copper marigolds

Hi there. I'm Copper and I careen wildly from one fandom obsession to another. Current fixation: The Bad Batch. Other fandoms you'll see here include BioWare (Mass Effect, Dragon Age, SWTOR), The Walking Dead, Star Wars, Until Dawn, Horizon Zero Dawn, Uncharted, Legend of Korra, Frozen, and various others. Also cats. Occasionally I bang words on the keyboard and call it writing.

[coppermarigolds]

So yesterday Sony announced they're making Until Dawn 2, coming out next year, complete with a trailer

Actual footage of my reaction:

If you've followed me for a while, you probably know that Until Dawn, in all its cheesy, cringy glory, is basically the fandom of my heart and soul. So naturally I have Thoughts.

I guess first and foremost, I don't want to judge an entire game off a two-minute trailer. Most of the things that made me fall in love with the first game weren't hinted at in its trailers, either. So I want to at least try to keep something of an open mind.

That said.

Sony. Sony listen. You can't just drop a bunch of young adult characters in a horror situation, throw in Dr. Hill, and call it Until Dawn. That's basically the same thing they did in the UD movie and it was Not Until Dawn. DR. HILL IS NOT WHAT MADE UNTIL DAWN UNTIL DAWN, OKAY.

I actually enjoyed the movie well enough for what it was, but it wasn't Until Dawn. It was essentially a generic horror film with a bunch of references/homages to Until Dawn. The trailer for UD 2 is giving me the same vibes, except with even fewer references/homages? If it wasn't for the two seconds of Dr. Hill right at the end, plus the fact that it's called Until Dawn 2, I would have zero clue that it was in any way related to the first game at all. It's not even being made by the same studio!!

About that. At first, my reaction to the apparent complete lack of involvement by Supermassive was "WTF," but after a bit more thought, that might not necessarily be a bad thing. Supermassive hit it out of the park with Until Dawn, but that was over a decade ago (???) and they have yet to recapture the magic. I've played The Quarry and all of the Dark Pictures games, and I enjoyed them all to one extent or another (some less than others--looking at you, Man of Medan), but none of them really came close to UD. IMO, The Quarry was the closest--it was the only one besides UD that I've actually replayed--but even it didn't quite get there.

So, maybe giving another studio a crack at it won't automatically be a disaster...but I keep coming back to two questions. HOW is this related to Until Dawn? And WHY was it necessary?

Look, I love Until Dawn with all my heart. But it was really not a game that screamed "I need a sequel." For one thing, there's the fact that every single character can die (well, except Dr. Hill). And the game's mysteries were all pretty well wrapped up. That's why I thought the "spiritual successor" route they took with The Quarry was the right way to go. Similarly choice-based, with choices having actual consequences, with the same "everyone can live or die" aspect, but with all new characters and setting. Same concept, but without unnecessarily tying it to a pre-existing game.

Other scattered thoughts:

How can you really call this game "Until Dawn 2" when 90% of the trailer takes place in broad daylight???

One thing that would unequivocally make this an UD sequel is if Sam is in it. Given the scene that they added at the end of the first game remaster a couple years back, I would actually be surprised if she's not in it, because that scene pretty much screamed "sequel setup." But it does make me wonder, if she is in it, why not have her appear at the end of the trailer instead of Dr. Hill?

Plot twist: maybe Sam is the killer 👀 Okay yeah, probably not. "Final girl gone very very wrong" would actually be an interesting concept, come to think of it, but probably not something they would risk doing with Sam, lest they piss off fans from the first game.

I'm not really a fan of the direction they've apparently taken Dr. Hill, between the movie and the suggestion in this trailer. It's like they're making him into some kind of supernatural, Curator-esque entity. On one hand, I kind of get it, since it would be easy to interpret him that way in the first game if you don't find all the clues. But based on the messages in Josh's phone, plus Josh's medical records, it seemed pretty straightforward that Dr. Hill in the first game is a real person, probably a perfectly normal person, and that the "Dr. Hill" in the game was just Josh hallucinating the entire time. To go from "real psychiatrist appearing in a patient's hallucinations" to "malevolent supernatural entity" is...a stretch.

On the other hand, maybe I'm wrong and the Dr. Hill appearing in UD 2 is actually Normal Psychiatrist Dr. Hill and one of the characters is another one of his patients? Would be a pretty big coincidence, but not out of the realm of possibility I guess.

[andthepeople]

always funny to remember darth vader is anakin skywalker. the adrenaline junkie chucklefuck who used to dive head first out of speeders and built a pod racer in his yard when he was like six is now upper-middle management for the evil empire. half of his appearances in the original trilogy are Meetings. vader spends like 80% of his time dealing with bureaucratic bullshit. status updates. team meetings. holo-Zooms. budget rundowns. anakin betrayed the jedi and caused the fall of the republic and his punishment is being CC'd on every email forever. and you know what. he would hate that. the punishment fits the criminal

[dyk-tv-theme-song]

Do you recognize this TV theme song? #273

I know this and can name the series

I know this but can't name the series

I might know this

I've never heard this

Voting ended onJan 12

[dyk-tv-theme-song]

Visit Original Link

Do you recognize this TV theme song? #206

I know this and can name the series

I know this but can't name the series

I might know this

I've never heard this

Voting ended onDec 17, 2025

[dyk-tv-theme-song]

Visit Original Link

Do you recognize this TV theme song? #136

I know this and can name the series

I know this but can't name the series

I might know this

I've never heard this

Voting ended onNov 21, 2025

[dyk-tv-theme-song]

Visit Original Link

Do you recognize this TV theme song? #115

I know this and can name the series

I know this but can't name the series

I might know this

I've never heard this

Voting ended onNov 14, 2025

[dyk-tv-theme-song]

Visit Original Link

Do you recognize this TV theme song? #90

I know this and can name the series

I know this but can't name the series

I might know this

I've never heard this

Voting ended onNov 5, 2025

[albrakia]

[sabalmirss-deactivated20210627]

Lana Beniko | M O O D

done in SAI

[uhhhhmanda]

Just came home from a dinner party with the friendgroup at which several people kept saying "Ask Pedro" or "Pedro will know" and I was terrified that they were referring to an AI like Claude but no, thank fuck, they were referring to a cardboard cutout of Pedro Pascal that someone left upstairs and who has been designated a kind of patron saint status in the household.

[theunfortunate-author]

my daily affirmation as an author

[coppermarigolds]

One of my favorite little Bad Batch moments is when Cid tells Omega, "You'll have to convince Dark 'n Broody first," and Hunter says, "Convince me of what?" without even skipping a beat or making any kind of protest

[coppermarigolds]

Super late to this, but @asaara-writes tagged me to share five fictional women I love, and obviously I can never pass up a chance to talk about fictional women. (I agonized over how to narrow it down to five haha)

Velanna, Dragon Age (o b v i o u s l y)

Emily "Danger is my middle fucking name" Davis, Until Dawn

Nadine Ross, Uncharted 4 and Uncharted: The Lost Legacy, because how could I not include a character capable of handing both the Drake brothers their asses but also adorkable enough to ride an elephant and geek out over monkeys

Fennec Shand, multiple Star Wars media, who could stand on my throat and I'd thank her with my dying breath

Kay Vess, Star Wars Outlaws, whose awesomeness makes me continually tempted to replay Outlaws even though the gameplay made me want to hurl my PS5 controller into the sun

Bonus round: more Star Wars women, because the above five were in danger of all being from the galaxy far far away...

*deep breath* Lana Beniko aka the light of my life, Phee Genoa aka the light of Tech's life, JYN FUCKING ERSO (the light of Cassian Andor's life), Bo-Katan Kryze, Omega, Asajj Ventress who's so cool they brought her back from the dead, Sabine Wren and Shin Hati who are extremely gay for each other (I accept no criticism), Vel Sartha and Cinta Kaz who are extremely gay in canon, Cara Dune because it's not her fault her actress is human garbage, Ahsoka Tano, the Armorer in The Mandalorian, Pelli Motto who is basically me in 20 years, and and and

Tagging anyone who would like to love on fictional ladies!

[skaraptor]

AO3 should have an Annotation Mode where you can click to view all of the author's commentary and thoughts about certain parts of the work. A little comment that says "I spent five hours researching vintage radio mechanics for this and didn't even end up using it" or "this is an ancient Hebrew literary technique!" would make my day

[tinderbox210]

"You're wasting your time, Kay. When my systems fail, Jaylen will provide you with a capable replacement." "Just… just save your energy, okay?"

(insp.)

[saltyduane]

Fit check for my Jedi era

[miraculouspaon]

GBBO: “A s’more is basically just an Italian merengue sandwiched between two ganache-covered digestives”

Americans:

[flange5]

in case anyone in wondering, this is Paul Hollywood's idea of a s'more

[theequeerstrian]

You know what, their absolute inability to grasp Mexican foods makes more sense every day

[ennairea]

[starlightshadowsworld]

Nodding my head in support of the Americans despite having no clue what a s’more is.

[mankillercalledbunny]

Okay, American immigrant to the UK here to explain all the mistakes from Paul Hollywood happening here: there is one fundamentally American ingredient required to make a s'more correctly but which is basically not available anywhere at all in the UK, and that is graham crackers. A plain digestive biscuit close-ish, but still a very different beast.

From Wikipedia: A graham cracker is a sweet flavored cracker made with graham flour.

The next ingredient (which is also extremely traditionally American but slightly more variable) is typically Hershey's chocolate, but you could probably swap this out in the UK with any plain chocolate bar.

Last ingredient is big marshmallows, the kind you do the chubby bunny challenge with, like the size of your thumb and twice as thick.

A proper s'more, the most traditional possible variety, involves to graham cracker squares, two slab segments of Hershey's chocolate, and one to two marshmallows depending on your preference for filling and gooeyness. You put a slab of chocolate on one of the graham cracker squares. Your marshmallows should be toasted, usually over a campfire but if you're doing them at home over a gas stove burner is fine, but the fire part is critical. You can toast them to whatever degree you like, some people like them nice and golden brown but still kind of firm in the middle, me personally? I want that bitch to CATCH ON FIRE, I want it gooey and sticky as hell in the middle, crispy and burnt on the outside. Slap that motherfucker on your graham cracker and chocolate square, top with the other one so your marshmallow and chocolate are sandwiched together by graham cracker on the outside. You do this with your freshly toasted marshmallow because ideally it will be hot enough to start to melt the chocolate so it sticks to the marshmallow and the graham cracker and, combined with the gooey marshmallow, it keeps the whole thing together, and for that reason some people will let them sit for a hot second to let the melting process happen (especially if like me you have chocolate on BOTH graham cracker squares, not just one, because you're a sugar fiend), but if you are a young child you do not have that degree of patience and you eat that shit immediately, unmelted chocolate and all. Consume your summer camp delight like a tiny club sandwich, get gooey sticky marshmallow and chocolate all over your hands, and enjoy.

Important note: this is a kids treat. It is a traditional summer camping trip dessert. It should be something any ten year old with adult supervision and access to the ingredients can make (and make a mess of). They're called s'mores because kids always "want s'more". If you are using a blowtorch, chocolate biscuits, and merengue, you are so far beyond the bounds of s'more-hood that you have thoroughly lost the plot. If you offered Paul Hollywood's concoction to an American child and called it a s'more, they'd tell you flat out that not only is it not a s'more, it looks dumb and you didn't do it right because it's not gooey.

[roach-works]

the point is the mess. the point is getting to make a food, at age seven, whose two basic food groups are 'sugar' and 'fire'. the other point is that this food item is so crumbly, chaotic, sticky, on fire, and prone to being dropped (outside, in the dark, while you are surrounded by other children who are also sticky and on fire) that your supervisors cannot accurately monitor how many smores you personally have consumed. the point is also that you may get away with a smore that is five blocks of chocolate and two marshmallows if you move fast and let nothing stop you.

if you haven't accidentally yet unrepentantly eaten a chunk of twigs or dirt or a bug that got enmeshed in the creative process around smore number 3st, you are too old to have any legitimate input into what makes a smore.

[kedreeva]

There's 2 other points that I think are important.

The first is that you don't pull the marshmallow off the roasting stick and somehow put it on the chocolate. Your staging area will look something like this, with the graham crackers and chocolate already set out (though not usually on the fire like this, for us it was always someone's lap or a picnic table or something)

And when your marshmallow has reached appropriate roasting perfection, you use the graham crackers to slide it off the stick.

and ideally, as a CHILD you are using a literal stick. Like you walked around and spent time looking for The Perfect Stick off the ground while the adults set up the fire. It has to be thin enough the marshmallow will fit, sturdy enough that it won't bow, long enough that you won't burn yourself roasting your marshmallow. And preferably doesn't have a lot of bark that's sloughing off, OR so much bar sloughing off you can peel it all back and get to the clean stick under it. If you're smart, you might stick the tip into the fire first to "wash" it/burn off anything that was still lingering, but. well, most kids don't.

When you bite in, the marshmallow and chocolate SHOULD ooze out all over you. If you don't kinda look like this eating it, you've probably done it wrong:

[figmentera]

The description of the marshmallows as being either brown on the outside but still firm on the inside or fully melted but burned on the outside is missing the true art: fully molten in the middle, without the black burns. Not to say OP is wrong for preferring the burn! But there is a technique for perfection and it goes like this:

You find a spot, not above all the logs where everyone sticks their marshmallows by default, but at the heart of the fire. Ideally between a couple logs already glowing gold. Something like here:

Below the leaping flame. Near the logs. There's probably only one or two spots good enough for this on any given fire, but that's okay because everyone else is up above. They will get their marshmallows faster. They will be either firm or burned or both. That's not your goal.

Rotate the marshmallow slowly. Ideally come in at an angle so the part closest to the flame is the side, not the tip. The spot closest to the fire is the spot that turns a crispy golden brown, and you want that everywhere, on the tip and around the circle.

You keep going, slowly turning, for several minutes. Several people will rotate in and out of the higher sections, getting their fast delight. Eventually, your marshmallow will start sagging badly, risking falling. Maybe it does fall and got start over. But eventually it will be golden brown all over, and so liquid it no longer clings to the stick. It is ready, finally.

You say "who hasn't gotten one yet?" And deposit it onto their waiting graham crackers and chocolate. You've made an excellent marshmallow. It isn't for you. Get another while you're over by the bags and go back to the heart of the fire.

That's your evening. One, slow, perfect marshmallow at a time, given to whomever still wants s'more. You're making art for children to stuff into their mouths cheerfully. You're watching the movement of the fire and the heat of the logs, like you would if you were maintaining it — maybe you would be, maybe you were the one who built it — but right now that's not the goal. Let someone else put more logs on, while you take only the one stick and find the best spot for it to live.

You will, eventually, finish a marshmallow and find that nobody moves to accept it. Maybe they're all eating right now, or maybe they've gone through so many they're hesitating. Eat your masterpiece then. Enjoy it, the hardest and most perfect result from a fun and beautiful moment. Go back in for another, until you've run out of marshmallows and the fire is too low or until even you are done with s'mores, until you have made enough.

"We don't want a gooey mess" pfft even the artistry studied at the feet of my father is inherently a gooey mess. That's the whole point!