Splendor solis, c. 1582

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@thelowlystylite
Splendor solis, c. 1582
You think Odysseus was Homer's favorite blorbo because of the amount of details he put in his descriptors. I think Odysseus was Homer's favorite blorbo because of the absolute hell he put him through. You cannot convince me that The Odyssey wasn't just someone going buck wild with their favorite oc—because that's exactly what it was.
ooh I got pliny of elder
so many people don't understand how abelist it is to kill your brother with a rock
she tower on my babel till I ἐπιούσιον
#ἐπιούσιον is a word that’s only ever used in the Lord’s prayer#with extreme controversy surrounding its translation#i suspect the joke here is that this post forces the reader to do a bunch of linguistic research#only to not come up with a conclusive answer#mimicking the experiences of those who built the tower of babel#this has been another installment of overexplaining jokes until theyre not funny anymore with autistics via @exbeekeeper
official linguistics post
(bonus: some more information on the dis legomenon ἐπιούσιον)
Would anyone be interested in a list of ancient Greek literature for noobs
Ancient Greek lit for people who only mostly know what Greece is
My goal of this list is to give you an idea of what you want to read based on your interests and reasons for diving into Ancient Greek literature. Not to instruct you to read all of this stuff. I have only included things that have either survived in full or have significant amounts of surviving fragments and have public domain translations easily available to find online with minimal digging.
My advice though if you can afford it or find it at your local library is to go for the most recent translations of these works because those will likely be much easier to comprehend for your 21st century brain. It'll also likely be helpful for you to read translator's notes, footnotes, and introductions and read any maps included in your editions because those can often give you important historical and cultural context that may otherwise be confusing for you. The far past is another country so get all the context you feel that you need.
The basics aka what every Greek writer has also read and frequently references back to:
The Iliad and the Odyssey by Homer, stories of the mythical Trojan war and its aftermath. The Iliad is about the ending days of the war and focuses on the hero Achilles, while the Odyssey is about the hero Odysseus getting lost at sea for many years on his way home from the war.
The Theogony and Works and Days by Hesiod, an attempt at tracing the genealogy of the gods and other various myths and personal opinions about them. This is what most people use as reference when talking about Greek creation stories.
Other longer works about Mythology:
The Argonautica by Apollonius Rhodius, the story of Jason and the golden fleece and the adventures his sailing crew of heroes had on the way there.
The Library or Bibliotheca by Pseudo-Apollodorus, basically an ancient reference book on the stories of Greek religion, told in roughly chronological order.
The Dionysiaca by Nonnus, the longest surviving book of ancient Greek literature, it tells the story of the god Dionysus before he ascended to godhood and his trip to and return from India.
The Posthomerica by Quintus of Smyrna, likely written in the 3rd century AD, is an epic poem attempting to tell the parts of the fall of Troy that Homer left out between the death of the prince Hector and the burning of Troy.
Shorter Poetry:
The Homeric hymns, not actually by Homer but by an unknown author or authors, these are a series of short and long poems and songs that tell stories of various gods and also show a bit how they were worshiped.
The works of Sappho, though not much of her poetry has survived, what remains is still good. She mainly wrote love poems about women but also men and is notable for referring to herself in the first person, something which was unusual at the time.
The works of Pindar, probably the most well preserved of the "nine lyric poets" of ancient Greece his work has been seen as confusing and unusual at times, but it's still a treat to read in my opinion.
The works of Bacchylides, a contemporary of Pindar, but his poetry is thought to be much more understandable and approachable.
Plays about Mythology and Folklore, all tragedies:
The works of Sophocles, especially the Oedipus trilogy that includes Oedipus Rex, Oedipus at Colonus, and Antigone which tells the story of the king Oedipus who was doomed by an oracle and the aftermath of his actions on his family.
The works of Euripides, especially Medea about the witch Medea and her betrayal by the hero Jason and the Bacchae, which tells the story of the god Dionysus.
The works of Aeschylus, especially The Oresteia, which is a trilogy of plays including Agamemnon, The Libation Bearers, and The Eumenides which together tell the story of the murder of the Greek king Agamemnon, the consequences of the cycle of revenge that followed, and the pacification of the furies, who are goddesses of punishment.
Selected comedic plays and political satires which are all by Aristophanes because he's the one whose work survived:
The Birds, a comedy about a man who convinces local birds to build a city in the sky and replace the gods.
Thesmophoriazusae or, Women at the Thesmophoria, a comedy about a man who sneaks into a women's only festival where the women debate how to punish the playwright Euripides for something he's written. The play pokes fun at tragic playwrights and poets.
The Knights, a satire of Athenian political life and an open criticism of many real politicians at the time where the real politician Cleon is the villain of the story.
Famous works of philosophy, science, mathematics, and medicine:
The works of Plato, especially The Republic which is about his idea of a perfect society and The Symposium which discusses philosophy through imaginary dialogues with the philosopher Socrates.
The works of Aristotle, and depending on what you're interested in he has books on Ethics, Politics, Poetics, Physics, The Art of Rhetoric, and Metaphysics, usually titled by the subject they discuss.
Sayings and Anecdotes, attributed to Diogenes the Cynic, this is what survives of a work said to collect the sayings of the philosopher Diogenes and other philosophers of the school of Cynicism.
The Hippocratic Corpus, a collection of around 60 texts often attributed to the physician Hippocrates, though this has never been conclusively proven. Notable works in this collection include On Airs, Waters, and Places, Epidemics, On Ancient Medicine, and On the Sacred Disease.
The works of Euclid, especially The Elements, which is a treatise on geometry.
The works of Archimedes, a famous Greek mathematician, especially On the Sphere and Cylinder, Measurement of a Circle, The Method of Mechanical Theorums, and On Floating Bodies.
Enquiry into Plants by Theophrastus, a colleague of Aristotle who had significant influence on the early history of botany.
Histories, historical fiction, geographies, and travel guides. The line between these genres is extremely blurry in this time period:
Histories by Herodotus, an account of the Greco-Persian wars as well as stories collected from around the Mediterranean and observations Herodotus made himself in his travels.
History of the Peloponnesian War by Thucydides, an unfinished account of the Peloponnesian war between Athens and Sparta by an Athenian general. Often seen as unusually neutral and unbiased in his accounting of events for the time period, though it is sometimes unclear how accurate he is.
The works of Xenophon, a military leader and philosopher, especially Hellenica which picks up where Thucydides left off, Cyropaedia which is a (likely fictionalized) biography of Cyrus the Great, and Anabasis which tells the story of Cyrus the Younger's attempt to steal the Persian throne with the help of ten thousand Greek mercenaries.
Description of Greece by Pausanias, a description of parts of Roman era Greece including Pausanias' own experiences in his travels, various cities and religious sites, and descriptions of topography.
Histories by Polybius, a work that only survives partially, is by a Greek who lived in Rome for a time after capture and is one of our main literary sources on the Punic wars between Rome and Carthage.
The works of Plutarch, a priest at the temple of Apollo in Delphi during the Roman era, especially Parallel Lives, which is a collection of biographies of famous Greeks and Romans that Plutarch thought were similar, Life of Alexander, which is a biography of Alexander the Great, and Life of Caesar, which is a biography of Julius Caesar.
Okay that's what I have for you. Go have fun!
not to be a gatekeeper or anything but i wholeheartedly believe that if you cannot appreciate the constant planning, effort, and labor of ancient workers (slaves, farmers, weavers, potters, etc) - you genuinely cannot examine or appreciate antiquity in any meaningful way (besides becoming an example for what NOT to do).
Because so much of what survives - the impressive works that people think of when they hear “Greece,” “Rome,” “Egypt,” “Sumer,” etc. is not the result of ‘scholars’ but was built off the labor and skills of laborers who were not ‘scholars’ in the modern sense, were not ‘educated’ in the same manner as someone from fucking middle-class USA or whatever, but who were trained and informed about their particular discipline in a way that most of us cannot even begin to fathom. And their labor was built off the unseen efforts of other workers - slaves, farmers, weavers, potters, quarrymen, smiths, etc - with similarly specialized, period-specific knowledge that I think is impossible to fully appreciate if you do not respect blue-collar work and manual labor.
Like, you can say you “know more” than the average person in antiquity - but you don’t. Maybe in a conceptual manner - yeah, we know about distant planets and galaxies, we’ve got germ theory, we have made a collection of the entire human genome, we have walked on the fucking moon - but from the perspective of someone from 500 BCE (if I may be allowed a dash of speculation here), does that matter?
In our industrialized, globalized world, I think we forget the sheer effort that went into everything. The sheer degree of skill needed to create homes, tools, clothing, ceramics, fine jewelry, statues, and everything in-between. The skill, knowledge, and effort that went into everyday subsistence activities, like farming, herding, and weaving; and into other trades such as shipping and manufacturing. These are not mindless tasks, devoid of calculation and forethought; to pretend they are in even the slightest is disingenuous.
I would even go so far as to say it is extremely classist & sexist, because - shocker - people still work in these fields. The food you eat, the clothes you wear, the streets you walk, the buildings you eat and sleep and live in - these did not spawn out of a vacuum. Constant effort - unending, backbreaking labor, time, and skill has gone into the world we walk through today, so people can go on pretending like they’re somehow ‘smarter’ than those who came before them, when the only difference is that we* are able to concentrate on something besides our own survival. something otherwise ‘useless’ for everyday survival, and i say that as an archaeologist. Excavating a Bronze Age brewery does not provide food, it does not provide you with clothes (it actually damages them), it does not give you shelter, it mostly provides you with broken potsherds and a whole lot of dirt destined for floatation. Yes, it requires practical skills too - but many of these are essentially also used, even more frequently, in manual labor and agriculture.
And - in this broken, frightful world - we are so damn lucky** that people can even spare time for this, to learn more about the ancient world. And we are even more lucky that - when we are born with health complications, are disabled, or are faced with diseases like pneumonia, measles, and COVID - that these are not death sentences. Artificial scarcity, corporate greed, and fearmongering can make them so, but there is still that ability to live. To focus on the past, instead of making it to the next day, the next week, the next month.
But - I want to emphasize here - this is all entirely reliant on the work of people who continue to carry out the same manual labor done by countless individuals - enslaved and free - up through antiquity. People whose calculations were their survival, whose understanding of the natural world and local resources made the difference between life and death.
To pretend like we are somehow more knowledgable, more capable, more “advanced” intellectually than those who laid the foundations for the entire fucking world we live in today, is a lie. A smug, disgusting little lie that spits on all we have done as a species (and all the progress we are trying to make) with the idea that “we’ve done it”, we’re “superior,” this idea that only encourages rotting in self-assured apathy while the world burns.
And you cannot appreciate the past when you approach it with false assumptions which are based on nothing except preconcieved notions of modern superiority and the belief that knowledge is both ‘quantifiable’ and absolute. We are just as capable of joy, wisdom, compassion, and love as the ancients; and we are just as susceptible to fear, anger, and hatred as they were. I’m not saying everyone has to know the ins and outs of every ancient industry ever to appreciate the fucking Parthenon, but if someone cannot approach the ancient world with an open mind, a sense of humility, and self-reflection - then I suspect they cannot appreciate the fucking Parthenon.
*When I use the term 'we,' I am referring to individuals who do not specialize in manual labor/blue-collar industries and/or engage in subsistence agriculture.
**I know that these are all very situational and that the management and medicine available to people is inextricable from their class, identity, and nationality. I am merely trying to stress that it is possible. I would be dead without modern medicine; and I know countless others who are the same way.
survival mechanism they don’t emphasize enough is memorizing a poem. you memorize a poem you have a little lift raft for a variety of situations
My favorite jokes are about mispronouncing philosophers' names but I'm afraid it's a nietzsche subgenre
But it can hit if you plato the right crowd
The Battistero degli Ariani (Baptistery of the Arians). It was built around the end of the 5th century by King Theodoric the Great.
Ravenna, Italy
He knows what's up
spill for me, Muse, the wine-dark tea on a problematic man
I translated the Ea-Nasir complaint into vulcan and engraved it in on a cooper plate
The tumblrest sentence I have ever seen
me: I'm Stupid. I spent all week drinking wine and jerking it in my tent because of how pissed off I am. Now Patroclus has fallen in battle. I have lost him. I'm Cringe Fail.
Xanthus, the famous foal: The Hour Of Your Doom Draws Nigh