What's the point of making all of season 4 about Mike saying ily to El because he's "inspired" by Will's words into being vulnerable and then them staying together still for those months between s4 and S5 only for then making Mike not able to say it again when El is literally DYING in front of him, he could say it when he thought she was dying inside the mind battle but now that she's about to stupidly kill herself in front of him he's just like no sorry I can't say it again because I'm back to my old selfish mindset where I want to protect myself from the hurt so I stay full of regrets, you die without hearing it from me in that moment and I make it look horrible for us as a couple from a writing point of view?????????? Did he actually forget the whole speech of the painting like, did Vecna just take it away? What the hell would be the point of that in a "this is the real finale" scenario... as a writer that is the most idiotic decision you could ever make, you literally regressed him for no fucking reason once again???? Nothing makes sense in that hellscape season, that shit cannot be real
You realize that their whole plotline in season 4 is now completely POINTLESS??? You could have called a fucking Uber for El and had the same results.
bruh im so tired of people in tik tok villainizing us for not liking will's ending.
"aren't you happy he finally got his happy ending"
IT'S NOT A HAPPY ENDING. AND IT SHOWS YOU DID NOT UNDERSTAND THE EMOTIONAL DEPTH OF HIS CHARACTER AND HIS FEELINGS.
also wtf his ending seems also conforming. like, wtf. it's the kind of ending everyone would expect. conformity destroyed those characters i swear to god.
@nightnutâs post mentioning esotsm and cyrano troupes in the same sentnce made me #inspired bcs i remembered PATRICKđđ who parallels El
Even though Elâs intentions are much different from Patrickâs, she still plays a similar role when it comes to substituting another character
In ESOTSM, Patrick wants Clementine to fall in love with him, so he tries to recreate her memories she has with Joel, except it doesnât work because Clementine is in love with Joel. Sheâs in love with who he IS, not the role he plays in her life, meaning Patrick could never recreate that.
Cue Mike finding El in the woods while heâs looking for Will. Though itâs not Els intention, she starts to replace Wills role in Mikes life, but no matter how she fills that role, he still canât tell her he loves her, because he loves the person sheâs replacing. He loves Will, but he doesnât feel like he can, so he redirects that to El. And even after Mike finds Will, heâs still looking for him in El throughout the entire show.
This is also why itâs important that El and Will not only parallel eachother story-wise, but also parallel eachother visually, down to their wardrobe, especially in shots with Mike. Itâs showing us his issue distinguishing between the two of them and their roles in his life.
Then we have the cyrano troupe. In ESOTSM, Patrick rehearses the lines that Joel said to Clementine on the frozen lake so he can replicate that memory. Similarly how Will conveys his own feelings as Elâs in the van scene.
Patrick also gives Clementine a necklace that Joel got for her, which also parallels the van scene, with Will giving Mike the painting on Elâs behalf.
And then the void scene feels like three cyrano troupes in one, where El is reciting Mikeâs words from the ily monologue back to him, which was Mike plagerising Willâs words from the van to El.
But that also wasnât El in the void scene, and I canât see it being Kaliâs projection of her either. Which means it really is a manifestation of Mikeâs fears of:
1. Not being enough (not being able to say ily)
2. Losing El
3. (In a weird fucked up sense) losing the person that allowed him to redirect his feelings for Will into something more ânormalâ
4. Facing the guilt of the consequences of making El an âideaâ instead of humanising her (possibly meaning he couldnât say âI love youâ back because he couldnât perpetuate this idea again and make the same mistake he did at the end of s4, lying to her in her last moments) leading his guilt to concoct this situation where El is telling him she loves him again, because he never got to tell her the truth and itâs too late now
Heâs going to have to live with how heâs the reason she never got to be more than a Superhero and how he never got to tell the truth
But itâs interesting to me how after all of that, in the end he still tells her story in a way that dehumanises her, not even giving her the liberty of grief, instead creating a fantasy, because otherwise it would mean heâd have to acknowledge that it isnât a happy ending. That heâs still stuck hiding from himself and not taking action in reality under the guise of hope and being a storyteller.
You know, them stealing "The Paladin & his Cleric" to twist it into that disgusting "the storyteller and the mage" bullshit after Bylers have been using the same concept for our ship for years does piss me off a lot
Mike and Will conformitygate edit to Killing Time - Magdalena Bayđđđ
WITH ESOTSM PARALLELSâŒïžâŒïžâŒïž
Bcs boy oh boy is time killing them!! Ha ha bcs vecna messes with time and clocks and is kinda like time personified as a villain!!
Time and memories are so important!!
And mike is the âkeyâ and hes swallowing himself hahahaaaa the lurics are so perfect
Also the song mentioning forgetting âa weekâ is perfect bcs itâs like for the entirety of season 5 (and even earlier, really), theyâve all forgotten the week that will went missing for (mike saying its when his life started, will saying they like getting lost in the woodsâthings that contradict the events of s1)
Which brings me to the ESOTSM parallels with the theme of tampering with memory, bcs i feels like vecna has tampered with their memories SPECIFICALLY of the WEEK will went missing for
And it seems like his obsession with time and âreversing itâ could lead to these altered memories, bcs heâs rewinding time and changing things
Also also the first shot of the epilogue being bricks in the wall (pink floyd) and then showing them at grad all linedup perfectly in orange gownsâŠ.looking exactly like bricks in the wallâŠ.
The mileven void scene genuinely reads to me as some kind of statement of how shows try to sell you a narrative, through flashbacks and a horrible attempt at an emotional scene despite evidence showing otherwise and it works just because of heteronormativity and taking that laughable montage at face value. "Well, if this is what they're showing us now, it must be true." "It's a boy and a girl, why should we believe they're not in love?"
I swear, if tomorrow we casually decipher the word âtogetherâ on the painting too, I might not survive to see the light of byler endgame as I will die immediately from the heart attack
the find is done by @badbuiltghostbones and Iâm just stuck atp, Iâve just circled it differently, mb itâll help someone, who canât tell where this word is hidden, to see it; let the main pic be blurry a bit, watch from the distance as a whole, donât zoom in, youâll lose the picture, donât look for details, itâs readable when your eyes are relaxed đ§
Or rather, why Vecna chose to appear to Holly as "a friend" in Season 5...
...and why this has been foreshadowed from the start.
Theory Overview
Theory Summary
1) Mr. Whatsit is in fact "real"
2) Evidence Vecna disguised himself as Will to Holly
3) But how???
4) The Party found out... but they couldn't save Holly
5) What does Vecna want with Holly and Will? Season 1-2 told us already...
Final summary
Theory Summary
After "stalking" Holly, Vecna disguised himself as Will (someone âgentle and kindâ, a "friendâ) in order to gain her trust.
Will: âI was him. I was Vecna.â
Mr. Whatsit, AKA "Will", told Holly that âthere are monsters in Hawkinsâ, that they eat kids like her... and that he was attacked by a monster when he was a kid!
Mike and Nancy realised that Holly was a target, and told her that Mr. Whatsit was the monster, thinking they could stop his plan.
But then, on November 3rd, Vecna sent a Demogorgon to attack the Wheelers. Mike and Karen were heavily injured in the attack⊠but Mr. Whatsit âsavedâ Holly.
Mr. Whatsit: The monsters, they tried to take you. But I saved you just in time.
He took her to the Wheelers' front door â the Demogorgonâs gate to the Upside Down. He told her it was their exit. A dimension door.
Holly: It doesnât look like an exit⊠are you sure youâre not a monster?
Mr. Whatsit: Pretty sure.Â
He convinced her that he was a hero, not a monster.
And so, when Vecna took Holly into the Upside Down, there wasnât a struggle â he proved to her that he wasnât a monster through a staged rescue, which was really a kidnapping in disguise.Â
This explains...
Why the concept of "Mr. Whatsit" was introduced at all
Why Mr. Whatsit's identity was framed like a huge reveal (it is!)
Why the characters never realised who he was until Holly was already taken (they did realise â they tried to save Holly, not Derek)
Why Holly wonders if Max is a monster, but it never amounts to anything (it was about Mr. Whatsit, not Max)
Why the "we have to save Derek" plotline was so important (it was Holly, who is much closer to the Party)
Why Will is repeatedly said to literally be Vecna
and more!
^ there's evidence for all of this!
Now let's get into that evidence!
First, as always, here's a brief overview of my main theory:
MIKE IN THE RIGHTSIDE UP
Mike is stuck in his own version of Camazotz: the Rightside Up.
In the 8 months after Season 4, the gang prepared for a big battle with Vecna. On November 3rd 1986, the Wheeler house was attacked and Holly was taken; then, on November 6th, Mike was taken â on the anniversary of Will's disappearance.
Every important plot point from Ep 1-8 was an edited version of what really happened in those 8 months. Vecna just changed the order, characters or context to suit his own narrative, keeping Mike trapped in the Rightside Up. That's why Mike's real memories will be crucial to his escape in the upcoming episodes: a reversal of the current episode descriptions.
Evidence!
ORDER OF EVENTS: Part 1 (Reality = reversed), Part 3 (12 Episodes), Part 4 (MWTFDYD), Part 9 (Wheeler attack -> Mike's kidnapping), Part 11 (Mr Whatsit = Will)
SCENE ANALYSIS: Part 2 (Will/Robin), Part 5 (Rainbows), Part 6 (The roof talk), Part 7 ("Where's Dustin right now?"), Part 8 (El is missing), Part 10 (Byler's missed date)
1) How do we know Mr. Whatsit is ârealâ?
First of all, how do we know that Mr. Whatsit even⊠well, exists in the real story?
As I said: every major plot point is based on something that really happened, and Vecna would have changed as little as possible to make it as believable as possible. So if there's a plot point which has huge ramifications and impacts multiple scenes, it's almost certainly part of the real story.
If Vecna didn't target Holly as Mr. WhatsitâŠ
Three big scenes would not have happened (Mike telling Holly that she doesnât need Mr Whatsit, âWhat if Mr. Whatsit is real?â, Mr. Whatsit's big identity reveal)
Will would not have realised the full extent of his powers by seeing through her eyes, and his entire character arc would be impacted
Three MORE big scenes would not have happened (Willâs self-acceptance moment + killing the Demogorgon(s), saving Max and Holly, falling into a trance)
Sounds like a pretty big deal to me!
Considering these ramifications? At the very least, Vecna targeted Holly in a way that allowed Will to see through her eyes â and most likely, he did it as Mr. Whatsit!Â
We can pretty safely assume Mr. Whatsit exists in the real story.Â
2) Well, how do we know heâs âWillâ?
The two final scenes from The Vanishing of Holly Wheeler are pretty much begging us to come to this conclusion.Â
When Nancy first brings up Mr. Whatsit's name to Karen, who does the shot immediately cut to?
Will Byers.
Every piece of information that Karen gives about Mr. Whatsit also applies to Will Byers. In fact, I would argue it fits Will MORE.
Watch â Yep. Tall â Compared to Holly.
Vest â Will wears vests famously. That's what he was wearing when Vecna took him. Nancy says that he was wearing a vest twice. They want us to pay attention to that detail.
Gentle and kind â Will is notoriously gentle and kind.Â
Remember in Season 2, when he came across the slug he threw up after being trapped in the Upside Down for six days (basically a representation of all the worst things that have ever happened to him)⊠and he treated it with kindness? Gentleness?Â
Thatâs Will.Â
Teacher saw talking to W â Mike: "W" as in "Whatsit"?
No, Mike. âWâ as in âWill.â
If you heard this description without visuals (like Nancy did)... would you instantly imagine Henry?
"Quick! Tell me which Stranger Things character wears a watch and a vest, is taller than your average child, is gentle and kind, and has a name starting with "W"?
...Or would you imagine Will?
Without visuals, none of this information actually tells us that Mr. Whatsit is Vecna. The ONLY one that does is his name: Henry. But that's the only detail Nancy doesn't say out loud!
If she never heard that detail, would she have known it was Vecna?Â
Remember, every word was written intentionally. If the writers were really trying to make it clear to the characters that this was specifically Vecna, then the writers would've made it clear to us, too. They could've mentioned his "001" tattoo, or his neat blonde hair... they wouldn't have given him a totally new costume. It's giving... reverse-engineering a costume based on the description of a different character.
It's not just that one scene, though. Onto the other evidence!
If Max telling Holly, âYou are your brother,â wasnât obvious enough, there are also countless scenes like this:
In which Will is not just compared to Vecna, but itâs said repeatedly that WILL LITERALLY IS VECNA.
Will: I was him. I was Vecna.
Considering that the above quote happens at the exact moment the Wheelers figure out that Vecna is Mr. Whatsit? Considering that these two scenes cut between each other, as though they're related?
Will = Vecna -> Vecna = Mr. Whatsit -> therefore, Will = Mr. Whatsit.
So I guess he's not just Henry/Vecna/001. Now he's Henry/Vecna/001/Mr. Whatsit/William. Oh god. The names are multiplying...
Finally, I'd like to mention one more suspicious cut.
Mary: Holly would never run away. She isnât like that. Youâre lying.
Derek: Iâm not lying! A monster tricked her. Itâs disguised as a girl with weird clothes and red hair.... she calls herselfâ
[Cut to Will Byers]
Actually, a monster did trick Holly â but itâs disguised as Will (who was canonically bullied for dressing in weird clothes).
So, weâve established that Mr. Whatsit is A) part of the real story, and B) that he looks and acts like Will Byers.Â
But how did he even pull that off? And why?
3) BUT HOW???
Now, the biggest and most gaping hole in this theory (thanks for that awful expression, Dustin) is⊠how exactly could Vecna have done this without everyone finding out?Â
Well, thatâs the thing. Maybe everyone did find out.Â
So in order to explore how Vecna did this, we first need to explore why Vecna did this.
And⊠they told us in The Turnbow Trap!
[CUT TO WILL BYERS]. Lmfao.
Nancy: âWe think he was trying to gain her trust.â
Vecna was trying to earn Hollyâs trust. And how did he do that? By appearing to her as a "friend"! Why exactly did he do that? He learned from the mistakes he made with Eleven and Will.
Instead of...
Doing a bunch of murders and getting covered in blood (scary)
Chasing Holly and snatching her into the Upside Down (also scary)
He tried to appear as "gentle and kind" as he could. (not scary)
And who is more gentle and kind than Will Byers?
Someone who Holly already knows and trusts, considering he's been friends with Holly's brother for her entire life. Someone who would surely tell her about the monsters in Hawkins, because he was genuinely attacked by a monster too.
(And if SOME of what Mr Whatsit said is confirmed to be true, then the rest must be true too, right?)
Holly might not trust a random stranger. But she would trust Will Byers. Which is especially convenient for Vecna, considering his plans for Will... but we'll talk about that particular "why" later.
For a moment, let's focus on the "how".
It's almost like Vecna is making Will out to be some kind of secret, powerful hero, fighting back against all the monsters in Hawkins, "protecting" Holly and "saving" her loved ones.
Let's explore that superhero-monster dichotomy a little bit further!
The Superhero-Monster Dichotomy (feat. Max the Monster)
Monsters and superheroes form a sort of dichotomy in Stranger Things. As long as you believe in one, you believe in the other; if someone isn't a hero, then they're a monster, and vice versa.
It's a very black-and-white worldview, and we see it most with Eleven.
For example:
In Season 4, Eleven believes she is either a superhero or a monster, with no in-between.Â
Vecna plays into her superhero-monster worldview to manipulate her. He tells El that Brenner treats her like "an animal, a monster," but that in reality, she is "better". Stronger. Superior, like him.
Vecna has already used this black-and-white way of thinking to manipulate El in the past, and now, he's doing it again with Holly. His "Mr. Whatsit" persona follows this same dichotomy.
Mr. Whatsit: The monsters, they tried to take you. But I saved you just in time.
Mr. Whatsit: Your loved ones will be saved. And you... you will be heroes.
Heâs manipulating her by making himself appear like Will Byers, the secret hero who was once attacked by the "monsters in Hawkins", recruiting Holly on a mission to protect her and her loved ones from the very same monsters.
So what's my point here?
This explains why Holly kept asking Max if she was a monster in the Camazotz plotline!
Isnât it weird how Holly kept asking if she was a monster, but⊠Max really wasnât one? The plotline never really went anywhere interesting. Why did they even write it into the show if they weren't gonna do anything with it? Because we simply haven't seen this plotline in full yet.
Vecna has hidden the truth from Mike (and the audience). Of course he wouldn't allow him to know the full extent of his plan. He can't allow Mike to remember what really happened, or he might escape.
Now, let's get back to Vecna, and how the Party found out about his Will Byers hero persona, his Will-sona if you will.
no, i mike
4) The Party found out, but they still couldn't save Holly...
Heroes keep their true identity a secret, right? So Vecna probably asked Holly to keep it a secret, and pretend that he was just her imaginary friend â assuming (incorrectly) that she would.
But she revealed enough information to her family (explored in section 2) that they were able to find out what was really going on. And so, before the kidnapping even happened...
Mike: [Does] Holly ever talk to you about Mr. Whatsit?
Nancy: Her⊠imaginary friend from the book?
Mike: Yeah. [...] She said that Mr. Whatsit told her that there were monsters in Hawkins. And he warned her that these monsters, they were coming for her.
Nancy: And your theory is⊠what, exactly?
Mike: What if Mr. Whatsit isnât a figment of Hollyâs imagination?Â
Nancy looks at Mike in utter disbelief.Â
Mike: What if heâs real?
Nancy: Real?
Nancy looks at Mike in disbelief again.Â
It was a little unbelievable at first, but when Will saw from Holly's eyes?
Nancy: How can you be sure that [Holly]'s the next target?
Will: Because I saw. The first time it happened, I saw through Holly's eyes. And this morning, it happened again.
They knew it had to be Vecna. So they actually told Holly the truth.
Joyce: Thatâs my son, Will. [...] What people donât know is that when he went missing, he was taken by a terrible, scary monster. And now that scary monster is after you.Â
[Holly]: Yeah, I know, Mr. Whatsit told me. [...]
Joyce: No, no. Mr. Whatsit is not who he says he is, okay? He is lying to you. All these monsters, they work for him.Â
Now â remember, Mike is going to be a key focus, so Holly isn't going to fill in for him with another "Holly the Heroic" plotline. I believe Mike promised Holly that Eleven, with her "divine powers" and ability to open "dimension doors", would protect her.
Mike: She'll protect you. I promise.
But on November 3rd, before Eleven could get there fast enough, Vecna sent a Demogorgon to the Wheelersâ house, severely injuring Karen and Mike.
(And like in the current episodes, Will would've seen through its eyes as it ran towards the Wheeler house...)
Then, Mr Whatsit showed up and âsavedâ Holly from the monster, taking her through a portal in the Wheelersâ front door. A dimension door â just like what Mike said El can make.
The Wheelersâ front door is where the Demogorgon took Holly through a portal, screaming.
The Wheelersâ front door is also where Max and Holly find the portal to Vecnaâs mind.
That's when this exchange happens. Instead of Max, it's Mr. Whatsit.Â
Holly: What is that?
[Mr. Whatsit]: Our exit.Â
Holly: It doesnât look like an exit... you sure youâre not a monster?
[Mr. Whatsit]: Pretty sure.Â
They both step towards the portal.Â
And she was gone.
Will: [Holly]. Vecna, he's got [Holly]. We failed.
Why It Makes Sense
In the current version of Season 5, Vecna went to all that effort to seem kind and friendly and disguise himself... only to have a literal monster burst into Hollyâs house and kidnap her in the most terrifying way possible. What kind of plan is that?
Even if he knew she would forget it all in Camazotz, itâs still a really stupid idea. What if she didn't?!
This would've been a much more logical plan. For Vecna to start by making himself seem all kind and friendly, in order to convince Holly to go with him willingly.
No big battle. Just â whoosh. Gone.
Because everyone found out, he had to improvise a little, which is at least partially why he staged that monster attack + "heroically" saved Holly "just in time". But he â as Will â still ended up the hero!
This was crucial to Vecna's plan.
5) Okay, but what does Vecna want with Will and Holly?
In this final section, I'll aim to answer these three questions!
âWhy was Will â specifically Will, taken in the first place?â
"Why was Holly â specifically Holly, taken too?"
âWhy would Vecna disguise himself to Holly as Will?â
"What will Vecna be able to do next?"
As I explored in my analysis of the Wheeler attack, Vecna did indeed take Holly on that day, three days before he took Mike. But why?
Dustin: âHolly⊠why Holly?â
In that analysis, I said that Holly was âthe baitâ. Meant to take up everyoneâs focus, strength and resources until eventually, Mike was left alone on November 6th, free for Vecna to yoink from the hospital.Â
I stand by that. But there is another reason Vecna may have taken her. Because... Vecna targeting Holly has been foreshadowed (if not already true) since Season 1.Â
Remember when she went into Willâs room? She was led there. She followed a trail of blinking lights leading to a circle of lamps (which much resembles the circle of lights in the Lab). Then, a Demo almost burst through the wall above her, before Joyce came in.
Why would Will try to lead only Holly into his room, when there were lights all over the house??? No. To me, this reads as Vecna imitating Will's communication attempts in order to do... something.
All the way back in Season 1!
Also, Holly always seems to notice supernatural stuff, when neither of her parents do.
Season 3
Holly: Mommy, look! The trees are moving!
Karen: Why are you looking at the trees, baby? Look at the fireworks!
Because of this, I think Holly may be âsensitiveâ, like Will, and like Henry. This would also match up to what Vecna tells the kids in Camazotz.
Vecna: [...] You are not like other children. Like Meg, you are special. You have dormant powers in here. And I believe if we work together, we can awaken those powers...
So is Holly bait, or a vessel with "powers" that Vecna can use to do "beautiful things"?
Itâs possible that both are true.
Considering that Mike is a highly important character in Vecna's illusion world, and possibly the only person trapped in it right now, Vecna really did intend to go after Mike⊠but rather than kidnapping any random kid as bait to distract the Party, Vecna specifically chose a kid that had âlatent powersâ, like him and Will.Â
Just like the Party had two plans, Vecna did too. That way, if anything went wrong, he had a backup plan â a little superpowered âfriendâ who was on his side.Â
He hit two birds with one stone. Or rather...
Joyce: We do both. We throw two darts and pray for a bullseye.
Having Holly as a backup would be especially useful, considering Vecna's plans for Will Byers.
A quick recap â in Season 2, the Mindflayer tried to completely take over Willâs body and mind.Â
Joyce: âWhat happens when he canât remember anything? When thereâs nothing else there? What happens when my boy is gone?âÂ
Vecna, thatâs what happens.
But his body is deteriorating. Perhaps the Mindflayer wants a new host.
It was going to fully take over Will's body, but too bad! His loved ones made Willâs body so uninhabitable that the Mindflayer was unable to complete the job. They burned it out of him, and it escaped. Chose Billy as a backup host for a backup plan â build a monster, stop Eleven.
But rememberâŠ
Will: âI donât think the connection was ever truly severed.â
Now, I am not the first to point out that all throughout Season 5, Will Byers had been showing signs that he was being possessed yet again.Â
Darkened eyes
Taking off his jacket; âHe likes it coldâ
Mixed-up memories (Melvaldâs only had milkshakes in the 50âs, when Henry was his age)
Speaking eerily similar to Vecna â calling children âweakâ, âvesselsâ, etc.
Being very adamant that he was apparently only siphoning Vecnaâs powers (way to be humble, Vecna)
Not just that, but in Season 4, Will doesnât even remember his own birthday, and only âvaguelyâ remembers a childhood moment with Jonathan, who remembers it well. Willâs loved ones donât seem to remember his birthday either.Â
All signs are pointing to the following conclusion: something is very wrong with Will Byers, and it has been for a while.
By connecting directly with Vecnaâs mind in Season 5, and with Vecna choosing to let him in? Will just unknowingly made it so much worse.Â
So whatâs going to happen to him? We can look to the reversed episode descriptions for clues.
The reversed episode descriptions...
A quick recap â my theory (rightsideupgate) is primarily based on the idea that when you flip the Season 5 episode descriptions upside down, youâre actually putting the story in the right order.Â
Iâve only included the parts that are relevant to this analysis. If you wanna read the whole thing, go here!
One group searched the Upside Down's Hawkins Lab, while another group hatched a plan to connect Will to the hive mind.Â
Will fell into a trance, and Mike got taken.Â
[In terms of the timeline, this is where Mike experiences the Season 5 we all saw â the fake story based on real events.]
El must now find a way into Willâs mind.Â
El comes face-to-face with the enemy [probably in Willâs mind].Â
My best guess â Eleven will come face-to-face with Vecna in Willâs mind, and like the "fake" episodes, she'll be able to rescue Will surprisingly easily...
Because Vecna will let her believe she rescued Will. In reality, he has already wormed himself into Will's mind, and is beginning to take over Will's body.
Will wakes up, and the crew gets the opportunity to set a trap after he gains unique insight into Vecnaâs next move.
Whenever someone (usually Will) has a âunique insightâ about Vecna, especially if they say âhe didnât want me to see itâ, itâs usually something that Vecna absolutely wanted them to see.
That's what Will said before leading a whole group of soldiers to their deaths in Season 2, after all.
The gang evades the military to scour the Upside Down for Vecna â but fails to notice a threat lurking closer to homeâŠ
(My interpretation â Something is wrong with Will. Who was his trap really for?)
El and Hopper must go on a rescue mission.
All signs are pointing to: Will becomes possessed, and El + Hopper's rescue mission might be for him.
[Mike escapes the Rightside Up. Will is saved.]
Epilogue, one year later â November, 1987.
In summation...
Vecna is going to use Will as a spy/vessel/builder again, just like he said he would.
Will is an unknowing double-agent, playing for both sides, until Vecna tries to fully take him over. His memory will likely be slowly erased/replaced (Melvald's milkshakes...), and Vecna will begin to have more and more control over him, like in Season 2.
But this time it will be WORSE, because at the very least, Will can use Vecnaâs powers⊠meaning that most likely, VECNA CAN USE HIS POWERS THROUGH WILL. Not to mention Will's own "innate powers" that he most likely also possesses!!!
Best-case scenario for Vecna:
Spending all that time convincing Holly that he is Will enables Vecna to convince everyone else that he is Will, too. Unlike last time, they'll have no idea that he is possessed â until it's too late.
Working with his âfriendâ Holly, and her friend "Will", Vecna would be able to use both their latent powers for... well, whatever he wanted. The "beautiful" world he wants to build, presumably.
Vecna would be able to turn Will and therefore Holly against their own families and friends, destroying his enemies with their combined power.
At the end of it all, Vecna could take over Will's body, replacing his current burnt, viney, old body with a younger human one.
Ew. That's pretty bleak.
But, as always â love and memories are the key to defeating Vecna, and they will save the day.
mikeâs behaviour with el and his behaviour with will are not interchangeable data points; they are two distinct relational constructs that the series deliberately stages using different formal, narrative, and performance strategies. the often repeated question, âif you think he mistreats el, why would you want him with will?â only holds if you treat mike as a static psychological unit rather than as a character whose subjectivity is mediated through specific dynamics, blocking choices, and camera logics. in other words, itâs a question that refuses to read the text.
the el relationship is consistently framed as a site of performative dissonance. diegetically, mike is positioned as âthe boyfriend,â but the series repeatedly undercuts his fit within that role. the blocking isolates him at key emotional beats; heâs frequently placed at the edge of the frame, turned away, or visually disconnected from el even when they share the space. the dialogue hands him romantic scripts he cannot convincingly inhabit, declarations that feel forced, delayed, or externally prompted rather than organically motivated. performance wise, his body language trends toward withdrawal: crossed arms, averted gaze, physical stillness in moments that ostensibly call for intimacy. the camera doesnât reward him with romantic close ups; instead, it lingers on his discomfort, his hesitation, his visible panic. what some people shorthand as âmike being a jerkâ is, on a formal level, the show staging a boy miscast in his own narrative, suffocating under a role that doesnât align with his internal architecture.
with will, the entire formal system shifts. the relationship is constructed through openness rather than constriction. spatially, mike is allowed to occupy the centre of the frame; the blocking brings him into proximity with will in ways that feel unforced and reciprocal. we get shot/reverse shot patterns that emphasise mutual recognition, not obligation. the eyeline matches are cleaner, the camera lingers on his face when he listens, when he softens, when he reaches out. the colour palette and lighting often move toward warmth and softness in their shared scenes, visually cueing a space of emotional safety rather than pressure. narratively, mike is granted clarity: his dialogue with will tends to be more direct, more vulnerable, less mediated by performance. he articulates fears, doubts, and needs in a way the text rarely permits in his scenes with el. the performance follows suit, his posture opens, his gestures become more animated, his affect more legible. he reads less like someone performing âboyfriendâ and more like someone allowed to exist.
this isnât incidental; itâs how the show encodes relational difference. one dynamic is built on misalignment and narrative obligation, the other on recognition and emotional legibility. to collapse them into âmike just mistreats peopleâ is to ignore the way television actually constructs character through form. the el dynamic functions almost as a critique of compulsory romance: the series uses their scenes to stage what happens when a character is slotted into a heteronormative script that doesnât fit. the resulting âjerkâ behaviour is symptomatic of that structural misfit, not an innate, context free cruelty. by contrast, the will dynamic operates as a space where mikeâs better capacities, care, attentiveness, reciprocity, are not only visible but actively foregrounded by the camera and the writing.
so, if weâre being precise: mike does not treat will the way he treats el because the text does not author him as the same subject in those two relational contexts. with el, he is written and framed as a boy under pressure, performing a role that fractures him and produces brittleness, avoidance, and emotional shutdown. with will, he is written and framed as a boy in proximity to his own authenticity, which produces openness, generosity, and a capacity for genuine connection. preferring the latter is not about wanting will to be âmistreatedâ; itâs about recognising that the show itself marks one relationship as a site of distortion and the other as a site of coherence.
the more accurate question, then, isnât âwhy ship him with will if you think heâs bad with el?â but âwhy insist on reading mike as a flat, universally awful partner when the series went out of its way, visually, narratively, and performatively, to differentiate who he becomes in each relationship?â thatâs not ship bias; thatâs basic textual analysis.
what confuses me most is the fact that will's love for mike was planned from the beginning, but it didn't make any sense other than will's powers appearing, and these powers were not properly explained and developed in the plot, and it's still not clear why mike said that will is a sorcerer and not a wizard and that these powers are innate, and what happened to them anyway?đ does anyone want to explain to me the connection between henry and will and why in this show the âunrequited loveâ took up 10 times more screen time than the connection between the main character and the main villain?
I'm just reminding you that people don't believe that byler exists because of heteronormativity. If mike and will were a straight couple people would immediately see the romance in them, just like they see romance in couples who act exactly like them
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turnnoffyourmind
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