#lobsang ludd

[onetobeamupart]

Therefore, he understood, there is, in truth, no Past, only a memory of the Past. Blink your eyes, and the world you see next did not exist when you closed them. Therefore, he said, the only appropriate state of the mind is surprise. The only appropriate state of the heart is joy. The sky you see now, you have never seen before. The perfect moment is now. Be glad of it.

[alda-rana]

Reread Thief of Time recently, here are Lu-Tze and Lobsang!

[creativenicocorner]

...lately I've been thinking a lot about Susan Sto Helit. Specifically her introduction and farewell in the Discworld series.

About how her introduction in Soul Music is through the eyes of Miss Butts who goes on describing this recently orphaned girl as:

"something frankly unloveable about the child. Academically brilliant in the things she liked doing, of course. But that was just it. She was brilliant in the same way that a diamond is brilliant, all edges and chilliness." *

And then the very last we see of Susan within the Discworld series, is in Thief of Time, ending with... well no matter one's personal opinion of Susan and Lobsang Ludd... the Death series ends with love. ( I could go on a tangent about how each Death book is about some version of Love but thats for another time)

ANYWAY the last we read of Susan is:

"She put the chocolate in her mouth, and shut her eyes. A faint cardboard-y sound made her open them. The lids were lifting on the boxes of stars. They spilled out, and whirled up into the shadows of the cupboard, brilliant against the darkness, a galaxy in miniature. Susan watched them for a while, and then said: "Alright, you have my full attention, whoever you are." At least, that is what she meant to say. The peculiar stickiness of the nougat caused it to come out as: "au-rite ou av my full at-em-ntion." Damn. The stars spiraled around her head, and the cupboard's interior darkened into interstellar black. "If this is you Death of Rats," she began. "It's me," said Lobsang. Tick! Even with nougat, you can have a perfect moment."

It ends with love!! Love for a girl who was described as "something frankly unlovable" we bid farewell to Susan in the series with a Perfect Moment!!

Does this mean anything? Do you see the glimpses of what I'm feeling and barely managing to articulate?!

*Please forgive me if the quotes aren't entirely accurate in terms of punctuation etc, I only have the audio form and transcribed it while listening.

[prosperdraws]

The news of Discworld graphic novels yesterday morning made me promptly reread Thief of Time and then draw up how I see these characters in my head so I have ‘em nice and solid before the comic comes out. I’ll probably do Monstrous Regiment soon too, though I’ve drawn the Little Lads before.

…screaming quietly about two of the three announced graphic novels being two of my three favourite Discworld books aaaaaaaaa

Most of this is either based on description or stuff that wasn’t mentioned, but I took a couple liberties—

Time’s dress is described as black and red, but by the time I got back to that I’d been imagining her as a black lady in white all book so I stuck with it; she’s referred to as “dark” a few times so why not

Lady LeJean’s hair is supposed to be black, but I made it a dark reddish-brown to align better with Lady With An Ermine and also because I liked it as a little bit of colour to presage her transformation

There’s not really any physical description of Ronnie but he’s Michael Palin dressed as a milkman. He just is.

[flannelshirtandjeans]

Since I'm still in this mode, some post-book, slightly incoherent personal headcanons for Lobsang (and Susan) under cut. AbsoLUTELY spoilers for Sir Terry Pratchett's "Thief of Time".

Lobsang sometimes goes to Oi Dong when he feels like it, and sweeps, for a long time to come, and he makes sure that nobody makes a big deal out of it. Catches up with Lu Tze. Maybe learns Deja Vu. Still, no monk in Oi Dong knows it. Just the sweepers HAH.

He keeps Jeremy's little clock shop, and keeps hiring Igor to take care of it. And whenever he needs to have a moment of calm for the parts of him that are Jeremy, he visits, and works on clocks, and to an outside it may look like he's there almost every day, but he can visit from any point in time so basically time is a weird soup and my brain hurts trying to understand it. But anyway, it's calming and centering for him when being in the present moment when he can see all of time is difficult. And he doesn't have to deal with customers as much with Igor being in charge, AND if he ever does, Lobsang's uh. Lobsang side is much more adept socially.

Susan keeps teaching in Ankh-Morpork. Maybe she lives in Lobsang's glass palace of perfect moments, maybe she doesn't, but she does visit. And so does Lobsang. Since he can be at any time and Susan can move the classroom anywhere, I imagine that together they could show the kids what Ankh-Morpork looked like at any point in history, or Klatch, or Quirm. Could take the kids safely to see historical events.

I kind of feel like maybe she doesn't stay at the glass palace and instead keeps her own place. Lobsang and Susan feel like busy people to me, and Susan is pretty fiercely independent, so I could imagine them living in a relationship but like... without actually living together all the time?

They can retreat out of time any time they want, and enjoy their time together, maybe fall asleep reading a book. Maybe eat chocolates on a roof. Perhaps taking rides on Binky every now and again. Susan marking papers while Lobsang perhaps writes his own scrolls about what happened as he remembers it (and Susan marks them too). Enjoy each other. Just be present.

They don't have kids. They are both uh. Fine Details, as Susan puts it, and it has affected them both a lot, and they just kinda decide that they have no idea what would become of their kid if they ever have one (and Lobsang can see all the options but can't tell which pant leg of time they're heading towards), so they just. don't. Lobsang also doesn't strike me as someone who would be very interested in parenthood. And neither does Susan - she is great with kids, but somehow I don't think she would actually want to be a mom.

Lobsang grows out his hair because LISTEN I WANT THAT GUY WITH LONGER HAIR because I just like that. and because he's not a monk. He's Thief of Time, Sweeper, and Clockmaker. He can grow his hair if he wants.

I think he actually thinks that dressing in all gray in different shades looks cool, and likes wearing all gray a lot, when he's being more human especially. Susan rolls her eyes but she does have to admit that he can pull it off better than the Auditors ever did.

Despite being the personification of Time, he does continue being an awkward dumb of ass. UuU Wiser, eventually, and smarter! But he's still AuDHD in my head, and being an Avatar does not change that. I say this as an AuDHD girly, and with so much love.

He gets to meet Susan's grandfather, and actually be seen because he's come to his power and like. He still isn't on Death's list, but they're at a more equal level as beings if that makes sense.

Imagine getting the shovel talk from Death djjdjdjdjdk. Or ALBERT.

Always brings chocolates to Susan. And makes sure that there's no nougat.

He gets to know his parents, though I don't know what becomes of his mom after he takes her place as Time. 🤔 Is she just a timeless being, but more human? Does she cease to exist? I don't know.

I think Lobsang's relationship with Wen remains mostly cordial. Wen wasn't really in Lobsang's life, and didn't raise him, so even after they get to know each other better, they're still... yk, ultimately two people with different lives. I can also imagine that should mom!Time disappear once she's no longer Time, Wen might retreat deeper into the perfect moments, and live in peaceful isolation.

I'm sure I had more on my mind but I'm about to fall asleep

[ancientannoyance]

the one good thing about my bus home being delayed by five hours is that i had time to reread both Thief of Time and Hogfather, and they're still two of the all-time Discworld bangers

Bonus:

[unseenwizzard]

Finished thief of time so spoilers for that book (also queued a bunch of stuff)

There were a lot of great parts and characters in the book but my favorite has to be the fifth horseman. Literal chaos personified and he delivers milk products. Wonderful. Enlightened.

Kaos was the start of the universe. It created space for the rules to be challenged, changed. It's something so human that even after being written out of history, Ronnie still had enough power of belief to fight the auditors. It's a force so strong it can ruin a city. Or one can run on it.

Its no wonder he settled in Ankh, a city that's in a constant state of barely controlled chaos.

Not good, not bad, just. Kaos.

But something from the beginning of the book stuck in my head because of the whimsical image it gave me and when I went back and read it with context-

ARRIVED WITH THE MORNING MILK?? ANCIENT FORM OF CHARITY!!

HAS HE BEEN OUT THERE DELIVERING BABIES TO GUILD HALLS??!

HES ANKH MORPORKS STORK

HER #1 FOSTER PARENT

LOST CHILDRENS FIRST GUARDIAN

Ok. Im good

But am I wrong or reading into this? Because it absolutely reads like the anthropomorphic personification of chaos keeps getting handed babies? for some reason? and just has to complete a job placement interview with them on the spot

Do you want to steal or catch rats? Mix chemicals or make clocks? Biikitt?Alright then, assassins it is!

And to take it even further than that, I might go so far as to say that Lu Tze was one of the children Kaos delivered. Surely abbotts need dairy products? and a being that can enter their perfect moment in time?

Even if he isn't, he read the fifth horseman like a picture book and played him like a fiddle (thats being played by someone that's good at playing fiddles)

I wish there was more on here about this book though. The ronnie tag is almost as sad as the jeremy one

[p4nishers]

why did none of u traitors tell me there was tragic father & son feels in thief of time do yall even know me