Kay, just spitballing shit to try to map out my feelings on Asgoriel.
So of course the main thing that really hits me about this ship is the idea of two broken people rediscovering a lost love for each other that fulfilled them before and they have been more empty for the loss of it.
Asgoreās feeling less fulfilled by Toriel not being there for him is more blatant in the story. Torielās is a LOT more subtle. Sheās run away from Asgore, sure, but she still talks about being āBonelyā in her journal. Itās not an accidental inclusion - she wants to be friends with people, she wants to connect to people again, but she gets too reminded of Him in those moments and I feel like she pushes herself away from that for the purpose of not wanting to forgive him yet. Yet sheās been lonely for so long that she struggles to understand why someone whoās not Asgore would flirt with her.Ā
I definitely DO think that the healing potential of this ship is real post-pacifist. Asgore and Toriel both havenāt had a real chance to come to healthy terms about what happened to their family, they never got the chance to get genuine closure. I genuinely think theyād struggle to do that solo. Itās plain that Toriel hasnāt gotten that closure yet - the alarm clock dialogue about ānever letting Asriel go againā is flat-out proof of that.Ā
And I think thatās something else big that the fandom struggles with on Toriel - she tries to BURY stuff. Hell, thatās the whole point of her fight! Sheās burying the realization that Frisk canāt stay in the ruins forever, sheās burying her feelings about all the bundled-up knots that entail her problems in the ruins! Why the hell would she NOT be doing the same thing with Asgore and her feelings about him? Sheās burying her feelings about him under the grudge, sheās prioritizing that wound above everything else.Ā
Also worth addressing the meme elephant in the room. I donāt think Sans is as good a fit for Toriel as Asgore purely because Sansā trauma is left deliberately vague. He doesnāt open up to his brother, much less anyone else, about what the deal is. He can make Toriel giggle and laugh, I definitely see him as being a damn good friend for Toriel, but love takes something more, it takes that potential for mutual improvement and support that I donāt think Sans can achieve with Toriel, because they just wouldnāt complement each otherās cracks correctly.Ā
Meanwhile, Asgore knows, like, exactly what Torielās deal is. Heās not confused about it in the slightest. Hell, he understands why sheās initially so bitter. Yet itās plain that itās not a Fuck You And Die grudge, but more a gargantuan issue that the two of them have been forced to simmer on for the past century. They definitely can address the problem, because they get down to business quick enough even after the dressing down Toriel gives Asgore in the throne room. They can address whatās gone down between them, and within a few months after the events of the game, itās quick enough that Asgore can make Toriel smile with a mention of the past.
Which DEFINITELY is not what fanon toriel would do. Fanon toriel would have a random flipout about āHOW DARE YOU BRING THEM UP YOU UNWORTHY SWINE11111!ā But thatās because they just copy+paste her throne room behavior on her whole time post-pacifist.
Torielās able to smile at Asgoreās acknowledgement of why she fills the soup up. And she smiles back, and breaks her usual cadence of speech when doing so.Ā
Because 1+1=2, and Asgore bringing up the past+good memories OF that past = smile. If she was still so injured as Fanon would make her about the whole thing, He wouldnāt even dare to bring anything about the past up around her, ever. They can remember the good times and work with each other professionally, so if the big wound is able to scar over as it very plainly can, itās entirely possible they can tread delicately enough over it to build something new.Ā
On top of all of that, without even bringing Frisk into it. Frisk VERY LIKELY, IN MY OPINION, considers Asgore to be something like a father figure. Why the fuck else would they ask about āwhat if I was his kid?ā to Gerson? Sure, it might just be an instance of a kid asking too many questions, but Iām like 90 percent sure that itās an implication of Frisk wanting to be Asgoreās kid to some degree.
And if you take that with the ending where Frisk wants to stay with Toriel, then that creates the inevitability of Asgore wanting to co-parent Frisk with Toriel. All of what Iāve described before can be feasibly approached with the two having an okay-ish friendship. But adding in Toriel realizing that Asgore was not just a good dad, but is still a good dad? Oh, youād best believe the question of āDo I still love him?ā is coming up in her head.Ā
Now, of course, a fair amount of this is UT-focused. Iām not perfectly sure how applicable this is to DR. DR Asgore and Toriel are plainly not nearly as broken as their UT counterparts. Toriel is still interacting with broader society. Asgore doesnāt have a family to mourn the DEATH of, just the loss of via divorce. His son and adopted human child arenāt DEAD, just not always around.Ā
A fair amount of what the case is remains to be seen. Iāll see if I ship Asgoriel in DR as well. But Iām gonna flat-out admit that Iām likely to ship it there too if thereās anything like the tragedy over their UT breakup in that game.
