They support each other and their bond is symbolised by a pink heart, but they're just very good friends.
Also, funny to note how Dimitri's foes for this map were basically Satan, two generals from Hel and an unit associated to Feh's local red "I love flames" king !
Lettuce fam headcanon: Going with the theory that the Saints' dragon forms are based on the five auspicious beasts, with Indech and Macuil being the turtle and bird respectively and Rhea being the yellow dragon as the leader or "center" figure, I think that Flayn must be the tiger because of her white cat alt from FEH and her love of fish! Plus a snake/dragon feels more "earth-y" for Seteth anyhow
Barioth!Cethleann when?
That would make sense, and given how FEH is the only game who cares at least a bit about Nabateans, at this point, I'm willing to believe everything they throw lol
(save for "that Fallen!Rhea fell bcs of "despair" but somehow she didn't fell after Zanado" tidbit and the various "Supreme Leader and two young men" or "Dimitri lost his parents in a car accident").
Maybe if the FEH devs remember that a non negligeable part of their fanbase would prefer them to release mythic NPCs from the maingames (like Bramimond or Yune) rather than their OCs for the mythic slots, maybe we could, one day, get Mythic!Cethleann and/or the other saints to give more spotlight to the Nabs...
But I guess "booba lady #55" taking a mythic slot is more important than FEH being a tribute/celebration of the franchise!
We don’t know when Sothis went to sleep after the Nuke Wars, but we know she never met Flayn, in Nopes, she says Flayn isn’t the “Benevolent One” she remembers, and even is awed by her existence!
(is it because Flayn was born after her “sleep” meaning Nabateans could, uh, create other Nabateans without her help, or is because Flayn is an hybrid which would be something impossible during the war (between humans and Nabateans) so by existing she sorts of shows that at least for shagging Humans and Nabateans could work together?)
But we know Flayn is no older than 1400, since Enbarr was built 1400 years ago.
I heavily suspect Nemesis didn’t do his thing back then - otherwise I don’t see Cichol meeting a human, fucking and then going to Rhodos to live a domestic life after the Red Canyon.
The War of Heroes roughly ended in 100 - Flayn thus feel in her coma - meaning, assuming Flayn was born the day Enbarr was built, Flayn was around 300-ish when she “died”.
So the timeline would go like this :
Sothis lands and shares tech
Some nabateans are born
Rhea is the last born
Nuke Wars
Sothis goes to sleep
-220 Rome Enbarr is built
Seteth meets his wife in a church,
Flayn is born
They move to Rhodos’s coast
Nemesis’s party
-41 Seiros the Warrior appears near Enbarr
That’s 1400 years or lore done with, only 8600 years to go!
At least I'm glad Engage is kinda acknowledging that SS is Billy's route/story rather than the "church route". I just wish Intsys would acknowledge Edel is the villain and that it's okay to like villains, buncha cowards.
Well,
Supreme Leader is the marketing waifu of the Fodlan games, if the sailor fuku was any indication, and you can't tank a waifu :(
I mean, with all the excitement around the Fallen Heroes banner in FEH, or at least with people cheering when Fomortiis was released, you'd think some people would realise that no, liking a character who's Satan himself isn't any indication about your personal beliefs or if you are a "GoOd" person or not but...
Waifu sells, and controversy around her writing/agency/role/whatever you want managed to make FE16 still relevant after a year of global pandemic and still kicking so, yep, if you add a copious dose of "uwu waifu" it'll make your game sell like hotcakes.
I mean, look at Vero from Feh.
IS is still using the "tried'n'true" recipe, bad woman was "brainwashed sad uwus" or "lonely uwu" when she isn't manipulated by a man because she had feelings for him or wanted to use her womb, so all of her agency will fly over the window and you can sell a lot of cute alts in the gacha game.
Back to SS, the more I think about it, the more I think that it couldn't have been a Nabatean/Church route for the kind of same reasons, if you shed too much light on Nabateans, then opposing them because they have pointy ears or what not will look dubious, and if the Fodlan games are a masterpiece in writing fog and smoke to avoid calling an ox an ox, full-on refusal to consider another sentient race as deserving to do things/live because they are "different" would look way too bad for the usual "controversy" needed to sustain discourse for years.
(even Nopes erased it because you can't have Sailor Adrestia suddenly tell people they cannot rule over humans because of their race!)
So yep, SS is half-baked, as is the rest of the game (except maybe AM because it doesn't even pretend to give a fuck about Fodlan's history and the Agarthans) because of the pathological need to shed any light on Nabateans - and is an unconclusive Billy route -
where Billy can't even react to the fact they are not 100% human (that is learnt in the DLC!) and their daddy dearest found them too "unatural" to stay in the Monastery with the person who saved their life and is most likely the only other family they had.
And yet it's the route where Billy (regardless of the player wanting to join the r/atheism sub) realises they can do much more for Fodlan than being a mere person who kills for money and ascends to their destined - but ultimately chosen - path as Fodlan's leader.
this artist made some really nice interpretations of Indech and Macuil. I thought you might enjoy them!
Ah, I've seen them before!
My HC!Indech is a bulkier though, but I can't deny those are nice fanarts!
I'm torn between wanting IS to tell us what they look like in their human forms, and not wanting this at all, because look at what they did for the "unseen dads" from FE16 or even Rufus...
Mareeta eventually meets Larcei in the post FE4/FE5 world and beats her soundly because Major Blood makes people OP, it's unfair but that's Jugdral
Velthomer robes have always been black and red, even for the people associated with the Velthomer court, but Saias wears inverted colors to make sure no one knows he's secretly a Velthomer himself. It's a foolproof plan.
Roy is Ninian's son, and him being part dragon is what enables him to use the Sword of Seals ; Harmut came to believe in a future where dragons and humans could live together, Roy's the living proof of this (and Sophia cannot uses swords!).
Everyone expects Leanne's Raven Boy to be a little terror and make Uncle Reyson get grey hair, but it's actually the Heron Girl who has a lot of fun messing with everyone. Naesala is a proud dad.
After the base convo with Ike, Rafiel tried to eat meat. That's the reason why he couldn't join everyone in the Goddess's Tower.
Grandma Eleanora taught Roy how to dance
Rhea and Macuil always insisted on sleeping in Cichol's bed when they were younger with their big bro - Cichol used to think it was uncomfortable because each of them had beds and they were cramped in his, but after Zanado he misses it.
Finn taught everyone in Fiana how to ride a horse - it doesn't mean everyone can fight horse back, but they at least can ride one.
The first shipment for trade between the two nations of United Archanea and United Valentia involved flour and oranges. Legend says Marth enjoyed oranges so much he wanted to give orange juice to everyone in his realm.
Nyna, Tatiana and Zeke are living happily in Rigel with their 6 children.
Eliwood really wanted to grow a mustache like his father, but when he saw Hector's beard he gave up.
Sanaki and Miccy try to be on amiable terms, but the "you tried to fry me remember" and "remember when our ancestor talked to you and ignored me, and wanted to destroy the world because he forgot I existed while playing with you?" are hard to get over with. They are on good terms as rulers of different nations, but they are not on good terms as sisters.
Every ruler from FE10 went to visit at least once Goldoa, and Rajaion's son. Ena was overjoyed, even if she didn't know what to do with the 52 plushies.
When Citrus told Rhea she wanted to marry Jerry, Rhea wondered what she did wrong, Jerry has a rat tail ! Maybe by constructing Citrus she forgot to program the "what is pretty from what is not pretty" software?
Hilda is Arvis's half sister and one of Victor's bastards
Ephraim using so much of Renais's funds to rebuild Grado is very unpopular post FE8, some people of Renais think Grado deserved it because their Prince consorted with demons - something Ephraim actively refutes whenever he can, as a result his reign is not a very popular one
After Mila'n'Duma went asleep, Valentia mages cannot use magic without staves/tomes
During his journey, Nergal learnt his wife died, but unable to accept this fact + the promise he made to the children to bring her back pushed to dwelve deeper and deeper to the Dark Artes, and we know what happened.
Julia's major Naga son will start a new conflict in Jugdral against Seliph's children
After the events of FE4/FE5, Silesse decided to base their hereditary monarchy on Queen Erinys's heirs, regardless if they have a Sety brand or not (given how both father and son ditched the country during various wars).
Cyril sees Shamir as his teacher and Catherine as some sort of annoying older sibling who gives him noogies even if he told her he dosn't like it
Seteth named his wyverns after his dead companions
Ismaire offered Joshua his trademark hat when he told her he was leaving to "discover the world". It's the only thing Joshua will never bet on.
Hugh becomes the first Elibian mage to master Light and Anima magic, but he dies before Niime, who could never told him how proud she is of him, even if he doesn't use dark magic.
Scatach eventually learns how to use an axe after asking his cousin Iuchar(ba?)
I write and write and make comparisons between a swimsuit and themes like tolerance and freedom,
But in this fandom, some people draw more dubious comparisons, especially ones regarding a certain game - and I warned (who?) at the beginning of the FE16 trend that while it wanted to have a Jugdral flair, it obviously failed. You have a sprinkle of Jugdral in FE16, but it’s only a surface image, or even a mirage.
“CrEsT SyStEM”? Holy Blood? No, those comparisons at least were made in good faith and had some merits.
One of the worst comparisons was noted by several friends, a certain someone, wanting to push a certain ship involving a certain character, managed to write :
“Every route makes one villain from Genealogy of the Holy War the hero, Edelgard being Arvis, Dimitri being Eldigan, Claude being Travant and Rhea being Manfroy”
:(
This will not be a post about Manfroy’s hips, you are warned
Who is Eldigan (Eldie)?
A man who is the carrier of Hezul’s holy blood, Hezul being the founder of Augstria, a sovereign state. Everyone loves Eldie, he is good-looking, strong, kind, chivalrous and has the magic blood that makes him able to use his magic sword.
Is he the King of Agustria? No.
The King is a man named Chagall, who has an ugly sprite, doesn’t have Hezul’s magic blood and cannot use the magic sword. He also killed his father, and is really jealous of Eldie.
However, Eldie’s line (House Nodion) has sworn to support the royal line of Augustria (Chagall’s), so even if everyone wants Eldie to ascend to the throne, he will never accept it. Even if Chagall pisses on him, or imprisons him because he felt like it, Eldie will not rebel against his King. Eldie is seen as a Camus, because he will fight and die for Chagall, and his country, when Sigurd is... more or less attacking Chagall (because Sigurd’s forces are occupying Augstria and Sigurd’s orders are to bring peace to the land, Chagall doesn’t want peace and wants to fight to retake his throne). If everything ends well, Eldie will promise Sigurd he will try to talk one last time his king, try to convince him to accept a ceasefire and peace with Granvalle - but Chagall is an ass and beheads Eldie.
Dimitri... isn’t like Eldigan, at all. First of all, Dimitri is supposed to be the crown Prince, instead of being a mere knight sworn to serve the royal family. Secondly, Dimitri doesn’t die because his liege beheads him - Edelgard will never be his liege - he dies either by defending his borders against someone who is bringing war to his lands and wants his head, or he dies because he pursues Edelgard in a three way battle in Gronder.
We do not know what Rufus is like to his nephew, but I am pretty sure he is no Chagall.
The only common points Eldie and Dimitri have is their blond hair, and sometimes, their manner of death. there is also something about bonds with their sisters but we’re not here for that
Who is Travant?
Travant is the King of the Thracian Kingdom, a proto Nohr-like place, where farming is difficult, and the people living there are starving and often turn to banditry or become mercenaries to be able to earn some money.
Thracia’s neighbour, the Manster District (Manster) could export food to Thracia... but they do not, because, well, the people in charge of the Manster District do not like Thracians a lot (and use slurs to talk about them, but Quan is a special character). So Thracians raid the border, with hopes to reunite the peninsula, with the dream that, one day, they will seize the arable lands in the North.
Travant has an infamous line, which more or less went like “I will unite the peninsula for the sake of my people, and if that process dooms me to hell then so be it”.
And to hell he will go, because by Jugdral standards, ambushing Quan and his family in a desert (horses cannot move in sand, another example of gameplay and story integration!) with horseslayers, is despicable, especially since he leaves no one alive, even, apparently, killing Quan’s young daughter Altena.
(Travant ranks pretty high in the douchebag ladder).
With time, Altena grows, unaware that Travant, who adopted her, isn’t her real Father, Quan was. Things happen, Altena discovers the truth, and Travant finally achieves his dream by making a suicidal charge against Seliph’s forces (he doesn’t even bring his magic lance to the fight!), with him dead, finally, the peninsula can be united under one leader.
Claude? Also has a wyvern. And comes from another land than our hero (but which one?). And... that’s all.
If Almyra raids every sunday, it is not because they are starving, but because they are doing it, per Cyril, for funsies. Claude pretends to be a schemer and underhanded, but he never does something on the scale of the Yied Ambush (the moment where Travant pulled out the horseslayers against Quan). Claude never takes a child hostage, and never orders his daughter to punish civilians.
If Claude wants to unite the two countries, it is not because he wants his people to finally leave their life as mercenaries and bandits behind, but because he wants people to understand each other.
Edit because I’m sleeping : Travant will die for his dream. Claude... always survive. Always. I am not saying he doesn’t believe in it, but he is not as desperate as Travant is.
Comparing Claude to Travant is like comparing... Virion to Iago. They are both male with long hair, and pretend to scheme. Bar that? Well... they both have hands...? I guess?
Who is Manfroy?
Manfroy is... both a mastermind and a plothole.
Manfroy was the one in the shadows engineering a war in Jugdral, not because he likes wars, nope, but because he wanted political instability to recreate the Loptyr Empire.
He will help a douchebag to conquer the world, and use him to sire Julius, the only person in Jugdral who can become a host for the dark dragon Loptyr. The last time Loptyr was there... well, apparently it wasn’t roses and sunshines, slavery was rampant and citizens were pitted against each other to make sure the strongest ones would become citizens of the Empire.
Why Manfroy does this? It depends on the sources, but it is heavily implied Manfroy is part of a sect (sect as in group of people practicing a religion, here the Loptyr religion/cult) persecuted by a lot of people in Jugdral - to the point where Agustrians were having witches hunts to chase them. Manfroy and his followers escaped the the Yied desert, touted to be an inhospitable land. His people had no where and no one to turn to, so they prayed to their God Loptyr (who doesn’t give 3 figs about them).
Manfroy is thus the Archbishop of the Loptyr Church. He also killed his son in law, for some reason, and planned to turn his granddaughter in a zombie. Manfroy also supports (and conducts?) the child hunts, basically the plot in the second part of FE4 and FE5 where the Granvalle Empire and the members of the Loptyr Church round up children, take them from their families (sometimes by killing said families) to send them to Granvalle, with the highly suggested goal of sacrificing them one way or another to Loptyr.
On the not-so bright side, Manfroy doesn’t kill Julia - when Loptyr/Julius expressly asking him to do so, because Julia is the only person, story-wise, able to kill him.
What a guy!
Now, Rhea?
There are some comparisons to be made, unlike Claude and Dimitri, but again, it reinforces how they could be seen as foils.
Rhea? Yes, also engineers the birth of a vessel.
However, unlike Manfroy who “forced” Arvis and Deirdre to marry and have a baby, Byleth’s birth, born from the union of Jeralt and Sitri, was completely unexpected. There is no trace in canon of Rhea arranging Jeralt and Sitri’s meeting, and future wedding.
Rhea? Also wants her granddaughter to “die”?
Well, not this one, since Rhea thinks Billy is actually an amnesiac Sothis. Billy would just recover their memories.
Rhea? Doesn’t start a war to build her Sothis vessel. Hell, the DLC is about her previous experiment to resurrect her mother - it was a failure, but someone supposes she fails because she did not want to bleed dry the Four Apostles. Rhea wishes to resurrect a benevolent Goddess (when Manfroy knows Loptyr is... far from benevolent) but will not kill to do so.
Sitri? Asked her to save Billy, by offering her own life.
The most interesting foil though is... how Rhea and Manfroy both belong to a community that was persecuted by others, the people they are supposed to live with.
Manfroy? Went the “if the world hates me, then I will hate it and burn it down” route.
Rhea? Doesn’t want to kill humans, hell, she and her brother disagreed because she didn’t want to kill children of the people who wronged her! She opens a monastery and offers guidance to anyone who needs it, a shelter for the needy and tries her best to protect peace and the humans living under her care.
They could have followed the same path, but didn’t. Manfroy rounds children to kill them, Rhea offers a new home to children who lost theirs.
They can also be compared with their “welp” points, Rhea gave CF!Billy the means to destroy her, just like Manfroy “forgot” to kill Julia - and yet, again, it is different. Rhea trusted Billy and never wanted to use them as a tool, in the other routes, it is because she trusted Billy with “those means” that Billy is able to save the world. Manfroy? Berserks Julia, wishes to use her as a tool and suffers when she regains some agency and beats her brother. But even without Manfroy, Julia would have recovered the Book of Naga to end Loptyr.
Rhea and Manfroy are definitely not parallels, but foils.
And the best for the end...
Who is Arvis?
Well... to summarise Arvis in a few words...
it’s impossible.
So, Arvis is the descendant of one Jugdral’s God-Crusader, Fjalar. Arvis is very proud of his heritage, but he also bears Loptyr blood, through his Mother. And yet, since the Loptry blood exists thanks to Saint Maira - the brother of the Loptry Host of that time, Emperor Galle, who rebelled and helped the Crusaders - he is also very proud of this heritage and his two brands.
Arvis’s familial history is a mess, his father was a womanizer and his mother abandoned him (which might have fueled his Freudian complex?). When his Father died, he exiled all of his bastard siblings, bar Azelle (his bastard half-brother, sired to his mother’s favorite maid). Arvis apparently wasn’t interested in women before he met Deirdre and fell in love with her...
But he had time to sire a bastard (on his best friend and confidante).
Arvis wants to build a world free of prejudice and oppression, and wants to build it by... associating with Manfroy, who blackmails him about his Loptyr blood (if Arvis is proud of his Loptry blood, sadly the Agustrian witch hunts are still a thing, and it will not be well seen in Granvalle’s nobility); however, he made it clear, to Manfroy himself, that he will never allow another Loptry Empire to be reborn. Arvis thus uses hiw fellow Dukes Reptor and Langobalt to set up a coup against Prince Kurth (the Prince of Granvalle) to kill him. Arvis grows close to Kurth’s father, Azmur and more or lesses takes care of everything in Granvalle, since Kurth has no heir left.
And, by chance, Deirdre, Kurth’s bastard daughter, thus rightful Princess of Granvalle, appears at his door. She bears the mark of Naga (the special blood of the Crusader Heim), so they marry, and if they have a son, their son will rule over Granvalle, Arvis acts as a regent until then.
(women can’t rule shit in Jugdral)
Then what? His plan is set into motion, all Granvalle Dukes die, he and Sigurd (plus his pals) are the only ones left, Sigurd dies after being lured to a welcoming party, and Arvis becomes the last man standing able to rule Granvalle, who became, through his plans and treacheries through the 1st gen, an Empire.
(and then his son becomes a Loptyr host, vaporises his mom and makes his sister disappear, wrestles power from him and he is reduced to a sad state (oldvis). He makes a last stand against Seliph, after delivering him Sigurd’s magic sword, and dies.)
Okay.
So, now, Edel.
Arvis managed to become the ruling... person in Granvalle by eliminating all of his rivals, and securing a nice marriage. Edel becomes Emperor... because Ionius gave her his crown, as her father.
So they do not rise to power the same way.
Edel never talks about her brands, but Arvis is proud to bear them and proud of his ancestors. Judging by how Edel speaks of Wilhelm I as a traitor who sold humanity to creatures, I am not sure she is proud to bear his blood.
Also, while Edelgard is extremely prejudiced against Nabateans, Arvis wishes to create a world... free of prejudice (his actions though...). He does not mind Manfroy preaching his stuff, when Edelgard will not allow anyone to follow the Seiros faith (friends put it better, but in several routes, the people who were followers of the Church of Seiros are missing in Adrestia...).
While both Edel and Arvis think they are making “sacrifices” for the greater good, as pointed out earlier, this greater good is different. They both ally with a death cult, but Arvis is naive enough to think Manfroy will not backstab him - he even wishes for him to preach his nonsense freely. Edelgard has been hell bent since day 1 on getting rid of Thales and friends.
By the time Arvis learns of the child hunts and Julius’s nonsense... he wants to stop it. He is however powerless to do so (or so we think! Apparently he and Ishtar managed to hide every children captured in a castle!) but, at least, he tried to do something.
Crest Beasts... are still used, no matter the path, and even after Edelgard became Emperor.
Now, if Manfroy had to capture children and round them up for execution to make sure Arvis would become Emperor, would Arvis have supported him? I... don’t think so. If children were captured during Arvis’s conquest of the world and it was a “necessary evil”, would Arvis have accepted it? We don’t know. Prideful as he is, I don’t think he would have agreed.
(which is all kinds of wrong, the man can start wars and backstab friends, allies and turn his own brother to ashes, but hunting children is too much? Meh. And yet, Manfroy mentions something about his ways and his pride being an obstacle to the realisation of his dream).
Arvis is... a complicated character. A douchebag through and through, who tries to redeem himself at the end, but ultimately fails. He is rewarded for his actions in the 1st gen by the 2nd gen, where Julius becomes Loptyr and destroys his Empire. He had it coming? Yes. Is it painful to watch? Yes.
Edelgard... does not face any retribution for her actions.
Yes, she can also kill her (step) brother. But either she didn’t remember it, or only cries after it, and ultimately puts the blame on him - so it is not a sacrifice ?
People doubt her words? Well, it doesn’t matter, Linhardt, Yuri and Lysithea are still alive after their... interrogations. Reptor doubted Arvis’s words? Aida was sent as back-up (and... backstabbed him).
Ultimately, Arvis loses Deirdre (whose ghost chills with Sigurd’s), Julia and Julius, whom he loved dearly. Edel loses... Billy, and some randoms.
So, in a way, Edel feels like a discount Arvis, because she misses his ascension to power and his downfall. Arvis doesn’t mow down enemies on the front lines like she is doing, Arvis maneuvers to ensure victory.
Both fight for ideals, but Arvis seems to believe in them when I cannot believe a world for “humanity” involves continuous making of Crest Beasts.
Both betray the main character, but Edelgard is hit with the uwu hammer, thus cannot kill Billy - Thales does it in the non CF-routes.
So... short story, long story, Eldie is not Dimitri, Claude is not Travant, Rhea is a foil to Manfroy and Edelgard is a discount Arvis.
Also, I don’t know what kind of weed the person who wrote this take had, but labeling Eldie as one of FE4′s villain is as dumb as labeling FE7 Karla a villain because she appears as a red unit you have to fight.
