Fervent Bane/Bhaal shipper. Mostly posting stuff about the Dead Three. I will ramble about quite a few things on here. Dyslexic, so please excuse any grammar mistakes. I am trying to correct as much as I can.
The Dead Three as Mortals: A VERY, VERY long analysis and summary of their origins, motivations and personality.
It's long. Very long. Braze yourselves.
The Dead Three are Bane, Bhaal and Myrkul: Three of the most feared and cruel gods in all of the Forgotten Realms. Especially Bane. Funnily enough they only earned the name "The Dead Three" after they perished during the Time of Troubles. Before that they were known as "The Dark/Dread Three", a name that originates from their mortal adventuring days.
So, let's start with our favorite impulsive tyrant: Bane.
Bane was a mortal battle-slave born in Abeir. When or how he became a slave we do not actually know. Sadly. But we do know that he was enslaved by Maram, a primordial from the beginning of the universe who was also counted among the Seven Lost Gods of Abeir and among the Elder Evils. So he is someone you don't want to encounter.
What are primordials? This:
"The primordials, or Dawn Titans, were god-like beings made of manifest entropy and elemental energy whose domains were the Elemental Chaos and Abeir, unlike the gods (Estelar), whose domains were the Astral Sea and Toril."
The primordials are older than the gods and were for a long time unaware of the fact that they existed. Yet when they did found out they invades the Astral Sea and tried to destroy the worlds that had already formed within both Shar and Selune, specifically those two, rose against them and even called other gods to their side.
"They (Selune and Shar) defended the new worlds from the primordials, naturally as the primordials were beings of entropy and destruction. Thus began the Dawn War and other gods were created from the residue of the conflict or summoned from other dimensions to help the native gods of Realmspace."
The Dawn War was a very violent and long conflict that created various other realms. During the conflict many gods and primordials died, were born and also betrayed their own allies. So a very, very messy time. So messy that the nature spirits had to interfere:
"Concerned by the unparalleled destruction caused by the gods and primordials to the worlds of Material plane, the nature spirits enacted the "primal ban", a powerful magic that bans outsiders from the Material plane unless they are summoned by its inhabitants."
There was also somewhere something that said that during the Dawn War a Primordial named Bane was slain and that the soul of the god Bane (or the mortal who would become him. Yeah, the Tyrant) was born/created from the wound that had slain the primordial. So... that's interesting, but I have no clue where I saw that and whether or not it's even true (I don't think it is but it would make a funny crack-fic (ancient Bane clowning on an old Myrkul before both troll a young Bhaal)). Still, I wanted to put that out here.
Now to the Seven Lost Gods:
"The "Seven Lost Gods", or simply the "Lost Gods", was a collective term used at different times for several different sets of deities and primordials."
Which sets are we talking about. Those two:
1. The Gods of Antiquity, who were seven Ancient Evils and/or Primordials that had all been slain or enslaved by Bhaal, Bane and Myrkul during their mortal adventuring days. Those include:
1. Maram of the Great Spear; (I will get back to him)
2. Haask, the Voice of Hargut;
3. Tyranthraxus the Flamed One;
4. Borem of the Lake of Boiling Mud;
5. Camnod the Unseen;
and two others whose names were lost to history, although it is speculated that they might have been "Dendar the Night Serpent" and "Kezef the Chaos Hound".
The other set is called the "Seven Lost Gods of Westgate" whose worship was banned in 927DR and include:
1. Garagos, the netherese god of war.
2. Ghaunadaur, a god touched by the Far Realms (think of Hermaeus Mora from the Elder Scrolls)
3. Jergal, the Lord of the End of Everything
4. Moander, a netherese god of corruption (Very evil bastard)
5. Savras, who was later replaced by Azuth through Mystryls interference
6. Silvanus, the celtic god of wild nature
And another god lost to history. The seventh is speculated to be Auppenser, who is associated with psionics, enlightment and personal autonomy.
Let's move on to Elder Evils, who are said to hail from the Far Realms and are wholly malevolent entities. They are divided into three categories:
1. Eternal Evils, to which there is no real info about what exactly qualifies them.
2. Aboleth Evils, who were worshipped by the aboleths and care only for madness and destruction
And 3. Far-Realm Infested Stars, who were once stars that were infested with malignant forces and now no longer have a set course.
I have no clue to which category Maram belongs, but I suppose he could be an Eternal One, given that it seems that he cannot die. Kezef and Dendar were also considered Eternals Ones, though no longer.
Given that Maram is classified as a Primordial, an Elder Evil and a Lost God it is safe to say that you really, really, really don't want to encounter him. Which sucks for Bane, because that man suffered years of slavery.
Which sucks even more for Bane is the fact that he was not just another nameless slave. He was a mortal that excelled in combat, seemingly even becoming a warlord under Maram, and displayed such a prowess in battle that he was called "The Bane of the Ancients" in Abeir. Given that the primordials seem to be set on killing each other I would dare say that Bane was sent into the field when Maram encountered harsh resistance. Bane can and will use violence in its most brutal forms. And I can't really blame him for that... because can you imagine what horrors Maram would inflict upon one of her favoured slaves? And favoured in this context is not the "oh I like you which is why I will treat you better" thing. It's more like: "You are a valuable tool and I will use you in whatever ways I see fit and if you think about turning against me I will make an example out of you." Bane was known in Abeir, which means Maram definetly was aware of him. He was not just another slave. He had purpose. Which is so, so, so much worse if that means that an wholly evil being watches every step you take. It's a wonder Banes hair didn't fall out from the fear, pressure, stress and expectation he was constantly under...
But yeah. Miserable past. And I don't even want to think about what punishments Maram would be capable of inflicting. That being has zero morals, no pity and will do things so much worse than whatever we can think of if he feels slighted.
Banes past as a slave also heavily influenced his personality. He is loud, impulsive, impatient, afraid of kindness and affection and constantly overestimates his own prowess:
"The summons had come wearing the face and form of that which each of the gods feared most... To the Black Lord, Bane, the summons came in the guise of absolute love and understanding, its light searing his essence as it carried him from his kingdom."
It's tragic that Bane fears genuine and healthy emotional connections more than being powerless. Because the moment someone is kind to him he becomes almost completely incapable of harming the individual that showed him mercy. He becomes "soft" (because he doesn't know how to handle kindness or affection), which he views as a weakness, something that will allow others to manipulate him: to have any kind of power over him.
Do you remember Blackthorne? Who saved Bane after he was heavily wounded from his fight with Mystra during the Time of Troubles? This is how he reacts after accidentally killing him:
"I will not grieve," the god decided coolly. Blackthorne was merely a human. A pawn. His loss is regrettable, but he can be replaced.
Then Bane thought of his endless talks with Blackthorne. He remembered the strange emotions that coursed through him when he had realized that Blackthorne had saved him, and aided in his recovery. The Black Lord looked at his hands and noticed he was trembling. Then the God of Strife screamed a cry of grief, loud and long. All over Bane's Dark Temple, people covered their ears and shivered at the sound of the Black Lord's pain.
When his scream ended, the God of Strife looked down through tear-clouded eyes and saw a figure standing before his throne.
"Blackthorne?" Bane said, his voice harsh and rasping.
"No, Lord Bane."
Bane wiped his eyes and looked down at the red-haired man who stood before him. "Fzoul," he said. "All is well."
"Milord, there are dead men surrounding you in the temple-"
Bane raised his taloned hand.
The red-haired man hung his head. "Yes, milord." Then Fzoul picked up his god's scattered armor and helped Bane to his feet.
"All is in readiness," Fzoul said as the Black Lord finally put on his bloody armor again. "When shall we begin to prepare for the battle?"
A fire crackled in the eyes of the Black Lord and Fzoul stepped back from the angry god. Then Bane's lips curled back in a frightful grimace. There was fire behind the God of Strife's pointed teeth, too, as his eyes narrowed and he said, "Now."
The fear, the confusion, the sheer denial. He can't handle his own emotions because he never learned how. The only affection he ever got as a mortal were probably from Bhaal and Myrkul (who are also completely emotionally stunted) and mayhaps from his family and friend (if he even had any and wasn't born into slavery) before Maram most certainly brutally murdered them and forced him into his servitude. And how does he respond to feeling grief and confusion? With rage and violence. And that's not surprising. Because confusion and grief, the pain that comes with it, are so often perceived as threatening. And how do you answer a threat you don't really understand? You lash out.
There is also this passage from Stormlight:
"...the shame and the trembling fear he so hated, that made him seek tyranny over others. This fear tasted like the tang of iron in blood, but came from a place weirdly different than Faerun. The mortal who had become Bane, so long ago, had come from... somewhere else... He was slaying himself, to keep from yielding to her.''
It's not just fear. It's trembling fear. And shame because he feels weak. And it's very important to me to point out that it's specified that it were exactly those two feelings that made him seek tyranny. Because he endured Marams tyranny for a very long time. Bane slays his own Avatar just so that he can tell himself that he wasn't actually defeated. It's also worth pointing out that Bane was the only god who kneeled only on one knee instead of two when Ao forced all gods to kneel before him, which happenend in the prologue of Shadowdale.
As for Bane being loud:
"I AM THE LORD OF LORDS AND THE PRINCE OF DARK PRINCES. MY BLACK HAND SMITES FROM ONE END OF FAERUN TO THE OTHER, AND BEYOND. BEHOLD ME, MORTALS, AND FEAR ME! FOR FEAR AND TYRANNY ARE MINE TO BESTOW, AND THE RUIN THEY DO IS MY EXULTATION. I AM BANE THE UNDYING, AND NONE SHALL ESCAPE ME!
As he shouted, red fire burst from the dark-skinned, many-tentacled figure that stood on the bed. The blaze seared draperies and clothing to hurl Shayna against the bedchamber wall. She struck it heavily, slid down it, and did not move again. Storm and Broglan were thrown to their knees, and as they struggled to rise, thunderous laughter rolled around them, and that terrible mind-voice spoke again.
STAY DOWN IN HOMAGE, WHERE YOU BELONG . . . FOR THE LAST FEW MISERABLE MOMENTS OF YOUR LIVES.
Bane exulted, slaughtering hapless creatures at random in a wild orgy of death as he celebrated his glee."
Or this scene, in which he managed to annoy Myrkul again:
"The God of the Dead shrugged and held the statue next to the snowflake. As before, there was a brilliant flash of light as the shard disappeared into the figurine. This time, however, the statue continued to glow brightly, pulsing red and black in a quickening pattern. Myrkul narrowed his eyes in pain as a loud, high-pitched shriek tore through his brain.
"I am alive!" the God of Strife screamed in Myrkul's mind. "I am whole again!" A pair of burning eyes and a leering, fanged mouth suddenly appeared on the smooth face of the statue.
"Please, Lord Bane, not so loud. You are giving me a splitting headache," the God of the Dead rasped.""
He is giving Myrkul a headache. While Myrkul inhabits an undead. That shouldn't be possible. And if you think Myrkul asking Bane to keep his voice low will make him silent, you're wrong:
"The voice inside Myrkul's head was growing loud again, and the God of the Dead winced at the noise."
Yeah, very loud. Myrkul should be allowed to hit him once per day. And Bhaal should be allowed to stab him. He is also impatient:
"Not dumb, but... we mortals have seen that Bane is rash, impetuous, and arrogant. He's no patient, long-term schemer, but lives in the present moment (he wants results NOW). And his pride often makes him over-estimate his own prowess, and ignore his own faults."
And gods, he is arrogant beyond measure:
"As my high priest pointed out, none of the gods live in the Border Ethereal, so Ao had no reason to stop us from entering it. Of course, with magic being so unstable, three of my wizards died trying to locate all the fragments of your being and send me here to recover them." The God of the Dead bowed slightly, and all the vertebrae in his back cracked. "But I could not let you suffer here."
"Please, Myrkul, spare me your flattery. After all, you need me to force my way into the heavens so you can follow."
Myrkul scowled. For a moment, he considered journeying farther into the Border Ethereal and dropping the statue into the Deep Ethereal, a place of swirling colors and mighty vortices. Bane would never make it back to the Realms - or his home- from there. But the thought lasted only a second.
Bane was right. Myrkul did need him. But not because the God of the Dead lacked courage or initiative. Myrkul wanted the God of Strife to lead the assault on the heavens because it was very dangerous, and it wouldn't do at all for the God of the Dead to be destroyed.
So Myrkul grinned obsequiously and again gave a slight bow to the obsidian statue. "Of course you are correct, Lord Bane. Let us exit this place so that we may find you a new avatar and proceed with your plans."
Kinda funny that Myrkul, who from the Dead Three seems to be the one least affected by emotions, can read and play that man like a fiddle. Also:
"I am intrigued, Myrkul," the Black Lord said as he paced back and forth. "As you have delighted in reminding me, our last collaboration was hardly a crashing success. Still, after my battle with Mystra, when I asked for your assistance, you all but laughed. I, on the other hand, am polite enough to answer your summons in the middle of the night."
And this one:
"If you feel so strongly about this matter, then I will help you to recover the tablet," Myrkul said, nodding slowly.
Bane tried to act confident. With a shrug, he noted, "I had no doubt that you would aid me."
"You had every doubt," Myrkul rasped harshly. "That is the only reason I chose to help you. I am pleased to note that you are no longer blindly stumbling into situations that you know nothing about." The God of the Dead paused and fixed Bane with an icy stare. "But there is one thing you must consider: You may not have my assistance the next time you need it, Lord Bane."
The God of Strife nodded, dismissing Myrkul's threat as so much pointless rhetoric. Then the Black Lord mocked a look of concern and noted, "Bhaal will not be pleased if you kill all his worshipers."
"I will deal with the Lord of Murder," Myrkul said, rubbing his hand across his decaying chin once more. "I will contact you when all is in readiness." The Lord of Bone s paused for a moment then added, "Have you given thought to what form you will use to hold the soul energy my spell will channel to you?"
Bane said nothing. Rage danced in Myrkul's eyes."
This whole interaction makes me believe that Bane was like this even as a mortal. Even Fzoul is done with him:
"Our overconfidence cost us everything!" the red-haired priest muttered aloud, although he was alone. "And your greed, Bane. Your madness and your greed..."
Kudos to Fzoul for having the balls to call Bane mad.
And Bane being this way makes sense. He had to find a way to assert himself, to make sure that others didn't get any funny ideas with him while he was a slave. Bane, while still serving Maram, was constantly in danger, which is why he is as loud as he is. Because being loud while also being able to commit great violence makes you look threatening. It makes others afraid. And Bane definetly wanted to make sure that others don't think about threatening/hurting him. It's not like he had much of a choice. Also:
"Serve no one but me. Fear me always - and make others fear me even more than you do. The Black Hand always strikes down on those who stand against it in the end. Defy me and die - or in your death find loyalty, for I shall compel it."
Again this whole theme of wanting to make sure that others won't come near him.
And his arrogance? He was a slave who killed and subdued other primordials with the help of Bhaal and Myrkul while he was still a mortal. And then he became a god himself. It's not really surprising.
As for how and when Bane came from Abeir to Toril:
"In the Year of Endless Song, −489 DR, the Netherese haphazardly summoned Maram and other primordials to serve as participants in the Seven Sigils War, but Maram escaped after the conflict ended."
Do you guys know who exactly broke the bindings that kept Maram away? The Crown-Sorcerers of Rdiuz. And then they tried to recruit Maram for their purposes. Which says a lot about them.
But.
It also explains how Bhaal and Bane met. Because Bhaal, at least in one of his origin stories, served the Crown-Sorcerers as Chief Assassin and Spymaster. And then Bane got employes by them. How did he escape Maram? No clue. Maybe he heard that the sorcerers wanted to work together and risked running away. Maybe Bhaal had a hand in helping him escape. No clue. But definetly possible:
Let me clear some things up.
What was the Seven Sigils War? Here:
"The conflict began in the Year of Endless Song, −489 DR at the Netherese domain of Rdiuz, which was located along the Gods' Legion Mountains (later known as the Desertsmouth Mountains). The Netherese had built a mighty floating citadel they named Meigg and were preparing to send troops into the Outer Planes through a massive portal called Cat's Gate, seeking to conquer communities in the Outlands."
You know what happened? The portal they created, the Cat's Gate, was insecure. Which means that Toril, especially Netheril, was invaded by extraplanar beings from the Outer Planes. Yeah. You don't want that. What was their answer to this problem? Bring a primordial into Toril by sabotaging the Anchor of Chaos within the Monument of the Ancients.
The Anchor of Chaos was an artifact that kept the Elemental Chaos away from Toril. What is the Elemental Chaos? It's the birthplace of the primordials and the "mirror" to the Astral Sea, which is the birthplace of the gods.
By sabotaging that artifact the netherese, especially the Crown-Sorcerers of Rdiuz, managed to bring a primordial into Toril for the first time since the Dawn War. Say hello to Maram, who also brought her slave-army (which Bane was part of) to visit. The Crown-Sorcerers of Rdiuz tried to employ Marams services against the extraplanar beings from the Outer Planes, which I presume were the rilmani. This obviously didn't work. Instead it got worse because they were incapable of closing the rift between Toril and the Elemental Chaos. So more primordials got loose. Great, isn't it? How did the Seven Sigils War end? Here:
"In the Year of Bruins, −371 DR, after over a century of bitter conflict, the Netherese managed to banish most all of the extraplanar entities that they had accidentally and deliberately summoned into Toril. Notably, one primordial, Maram of the Great Spear, escaped their attentions and fled into the wilderness."
Hm. Maram escaping is not a good thing. But let's get back to the rilmani first.
Rilmani are classified as "Outsiders" most commenly encountered in the Outlands, and are the living embodiment of True Neutrality. Their greatest goal consists of keeping the Balance between Chaos and Law, Good and Evil. Given that the netherese people were fucking up everything it's not surprising that they wanted to correct that behavior. Through violence, it seems. They are divided into three subraces.
The aurumachs, who are the most powerful:
The cuprilachs, who rank beneath them:
And the ferrumachs, who were the most numerous:
Pretty, aren't they?
After the Seven Sigils War had ended the lands of Netheril continued to be drained off all life, which was caused by the phaerimm (malevolent abberations that had nested beneath the surface of the netherese lands) and their powerful life-drain spell. Said spell had been cast a few years after Maram and other primordials had been summoned through the Anchor of Chaos, specifically in -461DR. Despite the phaerimm being very old, slave-driving beings, their life-drain spell was a form of self-defence, not of cruelty:
"Unbeknownst to the Netherese, their enormous usage of magic was destroying the underground home of the entire phaerimm race, which depended on the inherent magic of nature to survive."
As for what a phaerimm looks like:
If you want my opinion, those things are the stuff of nightmares.
Anyway. In -450DR many netherese people fled their home and migrated into safer lands in order to escape the life-drain spell.
Let me summarize real quick, because this is getting confusing:
1. -489DR: The Cat's Gate is opened and the rilmani protect their own home (the outlands) by invading Netheril. The Archmages of Netheril, especially the Crown-Sorcerers of Rdiuz, manipulate the Anchor of Chaos and allow primordials to walk on Toril. Maram and Bane come to Toril. The Seven Sigils War begins.
2. -461DR: The phaerimm cast their life-drain spell. Netheril begins its collapse.
3. -450DR: Many of the netherese people flee Netheril. Bhaal and Bane probably begin to work together for the Crown-Sorcerers of Rdiuz, scouting the rilmani armies. How Bane escaped Maram? No clue.
4. -439DR: The Crown-Sorcerers of Rdiuz, who had plundered a divine graveyard (in which Bhaal and Bane most likely had part) to craft god-slaying daggers in order to kill the primordials, succesfully craft them. Jergal starts noticing both Bhaal and Bane.
5. -438DR: Jergal steals the Daggers, turns the Crown-Sorcerers and their cults into ghouls and destroys Rdiuz. Bhaal and Bane are left to their own devices.
6. -371DR: The Seven Sigils War ends and Maram escapes towards the Monument of the Ancients. The phaerimm life-drain spell continues. Bhaal and Bane flee Netheril.
Source for the crown-sorcerers:
"Jathiman set about creating a method to kill gods and seize their power, both in order to kill Anubis and in preparation for the planned conquest of the planes. By studying the fragments of the dead god that had been seized, Jathiman was able to deduce how such divine entities might be slain. Under Jathiman’s leadership, each of the seven crown-sorcerers then founded a cult among populace of Rdiuz designed to worship them. In the Year of Chilling Laughter (-439 DR) the Crown-Sorcerers of Rdiuz used this nascent worship, combined with the fragments of the dead god they had recovered, to create the god-killing seven daggers of Rdiuz. It was at this point that Jergal, the Lord of the End of Everything intervened, concerned that the Crown-Sorcerers might interfere with his plans for the revised Ascension ritual. Under cover of darkness in the Year of Dripping Daggers (-438 DR), the Pitiless One stole the seven daggers of Rdiuz and murdered all the cultists, transforming them into ravenous ghouls."
So. Bhaal and Bane dash off and are left to their own devices. Which most likely didn't end well for many innocent people. Let's move on.
Hm. Hmmm.
The seven iron daggers described in this part are, as you may have already guessed, the god-slaying weapons crafted by the Crown-Sorcerers of Rdiuz. I dunno why Jergal stole them and then decided to throw them away. Or maybe he lost them... Also very nice of Jergal to torture both of them in their sleep.
Now you gonna ask me: "Who are the three primordials mentioned in the text?"
Obviously, I am gonna answer this. Because that's what I do. I answer things. (Oghma should hire me)😌
Let's start with Camnod the Unseen because he is the easiest one to answer: We know nothing about Camnod aside from the fact that he was defeated in -353DR.
I also already talked quite a lot about Maram, although I will get back later to her. Patience. This takes time and research.
As for Borem:
"Borem of the Lake of Boiling Mud was a primordial and one of the mysterious Seven Lost Gods."
He was also called the Patron of Anger (I am sure Bane was somewhat sad that he ended up serving Maram and not him. This is a joke).
But before Bane and Bhaal could hope to slay a primordial they needed to lay their hands on one of the seven daggers.
What is the scepter of the sorcerer-kings? A very powerful artifact crafted by the netherese arcanist Glaeros Lhaerimm. He also sacrificed many of his own followers to do so. And read a Nether Scroll. Yeah, I am also wondering why the netherese wizards always mess with things they should just leave be. The scepter was never finished because the netherese gods made sure that Glaeros was murderes beforehand (due to the fact that the sceptre was already capable of disrupting a gods power and slaying them as well. How did it end up in Urgunds hands? No clue, but given that that lich also posessed the Jathiman Dagger I would say Jergal had something to do with it. Because it's always Jergal.
Moving on.
So, to summarize: Jergal tortures Bane and Bhaal during their sleep until they obey and set out to find the daggers. Six years later they found Mezeketh Isle and encounter Myrkul, who had come for the sceptre. Those three look at each other and decide that killing the lich together is a good plan. Which they do. They also ransack the entire tower and leave it in ruins. Then they run off to Okloroum and ask the Topaz-Dragon Kisonraathiisar to be allowed to cross his lands unhindered, if they, in turn, slay Borem. The dragon agrees, blesses them and sends them off. They kill Borem (or more over: Bhaal delivers the killing blow with the dagger, even though Bane had originally claimed it for himself), leave the dagger in the heart and also sail all the way back to Mezeketh island, where they than bury the heart with the dagger still in it... okay. Works for me.
But.
I also wanted to share this:
Whoever this ELB is wrote that story on one of Kisonraathiisars scales. In modern times said scale can be found in on of Banes temple-vaults (don't remember which one though). As for how exactly they buried the heart:
"In those days, we three sought power, prestige, and eternal persistence. The planes had opened to us, revealing their terrible secrets. On the fields of fetid Rezamark, in the Lake of Boiling Mud, we took a step away from mortality. Borem, patron of anger, breathes no more. His indestructible heart is buried on this forlorn rock, where it must rest for eternity. We shall keep watch over it forever."
Like... I guess it was writren by Bane himself. How the fuck did they put an entire stone pillar on top of the heart? I guess Myrkul could have used the Shape-Stone spell... and I dearly hope Bane did not carve the inscription into that stone with his own two hands, because I can see Myrkul and Bhaal getting pissy about how long that takes. But Bane is Bane and he is stubborn...
But I definetly love the last part: The promise to keep a primordial evil at bay forever. Makes me wonder if they still make sure that no one digs Borems heart up even as gods.
Moving on!
Because now those three decide that killing one primordial is not enough, no! They wan't to end all of them and take their powees for themselves (greedy as fuck if you ask me). Their next victim? Maram. Banes old master. And for that they travel to Barze, a kingdom that lay north of the Moonsea and had been created by the netheres Archmage Barze (I don't know why the netherese put their names on everything. But Bane seems to have liked the idea).
Maram had spent fourteen years building a stronghold in the Monuments of the Ancients and terrorizing the people around him. What else did we expect?
In -357DR, two years after killing Borem (and apparently after having some pirate adventures) they made their way to Barze in order to convince the lord to ally with them:
"The sorcerer-king was happy until the Year of Sycophants, −357 DR, when the threat of Maram of the Great Spear prompted Barze to pledge his wizards to an alliance led by the Dark Three."
Those three idiots actually managed to assemble a giant force and marched against Maram into war:
"Led by the mortal Bane, Bhaal and Myrkul, a coalition of Horreb artificers, war wizards of Barze, horde nomads of Varm, gnoll warriors of Flindyke, goliath hunters of Mount Akoro, and gnome hammers of Forharn unite to defeat the primordial Maram. Though thousands were killed, the army succeeds in reaching the Monument of the Ancients and driving Maram back into the Elemental Chaos, resealing the Anchor of Chaos. Many more die on the journey away from the battle; of 50,000 troops fielded, less than 2000 return."
Yeah. 97% of their army was wiped out. And they didn't even manage to kill Maram! They only managed to banish him! Sucks for Bane. I believe it was said that Myrkul banished Maram back to the Elemental Chaos while Bane closed the seal. Bhaal... I don't know. He was probably busy keeping their foes away from his two allies to make sure that they could proceed with the rituals undisturbed. Kudos to all three of them!
So. Maram is gone, having lost some of her divine power to the Dark Three, and their army is shattered. What to do next? This:
"The warleaders who defeated Maram abandon their weakened army. Magic-resistant diseases kill many more as the soldiers trudge back to their respective homes."
...Nice, aren't they? Well, at least they stayed together...
On the topic of those three being nice.
A short time after they defeated Maram they tracked down Tyranthraxus in -356DR and subdue him, forcing the Flamed One to serve him. You know what they did afterwards? Had Bhaal assassinate Barze:
"It was by the hand of one once hailed as a hero that the sorcerer-king Barze was laid low; executed silently and without a struggle. The assassin and his dour companions left the kingdom that very day; the murderers unchallenged as they passed."
I mean... Kudos to Bhaal for managing that without raising the alarm but why? Did Barze refuse to pay them because so many of his people died against Maram? Now that I think of it, that is probably true. And if you think that those three were fine with just killing Barze you're wrong. They are petty:
"Less than a year later, the kingdom of Barze would lie in utter ruin, its cities overrun and set aflame by the Twisted Ones and their demonic general Tyranthraxus. Some whisper that the Dark Three had a hand in unleashing this new menace against their former allies, but that is a tale for another adventure."
No, that is not a tale for another adventure. They subdue Tyranthraxus, then kill Barze and then have Tyrantgraxus ylaughter the whole city!!! It's not the fault of some poor barber that Barze refused to pay them! But I suppose because Barze was well loved by his people the Dark Three took offense to that:
"It was not long after that the Twisted Ones came to finish off what was left of the grieving realm."
Those three have serious issues. Like damn, chill. Anyway, I am not yet done.
Three years after all of the things above Bhaal, Bane and Myrkul tracked down Camnod the Unseen in -353DR. I didn't found out whether or not they outright killed ir just subdued him. But I'd dare go as far and guess that it is the latter, given that they had no god-slaying weapons to do the former. Still, Camnod was dealt with.
You already know what is coming next.
They decide to go after Haask, who had summoney Hargut. Who is Hargut? A Lost god and giant, ugly, mudworm. They confronted said worm in the Ironfang keep. But first:
"In the Year of Craven Words, −350 DR, Haask summoned an elder evil to combat a goblinoid horde: Hargut of the Gray Pestilence. Hargut slew tens of thousands, consigning their souls to the Barrens of Doom and Despair, but three humans, the mortals who would become known as Bane, Myrkul, and Bhaal, took advantage of the distraction to attack and nearly slay Haask, revealing his true form as a doppelganger of the elder batrachi race."
And the batrachi are a creator race. So very old and very powerful. Also kinda ugly:
The batrachi, also called amphibioids, were an ancient amphibious race that were counted as one of the creator races native to Abeir-Toril,
I would add a picture but Tumblr only allowes to add ten per post. So don't throw things at me.
Also:
"Later, in the Year of Craven Words, −350 DR, they surprised Haask, priest-king of Grong-Haap, in his throne-room in Ironfang Keep. Bhaal thrust the Jathiman Dagger into the back and heart of Haask, draining his life energy and revealing the greathorn minotaur to be truly a batrachi-doppelganger."
Apparently between -353DR and -350DR they retrieved the Jathiman Dagger. Right. Why didn't they do it beforehand? That may would have helped against Maram and the others? I mean ???
After they had dealt with Haask they also seemed to have returned thw Jathiman Dagger back to Bogrems heart on Mezeketh:
"They left the Jathiman Dagger piercing Borem's Quagheart, which was still slowly beating, in order to prevent the reforming of the Lake of Boiling Mud and the potential return of Borem. They buried the two artifacts in a 3-foot-wide (1 meter) spherical chamber, buried some 35 feet (11 meters) deep."
Hm. They seem incapable of making up their own minds.
Oh, and they didn't even kill Haask. Yeah. Idiots.:
"As Haask lay dying, the Dead Three persuaded him to agree to a ritual that would bind him and Hargut together as one entity under the command of the three adventurers. Hargut agreed, and together they became Haask, Voice of Hargut, a fell entity bound to Ironfang Keep and responsible for the creation of numerous abominations and chimerical monstrosities during the centuries that followed."
...I am just gonna move on. Alright?
The book "Urgunds description of Darkness" says that the Dark Three dealt with Seven Lost Gods. But only have some details on five of them. As I already mentioned beforehand: Dendar the Night Serpent and Kezef the Chaos Hound are speculated to be the other two.
As for Urgund, who was the lich they had slain in Mezekeths tower, he started serving Bane, together with the other lost gods, after Bane became a god. A win for our favorite Tyrant.
So...
Next thing.
With all Seven Lost Gods dealt with they decided to go after Jergal, yet they only ascended in -339DR. As for how they ascended: They spended many years studying ancient portals, possibly the nodes of the spellweavers. It was Myrkul who figured out how to use them. They entered Jergals domain, fought their way through hordes of undead, reached Jergals throne, bickered among each other, decided to go bowling with skulls until Malar interrupted their game and then played knucklebones with Jergals fingers.
Bame won, Myrkul came second, Bhaal lost. I don't know how Bhaal managed to loose a game of dexterity against the elderly necromancer and Bane, who is as subtle as a living volcano. I can see Bane cheating in order to win and Myrkul using magic. Poor Bhaal really got the short stick.
I also realized that I actually wanted to analyse their personalities and backstories more. But I am tired. My brain and fingers hurt. And I cried like three times writing this. So I am probably gonna make another post. When? No idea. These three idiots are stupid.
There are few minor other things that those three did, but I am done for now.
If I got something wrong or you just wanna add something, feel free to comment.
Imma go sleep because I have to work from 4am - 12am tomorrow. Without a bloody break.
I like the idea that the Dark Urge, in their sleep, sometimes relives Bhaals mortal life. Like they can see his memories because they are so closely tied to him.
Are they aware of the fact that those are their fathers memories? Maybe.
But I love the idea that they told Gortash about some of them, which is why Bhaal fucking hates Gortash. Because how dare they tell their ally (lover) about that?
Bhaal: "Tf are you doing?! Stop telling Banes little snob about my business!"
Durge: "But father! A deeper understanding leads to a stronger alliance!"
Bhaal: "Just kill him. We have no need for an alliance with that upstart tyrant!"
Durge: "...is that about Bane? I once dreamed of you and him-"
Bhaal: "No! Orin! Orin! Ruin their mind - no! Not that much!... Oh... well."
Bane is laughing and waving his LGBTQ flag in the backround, Gortash is not sure what to think, Orin is giggling.
Ketheric and Myrkul have decided that this is none of their business.
Jergal (aka. Withers. Or just Grandpa) is shaking his head in utter disappointment. Somewhere. And later shaming Durge for their choice of partner. Were the two divorces between Bane and Bhaal not enough?
Does Bhaal allowing Orin to ruin Durges mind count as him refusing to bless the marriage? Gortash is crying, Durge is trying very hard to seem unbothered and Bane is screaming at Bhaal to allow those two to be young and foolish.
same anon as before, thanks for answering! I did have a question, not exactly related to the dead three but in the ballpark? I’ve always wanted to know why it seems like every major example of mortals becoming gods focuses on humans. bhaal bane and myrkul, yes but also kelemvor, midnight, cyric, fzoul, and even gale from bg3. so I was more curious if there’s any examples of the other species becomes gods? still learning more about forgotten realms lore so maybe I’m mistaken but I always thought I was kind of… lame? There’s all these interesting races of people yet all the gods were once humans. of course in faerûn humans are the most populous race but there are still many individuals from the other races and plenty of adventurers from all backgrounds, races, and places.
Jup, there are a few gods that were once mortas but no humans.
1. Diancastra, the giant demigodess of wit and pleasure. Her father Annam granted her demitgodess status during her life.
2. Shevarash, who is the elven deity of loss, hatred and revenge. He became a god after his desth in -4070 DR with the the help of Fenmarel Mestarine.
3. Kiaransalee, who was the lesser drow goddess of necromancy and undeath. As a mortal she was a powerful necromancer and lich. We don't really know how she became a goddess.
4. Raxivort: A very weak demigod that created the xvarts. As a mortal he served the demon lord Graz'zt and stole the Infinity Spindle from him: An artifact that could tramsform mortals intp gods under specific circumstances.
Apparently Diancastra had an older sister, Hiatea, who also became a demigod thanks to their father Annam. But I didn't find anything else about her.
I am also pretty sure Velsharoon was an elf as a mortal. At least he is depicted as one here:
But yeah, the majority of gods that were once mortal were humans. Why? Possibly because humans are described as one of the most ambitious race in Toril.
Hope that helps! Don't quote me on Velsharoon though...😃
I’m personally a sucker for a ginger bane. fzoul being ginger and him being a favorite of bane’s lends itself to perhaps fzoul resembling bane in life? you could make the same argument for gortash as well for the post about what he might have looked like as a mortal. though if he favors dark haired men as avatars and bhaal was a dark haired man
Never really considered ginger Bane before... and Banes relationship with Fzoul is certainly something. But I can definetly see Bane approving of Fzoul because Fzoul reminds him of his mortal self: Their ambition, their questionable loyalty to those they claim to serve, the constant plotting and scheming. And definetly their (somewhat) attraction towards dark-haired man.
Manshoon was dark-haired, wasn't he? I hope I remembered that right.
"[Fzoul] is close with Manshoon, as close as two such evil men can ever be."
And Bane and Bhaal have their own thing going on. Also: Gortash.
As for Bane and Fzoul:
"If any harm comes to Fzoul's body, it will be your flesh I will inhabit next. And I will not be as generous as I was with Fzoul. Your mind will be utterly destroyed. Is that understood?" The God of Strife squeezed the thief's shoulder until the bones felt as if they were about to break."
Yeah. He likes him. And repeatedly thinks of him as good-looking. I always wondered why Bane finds Fzoul "attractive". He seems to have a questionable taste in facial hair:
I mean a really questionable taste. Have you seen Bhaals avatar during the Time of Troubles? Absolutely horrendous.
Granted, at that point Bhaal was horribly wounded and about to die, but he could have shaved beforehand...
As Tara tells Gale: Those things on their chins are an affront to the people around them.
As for blonde Bane, Fzoul is also depicted as blone for some reason.
I don't remember why though.
Does Bane like ginger man because it reminds him of blood? I mean, right at the beginning of Shadowdale he gets very excited about blood... and Bhaals hair has probably been covered in blood multiple times before. And Gortashs as well.
And Bane seems to prefer man. Sure, Loviatar is his consort and he had a thing going on with Kiputytto, but Bane, like Bhaal, seems to sleep with everyone (he has many children. Not as many as Bhaal has (because that is impossible) but still.) He also seems to be somewhat woman-hating:
"You exist!" the banelich snapped. "Did you think you would be Bane's chosen priest? You? A woman? Lord Bane will be served by me, the banelich who carried his essence. When I lived, Bane had no priestesses. From the essence I carry, I know that time will come again. You are nothing but a slave." The banelich kicked at the priestess's ribs. "Begone from my sight, you disgusting abomination!"
Honestly, I think Bane likes men that look like you picked them out of a trash-can. Fzoul, Gortash, Bhaal... Maybe that's why he makes himself look pretty? We could also say that Bane likes them because they make him feel better about themselves, somewhat like this:
Bane: I like the ugly ones who have no problem getting drenched in blood. Or are red-haired. They make me look pretty 😃
(You can hear Myrkuls exhausted sigh in the corner somewhere behind him)
Gonna correct myself quickly here because @aureliaen actually made me realise that I got "World of Darkness" lore mixed up in here. Banes only child is Iyachtu Xvim! I was thinking about the Ferectoi. Completely different!
Double-checked everything else. The rest is still true.
Snippet from Chapter 6 for my fic: Of Mortals, Gods and Ambiton
Bane is sought out by Bhaal and sets his scheme into motion.
Link for the whole fic: https://archiveofourown.org/works/86404331/chapters/228585221
Two days had passed since he had awoken in his tent, bloody and near death. His men eyed him, doubting the right he had to be commander. A few tried their luck. After one such confrontation Bane was busy washing the blood from his face as the reflection of the water gave away to much.
“Here I began to think you would not show up.” The assassin froze, having only been two seconds away from slicing open his neck. Bane turned to face him.
He can't risk an open confrontation. Not while being in the heart of an enemies camp. He smiled and saw in the small mans stance that he realized this too.
“So,” he continued, choosing his words carefully. “I see that the beating I gave you left your old leather rags in a bad enough state to force you to wear something different.” No reaction. “If it makes you feel better, you left my armor in quite a similar state.” The man took a step forward without making a sound.
“As we did our bodies.” That was, he supposed, true. Still, Bane could not help but sneer.
“Speak for yourself.” he answered. “I am fine.” A chuckle.
“Now, perhaps. But do not lie to me. When I whisked myself away I noticed your limp husk.” A pang of shame filled his chest, but he did not look away.
“Then why didn't you kill me? You could have.” A single finger flinched. Guilty as charged.
“For the same reason that you didn't snap my neck. I lacked the strength.” The honesty surprised Bane.
“I didn't spare you.”
“You did. You didn't tell the others that I remained alive. If you had, my corpse would be decorating this camp by now. I could not have snuck in here with so many eyes and ears on high-alert.” he explained.
Bane stared at him. He had expected lies, deceptions, veiled truths and thus had mentally prepared himself to hold a conservation in this manner. This was... he didn't really now how to handle this.
You're remarkably honest.” he conceded. “And if I dare say so, calm. After our first encounter I was sure I would be talking to a mad beast. Yet I am not.” The other man stepped closer once more.
“Does this disappoint you, commander?” Bane straightened his back at the honorific. He had expected insults, belittlement, had prepared himself to leash his rage. Once more he was forced to adjust his strategy. The assassin didn't wanted to risk an all-out confrontation again, but as he had noted a few days past, a man who wielded his skills with such pride would not bear the shame of leaving a contract unfinished. He was still at risk.
Another solution would have to make itself known.
“No,” Bane said. “Just surprised. But I am pleased with this, even if it matters little to you. After all-” There were steps outside of the tent, a voice, and the the curtains were pulled back as General Haran stepped inside.
I’m personally a sucker for a ginger bane. fzoul being ginger and him being a favorite of bane’s lends itself to perhaps fzoul resembling bane in life? you could make the same argument for gortash as well for the post about what he might have looked like as a mortal. though if he favors dark haired men as avatars and bhaal was a dark haired man
Never really considered ginger Bane before... and Banes relationship with Fzoul is certainly something. But I can definetly see Bane approving of Fzoul because Fzoul reminds him of his mortal self: Their ambition, their questionable loyalty to those they claim to serve, the constant plotting and scheming. And definetly their (somewhat) attraction towards dark-haired man.
Manshoon was dark-haired, wasn't he? I hope I remembered that right.
"[Fzoul] is close with Manshoon, as close as two such evil men can ever be."
And Bane and Bhaal have their own thing going on. Also: Gortash.
As for Bane and Fzoul:
"If any harm comes to Fzoul's body, it will be your flesh I will inhabit next. And I will not be as generous as I was with Fzoul. Your mind will be utterly destroyed. Is that understood?" The God of Strife squeezed the thief's shoulder until the bones felt as if they were about to break."
Yeah. He likes him. And repeatedly thinks of him as good-looking. I always wondered why Bane finds Fzoul "attractive". He seems to have a questionable taste in facial hair:
I mean a really questionable taste. Have you seen Bhaals avatar during the Time of Troubles? Absolutely horrendous.
Granted, at that point Bhaal was horribly wounded and about to die, but he could have shaved beforehand...
As Tara tells Gale: Those things on their chins are an affront to the people around them.
As for blonde Bane, Fzoul is also depicted as blone for some reason.
I don't remember why though.
Does Bane like ginger man because it reminds him of blood? I mean, right at the beginning of Shadowdale he gets very excited about blood... and Bhaals hair has probably been covered in blood multiple times before. And Gortashs as well.
And Bane seems to prefer man. Sure, Loviatar is his consort and he had a thing going on with Kiputytto, but Bane, like Bhaal, seems to sleep with everyone (he has many children. Not as many as Bhaal has (because that is impossible) but still.) He also seems to be somewhat woman-hating:
"You exist!" the banelich snapped. "Did you think you would be Bane's chosen priest? You? A woman? Lord Bane will be served by me, the banelich who carried his essence. When I lived, Bane had no priestesses. From the essence I carry, I know that time will come again. You are nothing but a slave." The banelich kicked at the priestess's ribs. "Begone from my sight, you disgusting abomination!"
Honestly, I think Bane likes men that look like you picked them out of a trash-can. Fzoul, Gortash, Bhaal... Maybe that's why he makes himself look pretty? We could also say that Bane likes them because they make him feel better about themselves, somewhat like this:
Bane: I like the ugly ones who have no problem getting drenched in blood. Or are red-haired. They make me look pretty 😃
(You can hear Myrkuls exhausted sigh in the corner somewhere behind him)
Thanks so much for the shoutout in your Durge species post! I'm happy to have contributed to the scholarship and unraveling of all this lore. As you might've seen on my blog, I roll with a bit looser/original interpretations of the Dead Three, but I'm still super interested in what you've found for them! So out of curiosity: are there any accounts of what our favorite band of godkilling murder hobos actually looked like when they were alive? Dungeon #170 was the most I could find for Myrkul, and it was pretty limited to "weird and creepy looking".
I am always happy to meet other Dead Three fans😁
As you already correctly mentioned, we do have a description for mortal Myrkul, which I will add for others who may want the details:
'The necromancer was the most reserved of the three dark heroes, a gangling man of advancing years, speaking in a high whisper and largely keeping to himself. His emaciated form was shrouded within dark robes, the man’s cold eyes bespoke of malign intelligence and eldritch might. His given name: Myrkul Bey al-Kursi, Crown Prince of Murghôm.'
- Dungeon Magazine #170
For Bane I found no real description, aside from this one post @awwright shared with me:
Though this is not really mortal Bane. Still, we could interpret him to have looked similar to the given description as a mortal. (I am still a sucker for blonde Bane though. But that's me). We know that Bane was a human from Abeir, but whether or not these humans differed from those of Toril is unknown. Which is actually pretty shitty.
As for Bhaal. We are never given a direct description of his looks.
But.
We do know of his origins. He has been given two backstories: In one he was a Netherese Archmage and in the other one a Spymaster in Rdiuz, who seems to be tied to the Talfir of the western Heartlandss. And we know what those two groups usually looked like:
The Talfir:
"The Talfir were described by the elves who wrote about them as having fair skin and dark hair."
And for the Netherese:
"The Netherese, also known as the Neth, were an ethnic group of dark-haired, fair-skinned humans that resided in the ancient magocratic nation of Netheril."
So Myrkul was a creepy man built like a spaghetti, Bane is... not really described as mortal (at least I didn't find anything on that matter) and Bhaal was a small man with pale skin and dark hair. But that's all I could find about that.
The Dark Urge and how their chosen Race may echo Bhaal.
Part 1: Dragonborn, Drow, Dwarf, Elf and Human
The Dark Urge can, obviously, be any race because they were crafted from a drop of Bhaals own gore.
But as someone who likes parallels I decided to take a look at how the race of the Dark Urge may, in any way, hint towards Bhaals influence. Details below the cut.
1. Dragonborn: Honestly, after a Human Durge a Dragonborn makes the most sense. In one of Bhaals backstories he was a netherese Archmage and peer of Karsus. Do you guys know what language the netheril people spoke? Loross and/or Netherese:
"While the people shared a common script of draconic alphabet, the people of Low Netheril spoke Netherese while the nobles of High Netheril spoke Loross."
And as this part already points out, their language used the draconic script.
Even if we go with Bhaals other backstory, the one in which he was most likely of Talfiric origin and came to serve the Crown-Sorcerers of Rdiuz as Spymaster and Chief Assassin, he would still have had to learn this language. So Bhaal definetly knew how to read, write and speak draconic.
Dragonborns have, however, not existed during Bhaals mortal life. At least not on Toril. The very first Dragonborns that ever walked Toril were the so called "Dragonborns of Bahamut", who walked the world thousands of years before Bhaal ever lived:
"According to the Parwiccan Cycle, the first dragonborn were created by Bahamut during the Time of Dragons, and they acted as his knights and loyal warriors during the first battles of the Dragonfall War."
For those that don't know:
"The Time of Dragons was a period lasting from −30,000 DR to −24,000 DR, when the powerful empires of the creator races disappeared from the face of Toril and their land was occupied by giants and dragons far more powerful than those of the Present Age."
We don't really know when those champions of Bahamut disappeared, but we do know at which point they reappeared:
"The dragonborn of Bahamut vanished from Faerûn since that ancient time and only reappeared again in 1359 DR, when Bahamut was able to restore his deific status as a lesser deity and began to beseech some of his new followers to become dragonborn."
Bhaal lived around Karsus time, which means roughly around -420 DR and -390 Dr. The only creature he could have met as a mortal that resembles a Dragonborn is a dragon in a more humanoid shape. Which is not impossible. We also need to make a distinction between the Dragonborns of Bahamut and normal dragonborns. Because normal dragonborns were, apparently, not created by Bahamut:
"Faerunian sages of the 1470s DR believed that dragonborn were either the original inhabitants of Unther, who were transformed into draconic beings after being exposed to the energies of the Spellplague, or experiments created by the followers of Tiamat in the ruins of Unther. Such beliefs were wrong, however, as dragonborn were denizens from Abeir."
Instead we get these possibilities:
"It was believed that the first dragonborn hatched from dragon eggs as a race that combined humanoid and draconic traits, although if they were shaped by the dragon gods or by mortal dragons was a matter of debate. Some legends of Abeir told that Io, the first and greatest of the dragon gods, created the dragonborn as servants for the first dragons."
And this one:
"A third legend, preferred by those dragonborn who believed theirs was the superior race, told that Io created the dragonborn before dragon and before the other humanoid races, that were created later in an attempt to match the draconic perfection. According to this legend, dragonborn were originally created to be the companions of Io, while dragons were created later, during the war with the primordials. All those legends had in common that dragonborn weren't the creations of Bahamut and Tiamat, and therefore they were free to chose their own destinies."
Although it is worthy of note that Bahamut did create the Dragonborns of Bahamut (not the normal ones) after visiting Abeir:
"According to some really old dragons, Bahamut created his dragonborn after studying the biology of a few willing abeiran dragonborn which he had his servants bring from that world. This knowledge was lost to the ages, as only the surviving servants of Bahamut from those times remembered that fact in more modern times."
Yeah. It's a mess. But do you know what catched my eye reading this? The mention of Abeir. Because who originates from Abeir? Bane. And Bane definetly is implied to have a thing for dragons. And Bane and Bhaal travelled together for decades and it is not so far fetched that Bane may have told Bhaal about the Dragonborns of Bahamut in Abeir, because in Abeir they were definetly a thing even after they vanished on Toril. So yeah. Bhaals obsession with dragons? You can blame Bane for that (when in doubt, always point the finger at the Lord of Tyranny. Nine out of ten times he is to blame).
There is another tiny little aspect that may has fed into Bhaals obsession with dragons and I have to thank @thewiglesswonder for this one, which is why I will link two of their posts here:
Bhaal, Bane and Myrkul did not only meet a Topaz Dragon in their lives, they were specifically blessed by it:
As for who Kisonraathiisar was: https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Kisonraathiisar
Maybe that Dragon left quite the impression on Bhaal. There is however another thing about Dragonborns I want to put out here: Their family bonds.
"Clan and family bloodlines were both preserved among dragonborn and were highly important to dragonborn culture as a whole. Both were different, though the distinction was subtle to non-dragonborn. Family referred specifically to actual blood relatives, as far as could be traced, whereas clan, in the dragonborn context, referred to a confederation of families united by mutual purpose in ages past,..."
Where am I going with this? Bhaal keeps telling the Dark Urge that they are his most special child, his pureblooded spawn, his favorite. He is not necessarily lying about this. It may very well be that Durge considers only Bhaal as his actual family and every other half-bloodes child of his "only" a clanmember. They are still important, but not compared to Daddy-dearest. And Bhaal definetly wants to make Durge believe that.
Also, on the matter of the original Dark Urge:
"White dragon vendettas were brutal and violent, frequently leading them into serious trouble."
And also:
"...their memory was rudimentary, capable of recalling only physical events rather than abstract concepts. There was one exception: they remembered offenses committed against them and have a highly developed sense of vengeance and would often hunt down beings who crossed them, no matter how long it might take."
What is the first thing the Dark Urge does after escaping the Nautilod pod? They think of vengeance. What is the first thing they think of when they encounter Minsc? Killing them (because Bhaal wants vengeance on him for Bg1 and 2). What? You want an example of Bhaal being a vengeance seeking Bastard? Fine.
"Bhaal sought vengeance. Kazgoroth was neither Bhaal's most powerful servant, nor his most favoured. But he was slain by a mortal, and the man who dared strike a minion of Bhaal's might as well strike at the god himself."
Kudos to the lord of murder for giving a shit about his followers. Makes him better than Lolth, Bane and Myrkul. Which is a sad statement. Also this:
"Bhaal greeted the death of Thorax not with sorrow, but with an explosion of boiling hatred. The god thrashed within his oily medium, cursing his lack of physical form. Bhaal desired to smash objects, to strike solid blows, but his watery form denied him that power. As he raged, his will crystallized into actions. The perytons, gliding in eerie silence, flew from throughout the vale to gather at the Darkwell. His clerics, Hobarth and Ysalla, paused briefly in their own plotting as the stuff of their faith shook from the deep disturbance. Each recoiled before the rage of their deity, and each likewise felt immense relief that the rage was directed elsewhere. Instead, Bhaal's rage brought them a command, imperious and irresistible. Level the Iron Keep! Bhaal's intense anger needed slaying before it would cool, and at that fortress there would certainly be many humans gathered, seeking the imagined safety of its high walls. But those within were not reckoning on the mighty power of the god of murder and his minions. His clerics instantly set to work upon the plan. And then Bhaal gave another command, this to his flock of perytons. The monsters had gathered at the well and circled, a great cloud of corruption, above the center of their master's power. And they heard his command. Bhaal sent them soaring across the vale, silently gliding above the wasteland of death. He ordered them to find those who had slain Thorax and kill them."
Thorax is Bhaals owlbear child. And honestly? I get him. Imagine someone killed our owlbear-cub in Bg3. I would very much react the same way.
White dragonborns are also the most feral ones out of all the chromatic dragons. So there is that. Bhaal definetly knew what he was doing when he made them (if we ignore the original class, because Storm-sorcerer still irks me).
2. Drow: Lolth and Bhaal are very similar deities. They both encourage murder (Bhaal wants you to kill those stronger than yourself, Lolth doesn't care), kin-slaying (100%), wreck your mind if you fail or oppose them and turn you into a raving beast and also have a thing for breeding-schemes. And I am very sorry that I wrote it this way. Lolth also seems to like to disguise herself just like Bhaal instead of appearing in their original form. Bg3 created even more parallels between them: Cannibalism, wanting to dominate the world and a lack of impulse-control (I am still offended on Bhaals behalf). Larian seems to have painted Bhaal as a more chaotic aligned deity.
As for necrophilia... Kiaransaleen and her followers definetly give me those vibes. And she is also a drow goddess. Hm.
Lolth created the Drow because she and her ex-husband Corellon had some giant fall out so she stole some of his children (the elves) and corrupted them into the Drow. Then she set the Drow loose in order to slaughter elves. Anyone else is getting Bhaalspawn vibes? No? Only me? Alright.
Do you guys remember Mintharas line about the Dark Urge? The one she gives when they confess their urges to her? She speaks about "those driven by blood". Drows that have gone so far off the rails that even Lolth can no longer control them. Sounds to me like Bhaal loosing control of himself... and when you, in Act 2, kill your lover to get the slayer form and express zero regrets? Minthara will straight out say that Durge is one of them and attempts to kill them.
There is also a thing to be said about the fact that Bhaal only approves of a Minthara romance. At least according to Sceleritas. Though don't think Bhaal considers Minthara an equal to Durge. Because he doesn't. She is still a lowly mortal while Durge is his perfect child. You know what that reminds me of? This:
"This night the sacrifice fulfilled one of Lloth's most brutal requirements. Devotion to the Spider Queen was all-important, superseding any personal loyalty. Lloth was especially offended by the possibility that one of her priestesses might become too fond of a lowly male. So from time to time, a priestess was commanded to slay her lover, a matron to sacrifice her house patron, a mother to offer up the sire of her children. Knowing this, the drow had learned to be wary of giving and receiving affection; the penalty was too cruel for all involved. But as the young priestess approached the altar, the hard set of her face and the blood on her delicate hands proved she had been equal to the task."
Yeah. Lolth considers man in general lesser, and Bhaal everyone who isn't of some divine origin. And they will both have you kill those you care about (remember Sceleritas lines? "You are wrong to consider anyone your equal?" "You could slay this one dilberty, it would be seen as a show of great faith."? Same vibes).
Looking at Lolth and Bhaal really makes me wonder if a Drow Durge was their passion project. Maybe they wanted to seduce each other? I mean, Bhaal cannot be swayed in any way (which includes seduction) because he is paranoid as fuck. But I can see it happening. They are both crazy. Bhaal also has other Drow children, which shouldn't come as a surprise. He has mated with Rabbits, giants, dragons and I am pretty sure I read something about a Chicken Bhaalspawn once. Don't quote me on this one though.
Also the receiving and giving affection thing. The Dark Urge is not supposed to have any other connections than Bhaal: Their adoptive parents? Dead. Gortash? Already on the murder-list. Their lover? Definetly the next one to die.
Dwarves: I was unable to find anything that could tie Bhaal to Dwarves and their culture in any way. I did, however, found a few descriptions that could explain why he would want a dwarven Durge.
"Dwarven stomachs, for instance, were resistant to virtually all poisons and it took less effort for a dwarf to get back on their feet than other races."
Definetly something Bhaal would approve of.
"Dwarves also had a sense about them that few races did, with a preternatural awareness of their surroundings useful for a subterranean race as well as good judgment all-around in general."
Given that Durge was raised in a cult such an inborn sense would be useful to avoid being prematurely sacrificed.
"Many dwarves were difficult to like and lacked the charm of many other smaller races."
Hm. Could tie into Bhaal trying to keep the Dark Urge from making any deep, emotional bonds.
"Likewise, dwarves, perhaps moreso than most other races, turned to their gods for guidance and protection."
Yeah. Definetly something Bhaal would want: Love me, obey me, worship me. This whole thing. Now that I wrote that I realized that there are numerous instances in the game that allow Durge to say things that very much go into the same direction.
"...dwarves might be faithless, but the race as a whole, regardless of subrace, had a strong inclination for religion and almost every community maintained at least one temple or ancestral shrine."
Parallels the aforementioned paragraph.
Sorry to all dwarf lovers. I failed you.😔
Elf: Uhhhh. This one is interesting. I have mentioned the Moonshae triology in multiple posts of mine already and in those books there is something very interesting: Bhaal seems to develop a taste for elven flesh. After he killed the Earthmother (an aspect of Chaunte) he began to eat spirits. Which is funny, because Durge likes to eat dwarves. They should have made them like elven flesh as well. Would have been Chefs kiss. Although I must mention that Bhaal liking the taste of elves (aka. spirits) is mentioned only like one time.
But yeah. He does that sometimes.
During the Moonshae Triology he also managed to piss of every Seldarine Deity... which means the whole good-aligned elven pantheon hates him. What can I say? He is good at making friends.
And Bhaal is definetly petty enough to decide that an elven Durge that ruins the reincarnation cycle of the elves (by turning them into mindflayers) is a classic revenge. Also, maybe, he just wanted to have another method of threatening them:
Bhaal: Child! Where are my daily sacrifices?
Durge: I didn't found a suitable victim, dad. Those that I did find were sick. You don't like the taste of blood when the person was infected with a disease.
Bhaal: What? Blasphemy! I wan't my meals! Now!
Durge: Perhaps patience is better suited?
Bhaal: Patience? Better pray that your legs will carry you to a suitable victim soon, lest I shall have you for supper!
No one is brave enough to point out that Durge would have to pray to Bhaal for that. Although they could just ask uncle Bane for help. Maybe he is in the mood. Or ask Myrkul. Bhaal will probably listen to Myrkul.
Human: I won't bother going into an all-out explanation with this one. Bhaal was a human as a mortal. Durge being one as well just makes perfect sense. There. My explanation.
This took longer than I expected because my sister kept interrupting me. Which is why I will make a part 2. Most likely tomorrow. Because now I got a headache.
As always: Please share your thoughts and definetly point out anything I may have gotren wrong!
Bg3 Companions and how they parallel The Dead Three (both the gods and their chosen).
Part 2: Gale
This is part 2 of my little series. Obviously. Part 1 is about Astarion and already up.
1. Gale, Gortash and Bane as a gods ambitious and disposable Champion/Chosen:
Ah, yes. A topic that has been discussed many times within the Bg3 fandom: Gale and Mystra and the power imbalance in their relationship and the fact that Gortash, ultimately, is also just a tool to a god. I will get to Bane later.
Gale obviously, as everyone knows, was Mystras chosen before a part of Karsus weave was trapped inside his chest in the form of the orb we all know about. Gortash is Banes chosen during the events of Bg3 and most likely started worshipping Bane after escaping the House of Hope. And Bane, while he wasn't a chosen, was a slave and champion to the God Maram, who is also a Primordial evil from the beginning of time.
The three of them caught the attention of their respective gods when they were still young. One of Elminsters epilogue letters says that he found Gale when he was a mere eight years old. Minsc also mentions that his people hide young, talented wizards, especially boys, from Mystra. And Mystra definetly has a habit of cultivating pseudo-sexual relationships with those she believes to have the potential of becoming one of her chosen. Two of her more derogatory titles, used by those that despise her, are "The Whore" and "The Harlot". I mean, she also forcibly transformed Elminster into a woman:
"The Lady of Magic transformed him into a woman named Elmara to strengthen his bond with magic and to expand his understanding of the world."
And this part:
"After some time, Mystra appeared to El (aka. Elminster) once again as Myrjala Talithyn and trained her in the ways of spellcasting. The two became dear friends, and fell in love with one another."
Second part sounds familiar, doesn't it? There is another servant of Mystra who is very similar to Gale. Azuth. A mortal that became a god of spellcasters. Do you guys know what his relationship with her looks like? Here:
"In life, and beyond, Azuth maintained a dynamic relationship with his divine superior Mystra; having served as her Chosen, her subordinate, and her lover. Azuth was subservient to both Mystra and later Midnight, having sat as an adviser for and acted as a favored student of the goddess of magic."
And what does Azuth think of Mystra? This:
"There was once a wizard who wanted power beyond all mortal reach. Such stories always end poorly. But luckily for the wizard, the Lady of the Mysteries took a shine to him and became his queen. She granted him powers—such powers—until he was no longer a mere wizard but a god in truth. A god dedicated to his lady and all who wore her crown."
Eh? Doesn't this sound familiar? Being a chosen, subordinate and lover at the same time? The want for power that will always end badly (Yes, this is a reference towards Karsus). That both Karsus and Gale sought her crown, while Azuth did not? And you know what? Karsus didn't even kill Mystra (or rather Mystryl) because he wanted to be a god out of blind ambition. This is the real reason:
"In −339 DR (3520 in Netherese reckoning), the Netherese archwizard Karsus took it upon himself to defeat the phaerimm that were threatening the Netherese empire. He had spent years researching Karsus's avatar, the only 12th-level spell ever created, which was designed to temporarily rob a deity of their power and grant it instead to the spellcaster."
Karsus wanted to protect his home. That's it. He wasn't the scheming, malicious mastermind history makes him out to be. And he didn't even seek to kill Mystryl. He just wanted to take her powers temporarily to destroy the phaerimm and end the life-drain spell that plagued his homeland. Do you remember Gales line about being "someone with the power of a god and the heart off a mortal"? Yeah. It's a shame it didn't really work out for Karsus:
"Karsus chose to rob Mystryl, and when her godly essence poured into him his mind and body were overwhelmed and he found that he was incapable of wielding such power."
This line definetly makes me believe that mortals that become gods definetly get their mind broken.
Kelemvor went from a man who wanted to be fair and just to someone who remains unfazed by whatever reasons a mortal may had to act a certain way. Midnight, who became the Mystra in Bg3, never wanted to be a god, yet when she became one she left Kelemvors side (who had been her mortal lover) and, in time, abandones the love she had held for many little things a god has no time to care about. Bhaals mind was completely sundered apart and he became a bloodthirsty lunatic. Bane was consumed by his aspect of Tyranny. Myrkul got his heart almost completely hollowed out. And Cyric? Let's not even go there, because damn. That man is more crazy than Bhaal (probably due to the fact that Bhaal went to quite some effort to make that happen).
And Gale? Gale loses his passion for poetry, his love for music, his appreciation for books, his dedication towards his mother and the tea-time they shared. He doesn't even visit them anymore. So, if you're living in the forgotten realms: Don't become a god. It will ruin your life.
I realized I lost sight of what I actually wanted to write. Gale, despite being close to Mystra, is only a mortal. He can and will be discarded if he is no longer perceived as useful or loyal enough. And that isn't something unique to only Mystra and her chosen. Gale can straight out tell a Dark Urge who become Bhaals chosen that being a gods chosen is no small thing. Yet he also, correctly, points out that the moment you become one you have no longer a real choice: You must follow your god wherever they go. If Gale goes against Mystra she sets off the orb in his chest and kills him. If Durge goes against Bhaal he rends their mind to pieces and makes a slave out of them.
It's the same with Bane and Gortash. Gortash, while being loyal to Bane, is not as blindly devoted towards him as Gale is to Mystra. He knows that he is just a tool and expects that sooner or later he will want to do something that Bane will disapprove of. Gale and Gortash actually seek the Crown of Karsus for the same reasons: To become a god and free themselves of their own deities. Ironically, Bane also has a pseudo-sexual relationship with his followers. At least in a way:
"Bane prefers to keep to the shadows, allowing his servants to carry out his intricate plans. On the rare occasions in which he appears, he takes the form of a shadowy humanoid figure - often bare-chested."
Bane also has a whole thing going on where he flirts with those he seeks to employ (or just likes/finds attractive), touches other peoples faces constantly, uses a sotty voice and so on. Really. Read the Avatar Triology. It's a wild ride.
As for Bane and Maram. Bane never was Marams chosen, but he definetly was one of his champions. He was also his slave: so once again the whole theme of not really being able to go against the god that picked you. Bane, when he was still in Abeir, actually managed to make a name for himself as "The Bane of the Ancients". And Maram would not just allow any slave to form at least some sort of identity. No. Bane was special to Maram because he was useful. And the sexual aspects... I already mentioned in my post about Astarion (part 1 of the series) that Bane may turned out the way he did because Maram has zero morals and isn't above using sexual violence.
The three of them, Gale, Gortash and Bane, are also very much ambitious idiots who pursue(d) godhood. Gale can become the God of Ambition if the player encourages him to do so, or die trying. Gortash definetly tries, although he fails at the last three steps. And Bane already succeeded in becoming one and now wants to be King of the Gods. Yeah. They are blinded by their ego.
2. Gale, Durge (and Orin) and Bhaal as individuals whose whole Identity is tied to a god:
Mystra is more than just the goddess of magic. She is magic. The weave is an extension of her. And Gale loves magic. He is good at it. His best friend, Tara, was summoned by him through magic. That man spent his entire life studying and practicing it. And that ruined him. Because in the beginning of Bg3 he believes that he is only worthy anything at all because of his prowess in that particular field. There is a line act 2, during the scene in which he summons the illusion of a starry night, in which he straight out tells the player that he only recently found something worth living for again: Genuine connections that have not some giant power-inbalance going on. And it is precisely because of that small hope, this realisation that he is worth more than whatever Mystra (most likely unintenionally) made him believe, which allows us to not only talk him out of activating the orb beneath Moonrise Towers, but also at the end of act 3 during the final. He was reminded that there are more purposes in life than just being a gods chosen. His whole identity revolved around magic and we, as the player charactere, can either help him understand that he is more or let him fall and then proceed to watch how he follows Karsus (something Tara points out in the Epilogue party). As previously mentioned, once Gale becomes a god he is no longer the Gale we came to know. His whole identity, as with all gods, now revolves around their portfolio. For Gale that is ambition and the karsite weave. Congratulations Gale.
I don't think I need to explain the Dark Urge and Orin that much. Honestly. They were both abused and groomed to be Bhaals chosen. Their whole lives revolved around Bhaal and what he wants them to be. When we meet Orin she is already almost completely subdued by Bhaal. Minthara accuratly describes her as being "lost to madness and blood". And when Orin doubts? when she begins to question her purpose? When her whole identity comes crashing down the moment you tell her about her mother and Sarevok? About how she was abused and used? She becomes a burden, a thing to be discarded. Bhaal doesn't waste a second punishing her for it. At least the Dark Urge gets multiple chances to return to their former position.
Let's move on to Bhaal and pick at his own mortal life. Bhaal has been given two backstories, in both of them he was closely connected to Jergal. Like really closely. In the first he was Tharlagaunt Bale, a netherese Archwizard and peer of Karsus (yes, he worked together with him) and in the other one he was Arabhal and served the Crown-Sorcerers of Rdiuz.
Bhaal, as Tharlagaunt Bale, was one of twelve chosen wizards, specifically picked out by Jergal, to inherit a spark of his divinity so that he can redefine it. Spoiler alert: The twelve were actually betrayed. Had Jergal managed to complete the ritual they would have been turned into mindless liches chained to his wilk. Sure, they would have inherited a minor spark of Jergals power, but would also have lost everything else.
Bhaal as Arabhal was a Chief Assassin and Spymaster and Jergal was his patron deity. And what did Jergal do? This:
"In the Year of Chilling Laughter (-439 DR) the Crown-Sorcerers of Rdiuz used this nascent worship, combined with the fragments of the dead god they had recovered, to create the god-killing seven daggers of Rdiuz. It was at this point that Jergal, the Lord of the End of Everything intervened, concerned that the Crown-Sorcerers might interfere with his plans for the revised Ascension ritual. Under cover of darkness in the Year of Dripping Daggers (-438 DR), the Pitiless One stole the seven daggers of Rdiuz and murdered all the cultists, transforming them into ravenous ghouls."
The aforementioned Ascenion Ritual very much parallels the one I already mentioned. Both times Bhaal had something to do with it: As Tharlagaunt Bale he was indirectly chosen by Jergal and was supposed to participate in that ritual himself. As Arabhal he retrieved the bone-shards of the dead god which were used to craft the daggers. And Bhaal really dis believe, both times, that Jergal would not turn on him. He was wrong.
In the first backstory he spent his entire life preparing to ascend alongside eleven other wizards, only to get a harsh reality check. In the second one Jergal, as Lae'zel puts it with Vlaakith, sinned against him. Acted against him. By killing almost everyone. Bhaal lost friends to Jergal, people he had known for years - gone. Their lives snuffed out. No wonder he goes against Jergal. He was probably the one to tell Bane and Myrkul that if they were to steal the power of a god it should be him. His identity was ripped out of his hands and buried.
3. Gale, Ketheric and Myrkul as wealthy and influential people, who also have quite some ego:
Gale has a wizard tower, was Mystras chosen and seems to come from a family of spellcasters. His mother was wealthy enough to allow him to attend the best academies a young wizard can visit. Ketheric also has a tower, is a gods chosen and also a lord. That man is wealthy, alright? And Myrkul was the heir to the Throne of Murghom when he was still alive, which means: Money, treasures and gold. Lots and lots of gold.
This privilege also seemed to have nurtured a sense of entitlement and ego in them.
Gale, let's face it, is not as innocent as he likes to portray himself. Was the relationship between him and Mystra unhealthy? Yes. Should she have waited before getting into contact with Gale? Definetly! Is Gale some innocent casuality that did nothing wrong? No. He is ambitious, seems to harbor quite a power-hungry streak, impatient and certainly acts like he is the greatest wizard wandering the realm. I mean, just play a sorcerer or any other magic-user and un thw first conversation you can have with him he is like: "Oh, I meant to ask if you're studied in magic. Which you are not." So, yeah. Or the beginning of act 2 where he feels like he needs to mock a sorcerer that tells him that he doesn't need to describe shadow-magic to them? The ritual-circle in Moonrise Towers? Hm? Any bells? Any arrogant undertones? He definetly acts and acted like he is better than almost everyone else. And he doesn't even realize it. Still love him though.
And Ketheric? Gods. That man murders hundreds, starts wars, curses an entire region and traps and tortures his daughters lover. And he still acts like he is justified in doing so. Did the gods fuck him over? Yes, especially Shar and Myrkul. Did he overstep quite a few boundaries a long time ago? Also yes. I understand that it was grief, the loss of his wife and daughter, that drove him to do these things. But he never even expresses any kind of regret! He is only sorry about the fact that Isobel has turned against him. And if we allow Marcus to bring Isobel to him? He wipes her mind and makes her an obedient puppet. Great parenting. Did Myrkul tell him to take a page out of Bhaals book? Looks like it.
And Myrkul? Honestly? Arrogant, entitled, haughty. You can take the prince out of his kingdom but not the royal sense of superiority out of the man. He views everything and everyone as lesser. More stupid. Disposable. And so on. Unless its Bhaal. Bhaal is fine. He likes him. Everyone else though? Nah. He can do without them.
That's enough for today.
I am going to bed. This time for real.
As always, feel free to offer your own ideas and thoughts! I am always happy to discuss various topics.
Bg3 Companions and how they parallel The Dead Three (both the gods and their chosen).
Part 1: Astarion
I am a sucker for parallels between villians and (anti-)heroes. It makes the dynamic between them and the progression of various story aspects so much more interesting.
Which is why I decided to take a closer look at the Dead Three and how they resemble the Bg3 Companions. Because yes, there are many similiarities.
1. Astarion, Gortash and Bane as slaves and emotionally insecure individuals:
Those that have read my previous analysis for Gortash/Bane and Durge/Bhaal will definetly know what I am talking about.
Those three have been slaves for years. Astarion to Cazador, Gortash to Raphael and Bane to Maram (an Ancient Evil of Abeir). They spent years trapped serving a being that they could not fight against. We definetly know that Astarion was unable to lift a single finger against Cazador, and the only reason he managed to challenge Cazador was because of the Tadpole. Gortash was sold to Raphael by his own parents. There are some implications that something similar to a warlock contract was involved and if it is so than Gortash would not have been able to do anything against Raphael as well. He only got out with the help of either Helsik (who is a favored warlock of Mammon and definetly could help find a loophole in the contract that may have existed) or with the help of Bane, who could very much fulfill the same function. Bane definetly was utterly defensless against Maram in the beginning. Being enslaved to a Primordial God is an absolutely horrific fate because said god can and will break your mind. Sure, Cazador can inflict the most vile torments upon Astarion but as powerful as he is, he is not comparable to Maram. He cannot really turn Astarion into a mindless puppet. Raphael? Also very powerful, more so than Cazador. He definetly can and will manipulate you and wreck your mind, although he needs magical components to be able to do so (Remember how Hope got tortured in her dreams through a dream-catcher?). Maram just has to look at you and can invade your thoughts and dig into the deepest parts of your psyche. That being said, we don't know how Bane got away. He freed himself (or had Bhaals/the Crown-Sorcerers of Rdiuz aid in doing so) some time after he first came to Toril. But the details are unknown.
Their past as slaves also nurtured very similar fears: Affection, kindness, honesty. All three of them are afraid of REAL intimacy. The kind that makes you break down crying infront of another person without feeling ashamed, the kind that allows you to answer kindness with kindness.
Astarion, after some time (I think in act 2?) openly admits that. He believes that to show what he truly feels will get him hurt through either direct punishment or subtle manipulations. Do you remember his dream scene in act 1 on a origin run? How he forces himself to smile? He struggles to express his emotions (which becomes obvious in act 2) because he has spent 200 years denying and hiding them. And it is only due to the player that he slowly understands that there are people out there who do care and don't seek to hurt him. But just because he started to learn this doesn't mean he is fine after the game (if you choose his spawn ending). He is not. In act 3 he still expresses how the player is unique, how other people don't have a heart like them. Which is not true. Karlach cares, Wyll cares and the others care as well. Even Minthara in her own way. And it is very important that we can tell him not only that, but also that there are many people in the world who will care about him if he only allows himself to be cared for. I don't think he could come to that exact realization on his own so soon. It is also worth mentioning that we, as the player, did not always just do what he demanded. During the mirror scene in act 2 he tells us to leave him be because he doesn't want us to know about the scars on his back (something that is a source of shame to him). Only by telling him that we know that it is technically not our problem but still want to help (and in so doing imply that we want the best for him) are we able to find out about this part of his story without having Rapahel humiliate him.
Gortash can't handle his own emotions in any way as well. He literally wears a coat that keeps him from being afraid. And did you see how he react when Karlach confronts him? When she tells him that evil doesn't even need to have a cause? He looks away, rolls his eyes, takes a step back. He behaves like a child confronted with something they know is true but are incapable of accepting, because that would mean they were wrong and that also means they would have to admit that they made a mistake. That they slipped. Gortash is not stupid. He sees what the Hells did to her and when Karlach first confronts him in the audience hall he dismisses her. But in his own chambers? He can't run away there, which is why he looks away. He still claims that he did it for the greater good because that is what he has to believe in order to keep control of himself. According to Fytz he did like her. And admitting that he hurt someone he cared for? That requires to be actually able to reflect yourself and handle your own emotions. Something he never learned to do. Also: The Dark Urge. Even with them they try to act confident and only through insight checks do we learn that he missed them. He admits something similar out loud, but there is a key difference: He wasn't the one to hurt them like he did Karlach. And there is also the fact that he views Durge, unlike Karlach, as ruthless as himself. And when the Durge tells them that they liked him? Openly display some kind of affection? He hesitates. He is taken aback. He doesn't know how to properly react. Even the question that follows ("Is that what you-") is expressed in a tone that too me sounds like he is trying to make sense of it.
And Bane? Gods, that man has issues. But I already went through Bane and his emotional struggle on my previous post, so feel free to visit there.
Another factor that makes those three similar is their slaver and how they can confront them. Astarion does it with the help of the other bg3 companions. Bane faced Maram together with Bhaal and Myrkul as mortals. And Gortash, in a sense, also faced Raphael. We can find a letter between him and Helsik in which he requests to return to the House of Hope, tho for what purpose is unknown. And not only did he return there (most likely with the Dark Urge at his side) but also went into Cania and stole from Raphaels father.
There is also something to be said about the fact that all three of them got the chance to not continue the cycle. Astarion can walk away, he can be convinced to not go through with the ritual. But that requires the player to actually read between the lines and listen to what he says. Astarion doesn't want to end up like Cazador and both the Narrator and our player charactere can point this out to him.
Gortash? He could have stopped. Especially if you play Durge and appeal to him he seems to consider walking away from the whole Absolute plot for a mere moment. But he doesn't. Because the Durge that stands before them, the one that asks him to stop, is not the one they grew to like (and maybe even love). In that moment Gortash realizes that he has nothing left but his own ambitions. He doesn't have any siblings, he doesn't have parents that love him, his former friend Karlach hates him, his allies (Ketheric and Orin) betrayed him, his underlings are ultimately loyal to Bane, and Bane himself only cares for the Absolute. The Dark Urge was his only friend. The only one that liked him for the man he was and not the one he pretended and/or tried to be. And now they have changed beyond recognition. Perhaps Gortash could have changed as well if he had walked that path with Durge together. But that chance is gone. The Durge did, afterall, only changed for the better because their mind was completely destroyed and they had to start again.
And Bane travelled together with two other people who never really learned how to accept affection either. Both Bhaal and Myrkul are driven by their ambitions and fears as well. There is something incredibly tragic about the fact that Bane, most likely, was never told that he didn't need to pursue power in order to feel safe and to be loved: Because Bhaal and Myrkul believed the very same thing. That only power can save someone. Bhaal came to believe it because of Jergal, and Myrkul was raised a prince of a vassal state. His own home practiced slavery, which is probably why he clings to his royal status even in godhood: If he had not been born into power he would have ended up as a slave.
We can also consider physical intimacy.
Astarion was SA'd mutiple times. That is a huge part of his story. Because of that he struggles experiencing it and mostly views it as a tool to get what he wants, which is sad because the mere thought of being intimate seems to repulse him. Yet he still forces himself through it right up until the player charactere actually helps them stand up against Oblodora (or whatever she was called).
Gortash views physical intimacy in much the same way. We can find multiple letters throughout act 3 that prove this: He offers his body to get what he wants. Even Raphael interacts with the player, Mol and Hope in a way that has sexual undertones. And forcing Astarion out of his clothes in that one particular scene in the Last Light Inn? Raphael doesn't respect boundaries. At all. Hope outright confirms that when you speak with her infront of the Boudoir. Gortash definetly has some trauma in that direction.
Bane, especially in the Avatar Triology, views s*x as a tool of domination. Hells, even normal physical intimacy (like a hug or a comforting hand placed on a shoulder) is something that serves him only if he wants something. Do you guys remember how he interacts with Kelemvor? The flirting and face touching? How he humiliates Adon by kissing him? How he always touches the faces of the people he uses as avatars? How he uses an almost sotty voice? Yeah. That is not the action of a man who has a healthy relationship towards physical intimacy. What caused this? I don't know, but I wouldn't put it past Maram to use SA, or anything that comes close to it, as a punishment. Maram has zero morals.
2. Astarion, the Dark Urge (and Orin) and Bhaal as individuals who suffer from an unnatural hunger and were turned into a "monster" against their will:
Astarion, as a vampire, suffers from the hunger for blood. He needs it in order to survive. Minthara correctly points out that, despite many people in Faerun claiming that his hunger is unnatural, his need for blood is not so different from a wolves need for flesh. We do not judge a carnivore for following its instincts, yet we do say that a vampire is an abhorrent thing because they feed on other people. Don't get me wrong, I understand why, but I also appreciate Minthara for pointing out that it is stupid to call the hunger "unnatural". Is Astarions condition unnatural? Yes, because it violates the natural order of the world. Is the hunger itself unnatural? No. Unless we call a mosquite or even leech unnatural as well.
The Dark Urge does not hunger for blood in the literal sense, like Astarion does, but more in the meraphorical: They desire its spillage, something that drives them into madness because Bhaal specifically designed them to be this way. The Dark Urge does display unhealthy cannibalistic tendecies, but those seem to be a personal preference and not on born from a hunger they cannot control.
Orin, as a Bhaalspawn, suffers from being drawn to death as well, although in different ways. Yet she, unlike Durge, was not actually forcefully compelled to slaughter. She was groomed into it. Which is somehow even worse.
Bhaal suffers from both the literal and metaphorical kind: In the Moonshae Triology he is shown as someone who, like a vampire (aside from the fact that he doesn't need it to survive), is attracted by the scent of blood. He leers over the Earthmothers corpse because he killed her and the sight and scent of her blood sets him off. He drinks it and his followers often smeer the blood of their victims on his altars so that he can taste it. And the metaphorical hunger refers to the hunger for death: He hates life and being in the presence of something that is alive makes him ravenous. Despite people portraying Bhaal like someone who exults in hapless slaughter he is actually the opposite (Bg3 is the only source we have that displays him as a maniac without impulse-control): He craves control, over himself and others. In the Moonshae Triology he puts his own plans on hold if he feels himself slipping. So yeah. An unnatural hunger, or at least something that can be considered as such, is present in all three of them. Astarion suffers from it because it is his nature. Durge because they were designed to be that way, and Bhaal because he has long since lost whatever sanity he was able to call his own as a mortal.
On to the matter of the whole "they were turned into a monster against their will". I don't think I have to explain much about Astarion. Cazador turned him without even explaining what being a vampire entailed. Sure, he saud that Astarion would live forever, but he made absolutely no mention about the slavery, the powerlessness and the multiple weaknesses a spawn has. Astarion was forced to make desicion without being fully aware of the consequences. Which means he didn't really wanted to be a vampire. It was just the only out he had in that moment, because he was bleeding to death.
I don't need to elaborate that much on the Dark Urge either. They never had a real choice, less so than Astarion, because they were Bhaals child from the very first breath. Every Bhaalspawn is born unclean, their blood thick with the sins of their own father. They are not necessarily evil people, but spells that detect an alignment will always categorize them as such. Others will always be unnerved by their presence. They have little choice in who or what they want to be. And the ending you get in which you loose to Orin? A perfect representation of the theme of having no autonomy and control.
Orin is much the same. She was raised in a murder cult and the moment she doubts Bhaal turns her into the Slayer by force. That woman never had an ounce of control over her life. Even her mind is ruined.
And Bhaal? For him I will have to explain one of the two backstories he has been given: In this backstory he was, as a mortal, Tharlagaunt Bale. A powerful netherese Archwizard who worked alongside Karsus for years. Tharlagaunt Bale was one of twelve chosen, picked by Jergal, to inherit some of his divinity. All of them were, however, betrayed by Jergal and only three survived: Alithar Chonis, Elah Nydra and Bale. But the part of this backstory I wanted to actually talk about is this one:
"He is most often depicted as a hulking brute covered in bleeding wounds, and armed with a wicked, curving dagger. His head is flayed of flesh, taking on the visage of a bone white skull surrounded by a halo of blood. In this form Bhaal is supposed to be an unthinking brute that slays without thought or question. It is believed this depiction derives from the last days of Bhaal’s life where he was half mad from poison and torture and rampaged across Calimshan and Tethyr before being slain."
This is the description of one of the two Avatars he has been given. Also:
"Ultimately Bhaal was betrayed by his former companions, poisoned and mutilated by magic until he resembled a hulking behemoth consumed by bloodlust."
These two passages seem to imply that while Bhaal certainly liked blood as a mortal, as described here:
"Bhaal's Rest: Bhaal's Rest is a ritual obeyed every month whereby the Bhaalyn with the greatest kill count or most prestigious kill is rewarded by filling the temple's sarcophagus with the blood of sentient beings and the winner then lays down in the sarcophagus and is shut in for the night (a practice Bhaal was said to enjoy on occasion)."
You may also want to know about this one:
"He was ultimately slain and was secretly buried in an underground vault known as Bhaal’s Rest (the name given to the secret crypt hidden in every temple of Bhaal)."
Where was I? Right. While Bhaal seemingly enjoyed blood even as a mortal he was not yet at the point where he went completely off the rails when faced with the mere scent or sight of it. That particular mental problem seems to be a direct result of the torture he suffered. Bhaal was quite literally mutilated into a monster, and whatever agonies he endured drove him completely mad. So yeah. While he wasn't a good person as a mortal he certainly was not as deranged as he is now. Also puts the importance of self-control within his doctrine into perspective.
3. Astarion, Ketheric and Myrkul as wealthy individuals who are connected to undead forces and also display a haughty mindset:
Astarion was, before being turned into a vampire, a magistrate in Baldurs Gate. He had influence and power. And magistrates are not poor. That man had a good life before his racism (and yes, he definetly displays racist tendecies) got him into the whole situation with Cazador.
We don't know much about the Thorm family that predates Ketheric, but given that he was the lord of Moonrise Towers before ever even considering worshipping Shar (and later Myrkul) it is safe to assume that he had been either born into wealth or managed to earn it. As a lord he also wielded power and prestige.
Myrkul was the Crownprince and heir to the throne of Murghom, a vassal-state to Mulhorand. I don't need to explain what kind of power and wealth you get from that. Myrkuls surname is Bey al-Kursi, while Bey is actually a title of power:
"In the Hordelands, prior to the 15th century DR, the title "bey" could be found in use in the nation of Murghôm. This went as far back as the days of ancient Netheril, when mortal Myrkul was known as Myrkul Bey al-Kursi. The title was a singular position within the nation, known fully as the "Bey of Murghôm". Those who held the title had the power to appoint emirs to rule over a location the bey specified. Furthermore, the bey could rule and enact laws in a city, such as Zindalankh, offering protection in return. To attack a city that was under the Bey's protection would be considered a declaration of war against Murghôm as a whole."
Those three were influential. Now to their connection towards undead forces.
Astarion, most obviously, is a vampire. He is classified as undead was surrounded by other vampires for 200 years.
Ketheric began to practice the necromantic arts in order to bring back his daughter Isobel under the guidance of Balthazar. He later became the chosen of the god of necromancy and continued to employ the service of undead creatures: Ghouls most notably among them. There is also the whole Shadowcurse thing.
And Myrkul was a wizard, a necromancer. And a powerful one at that. We don't know if the practice of necromancy was a common thing in Murghom during his time or not, or if that was just an interest he developed on his own. There is also the whole thing about being the god associated with necromancy.
As for the three of them being haughty and arrogant:
Astarion displays racist tendecies and clearly believes that his life, as an elf, is worth more than that of a gnome or goblin. I mean, really. The comments he makes in the Grymforge, the whole situation with the Gur, the talk you can have with him after he bites you for the first time... Astarion is a flawed man.
In Moonrise Towers we can find multiple letters in which Ketheric hints at the fact that he views others as disposable and less important compared to him. He recruits goblins because they are disposable fodder in the war he seeks to wage, he recruits drow because they are blindly hubristic, gnolls because they are unthinking savages and so on.
And Myrkul is just the worst. In the Avatar Triology his superior-complex becomes quite obvious when we look at his inner monologues about Bane. He also just throws his own followers, who he views as mere cattle, away because their lifes are worthless, and even considers other gods beneath him (Bhaal is the only exception because they are besties and have an unbreakable, symbiotic friendship. That for once seems to be genuine). He is arrogant incarnate, although we have to put some respect on his name because he is the actual brains of the Dead Three.
Another parallel Astarion, Ketheric and Myrkul share is that they are the oldest and most tired of their respective party.
Astarion, too me, reads like someone that has lost whatever joy he once held for Toril and only begins to rediscover it during his travels. I am also pretty sure that he is older than Minthara (I will not count Halsin because that man can barely be considered a companion).
Ketheric is definetly done with the mortal world and only clings to life because he hopes too "reclaim" Isobel. Yeah, have I ever mentioned that some of the things he says are kinda creepy? He is also older than both Gortash and Orin.
Myrkul was also older than Bane and Bhaal when they were still mortals, and given that Myrkul is exhausted the moment Bane opens his mouth we can also deduce that he is absolutely done with not only him, but also godhood in general (He did enjoy being a mortal during the Time of Troubles). Bhaal is most likely the only reason he still sticks around.
I think that's it. I have covered whatever I could think of. Although I will probably add some things later.
Feel free to offer your own ideas in the comments!
I think I will go to sleep now. Writing for three hours has given me a headache.😀
The Parallels between Bane and Gortash, and their relationship to Bhaal and the Dark Urge
As someone who is fascinated with the Dark Three and has taken multiple deep dives into their lore, the fact that both mortal Bhaal and Bane are very similar to their aforementioned chosen is very interesting to me.
I decided to take a closer look at the four of them and work out the details. Said details are below the cut.
1. Bane and Gortash as slaves:
What most people don't know about Bane is that he was, as a mortal, a slave to a primordial evil from the beginning of time. Said evil was called "Maram of the Great Spear" and was also one of the Seven Lost Gods of Abeir (Banes original home. Yeah. He is technically an alien in Toril). Bane, despite being enslaved by a literal Primordial Evil, displayed even back then a lot of prowess in battle, having earned the title "The Bane of the Ancients" back in Abeir. We don't know how exactly Bane became a slave, whether or not he was born into it or sold, but we do know that he developed serious mental problems during that part of his life (which is not a surprise). How Bane escaped Maram is unknown, but given that the Crown-Sorcerers of Rdiuz were the ones to break the ancient bindings that kept Maram at bay, that Bhaal (back then still known as Arabhal) worked for them, and that Bane was employed by said sorcerers later on, we can assume that they had a hand in freeing him. Maybe Bhaal himself helped him, which sets things up nicely for other parts of this post.
Gortash, of course, was sold by his own parents as a child to the devil Raphael and raised in the House of Hope. There are already confirmations in the game that he was tortured and abused. He later managed to escape the House of Hope, though by which means we don't really know. There are theories floating around that Helsik somehow managed to help him escape or that even Bane himself had a hand in it, but, sadly, we aren't told how it actually happened.
So both definetly have a similar backround as slaves to a being they cannot possibly hope to defeat alone.
2. Bane and Gortash as strangers:
Okay, let me set the scene here: Bane came to Toril from Abeir, which is a completely different world. And although they are similar there are still differences. Bane came to Toril as part of Marams slave-army. He lost his real home (and possibly also family) when he was a child and was now sent to die in a place he knew nothing about. The cultures, the languages, the customs, literally EVERYTHING was new to him. He had no knowledge of Toril. Zero. All he knew was that he was supposed to fight against the magic-users of Rdiuz. That is an incredibly frightening situation to be in, even if you posess his strength of will.
Gortash on the other hand went from Toril to the Hells, Avernus to be precise. He also knew nothing of the hells aside from the fact that they were a place you really don't want to end up in. Does anyone know how long he spent there? Because depending on how long he spent there and the time he got back towards Baldurs Gate, the city may have changed as well, although I can say little about that.
So yeah. Those two were taken away from everything they new (two times actually) and just thrown into an incredibly dangerous enviroment and expected to just suck it up.
3. Bane and Gortash as affection-seeking individuals:
That may surprise some but despite their demeanor and dedication towards trying to not rely on others (because that makes you vulnerable and neither of them can, in any way, admit a certain desire for kindness) they do, actually, want to have someone that appreciates them. Someone that respects them.
We see that in Bane multiple times during the Avatar Triology: Especially with Blackthorn. Banes whole doctrine is about assembling and keeping power, about having no equal and ruling over all others, about kindness being a weakness. And yet, when Blackthorne shows him mercy and kindness after Bane got wounded during the Time of Troubles (something that is a sin in the religion he established) he not only tolerates it but accepts it with gratitude (no, he doesn't admit it to himself). He begins to like Blackthorne and when he acidentally kills him (because Bane doesn't think things through and just assumes thinngs will work out because he is the one doing it (remember how exhausted Myrkul was because of that)) Bane grieves. The man that had spent thousand of years telling everyone that attachements of any kind make you unworthy of being a leader mourns. Bane goes around and claims that mortals are easily replaced and worthless in the grand scheme of things, but spills tears and cries out loud because over the death of a mortal? Yes, definetly the behavior of someone that never learned that you are allowed to have emotions and like other people. And the tragic thing? Bane is utterly afraid of being known and understood. That is, as we learn directly in the beginning of the Avatar Triology, his greatest fear. Not being enslaved again, not dying, not losing power, prestige or control, but being loved and cared for. Because that would mean he could be manipulated. And that is a fact that makes me incredibly sad but also puts his loud and overbearing demeanor into perspective.
Gortash is very similar. He wears an anti-anxiety coat, presents himself as a man that has complete control over himself and the city he seeks to rule, and yet, at heart, is also just a man that tries to keep his life together by controlling every aspect of it. And I do believe that he is convinced that sending Karlach to the hells would help her become stronger and that it was not some malicious plan of his (it was still utterly cruel but he genuinely doesn't sees it that way). And if Fytz is to be believed, he did care for her in his own fucked up way ("I think you were the only one that kept him a little honest"). That being said it is also plausible that his affections (strictly platonic speaking) for her were also one of the reasons he sent her away to begin with. Do you guys know Mel and Ambessa from Arcane? How Ambessa tells Mel that she sent her away because "she weakened her"? Gortash would do this because he, like Bane, tells himself that genuine connections are dangerous and not affordable for people in their position. And do you remember Gortashs parents? How he doesn't kill them and instead forces them to tell him that he is loved? Yeah? Issues. Serious, serious abandomnent issues.
4. Bane and Gortash as rulers who desire an equal:
Bane and Bhaal. Gortash and the Dark Urge. Lord and Assassin. Tyrant and Liberator. The man that rules and the one that drives the herd into their arms (as Orin so eloquently puts it).
Bane and Bhaal have a long, long history. Those two travelled together for at least six years before meeting Myrkul. They go back a long way. The things is: They did not only respect each other, but actually admired the other one. They liked each other and were a highly efficient duo. Bhaal probably had a hand in getting Bane away from Maram and looking at how Bane handles Blackthorne helping him later on, he probably was immensily grateful towards Bhaal as well. The two of them met each other when they were still young, worked together under the Crown-sorceres of Rdiuz before fleeing Netheril due to the phaerimms life-drain spell together, were both tortured by Jergal in their dreams (because he wanted them to slay the Primordials that had invaded Toril and threatened his plans), and stayed together for the rest of their lifes. In the book Tantras we learn that Bane does want one to share his triumph with, and who, in the long-run, is better suited than his oldest friend? And Bhaal is very similar in that regard. When the Dark Urge looses the duel with Orin they can Sceleritas that they will still try to claim the Crown of Karsus, to which Sceleritas says something along the lines of "What worth lies in world domination/assembling all this power if you don't have a family to return to?" Is it cruel? Yes. Could Sceleritas say that to make them even more miserable? Also yes. Does it make sense for him to speak the truth here? Definetly. Because if you are a ruler you need someone to acknowledge you as such. Not just out of fear or blind obedience, but out of mutual respect and admiration. And if you're an assassin you not only need someone to hire you, but also someone who praises your skills and acknowledges them openly as well. And in a certain way, Bane did exactly that. In 2e Bhaal is listed as serving Bane. We don't really know how that happened but it probably happened shortly after the Moonshae Triology in which Bhaal was thrown from Greater Deity status down to Lesser One. That is a huge loss of power. And Bhaal resides on the lower planes, which is not a good place to be in if you're weakened and hurt. Bane could have killed Bhaal and absorbed his power. He could have stolen his portfolio, he could have enslaved him. Bane has done these things to numerous other divine beings without blinking. Yet he did not. Instead, it seems, he offered his protection in return for Bhaals servitude. And it worked out well. The two of them have no recorded instances of any kind of quarrels between them during that time. Bane respects Bhaal because he knows he is efficient. And Bhaal respects Bane enough to actually listen to him, despite viewing him as an impulsive loud-mouth.
Gortash and the Dark Urge are exactly the same. They respect and admire each other. Gortash wants to have the Dark Urge at their side and share his kingdom with them, and the Dark Urge is awed by Gortashs cunning and ambition and seems reluctant to kill them. It is exactly the same, because even Bhaal never really made any attempts to inflict any direct harm on Bane. Remember the whole "my nearest and dearest" and "favorite assassin" line? Yeah. That works for Bane and Bhaal as well because Bane never had another assassin that served him so directly.
5. Bane and Gortashs want to be challenged:
And when I say challenged I mean questioned and sassed.
We already get a narrator line between Gortash and Durge that straight up confirms that he did miss the harmless arguments with them. He want's someone with a backbone, someone who will tell them when they are wrong. Karlach most likely did it too some degree but was ultimately disposable because she had no part in the Absolute plot. But Durge? They argued back, they discussed, they didn't just submit. They earned not only Gortashs respect (like Karlach did) but also his admiration (which Karlach did not).
Bane reflects that with Bhaal, because just like the Dark Urge, Bhaal would never truly submit to anyone completely. He may follow Banes wishes and kill in his name, but he won't lay down and just allow Bane to do as he wants with him. And do you guys know who else constantly sassed Bane and got away with it because he dared look him in the eyes while doing so? Fzoul, who also, somewhat, betrayed Bane mutiple times and was still kept around.
If you watched The Boys you are definetly familiar with the charactere Homelander, who is very similar to Bane and Gortash (though not as much too Gortash as too Bane): The ego, the insecurities, the delusions of grandeur, the need for love and approval. And that he leaves those that dare speak up against him alive.
Bane and Gortash are proud, but also severely afraid of being questioned and though weak. Yet, simultaneously, hate being thoughtlessly obeyed. Challenge them with words while still aiding them and they will like you.
6. Bane and Gortash have an obsession with industralisation:
While Bane is a god and thinks himself above such things, he definetly does reveal that the fine workings of mortal biology and technology fascinate him. I mean, he get's really excited about it during the Avatar Triology when ge himself was stuck in a mortal body.
And Gortash and his messy experiments that led to the Steelwatch? Yeah. He seems to have taken a page out of Banes book.
7. Bane and Gortash lost their name
Lost their name? Whatever do you mean?
Well... Bane isn't Banes actual name. That is not the name he was given at birth. The name derives from his title: The Bane of the Ancients, which he earned on Abeir. We don't even know his real name. Bhaal and Myrkul possibly do. But it is also possible that Bane himself doesn't remember his name because he spent to much time a slave and got his identity almost completely erased.
And Gortash is just his surname. His real name is Enver. Enver Gortash.
They both have no real identity outside of being "the perfect lord" anymore. That is what they have been reduced to. And who still calls them by their real names?
Bhaal, Myrkul and the Dark Urge. As already mentioned: Bhaal and Myrkul probably do that in the most intimate moments they are capable of sharing. And I can also see the name Enver slipping from Durges tongue.
And what is even more tragic and also strangely sweet? It works the other way around as well. Bhaals real name (depending on which backstory we are going with) is either Arabhal or Tharlagaunt Bale. And the Dark Urge was raised by adoptive parents and must have been given a real name at some point. Bane and Gortash (and Myrkul) know this. In the few moments of genuine trust they dared show affection to one another (in any way) they most likely referred to them with their original names. That being said, the name Bhaal already seems to be a nickname that Bane gave him, given that he only became known as such during the time he spent travelling together with Bane (after Rdiuz and before meeting Myrkul).
Another ramble complete. I may or may not come back to this. We will see.
As always, feel free to leave your own thoughts and correct me on anything I got wrong! 🙃
I knew I had overlooked something! Let me add one more parallel between Gortash Bane:
8. Bane and Gortash as self-made man:
Both Bane and Gprtash were slaves that seized freedom with their own bloody hands. They fought for it and had to learn how to be part of a society (because slaves usually are kept away from it). They had to figure out how to move among wealthy people (Bane in Rdiuz, Gortash with Baldurs Gate (although he probably had it easier due to the fact that he returned to his former home)). And the fact that both Bhaal and the Dark Urge were already present in their lifes during that time definetly makey me believe that they helped those two figure things out because they began to work together rather quickly.
They climbed the ladder from being a slave up to being a god/lord. That is not an easy thing to do.
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