Kazi's Girlfriend

[ladyandherbooks]

I think that the idea that TDP has to have a singular main character has really negatively impacted the fandom. It's an ensemble cast with multiple main characters, it doesn't need or require this debate, and in fact, sometimes shows don't need 1 main character.

And since this started, we've seen a very vocal part of the fandom decide that Callum is the main character we've seen this view change how people engage with the show and within the fandom.

The most infamous victim of this is Rayla who gets relegated to MC's love interest who bounces between being the worst when she makes mistakes that hurt Callum or is a timid wallflower who needs Callum to be her Knight who saves her or stands up to her family for her because she can't (she can and has). It's such a deliberate misunderstanding and misrepresentation of who Rayla actually is and shows that people don't actually see her a complicated person, they see her as a prop or a prize.

And it also probably explains why some fans also hate Rayla's family and the idea of them getting anymore screen time. If they don't see Rayla as her own character then they don't see the point of Rayla having important relationships outside of Callum. Because having those relationships will detract from her romantic relationship with Callum because she's only truly Callum's love interest to them.

I keep to my nicely curated Ruthari/Moon fam bubble so I don't see or hear about much of this for other characters or story arcs but I wouldn't be surprised if it has or is happening to other parts of the fandom too, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was or had.

[kazisgirlfriend]

I think it's accurate to call TDP an ensemble cast, but even ensemble - including with multiple main characters - can have a single character the larger story revolves around. Game of Thrones is probably the best example, where there are clearly many main character but Jon Snow is the focal point of the entire story (in the books it's even more clearly spelled out that "his is the Song of Ice and Fire"). LOTR had an ensemble cast, but Frodo was the most central character. In some ways ATLA and Star Wars have ensemble casts with multiple main characters who have as much attention than Aang and Luke respectively, but there's still a central character in the midst.

And in TDP, I think it's without question that Callum is that person. The latest trailer made that extremely apparent. I have no problem with Rayla and her family getting plenty of attention too, and Rayla is an icon for sure. But it's not surprising if people are more focused on Callum given his longstanding importance and relevance to the story.

[kazisgirlfriend]

Morally upstanding Rayla acquiring a key from her boyfriend.

[distinguishedgladiatorbluebird]

It's some pretty wild shit to see people claim "Callum using dark magic is a slippery slope, just look at Claudia."

First, Claudia's been using dark magic for frivolous reasons for the entire runtime of the show (killing fairies to make fluffier pancakes hello). She kinda shot the moon here, less "slippery" and more nosedived right down that slope.

Second, this is just a tacit admission that what Callum did wasn't so bad, if you have to appeal to "he might do actual bad shit later than makes this retroactively bad." So, thanks I guess?

[kazisgirlfriend]

If Callum really is on a slippery slope here, do people really not see the parallels with Harrow? Like, Viren and Claudia were always into doing extreme stuff, there's nothing slippery about it. They only escalated in using dark magic because the situation became more and more dire. But s1 Viren/Claudia would absolutely have done all the horrible stuff their characters ended up doing, no slipping required.

Yet people are so obsessed with making Callum a carbon copy of Viren/Claudia that they forget who it was that was slipping down that slippery slope to begin with - Harrow. Just like Harrow, Callum was trying to do the right thing. Just like with Harrow, things didn't go off without a hitch. Maybe things will go badly for Callum too, maybe they won't. But the snake boi Callum thing has become so incoherent that I don't think its proponents know just what they're saying.

[kazisgirlfriend]

Remember, the crowd that's saying "using dark magic is fucked up no matter when or how you use it" somehow thinks they're being nuanced and are rejecting the binary of right and wrong.

lol

[imminent-danger-came]

Thinking about Callum being confronted by a Dark Version of himself that he then refuses (but who is still undeniably a part of him), and how then Viren confronts an Uncorrupted Version of himself who he then accepts as still part of him. And that happens through the mirror for Viren, but for Callum it happens through the cube. And in order to connect to the ocean Arcanum Callum had to accept that dark part of himself, the part that would do dark magic, that would do "anything for his family, however dangerous, however vile". He essentially un-made his s2 choice to deny Dark Callum.

[instantnightmareturtle]

"Sometimes to do the right thing [Callum] might have to reach somewhere dark inside of him."

-Devon Giehl (lead writer of The Dragon Prince)

Turns out this isn't a "however dangerous, however vile" situaton, it's a "doing the right thing" situation.

[imminent-danger-came]

Hey Hordi, how are ya.

So, I think plenty of folk find that saving your family, or having your actions driven by love, are considered the "right things". I know plenty of people delight in engaging with the "love is wholly good", and "love fixes everything" binary, however, tdp dismantles this binary over and over again. It spent all of seasons 4 and 5 dismantling this binary.

Love isn't good a pure, and it can lead to just as much bad as good.

So, Callum using dark magic to save Rayla? That's the "right thing" for him and his life, but plenty of others may have very different opinions. The "right thing" is subjective, it changes from person to person and situation to situation. But, thank you for quoting Devon! She also agrees that Callum became "a version of [him]self [he] doesn't like", because he did something morally questionable for the love of his life:

(Which, by the way, Aaron Ehaz, the co-creater of the show, agrees that his actions were morally ambiguous. God bless raayllum.)

It's basic subtext. Both Callum and Viren would (or believe they would) do "anything, however dangerous, however vile" for their loved ones, and the "vile" thing Callum does later in s5 is dark magic for Rayla. This is so blatant it's practically just the text.

When it comes to defining who is and who is not a person, and who you think is "good" to sacrifice in the name of the "right thing", that is a very slippery slope (hello magma titan that looked eerily similar to Elmar, a character who it was obviously bad that they had been treated like an object). We see the natural conclusion of the depersonalization with Claudia, where she goes from squeezing bugs to squeezing 12 year old boys to save her father/Aaravos. This is such a nuanced discussion that pretending this is even close to a "doing the right thing" situation OR "doing something vile" is such a disservice to tdp and it's narrative.

[chiefgardenerwonderland]

Let's break this down.

So, I think plenty of folk find that saving your family, or having your actions driven by love, are considered the "right things". I know plenty of people delight in engaging with the "love is wholly good", and "love fixes everything" binary, however, tdp dismantles this binary over and over again. It spent all of seasons 4 and 5 dismantling this binary.

Nothing says "dismantles the binary" like unequivocally calling what Callum did "the right thing."

And that's kinda the point, isn't it? It's not that Callum thinks he did the right thing, it's that the lead writer herself stated in no uncertain terms that he did the right thing.

So, Callum using dark magic to save Rayla? That's the "right thing" for him and his life, but plenty of others may have very different opinions.

Again, not what was said. Devon didn't claim that it was the right thing for Callum to do, but that it was the right thing, full stop. Maybe you'd find not trying to headcanon your way out of the story and instead accept it for what it is a lot more rewarding?

The "right thing" is subjective.

If that's so, then Callum's actions can't be morally dubious. Either there's a standard for morality that makes his actions dubious, or it's subjective and he's just doing the right thing from his perspective. These are mutually irreconcilable claims.

She also agrees that Callum became "a version of [him]self [he] doesn't like", because he did something morally questionable for the love of his life.

Maybe actually read what you're quoting instead of lifting all of your interpretations directly from raayllum?

At no point does Devon say that Callum did anything morally questionable. She said that he had to tap into his dark self in order to do what he did, which she ultimately characterized was the "right thing." He might not like it (who would), but she also goes a step further and says this is "part of growing up." EVERYONE has a dark side that they tap into, even for the right thing such as Callum. You and the other Rayla stans seem to insist on this is just a Callum/Viren thing (and sometimes Claudia when you remember she exists), yet what Devon did is universalize this:

Everyone has a dark side - including Callum but also Rayla, Ezran, Soren, Amaya, and so on - yet the difference between all of these characters and Viren/Claudia is that they are genuinely motivated to break the cycle and make their world better.

It's basic subtext. Both Callum and Viren would (or believe they would) do "anything, however dangerous, however vile" for their loved ones, and the "vile" thing Callum does later in s5 is dark magic for Rayla. This is so blatant it's practically just the text.

FFS it's been five seasons and you still can't figure out not to take Viren at his word? You seriously think that the biggest flaw for Mr. "If you have to choose, choose the egg" is that he cares too much about his family? When he turned on Harrow, was that out of love? Or when he ordered Soren to kill the princes? Or when invaded Xadia and toppled Lux Aurea? All of this was just out of love? Even in the scene itself, Kpp'ar calls Viren out on this, so even the barest level of media literacy would debunk this. The only reason this is even brought up is to illustrate how Claudia has been following in the footsteps that she thinks Viren laid out before her (in a visual so blatant I don't even think it counts as symbolism anymore).

On Callum's end, he has so frequently beat this rap, I've practically lost count. Callum repeatedly chooses to do what he genuinely believes is the right thing to do over his loved ones I've practically lost count:

-Chose not to go back for Harrow, but instead wants to take the egg to Xadia.

-Chooses to help Rayla escape Amaya rather than stay at the Banther Lodge.

-Chooses to continue to Xadia despite Claudia/Soren repeatedly suggesting he should go home.

-Chooses to continue to Xadia even when Ezran decided to go home.

-Chooses to remain on the Storm Spire and fight even though it would put all of his remaining loved ones at risk.

And on and on. It's not text. It's not subtext. It's just raayllum and hangers-on like yourself who can't seem to follow the pretty straightforward characterization for both Viren and Callum and to just pretzel your way into this weird dichotomy where they're both oppositional yet also basically the same and are driven by helping their loved ones despite this failing to explain 99% of their actions.

(Which, by the way, Aaron Ehaz, the co-creater of the show, agrees that his actions were morally ambiguous. God bless raayllum.)

Holy shit. He liked a tweet. That's not an endorsement 😂😂😂

He has talked repeatedly about this moment with Callum and he has never once characterized his actions as morally ambiguous himself. If he "endorsed" this view rather than just like that people are discussing the scene with their own takes, why not just say this outright?

When it comes to defining who is and who is not a person

You mean like snake tail? Because I'm pretty sure under most accepted viewpoints that was not a fucking person, it's a piece of dead organic matter.

Like, this is unbelievable. Both times Callum uses dark magic the circumstances are deliberately set up as to eliminate all reasonable objections - Callum doesn't kill anyone, and the circumstances are an emergency life-or-death situation that leaves no alternatives. It is not ambiguous, his actions are clearly justified. Yet somehow neither you nor raayllum/their sycophants seem to get it anyway.

that is a very slippery slope (hello magma titan that looked eerily similar to Elmar, a character who it was obviously bad that they had been treated like an object)

Fantastic racism aside (unless you think wood and magma are the same thin), Callum does the same exact thing in both situations he uses dark magic. Less of a slippery slope and more of a gravely plateau. If anything, the second time his motives were more justified and caused less harm,

We see the natural conclusion of the depersonalization with Claudia, where she goes from squeezing bugs to squeezing 12 year old boys to save her father/Aaravos.

By the third episode of the show, Claudia saw no problem with Harrow letting a complete stranger die in his place, aiding and abetting Viren keeping the dragon egg a secret from everyone including the king (a pretty egregious moment of treason), and had no problem sending a bunch of smoke wolves that would have absolutely mauled Ezran and Callum to death. If Claudia is squeezing Ezran now, it's because it's a natural conclusion of her actions towards him, not because she was somehow twisted by Dark Magic in some way.

This is such a nuanced discussion that pretending this is even close to a "doing the right thing" situation OR "doing something vile" is such a disservice to tdp and it's narrative.

Lol, when you're the one suggesting Callum and specifically Callum (not Rayla/Ezran) either has or will do vile things, having the gall to say "well who could really say what's vile or the right thing, it's a matter of perspective" is mildly impressive. Something that would probably have left a normal person speechless, but as this ain't my first rodeo I'll just roll right past this and bring this back full circle:

Devon did say that Callum did the right thing, without any of the qualifications that you are desperately throwing around to keep this "snake boi callum" thing on life support before s6 fully demolishes it. So, if you think that the lead writer is doing such a disservice to TDP and it's narrative, I'm honestly game to just let that hang there.

[kazisgirlfriend]

Welp, god damn what a takedown lol.

Honestly, it's a bit disappointing watching the snake boi callum thing end like a wet fart with a half-assed "but the right thing is subjective." It's obviously just a deflection tactic since OP thinks dark magic is objectively evil, but it's hard not to see the natural conclusion here - morality is relative and we're just choosing whatever standards casts Callum in the worst light possible.

It's a pretty pathetic admission, not something I expected, but at least this is out there now.

[kazisgirlfriend]

The fact that the head writer at WS legit gave us an explanation last year as to what Callum learned when he connected to the Ocean Arcanum, and to have people not only outright ignore it but bury it all because it doesn't neatly fit into the "Callum would do horrible things for Rayla" fanon is just...mind-blowing. It's fine to have headcanons, but FFS can people just stop pretending that they're in any way supported by canon at this point?

[kazisgirlfriend]

I’ll never fathom how the same group that have this endless well of empathy and compassion for Viren and Rayla will then zero in on Callum being this morally dubious sociopath because he smirked or glared once.

But like, actually...

Viren is granted all this compassion and deference to "he means so well" for doing the barest minimum of realizing how his shitty behavior is at the root cause of everything that went wrong from s1 on, including screwing up his daughter to the point that she may destroy both herself and the world. Standards are in the basement for this one.

Rayla has had a complicated relationship with doing the right thing (willing to lie, steal, break social convention for what she thinks is justifiable) that makes her genuinely interesting and fits perfectly with her status as the "Rogue" of the group. Yet all of this gets whitewashed in place of some vague sense that she hates herself and needs to learn how awesome and amazing she truly is, and extremely self-serving and self-congratulatory message focused entirely on a wish-fulfillment character (because that's why she stole from Callum, she didn't realize how amazing she was /s).

Callum, meanwhile, can never do anything right. His smirk in 3x09 (more reminiscent of Amaya's confidence than Viren's sadism) is twisted into some sort of ruthless bloodlust. Two words from a non-canon gamebook about Callum's "inner circle" now matters so much that there's now this complex "Callum's hierarchy of care" floating around based on nothing but "trust me bro." Inconvenient facts like Callum saying returning Zym is "the most important thing any of them will do" or the lead writer talking about Callum's efforts in doing the right thing get completely ignored.

"Bias" is one thing, and people are allowed to have their own favorites. But let's not pretend that Viren/Rayla are angels while Callum is some amoral sociopath who just happens to be on the good guys' side.

[kuno-chan]

I really don't understand why there is a war over morally dubious callum (of which apparently I cannot fucking escape). Like why is it a big deal if Callum is morally dubious?

Why is it a big deal if Callum is, indeed, gaga over Rayla and would doom the world over her? That's fun shit.

Why is it an issue if people think this???

Literally everyone else in the show makes morally dubious decisions. I don't understand this is the first fandom I've been in where this is an issue jadkajdkls

[virenhunter]

I mean, if you think Callum, Rayla, and Ezran are all morally dubious, that’s rad. But if people don’t see Callum (or any of them) as morally dubious, I don’t get why that’s a big deal either.

[kazisgirlfriend]

If people think that Soren, Rayla and Ezran are morally dubious, then ask where are all the "snake boi Ezran/Rayla/Soren" posts and you'll realize why this is became a big deal.

Even if all the characters make morally dubious decisions, Callum is the only one of the main four who ever gets savaged for his decisions, or have these long metas/rants all about why he's just "that way." Write something similar about Rayla or Ezran, and you'll see just how morally dubious fans really think they are when they aren't just trying to justify their stance on Callum.

[kazisgirlfriend]

I guess we're at this stage of the whole "morally dubious Callum" rigamarole - straight up lying:

Bear in mind that from 6x01 we know that Callum is absolutely fixated to an unhealthy extent on destroying the prison (and Aaravos) outright, with saving Rayla's parents being a footnote in his mind that he brings up to Rayla to convince her they need to go to the Starscraper to destroy Aaravos. It all comes back to Aaravos for Callum, not Rayla's parents.

By the way, I gotta admire the absolute gall that raayllum would go from insisting all of TDP Youtube is irredeemable for pointing out that Rayla wanted to kill Aaravos from the get-go and then go ahead and claim the exact same fucking thing when it's convenient and portrays Rayla as an idealized heroine.

[brynnsasha191]

Seeing people crap on arc two Rayla genuinely makes me sad. I don't think many people truly realize the depth of Rayla's isolation. What happened to all the characters in arc one was horrible (I am not down playing that), Callum and Ezran lost their father, and Soren lost his family, but they all had Katolis to go back to. Their home. Rayla lost EVERYTHING. She lost the assassins who she grew up with and trained her, she lost her home, and worst of all she lost her parents. She lost Runaan and Ethari in one go, only months after her parents. And all she had to remember them by was what they taught her. And they taught her self sacrifice, they taught her to do questionable things in the name of protection and the greater good. Viren threatened everything she loved which WAS Callum and Ezran, and she thought he was still alive. She was stuck in fight or flight mode, she was bathed in trauma. And she had a point in TTM, everyone was just moving on, and didn't take or let her have anytime to truly grieve. She was in such a dark place in TTM and it influenced her decisions. She knows she did something wrong, she knows she hurt Callum. She hasn't brought herself to apologize yet, but why did we stop treating her as human? (Or elf, as it were)

Also hi, I've recently been liberated from TDP reddit

[kazisgirlfriend]

I think it's important to remember two things:

First, most people who "hate" arc 2 Rayla are directing that hate at the writers, not at Rayla herself. This hate is entirely based on the idea that Rayla would never do the things she ends up doing in TTM, or arc 2, etc. So it's due to the compassion and love they have for Rayla (however misplaced) that they hate on the direction the show is taking her.

But second, she has done a lot of pretty bad things in arc 2 (abandoning Callum, abandoning the drake, abandoning Soren, lying to Callum, stealing from Callum, almost murdering a random boy in Chasing Shadows simply because he reminds her of Viren, and on and on). And her personal tragedies do not excuse that, just as personal tragedy doesn't excuse Claudia's actions. Honestly, I think I'd have been a bit more graceful with Rayla had half the fandom not become obsessed with Callum becoming this morally dubious "Snake Boi," so that pretty much dries up whatever good will I have towards this point.

[kradogsrats]

Hol' up, at no point does Devon ever say "Callum is realizing he's basically the 'however dangerous however vile' guy." In fact she never once mentions Rayla when describing 5x08.

You want some sixth grade reading homework? Have this ready to turn in on Monday, then:

Read over Devon Ghiel's tweets about Callum and the Ocean arcanum again, paying careful attention to the highlighted parts:

Now answer the following comprehension questions. Use at least three full sentences for each of your answers.

Devon Giehl's tweets mention Callum being able to "save people," but Callum won't do dark magic when Finnegrin tortures him and threatens to torture his friends. Why does Callum then do dark magic in 5x08? Is there a person he's trying to save?

Callum doesn't understand the ocean arcanum until 5x08, after he does dark magic. Does that mean he already recognized "the dark depths and dark potential within himself," or that he's realizing something new about himself?

Does Callum feel proud of what he does in 5x08? Does Devon Giehl think Callum feels proud of what he does? Quote specific parts of her tweets that support your answer.

What set of words would Callum be more likely to use to describe doing dark magic: "responsible and heroic" or "dangerous and vile"? If you aren't sure what a word means, use a dictionary online or at the library to look it up!

Do you think Callum would do dark magic again if he found himself in the same situation? Why or why not?

[kazisgirlfriend]

The thing that sent me reeling was the fact that this fandom went from:

"Callum will doom the world to save Rayla"

to

"Okay, maybe not doom the world, but he'll definitely do something fucked up for Rayla."

to

"Okay fine, maybe he won't do anything fucked up for Rayla, but he'll still feel bad about it anyway."

All in the span of less than a year. You guys are too much XD

[inamindfarfaraway]

I can’t wait to see Ezran’s reaction to Callum wanting to free Runaan, and then Runaan himself. We all know that he’s a kind, wise kid. He strives for peace, sees the best in people, prefers diplomacy over combat and applies respect and compassion to everyone he meets. He'd rather show mercy than take prisoners. He wants to avoid his father's mistakes of pursuing hatred and escalating conflict. His power is literally enhanced communication. Compared to the much more ruthless Prince Callum "Stab, stab, bye-bye, bad guy!" of Katolis, he seems pretty 'pure of heart'.

But he has anger inside him. He resents the pain and injustice he's experienced and holds grudges, like Harrow before him. He admits to his people that he is learning to forgive and move forward alongside them. And it isn’t easy.

"We are angry! I am angry. I have been hurt. ...We all want peace and we all want love, but violence tests us. In a twisted way, it converts us to its cause. Because pain and loss feel so terrible inside, you want to hate, you want to hurt someone else."

Callum would kill to save his loved ones, but not to avenge them. One of the first things he does in the show is condemn the self-perpetuating cycle of revenge as irrational, unhelpful and needlessly destructive. He forgives Rayla and Soren. He jumps on board with liberating Runaan, his father's killer, because it's what Rayla wants, even though she's actually willing to put it aside for now. When she steals Runaan's bow he used to commit the crime, he exhibits no hard feelings.

But when Ezran finds the arrow Runaan fired to inform the Dragon Queen of Harrow's death, he breaks it out of rage and spite.

So when he discovers that his dear brother is trying to free the man who murdered their father and stole his childhood, to allow him to experience life and be with his loved ones when Harrow can't? He's not gonna like it.

This arc seems wonderfully plausible in Season Six becaues this franchise adores its parallels and foil dynamics, and Claudia's most likely motivation in Season Six is "The heroes killed my dad and I'm going to make it everyone's problem!" It's telling that his speech about the cycle of pain, bitterness and vengeance I quoted is layered over Claudia fighting in the name of her own murdered father.

The beautiful symbolism of Ezran having his crown forged from the steel of Harrow’s sword... on one hand, he's destroyed a weapon because he never wants to use it. He's choosing a narrative of love over a narrative of violent strength. But on the other hand, he carries the weight of his murdered father's weapon, which did spill blood and take lives, with him all the time as a symbol of his identity, specifically his identity as a powerful authority figure and Harrow’s successor. You see how that’s a little troubling, right? In a show so concerned with generational trauma and history repeating? Ezran? Are you okay?

[kazisgirlfriend]

I'm pretty confused about this. Both Callum and Ezran intensely dislike Runaan (Callum even says he's trying to save Rayla's parents without mentioning him). But I'm pretty sure that both of them know that leaving him in a coin for eternity is pointlessly cruel, even if they want to see him face justice. So they're of one mind here.

Also, at least the people who saw 6x01 seem to think that Ezran is completely aware that Callum is trying to free Rayla's family and he's completely on board with this.

[baatarthefirst]

Callum/Viren parallels...Callum/Amaya parallels. There shouldn't be arguments on which we should take seriously and which are just coincidence. They can (and do) exist simultaneously for a purpose. It shows us that Callum can take after either of them. He is going to get to a point where he has to make a choice.

A) Follow in Viren's footsteps down that easy, but slippery, slope where the ends always justify the means, no matter how vile.

B) Follow Amaya's much more difficult path where he does what's necessary within the bounds of his morals.

[svperluminous]

Yes, oh my god, thank youuuuu!!!

Callum is the protagonist and as the protagonist, it makes sense that different aspects of his arc parallel or reflect other characters. It doesn't have to be a full season-by-season parallel, either. Callum has important thematic parallels with Finnegrin, for instance bur they don't reflect his full character journey, rather: Finnegrin's desire to control others vs Callum's desire to help those he loves (the love vs control theme), but also how both characters deal with knowing that they can't control everything (Finn gera angry and Callum accepts that), how they both react to the darkness within themselves (Finn embraces it/pulls his strength from it and Callum fears it). And that's one episode!

With characters like Viren, Claudia, Amaya and Aaravos, the parallels run "longer". And because uncertainty is an important part of his character arc, he will eventually pivot between different parallels. As you pointed out - will he choose Viren's outlook on morality (pragmatism > morals) or Amaya's (morals > short term gain)? Aaravos' desire to fulfill his vengeance or Ezran's desire to forgive? Will he endanger the world to save those he loves like Claudia? Or choose another path?

[self-spaghettification]

THIS THIS ALL OF THIS

the claudia thing especially. ppl talk about him paralleling viren in that sense but really, if the rayllum aaravos danger bit happens and he succumbs to aaravos, it will be more of a claudia parallels than viren parallel tbh. and people don’t talk about that enough.

because the key difference between viren and callum is that where callum will always choose his inner circle over anything else (as it says in ToX), whereas when viren is forced to choose between his inner circle and the power to change the world for the perceived better, he falters or almost always chooses the latter, (looking at his relationship with soren) but covers it up by claiming he chooses his inner circle.

meanwhile, claudia does actually choose her inner circle, but she takes it a step further than callum, making sure they stay together even if it means blinding herself to what they truly want (standing by while viren abuses soren, ignoring viren’s wishes in s4/s5 to ensure he survives) if callum chooses to listen to aaravos and seeks his help to save rayla or someone else in his inner circle, it really would parallel claudia more than viren. especially if it’s against their will. but he struggles a lot more with the shame of the matter (looking at 5x08 and his face during his hug with rayla.)

[kazisgirlfriend]

callum will always choose his inner circle over anything else (as it says in ToX),

I think it's a true testament to how thoroughly raayllum had poisoned the well, since basically all of the "Callum dooms the world for his friends" takes hinge on this one bit of trivia from a gamebook that the gamebook authors themselves said applies only to the pre-timeskip characters and to take it with a grain of salt:

"We have assigned all of these die ratings, values, and so forth to reflect where we believe the characters would be at the end of Season Three."

[baatarthefirst]

Callum/Viren parallels...Callum/Amaya parallels. There shouldn't be arguments on which we should take seriously and which are just coincidence. They can (and do) exist simultaneously for a purpose. It shows us that Callum can take after either of them. He is going to get to a point where he has to make a choice.

A) Follow in Viren's footsteps down that easy, but slippery, slope where the ends always justify the means, no matter how vile.

B) Follow Amaya's much more difficult path where he does what's necessary within the bounds of his morals.

[svperluminous]

Yes, oh my god, thank youuuuu!!!

Callum is the protagonist and as the protagonist, it makes sense that different aspects of his arc parallel or reflect other characters. It doesn't have to be a full season-by-season parallel, either. Callum has important thematic parallels with Finnegrin, for instance bur they don't reflect his full character journey, rather: Finnegrin's desire to control others vs Callum's desire to help those he loves (the love vs control theme), but also how both characters deal with knowing that they can't control everything (Finn gera angry and Callum accepts that), how they both react to the darkness within themselves (Finn embraces it/pulls his strength from it and Callum fears it). And that's one episode!

With characters like Viren, Claudia, Amaya and Aaravos, the parallels run "longer". And because uncertainty is an important part of his character arc, he will eventually pivot between different parallels. As you pointed out - will he choose Viren's outlook on morality (pragmatism > morals) or Amaya's (morals > short term gain)? Aaravos' desire to fulfill his vengeance or Ezran's desire to forgive? Will he endanger the world to save those he loves like Claudia? Or choose another path?

[self-spaghettification]

THIS THIS ALL OF THIS

the claudia thing especially. ppl talk about him paralleling viren in that sense but really, if the rayllum aaravos danger bit happens and he succumbs to aaravos, it will be more of a claudia parallels than viren parallel tbh. and people don’t talk about that enough.

because the key difference between viren and callum is that where callum will always choose his inner circle over anything else (as it says in ToX), whereas when viren is forced to choose between his inner circle and the power to change the world for the perceived better, he falters or almost always chooses the latter, (looking at his relationship with soren) but covers it up by claiming he chooses his inner circle.

meanwhile, claudia does actually choose her inner circle, but she takes it a step further than callum, making sure they stay together even if it means blinding herself to what they truly want (standing by while viren abuses soren, ignoring viren’s wishes in s4/s5 to ensure he survives) if callum chooses to listen to aaravos and seeks his help to save rayla or someone else in his inner circle, it really would parallel claudia more than viren. especially if it’s against their will. but he struggles a lot more with the shame of the matter (looking at 5x08 and his face during his hug with rayla.)

[kazisgirlfriend]

Broke: Callum might, under some stupid contrived circumstances, be willing to kill a dragon egg.

Woke: Rayla would, under pretty ordinary circumstances, have been willing to kill a ten year old child for pretty fucked up reasons but thank god the entire premise of her mission was eliminated at just the nick of time!

[kazisgirlfriend]

lol @ people saying "foils are not always oppositional" when that's literally The Definition of a foil. Speaking of media literacy...

[kazisgirlfriend]

I'm by no means a religious person, but I think that the "cast the first stone" mantra is pretty apt when it comes to accusing others of media illiteracy. This accusation gets thrown around a lot in the TDP fandom, particularly against people who may not have been super thrilled with s4 as a means of shutting them down.

If, for example, you're going to accuse others of failing to have a good understanding of what the text actually is, it's probably best to first ask yourself whether you have a good understanding of what the text actually is. If, for instance, you regularly suggest that Callum most cares about some ill-defined "inner circle" when he is repeatedly shown to be very cause and goal-oriented, if you try to shut down any suggestion that Callum is similar to his aunt when canon explicitly says as much, if you try to allege that he gives a wicked smirk at the thought of killing people when the show explicitly calls him "good-hearted," then maybe you're not the one to lecture about media literacy.

On a related note, if your very first recourse in any disagreement is to engage in ad hominem mud slinging and personal attacks, then maybe you're not one to lecture about good faith either.