Gamblegun

Trans Man, I block all anon hate & hateful comments

[velvetvexations]

Do a lot of TRFs project their dysphoria onto other trans people? Undoubtedly, but this is more a symptom than a cause, and I've moved away from describing resentment as a root motivation of TRFism. They're just selfish bullies. That's why they feel entitled to the world revolving around their preferences and dysphoria triggers.

[scramratz]

[st-dionysus]

Hey Saint, could I ask to what degree formulating transandrophobia theory was inspired/prompted* by people talking about transmisogyny? If at all?

*not sure which word is better

None. Transandrophobia is not the opposite or the mirror of transmisogyny.

Discussions of transandrophobia existed well before the term transandrophobia was coined and well before transmisogyny was coined, but it was difficult to have those conversations or to categorize the subject without a word for it.

If you read through literature about the butch/FTM border wars or any early FTM literature (zines, newsletters, feminist and lesbian journals, ect.), you will find discussions about what we might now call transandrophobia or anti-transmasculinity. (Likewise, if you look at early MTF literature, you will find many discussions of what we would now call transmisogyny, long before Julia Sernao was born). So, I think it's important to note that these conversations were already being had, I just gave it a name to make it easier to discuss, easier to organize, and in the hopes that it would provide "legitimacy" to the voices of trans men in queer academia. Once you can name an oppression, you can force others to aknowledge that it's real.

When I came up with the term "transandrophobia", transmisandry was the only word being really being used, but also at that time, it was being used frequently by transmedicalists and had several negative connotations and I felt the etymology of the word didn't really capture the issue that I wanted to speak on.

Transandrophobia is a very specific topic, though as the word has grown in popularity and is sometimes used a synonym of anti-transmasculinity (a term that was developed after transandrophobia, but more broadly discusses any anti-transmasculine bigotry, and I do encourage using both terms).

The first usage of the term transandrophobia was on my private Twitter in like 2017/18~ ish (?, I can't give you an exact date, I'm no longer on Twitter for obvious reasons) when I was trying to voice personal complaints about the forms of oppression and biogty I was facing. I suggested the word to a couple of my mutuals and described the word as being a way to speak about how a combined fear of men and a sort kindergarten feminist (boys have cooties!) thinking worked to perpetrate an existing model of gender-essentailism that specifically targeted transgender men through minimizing or denying our oppression and excluding us from community spaces that we have helped build.

So yeah, it was not prompted by discussions about transmisogyny or transfem oppression. It was prompted by the need to name and discuss my own oppression with the hopes it would empower other trans men to do the same.

[lonelydesolate]

needless to say, no trans people structurally benefit from the patriarchy. this is because we are trans. obviously instances of privilege can and do occur, but the system is not set up in a way that benefits any trans people of any kind! again. this is because we are trans.

[gamblegun]

The new files show that Epstein influenced the invention and development of /pol/ on 4chan, which frankly increases my disgust with the 4chan-originated term 'theyfab' even more, and more convinced there is a psyop element to this trans infighting movement

[gamblegun]

One of the ways I keep my sanity is by describing the transmasc hate craze and the rhetoric surrounding it to complete normies, and how utterly baffled they become. Even parroting the talking points makes me experience in real time how unreasonable, obviously untrue, and frankly deeply annoying the whole thing is. It can feel like gaslighting when every queer blog and their mother is buying into the trf thing wholesale, so it's nice to get an outside perspective in how evil and stupid this discourse is once in a while lol

[gamblegun]

While I don't care much if women randomly say "I hate men" when some guy is being shitty or something, I feel like there's this hyper specific thing where, sometimes, if they know I'm trans, the woman in question will deliberately say it in front of me with the airs of a microaggression, or start to say it in front of me suspiciously often, or give me a Look after, and it's like... Can I help you? What do you want from me girl?

[cat-in-a-mech-suit]

While cis women have managed to secure some sort of subdued “dual power” under capitalism in the late 20th and early 21st century, trans men are still seen the way 1800-1900s eugenicists and psychiatrists viewed anyone assigned female at birth: as unreliable, subhuman, lacking any unique thoughts or perspectives, insane. And because of the normalization of liberal capitalist feminism (and radical feminism too), no one even believes or can recognize bigotry that operates on that level anymore, especially in complex ways, even though it is everywhere - not only happening to trans men. The “neurodiversity” movement being aspie supremacist is another modern example. Also heavily intersects with race and class. And the fact that america is an ugly place and no one wants to think about that.

[generalbitchfest]

I really wish I could get behind the idea that the current transandrophobic discourse will go the way of ace and bi discourse, but TRFs are making names for themselves in actual transfeminist theory. Respected trans journalists are spreading anti-transmasc talking points. I don't think this is simply going to fade away as part of the cycle of discourse.

I hate feeling like I'm a doomer about this, but the bi and ace discourse felt way more like primarily online queer discourse to me while I see transandrophobic sentiments and continued transmasc/nb erasure everywhere, not just on social media. I don't want to discount the prevalence of bi- and ace- phobia and erasure (I am bi and ace), but, by and large, anti-transmasculinity feels way more baked into feminism, and our erasure when we are explicitly relevant more normalized in society.

This isn't just Tumblr discourse, and I've seen more people recognizing it and pushing back on it (in proportion to how much I've seen anti-transmasculinity) here than I have anywhere else so far.

Everything I've talked about is still all technically online, since I haven't been able to get out to queer spaces irl, but I'm not just talking about medium article journalists or academics (not that they're inherently lesser). I think this is a more widespread problem than some people on here seem to think it is.

[lonelydesolate]

hi can you name one transmasc congressman 👍

[hellofmychoice]

This is wild because restricting HRT for trans women, but keeping access for trans men has NEVER been a stated goal of people who advocate for trans men. However, multiple transphobic trans women have specifically advocated for more gatekeeping of HRT for trans men and mascs.

[kittenscratches]

Masterpost of Transmasc Theory

The following is a list of posts, articles, sites etc that talk about transandrophobia and/or anti-transmasculinity, or broader issues and experiences of transmascs that may not use (or even like) this language. I think it's important to look at works from people of all perspectives, and I think it's important for us to be able to look at others' works and see if we can apply our own frameworks (i.e anti-transmasculinity) to the ideas they're presenting as well.

I have also included some texts that I consider foundational to these theories, and I highly recommend reading them to see the frameworks a lot of us are building upon.

Some of these works are much more academic in nature, which I understand is an entry barrier. If anyone needs help with parts of works that you may not understand or would like a second opinion, feel free to DM me or send me an ask and I'll try my best to help out if spoons and time is available.

** = contains more links you should also click through and read thoroughly. Some links may be repeated here, because I think they're also foundational and/or exceptional works.

Transmasc Issues & Experiences

Coiner's (st-dionysus) definition of transandrophobia

**genderkoolaid's intro to anti-transmasculinity

**Archive of Violence Against Trans*masculine People by genderkoolaid

**nothorses' pinned post

The Transgender Dictionary "Transandrophobia" page

Not transmasc invisibility, but erasure by S.L. Void

"irl we just kiss" by S.L Void

Boygirl Girlboy blues by S.L. Void

Eraserhead by Jude Doyle

TERFs, Trans Mascs, and Two Steve Feminism by Jude Doyle

Trans Man or Baby Boy? by Adrian Beyer

There is a hidden epidemic of violence against transmasculine people by Orion Rodriguez

Trans Male Privilege by The Trans Dandy

"My Story Is One of Many": The Criminalization of Testosterone HRT by Stann Fransisco

Strip searches, trauma, isolation: Trans men describe life behind bars by Aviva Stahl

**Repro Masculinity: “An intimate snapshot of trans masculinity, reproductive health and the care that keeps us alive” by Ale Pedraza Buenahora, with interviews of many others

Can the Monster Speak? by Paul B. Preciado

Youngman by Lou Sullivan (also known as We Both Laughed in Pleasure)

Sons of the Movement by Bobby Noble

Becoming a Visible Man by Jamison Green

A Trans Man Walks Into a Gay Bar by Harry Nicholas

Transmasculinity and Feminism by Liam Lair

Other Trans Theory

Trans, Feminism: Or, Reading like a Depressed Transsexual by Cameron Awkward-Rich

The Transunitist Manifesto by Luke B.

The Transfeminist Manifesto by Emi Koyama

A Short History of Trans Misogyny by Jules Gill-Peterson

**What is Transmisogyny? by Julia Serano

Articulating Trans-Misogyny by Julia Serano

Black Trans Feminism by Marquis Bey

Gender Trouble by Judith Butler

Who's Afraid of Gender? by Judith Butler

Black on Both Sides: A Racial History of Trans Identity by C. Riley Snorton

I Am A Transwoman. I Am In The Closet. I Am Not Coming Out. by Jennifer Coates

Feminism & Intersectionality

Feminism is for Everybody by bell hooks

The Will to Change: Men, Masculinity and Love by bell hooks

The Routledge Global History of Feminism by Bonnie G. Smith (editor), Nova Robinson (editor)

the problem with radical feminism by lou reading things (youtube)

Gender: A Useful Category of Historical Analysis by Joan Scott

The Urgency of Intersectionality TED talk by Kimberle Crenshaw

Demarginalizing the Intersection of Race and Sex by Kimberle Crenshaw

Mapping the Margins by Kimberle Crenshaw

There is No Hierarchy of Oppressions by Audre Lorde

The Master's Tools Will Never Dismantle the Master's House by Audre Lorde

Freedom is a Constant Struggle by Angela Davis

Women, Race, and Class by Angela Davis

This Bridge Called My Back, editors Cherríe Moraga, Gloria Anzaldúa; foreword, Toni Cade Bambara

**Masculinity and Gender Youtube Playlist by F.D Signifier

[gamblegun]

And speaking of, it's extremely obvious that literally all this political transgender panic is completely invented and astroturfed by billionaires looking to kill us all. And like, it makes me suspicious that the trans community is so hateful and fractured as it is now by all this bullshit. I know it's cute to say you're "doing the feds' work for them" when it comes to queer disourse, but it is my honest belief that this all is held up by an actual psyop effort of some kind.

[learn-how-to-love]

I just think it’s weird when folks act like trans and cis men are equally complicit in perpetuating misogyny in our society when like. No I’m pretty sure the number of trans men and mascs listening to Andrew Tate and manosphere podcasts, advocating for dismantling reproductive rights and talking about restoring Traditional Gender Roles™️ are likely so few as to be basically imperceptible. I think it’s actually way more likely that a cis WOMAN would do those things before a trans man would because (and I know this will shock many) misogyny isn’t an inherent part of manhood but is, instead, a learned behavior that anyone can perpetuate, especially those who exist within the bounds of cishetperisex society. Which trans men do not.

[gamblegun]

It's sadly an issue for all trans people that people hold the actions of cis men against us constantly. The most obvious example is the idea that cis men will use trans women as an excuse to sneak into women's bathrooms or sports teams or whatever other hysterics the Right astroturfs, so the public doesn't notice the rich stealing all their money. As for stupid petty internet drama, I feel like I see a kinda casual mainstream acceptance (as in queer social media crowd mainstream, not as in general normie public mainstream) of this kinda made-up worry in that trans men en masse exactly replicate cis gender dynamics with trans women because we are the cis men of the trans community or something. Type shit. "There are issues with [insert group of] marginalized men who hate and leverage their male privilege over their cis women counterparts, thus..." You are still talking about CIS MEN. We are not trying to be "special" by bringing up that we have no actual male privilege and thus have inherently different dynamics with society and other trans people than cis people have with their oppressed counterparts. We are the only group of men society fully and utterly does not see or treat as men! We are all trans people! We can be dicks to each other, but we cannot actually oppress each other on this specific axis!

[gamblegun]

When I see TRF posts completely making things up, like "I bet transandrobros want to become congressmen so they can restrict all hrt EXCEPT testosterone", really just seem like another classic case of every-accusation-is-a-confession syndrome that reactionaries have. Like, what group feminizes the enemy and demonizes their transition again? Who came up with theyfab? Who thinks all masculinity is poison? Who revels in deep, deep hatred and acts via a desire to punish and dominate? Who even thinks of this in the first place lmaoooo

[that-grassbro]

the reason they will claim transmascs can't reclaim bitch in the same breath as the one they draw to call us birthday boy bitches, whiny bitches, hysterical bitches, pussy bitches and 100 other pejoratives is because they're liars.

They don't view transmascs as an oppressive class to punch up at they view transmascs as people of equal or lesser status, who have given up their right to defence.

[that-grassbro]

'trans women hating trans men is the same as any other marginalised woman hating men of their group' but i never heard of disabled (cis) woman hating disabled men for being 'biologically inferior', 'being hysterical and whiny' or 'having no culture/contributions to society'

I mean it may just be me but that doesn't really sound like punching up. Almost like theres a word for considering people lesser for what you perceive their sexgender class to be. Idk what that word is.. misoery, mogyny?