Fleeting Thoughts

I’m me.

[manateeinmoline]

To all the River Song stans that I’ve pissed off lately, I just want to say one thing:

[manateeinmoline]

This. Ask yourself “what did the Doctor do for River to prove his love?”

Nothing. He left her to the weeping angels.

But Rose. He BURNED UP A SUN JUST TO SAY GOODBYE. Did he have to do that? Absolutely not. She was in the parallel universe; he could have just moved on. But he couldn’t. He HAD to see her, even if one last time.

(And let’s not forget that he literally gave her a piece of himself too)

And had Rose asked him to get her; had she admitted SHE was the pregnant one, he would have stopped at nothing to get her back.

Don’t come at me with the River shit. She isn’t the Doctor’s OTP. Rose is. Actions speak louder than words. And burning up a sun is screaming. ☀️

[manateeinmoline]

Let’s talk about this episode.  Trenzalore.  The episode where the Doctor is supposed to die before he’s given his regeneration energy.  He spends 900 years there.  He saves the planet time and time again.  And he grows older.  And at the end of his eleventh life, he summons someone to be with him.

But it’s not who you think.

That’s right.  Clara.  He calls Clara to be with him.  And she witnesses him fight the Daleks, receive his regeneration energy (thanks to her) and is the first to see his new face.  Guess who is not there?

Correct.  River Song.  The woman he “loves.”  Why wasn’t she there?  If she is “the love of his life,” wouldn’t he want her there?  After all, she’s part Time Lord.  Maybe she could use her regeneration energy to extend his eleventh life a little longer (but we all know she’s selfish and wouldn’t do that). 

No.  He summons Clara.  He wanted Clara by his side.  Not his wife.  Why do people ignore this fact?  Why do people assume that the Doctor had romantic feelings for this woman?  He clearly doesn’t.  He called Clara, whom he might have romantic feelings for.  Not River.

And not only that, but Clara is only the second companion in NuWho to witness the change.  Who was the first?

Bingo. 

Clara had to adjust to a new Doctor, just as Rose had to.  River wasn’t around.  She recorded their adventures but was never there for the heavy lifting.  She just showed up, annoyed the f*** out of people, and left.  Doctor Who could’ve carried on without her.  River really had no purpose, other than to fulfill some “wife” role.  How stupid.  Clara was the Impossible Girl.  She saved the Doctor numerous times.  She sacrificed herself for him.  What did River Song ever do?  Besides trying to kill him and slap him?

Once again, River has proven herself useless.  Just a way to try and get people to forget his true love, Rose Tyler. 

[manateeinmoline]

LMAO. River Song stans reporting my page as NSFW because they can’t handle facts. 😆

Whiny crybabies. 😭

I see you. 👀

[reverie-de-la-rose]

Y’all Rose is gonna lose to Amy Pond as the Doctor’s fav companion if we don’t rally. There’s only two of us making arguments for her! 11 hours left!!! We all know the thousands of reasons she is the Doctor’s favorite. He loves Amy but Rose is something else. But me and one other person can’t be the only ones making arguments in the reblogs!! We know we’re right so we are complacent. But we can’t get complacent right now!

[manateeinmoline]

Come on, let’s get our Bad Wolf to win!

[reverie-de-la-rose]

Another Anti River post. Warming up for the next really big one but I needed to get this one off my chest. Scroll or block me if you’re offended.

No, Husbands of River Song does not prove that The Doctor loves River Song. Let’s break down the infamous scene.

River makes this speech:

“Go on, scan the whole parsec! He's not here. God knows where he is right now, but I promise you, he's doing whatever the hell he wants and not giving a damn about me! And I'm just fine with that. When you love the Doctor, it's like loving the stars themselves. You don't expect a sunset to admire you back. And if I happen to find myself in danger, let me tell you, the Doctor is not stupid enough, or sentimental enough, and he is certainly not in love enough to find himself standing in it with me!”

Here, River is setting up a false dichotomy. If he’s absent he doesn’t love her, so if she’s wrong and he’s present, he does. She believes that the Doctor doesn’t love her because he won’t show up for her in this specific moment. The issue is, this is improper logic from the get go. Whether or not the Doctor is willing to put himself in danger alongside someone is not a good thermometer for whether he loves someone. He will stand in dangerous situations for complete strangers. So “if the Doctor loved me he’d be here right now. I don’t think he’s here because I don’t think he loves me,” is already a logical fallacy. He doesn’t have to “love someone enough” to stand in danger with them. It’s just what he does.

The Doctor shows up. He is there. And because River and the audience all have that false dichotomy of “absence in this moment means no love and presence means love,” we are set up to view this as “oh. He must love her because he’s here when she didn’t think he’d be and he called her sweetie”.

When in reality, the simple fact that the Doctor is there in that moment has nothing to do with whether he loves her or not. This scene neither confirms nor denies that the Doctor loves River.

If anything, the scene leans on denying he loves River. Because he doesn’t actually correct River’s statement that he doesn’t love her. We know the Doctor is capable of saying the words “I love you” because he said them to Rose Tyler. She just didn’t hear them because of the connection being severed while he said it. And I think having a love confession cut off like that would make any individual do everything possible get the words out next time if they ever felt romantic love of that depth ever again. (Let’s also not forget that even this encounter between the Doctor and River only happened because the Doctor no longer had Clara around)

That said, my interpretations aside, the entire scene objectively neither confirms or denies that the Doctor loves River Song because the basis on which it’s trying to claim he loves her isn’t logically sound.

It would be like me getting on a horse who regularly breaks into a gallop and saying to my trainer “this horse won’t gallop for me because he doesn’t love me.” Then deciding the horse loves me after all because he listened to my cue to gallop. The horse’s willingness to gallop has nothing to do with love. It’s the same train of logic.

The other events in the episode also don’t confirm or deny that that the Doctor loves River either. Him taking her to Darillium and giving her a sonic screwdriver doesn’t indicate anything because he’s fulfilling what he knows has to happen. And he’s finally accepted that it has to happen, possibly because River is the last remnant he has of Amy.

Yes. This was another negative post. But it’s the kind of post I think I would’ve liked to have read when I was very young and new to the fandom and confused as to why I didn’t believe in the Doctor/River love story. And I want fans like that to have something to validate them.

[manateeinmoline]

This. 👏🏻👏🏻

[manateeinmoline]

Seeing this image caused me to have a thunk.

What if, behind each wall, was Rose?

We know she was on the other side with Ten; but what if, metaphorically, she was with Eleven or Twelve as well?

I've always suspected that the crack in Amy Pond's wall was caused by the rift Rose created coming across the void. Something else got through, of course, but what if she was there too?

As for Twelve, perhaps the wall represents that she was always with him. She did tell Nine that she saw everything as Bad Wolf. So, theoretically, she would've seen him regenerate into a grumpy Time Lord. She would have seen him beat himself up over Clara's death. She could've created the wall for him to work through his grief; knowing her Doctor would come out stronger on the other side.

If this is the case; if this is a subtle nod for Rose; then it is proof that she IS the Doctor's OTP. He carried her in his hearts; why wouldn't she reappear at some point? Even if only in his subconscious. Perhaps he truly didn't know why the wall was there or what it represented. But perhaps, his hearts leapt when he saw the walls because deep down, in the lowest recesses of his brain and body, he knew. Perhaps the part of his hearts that he tried to shutter away suddenly burst open. He tried to bury his Bad Wolf because the pain of losing her was too much.

Maybe this was her way of telling him she will always be there.

[manateeinmoline]

This is why the whole River Song storyline was ridiculous. He didn’t love her; he couldn’t.

I think Moffat kind of realized that later, as more & more Rose hints appeared in Eleven’s run.

[manateeinmoline]

But sure. He loved River. 🙄

[skeletourism]

Nothing anyone can ever say or do in any show ever will EVER be as romantic or as heartbreaking as "I'm burning up a sun just to say goodbye"

[manateeinmoline]

He would NEVER say this to River. Because she WASN’T THE ONE.

[burningupasun]

What if…

[hardythehermitcrab]

#go to your ROOOOOM (via)

[manateeinmoline]

[manateeinmoline]

I just wanted to point something out.

What do you see in this pic? I see two people standing there. But they are supposed to be "married." Why do they look so unhappy? And if they're "so in love" as fools think, why is there so much distance between them? I mean, look. You could drive a bus between their shoulders. This was the moment when he confirmed to her that he did NOT love her with his sad, small smile. The look on her face says it all. But not many husbands and wives stand like this; at least, not ones who are ACTUALLY in love.

Here's a comparison:

Nine with Rose. He had basically just met her; taken her on their first "date." Still learning who the other one is. Basically strangers. And look. No bus could make it through. There is NO space between them.

Another example:

She's holding his arm, they're both smiling and happy. Again, zero distance.

But sure. The Doctor "loves" River Song. Give me a break.

It's clear as day where his hearts lie. And it's not with the hag in the first pic.

[manateeinmoline]

And this isn’t the first time, either. ❤️

Show me when he looks at River like that. It doesn’t exist.

[manateeinmoline]

250 posts! 🙌🏻

[manateeinmoline]

I’ve mentioned before that there are very few hints of Rose in Eleven’s first season.  Basically, the name Powell on the gravestone and the Magpie Electricals sign.  If you want, you COULD say the crack in Amy’s wall is Rose-related; after all, it happened when 2 parts of the universe were weak.  And we know the last time that happened, Rose came through.  So, did she cause the crack?  Perhaps.  But that’s a story for another time.

We all know this pic, it is The Pandorica Opens.  I noticed that Eleven’s speech contained a familiar sentence.  He says “look at me.  No plan, no backup, no weapons worth a damn.”  And then follows that up with “I don’t have anything to lose.”  So, it took me a few times watching this scene and then it dawned on me: THIS IS A ROSE REFERENCE.  Forgetting the “don’t have anything to lose” for a moment, listen to the first part.  The whole no backup part.  THAT was referenced before.  By the Daleks in Bad Wolf during Nine's run. 

So, Eleven is REPEATING something that the Daleks said to his NINTH self.  While Rose was in captivity.  How is that not a reference?  Answer, it’s not. Because Eleven HAD to have been thinking of her when he said it, given that the Daleks said it to him while he could see her captive.

Also, Eleven says “I don’t have anything to lose.”  Which is true, he doesn’t.  He’s already lost the woman he loves, Rose.  And no way in hell is that a River reference.  THAT in itself should tell the River stans that he didn’t care about her; otherwise he wouldn’t have said it.  And she was in that episode; she probably heard him.  So that HAD to have stung.  Good.

And as we know, a man with nothing to lose is a dangerous man.  Eleven was proving that.  He had lost his planet, his people, (according to him) his daughter.  And the woman he fell in love with.  He literally had nothing else.  And that was the most terrifying thing.

So yes.  Rose reference number 3 in season 5.  Proving, as always, that she truly never left him.  After all, she promised him forever. 

[manateeinmoline]

Where’s the lie? 😆