#community issues

[notebeans-galaxy]

if tumblr cant handle the transandrophobia conversation they are absolutely not ready for the exorsexism or intersexism conversations (i hate it here)

[through-lines]

Obligatory disclaimer that this isn't in direct response to any recent discussion (and as it stands, I've been OOTL anyway), but this seems to be an evergreen issue:

You do not have to identify with any label you don't want to. Just because you "can" use a label doesn't mean you have to.

But if you're going to explain why you don't use a label, and it involves making sweeping generalizations about what a group does/doesn't or can/can't experience, that group is well within their rights to push back and tell you you're wrong.

Identity labels are coined at different times under different contexts to describe experiences that are rarely exclusive from those described by other labels. If you try to limit which experiences can fall under which labels, 99 times outta 100 you're just plain wrong.

That doesn't mean you have to start using the label. But you do have to stop spreading misinformation about the individuals who use the label.

That's not an unreasonable thing to expect, right?

[subsystems]

At this point, I don't want anyone following me if they uncritically support The Plural Association. This is full rant mode.

I'm triggered and deeply disturbed by the stuff I see being pumped out by this group under the guise of "inclusivity." I'm sick and tired of TPA stigmatizing systems that are different from themselves. I'm sick and tired of TPA spreading misinformation about systems that are different from themselves. I'm sick and tired of the false promises of resources and lack of transparency.

Instead of listening to systems that are different from them, they make up shit about us to turn our own community hostile towards us. You think systems who are pursuing or achieved final fusion don't see the shit you say about our existence? The misinformation you spread about us? You think systems with CDDs don't see the way you talk about them? You think we don't see you inciting more syscourse on social media?

You think we don't see you manipulating the articles people send you with their lived experiences in order to spread your toxic views?

It's ALWAYS the final fusion hatred. Have you ever asked systems who have actually achieved final fusion whether their ideas about us reflect the recovery we desired?

"It does not allow for personhood" what the fuck does that even mean! Never once during my final fusion process did anyone in my system feel like we weren't seen as or allowed to be people. Never once did our therapist erase or minimize our personhood.

Do you even care that our concept of "personhood" can shift throughout recovery, too? That we collectively pursued final fusion because our personhood felt more authentic and wonderful with fusions? And that we wouldn't fucking voluntarily pursue a recovery option if it felt like it took away from our existence, dehumanized us, or harmed us!

You only give a damn about the systems who fit your narrow little box of "valid." The ones who act and talk in the way YOU want, who heal in the way YOU want, who exist in the way YOU want. But fuck all the other ones, right!

God, sorry for this rant but I am just. So done. Please don't send them any hate or harassment, especially people who aren't even associated with them or got paid to write articles & shared their lived experiences for them. I just sincerely hope for TPA to change.

[syscourse-shmiscourse]

epic syscourse question: question?

more seriously though: what are the cons of each syscourse side in your opinion?

@starlight-chickens

Joking.

But honestly, I a lot of the issues we see in the general syscourse community are things that both communities do and then blame the other on. I've seen both sides either cherry-pick science to back themselves up or deny a valid source completely. I've seen both sides appropriate terminology from the other and then bitch about the other side doing it. I've seen circular reasoning in both spaces (that's the whole of syscourse after all!).

If I had to pick one thing that one community did worse than the other, I'd have to say antis are the absolute worst with tag-spamming. I've hardly ever seen it from the endos but the CDD tags are DROWNING in how much the antis hate the endos and it drives us nuts.

[sodalpiss]

I think the reason why so many trans people will say they are intersex or have intersex traits to transphobes in an effort to avoid discrimination is the false belief that transphobes actually care about whether or not you are like this by choice.

full disclosure: im a perisex trans guy, so i have not experienced intersexism, but from what I have read from other intersex people, bigots don't care. They don't care if it's a choice or not. If you look like a queer, you are a queer.

And I will admit, this throws me for a whiplash, not from intersex people ofc, but from bigots, because it's hypocritical. Transphobes and homophobes will argue about how trans and gay people chose to be this way. They say me and my trans siblings are ruining our bodies and choosing to believe we are some imaginary thing. They say gay people are allowed to have gay feelings but they are not allowed to act on them. So one could falsely assume that bigots care about choice.

I think this is the core of why some trans people will lie and say they are intersex or have intersex traits (disclaimer: i'm not condoning or rationalizing this, but I'm merely observing the 'why' here). It is a counter to the "you chose this and that's why you are wrong." They think "I'm not like this by choice" is a shield from any criticism from bigots.

Lying and pretending to be a discriminated minority aside, the biggest issue here is thinking bigots actually operate on the 'choice' logic, because they don't. We know this because intersex people tell us they don't care. Their experiences are proof of that.

Just from my own observations about 'bigot logic:'

Being trans is a choice and intersex people don't exist.

If intersex people exist, they are so small in terms of the population that they don't really matter.

If they see an intersex person in real life, they see a freak.

Bigots do not think "Oh, they didn't choose this so they are clear." They think "Oh, this is a queer freak, I'm going to call them a [insert relevant slur here]." And if we are following their logic about trans people, yeah, that's hypocritical!

Now some bigots think that intersex people are choosing to not align themselves with the binary gender they are closest too, but I honestly think this is also a surface logic to the deeper logic underneath. And this deeper logic is the same logic that the bigots in the previous paragraph with their hypocritical arguments.

The consistent, underlying logic that is hidden by the "choice" rhetoric is that if you break the gender binary, you are sub-human. End of story.

Bigots do not actually care about whether or not you are intersex or trans, whether you chose it or not, you break the gender binary and you are sub-human. That is what intersex people have been saying. They. Do. Not. Care.

Bigots are not honest and we shouldn't trust they actually believe what they are arguing (i.e. "Being trans is a choice and that's why it's wrong) because what they actually believe goes far deeper than their words.

Tl;dr: Intersex people have been telling us bigots don't care, and they have been right all along.

End of post, Disclaimer below read more.

Disclaimer: I am a perisex trans man but I am working to be a better intersex ally. I encourage intersex people to comment and reblog and please call out anything inaccurate that I have said. I also encourage you to add your own experiences. Everything here is my own observations of bigots and people in the LGBTQIA community, and reflections on my own thoughts prior to being more educated in intersex rights. I made this post to give intersex people a voice and to hopefully frame why pretending being intersex is wrong to trans people in a way that makes sense.

Everything in this post is intended to be pro-intersex and pro-trans.

[witchiewinchester]

I'm gonna hold your hand when I say this.

A lot of people who receive government assistance are also taxpayers. Most of the time, it's not one or the other, and you need to stop acting like you're better than those who need help.

One day you'll need help it won't be there if you think you're better than everyone else.

[transandrobroism]

Hi I'm the person who asked if you were transmed: I was super tired last night and misread a post that you reblogged and thought it used some vaguely transmed-adjacent wordage and wanted to be sure. I just reread the post and realized it had nothing to do with what I thought. Sorry for being accusatory, i should have given more context lol

it's all good anon it happens.

for the record: no, i don't consider myself to be a transmed and i don't really agree with that kind of community gatekeeping. i don't think people need dysphoria to be trans and i don't think medically transitioning makes someone a "better" trans person or "more valid" or a "real trans person". it's just another way to stir up community division.

the reality is that trans people are not a homogenous group and we experience things like dysphoria and medical transition differently. some people don't want to medically transition at all; some people want all the hormones and surgery they can get their hands on. a LOT of people fall somewhere in the middle of those two points. so if you start saying "you need dysphoria to be really trans!!!" well... how much? plenty of people have dysphoria over some body parts and not others. do you need to be completely dysphoric and miserable to be "really trans"...? also if the metric is dysphoria, then someone who has no real dysphoria over their body but just figures they'd be happier on a full dose of hormones and getting every surgery would like... not count as "really trans" despite medically transitioning pretty drastically.

on the other hand you have the issue that a lot of trans people just can't access medical transition due to gatekeeping, costs, wait times etc etc. which makes "has this person done any medical transition" a really poor metric of someone's legitimate transness.

so yeah not a transmed. i take the nuanced view that the trans community is a broad umbrella and has space for everyone, regardless of their specific experience of dysphoria, transition etc. i think we can welcome non-dysphoric trans people whilst recognising that dysphoria is a big, serious problem for a lot of trans people. we can welcome people who don't want to medically transition and are happy to embrace their body as-is, whilst also acknowledging that for many trans people, medical transition is literally life-saving care. it's just different experiences and different needs. taking an extreme view either way is unhelpful and divisive and i'm all about building up the community and working together, not creating more arbitrary divisions.