i gotta think a little more about this and flesh it out in my head BUT okay. walk with me for a second. we are talking about ishgard again ok
artoirel is 30. haurchefant was 28. emmanellain is 26. they got that 2 year gap between each other, ok. right. yes. ok so. encyclopedia eorzea mentions that the fortemps countess grew ill and passed away in artoirel's section, when explaining his treatment and relationship to haurchefant. but i dont think theres any info on when exactly she passes away?
"an empty throne" has a flashback that happens when artoirel is 13 (haurchefant 11, emmanellain 9) during the ceremony of thordan vii's ascension. the countess is alive even if she doesn't make an appearance, we know this thru context. then there's "vows unbroken" which happens A YEAR after "an empty throne" because francel is 6 years old, meeting haurchefant who is TWICE his age, so 12. (artoirel 14, emmanellain 10). the countess is still alive because she forbids haurchefant from attending the dinner event. unrelated pause to mention how crazy it is that FRANCEL wasn't allowed to go to thordan vii's ascension because he was too "tender in years" but then the NEXT YEAR when he turns 6, they send his ass to "assume his responsibilities" at a dinner party in the fortemps manor
ok so! heres where it gets tricky for my brain!
"vows unbroken" continues the haurchefant and francel childhood friendship and there's one section where francel mentions knowing when haurchefant would show up to whisk him away to some adventure, because francel would hear "muffled shouts from the manor, a door slamming shut, the patter of running feet across the cobbles". we know through haurchefants direct retelling in his letter in "thoughts unspoken" that he and edmont just didn't talk or argue or do anything together, their longest conversation was him talking about the warrior of light and convincing his dad to let them into ishgard. so we can assume that these muffled shouts were because haurchefant was arguing with the countess instead, since a 13 year old artoirel mentions his mom felt disdain for haurchefant and he himself didn't really understand why. implying that he didn't know haurchefant was a bastard, which is an entirely different can of worms
but if it is indeed the countess, then she was alive during that period of time from "vows unbroken" of haurchefant and francel growing up, acting as one of the many things that exacerbated haurchefant's need to run away. which is like, okay! the closest thing i have to a death date for her!
ok now keep walking with me, i am holding your hand so we dont get lost. trust me for now. emmanellain and honoroit's age gap is of 11 years. encyclopedia eorzea mentions emmanellain took honoroit under his wing when honoroit was 9, thus emmanellain must've been 20 years old. so as of heavensward, honoroit has been working for the fortemps for 6 years (depending on how you see the timeline, this could've happened right BEFORE or right AFTER the calamity). THEN we have the old manservant of house fortemps, who is confirmed to be firmien vauxlointard in the encyclopedia eorzea + in "thoughts unspoken"--hes 60 something and so close and loyal to the fortemps that he acts as a close confidant for edmont. this guy taught haurchefant how to use a sword as a child and if you ask him in the game to tell you about ishgard (post heavensward) he tells you that he CONSIDERED resigning from his job but artoirel forbade it
ok now. stephanivien is 30 years old, same as artoirel. makes sense because they're the heirs of their families. francel is 22, hes the youngest. considering there are 3 other siblings in between without confirmed ages and after seeing the pattern in house fortemps, it makes sense to me that the house haillenarte children go in this order -> stephanivien (30), aurvael (28), chlodembait (26), laniaitte (24) and francel (22). which makes sense, because emmanellain (26) is seen hanging out with the ones closest to his age, chlodembait and laniaitte, in "an empty throne"
you may be asking, "prince where are you going with this and where are you taking me?". ok. listen to me. i have no way of figuring out when the countess died, but i can fill in the blanks with theories ideas and headcanons
grabs your shoulders. wouldn't it be fucked up if the fortemps countess got sick and died in the period of time between haurchefant (17) becoming a knight and artoirel (25) taking back dzemael darkhold in 1.0? the idea that she was too sick to do anything against haurchefant gaining a post as commander for the family. or alternatively, that she supported his endeavors as a knight bc it would mean pushing him away from the main family and this was her last act alive. the idea that she dies around the same period of time as emmanellain's decision to take in honoroit and no one stops him because the most unreliable son just lost his mother. it makes sense that they'd let him have a manservant that pretty much acts like the adult in their dynamic to keep him in check. if emmanellain just lost his mother recently. the idea that artoirel, who is seemingly the closest to her, goes on his first battles and crusades knowing that shes not going to be there to welcome him and be proud of him, specially when he saw haurchefant as a rival. he finally got to be a proper noble, a proper knight and his mother is not there to celebrate it. and his father is not there to look at him either. ofc he would ask firmien to stay and work for the fortemps post heavensword and after becoming the new count, if this is the manservant thats been in the family for decades and probably acted more as a father figure for these kids than edmont ever did.
the idea that she dies around a relatively close period of time as chlodembait's death in the steel vigil, further linking the two houses since theyre already so close. one loses a brother, one loses a mother. you have to think about the potential of emmanellain and laniaitte being childhood friends, but these deaths are what ultimately cause her to grow up and move on while he remains childish and stagnant, all bc of grief. you have to think about the potential between artoirel and the eldest children of haillenarte, how envious and jealous he must be to see stephanivien prove his father WRONG through the machinist questline and get his unconditional support. or how the haillenarte children mightve reacted after learning that haurchefant died. they may not be close to him like francel was, but they also lost a brother. and theyre a tight knit pack, bc all of these siblings show up to cheer for francel during the firmament questline. you have to think abt how house haillenarte and house fortemps are technically one big family no matter what. you have to think abt how the countess of haillenarte loves music and how artoirel also loves music. the idea that your own blood will not really see you for who you are, but there is a different type of family that will. noble families that come in a pack. if you get along with one, you get along with the other. you have to keep thinking abt ishgard for me, ok. you gotta
