I know you already did a video of you doing/ranking Dick Grayson hot takes (which I look forward to watching that video when I get the chance maybe), but I also wanted to send hot take(s)/take(s) too.
Anyways, my hot take is, while I have enjoyed Dick and Tim's relationship in the past, I don't really want Tim near Dick that much right now until they can learn to write Tim better and to write Tim better in relation to other characters, like the Robins, Batgirls, and ofc Dick. Because some writers have a bad tendency of downplaying and undermining other characters' traits, skills, intelligence (Dick is very smart and good with tech and a great detective and etc., man), and etc. around Tim (like Dick, Steph, Cass, Jason, Damian, etc.). This doesn't just happened with Tim though (seen it happened with Duke and Harper Row just to name a couple other more big examples of this, imo. Happens with Babs sometimes too, but not that often, and I feel like there are getting better about this - I do love Babs btw, but it does sometimes happened with her -. Bruce/Batman himself too sometimes - still love him though -. There are others too though. Not saying this kind of thing only happens with Tim in relation to other characters, just that really happens with Tim quite a lot, imo), but still.
Also just some canon and fandom creators/writers put down the other Robins in favor of/to prop up Tim too often, so yeah, while I have loved Dick and Tim's relationship in the past, and some of Tim's other Batfamily relationships in the past, I just would rather Tim stay from Dick and/or etc. until he and his relationships get better writing and directions. Just imo though.
Also, at this point just prefer Dick and Damian's relationship esp., just because it is great (please give more great stuff with them DC), and because canon and fandom doesn't usually put down one or demonize one or bash one or etc. in favor of the other, like I have seen with Tim and Dick's relationship (Dick is usually the one getting demonized, bashed, made out to be the villain a##hole, put down, etc. btw), and people just actually seem to appreciate Dick and Damian's relationship. Instead of doing all that stuff I said against Dick, plus also saying Dick (and the other Robins, but esp. Dick) just stole and took so much from Tim in adaptations and/or sometimes comics and/or etc. (just not true at all, and this has been disproven and countered so many times by Dick fans and/or people who know Dick more at this point, but some people keep repeating this kind of thing for some reason), while some of them sometimes still acting like they like Dick and Tim's relationship and getting mad of there being less of the relationship over the years and getting mad at other Dick relationships (esp. with Damian). Like, it is just annoying and frustrating and they just sound like the only care about Tim really, and not actually Dick at all. 1/2.
Alright. Here’s my thing:
1) I agree that Tim’s writing is non-existent right now. I mean, actually, I don’t think that’s something that can be argued. He doesn’t have a solo. He’s not involved with the family in any sizable way, outside of surface level interactions (he wasn’t even part of Barbara’s prison planning, which would have felt on brand for him, and I know that’s because he stepped out but also this planning might’ve taken place for weeks leading up to that so…). As far as I’m aware, his involvement in teams prior to his retirement in the Fraction run was nominal. The poor boy needs better writing. Or more writing period.
2) I’m not sure there’s been much interaction with them at all. Like, my personal opinion is that the flaw is not in writing quality, per se — though there is some of that — but rather scarcity. There haven’t been meaningful Tim and Dick interactions since, like, fucking Batman and Robin Eternal or some shit. Maybe during Rebirth when he was zapped and people thought he died for a little bit in Detective Comics. But even then, the drama was his absence and the perception of everyone else’s failure because of that, which is definitionally NOT INCLUDING HIM.
Further, as someone who has read the Batman and Detective Comics runs from Rebirth and beyond, I can’t think of any super memorable character actions from him with anyone else either. At the beginning he had some things going on with Stephanie I think, but it petered out afterwards. It always bothered me that Stephanie and Tim just kind of stopped engaging at the same level they used to after they broke up. Don’t get me wrong, they don’t have to have to be together. But like, even when Dick and Babs are on the outs with each other, they still have an incredibly rich dynamic as two people that care about each other. Meanwhile, it feels like writers dropped a significant portion of Tim’s and Stephanie’s relationship as soon as the romance angle died.
So I dunno if the issue is “they need to be kept apart until Tim gets written with the rest of the family better” or if the issue is “Tim needs to get written with the rest of the family”. You’re right that right now, Dick and Damian have a better dynamic, and I think a key reason why is because they *have* done things together. Damian visited Dick multiple times during the Nightwing rebirth run, during that shit with Dr. Hurt and with the Roy crossover. They had that super sweet moment in Beast World. Dick gave Damian his trapeze bar and told Damian that he was Dick’s Robin during the Robin run. Like they have HAD consistent characterization as being very close… whatever they are.
3) About stealing character traits, I usually see this discussed in terms of non-comic adaptions where Dick is “the Robin” but ostensibly has Tim adjacent traits. For TT: 2003, which is the only one I’ve watched and thus the only one I can comment on (sorry I’m a loser that can read 120 comics but can’t keep my attention span for one full episode of TV), idk that depiction of Robin is very reminiscent of New Teen Titans Dick to me.
More importantly than that, however, I feel like people are missing the point when it comes to Robin in wider media. I have said this multiple times now, but I once got into a conversation with people in my lab about a Batman comic I was reading and they asked who was in it, and were surprised to learn there were multiple Robins. Outside of the comic sphere, people widely DO NOT KNOW Dick Grayson or Jason Todd or Tim Drake or Damian Wayne or heaven forbid Stephanie Brown. So yes, the “Robin” depicted in a lot of media, for the purpose of being recognizable as Robin, is generally an amalgam of traits.
BUT ALSO, the Robins JUST GENERALLY SHARE A LOT OF TRAITS. There’s a reason it’s a mantle. The need for each Robins to have One Character Trait is stupid, and wholly untrue.
(Also Red Robin came from Dick in Kingdom Come so if anyone stole a costume… idk bro 🤷♂️ 🤷♂️… you can keep it tho the suit was fugly AF)
So I guess my conclusion here is that Tim just needs more writing period. While his characterization may not be the greatest, I’d literally take anything involving him doing something that isn’t dumbfuck “smart person comic yapping” at this point. He needs his own solo or at least involvement in a team book, he needs to be built up as a character again so fans and critics alike don’t feel the need to define him by how he’s better or worse than the other Robins, which honestly might be one of the underlying reasons for the comparison problem, and then once he’s cultivated himself again, he needs to be The Brother.
That’s just me tho idk. Also Dick and Damian are so based together they’re great.
