"For from her, all good descends"

🇵🇭 An Arthurian Blog and other related topics (Fantasy, Celtic Myth, Medieval Culture and History, etc.)

[gawrkin]

On Queen Guinevere, by Sir Gawain

“Lady, in truth, she is so courteous, so beautiful, and so wise that God made no law and no language in whose spheres one would find such a graceful lady. Ever since God formed the first woman out of Adam’s rib, there has not been so renowned a lady. And she deserves to be called thus, for in the same manner as the wise masters educate the little children, my lady the queen educates and instructs the whole world. Of her springs all good: It flows from her and begins in her. No one could leave my lady and go away despondent. For she knows well what everybody wants and what she has to do to please every single one of them. No man can do good or win respect who has not learnt of my lady how to do so. Never was a man so out of sorts that he parted from my lady but not from his worries”

-Conte du Graal, Chretien de Troyes

[wandrenowlereacts]

A Possible Sir Agravaine Romance

In the 15th century, the English Arthurian text “Sir Degrevaunt” was written. The plot of this text is essentially about a neighborly feud between the eponymous Sir Degrevaunt and Sir Sere of Cyprus. As it turns out, Sir Sere invades Sir Degrevaunt’s lands, which causes conflict between both men. The young knight goes out to confront Sir Sere and, while waiting for an answer, he meets the older man’s daughter (whose name is Melidor) and falls in love with her. Naturally, Sir Sere doesn’t approve because he has someone else in mind to marry his daughter. So, Sir Degrevaunt sets out to prove himself he’s a worthy suitor for Sir Sere’s daughter. In the end, Sir Sere ends up approving of the match and Melidor and Sir Degrevaunt get married (Kooper, 2006; Gibbs, 1966).

What is most interesting is that (in lines 17-19 of the text, as can be seen in the highlighted parts above) the eponymous Sir Degrevaunt is identified as kin to both King Arthur and Queen Guinevere. Gibbs (1966) identifies him as identical to Sir Agravain and mentions that Agravaine’s name has been misspelled as “d’Egrivaunt or d’Egrivauns” in French romances (p. 137). Furthermore, Kooper (2006) reveals that several scholars “have argued that Degrevaunt is a variant of Agravain” (p. 106).

In short, it seems that (besides P.G. Wodehose’s Arthurian short story) Sir Agravaine has his very own romance, where he’s the protagonist and has to go through different events in order to get his happy ending with the woman he loves.

The text can be found here -> [Link].

References

Gibbs, A. C. (1966). Middle English romances. Northwestern University Press.

Kooper, E. (2006). Sentimental and humorous romances: Floris and Blancheflour, Sir Degrevant, The Squire of Low Degree, The Tournament of Tottenham, and The Feast of Tottenham. Medieval Institute Publications. https://metseditions.org/editions/E6pge7KhrDE7HNbgIqNjgh6bm4ENQyg

[gawrkin]

It seems to me the passage is saying, not that the ring didn't work because no spell had been cast in the ring to make it work, but because no spell had been cast to lock Lancelot in (i.e. he was trapped through mundane means), so the ring's (presumably real) anti-magic property couldn't do anything.

That is true, but then again, as KOTC text shows, the anti-magic property isn't the only thing Lancelot expects. He fully expected the Lady herself to show up and get him out of the mess - she doesn't.

The ring in Vulgate OTOH doesn't explicitly have this power and is solely an anti-magic ring.

So it goes back to my points about how KOTC intended this be a case of Lancelot being weird there, while Vulgate does a perspective change and attributes the lack of power to outside causes.

[gawrkin]

[...]

(Source: Knight of the Cart, by Chretien de Troyes)

Something of a "hmmm..." shower-thought: in KOTC, part of Lancelot's zany characterization in this story is how he treats objects associated with the important women in his life as if they're mystical artifacts.

When Lancelot finds a comb with Guinevere's hair in it, he treats those hair strands like they're the ultimate panacea. While the ring he receives from the Lady of the Lake, the story purports to have the power to lift spells and summon the Lady to help him. However, this gets disproven when Lancelot tries to the use the ring and nothing happens.

All of this is supposed to reinforce the image of Lancelot's zealous championing of women as a knight and how foolishly overwrought he can be.

But then Vulgate Cycle comes along and changes the context of Lancelot's ring. In Vulgate's version, the Lady of the Lake actually does give Lancelot a ring that can dispel magic and the reason why it doesn't work in the specific scene in Cart, is because the real ring was stolen by Morgan le Fay and the ring Lancelot is wearing a powerless fake.

This is a subtle change from Chretien's narrative because Lancelot here isn't being ridiculous; he has a reason to assume the special properties of the objects he holds.

The same can't be said with Guinevere's hair, however.

[...]

(Source: Vulgate Cycle - Lancelot pt. III)

In Vulgate, Lancelot fights a knight over Gwen's comb (and the strands of her hair with it) and is so delighted to acquire them, but nothing is made much about them apart from being very beautiful. It's notable to me because Vulgate writers worked to salvage the efficacy of the magic ring from Chretien's humorous take but does not do so for the Queen's hair.

Perhaps they thought the idea of Guinevere's hair having special properties was a step too far or that it was better preserved as the sign of Lancelot's zealous love it was?

As a final note, in previous posts, I also noted how the aforementioned magic ring is retconned to have come from Guinevere instead of the LotL. Maybe there's something to this...

[cesarescabinet]

Not sure if this has been posted anywhere, but reading Gutenberg's version of Parzival includes the family trees for German Arthuriana (at least Wolfram's stream)! Most interesting to me is the lack of other Orkney (Or in this case, Norway) brothers, with Beacurs/Beaucorps possibly being an Agravaine variant. And this funny remark on the wiki;

[gawrkin]

King Arthur's Affairs by Peggy McCracken

(Found in The Cambridge Companion to the Arthurian Legend, by Elizabeth Archibald)

Courtly Love in Action, for Arthur this time...

[...]

[...]

Ms. McCracken asking the real questions here

[gawrkin]

[...]

[...]

(Source: Vulgate Cycle - Lancelot pt. II)

A famous recurring character of Arthuriana, Malaguin, the King of the Hundred Knights. If his name is any indication, it might very well be that Mr. 100 Knights here is none other than Maelgwn Gwynedd.

Him being the cousin of Galehaut and brother to the Lady of Malehaut kinda makes sense when realized his chief territory is Ynys Mon/Anglesey. (Sorelois has been speculated to be identifiable with the Isle of Mann) This technically means he's also the King of Norgales (Gwynedd/North Wales), even though that's separate character in-story*

*(Here in Vulgate Lancelot, the King of Norgales is "Bernant" but in Vulgate Merlin, the King is Tradelmant/Cradelmant, who if I didn't know any better might be another expy, this time of Maelgwn' dad Cadwallon Lawhir. Tradelmant also has a brother who is king of South Wales named "Belinant". Makes you think....)

Prose Tristan tries to change his name to Heraut li Aspres, but honestly, Malaguin/Maelgwn sounds better and has the history points for it, similar to the idea of "King Claudas = Clovis I of the Franks"

Also, this kinda places the character known as the "Queen of Norgales"- sorceress companion to Morgan le Fay and Sebile - in very weird position considering "Heraut" is the Queen's lover in Post Tristan Canon.

[gawrkin]

The Progression of Arthurian Champions...

The original trio: Arthur, Cai and Bedwyr - the Heroes of the Welsh Corpus. Standing for: Supreme Warrior Prowess in this world and the supernatural Otherworld, Proto-Nationalistic Resilience against foreign encroachment, and the Bardic Tradition.

Superseded by

Sir Gawain, the First Exemplar of Courtliness and (Secular) Chivalry - The 1st Hero the non-Welsh writers latched on to project an ideal model of the emergent Code of Chivalry and Courtliness. A bit rough around the edges as he combines traits of old and new modes such as supernatural abilities, combative knighthood, heroic lineages and blood ties alongside refined manners and the championing of ladies.

Superseded by

Sir Lancelot and Sir Tristan, The Knights of Love - Building on the ground tread by Gawain, here we have two figures whose mode of heroism is expressed though their steadfast pursuit of their respective Beloveds, despite the taboos inherent in such. As Medieval Romance holds that emotions, and in particular Love, are supreme forces that affect the heart and body, these two men are thus elevated above all other warriors, in both physical prowess and nobility, thanks in part to the great passions they harbour.

Superseded by

Sir Percival, Sir Bors and Sir Galahad, the Spiritual Trio - As the Legends reach the apex of its religionization, there comes an awareness that the previous models do not fit the highest theoretical standards in accordance with the faith, of which is the rejection of the worldly and material, with a particular bent towards sexual matters. Thus, out of the deconstruction of the previous characters (namely, Lancelot and Gawain), the characters of Percival and Galahad were put forward, with the third figure of Bors included to fulfill a thematic trinity of knights.

Special Mention:

Sir Segurant - A small retrograde movement away from the progressions of Lancelot (Romantic Love) and Galahad (Spirituality), a sort-of course correction towards basic chivalry and less high-minded pursuits, such as monster-slaying. Also found is the undercurrent of the Prior Generation's greatness, as members of the Knights of Uther Pendragon's Round Table (which includes Segurant's family) are shown defeating the Knights of Arthur's Table.

And with that, I guess the question now becomes "What about now? Where next?". Hard to say, though there's certain themes I've noticed that hopefuls are cultivating in Arthuriana. There's Feminism (Guinevere and the Ladies as the hero(ine) and as warriors), Art/Brains-over-Brawn/Magic (Merlin and other magic users as the hero), Counter-Narratives (Traditional villains like Morgan and Mordred as the hero, Paganism-vs-Christianity) and Non-Conforming Identities (Any, but Galehaut and Lancelot come to mind)

[gawrkin]

(Source: Nightbringer.se)

(Source: Le Bel Inconnu, by Renault de Beaujeu)

(Source: Vulgate Cycle - Lancelot pt. II)

(Source: Post Vulgate Cycle - Merlin Continuation)

...Do you guys get the feeling that sirs Segwarides, Sagramore and, potentially, Segurant le Brun are actually just permutations of the one character that writers took in different directions without realizing it was the same guy?

[awayaray]

Preparedness

I drew this for my favorite hero. 🥰It's the most perfect knight design I've ever seen—I was completely captivated the moment I first laid eyes on him. Neocore, you absolutely nailed it.😭

Unfortunately, not all of my ideas came together the way I wanted. I may revisit this piece and make some adjustments later.🥲

I'll draw one for Mordred too. After all, those two are inseparable.🫶

[caveofserpents]

Combat between Brutus’s troops and the giants led by Gogmagog. —abridged Historia Regnum Britannae; British Library MS Harley 1808, fol. 8.

[gawrkin]

(Consolatio Peccatorum, seu Processus Belial, by Jacobus de Theramo)

Consolatio Peccatorum, seu Processus Luciferi contra Jesum Christum ("The Consolation of Sinners, or the Trial of Lucifer against Jesus Christ"), a tract written by Jacobus de Theramo, also known as the "Book of Belial".

Also known as "The Time Satan tried to sue Jesus for the Harrowing of Hell"

Lucifer's Prosecution Team: Belial, Emperor Augustus and Jeremiah

Jesus' Defense Team: Moses, Aristotle, Isaiah

Judges: King Solomon, Joseph (Son of Jacob)

Verdict: Jesus wins on two accounts, but Lucifer is granted the right to take the bodies and souls of sinners at the Last Judgement

[lefresne]

[ And the king rose and went to piss and saw that the damsel was still asleep and when he returned, he was suddenly gripped by a great desire, and he began to toss and turn as he lay by the damsel and could not go back to sleep. And he was tossing and turning so much that the damsel awoke and saw that he was complaining and said ‘Sir, what is wrong?’ And he replied that he was extremely uncomfortable and that this grieved him. And she asked him what he had and he replied that he would tell her if she might agree to help him. And she said that there was no cure she wouldn’t bring him if it meant he would feel better. ‘Damsel’ he said ‘I cannot hide it so know that if I do not lie with a woman I will die’ ‘By God,’ said the damsel ‘is this because I lie so close to you?’ ‘Damsel’ he replied ‘I do not know what it could be but I awoke because of the distress I was feeling.  I am not telling you this to deceive you as there is no woman in the world that I would force if they did not reciprocate my desires. By God, if you are no longer a virgin, I ask if I may lie with you’ ‘Sir,’ she said ‘it seems to me that you are a gentleman and it would be a great shame if you were so uncomfortable when I could so easily cure you. I am a damsel, and I am as I am, you may do with me as you please’ and the king thanked her and took her into his arms and held her and kissed her tenderly and so did she as she desired him as much if not more. And so the king lay with her twice with great passion] Livre D’Artus, p.219

[lefresne]

‘if I do not lie with a woman I will die’ - king arthur

[normal-horoscopes]

Greco-Egyptian Magic :

"I call upon Helios + Thoth + Christ + Jewish God + Hekate + Ten Thousand Angels + Ten Thousand Demons + Hermes + John + Paul + George + Ringo + L + Ratio to make the other team's racehorse shit itself and die"

[gawrkin]

I meant the girdle Percival's sister provided that was fashioned from her own hair. Are there any illustrations or historical examples how it is supposed to look like?

I'm afraid I haven't come across a Medieval manuscript art depicting the hair belt. (My usual sources don't have pictures 😅)

If it's any help, here's some art I managed to scrounge online, using Google and Robbins Library Digital Projects.

[gawrkin]

[...]

(Source: Guinevere and Lancelot, by Arthur Machen)

Our lovely queen doing secret magic devil deals, with a stick and some help from one of Camelot's sorcerers. This is probably worse than the time she restarted a war for the same Lancelot-centric reasons.

What's interesting is that it's implied Gwen makes sure noone can notice via magic and that Lancelot does try and fight the spell:

[gawrkin]

do you know if there are any illustrations of Galahad and his hair girdle?

I'm not sure what you mean by "hair girdle".

If you mean a circlet, here's one depiction from Alamy.

If you mean a cilice/hair shirt, then no, I don't think I've encountered a depiction of Galahad in a sackcloth as of yet.