#ch 687

[kaizokuou-ni-naru]

Hi, I was wondering if you could take a look at these panels (from chapter 687). In a foreign language translation I have, in both scenes Zoro uses the verb "to underestimate" ("are you underestimating me?"/"you underestimated me"). So I always thought Oda was making some kind of parallel here, since the two panels are only a couple pages apart. However, the official English volume translates the first panel very differently, as if it's a completely different phrase. What are the original panels like? - @marspiter

Whichever foreign language translation you have is right! Zoro uses the same phrasing in both panels here. Though the English translations aren’t necessarily wrong, they just choose to translate the one verb two different ways and in doing so the little parallel is lost.

The verb is ナメる/nameru (it’s used a lot in One Piece) and it means like, the best single translation I think would be ‘to not take seriously’- thus it can be translated either as ‘to underestimate’ or ‘to mock’, which is where the disconnect here comes from. It got translated along the latter lines for the first panel, and the other meaning for the second panel.

[kaizokuou-ni-naru]

Hi and congratulations on your new milestone! I have a question for the last panel in chapter 687, when Zoro and Tashigi banter. I have seen both the german and English translation, and since they differ I wonder how you’d translate the ue/shita part, especially Zoro’s reply? In german it’s “because you’re smaller”, English goes with “you’re below me”. Is the truth somewhere in the middle? Also, is it possible to read a pun on jouzu/heta (to be good/bad at smth) into it since they use the same kanji or is this strictly about their levels? Thank you for your time! ♥ - @kaktuskopf

Thank you!! The words used here are 上/ue and 下/shita, which do mean ‘up/above’ and ‘down/below’ respectively, so I think the English you give is definitely more accurate- I’d translate it as ‘why are you acting like you’re above me?’ / ‘because you’re beneath me.’ (‘Because you’re smaller’ would be a different phrase, something like おまえは小さいだから/omae wa chiisai dakara).

It’s worth noting also that the kanji 上 and 下 also mean ‘superior’ and ‘inferior’ respectively, so Zoro’s ‘you’re below me’ is very straightforwardly ‘you’re inferior to me/I’m better than you.’ So you don’t need to interpret 上手/jouzu and 下手/heta (‘skilled’ and ‘unskilled’ respectively) out of this, although it’s true they use the same kanji, because he’s already saying ‘I’m more skilled than you’ on the surface, with no real reading into it required.

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[gogoakechi]

jojo chapter 686/687 spoilers

WAIT HOLD ON NO YOU CANT BE FUCKING SERIOUS ITS A FUCKING PUNCH THROUGH AND IN JOJO YOU KNOW THAT MEANS THEYRE FUCKING DEAD BUT THEY CANT JUST KILL ANASUI LIKE THIS????????

HOLY SHIT AND FOO FIGHTERS????????? THIS IS FAKE RIGHT THIS IS FAKE THEYRE GONNA BE FINE

wait if jolyne got punched too then that means theyre all gonna be okay right

jolyne this is fucking Metal

[larkreadsop]

...and then he goes and treats Tashigi like a child and I’m so over this fight and this side of Zoro since it’s not doing him any favors.

[larkreadsop]

Zoro I’d like to believe you but it’s really hard considering everything that’s happened this chapter

[larkreadsop]

Thank you Tashigi 

[larkreadsop]

I mean, if this was what Oda was going for, which Tashigi’s comments seem to imply it is, he went about it entirely the wrong way.  Monet’s a legitimate threat who’s harmed both the Strawhats and the Marines while directly trying to stop all of them from rescuing the children, so Zoro ‘showing off’ that he can ‘intimidate’ an opponent into submission without hurting them isn’t the best plan when it does nothing to actually neutralize the threat she poses.  

And, of course, it plays right into Oda’s persistent theme of men rarely actually hurting the women but instead ‘defeating’ them in other ways which opens up a whole different can of worms...

[larkreadsop]

And then Zoro retaliates to their accusations about him not actually trying to hurt her by...not hurting her.