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I think when it comes to Bethesda fallout raiders displaying gore everywhere and the interplay/obsidion raiders not doing that, obviously the Doylist explaination is just that Bethesda thinks that fighting raiders that hang bodies and gore everywhere is fun. And they’re right.

If we’re thinking of a Watsonian explaination though, maybe it’s a cultural thing on the east coast to display the bodies/heads of your slain enemies as a show of intimidation.

I mean the British did it up until the 18th century so like.

You know it’s fun to poke holes in the society of the Bethesda fallouts but frankly a lot of stuff going on in there is stuff that has also happened in the real world that we’ve just forgotten about. So like. idk maybe human beings are just more gross than you thought they were. You know what I mean? Like if you think that displaying the heads of your enemies is rediculous take it up with the British.

Bethsoft h8r here! Fallout fanboy. Having recently seen a clip from a very terrible, almost unwatchable, live-action version of the anime/manga "Terra Formars"... Listen, guys. Something doesn't have to be *good* for you to enjoy or justify enjoying it. It can be ridiculous. It can be campy, corny, cheesy, cliche. It's supposed to be fun, right? I don't defend the newer Fallouts, or even the live action series. I can still enjoy them without having to try to make a case that they're all that defensible or superior media. I just think its limiting people's flexibility and creativity to think that they have to defend something in order to justify having played or watched something and enjoyed it. Yeah, OP's right, they probably just did it because they thought it was fun. You gotta remember how they originally released statements while FO3 was beginning to be made that basically told all the original fans to f-off. So the fanbase not taking kindly to Bethsoft was a bit more personal to the fans who were around back then than it is about the newer ones. They knew they were marketing to a newer audience and that's also why they virtually removed the entire turn-based combat system (it was originally a spiritual successor to the game "Wasteland" and based largely on Dungeons & Dragons RPG style, but the newer audiences were more willing to forgive and consume something that felt like it was basically just "Oblivion with guns"). I think it helps enjoy the game to see it all through a different perspective, almost like a spinoff. And Oblivion/Skyrim were fun games, but they were for a different feel and style. You'll notice that the time that dead bodies were used to ward off intruders or passers-by it was in Fallout 2 when the Ghost Farm used dummies smeared in Brahmin guts as a sort of scarecrow. It was a very cool story device and I think a bit more nuanced that these relatively peaceful people, the Slags, only used such a strategy in order to deter people-- not as a show of actual aggression or trophy-display. Using actual bodies is more of a medieval tactic that fits more with the fantasy genre along the lines of turning deathclaws into the equivalents of dragons and going full-overboard with emphasizing the Brotherhood of Steel as an order of knights. It also helps to remember the difference in resource availability. The intro to both the first Fallout games has the lines (FO1):

"The Romans waged war to gather slaves and wealth. Spain built an empire from its lust for gold and territory. Hitler shaped a battered Germany into an economic superpower.

But war never changes.

In the 21st century, war was still waged over the resources that could be acquired. Only this time, the spoils of war were also its weapons: petroleum and uranium. For these resources, China would invade Alaska, the US would annex Canada, and the European Commonwealth would dissolve into quarreling, bickering nation-states, bent on controlling the last remaining resources on Earth..." And it was actually a criticism many of us had of the first games before there was even talk of a third in the works-- that there was too much ammo and it was too easy to come by. There was even a fan-made mod to reduce the quantity and ease by which you could acquire it. The theme of desolation and scarcity, the collapse of order and the enveloping coldness of entropy was palpable, whereas in the newer games everything seems not just bountiful, but so available that microfusion cells are littered across the wasteland and you can even wield mini-nuke-launchers! (FO2):

"too many humans, not enough space or resources to go around." Certainly doesn't feel like that anymore. There's free-energy everywhere. Much more like magic. Anyway, that's how I'm still able to partake in the newer content of the fandom. It's a spinoff. It's fun. That's how Fallout was able to be a spiritual successor to Wasteland without having to BE a Wasteland franchise game. The number and type of differences are almost the same distance on the same spectrum away from each other.

You make some interesting points but I do think that fallout 3 and 4 are good. Unironically. And like as a new fan all the talk from the old fans about how much something I enjoy sucks actually just kinda gets annoying after a while? I’m sure the new fans are also annoying to you in different ways so I’m not like angry or whatever but I unironically think that a lot of Bethesda games are good despite their flaws and sometimes very much because of their flaws. I just kinda don’t wanna put a million caveats on my enjoyment in order to partake in discussion and analysis. They’re good games. Often more well thought out than people give them credit for.

Have fun! Enjoy the games. They are good games! (personally I don't count 76, and New Vegas seems to try to be more aligned with the canon) Even the combat system was interesting.

It's just a bit disheartening to call them Fallout games and canon. Even in game franchises like Resident Evil or Silent Hill, new fans don't discount the fans of the classic games and don't put the new films on a pedestal, there's more perspective in proportion.

New fans weren't hazed and mocked by Bethsoft devs calling you "supernerds." 😭 And gloating about how they bought it and it was theirs now to do as they wished, even saying they didn't need to play the original games to make a good Fallout game, which fan outcry forced them to later reconsider and largely contributed to the changes made before release and in the dev team for New Vegas.

Bethsoft hated us at first! To them it was an intellectual property and copyright acquisition and at a bargain price from a sinking company. It's not about shitting on the new fans, I personally love that this franchise was given a breath of new life with you guys.

I also think you guys should check out Wasteland, there was a second and third in the series. I think you'll understand the connections and threads running through these games.

I’m not personally putting the new games on a pedestal but I think I understand your point. I’m just not super into 80s and 90s computer games because their UI often makes me so frustrated that I want to snap my keyboard in half. That’s probably just a personal flaw on my end or something. I’ve watched other people play them though so that I’m familiar with them on a story level.

As someone whose favorite game in the series is fallout 3 though I know firsthand that people who are only fans of the classic games and new Vegas can be really condescending sometimes so I’ve just kind of come to expect that unfortunately.

I think when it comes to Bethesda fallout raiders displaying gore everywhere and the interplay/obsidion raiders not doing that, obviously the Doylist explaination is just that Bethesda thinks that fighting raiders that hang bodies and gore everywhere is fun. And they’re right.

If we’re thinking of a Watsonian explaination though, maybe it’s a cultural thing on the east coast to display the bodies/heads of your slain enemies as a show of intimidation.

I mean the British did it up until the 18th century so like.

You know it’s fun to poke holes in the society of the Bethesda fallouts but frankly a lot of stuff going on in there is stuff that has also happened in the real world that we’ve just forgotten about. So like. idk maybe human beings are just more gross than you thought they were. You know what I mean? Like if you think that displaying the heads of your enemies is rediculous take it up with the British.

Bethsoft h8r here! Fallout fanboy. Having recently seen a clip from a very terrible, almost unwatchable, live-action version of the anime/manga "Terra Formars"... Listen, guys. Something doesn't have to be *good* for you to enjoy or justify enjoying it. It can be ridiculous. It can be campy, corny, cheesy, cliche. It's supposed to be fun, right? I don't defend the newer Fallouts, or even the live action series. I can still enjoy them without having to try to make a case that they're all that defensible or superior media. I just think its limiting people's flexibility and creativity to think that they have to defend something in order to justify having played or watched something and enjoyed it. Yeah, OP's right, they probably just did it because they thought it was fun. You gotta remember how they originally released statements while FO3 was beginning to be made that basically told all the original fans to f-off. So the fanbase not taking kindly to Bethsoft was a bit more personal to the fans who were around back then than it is about the newer ones. They knew they were marketing to a newer audience and that's also why they virtually removed the entire turn-based combat system (it was originally a spiritual successor to the game "Wasteland" and based largely on Dungeons & Dragons RPG style, but the newer audiences were more willing to forgive and consume something that felt like it was basically just "Oblivion with guns"). I think it helps enjoy the game to see it all through a different perspective, almost like a spinoff. And Oblivion/Skyrim were fun games, but they were for a different feel and style. You'll notice that the time that dead bodies were used to ward off intruders or passers-by it was in Fallout 2 when the Ghost Farm used dummies smeared in Brahmin guts as a sort of scarecrow. It was a very cool story device and I think a bit more nuanced that these relatively peaceful people, the Slags, only used such a strategy in order to deter people-- not as a show of actual aggression or trophy-display. Using actual bodies is more of a medieval tactic that fits more with the fantasy genre along the lines of turning deathclaws into the equivalents of dragons and going full-overboard with emphasizing the Brotherhood of Steel as an order of knights. It also helps to remember the difference in resource availability. The intro to both the first Fallout games has the lines (FO1):

"The Romans waged war to gather slaves and wealth. Spain built an empire from its lust for gold and territory. Hitler shaped a battered Germany into an economic superpower.

But war never changes.

In the 21st century, war was still waged over the resources that could be acquired. Only this time, the spoils of war were also its weapons: petroleum and uranium. For these resources, China would invade Alaska, the US would annex Canada, and the European Commonwealth would dissolve into quarreling, bickering nation-states, bent on controlling the last remaining resources on Earth..." And it was actually a criticism many of us had of the first games before there was even talk of a third in the works-- that there was too much ammo and it was too easy to come by. There was even a fan-made mod to reduce the quantity and ease by which you could acquire it. The theme of desolation and scarcity, the collapse of order and the enveloping coldness of entropy was palpable, whereas in the newer games everything seems not just bountiful, but so available that microfusion cells are littered across the wasteland and you can even wield mini-nuke-launchers! (FO2):

"too many humans, not enough space or resources to go around." Certainly doesn't feel like that anymore. There's free-energy everywhere. Much more like magic. Anyway, that's how I'm still able to partake in the newer content of the fandom. It's a spinoff. It's fun. That's how Fallout was able to be a spiritual successor to Wasteland without having to BE a Wasteland franchise game. The number and type of differences are almost the same distance on the same spectrum away from each other.

You make some interesting points but I do think that fallout 3 and 4 are good. Unironically. And like as a new fan all the talk from the old fans about how much something I enjoy sucks actually just kinda gets annoying after a while? I’m sure the new fans are also annoying to you in different ways so I’m not like angry or whatever but I unironically think that a lot of Bethesda games are good despite their flaws and sometimes very much because of their flaws. I just kinda don’t wanna put a million caveats on my enjoyment in order to partake in discussion and analysis. They’re good games. Often more well thought out than people give them credit for.

thickness-protection-program

Have fun! Enjoy the games. They are good games! (personally I don't count 76, and New Vegas seems to try to be more aligned with the canon) Even the combat system was interesting.

It's just a bit disheartening to call them Fallout games and canon. Even in game franchises like Resident Evil or Silent Hill, new fans don't discount the fans of the classic games and don't put the new films on a pedestal, there's more perspective in proportion.

New fans weren't hazed and mocked by Bethsoft devs calling you "supernerds." 😭 And gloating about how they bought it and it was theirs now to do as they wished, even saying they didn't need to play the original games to make a good Fallout game, which fan outcry forced them to later reconsider and largely contributed to the changes made before release and in the dev team for New Vegas.

Bethsoft hated us at first! To them it was an intellectual property and copyright acquisition and at a bargain price from a sinking company. It's not about shitting on the new fans, I personally love that this franchise was given a breath of new life with you guys.

I also think you guys should check out Wasteland, there was a second and third in the series. I think you'll understand the connections and threads running through these games.

colorful4japan

A window of a temple

Kyoto,Japan

2012

pmamtraveller

Eugène Cyrille Brunet - Mesalina

simzart

Heat Wave. 🫠

Dang rip America

karlyboyyy

lemondoddle

[ID. Two photos, the first of a display for americana paper plates, one of them with text reading, "united states of america: 1776-2026". The second photo is of a person squatting at a tombstone, smiling and giving a peace sign to the camera. The text from the paper plate has been added on the tombstone. End ID.]

pmamtraveller

Carved from a single emerald over 400 years ago

wiley-treehouse-gardens

South Africa, 2025

#Make Racists Scared Again 2026

Share if you want people to know they should be scared to be racist around you 👊🏾

"making them afraid will make them more racist" that's wild to me, because we live in a whole culture of social consequences for antiracism anyway. It is literally safer to be a racist than it is to speak up against it, socially.

Idk about you, but "I'm afraid no one will want to be my friend if I'm a white supremacist" seems like a pretty logical thought process to have, and I wish THAT were the normal and not "I'm afraid my friends will hate me if I tell them they made racist jokes".

zajef37

sometimes racists aren’t even aware that they’re racist tho