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[betting-on-hope]

Re-Adapting the Adapted : Introduction (Overview)[Piecing Together the Puzzle]

COMIC READER ENTERS THE RING : BEWARE TOXIC CARYLERS!

It's not looking good for you...

MAX VS. THE TOXIC CARYLS (Specifically Sarah aka Lightenerrthang on X/Twitter and MyTayTayHeart too always dissing @twdmusicboxmystery) It's you versus me hons! Now get in the ring! I'm about mop the floor with you two!)

This how you research! And think critically about what you are seeing. You guys are the catalyst for this whole entire series! Thank for the help guys! I mean that from the bottom of my heart! 💚

"Darkness cannot drive out darkness, only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that" - Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. 

Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good" : Romans 12:21 (ESV)"

But my "Mercy Prevails Over My Wrath!" - Rick Grimes (A lesson I learned watching the show. You could learn a thing or two about watching it critically too...)

In my first post I discussed when I was on TD from the back end of season 5, took a break around season 8 and now back on Team Delusional! This is because I would still read the symbolsim analyses @twdmusicboxmystery would make. Plus her symbolism videos made me understand things more clearly. So, I want to go over Volume 10 : What We Become from TWD comic, spanning from issues 55-60. And how it relates to season 05's production, unseen filming and the larger narrative as a whole in the show.

This volume had story beats adapted earlier many times in the tv show before season 05. This volume is where these story beats initially would have taken place, if they adapted it one to one with the comic from the start of the show. But previous showrunners didn't always stick to the book. Or the right order of events. So when Gimple took over and got to this point to adapt it for the show, a lot of it had already been used. Leaving holes in the story and most likely how Grady/Beth filled up the space of said holes for 5A. With the writers picking and pulling from this arc and the previous arcs which should have been adapted already but weren't. Specifically under showrunner Glen Mazarra's run. Mixing this volume with creating the Grady storyline to build upon each other. And using Beth at the center of it all! And how all the storylines throughout TWDU converged all the back in season 5. (More on this in later)

I will also be going over all the times we see this volume's name mentioned/referenced in TWDU as a whole in part 16. Spanning across all shows across TWDU. Most importantly TWD 10x13 - What We Become, FTWD 08x04 - King County and The Ones Who Live season 01. (I go over these in my deep dive on the issues later on in parts 7-12 and What We Become in part 16) (go back and watch 10x13/Talking Dead episode, FTWD 8x04 and TOWL episodes 4 and 5)[I would watch TTD clips on YouTube the next day after episodes aired, meaning I didn't watch every full episode of TTD. If you think there are any important strange things that happening in TTD please let me know and please provide clips if you can! Thanks!]

I actually stopped watching FTWD because I thought the original showrunner Dave Erickson was done dirty being let go. But that's not new for The Walking Dead. (i.e. Frank Darabont's firing, which Jon Bernthal discussed with Sarah and Norman on his podcast REAL ONES. Also Glen Mazzara's firing. With Laurie Holden stating her frustrations with him not reading the comic book and not adapting her character right. And how she stated TV Andrea's storyline was bad. And how she originally contracted for 8 seasons of the show like Andrew Lincoln was. And the renewing his contract for 5 episodes of season 9. They wouldn't do this to Beth/Emily after all the failure right? So now I see why AMC wanted Gimple to take over the entire TWDU as a whole. They wanted him to stick to the comics and adapt storylines that were missed in both previous showrunners runs. Also why the Beth references in TOWL are there. And how the taglines of each show are representative of Beth! (i.e. Beth look alike in background in TOWL + this tumblr ask video pointed out by @candyprankster. (Interesting trunk detail catch there!)(More on this in Part 16) Plus Wolrd beyond connections to! When Frank Darabont was fired after seaso 01 as showrunner, he was underprepared to take on a TV role as he was a film director, Glen Mazzarra took on the reigns of showrunner after he left. Mazzara was not able to adapt the comic correctly wanting to kill everyone off such as Andrea,Carl and Beth in season 03 unexpectedly ruining the comic counterpart's stories. Beth's original death killed by Axel was deemed too dark for TV, thus AMC extinguishing that story beat from the comic. The only story beat NEVER adapted. So, Gimple went back and built a story from the ground up and connected some unused story beats from the comic. Using many different famous story templates to many symbols/symbolisms I found this all out on that PBS interview linked above. I saw it on X when the toxic Carylers discussed this being their idea of wanting it/becoming canon. Nope! NOT IN THIS TIMELINE! (Link in this section the appropriate link regarding Laurie Holden's interview+Add video evidence of her disdain for the story in larry king interview way back when. (In regards about talking about season 03's deaths) + Links to Andrew Lincoln's 8 year contract and renegotiations to stay til 9x05.

OUR SPOON CAMPAIGN WORKED! Well, it didn't. As it was all planned from the start converging all the shows and making her way home on the Greene Route.

As well as The Ones Who Live, specifically episodes 01x04 - What we and 01x05 - Become. I will be focusing on Michonne's mission to find Rick sent off by Judith. (More on this in Part 16) When the titles dropped before the release of TOWL is when I started noticing Volume 10 : What We Become kept being referenced over and over again. I noticed this back in 2023.

They wanted to keep Erickson around as suggested by this article, but he left AMC on his own terms. RIP Dave Erickson's run as showrunner. As AMC couldn't trust him either after the lawsuit he put them through in season 2 of FTWD. Now with Erickson suing AMC as of 2025 after his unjust firing from FTWD. I didn't really love the transition to Gimple's Fear. But I watched the whole series over last year with my mom. (She knows i'm Team Delusional, but doesn't believe in Beth's return lol. She doesn't see the symbolism like TD. She is more of a casual viewer. I am going to wait to show my mom these posts after her return to say that I knew it!) I also read some posts about parallels to Madison Clark (specifically in Gimple's era, which I will discuss part 14.) And some Alicia Clark parallels! I'm really glad I watched Fear again and see all the parallels!

Also the Red Machete webisode titled "What We Become" and how all the titles connect to Beth somehow! With the Nick Bernardone's interview with creativescrwriting.com he states "I’ve heard a lot of good things. But I’m sure people would lie to me either way!" in regards to the fan perception of the webisode. Most likely AMC's way of testing the waters with Beth's return as I believe she IS "Legs" from the post coda scene in Red Machete. As well as this Deadline interview with Avi Youabian where he states "The Red Machete narrative is completely over. We can’t say a lot more than that, but there is more to come. There is a plan." Noting that there is a plan in mind with the Red Machete itself.

I will mention how the Claimers in this webisode link back to Beth and Daryl's s story arcs in Part 3 (Also note that he said in the interview that this was figured out a way to make it work in LA. No, we actually figured out a way to make it work in LA.

"We had the entire production shot at several different ranches around the LA area and Santa Clara area. With a lot of visual effects and scene extensions, we were able to mask LA buildings and backgrounds. It’s just a lot of smoke and mirrors—but it doesn’t take place in Atlanta. The narrative is “Anywhere, America.” (Note that is where Emily lives/was living at the time. Possibly making filming more comfortable for her and not to spoil anything by being seen shooting in GA for TWD. Remember she shot a few indie movies around 2017 in CA. It may have coincided with the filming of Red Machete throwing people off her trail for filming it. She was also wearing a yellow outfit for the film to! Probably to be undetected. This also aligns with the Red Machete taking place GA still as that is where the webisode takes place for the majority of the run.) (Below is Youabian's response to this question asked Do you have specific hopes for future short-form projects within the Walking Dead universe? With Bernadone from the other interview speaking before Youabian who also in this interview speaking before him. And look at Youabian's answer. With not having real estate on the show, most likely referring to the unadapted storylines from showrunners past. Linking the comic volume titles of the webisodes. The arcs that weren't adapted. The story beats not adapted in Mazzarra's run. Plus the helicopter lost arc from Darabont's run of the show. These Titles were chosen for a specific reason. That I am going to uncover as I deep dive into the issues individually. (More on that in Parts 7-12 and Part 16)

The main character Mandy is a proxy for Beth. With them being a family of 3, representing Hershel Beth, (Not Maggie) but Shawn the brother she says she misses in season 4 who died and was in the barn in season 2. Most likely the younger sister being a mashup representation of Maggie/Shawn, a sibling with both Shawn and Hershel dying foreshadow by Mandy's family's death.

I had the same belief as the Carylers when they say TD overanalyzes all the other shows too much. But I think that you guys were actually right! The Red Machete is an original TV weapon, but it represents Volume 13's message of what lengths we are willing to go to keep ourselves safe and the ones we love is this arc's message in a nutshell. In the Deadline interview they mention that the Red Machete is its' own character with heart as well. Most likely representing Beth's big loving open heart, in reference to Daryl. (More on that later in Part 16)

Red Machete WAS the Beth spinoff. That @BethGreenIsHopeUnseen foretold all those years ago saying she would have. We just didn't know it at the time. And now with her closing in on the show, her missing 17 days/Aftermath is coming very soon. (Go back and watch Red Machete webisodes)

PUT WORLD BEYOND SECTION HERE!!!

With Dead in the Water also being a webisode. A kind of reference/follow up to Red Machete in a way. Since it relates to the doomsday cult in season 06 of FTWD with the nukes storyline. Referencing back to Fear season 1's

So I will be going issue by issue to see any similarities to season 05, how it could possibly correlate to the unseen filming and how this arc is still in play to this day. And keeping in mind @twdmusicboxmystery's theories that I think ring true (that I will link as I go)

And how some of them may play a role in the spin offs Daryl Dixon and Dead City. And if we see Daryl in Maggie's hallucination/AU dream (See a fan interpretation here as to how the scene plays out coming up in DC s03.) involving Beth somehow. We'll have to wait and see! The trap AMC set is in full motion with the general pubilc thinking Beth only retruns for a dream/hallucination. Like these videos here, here and here.

And the Daryl Dixon spin off originally titled "Raise the dead" based on that BTS Pic he posted on the box with in the costume department. Remember that?

Gimple even referencing Dave Erickson's FTWD as season 01's tagline being "The End of the Beginning". I knew I saw this somewhere before letting me make that connection. I realized it was FTWD's season 1 OST opening track on YouTube that I saw that a few years ago. Gimple took what was already in Fear and adding to Gimple's version. I noticed this in the Mazzarra PBS interview while working under Frank Darabont that he went back and watched season 1 and saw he he wrote/directed. Gimple did the same thing for ALL previosus seaons.

I also incorporate some more trading cards i found interesting from the TOPPs digital archive app since the original app went defunct back in 2021. And I go over strange things that happen in The Talking Dead as well.

I've decided to make this a multi-post series to make it more palatable not only for me but for the reader as well. Since tumblr only allows 30 pictures per post, breaking this series into parts is the best overall option. Since I have lots of pictures and references to show. And YEARS of information to go over.

My series of upcoming posts I am making are in a fluid state. Meaning I will most likely be going back to these posts and add things to them at a later date if I missed something/found a link I was looking for that I couldn’t. Red text are links/interviews/videos that I remember but couldn’t find at the time of making them. I will make it clear to know when the post is officially finished with the word FINISHED in green text at the bottom of my posts to notify that I have nothing more to add. And blue text is just quick notes i wrote for myself to do. Text in orange are my Works In Progress posts. Editing them frequently.

This is where I need Team Delusional's help. Your help. To prove my/our case of Beth still being alive! If anyone can find me the source/link/screenshot of ANYTHING I mention in red, that I can't locate please let me know if you have anything on what i'm trying to reference. This is going to be a Team Delusional community based endeaver everybody. So tell your friends of TD or past TD members you know if they know anything about the notes I made in red. Thank you in advance!

They are mostly things I noticed on @BethGreeneIsHopeUnseen's account back in the day that stood out to me. The help would be greatly appreciated! Please message me if you think I should add something more to my posts. "We've all got jobs to do."

Before I start this series I want to cite my sources here first. So you can look at them for yourself as I go along. Here are links to the websites, tumblr blogs and tumblr posts I am cross referencing throughout this whole series.

@twdmusicboxmystery's entire account/ Youtube channel. I reference her theory index quite a lot in this series. (Love the videos!)

Team Delusional Masterpost by @arabianbaby53 (Thank you for the archival of everything you have!)

TWDBrasil's post (A big fan site for TWD heavily monitored and reported on the filming of season 05 at the time documenting the actors on set. But the post doesn't cover everything as it stops around mid July and doesn't cover late July/all of August's filming for the rest of 5A-5B. [They got their information from The Spoiling Dead Fans facebook and forum and archived it chronologically here. Thank goodness!]

The Spoiling Dead's facebook. (The OG documenters of the show.)[Also note that Chandler Riggs asked them to keep Carl's death to themselves around season 08's filming. They respected his wish by not posting about until after it aired. Pointing out how they respected the actor's wishes. I would say AMC or Emily herself asked them to not mention her that day of filming. Which would ruin Beth's survival reveal for the general audience at the time. Making their hard work go to waste. TSDF making that post backtracking about the Emily sighting in the white van makes more sense with that context in mind. Not that they didn't like her character or Emily. But because they were asked to, at least for that specific post. Or maybe they got hit with litigation by AMC. Or paid off. Who knows. But the posts are still up presumably because they didn't capture her on camera. Leaving the report just speculation and without concrete proof.] (more on that in part 2)

This Walking Dead photo gallery (Archived more pictures filming from on the sets during the time.)[Not as useful. But still helpful.]

And all the knowledge over my years on Team Delusional thanks to @BethGreeneIsHopeUnseen's account. (The OG Archivist of Beth/Emily content for Team Delusional to be here to this day.)[Why is your account locked?? Come back please! Or at least unlock your account! Tell her to unlock it for just a minute!!! 😭]

Here is a list of unanswered TD questions that I will be referencing throughout this series. Here is a playlist going further in depth by @twdmusicboxmystery. To better get an understanding of why so many of us are still on Team Delusional.

The Walking Dead is one of the few franchises I have been invested in since I was young and the media I consume the most. Engaging with The TV show, the spinoffs, the comics and the Telltale Games series. I feel like I have a lot of expertise when it comes to TWD. Most importantly, Team Delusional! As I was there when TD formed in real time during season 5B. I remember most of the information back from my formative years looking at it constantly. As well as when I started getting back into TD around 2021/2022. My love for lost media/cut content started here and it being about my favorite character Beth Greene always interested me. So I am going to try my best to compile the evidence neatly in these posts. Not only appealing to Team Delusional, but to prove my case to the general audience as well. Or at least convey that something strange happened to Beth after Coda. I guess it took the ultimate TWD fan to figure out the giant puzzle at play. With the help of Team Delusional of course! (Our joint slay is coming in clutch here!) I may not have went to college but The Walking Dead Universe is where I know my facts!

Side note. Back in the day a few years ago I saw that one toxic Caryler on X (who beefed with Abraham's actor over the word pookie on this X post, and how it was inherently a romantic word. But Cudlitz said his mom called him that. In a familial setting. She did not like that. Insinuating that his mother was bad for calling him that... (um ok?) The toxic Carylers only love that because Carol called Daryl that in season 04 and see it as evidence to a Caryl romance foreshadow. How lame do you have to be to get into fights with the actors of a show you claim to love over a word's interpretation.

I also noticed Dawn Glen, the reviewer of season 03 who referenced Team Delusional on X before DD s03 aired.

She said Team Delusional would get a lot out of DD s03. Stated here on X.

She saw the symbolism of Beth in Justina and the conversation with Paz, even though she said it was meant to refer to Isabelle. After s03 aired posted here on X too. I thought to myself if she was seeing the parallels to Beth, why can't the other Carylers? (They just don't want to.)

I was so tired of the toxic Carylers and some of the general audience calling us crazy over the years.

I'm so lucky that I searched the bethyl and the DD series tag on X so frequently during that time/saw posts regarding this on tumblr. (link for tumblr posts talking about this/the person who DMed her and she replied? About Beth singing or something/we would hear her? Thanks!)

So I am presenting my case with all the evidence I know! I also try to recall what I remember from BethGreeneIsHopeUnseen's account from when i skimmed through it back in 2021 before it locked, so it's kinda recent in my mind and I reference things from her account from memory the best I can. I would like for you to go into this series with an open mind. Thank you!

And for any toxic Carylers reading this post or my upcoming theories/analyses, I just want them to know that I love that you love Caryl! Ship and let ship! Let me be clear this is not a message for the nice/calm Carylers in your fandom.

But I don’t think Bethlyers should get flack for seeing Beth and Daryl’s relationship as potentially romantic. As Norman himself has stated many times. And Lauren Cohan, Nicotero and a lot of the cast/crew being fine with it. She was not a child. Nor a full adult woman like Carol. Beth was a young adult who sparked a connection with a man (Daryl) who was a bit older than her. I also saw Daryl/Beth as the visual adaptation of comic Rick/Andrea With her taking the age love storyline from comic Andrea's relationship with Dale. Yes they met on the farm when she was 16, but they hardly interacted with each other. I don't even think they have a one on one scene in together. Season 3 yes, but not season 2. Forming no romantic connection at this time in either season. Also the ICONIC Piéta pose and physical similarities to each other. Making me side eye the Beth "spoiler" post AMC posted on Facebook and X/Twitter back after Coda aired. All these articles/interviews are instructed by AMC to push this narrative that she "died."

Both Emily and Norman were adults playing younger characters than their actually ages. (Remember Norman originally auditioned for Merle. Thus making Norman act out Daryl a little younger as he is the Dixon baby brother.) Whereas Melissa was more closely playing her real age/ a few years younger as well playing Carol. (Early 40s.) Unlike Emily and Norman who are playing the characters much younger than they actually are in real life.

(Insert screenshot about Norman saying Daryl being around 32? 34? comment on Twitter I think during season 4?)

With Emily being in her late 20s during this time playing an 18 year old as confirmed by Emily in this AccessOnline interview back in season 04. (Note how she addresses Daryl's age and shutting down the father/daughter bond that people seem to claim it was. With her seeing Daryl as an adult while playing Beth, an adult at the time herself.)

As well as Daryl's age being up for debate in the fandom and Daryl Dixon season 03 clueing us in on the time frame of his childhood. (Someone on TD made a great analysis of the flashbacks in DD s3 relating to the time frame possibly taking place in the late 80s/early 90s. Can anyone message me that post? @bookqueenrules I think it may have been ur post, if not do you know who? Anyone know?) You don’t have to like them together. That’s fine. I see many toxic Carylers online (mostly on X) still holding grudges over the great Caryl/Bethyl shipping war that happened over 10 years ago now. Saying that Bethylers said some horrible things about Melissa. I didn’t really see that at the time personally, but I have no doubt that there were some toxic Bethylers in our community too. No fandom is without sin.

There is also this interview and Norman's Reddit AMA back after Coda aired. (find link for this review. it says its from the main review of coda? Who wrote the main review? I'm not sure where to find this) This review shows that not only Bethylers/Team Delusional supported their romance, but how some of the general audience did as well! The reviewer here states that "Clearly, there was a romance blossoming between Daryl and Beth. And states "Reedus' performance was clearly his best and more emotionally heartbreaking than when he lost his own brother." Again they are stomping out the false narrative of Beth and Daryl being a sibling dynamic. Going as far as saying he was more emotional over Beth than he was over his own brother. It's literally Daryl mourning the love of his life. Note he was upset about Connie's death close call in 10x09 - Squeeze, but nowhere near emotional as Beth's. Also stomping out the narrative of Donnie being romantic as well. Sorry Donnie fans.

Leah and Isabelle were the only official love interests for Daryl. Visually similar to Beth, both blonde women who had connections with him. Dealing with arcs involving religion. (i.e. Faith, Pope and Nun respectively.) (Beth - "If you don't have hope, what's the point of living?/Leah - "Find me." (As we think Beth is missing from Daryl's + TF's POV. And Leah asks Daryl to stay with her, the inverse of 4x13 - Alone but he doesn't as she is gone by the time he comes back to her cabin.)/Isabelle - "Bet on hope." (Making Daryl start believing in hope again. Beth is the reincarnate of hope. Daryl's hope for living fully is when Beth is found alive/shows up! This is why she shows up in his hallucination as he has not fully accepted his true feelings for Beth still.)

With Daryl never fully able to grow as close to Leah or Isabelle. Since his love still lied with Beth. (find links/interview/video where Leah's love is described as toxic. + Talking Dead clip where they were told specifically not to kiss on TTD not because of COVID either. It was intentional for them not to by the writers. Find Both clips! Thank you! And find the other interview where she talks about what Carol's relationship to Daryl is. I think she referred to Carol like a mother to him. The Carylers won't like that one! Not that I view Daryl as his mother either, I see her as a big sister to him. As they have said they are just best friends numerous times.) He was willing to make it work with Isabelle but his heart wasn't fully committed to their relationship. Thus Daryl kissing Isabelle first. This was Daryl's best attempt to ignite the spark he had with Beth from 04x13 - Alone. But it wasn't the same. Daryl desperately wants his own family by getting with Isabelle and being a father figure to Laurent. But alas she died. And Laurent gone. Heading back to America with Ash. (Below are Norman's interpretations of Daryl's relationships with both Isabelle and Laurent)

Norman's thoughts on the kiss

Norman's thoughts on if he loves Laurent like family discussed with showrunner Zabel (he references deep connections here. Emily in an interview once discussed her deep bond with Daryl. Can somebody find me that interview?)

Making Daryl's conversation at the end on the beach with Carol in DD 03x07 - Solaz del Mar about always running, not being grounded in something and always on the move make much more sense with this context. He has to let go of his guilt about not doing enough at Grady, Beth getting shot and leaving her behind. (The unseen filming events from season 05.) Hence the quote from 03x01 - Costa Da Morte, "I have my dead and I let them go." (I will make a whole dedicated post about this in part 13 about the arcs of the women in Daryl's life)

I'll give the Carylers this, that Beth was not a love interest for Daryl right there in the moment in season 04 since they never got a chance to explore it. But it was foreshadowing and being set up all these years later for her return! Trust!

And with the official AMC website confirming those feelings. Before they changed them. (Probably due to the toxic Carylers outrage) [See more here]

So can we put the grudges aside and just wish the best for the character you all claim to love? Daryl Dixon. No matter who he ends up with. And if it is Beth then the age gap won’t matter all that much anymore since she would be much older now. And if it is Carol then I’d be happy for you! Or anyone else he would end up with. I just want Daryl to be happy! Although I think the symbolism suggests otherwise, with Carol staying behind with Antonio’s family in Spain. But I could be wrong. And that’s ok! Some of you guys tear Norman down constantly on social media/threatening his family… I think some self reflection needs to be in order. We can put aside our differences and enjoy the show in our separate communities. No bad mouthing the other. Let go of the past and move forward! I’m not here to argue.

If and when Beth does eventually return, please don’t send hate or death threats to anybody in the cast or crew. Especially Emily,Norman and Gimple/Zabel on Melissa's behalf. I know Melissa likes the idea of Caryl but that doesn't mean you are guaranteed it. Melissa may be scared of you guys turning on her just like you did Norman, with harassment death threats to his family. Maybe if you were all a little bit nicer to the cast/crew then something could have happened. (Not that I think it was ever going to anyway.) Maybe under Glen Mazzara's run as he said he saw a connection between the two. At 24:10 in this interview with him discussing the Daryl and Carol's relationship. But notice how he answers the question at 17:40 about pissing off the fans. "You can't be fearful of pissing off the fans. The Carylers in this case regarding Bethyl going canon. But he's been gone for ages now, whereas Gimple is still in charge, not linking Daryl/Carol romantically. Plus Angela Kang, then becoming showrunner, with Gimple at the helm, backing this up in The Talking Dead episode. (It was in season 10 on TTD when a fan came up and asked if Caryl would go canon? Anyone have it/could find it? Need this clip. I believe it was during 10A. She said something along the lines of "we like the way their relationship as it is and don't want to ruin what they have" IIRC.) Who knows, maybe Melissa actually likes Bethyl too. You don't know her personally and she might be scared of the backlash from the toxic Carylers if she showed her support. Much like us Bethylers get called weirdos and creeps for shipping Bethyl. And Norman as well. You’re within your right to not like the pairing of Beth and Daryl or when it does go canon. But please be better than that. Don’t continue this cycle of toxicity. I just wanted to clear the air on that real quick, as i can foresee the response to Bethyl going canon from the toxic Carylers. Notice how i'm reiterating the words toxic Carylers here. Not lumping them in with the respectful Carylers who just happen to like the Caryl ship. I fully agree with what Michael Cudlitz said on X here. (In response to Sarah's tweets/opinions/attitude)

I have the perfect song I think the TOXIC Carylers should listen to! You guys might be laughing at me now, but we'll see who gets the last laugh! You have no idea what's in store with my upcoming posts! 😈

My reaction to all the toxic Carylers and the abuse Bethylers and TD faced over the years. This was me typing all my notes on my notes app so i didn't forget what connections I made. And this way my reaction finding about the comic volume's connections and my TD findings. (Come back and watch this video after I finish my series and you'll get an even bigger laugh) [I remember thinking these memes were similar to how I felt about being a Bethyler/on TD back around 2017/2018]

While they self reflect for a little bit, let us (Team Delusional) get back to my series of posts. Which will be me looking back at all the spoiler filming from TSDF/TWDBrasil's post during that time and see what filming was used/not used. Also, here is a good video if you want to familiarize yourself with this volume before diving deeper with me. Thank you for reading! I found this Team Delusional essay online made by someone named TR Taylor that breaks down why Team Delusional exists.

@twdmusicboxmystery if you feel that you have any posts/links/videos that are relevant, please feel free to message me! And if any TD go looking at your account and find something pertaining to anything I reference down the road please let me know to! And it's ok if you want to make a YouTube series if you want on this. Only if you want to! I give you permission! I would love hearing your analysis of my series as it could help me make more connections I see. (I want to make my mom watch them too!)(YOU MAY WANT TO WAIT TO MAKE A VIDEO ON THIS AS I AM STILL MAKING EDITS TO THIS POST BUT IF YOU JUST WANT TO ADD THIS AS A SHOUTOUT IN THE END OF AN ASK VIDEO. AND THEN GO INTO THE DEEP DIVE IN IT'S OWN VIDEO. AS IT MAY TAKE SOME TIME. YOU MIGHT JUST WANT TO GO OVER MY TITLES FOR A VIDEO INSTEAD AND SPECULATE WHAT'S TO COME. YOU SHOULD PROBABLY DO LIVE REACTION VIDEOS CAUSE IT'D BE FUN TO SEE YOUR REACTION TO WHAT I'M THINKING. AND YOU ELABORING ON IT. OK Thanks!)Maybe you'd even want to do an interview after my entire series is out for your YouTube channel? That would be cool if your down! Spread the word guys, we need to reach to the general public and prove the toxic Carylers wrong! Thanks for listening everybody! I know this was long. But please have both patience and faith in me as I work hard and get these posts out in the following days-months. There are going to be quite a few as there is a lot to cover! Most likely a 23 part series I know... it's a lot. But just know it's worth the wait! More to come soon! 💚

Here is a sneak peak of what I have in the works. These are the titles + some of the content I will be going into.

Re-Adapting the Adapted : Introduction (Overview)[Piecing Together the Puzzle] Make TWDU section it's own post + Discuss the Webisodes (most importantly made by Gimple + Add MagnusRobert's video on Chris Hardwick giddily mention doing more webisodes for TWD(I think discussing season 6? When Nicotero discusses Sophia's alternate death filming. Where they see her as alive)

Video Clips Post + ( all visual video evidence The Talking Dead and interviews outside the show)[Melissa/Emily/Lynn Collins/ Clémence Poésy discussing their relationships to Daryl and Norman talking about this as well) I WILL PUT ANGELA KANG'S CLIPS FROM TTD IF I FIND THEM. AND LYNN COLLINS INTERVIEW I MENTIONED BEFORE. AND HILARIE BURTON TALKING ABOUT BETHYL + ANYMORE STUFF LIKE THAT

Reviewing TSDF & TWDBrasil's Coverage of Season 05 (Unseen filming that occurred)[Mapping Out the Griffin Area + Church nearby]

How the Claimers storyline link Beth and Daryl's arcs together (How they learned from each other and adapt to their individual stories)[Role Reversal]

Andrea was a Guardian Angel to Carl(Since she was his adopted mother in the comic)/Beth was Judith's + TV Andrea's death ignited EVERYTHING WHEN GIMPLE TOOK OVER (Beth was Judith's caretaker after Lori died) [Everyone's relationship to Andrea in the prison)[How Gimple turned Mazzarra's version of Andrea's lackluster death in his original filming. Using her as the template to foreshadow everyone's storyline to come + How Comic Andrea's storylines were affected by her TV counterparts death and how comic Rick/Andrea = Daryl/Beth in the show]

The Canon Ending of 05x08 - Coda (Analyzing all of the still and BTS images + Alternate Takes included)[From the events of Coda's courtyard/parking lot scene + all the Piéta symbolism]

How Leah Foreshadows Beth's future Arc (The Designation 2 Reference/Outpost 22 parallel) + (Focusing on Beth's Episodes/Leah's episodes 04x13/05x08/10x18/11x05)[Religion Involvement + Deluded Leaders]

Green/Greene References throughout the show (Green route on Terminus map/Glenn's green balloons/Green chlorine gas from World Beyond)[How the Terminus map routes = Beth/Morgan/Team Families routes respectively]

The Spinoffs and their purpose in the overall story at large planned out for the planning of season 5 of the main show + how their all connected (How 4A/5A foreshadow things to come)[Hope in New York working at the lab and the CRM kids going to Portland to stop the Echelon briefing]

Timeline of Events After Coda + Missing 17 Days + Aftermath(Weirdness in 5B surrounding Glenn/Sasha/Father Gabriel)[What I Think Happened Using the Comic Events as a Frame of Reference]

Season 5B Teaser Trailer "Surviving Together" + Extended Trailer Analysis and how it correlates to the 17 missing days.(As it's what it symbolically trying to represent.) (Characters Not Accounted For)[Where are they? Carl/Judith/Father Gabriel/Noah - BOB connection with limb symbolism](I think I know where they are.)

Everyone Joking that Beth's Still Alive (Kirkman/Jeffrey Dean Morgan/Emily herself and more)[Video evidence of them hinting at this]

Re-Adapting the Adapted (Issue #55) [Part 1/6 + Mazzarra's Original death ending filming/evidence with Gimple re-writing and re-shooting it AKA his unofficial/official first scene on the Gimple era]

Re-Adapting the Adapted (Issue #56) [Part 2/6]

Re-Adapting the Adapted (Issue #57) [Part 3/6]

Re-Adapting the Adapted (Issue #58) [Part 4/6]

Re-Adapting the Adapted (Issue #59) [Part 5/6]

Re-Adapting the Adapted (Issue #60) [Part 6/6]

Dixon's Girls (Bridal Carries and Their Meanings)[Carol/Sophia/Beth/Judith/Leah/Isabelle + Conine/Lydia]

Rick Grimes/Madison Clark/Beth Greene Parallels (ALL DEATH FAKE OUTS! YES BETH TOO! OBVIOUSLY! (Boot similar shots/Beth's coda costume Boots being her season 2 boots + Alicia/Michonne Parallels [The Grady/CRM(Greater Good) + Gone Symbolism + Everything Gets a Return

All the Main Callbacks to Beth in the Daryl Dixon Series + Name Origins (Hallucinations and What They Represent)[Isabelle Parallels]

Other Webisodes Titles + Connections

What We Become References (In the Titles of TWDU Episodes)

Where We Are Now? (DC Season 3 and DD Season 4 incoming + What's to Come)[What Role will Beth play? + Snow White [Literally all the OBVIOUS Symbolism + Analysis)[Snow White/Red Riding Hood/Alice in Wonderland/Venus+Saving Odyssey symbolism for later on]

Re-Adapting the Adapted : Conclusion (The Odysseus/Greek Mythology Template and How it represents the main romantic couple in the show. Richonne and Bethyl Parallels)[Paz's story with Elena and conversation in DD 03x06 and why Richonne Parallels Bethyl's arc so closely. Them being the BIG 2 MAIN couples of TWD as a whole]

Analyzing Dead City season 3 and Daryl Dixon Season 04 when They Release (Beth Greene's Return and how she is taking Comic Lily's story from the original novels) [A look back at my series to see what I got right and wrong hypothesizing]

Victory Rally! (I am nothing but a vessel for all of TD's research over the years + I just compiled it neatly in a nice bow)[Take that toxic Carylers!]

This Bethyl asks video recently really made it click for me. What weird timing! What are the odds! It's like a sign! And the cold superstorm is like a forewarning to the toxic Caryler's icy cold remarks about this post/me. I have never been more sure of anything in my life about Beth coming back now! I'm just glad our ship is sailing while theirs is crashing and burning kind of symbolic of how Daryl was originally meant to get together in Mazzara's run, but Gimple paired him up with Beth instead! Life is good! Life is worth living!!! lol. I am not very religious but I feel something spiritual happening especially with this superstorm! It's like my manifestation of Bethyl going canon is coming true! I feel like my whole life has been waiting for this moment! It's insane!

What do you think of these titles and notes? I can't wait to get them all out for you to guys read! But like I said you have to be patient with me as I research and make my posts. God this is gonna be one hell of a ride with all the research i'm doing. But i'm doing good pace wise! Y'all are gonna freak with what I am seeing here... When I do research, I do research! I know people like to call us well, delusional but that won't be like that for much longer. This series has MANY revelations. And toxic Carylers stay away! Later!

THIS WILL BE MY MAGNUM OPUS FOR THE TEAM DELUSIONAL COMMUNITY! As I am a comic Rick and Andrea as well as Bethyl. So i see what Gimple is setting up and throwing down! And i can tell because I kept on seeing this Volume being referenced sooo many times. So I went back and looked at it and saw what Gimple was thinking/adapting! I GOT YOU! WE GOT YOU GIMPLE! CHECK AND MATE! hahaha!!! Will this make the news? lol

Next post I will upload all the Audio/Video clips I mentioned I wanted to be found. If anybody could send me anytime anybody ever mentioned the Bethyl romance and Leah romance. Mostly from The Talking Dead.

[doe-rose-q]

Wow!!! This is a fantastically exhaustive post that you poured so much work into. I am quite impressed! 😁

This upcoming April 3rd of 2026 marks the 10th anniversary(!!!) of founding my Bethyl/Team D/Normily group on Facebook. 🤩

[betting-on-hope]

Re-Adapting the Adapted : Introduction (Overview)[Piecing Together the Puzzle]

COMIC READER ENTERS THE RING : BEWARE TOXIC CARYLERS!

It's not looking good for you...

MAX VS. THE TOXIC CARYLS (Specifically Sarah aka Lightenerrthang on X/Twitter and MyTayTayHeart too always dissing @twdmusicboxmystery) It's you versus me hons! Now get in the ring! I'm about mop the floor with you two!)

This how you research! And think critically about what you are seeing. You guys are the catalyst for this whole entire series! Thank for the help guys! I mean that from the bottom of my heart! 💚

"Darkness cannot drive out darkness, only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that" - Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. 

Do not be overcome by evil, but overcome evil with good" : Romans 12:21 (ESV)"

But my "Mercy Prevails Over My Wrath!" - Rick Grimes (A lesson I learned watching the show. You could learn a thing or two about watching it critically too...)

In my first post I discussed when I was on TD from the back end of season 5, took a break around season 8 and now back on Team Delusional! This is because I would still read the symbolsim analyses @twdmusicboxmystery would make. Plus her symbolism videos made me understand things more clearly. So, I want to go over Volume 10 : What We Become from TWD comic, spanning from issues 55-60. And how it relates to season 05's production, unseen filming and the larger narrative as a whole in the show.

This volume had story beats adapted earlier many times in the tv show before season 05. This volume is where these story beats initially would have taken place, if they adapted it one to one with the comic from the start of the show. But previous showrunners didn't always stick to the book. Or the right order of events. So when Gimple took over and got to this point to adapt it for the show, a lot of it had already been used. Leaving holes in the story and most likely how Grady/Beth filled up the space of said holes for 5A. With the writers picking and pulling from this arc and the previous arcs which should have been adapted already but weren't. Specifically under showrunner Glen Mazarra's run. Mixing this volume with creating the Grady storyline to build upon each other. And using Beth at the center of it all! And how all the storylines throughout TWDU converged all the back in season 5. (More on this in later)

I will also be going over all the times we see this volume's name mentioned/referenced in TWDU as a whole in part 16. Spanning across all shows across TWDU. Most importantly TWD 10x13 - What We Become, FTWD 08x04 - King County and The Ones Who Live season 01. (I go over these in my deep dive on the issues later on in parts 7-12 and What We Become in part 16) (go back and watch 10x13/Talking Dead episode, FTWD 8x04 and TOWL episodes 4 and 5)[I would watch TTD clips on YouTube the next day after episodes aired, meaning I didn't watch every full episode of TTD. If you think there are any important strange things that happening in TTD please let me know and please provide clips if you can! Thanks!]

I actually stopped watching FTWD because I thought the original showrunner Dave Erickson was done dirty being let go. But that's not new for The Walking Dead. (i.e. Frank Darabont's firing, which Jon Bernthal discussed with Sarah and Norman on his podcast REAL ONES. Also Glen Mazzara's firing. With Laurie Holden stating her frustrations with him not reading the comic book and not adapting her character right. And how she stated TV Andrea's storyline was bad. And how she originally contracted for 8 seasons of the show like Andrew Lincoln was. And the renewing his contract for 5 episodes of season 9. They wouldn't do this to Beth/Emily after all the failure right? So now I see why AMC wanted Gimple to take over the entire TWDU as a whole. They wanted him to stick to the comics and adapt storylines that were missed in both previous showrunners runs. Also why the Beth references in TOWL are there. And how the taglines of each show are representative of Beth! (i.e. Beth look alike in background in TOWL + this tumblr ask video pointed out by @candyprankster. (Interesting trunk detail catch there!)(More on this in Part 16) Plus Wolrd beyond connections to! When Frank Darabont was fired after seaso 01 as showrunner, he was underprepared to take on a TV role as he was a film director, Glen Mazzarra took on the reigns of showrunner after he left. Mazzara was not able to adapt the comic correctly wanting to kill everyone off such as Andrea,Carl and Beth in season 03 unexpectedly ruining the comic counterpart's stories. Beth's original death killed by Axel was deemed too dark for TV, thus AMC extinguishing that story beat from the comic. The only story beat NEVER adapted. So, Gimple went back and built a story from the ground up and connected some unused story beats from the comic. Using many different famous story templates to many symbols/symbolisms I found this all out on that PBS interview linked above. I saw it on X when the toxic Carylers discussed this being their idea of wanting it/becoming canon. Nope! NOT IN THIS TIMELINE! (Link in this section the appropriate link regarding Laurie Holden's interview+Add video evidence of her disdain for the story in larry king interview way back when. (In regards about talking about season 03's deaths) + Links to Andrew Lincoln's 8 year contract and renegotiations to stay til 9x05.

OUR SPOON CAMPAIGN WORKED! Well, it didn't. As it was all planned from the start converging all the shows and making her way home on the Greene Route.

As well as The Ones Who Live, specifically episodes 01x04 - What we and 01x05 - Become. I will be focusing on Michonne's mission to find Rick sent off by Judith. (More on this in Part 16) When the titles dropped before the release of TOWL is when I started noticing Volume 10 : What We Become kept being referenced over and over again. I noticed this back in 2023.

They wanted to keep Erickson around as suggested by this article, but he left AMC on his own terms. RIP Dave Erickson's run as showrunner. As AMC couldn't trust him either after the lawsuit he put them through in season 2 of FTWD. Now with Erickson suing AMC as of 2025 after his unjust firing from FTWD. I didn't really love the transition to Gimple's Fear. But I watched the whole series over last year with my mom. (She knows i'm Team Delusional, but doesn't believe in Beth's return lol. She doesn't see the symbolism like TD. She is more of a casual viewer. I am going to wait to show my mom these posts after her return to say that I knew it!) I also read some posts about parallels to Madison Clark (specifically in Gimple's era, which I will discuss part 14.) And some Alicia Clark parallels! I'm really glad I watched Fear again and see all the parallels!

Also the Red Machete webisode titled "What We Become" and how all the titles connect to Beth somehow! With the Nick Bernardone's interview with creativescrwriting.com he states "I’ve heard a lot of good things. But I’m sure people would lie to me either way!" in regards to the fan perception of the webisode. Most likely AMC's way of testing the waters with Beth's return as I believe she IS "Legs" from the post coda scene in Red Machete. As well as this Deadline interview with Avi Youabian where he states "The Red Machete narrative is completely over. We can’t say a lot more than that, but there is more to come. There is a plan." Noting that there is a plan in mind with the Red Machete itself.

I will mention how the Claimers in this webisode link back to Beth and Daryl's s story arcs in Part 3 (Also note that he said in the interview that this was figured out a way to make it work in LA. No, we actually figured out a way to make it work in LA.

"We had the entire production shot at several different ranches around the LA area and Santa Clara area. With a lot of visual effects and scene extensions, we were able to mask LA buildings and backgrounds. It’s just a lot of smoke and mirrors—but it doesn’t take place in Atlanta. The narrative is “Anywhere, America.” (Note that is where Emily lives/was living at the time. Possibly making filming more comfortable for her and not to spoil anything by being seen shooting in GA for TWD. Remember she shot a few indie movies around 2017 in CA. It may have coincided with the filming of Red Machete throwing people off her trail for filming it. She was also wearing a yellow outfit for the film to! Probably to be undetected. This also aligns with the Red Machete taking place GA still as that is where the webisode takes place for the majority of the run.) (Below is Youabian's response to this question asked Do you have specific hopes for future short-form projects within the Walking Dead universe? With Bernadone from the other interview speaking before Youabian who also in this interview speaking before him. And look at Youabian's answer. With not having real estate on the show, most likely referring to the unadapted storylines from showrunners past. Linking the comic volume titles of the webisodes. The arcs that weren't adapted. The story beats not adapted in Mazzarra's run. Plus the helicopter lost arc from Darabont's run of the show. These Titles were chosen for a specific reason. That I am going to uncover as I deep dive into the issues individually. (More on that in Parts 7-12 and Part 16)

The main character Mandy is a proxy for Beth. With them being a family of 3, representing Hershel Beth, (Not Maggie) but Shawn the brother she says she misses in season 4 who died and was in the barn in season 2. Most likely the younger sister being a mashup representation of Maggie/Shawn, a sibling with both Shawn and Hershel dying foreshadow by Mandy's family's death.

I had the same belief as the Carylers when they say TD overanalyzes all the other shows too much. But I think that you guys were actually right! The Red Machete is an original TV weapon, but it represents Volume 13's message of what lengths we are willing to go to keep ourselves safe and the ones we love is this arc's message in a nutshell. In the Deadline interview they mention that the Red Machete is its' own character with heart as well. Most likely representing Beth's big loving open heart, in reference to Daryl. (More on that later in Part 16)

Red Machete WAS the Beth spinoff. That @BethGreenIsHopeUnseen foretold all those years ago saying she would have. We just didn't know it at the time. And now with her closing in on the show, her missing 17 days/Aftermath is coming very soon. (Go back and watch Red Machete webisodes)

PUT WORLD BEYOND SECTION HERE!!!

With Dead in the Water also being a webisode. A kind of reference/follow up to Red Machete in a way. Since it relates to the doomsday cult in season 06 of FTWD with the nukes storyline. Referencing back to Fear season 1's

So I will be going issue by issue to see any similarities to season 05, how it could possibly correlate to the unseen filming and how this arc is still in play to this day. And keeping in mind @twdmusicboxmystery's theories that I think ring true (that I will link as I go)

And how some of them may play a role in the spin offs Daryl Dixon and Dead City. And if we see Daryl in Maggie's hallucination/AU dream (See a fan interpretation here as to how the scene plays out coming up in DC s03.) involving Beth somehow. We'll have to wait and see! The trap AMC set is in full motion with the general pubilc thinking Beth only retruns for a dream/hallucination. Like these videos here, here and here.

And the Daryl Dixon spin off originally titled "Raise the dead" based on that BTS Pic he posted on the box with in the costume department. Remember that?

Gimple even referencing Dave Erickson's FTWD as season 01's tagline being "The End of the Beginning". I knew I saw this somewhere before letting me make that connection. I realized it was FTWD's season 1 OST opening track on YouTube that I saw that a few years ago. Gimple took what was already in Fear and adding to Gimple's version. I noticed this in the Mazzarra PBS interview while working under Frank Darabont that he went back and watched season 1 and saw he he wrote/directed. Gimple did the same thing for ALL previosus seaons.

I also incorporate some more trading cards i found interesting from the TOPPs digital archive app since the original app went defunct back in 2021. And I go over strange things that happen in The Talking Dead as well.

I've decided to make this a multi-post series to make it more palatable not only for me but for the reader as well. Since tumblr only allows 30 pictures per post, breaking this series into parts is the best overall option. Since I have lots of pictures and references to show. And YEARS of information to go over.

My series of upcoming posts I am making are in a fluid state. Meaning I will most likely be going back to these posts and add things to them at a later date if I missed something/found a link I was looking for that I couldn’t. Red text are links/interviews/videos that I remember but couldn’t find at the time of making them. I will make it clear to know when the post is officially finished with the word FINISHED in green text at the bottom of my posts to notify that I have nothing more to add. And blue text is just quick notes i wrote for myself to do. Text in orange are my Works In Progress posts. Editing them frequently.

This is where I need Team Delusional's help. Your help. To prove my/our case of Beth still being alive! If anyone can find me the source/link/screenshot of ANYTHING I mention in red, that I can't locate please let me know if you have anything on what i'm trying to reference. This is going to be a Team Delusional community based endeaver everybody. So tell your friends of TD or past TD members you know if they know anything about the notes I made in red. Thank you in advance!

They are mostly things I noticed on @BethGreeneIsHopeUnseen's account back in the day that stood out to me. The help would be greatly appreciated! Please message me if you think I should add something more to my posts. "We've all got jobs to do."

Before I start this series I want to cite my sources here first. So you can look at them for yourself as I go along. Here are links to the websites, tumblr blogs and tumblr posts I am cross referencing throughout this whole series.

@twdmusicboxmystery's entire account/ Youtube channel. I reference her theory index quite a lot in this series. (Love the videos!)

Team Delusional Masterpost by @arabianbaby53 (Thank you for the archival of everything you have!)

TWDBrasil's post (A big fan site for TWD heavily monitored and reported on the filming of season 05 at the time documenting the actors on set. But the post doesn't cover everything as it stops around mid July and doesn't cover late July/all of August's filming for the rest of 5A-5B. [They got their information from The Spoiling Dead Fans facebook and forum and archived it chronologically here. Thank goodness!]

The Spoiling Dead's facebook. (The OG documenters of the show.)[Also note that Chandler Riggs asked them to keep Carl's death to themselves around season 08's filming. They respected his wish by not posting about until after it aired. Pointing out how they respected the actor's wishes. I would say AMC or Emily herself asked them to not mention her that day of filming. Which would ruin Beth's survival reveal for the general audience at the time. Making their hard work go to waste. TSDF making that post backtracking about the Emily sighting in the white van makes more sense with that context in mind. Not that they didn't like her character or Emily. But because they were asked to, at least for that specific post. Or maybe they got hit with litigation by AMC. Or paid off. Who knows. But the posts are still up presumably because they didn't capture her on camera. Leaving the report just speculation and without concrete proof.] (more on that in part 2)

This Walking Dead photo gallery (Archived more pictures filming from on the sets during the time.)[Not as useful. But still helpful.]

And all the knowledge over my years on Team Delusional thanks to @BethGreeneIsHopeUnseen's account. (The OG Archivist of Beth/Emily content for Team Delusional to be here to this day.)[Why is your account locked?? Come back please! Or at least unlock your account! Tell her to unlock it for just a minute!!! 😭]

Here is a list of unanswered TD questions that I will be referencing throughout this series. Here is a playlist going further in depth by @twdmusicboxmystery. To better get an understanding of why so many of us are still on Team Delusional.

The Walking Dead is one of the few franchises I have been invested in since I was young and the media I consume the most. Engaging with The TV show, the spinoffs, the comics and the Telltale Games series. I feel like I have a lot of expertise when it comes to TWD. Most importantly, Team Delusional! As I was there when TD formed in real time during season 5B. I remember most of the information back from my formative years looking at it constantly. As well as when I started getting back into TD around 2021/2022. My love for lost media/cut content started here and it being about my favorite character Beth Greene always interested me. So I am going to try my best to compile the evidence neatly in these posts. Not only appealing to Team Delusional, but to prove my case to the general audience as well. Or at least convey that something strange happened to Beth after Coda. I guess it took the ultimate TWD fan to figure out the giant puzzle at play. With the help of Team Delusional of course! (Our joint slay is coming in clutch here!) I may not have went to college but The Walking Dead Universe is where I know my facts!

Side note. Back in the day a few years ago I saw that one toxic Caryler on X (who beefed with Abraham's actor over the word pookie on this X post, and how it was inherently a romantic word. But Cudlitz said his mom called him that. In a familial setting. She did not like that. Insinuating that his mother was bad for calling him that... (um ok?) The toxic Carylers only love that because Carol called Daryl that in season 04 and see it as evidence to a Caryl romance foreshadow. How lame do you have to be to get into fights with the actors of a show you claim to love over a word's interpretation.

I also noticed Dawn Glen, the reviewer of season 03 who referenced Team Delusional on X before DD s03 aired.

She said Team Delusional would get a lot out of DD s03. Stated here on X.

She saw the symbolism of Beth in Justina and the conversation with Paz, even though she said it was meant to refer to Isabelle. After s03 aired posted here on X too. I thought to myself if she was seeing the parallels to Beth, why can't the other Carylers? (They just don't want to.)

I was so tired of the toxic Carylers and some of the general audience calling us crazy over the years.

I'm so lucky that I searched the bethyl and the DD series tag on X so frequently during that time/saw posts regarding this on tumblr. (link for tumblr posts talking about this/the person who DMed her and she replied? About Beth singing or something/we would hear her? Thanks!)

So I am presenting my case with all the evidence I know! I also try to recall what I remember from BethGreeneIsHopeUnseen's account from when i skimmed through it back in 2021 before it locked, so it's kinda recent in my mind and I reference things from her account from memory the best I can. I would like for you to go into this series with an open mind. Thank you!

And for any toxic Carylers reading this post or my upcoming theories/analyses, I just want them to know that I love that you love Caryl! Ship and let ship! Let me be clear this is not a message for the nice/calm Carylers in your fandom.

But I don’t think Bethlyers should get flack for seeing Beth and Daryl’s relationship as potentially romantic. As Norman himself has stated many times. And Lauren Cohan, Nicotero and a lot of the cast/crew being fine with it. She was not a child. Nor a full adult woman like Carol. Beth was a young adult who sparked a connection with a man (Daryl) who was a bit older than her. I also saw Daryl/Beth as the visual adaptation of comic Rick/Andrea With her taking the age love storyline from comic Andrea's relationship with Dale. Yes they met on the farm when she was 16, but they hardly interacted with each other. I don't even think they have a one on one scene in together. Season 3 yes, but not season 2. Forming no romantic connection at this time in either season. Also the ICONIC Piéta pose and physical similarities to each other. Making me side eye the Beth "spoiler" post AMC posted on Facebook and X/Twitter back after Coda aired. All these articles/interviews are instructed by AMC to push this narrative that she "died."

Both Emily and Norman were adults playing younger characters than their actually ages. (Remember Norman originally auditioned for Merle. Thus making Norman act out Daryl a little younger as he is the Dixon baby brother.) Whereas Melissa was more closely playing her real age/ a few years younger as well playing Carol. (Early 40s.) Unlike Emily and Norman who are playing the characters much younger than they actually are in real life.

(Insert screenshot about Norman saying Daryl being around 32? 34? comment on Twitter I think during season 4?)

With Emily being in her late 20s during this time playing an 18 year old as confirmed by Emily in this AccessOnline interview back in season 04. (Note how she addresses Daryl's age and shutting down the father/daughter bond that people seem to claim it was. With her seeing Daryl as an adult while playing Beth, an adult at the time herself.)

As well as Daryl's age being up for debate in the fandom and Daryl Dixon season 03 clueing us in on the time frame of his childhood. (Someone on TD made a great analysis of the flashbacks in DD s3 relating to the time frame possibly taking place in the late 80s/early 90s. Can anyone message me that post? @bookqueenrules I think it may have been ur post, if not do you know who? Anyone know?) You don’t have to like them together. That’s fine. I see many toxic Carylers online (mostly on X) still holding grudges over the great Caryl/Bethyl shipping war that happened over 10 years ago now. Saying that Bethylers said some horrible things about Melissa. I didn’t really see that at the time personally, but I have no doubt that there were some toxic Bethylers in our community too. No fandom is without sin.

There is also this interview and Norman's Reddit AMA back after Coda aired. (find link for this review. it says its from the main review of coda? Who wrote the main review? I'm not sure where to find this) This review shows that not only Bethylers/Team Delusional supported their romance, but how some of the general audience did as well! The reviewer here states that "Clearly, there was a romance blossoming between Daryl and Beth. And states "Reedus' performance was clearly his best and more emotionally heartbreaking than when he lost his own brother." Again they are stomping out the false narrative of Beth and Daryl being a sibling dynamic. Going as far as saying he was more emotional over Beth than he was over his own brother. It's literally Daryl mourning the love of his life. Note he was upset about Connie's death close call in 10x09 - Squeeze, but nowhere near emotional as Beth's. Also stomping out the narrative of Donnie being romantic as well. Sorry Donnie fans.

Leah and Isabelle were the only official love interests for Daryl. Visually similar to Beth, both blonde women who had connections with him. Dealing with arcs involving religion. (i.e. Faith, Pope and Nun respectively.) (Beth - "If you don't have hope, what's the point of living?/Leah - "Find me." (As we think Beth is missing from Daryl's + TF's POV. And Leah asks Daryl to stay with her, the inverse of 4x13 - Alone but he doesn't as she is gone by the time he comes back to her cabin.)/Isabelle - "Bet on hope." (Making Daryl start believing in hope again. Beth is the reincarnate of hope. Daryl's hope for living fully is when Beth is found alive/shows up! This is why she shows up in his hallucination as he has not fully accepted his true feelings for Beth still.)

With Daryl never fully able to grow as close to Leah or Isabelle. Since his love still lied with Beth. (find links/interview/video where Leah's love is described as toxic. + Talking Dead clip where they were told specifically not to kiss on TTD not because of COVID either. It was intentional for them not to by the writers. Find Both clips! Thank you! And find the other interview where she talks about what Carol's relationship to Daryl is. I think she referred to Carol like a mother to him. The Carylers won't like that one! Not that I view Daryl as his mother either, I see her as a big sister to him. As they have said they are just best friends numerous times.) He was willing to make it work with Isabelle but his heart wasn't fully committed to their relationship. Thus Daryl kissing Isabelle first. This was Daryl's best attempt to ignite the spark he had with Beth from 04x13 - Alone. But it wasn't the same. Daryl desperately wants his own family by getting with Isabelle and being a father figure to Laurent. But alas she died. And Laurent gone. Heading back to America with Ash. (Below are Norman's interpretations of Daryl's relationships with both Isabelle and Laurent)

Norman's thoughts on the kiss

Norman's thoughts on if he loves Laurent like family discussed with showrunner Zabel (he references deep connections here. Emily in an interview once discussed her deep bond with Daryl. Can somebody find me that interview?)

Making Daryl's conversation at the end on the beach with Carol in DD 03x07 - Solaz del Mar about always running, not being grounded in something and always on the move make much more sense with this context. He has to let go of his guilt about not doing enough at Grady, Beth getting shot and leaving her behind. (The unseen filming events from season 05.) Hence the quote from 03x01 - Costa Da Morte, "I have my dead and I let them go." (I will make a whole dedicated post about this in part 13 about the arcs of the women in Daryl's life)

I'll give the Carylers this, that Beth was not a love interest for Daryl right there in the moment in season 04 since they never got a chance to explore it. But it was foreshadowing and being set up all these years later for her return! Trust!

And with the official AMC website confirming those feelings. Before they changed them. (Probably due to the toxic Carylers outrage) [See more here]

So can we put the grudges aside and just wish the best for the character you all claim to love? Daryl Dixon. No matter who he ends up with. And if it is Beth then the age gap won’t matter all that much anymore since she would be much older now. And if it is Carol then I’d be happy for you! Or anyone else he would end up with. I just want Daryl to be happy! Although I think the symbolism suggests otherwise, with Carol staying behind with Antonio’s family in Spain. But I could be wrong. And that’s ok! Some of you guys tear Norman down constantly on social media/threatening his family… I think some self reflection needs to be in order. We can put aside our differences and enjoy the show in our separate communities. No bad mouthing the other. Let go of the past and move forward! I’m not here to argue.

If and when Beth does eventually return, please don’t send hate or death threats to anybody in the cast or crew. Especially Emily,Norman and Gimple/Zabel on Melissa's behalf. I know Melissa likes the idea of Caryl but that doesn't mean you are guaranteed it. Melissa may be scared of you guys turning on her just like you did Norman, with harassment death threats to his family. Maybe if you were all a little bit nicer to the cast/crew then something could have happened. (Not that I think it was ever going to anyway.) Maybe under Glen Mazzara's run as he said he saw a connection between the two. At 24:10 in this interview with him discussing the Daryl and Carol's relationship. But notice how he answers the question at 17:40 about pissing off the fans. "You can't be fearful of pissing off the fans. The Carylers in this case regarding Bethyl going canon. But he's been gone for ages now, whereas Gimple is still in charge, not linking Daryl/Carol romantically. Plus Angela Kang, then becoming showrunner, with Gimple at the helm, backing this up in The Talking Dead episode. (It was in season 10 on TTD when a fan came up and asked if Caryl would go canon? Anyone have it/could find it? Need this clip. I believe it was during 10A. She said something along the lines of "we like the way their relationship as it is and don't want to ruin what they have" IIRC.) Who knows, maybe Melissa actually likes Bethyl too. You don't know her personally and she might be scared of the backlash from the toxic Carylers if she showed her support. Much like us Bethylers get called weirdos and creeps for shipping Bethyl. And Norman as well. You’re within your right to not like the pairing of Beth and Daryl or when it does go canon. But please be better than that. Don’t continue this cycle of toxicity. I just wanted to clear the air on that real quick, as i can foresee the response to Bethyl going canon from the toxic Carylers. Notice how i'm reiterating the words toxic Carylers here. Not lumping them in with the respectful Carylers who just happen to like the Caryl ship. I fully agree with what Michael Cudlitz said on X here. (In response to Sarah's tweets/opinions/attitude)

I have the perfect song I think the TOXIC Carylers should listen to! You guys might be laughing at me now, but we'll see who gets the last laugh! You have no idea what's in store with my upcoming posts! 😈

My reaction to all the toxic Carylers and the abuse Bethylers and TD faced over the years. This was me typing all my notes on my notes app so i didn't forget what connections I made. And this way my reaction finding about the comic volume's connections and my TD findings. (Come back and watch this video after I finish my series and you'll get an even bigger laugh) [I remember thinking these memes were similar to how I felt about being a Bethyler/on TD back around 2017/2018]

While they self reflect for a little bit, let us (Team Delusional) get back to my series of posts. Which will be me looking back at all the spoiler filming from TSDF/TWDBrasil's post during that time and see what filming was used/not used. Also, here is a good video if you want to familiarize yourself with this volume before diving deeper with me. Thank you for reading! I found this Team Delusional essay online made by someone named TR Taylor that breaks down why Team Delusional exists.

@twdmusicboxmystery if you feel that you have any posts/links/videos that are relevant, please feel free to message me! And if any TD go looking at your account and find something pertaining to anything I reference down the road please let me know to! And it's ok if you want to make a YouTube series if you want on this. Only if you want to! I give you permission! I would love hearing your analysis of my series as it could help me make more connections I see. (I want to make my mom watch them too!)(YOU MAY WANT TO WAIT TO MAKE A VIDEO ON THIS AS I AM STILL MAKING EDITS TO THIS POST BUT IF YOU JUST WANT TO ADD THIS AS A SHOUTOUT IN THE END OF AN ASK VIDEO. AND THEN GO INTO THE DEEP DIVE IN IT'S OWN VIDEO. AS IT MAY TAKE SOME TIME. YOU MIGHT JUST WANT TO GO OVER MY TITLES FOR A VIDEO INSTEAD AND SPECULATE WHAT'S TO COME. YOU SHOULD PROBABLY DO LIVE REACTION VIDEOS CAUSE IT'D BE FUN TO SEE YOUR REACTION TO WHAT I'M THINKING. AND YOU ELABORING ON IT. OK Thanks!)Maybe you'd even want to do an interview after my entire series is out for your YouTube channel? That would be cool if your down! Spread the word guys, we need to reach to the general public and prove the toxic Carylers wrong! Thanks for listening everybody! I know this was long. But please have both patience and faith in me as I work hard and get these posts out in the following days-months. There are going to be quite a few as there is a lot to cover! Most likely a 23 part series I know... it's a lot. But just know it's worth the wait! More to come soon! 💚

Here is a sneak peak of what I have in the works. These are the titles + some of the content I will be going into.

Re-Adapting the Adapted : Introduction (Overview)[Piecing Together the Puzzle] Make TWDU section it's own post + Discuss the Webisodes (most importantly made by Gimple + Add MagnusRobert's video on Chris Hardwick giddily mention doing more webisodes for TWD(I think discussing season 6? When Nicotero discusses Sophia's alternate death filming. Where they see her as alive)

Video Clips Post + ( all visual video evidence The Talking Dead and interviews outside the show)[Melissa/Emily/Lynn Collins/ Clémence Poésy discussing their relationships to Daryl and Norman talking about this as well) I WILL PUT ANGELA KANG'S CLIPS FROM TTD IF I FIND THEM. AND LYNN COLLINS INTERVIEW I MENTIONED BEFORE. AND HILARIE BURTON TALKING ABOUT BETHYL + ANYMORE STUFF LIKE THAT

Reviewing TSDF & TWDBrasil's Coverage of Season 05 (Unseen filming that occurred)[Mapping Out the Griffin Area + Church nearby]

How the Claimers storyline link Beth and Daryl's arcs together (How they learned from each other and adapt to their individual stories)[Role Reversal]

Andrea was a Guardian Angel to Carl(Since she was his adopted mother in the comic)/Beth was Judith's + TV Andrea's death ignited EVERYTHING WHEN GIMPLE TOOK OVER (Beth was Judith's caretaker after Lori died) [Everyone's relationship to Andrea in the prison)[How Gimple turned Mazzarra's version of Andrea's lackluster death in his original filming. Using her as the template to foreshadow everyone's storyline to come + How Comic Andrea's storylines were affected by her TV counterparts death and how comic Rick/Andrea = Daryl/Beth in the show]

The Canon Ending of 05x08 - Coda (Analyzing all of the still and BTS images + Alternate Takes included)[From the events of Coda's courtyard/parking lot scene + all the Piéta symbolism]

How Leah Foreshadows Beth's future Arc (The Designation 2 Reference/Outpost 22 parallel) + (Focusing on Beth's Episodes/Leah's episodes 04x13/05x08/10x18/11x05)[Religion Involvement + Deluded Leaders]

Green/Greene References throughout the show (Green route on Terminus map/Glenn's green balloons/Green chlorine gas from World Beyond)[How the Terminus map routes = Beth/Morgan/Team Families routes respectively]

The Spinoffs and their purpose in the overall story at large planned out for the planning of season 5 of the main show + how their all connected (How 4A/5A foreshadow things to come)[Hope in New York working at the lab and the CRM kids going to Portland to stop the Echelon briefing]

Timeline of Events After Coda + Missing 17 Days + Aftermath(Weirdness in 5B surrounding Glenn/Sasha/Father Gabriel)[What I Think Happened Using the Comic Events as a Frame of Reference]

Season 5B Teaser Trailer "Surviving Together" + Extended Trailer Analysis and how it correlates to the 17 missing days.(As it's what it symbolically trying to represent.) (Characters Not Accounted For)[Where are they? Carl/Judith/Father Gabriel/Noah - BOB connection with limb symbolism](I think I know where they are.)

Everyone Joking that Beth's Still Alive (Kirkman/Jeffrey Dean Morgan/Emily herself and more)[Video evidence of them hinting at this]

Re-Adapting the Adapted (Issue #55) [Part 1/6 + Mazzarra's Original death ending filming/evidence with Gimple re-writing and re-shooting it AKA his unofficial/official first scene on the Gimple era]

Re-Adapting the Adapted (Issue #56) [Part 2/6]

Re-Adapting the Adapted (Issue #57) [Part 3/6]

Re-Adapting the Adapted (Issue #58) [Part 4/6]

Re-Adapting the Adapted (Issue #59) [Part 5/6]

Re-Adapting the Adapted (Issue #60) [Part 6/6]

Dixon's Girls (Bridal Carries and Their Meanings)[Carol/Sophia/Beth/Judith/Leah/Isabelle + Conine/Lydia]

Rick Grimes/Madison Clark/Beth Greene Parallels (ALL DEATH FAKE OUTS! YES BETH TOO! OBVIOUSLY! (Boot similar shots/Beth's coda costume Boots being her season 2 boots + Alicia/Michonne Parallels [The Grady/CRM(Greater Good) + Gone Symbolism + Everything Gets a Return

All the Main Callbacks to Beth in the Daryl Dixon Series + Name Origins (Hallucinations and What They Represent)[Isabelle Parallels]

Other Webisodes Titles + Connections

What We Become References (In the Titles of TWDU Episodes)

Where We Are Now? (DC Season 3 and DD Season 4 incoming + What's to Come)[What Role will Beth play? + Snow White [Literally all the OBVIOUS Symbolism + Analysis)[Snow White/Red Riding Hood/Alice in Wonderland/Venus+Saving Odyssey symbolism for later on]

Re-Adapting the Adapted : Conclusion (The Odysseus/Greek Mythology Template and How it represents the main romantic couple in the show. Richonne and Bethyl Parallels)[Paz's story with Elena and conversation in DD 03x06 and why Richonne Parallels Bethyl's arc so closely. Them being the BIG 2 MAIN couples of TWD as a whole]

Analyzing Dead City season 3 and Daryl Dixon Season 04 when They Release (Beth Greene's Return and how she is taking Comic Lily's story from the original novels) [A look back at my series to see what I got right and wrong hypothesizing]

Victory Rally! (I am nothing but a vessel for all of TD's research over the years + I just compiled it neatly in a nice bow)[Take that toxic Carylers!]

This Bethyl asks video recently really made it click for me. What weird timing! What are the odds! It's like a sign! And the cold superstorm is like a forewarning to the toxic Caryler's icy cold remarks about this post/me. I have never been more sure of anything in my life about Beth coming back now! I'm just glad our ship is sailing while theirs is crashing and burning kind of symbolic of how Daryl was originally meant to get together in Mazzara's run, but Gimple paired him up with Beth instead! Life is good! Life is worth living!!! lol. I am not very religious but I feel something spiritual happening especially with this superstorm! It's like my manifestation of Bethyl going canon is coming true! I feel like my whole life has been waiting for this moment! It's insane!

What do you think of these titles and notes? I can't wait to get them all out for you to guys read! But like I said you have to be patient with me as I research and make my posts. God this is gonna be one hell of a ride with all the research i'm doing. But i'm doing good pace wise! Y'all are gonna freak with what I am seeing here... When I do research, I do research! I know people like to call us well, delusional but that won't be like that for much longer. This series has MANY revelations. And toxic Carylers stay away! Later!

THIS WILL BE MY MAGNUM OPUS FOR THE TEAM DELUSIONAL COMMUNITY! As I am a comic Rick and Andrea as well as Bethyl. So i see what Gimple is setting up and throwing down! And i can tell because I kept on seeing this Volume being referenced sooo many times. So I went back and looked at it and saw what Gimple was thinking/adapting! I GOT YOU! WE GOT YOU GIMPLE! CHECK AND MATE! hahaha!!! Will this make the news? lol

Next post I will upload all the Audio/Video clips I mentioned I wanted to be found. If anybody could send me anytime anybody ever mentioned the Bethyl romance and Leah romance. Mostly from The Talking Dead.

[doe-rose-q]

Wow!!! This is a fantastically exhaustive post that you poured so much work into. I am quite impressed! 😁

This upcoming April 3rd of 2026 marks the 10th anniversary(!!!) of founding my Bethyl/Team D/Normily group on Facebook. 🤩

[unbadger]

single frames under the cut:

Seguir leyendo

[rod1biez]

miss her

[stephairth-deactivated20180914]

It’s okay to cry. I don’t cry anymore.

[shugar-ponk]

DIOOOS!!!!, EMILY KINNEY SE VA A CASAR!!! 😭

DIOS ESTO ES TAN EMOCIONANTE Y ESTOY TAN FELIZ POR ELLA, LA AMO TANTO EMMY!!! INVITAME A LA BODAA 😭🌺👰💗

[bethgreeneism]

Oo Bethyl scraps (+ Glenn , hi Glenn !!!)

[shugar-ponk]

Tiempo oscuros se acercan....

¬OK estaba viendo mucho ese trend en tiktok y me estoy animando en hacerlo, lo malo? es que apenas se dibujar y también animar Jsjsj así que voy a tratar poco a poco.

[shugar-ponk]

OK me convencí por hacerlo pegaso pero mmm su cutymark aun no, hasta ahora esto será el canon ¬Darly no puede mover su ala izquierda por el corte que tiene en la espalda, es simple no puede desplegar la Ala (aun que ya esté curado darly tiene un trauma con que nunca podrá volar y esto por que la prk. era ves que intento volar luego de esa herida se callo y desde entonces no logra superar ese miedo), Darly puede planear eso si pero no se anima a volar

[shugar-ponk]

Hasta Ahora creo que esta es la mejor manera en que maneje luces en un dibujo eso y me gusta la idea de que beth sie ore alumbre a darly en las noches más oscuras por que ella, ella es su luz

[shugar-ponk]

Darly protegiendo a una beth Greene agotada 🌺 (sigo pensando en su cutymark, no me convence)

[shugar-ponk]

Siempre eh pensado que beth sería de esas chicas que utilizan volantes o vestidos lindos y largos, ejem más por su padre que otra cosa JAKSJA

[zombiie-kitty]

[bethgreeneism]

TW // Attempted suicide .. that’s it I think

Ohohooooo Beth is so catty

“When has dad ever admitted he was wrong ?”

“And Jimmy ? “

“We went out for three months n now I’m married to him ?”

Tbf she’s like going through it , even going as far as begging Maggie to kill herself alongside her :( I think in the past before all of this , she’s might’ve never experienced these types of thoughts , sheltered from a lot of bad things . Or maybe she has experienced those thoughts due to being sheltered for so long (if we take into account my next point: how Hershel n Maggie seems to treat her) .

It’s implied that Maggie n as well as Hershel treated her like a child even as she entered her teenage years , I’m sure she played that role too . But once something bad like losing her mother n then seeing her as walker get shot in the head , losing her again , that really broke the camels back so to say .

So , everything goes to “best” possible solution to this now crazy , infected world . Kill yourself or “live n make room with that pain” as Andrea suggested . (Paraphrasing it)

I really diverted from my main part of this post oops .

Maybe this is a bad analysis but uh it’s what I got so far <////3

[shugar-ponk]

Siento que esa sería la cara de beth al ver los diversos fanfic qué tiene donde le cambian totalmente la personalidad jajsjja - NO se mucho inglés así que no se si esta bien las letras del dibujo - En fin me gusta mucho que le den desarrollo a beth por eso mi fanfic fav de ella y darly es el de "siguiéndote" es bueno y amo que beth se sienta beth KAJAJJAJ

[girlfrieds]

I LOVE THEM!!!

[bethiscomingsoon]

One of walking dead official accounts randomly posting about beth “death” 5 hours ago …nothing weird 🙃