been exactly as brusque. As with a lot of other things, Jon is way out in front of a lot of Westeros in recognising Sam's ongoing trauma even when it seems irrational to an outside observer. In the sort of small scale tragedy all over this series, Jon has even less of an idea how to handle it than he does the impending zombie invasion.
I think when Dany is compared to the moon, sometimes the dark symbolism and meaning of this comparison is lost, especially in AGOT:
here we're presented with a story where a moon is a receptacle for a birth. something fragile, something that perishes in the fire, and something that gives way for that which is considered much more important: dragons. it is not venerated as a creator; it 'wanders', without intention, and then dies. it is passive, it does not exert much will, it does not have much control. notably, as much as 'the other moon will kiss the sun' is phrased romantically, it means destruction for that moon as well.
Irri and Jhiqui, however, dispute this telling:
'it is known,' of course, signals common knowledge that should not be questioned or disputed (read: we should question and dispute this). Here, the moon is positioned as a divine feminine who is defined by being a wife. It is a feminine construction but instead of being subservient to the process of childbirth, it is instead subservient to its husband. This is reaffirmed when Drogo calls Dany 'moon of my life' as a form of address. It is worth remembering how Dany has had choices made for her, her will and volition curved, and that marriage to a khal is not a marriage to an equal (and nor is marriage in Westeros); indeed, marriage in this workd is not about romantic unity, it is about consolidation of power.
As a result we have two symbolic constructions for the moon - both feminine, both passive, both involve a dissolution of will, and a destruction of sorts - either of personality and independence as ones wants and dreams are secondary to one's husband, or a literal fiery destruction in childbirth. These depict two dreary routes for Dany's future - wife or sacrifice - but also foreshadow the coming of dragons and a future outside of the Dothraki.
In any case, Daenerys manages to overcome this binary by being both sun & moon, by birthing the dragons by her own volition and will and decision, by using others as her sacrifice - others who represent the life she has rejected, Khal Drogo her husband and Rhaego her child and Mirri, most importantly, her midwife. She defies subservience. She walks into the fire. She forges her own path. But that path is not without blood (fire and blood, of course) and we should not forget that.
jon and dany being hungry for food, for answers, for home, for belonging, for love, for a place in the world. jon’s hunger being compared to a dragonglass blade vs dany being reminded of her hunger when she hears a wolf howl. possibly the loneliest kids in the world.
jon has been a collector of father figures since birth like even his name is in honor of his father’s father figure but so motherless in every aspect of his life
re: book titles
Question 17: Um, was there any reason that you chose to have a lunar theme with all the titles of the books?
Stephenie: Um, the titles, well, when I first got started I never could find a title for Twilight that I really loved. Nothing fit. Originally it was called Forks, which was not a good title either. And my editor, my agent and I came up with that name, we were just throwing titles back and forth, and finally we were throwing words, just words. What are some words you like? And twilight was one of the words that I put on the list I kind of like the feeling of it. It's actually, um, Anne of Green Gables, when she talks about why she likes that word, that's where I got it from. And we thought we would change it when it comes out. Then I would find a title for it. But then after Twilight was set up, then it kind of was obvious to keep going, and the next two titles fit really, really well. You know, New Moon was perfect, Eclipse was exactly what I wanted to say. I had trouble again with book four, where I couldn't quite encapsulate it. Breaking Dawn was as close as I could get.
She wasn’t a famous knight, and kings were supposed to put the realm before their sisters.
Arya IV, ASOS
AKSJSNIABABSNABSBS
Jon Snow could’ve “put the realm before his sister” by rationalizing that he can do more good as Stannis’ man and Lord of Winterfell. But he chose not to because
Which would you have as Lord of Winterfell, Snow? The smiler or the slayer?”
Jon said, “Winterfell belongs to my sister Sansa.”
The same Jon who, when push came to shove, decided to become a deserter, to abandon his post as the “shield that guards the realms of men”, for his family….FOR HIS SISTER!!!
I have my swords, thought Jon Snow, and we are coming for you, Bastard.
Yarwyck and Marsh were slipping out, he saw, and all their men behind them. It made no matter. He did not need them now. He did not want them. No man can ever say I made my brothers break their vows. If this is oathbreaking, the crime is mine and mine alone. […]
IM CRYING SCREAMING THROWING UP IN THE CLUB RN
just dawned on me that he first chose to stay in the Watch for one sister, and then later chose to abandon it for the other 🫠🫠
grrm try to have jon and sansa long for the future without directly mirroring each other challenge failed once again
what i've always loved about catelyn, is that she doesn't wait for others to do things for her and instead takes matters in her own hands, from the way she goes to king's landing to deliver that warning to ned in person, to how she decides to release jaime, not out of delirious grief but as a calculated gamble for the lives of her daughters. if the amount of narrative agency and voice catelyn gets within asoiaf is meant to be a subversion of the archetype of the plot irrelevant mother of the conventionally heroic main character (robb), then her story is also that of the men in her life doing their very best to put her back into that box of genre expectations. she's reduced to a helpless spectator by both stannis and renly at the parley at storm's end despite being the only voice of reason there. both edmure and robb ignore her advice in acok and later regret doing so. asos opens with her in confinement at riverrun—a marked contrast to the amount of travelling she undertakes in the previous books. and the last thing robb does to catelyn is make arrangements for her to wait out the rest of the war in some tower. (Is this my punishment for opposing him about Jon Snow? Or for being a woman, and worse, a mother?), permanently sidelined and imprisoned far away from the site of narrative action, such a fate effectively undoes her entire character. it's not surprising that she dies in the very next chapter. the freys also intend to take her hostage after robb's murder, but catelyn self harming leads to a change of plans. and if you read her final moments at the twins as one last resistance against that fated passivity, then her returning as lady stoneheart becomes significant in another way.
brienne compares the grey stoneheart dresses in to that of the silent sisters' (Grey was the color of the silent sisters, the handmaidens of the Stranger. Brienne felt a shiver climb her spine. Stoneheart.), and is that profession not a means through which westeros discards and punishes its women for having broken social codes, for transgressing westerosi patriarchal ideals. that catelyn's misery doesn't end with her death is doing something similar. she is both being discarded by the narrative—she stops being a POV character, just as she loses her voice ("She don't speak,"—"You bloody bastards cut her throat too deep for that. But she remembers.") and being punished for having resisted her socially expected passivity. and i know catelyn discussions focus a lot on the mistakes she makes over the course of the books, but i do think her spontaneous decisions would've turned out differently if she had possessed the power her husband and son were given freely by westerosi society. ned wouldn't have had to carry tyrion to the eyrie only to lose him to lysa's jurisdiction, he had the personal authority to conduct a trial all by himself. robb had power and men at command to transport jaime entirely unharmed to king's landing. which is something to consider when discussing her character, that her reasonable decisions (given what information she had, capturing tyrion was the smart thing to do) not panning out well, had a bit to do with the power denied to her as a woman.
westeros's violently misogynistic, feudal patriarchy first suffocates her will, through her slow entrapment by the men around her. and when she finally breaks in her final moments, no longer capable of performing the role of the perfect lady, she's promptly pronounced mad. and then she's brought back as a shell of her former self, hollowed out of everything that defined her as a character and denied a voice, only left with the memories of the wrongs commited against her. i point all this out because catelyn is often talked about as a woman who learns to navigate societal restrictions by having made her peace with them, as if this allowed her to thrive as a lady, as if she was content with her lot in life. that all that went wrong with her life was an unlucky, tragic mistake or two. but that's not true, is it. because there is no way to win as a woman under westeros's feudal patriarchy.
#my only change would be this> #“reduced to a helpless spectator by both stannis and renly at the parley at storm's end despite being the only voice of reason there” #I'd change 'voice of reason' to 'a king's plenipotentiary' #because IMO. more importantly than reason here is ranking #if she were a man spouting nonsense -- but robb's ambassador -- he would have been taken more seriously #than she was in the same role #like. i really think this is important (@/child-of-hurin)
[...] Sansa had done nothing to make the commons hate her, no more than Margaery Tyrell had done to win their love. Does she want me to love her too? [...] -Sansa I, aSoS
Stannis gave a curt nod. "Your father was a man of honor. He was no friend to me, but I saw his worth. Your brother was a rebel and a traitor who meant to steal half my kingdom, but no man can question his courage. What of you?" Does he want me to say I love him? Jon's voice was stiff and formal as he said, "I am a man of the Night's Watch." -Jon XI, aSoS
why is this where both of their minds go? the gay is strong in this family, i tell you.
arya earning the ire of a cruel queen for defending her friend mycah and lyanna attracting the mad king's attention for standing up for howland reed. my beautiful tragic wolfgirls i love them so fucking much.
sansa held a hostage in king's landing by her insane mother in law as war that her betrothed started rages around her killing her brother & thousands of northerners, elia stuck in the red keep, a prisoner of her father in law as war that her husband's actions sparked rages around her killing her uncle and thousands of dornishmen. both abide by the rules set for them, both exist as examples of the perfect sweet and gentle ladies and both suffer the consequences of the actions of the men they've been bound to. oh how much i love to see glimpses of these sad and dead girls in stark sisters.
one of my favorite details about jon’s evolving relationship with the free folk is his attention to language as a constant reminder of their autonomy (rejecting the derogatory label of “wildlings” in favor of calling them by their chosen name of “free folk”, while also respecting the identity of the thenns by not calling them “free folk”). there’s also jon’s refusal to lump all of the different free folk groups together as simply “wildlings” as if they’re a monolith. instead he takes the time to learn about different tribes and clans, their different cultures, beliefs, traditions, and languages (he even wants it written down! he doesn’t want a single group to be forgotten!). it reminds me of how americans will often refer to any indigenous people as simply “native american” as if they all belong to one single culture…rather than taking the time to learn the actual names of different groups. because it’s a lot easier to dehumanize and displace millions of people when you reduce them down to one big culture of “savages.”
but jon has lived among the free folk and formed close relationships with people like ygritte, tormund, mance, val, etc., so overtime he begins to recognize the absurdity of generalizing them as one single group:
Along with the Tormunds and the Longspears rode other sorts of wildlings, though . . . from the northernmost reaches of the haunted forest, the hidden valleys of the Frostfangs, and even queerer places: the men of the Frozen Shore who rode in chariots made of walrus bones pulled along by packs of savage dogs, the terrible ice-river clans who were said to feast on human flesh, the cave dwellers with their faces dyed blue and purple and green. With his own eyes Jon had beheld the Hornfoot men trotting along in column on bare soles as hard as boiled leather.
(ASOS, Jon II)
Beneath the trees were all the wildlings in the world; raiders and giants, wargs and skinchangers, mountain men, salt sea sailors, ice river cannibals, cave dwellers with dyed faces, dog chariots from the Frozen Shore, Hornfoot men with their soles like boiled leather, all the queer wild folk Mance had gathered to break the Wall.
(ASOS, Jon VIII)
“Worse, he was bred and trained to give orders, not to take them. Do not confuse the Thenns with free folk. Magnar means lord in the Old Tongue, I am told, but Styr was closer to a god to his people, and his son is cut from the same skin.”
(ADWD, Jon VII)
Truth be told, he would have been loath to part with Wun Wun. You know nothing, Jon Snow, Ygritte might say, but Jon spoke with the giant whenever he could, through Leathers or one of the free folk they had brought back from the grove, and was learning much and more about his people and their history. He only wished that Sam were here to write the stories down.
(ADWD, Jon VIII)
“He's a wildling.”
“He was, until he said the words. Now he is our brother. One who can teach the boys more than swordcraft. It would not hurt them to learn a few words of the Old Tongue and something of the ways of the free folk.”
(ADWD, Jon VIII)
“So,” said Alys, as Jon poured, “I am now a woman wed. A wildling husband with his own little wildling army.”
“Free folk is what they call themselves. Most, at least. The Thenns are a people apart, though. Very old.” Ygritte had told him that. You know nothing, Jon Snow. “They come from a hidden vale at the north end of the Frostfangs, surrounded by high peaks, and for thousands of years they've had more truck with the giants than with other men. It made them different.”
(ADWD, Jon X)
but of course the other men of the night’s watch have absolutely no interest in acknowledging the humanity of the free folk or the fact that they’re as diverse and multicultural as any westerosi, which prevents them from forming any meaningful relationship with the free folk on the wall. which is exactly how the night’s watch likes it! thanks a lot JON.
THE X-FILES ↳ 5.9 - Schizogeny
the way in which jon and robb's futures are foreshadowed by the mother of the other: robb dying too young and becoming a ghost that haunts their siblings, a reminder of innocence and happier days, and jon dying and being brought back to life, a shadow of what he once was, a dark mirror to himself
#cat stark is jon's real mother as in mother of the narrative
#you know how sansa and arya are foils because sansa is ned with cat's looks and arya is cat with ned's looks
#robb is lyanna with cat's looks and jon is cat with lyanna's looks
(tags via @befooremoonrisee)