[buyercrimtheory]

“If technology includes both non-material techniques and material technology and given that technologies are becoming increasingly coordinated, then it’s not an exaggeration to refer to technology as a system. Technology is an open system in that it interacts with its two environments—nature and human society—but it is not open in that it does not possess genuine feedback. What finally allows technology to become a system is the widespread use of the computer. The computer allows each technology to become a source of information for the coordination of the various technologies. Technology is a system, then, at the level of information. This means, however, that each subsystem loses some of its flexibility, for its courses of action must be adjusted to the needs of the other subsystems. The mutual interaction and mutual dependency of subsystems made possible by the computer is the technological system. In large urban areas, for example, the various technological subsystems such as communication, transportation, law enforcement, and commerce become more dependent upon one another for the smooth operation of the overall urban system.

Although the technological system is an open system, it is more or less autonomous in relation to its human environment. The problem is that the technological system allows for no effective feedback, that is, self-regulation. Feedback means that a system (such as an ecological system) has the ability to correct the problem at its source. For instance, if the technological system possessed feedback, then the use of the automobile, a major cause of air pollution, would be eliminated or severely curtailed. Instead, we attempt to discover ways of countering the negative effects of the automobile on the environment. Only humans, however, can provide feedback for the technological system. But because of our supreme faith in technology and because of our delusion that as technology’s creators we are its masters, we do not perceive the need to provide such feedback. As a consequence, the technological system is more or less autonomous, that is, independent of moral control.”

— Technology as Magic

[buyercrimtheory]

“Under capitalism, the totality of its relations appear as a “contradictory unity of material and social, objective and subjective, exploiting and exploited elements…” (21) So what then is capital’s particular antagonism with nature? Why does it appear to ‘undervalue’ nature? Perhaps the problem is with the specifically capitalist value-form itself, and in particular with the tension between its two aspects, use-value and exchange-value. Capitalism is a mode of production that subordinates the production of use-values to the production of exchange-values. As such, it depletes its own means of existence, the land and the worker. At first this depletion is local, but as capitalism becomes global, it moves from exploiting and discarding particular ecosystems to a biospheric practice of depletion and exhaustion. This is an admitted ‘vulgar Marxist’ view of the world, which sees history first and last as the production wealth, understood as use values, or that which satisfy human needs. As Donna Haraway also stresses, we have to live first in order to make history. But the worker and the capitalist stand in a different relation to nature. The worker is opposed to nature, and yet at the same time is one of nature’s forces. (Yes, one of those dialectical concepts one just has to get used to in reading Marx). There is a non-identity of labor (natural) and production (social). The metabolic process of nature is independent of labor, and yet labor is an undecidable category between nature and the social. Useful labor is a category imposed by nature, but labor assumes a social form. “The production relation between people and nature must be treated as a socially mediated natural relationship.” (29)”

— Marx and Nature

[buyercrimtheory]

“Both the (pseudo)Promethean achievement of capital and its limit derive from the separation of direct producers from their conditions of production. The expropriation of the peasant from the soil is this historical basis. The peasants were separated from their means of subsistence, and also from the means via which they supported a non-producing class. Capitalism is not constrained by local ties between direct laborers and their immediate natural conditions. But there is a tension in the capital-labor relation. Capital still depends on the labor-nature relation that is its basis, but in an abstracted and attenuated form. Capital subsumes both labor and nature in all their differences and their qualities to the abstraction that is exchange value.
Capitalism is thus historically first the separation of labor from the conditions of production and then the eternal expansion of production separated from direct determination by need: “… natural conditions now appearing as ‘separate’ conditions for the reproduction of ‘free’ labor power…” (65) Meanwhile capital appears as its own eternal self-reproduction on an ever-expanding scale. “An economic system in which the laborers are socially separated from natural conditions of production can only accelerate the divergence of human production’s evolutionary path from the (hypothetical) evolution of extra-human nature sans human intervention.” (65) I emphasize ‘accelerate’ here, to highlight its distinct meaning here.

The separation of the peasant from the land hastens the division of labor. The division of labor makes production less determined by local natural conditions, and more determined by social connections between producers mediated by exchange values. The division of labor sets labor free, for the discovery of new processes by experimenting with all of nature. It also enables what we would now recognize as exchanges between biomes. Ever branching labor subjecting all aspects of nature to itself. And, one might add, changing in the process what ‘nature’ might be understood to be. Burkett: “the subsumption of labor under capital implies a parallel subsumption of nature under capital.” (67) This might be the ‘real’ meaning of the term real subsumption.”

— Marx and Nature

tagged the bicameral mind for this [1]

Except for signifying potential group danger, primate signals rarely apply to events outside the group, such as the presence of food or water. They are totally within group affairs and are not evolved to give environmental information in the way human languages are.

and the german ideology [2]

Consciousness is at first, of course, merely consciousness concerning the immediate sensuous environment and consciousness of the limited connection with other persons and things outside the individual who is growing self-conscious. At the same time it is consciousness of nature, which first appears to men as a completely alien, all-powerful and unassailable force, with which men’s relations are purely animal and by which they are overawed like beasts; it is thus a purely animal consciousness of nature (natural religion) just because nature is as yet hardly modified historically. (We see here immediately: this natural religion or this particular relation of men to nature is determined by the form of society and vice versa. Here, as everywhere, the identity of nature and man appears in such a way that the restricted relation of men to nature determines their restricted relation to one another, and their restricted relation to one another determines men’s restricted relation to nature.)

see also [3] (specifically, linking for the mies except at the bottomish..)

[lakdjdjsidj]

First of all its just as normative as abolitionist except the abolitionist approach at least the norm is consistent with communist ideals - that buying and selling of women should be abolished

second Harvey even says the liberal “contract” approach to labor, which is the regulatory approach, necessarily requires state intervention idk how Marxists feel about that seems that’s what polanyi advocated (since I’m bringing up his normative or structuralist is what I’ve seen economic theories and approaches based on him called so idk, tho he didn’t mention the sex industry I imagine he was opposed)

but what about like pro sex industry liberalization anarchists

besides a lot of Marxists probably all oppose further liberalization of global markets, further enclosure, etc bc of imperialism and it’s not bringing any gains of like development, just lumpenization and “jobless growth” why should liberalization of women and girls bodies be any less something to be resisted as counterproductive to progress

[lakdjdjsidj]

even if it couldn't be enforced bc state powers would be expanded criminalizing buyers is still important even if just as a symbolic measure

and push back against a certain mentality of instant gratification under capitalism that is the consciousness of reaction imo

I think it’s probably much better for communism too than not

#cont from tags

Elsewhere I’ve seen that idea is basic enlightenment philosophy? After I decided he must mean something like that so I’m probably on the right track … idk

[lakdjdjsidj]

Anyway so when I say this….. and I say it’s something about alienation from needs, or separation from needs (and therefore needing to pay $ to obtain them) I don’t really mean the fact that that is what prostitution is…. even tho that is part of it,

I also mean that this is the condition of all needs for most of the population under capitalism or for all proletarians, and I think that must be what Polanyi is talking about somehow. That transformation of mentality ppl go thru under capitalism. Working to get a wage in order to meet immediate needs even if most of them are actually producing means of production to be used later or whatever. They would never know that bc all of that labor is mediated thru exchange.

so buyer criminalization vs sex available on demand as a commodity (use value I guess) is a difference bw resistance of that mentality and like further descent into it and therefore further descent into reaction and therefore away from communism

[lakdjdjsidj]

Let us return to Vitalism and Totalitarianism. There is no need to regard them as logical alternatives. Yet their striking contrast proves that there is more than a superficial opposition between them; it suggests some measure of polarity. Vitalism is preconscious and prehistoric. With the one, history has not yet started; with the other, “it has been.” With the one, there is no necessity of change; with the other, there is no possibility of it. With the one, the “Soul” is the reality, the Mind is a fatal deviation; with the other, the Mind is the reality, and it is the vestiges of the “Soul” that cause the trouble. With the one, the person is not yet born into society; with the other, he has already been absorbed in it. With the one, there is no dialectic, because the “Soul” is undialectical; with the other, there is none because Capitalist society does not lead onward to a higher personality, but back to the unconscious social organism. The one flees from the present into the animal past; the other is an apotheosis of the inhuman present. Indeed, the Vitalist’s vision of a life sapped and destroyed by impersonal entities of the Mind-world is not entirely fictitious; it is that condition of things in a market-society which is seen in Totalitarianism. But in a highly developed society of the machine age there is no alternative to Capitalism but Socialism. Consistent Vitalism is the end of civilization and culture of any kind whatsoever. Totalitarianism thus signifies the perpetuation of the loss of freedom in self-estrangement and unreality; Vitalism, the return to the fumbling blindness of the cave. If there is one thing which could justify either of them, it is the appalling alternative presented by the other.

that (via rgyhr5y)

[lakdjdjsidj]

even if it couldn't be enforced bc state powers would be expanded criminalizing buyers is still important even if just as a symbolic measure

and push back against a certain mentality of instant gratification under capitalism that is the consciousness of reaction imo

I think it’s probably much better for communism too than not

#cont from tags

Elsewhere I’ve seen that idea is basic enlightenment philosophy? After I decided he must mean something like that so I’m probably on the right track … idk

[buyercrimtheory]

Relation of Wage-Labour to Capital What is it that takes place in the exchange between the capitalist and the wage-labourer? The labourer receives means of subsistence in exchange for his labour-power; the capitalist receives, in exchange for his means of subsistence, labour, the productive activity of the labourer, the creative force by which the worker not only replaces what he consumes, but also gives to the accumulated labour a greater value than it previously possessed. The labourer gets from the capitalist a portion of the existing means of subsistence. For what purpose do these means of subsistence serve him? For immediate consumption. But as soon as I consume means of subsistence, they are irrevocably lost to me, unless I employ the time during which these means sustain my life in producing new means of subsistence, in creating by my labour new values in place of the values lost in consumption. But it is just this noble reproductive power that the labourer surrenders to the capitalist in exchange for means of subsistence received. Consequently, he has lost it for himself.

[buyercrimtheory]

The situation is probably at its worst in the Balkans, where the devastation of capitalist counterrevolution was amplified by the bloody U.S./NATO imperialist war against Serbia in 1999. Murderous ethnic hatred, promoted by the breakup of the former multinational Yugoslav deformed workers state along national lines, erupts constantly. Refugees from war and ethnic strife are desperate to flee the area. At the same time military occupation by thousands of U.S./UN troops provides a fertile source of paying customers for prostitution. These factors converge to make the Balkans ground zero for human trafficking in Europe. Traffickers bring women in from Russia and other East European countries to staff the brothels, while Albanians and others try to find their way out to the capital cities of West Europe. The U.S. government claims that criminal rings are driving the “sex slave” trade, but trafficking in the Balkans has been linked directly to U.S./UN/NATO personnel. In a 24 April 2002 statement to the House Committee on International Relations, David Lamb, a human rights investigator in the Balkans who looked into forced prostitution there, blamed the trade on UN collusion and cover-up: “The sex slave trade in Bosnia largely exists because of the UN peacekeeping operation…. Trafficking of women for forced prostitution, and the prostitution trade, are controlled by organized crime war-lords, most of whom came to power as aggressive and ruthless military or militia commanders during the war.” In describing the difficulties in investigating these abuses, he said, “Whenever involvement of UN personnel surfaced during investigations, support from UN headquarters stopped…. My investigators and I experienced an astonishing cover-up attempt that seemed to extend to the highest levels of the UN headquarters.” Press reports have detailed the involvement of personnel from both the United Nations and the Pentagon military contractor DynCorp in running sex rings in the Balkans; women were brought into Bosnia from East Europe and had their passports confiscated (“America’s For-Profit Secret Army,” New York Times, 13 October 2002; “Bosnia: UN Police Accused of Involvement in Prostitution,” Associated Press, 19 June 2001). As far as the other NATO forces go, an article in Junge Welt, “The Child Brothel of Tetovo: Covered-Up Sex Scandal Among Bundeswehr Soldiers in the Balkans” (1 March 2001), revealed discussion within the German Social Democratic/Green coalition government of possible “soldiers’ brothels” organized by the army. Reportedly, Green Party spokeswoman Angelika Beer expressed the government’s “concern for the psychological well-being and thus the combat-readiness” of the German armed forces abroad as a reason to set up brothels of German mädchen to protect the troops from the presumed diseased and under-age Balkan women. The proposal was all too reminiscent of the state-controlled brothels administered through the concentration camp system by the Wehrmacht in Nazi-occupied Europe.

http://www.icl-fi.org/english/esp/58/sextraffic.html

[buyercrimtheory]

The forces that contribute to commercial sex are found in concentrated form when examining the historic relationship between the presence of the military and prostitution. A great deal of attention has been paid to the role of military personnel in fueling demand for prostitution and sex trafficking worldwide (e.g., Allred, 2006; Zimelis, 2009), throughout history and across nations.27 Where there is a large military presence, usually one finds high levels of prostitution (e.g., Daranciang, 2010; Stensland, 2008). In the United States, for example, histories of civil war army camps discuss “travelling brothels” that follow troop movements (Krick, 2002). Contemporary reports describe how the presence of thousands of U.S. military personnel near the border of North Korea creates a robust market for commercial sex, and that women are trafficked from abroad to serve this market.28 A brief discussion the historic correlation between the military, prostitution, and sex trafficking is provided in Appendix D.

A National Overview of Prostitution and Sex Trafficking Demand Reduction Efforts, Final Report (2012), p9

[buyercrimtheory]

V. Spann, Hegel, and Marx Spann’s method in using Hegel’s concept of the Mind Objective without his dialectic tends to produce a new kind of metaphysical justification of Capitalism. This can be readily seen when contrasted to Marx’s criticism of Capitalist society. Marx starts from primitive Communism as the original state of mankind. Human relationships in daily life are here immediate, direct, personal. In a developed market-society distribution of labour intervenes. Human relationships become indirect; instead of immediate co-operation there is indirect co-operation by the medium of the exchange of commodities. The reality of the relationships persist; the producers continue to produce for one another. But this relationship is now hidden behind the exchange of goods; it is impersonal: it expresses itself in the objective guise of the exchange value of commodities; it is objective, thing-like. Commodities, on the other hand, take on a semblance of life. They follow their own laws; rush in and out of the market; change places; seem to be masters of their own destiny. We are in a spectral world, but in a world in which specters are real. For the pseudo-life of the commodity, the objective character of exchange value, are not illusion. The same holds true of other “objectifications” like the value of money, Capital, Labour, the State. They are the reality of a condition of affairs in which man has been estranged from himself. Part of his self is embodied in these commodities which now possess a strange self-hood of their own. The same holds true of all social phenomena in Capitalism, whether it be the State, Law, Labour, Capital, or Religion. But the true nature of man rebels against Capitalism. Human relationships are the reality of society. In spite of the division of labour they must be immediate, i.e., personal. The means of production must be controlled by the community. Then human society will be real, for it will be humane: a relationship of persons.

The Essence of Fascism, Karl Polanyi

[buyercrimtheory]

In Spann’s philosophy it is precisely the self-estranged condition of man which is established as the reality of society. Thus pseudo-reality is justified and perpetuated. Social phenomena are universally represented as thinglike: yet, it is denied that there is self-estrangement. Not only the State, Law, the Family, Custom, and the like are “objectifications,” as with Hegel, but so is every kind of social group function and contact, including economic and private life. This leaves no foothold for the individual; man is entrapped in his condition of self-estrangement. Capitalism is not only right, it is also eternal.

the essence of fascism

“Another john, who goes by name of “Loaded,” stated: “I feel no guilt whatsoever. I am getting what I need and I am helping them get what they need. No one is being hurt … I do not believe that God would send me to hell for acting on my natural instincts.”100”

Prostitution is Not a Choice (2007), p11

The alternative type of consciousness is as far removed from this as can be imagined. The Mind is the chief actor in producing that other plane of existence in which there is society which is not personal relationship. Society which is the realm of Totality has not persons for its units. The Political, the Economic, the Cultural, the Artistic, the Religious, etc., are the units; persons are not related to one another except through the medium of that sphere of Totality which comprises them both. If they exchange their goods they are fulfilling an adjustment Totality, i.e., the Whole; if they co-operate in producing them, they are relating themselves not to one another, but to the product. Nothing personal has here substance unless it be objectified, i.e., has become impersonal. Even friendship is not an immediate relationship of two persons, but a relation of both to their common Friendship. What the individual person is supposed to contain as a subjective experience in himself, he thus encounters as colourless semi-translucent objectivity outside himself. Society is a vast mechanism of intangible entities, of Mind-stuff; the substance of personal existence is merely the shadow of a shadow. We are in a world of specters in which everything seems to possess life except human beings.

Karl Polanyi, The Essence of Fascism

another part

[buyercrimtheory]

SOLWODI: Is prostitution a job like any other? Lutz-Ulrich Besser: This activity is not at all a job like any other. To anyone dealing with this topic it should be clear that this very intimate process when a « john » penetrates the body of a woman – even if it supposedly happens by mutual consent – only becomes bearable if the woman splits off her feelings from her consciousness.

https://ressourcesprostitution.wordpress.com/2015/04/10/prostitution-the-human-being-dehumanized/ (via buyercrimtheory)

Firstly, as commodity producers, individuals do not produce for their own immediate needs but for the needs of others that are both indifferent and separate from themselves. The results of their human activity - their labour - are thereby divorced from their own activity. The results of their labour stand apart from them as commodities that are to be sold. Secondly, as commodity consumers, objects of an individuals need do not emerge out of their own activity as social individuals but as the ready made property of some other - the producer - who is separated from them. As a consequence they find themselves immediately separated from their own social needs through the non-possession of material objects in the form of commodities.

As a consequence labour - the human activity of the producer - is separated from need - the needs of the consumer. Hence, for each particular commodity, producers are separated from consumers and are only subsequently united through the sale or exchange of the commodity. The relation between the consumer and the producer is therefore mediated through the exchange commodities - that is they are mediated through the exchange of things. To the extent that commodity exchange becomes generalised then the relations between people manifests themselves as a multitude of relations between things.

https://buyercrimtheory.tumblr.com/post/163516335427/what-is-a-commodity-the-simplest-answer-is-that-a

from op link

SOLWODI: What significance do previous experiences in childhood have for the step into prostitution?

Lutz-Ulrich Besser: Women who were subjected as a child to so-called sexual abuse had no way in their childhood to realize what happened to them. The fear, the disgust, maybe the pain can only be overcome by strong dissociative phenomena, ie a separation from consciousness. However, this experience remains virtually frozen in the brain. The main mechanism is here a « standing-beside-oneself », a choice « not-to-be-myself-any-more ». As their feelings and body sensations are separated from consciousness, prostitution is for many sexually exploited women a repetition or continuation of humiliation and exploitation of their own body from childhood.

SOLWODI: Can these women heal?

Lutz-Ulrich Besser: Such phenomena can of course be treated today. Once the women are not forced by economic hardship or violent pimps, the crucial question for healing becomes whether the woman has the inner strength to realize that all this is not good for her and that she must get out of there.

SOLWODI: What should be done to reduce trauma in prostitution?

Lutz-Ulrich Besser: Above all, information is required. One must also address the men and create an awareness that an abuse of women takes place in prostitution. The men think: « I buy myself a woman’s body, so I have the right to use it. » This ability to buy the women is the real problem. The men do not realize this in the moment, because they are paying money for a commodity over the counter, so to speak. But this is always, well, I would say, a dirty business.

[buyercrimtheory]

SOLWODI: Is prostitution a job like any other? Lutz-Ulrich Besser: This activity is not at all a job like any other. To anyone dealing with this topic it should be clear that this very intimate process when a « john » penetrates the body of a woman – even if it supposedly happens by mutual consent – only becomes bearable if the woman splits off her feelings from her consciousness.

https://ressourcesprostitution.wordpress.com/2015/04/10/prostitution-the-human-being-dehumanized/

[lakdjdjsidj]

The paradigm of the bare life captured in the sovereign ban Agamben finds in the figure of homo sacer of archaic Roman law (ibid: 8). Homo sacer ‘has been excluded from the religious community and from all political life: he cannot participate in the rites of his gens, nor […] can he perform any juridically valid act. What is more, his entire existence is reduced to a bare life stripped of every right by virtue of the fact that anyone can kill him without committing homicide; he can save himself only in perpetual flight or a foreign land.’ (ibid: 183) Stripped of legal status and expelled from the political community, homo sacer is exposed unconditionally to the potential for killing by anyone. Homo sacer ‘is in a continuous relationship with the power that banished him precisely insofar as he is at every instant exposed to an unconditional threat of death’ (ibid). Zoē and Bios Those who are captured in the sovereign ban and stripped of all legal status, find themselves, by the same act, banned from the political community. In this way, the sovereign decides which lives will be recognised as belonging to the community of political beings and which will be classified only in terms of biological fact. The basis of this distinction is addressed by Agamben with recourse to the two terms used by the Greeks to distinguish between forms of life: zoē, ‘natural reproductive life’ confined to the private sphere, and bios, ‘a qualified form of life’, political life (ibid: 1). Those who are banned from the domain of political beings are reduced by the sovereign to life defined only in terms of zoē (ibid: 183), recognised by the sovereign only as biological beings. The separation of zoē from bios, and the production of a bare, human life as a product of sovereign power can be said to undergo a transformation in modernity as zoē, or biological life, is repositioned inside the polis, becoming the focus of the State’s organisational power. This process, rooted in classical politics and extending into the present, indicates, for Agamben, a Western politics that has constituted itself from its beginnings as a biopolitics (ibid: 181).

http://criticallegalthinking.com/2015/07/02/sovereign-exception-notes-on-the-thought-of-giorgio-agamben/

I say it in the tags but want to stress that um this also sounds like vitalism and totalitarianism

(via rgyhr5y)

[lakdjdjsidj]

even if it couldn't be enforced bc state powers would be expanded criminalizing buyers is still important even if just as a symbolic measure

and push back against a certain mentality of instant gratification under capitalism that is the consciousness of reaction imo

I think it’s probably much better for communism too than not

#cont from tags

Elsewhere I’ve seen that idea is basic enlightenment philosophy? After I decided he must mean something like that so I’m probably on the right track … idk

[lakdjdjsidj]

Anyway so when I say this….. and I say it’s something about alienation from needs, or separation from needs (and therefore needing to pay $ to obtain them) I don’t really mean the fact that that is what prostitution is…. even tho that is part of it,

I also mean that this is the condition of all needs for most of the population under capitalism or for all proletarians, and I think that must be what Polanyi is talking about somehow. That transformation of mentality ppl go thru under capitalism. Working to get a wage in order to meet immediate needs even if most of them are actually producing means of production to be used later or whatever. They would never know that bc all of that labor is mediated thru exchange.

so buyer criminalization vs sex available on demand as a commodity (use value I guess) is a difference bw resistance of that mentality and like further descent into it and therefore further descent into reaction and therefore away from communism

[buyercrimtheory]

this blog and these posts are meant to support these assertions

[buyercrimtheory]

“* Attitude of the public towards prostitution: The support of the population on the ban on buying sexual services has increased. Judging by the results of four opinion polls, there has been a change of attitude with regard to the purchase of sexual services, which correlates with the criminalization of the purchase of such services. In all three surveys conducted since the ban was introduced, more than 70% of those asked had a positive view of the ban. Support for criminalization is greatest among young people233.

* Development of demand: In the survey of 1996, around 13.6% of men stated that they had bought sex, while in 2008, this figure had fallen to 8%234. A number of respondents also reported that the ban had affected their actions to the extent that they no longer purchased sexual services. The impression that buyers have become more ‘cautious’ is shared by some of the current and former prostitutes who responded to an inquiry, while others have reported that criminalization has not affected buyers because so few are caught and the penalties are so lenient. However, it should be noted that both surveys showed that it was more common to buy sex abroad than in Sweden. Eight out of ten purchases by Swedes of sex was carried out abroad, where it is legal. At the same time, there is a current debate in Sweden on whether to criminalise Swedish men (and women) buying sex abroad (which is the case in Norway). For ten years, social services in Stockholm, Gothenburg, and Malmö have been operating as so called KAST groups to motivate potential and active sex buyers to change their behaviour235.”

idk if this is what I was thinking when making op (on the other blog) but see, it’s worth it for these results, whether you could enforce it or not

[buyercrimtheory]

* Attitude of the public towards prostitution: The support of the population on the ban on buying sexual services has increased. Judging by the results of four opinion polls, there has been a change of attitude with regard to the purchase of sexual services, which correlates with the criminalization of the purchase of such services. In all three surveys conducted since the ban was introduced, more than 70% of those asked had a positive view of the ban. Support for criminalization is greatest among young people233. * Development of demand: In the survey of 1996, around 13.6% of men stated that they had bought sex, while in 2008, this figure had fallen to 8%234. A number of respondents also reported that the ban had affected their actions to the extent that they no longer purchased sexual services. The impression that buyers have become more ‘cautious’ is shared by some of the current and former prostitutes who responded to an inquiry, while others have reported that criminalization has not affected buyers because so few are caught and the penalties are so lenient. However, it should be noted that both surveys showed that it was more common to buy sex abroad than in Sweden. Eight out of ten purchases by Swedes of sex was carried out abroad, where it is legal. At the same time, there is a current debate in Sweden on whether to criminalise Swedish men (and women) buying sex abroad (which is the case in Norway). For ten years, social services in Stockholm, Gothenburg, and Malmö have been operating as so called KAST groups to motivate potential and active sex buyers to change their behaviour235.