A Grumpy Social Worker

Social Worker Blog ~  Meaningful social change requires organization, perseverance,and an attitude of learning. It's okay to be wrong. It is not okay to dig your heels in and continue on a path of willful ignorance.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

After close to ten years I finally know how to answer “what is social work?”

The art and science of helping people.

Boom.

Thanks textbook

[knowbetterdobetter2]

Social Workers and Abortion

A…. disgruntled commentor mentioned that I would be a terrible social worker if I thought I should sacrifice the life of a child (unborn) to save its mother. 

This shows me what I already knew; that people have no idea what social workers do or what their values are. It’s a pretty versatile profession, which I will admit makes it hard to explain. But let me do my best to help you understand why a Social Worker (a human helper) would support abortion. 

Social workers help disadvantaged people overcome barriers that keep them from reaching their potential.

Basically, this means when a social worker is helping an individual, community, or institution, they identify barriers (socioeconomic, health, mental health, etc.)  to their client’s success and help the client overcome them.

Again, this is pretty vague. To better understand it, you need to look at social work’s core values. These are applied in every single step of every single situation. You are meant to live, breathe, and eat with these values on your mind. 

IF THESE ARE NOT VALUES THAT YOU HOLD, THEN YOU SHOULD NOT BE A SOCIAL WORKER. FULL STOP. END OF STORY. IF YOU DON’T BELIEVE IN THEM, IT IS VERY LIKELY YOU WILL TAKE ACTION DURING THE COURSE OF YOUR CAREER THAT PUTS YOUR LICENSE AT JEAPORDY DUE TO POTENTIAL HARM TO YOUR CLIENT OR SOCIETY. Core Social Work Values:

Service

Social Justice

Dignity and Worth of a Person

Importance of Human Relationships

Integrity

Competence

These ethical principles are woven into everything a social worker does. How does that look in practice? Here are the definitions from the NASW Code of Ethics.

1. Service

There is no other discipline whose licensing board tells you that you must price your services fairly and consider the client’s ability to pay. That’s pretty darn special if you ask me. 

“Social workers elevate service to others above self-interest. Social workers draw on their knowledge, values, and skills to help people in need and to address social problems. Social workers are encouraged to volunteer some portion of their professional skills with no expectation of significant financial return (pro bono service).”

2. Social Justice

“Social workers pursue social change, particularly with and on behalf of vulnerable and oppressed individuals and groups of people. Social workers’ social change efforts are focused primarily on issues of poverty, unemployment, discrimination, and other forms of social injustice. These activities seek to promote sensitivity to and knowledge about oppression and cultural and ethnic diversity. Social workers strive to ensure access to needed information, services, and resources; equality of opportunity; and meaningful participation in decision making for all people.”

3. Dignity and Worth of a Person: 

“Social workers treat each person in a caring and respectful fashion, mindful of individual differences and cultural and ethnic diversity. Social workers promote clients’ socially responsible self-determination. Social workers seek to enhance clients’ capacity and opportunity to change and to address their own needs. Social workers are cognizant of their dual responsibility to clients and to the broader society. They seek to resolve conflicts between clients’ interests and the broader society’s interests in a socially responsible manner consistent with the values, ethical principles, and ethical standards of the profession.”

4. Importance of Human Relationships

“Social workers understand that relationships between and among people are an important vehicle for change. Social workers engage people as partners in the helping process. Social workers seek to strengthen relationships among people in a purposeful effort to promote, restore, maintain, and enhance the well-being of individuals, families, social groups, organizations, and communities.”

5. Integrity

“Social workers are continually aware of the profession’s mission, values, ethical principles, and ethical standards and practice in a manner consistent with them. Social workers should take measures to care for themselves professionally and personally. Social workers act honestly and responsibly and promote ethical practices on the part of the organizations with which they are affiliated.”

6. Competence

“Social workers continually strive to increase their professional knowledge and skills and to apply them in practice. Social workers should aspire to contribute to the knowledge base of the profession. “

From here, we branch off to the Ethical Standards section, which is looong. It covers responsibilities to:

Clients

Colleagues

In Practice Settings

As Professionals

The Social Work Profession

The Broader Society

So here’s the thing, social workers believe and don’t believe in things that many people, on BOTH sides of the political aisle, struggle to reconcile. Here are some examples:

Social Workers do not believe in the death penalty no matter what

Social Workers believe in Reproductive Freedom no matter what

Social Workers believe in Marriage Equality no matter what

Social Workers believe in Respecting and Protecting Undocumented People no matter what

Social Workers care about Prisoners  no matter what. Yep, even the really super bad ones

Explore NASW’s Website here When Social Workers say they fight against inequality, there are no caveats.  Social Workers are not naïve liberal idealists with their heads in the clouds. Their beliefs are evidence based. If significant data supports that something is bad for society (Increases poverty, widens inequality gap, worsens individual outcomes), it is disallowed by the code of ethics. These are not just knee-jerk opinions, they are carefully studied before being added into the code. 

So, how does the code of ethics support abortion? Because an individual’s right to choose what happens to their own body is fundamental to what social workers hold dear. Females cannot achieve economic equality if they cannot choose when and if they have a child. Banning abortion strips an individual of their right to bodily autonomy. Therefore, social workers (who are adhering to the code of ethics) not only “accept” abortion, but they see it as a non-negotiable, fundamental human right…

[knowbetterdobetter2]

Social Workers and Abortion

A.... disgruntled commentor mentioned that I would be a terrible social worker if I thought I should sacrifice the life of a child (unborn) to save its mother. 

This shows me what I already knew; that people have no idea what social workers do or what their values are. It’s a pretty versatile profession, which I will admit makes it hard to explain. But let me do my best to help you understand why a Social Worker (a human helper) would support abortion. 

Social workers help disadvantaged people overcome barriers that keep them from reaching their potential.

Basically, this means when a social worker is helping an individual, community, or institution, they identify barriers (socioeconomic, health, mental health, etc.)  to their client’s success and help the client overcome them.

Again, this is pretty vague. To better understand it, you need to look at social work’s core values. These are applied in every single step of every single situation. You are meant to live, breathe, and eat with these values on your mind. 

IF THESE ARE NOT VALUES THAT YOU HOLD, THEN YOU SHOULD NOT BE A SOCIAL WORKER. FULL STOP. END OF STORY. IF YOU DON’T BELIEVE IN THEM, IT IS VERY LIKELY YOU WILL TAKE ACTION DURING THE COURSE OF YOUR CAREER THAT PUTS YOUR LICENSE AT JEAPORDY DUE TO POTENTIAL HARM TO YOUR CLIENT OR SOCIETY. Core Social Work Values:

Service

Social Justice

Dignity and Worth of a Person

Importance of Human Relationships

Integrity

Competence

These ethical principles are woven into everything a social worker does. How does that look in practice? Here are the definitions from the NASW Code of Ethics.

1. Service

There is no other discipline whose licensing board tells you that you must price your services fairly and consider the client’s ability to pay. That’s pretty darn special if you ask me. 

“Social workers elevate service to others above self-interest. Social workers draw on their knowledge, values, and skills to help people in need and to address social problems. Social workers are encouraged to volunteer some portion of their professional skills with no expectation of significant financial return (pro bono service).”

2. Social Justice

“Social workers pursue social change, particularly with and on behalf of vulnerable and oppressed individuals and groups of people. Social workers’ social change efforts are focused primarily on issues of poverty, unemployment, discrimination, and other forms of social injustice. These activities seek to promote sensitivity to and knowledge about oppression and cultural and ethnic diversity. Social workers strive to ensure access to needed information, services, and resources; equality of opportunity; and meaningful participation in decision making for all people.”

3. Dignity and Worth of a Person: 

“Social workers treat each person in a caring and respectful fashion, mindful of individual differences and cultural and ethnic diversity. Social workers promote clients’ socially responsible self-determination. Social workers seek to enhance clients’ capacity and opportunity to change and to address their own needs. Social workers are cognizant of their dual responsibility to clients and to the broader society. They seek to resolve conflicts between clients’ interests and the broader society’s interests in a socially responsible manner consistent with the values, ethical principles, and ethical standards of the profession.”

4. Importance of Human Relationships

“Social workers understand that relationships between and among people are an important vehicle for change. Social workers engage people as partners in the helping process. Social workers seek to strengthen relationships among people in a purposeful effort to promote, restore, maintain, and enhance the well-being of individuals, families, social groups, organizations, and communities.”

5. Integrity

“Social workers are continually aware of the profession’s mission, values, ethical principles, and ethical standards and practice in a manner consistent with them. Social workers should take measures to care for themselves professionally and personally. Social workers act honestly and responsibly and promote ethical practices on the part of the organizations with which they are affiliated.”

6. Competence

“Social workers continually strive to increase their professional knowledge and skills and to apply them in practice. Social workers should aspire to contribute to the knowledge base of the profession. “

From here, we branch off to the Ethical Standards section, which is looong. It covers responsibilities to:

Clients

Colleagues

In Practice Settings

As Professionals

The Social Work Profession

The Broader Society

So here’s the thing, social workers believe and don’t believe in things that many people, on BOTH sides of the political aisle, struggle to reconcile. Here are some examples:

Social Workers do not believe in the death penalty no matter what

Social Workers believe in Reproductive Freedom no matter what

Social Workers believe in Marriage Equality no matter what

Social Workers believe in Respecting and Protecting Undocumented People no matter what

Social Workers care about Prisoners  no matter what. Yep, even the really super bad ones

Explore NASW’s Website here When Social Workers say they fight against inequality, there are no caveats.  Social Workers are not naïve liberal idealists with their heads in the clouds. Their beliefs are evidence based. If significant data supports that something is bad for society (Increases poverty, widens inequality gap, worsens individual outcomes), it is disallowed by the code of ethics. These are not just knee-jerk opinions, they are carefully studied before being added into the code. 

So, how does the code of ethics support abortion? Because an individual’s right to choose what happens to their own body is fundamental to what social workers hold dear. Females cannot achieve economic equality if they cannot choose when and if they have a child. Banning abortion strips an individual of their right to bodily autonomy. Therefore, social workers (who are adhering to the code of ethics) not only “accept” abortion, but they see it as a non-negotiable, fundamental human right...

[knowbetterdobetter2]

Has anyone else noticed that most male mentors for foster kids are like super jacked? 

[knowbetterdobetter2]

I am so excited lol. AHHHH ITS BEEN SO LONG GETTING TO THIS PLACE

[knowbetterdobetter2]

Sometimes I think about how women have to get transvaginal ultrasounds to get abortions in some places. You know, so they can make an informed decision about getting an abortion.

Why can’t we do the same for forced birthers or people who do IVF? Before you can vote to take reproductive rights away, you have to take care of a foster kid for a month, or go hold a baby with fetal alcohol syndrome.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Thé pRoLiFe woman who went up there and said there were “plenty of facilities for unwanted children!” really got me. 10/10 for the person who told her 53,000 kids were in foster care right now. She didn’t know how to respond, lmao.

You care about kids? Great! GO ON BRUH. Take jr home with you. No, no… not that fresh baked Jr; it’ll be easy to find them a placement. I’m talking about the neurodivergent 12 year old who has frustration induced screaming fits; that knows every curse word in the English language and loves to use them liberally.

O-Oh. You don’t want him? Why not… I thought you cared about kids?

Oh… I get it. You only care about “normal” kids.

Alright, well… I guess I’ll keep him in my office until we find a place for that’s willing to take him in… sure hope we have enough gogurt in the fridge… not sure our budget will let us get another box so soon. It’s alright. I have a few extra bucks in my purse. I’ll grab him a Happy Meal and make sure he eats well even though I make $14 an hour. He’s had a crappy day.

[crystallineknight]

....Your advice is to kill the neurodivergent 12 year old who has frustration-induced screaming fits.

Your solution is to make sure the 12 year old never lives anywhere. Never sleeps anywhere, never eats anything, never has a conversation, never speaks their first word, never grows old or makes a friend or falls in love or ever does anything other than die.

While pretending to care about him.

If you had your way, if the value of life should only be respected when it is wanted, then all 53,000 of those children would be dead.

You are using sympathy for people you want to murder....to argue why it is good to murder them.

[locked-keye]

“I’m going to commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe, and educate my potential victims”.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Hi! How many LIVING children have you helped? How many unwanted living children have you adopted? Fostered? I trust you’re making a real conscious effort to care for all the kiddos we already have before you bring new ones on board, so I look forward to hearing your plan!

[locked-keye]

I appreciate the admission of guilt.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Bro you can just say you’ve done nothing, lol. It’s okay, we already knew.

[foreversaes-deactivated20230903]

“I’m going to commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe, and educate my potential victims”

yeah!! it’s not technically even murder- they aren’t alive but that!s a conversation for another day-

I’m gonna commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe and educate the CHILDREN THAT I’D BE RAISING

yeah. “murder” the fetus if you can’t ensure that it’ll be alive, happy and healthy. THAT INCLUDES HOUSING, FOOD, CLOTHING AND EDUCATION.

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

And here you once again blissfully ignore the actions that HAVE been taken....

[knowbetterdobetter2]

You don’t get it. The things that aren’t being done aren’t enough, not even close. 400k + kids are in foster care, and you want to add 600k+ on top of that? Your good intentions are misguided and incredibly dangerous. Tell me, if a living toddler was about to get shot right in front of you, and a pregnant woman was about to get kicked in the stomach, which would you save? What is your gut reaction?

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

There's a difference there - one is more likely to cause harm than the other. Both are obviously still dangerous, but different. I would save both, obviously.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

You missed the point of the exercise; you don’t get to save both. Only one.

And Are you saying a toddler is more likely to cause harm than a fetus?

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

Sorry, I meant 'one action' rather than one person or another.

Situations are never that simple.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

My bro,

Both the fetus and toddler are going to die if they get struck, pick.

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

Situations are never like that.

And how many times do we have to remind you all that it's a baby - that fetus is a medical term used for stages of development?

[knowbetterdobetter2]

There is no situation in which both will die and you’ll have to make a choice??? Do you live in Disney Land? LOL. One very pertinent example of this is letting a mother die because you don’t want to perform an abortion - you choose.

A fetus is not a baby. They are distinctly different. According to… the dictionary

You SAY baby to manipulate emotions. A fetus and a baby are not the same. No matter how upset that makes you. A whole ass baby, crying in your arms, is not the same as this:

This is a FETUS at 6 weeks, when the vast majority of abortions are performed. Stop manipulating people by saying baby. THAT is what gets aborted. You have some weird vision in your head of a whole ass developed baby in a human lmao. You are wrong.

A fetus can NOT bond. A fetus has NOT experienced life. So if you genuinely think for a second that ^ is more important than the life of the person who made it, or the life of living, breathing children, something is deeply wrong with your ability to feel empathy.

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

Abortions are different to cleaning up after miscarriages. It is vanishingly rare that a woman is genuinely going to die if she continues to carry the baby, if it still lives.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

Vanishingly rare. Lol. As I thought. Something is deeply wrong with you. Amazing how you carefully select when you want to rely on data and reason. I’m sure the families of the 700 women who die yearly in the US from pregnancy would love to hear that.

So you skirted over the fact that a fetus is not a baby.

Cited “rareness” as a reason to deny women their right to choose

And conveniently avoided the wrongness of your statement that “situations like that don’t exist.”

I’m sure you also don’t care that %5 of rape victims get pregnant, and I’m sure you also don’t think it matters that the vast majority of sexual assaults are not officially reported.

I’m sure you don’t care about the 400k+ kids in foster care in the US, and that 50% of homeless people were in foster care

I’m sure you don’t care that the vast majority of perpetrators of Child abuse were abused themselves (read that carefully) meaning they likely went through the DCS system

And I’m sure you don’t care that 42% of teens in foster care live in group homes.

I’m sure you don’t care about substance abuse, or trauma, or any of the other things that being a foster kid increases the likelihood of. After all, they are fetuses, so why would you care about them?

You’re gross. :)

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

You are making assumptions about me and mine that are incorrect.

I spoke poorly; I meant it is vanishingly rare that a woman will be 100% certain of dying. My error that I did not clarify, sorry.

I simply did not have the time to go through every tiny nuance right then. And now - it is late, I will return tomorrow if you care to debate.

@alunafort please.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

And there is no debate here, motherfucker. You forfeit your right to civil debate when you come at me and call me a murderer without having a base understanding of how humans bond and develop aside from the physical.

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

point me to where I expressly called you a murderer please

[knowbetterdobetter2]

?!?!? Do you think we can’t see the tags lmao? And so help me if “that’s not what you meant” are the next words you type. If you struggle to get your point across then step the fuck back and regather before you hop in.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Thé pRoLiFe woman who went up there and said there were “plenty of facilities for unwanted children!” really got me. 10/10 for the person who told her 53,000 kids were in foster care right now. She didn’t know how to respond, lmao.

You care about kids? Great! GO ON BRUH. Take jr home with you. No, no… not that fresh baked Jr; it’ll be easy to find them a placement. I’m talking about the neurodivergent 12 year old who has frustration induced screaming fits; that knows every curse word in the English language and loves to use them liberally.

O-Oh. You don’t want him? Why not… I thought you cared about kids?

Oh… I get it. You only care about “normal” kids.

Alright, well… I guess I’ll keep him in my office until we find a place for that’s willing to take him in… sure hope we have enough gogurt in the fridge… not sure our budget will let us get another box so soon. It’s alright. I have a few extra bucks in my purse. I’ll grab him a Happy Meal and make sure he eats well even though I make $14 an hour. He’s had a crappy day.

[crystallineknight]

....Your advice is to kill the neurodivergent 12 year old who has frustration-induced screaming fits.

Your solution is to make sure the 12 year old never lives anywhere. Never sleeps anywhere, never eats anything, never has a conversation, never speaks their first word, never grows old or makes a friend or falls in love or ever does anything other than die.

While pretending to care about him.

If you had your way, if the value of life should only be respected when it is wanted, then all 53,000 of those children would be dead.

You are using sympathy for people you want to murder....to argue why it is good to murder them.

[locked-keye]

“I’m going to commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe, and educate my potential victims”.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Hi! How many LIVING children have you helped? How many unwanted living children have you adopted? Fostered? I trust you’re making a real conscious effort to care for all the kiddos we already have before you bring new ones on board, so I look forward to hearing your plan!

[locked-keye]

I appreciate the admission of guilt.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Bro you can just say you’ve done nothing, lol. It’s okay, we already knew.

[foreversaes-deactivated20230903]

“I’m going to commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe, and educate my potential victims”

yeah!! it’s not technically even murder- they aren’t alive but that!s a conversation for another day-

I’m gonna commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe and educate the CHILDREN THAT I’D BE RAISING

yeah. “murder” the fetus if you can’t ensure that it’ll be alive, happy and healthy. THAT INCLUDES HOUSING, FOOD, CLOTHING AND EDUCATION.

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

And here you once again blissfully ignore the actions that HAVE been taken....

[knowbetterdobetter2]

You don’t get it. The things that aren’t being done aren’t enough, not even close. 400k + kids are in foster care, and you want to add 600k+ on top of that? Your good intentions are misguided and incredibly dangerous. Tell me, if a living toddler was about to get shot right in front of you, and a pregnant woman was about to get kicked in the stomach, which would you save? What is your gut reaction?

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

There's a difference there - one is more likely to cause harm than the other. Both are obviously still dangerous, but different. I would save both, obviously.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

You missed the point of the exercise; you don’t get to save both. Only one.

And Are you saying a toddler is more likely to cause harm than a fetus?

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

Sorry, I meant 'one action' rather than one person or another.

Situations are never that simple.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

My bro,

Both the fetus and toddler are going to die if they get struck, pick.

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

Situations are never like that.

And how many times do we have to remind you all that it's a baby - that fetus is a medical term used for stages of development?

[knowbetterdobetter2]

There is no situation in which both will die and you’ll have to make a choice??? Do you live in Disney Land? LOL. One very pertinent example of this is letting a mother die because you don’t want to perform an abortion - you choose.

A fetus is not a baby. They are distinctly different. According to… the dictionary

You SAY baby to manipulate emotions. A fetus and a baby are not the same. No matter how upset that makes you. A whole ass baby, crying in your arms, is not the same as this:

This is a FETUS at 6 weeks, when the vast majority of abortions are performed. Stop manipulating people by saying baby. THAT is what gets aborted. You have some weird vision in your head of a whole ass developed baby in a human lmao. You are wrong.

A fetus can NOT bond. A fetus has NOT experienced life. So if you genuinely think for a second that ^ is more important than the life of the person who made it, or the life of living, breathing children, something is deeply wrong with your ability to feel empathy.

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

Abortions are different to cleaning up after miscarriages. It is vanishingly rare that a woman is genuinely going to die if she continues to carry the baby, if it still lives.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

Vanishingly rare. Lol. As I thought. Something is deeply wrong with you. Amazing how you carefully select when you want to rely on data and reason. I’m sure the families of the 700 women who die yearly in the US from pregnancy would love to hear that.

So you skirted over the fact that a fetus is not a baby.

Cited “rareness” as a reason to deny women their right to choose

And conveniently avoided the wrongness of your statement that “situations like that don’t exist.”

I’m sure you also don’t care that %5 of rape victims get pregnant, and I’m sure you also don’t think it matters that the vast majority of sexual assaults are not officially reported.

I’m sure you don’t care about the 400k+ kids in foster care in the US, and that 50% of homeless people were in foster care

I’m sure you don’t care that the vast majority of perpetrators of Child abuse were abused themselves (read that carefully) meaning they likely went through the DCS system

And I’m sure you don’t care that 42% of teens in foster care live in group homes.

I’m sure you don’t care about substance abuse, or trauma, or any of the other things that being a foster kid increases the likelihood of. After all, they are fetuses, so why would you care about them?

You’re gross. :)

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

You are making assumptions about me and mine that are incorrect.

I spoke poorly; I meant it is vanishingly rare that a woman will be 100% certain of dying. My error that I did not clarify, sorry.

I simply did not have the time to go through every tiny nuance right then. And now - it is late, I will return tomorrow if you care to debate.

@alunafort please.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

And there is no debate here, motherfucker. You forfeit your right to civil debate when you come at me and call me a murderer without having a base understanding of how humans bond and develop aside from the physical.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Thé pRoLiFe woman who went up there and said there were “plenty of facilities for unwanted children!” really got me. 10/10 for the person who told her 53,000 kids were in foster care right now. She didn’t know how to respond, lmao.

You care about kids? Great! GO ON BRUH. Take jr home with you. No, no… not that fresh baked Jr; it’ll be easy to find them a placement. I’m talking about the neurodivergent 12 year old who has frustration induced screaming fits; that knows every curse word in the English language and loves to use them liberally.

O-Oh. You don’t want him? Why not… I thought you cared about kids?

Oh… I get it. You only care about “normal” kids.

Alright, well… I guess I’ll keep him in my office until we find a place for that’s willing to take him in… sure hope we have enough gogurt in the fridge… not sure our budget will let us get another box so soon. It’s alright. I have a few extra bucks in my purse. I’ll grab him a Happy Meal and make sure he eats well even though I make $14 an hour. He’s had a crappy day.

[crystallineknight]

....Your advice is to kill the neurodivergent 12 year old who has frustration-induced screaming fits.

Your solution is to make sure the 12 year old never lives anywhere. Never sleeps anywhere, never eats anything, never has a conversation, never speaks their first word, never grows old or makes a friend or falls in love or ever does anything other than die.

While pretending to care about him.

If you had your way, if the value of life should only be respected when it is wanted, then all 53,000 of those children would be dead.

You are using sympathy for people you want to murder....to argue why it is good to murder them.

[locked-keye]

“I’m going to commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe, and educate my potential victims”.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Hi! How many LIVING children have you helped? How many unwanted living children have you adopted? Fostered? I trust you’re making a real conscious effort to care for all the kiddos we already have before you bring new ones on board, so I look forward to hearing your plan!

[locked-keye]

I appreciate the admission of guilt.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Bro you can just say you’ve done nothing, lol. It’s okay, we already knew.

[foreversaes-deactivated20230903]

“I’m going to commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe, and educate my potential victims”

yeah!! it’s not technically even murder- they aren’t alive but that!s a conversation for another day-

I’m gonna commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe and educate the CHILDREN THAT I’D BE RAISING

yeah. “murder” the fetus if you can’t ensure that it’ll be alive, happy and healthy. THAT INCLUDES HOUSING, FOOD, CLOTHING AND EDUCATION.

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

And here you once again blissfully ignore the actions that HAVE been taken....

[knowbetterdobetter2]

You don’t get it. The things that aren’t being done aren’t enough, not even close. 400k + kids are in foster care, and you want to add 600k+ on top of that? Your good intentions are misguided and incredibly dangerous. Tell me, if a living toddler was about to get shot right in front of you, and a pregnant woman was about to get kicked in the stomach, which would you save? What is your gut reaction?

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

There's a difference there - one is more likely to cause harm than the other. Both are obviously still dangerous, but different. I would save both, obviously.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

You missed the point of the exercise; you don’t get to save both. Only one.

And Are you saying a toddler is more likely to cause harm than a fetus?

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

Sorry, I meant 'one action' rather than one person or another.

Situations are never that simple.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

My bro,

Both the fetus and toddler are going to die if they get struck, pick.

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

Situations are never like that.

And how many times do we have to remind you all that it's a baby - that fetus is a medical term used for stages of development?

[knowbetterdobetter2]

There is no situation in which both will die and you’ll have to make a choice??? Do you live in Disney Land? LOL. One very pertinent example of this is letting a mother die because you don’t want to perform an abortion - you choose.

A fetus is not a baby. They are distinctly different. According to… the dictionary

You SAY baby to manipulate emotions. A fetus and a baby are not the same. No matter how upset that makes you. A whole ass baby, crying in your arms, is not the same as this:

This is a FETUS at 6 weeks, when the vast majority of abortions are performed. Stop manipulating people by saying baby. THAT is what gets aborted. You have some weird vision in your head of a whole ass developed baby in a human lmao. You are wrong.

A fetus can NOT bond. A fetus has NOT experienced life. So if you genuinely think for a second that ^ is more important than the life of the person who made it, or the life of living, breathing children, something is deeply wrong with your ability to feel empathy.

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

Abortions are different to cleaning up after miscarriages. It is vanishingly rare that a woman is genuinely going to die if she continues to carry the baby, if it still lives.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

Vanishingly rare. Lol. As I thought. Something is deeply wrong with you. Amazing how you carefully select when you want to rely on data and reason. I’m sure the families of the 700 women who die yearly in the US from pregnancy would love to hear that.

So you skirted over the fact that a fetus is not a baby.

Cited “rareness” as a reason to deny women their right to choose

And conveniently avoided the wrongness of your statement that “situations like that don’t exist.”

I’m sure you also don’t care that %5 of rape victims get pregnant, and I’m sure you also don’t think it matters that the vast majority of sexual assaults are not officially reported.

I’m sure you don’t care about the 400k+ kids in foster care in the US, and that 50% of homeless people were in foster care

I’m sure you don’t care that the vast majority of perpetrators of Child abuse were abused themselves (read that carefully) meaning they likely went through the DCS system

And I’m sure you don’t care that 42% of teens in foster care live in group homes.

I’m sure you don’t care about substance abuse, or trauma, or any of the other things that being a foster kid increases the likelihood of. After all, they are fetuses, so why would you care about them?

You’re gross. :)

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

You are making assumptions about me and mine that are incorrect.

I spoke poorly; I meant it is vanishingly rare that a woman will be 100% certain of dying. My error that I did not clarify, sorry.

I simply did not have the time to go through every tiny nuance right then. And now - it is late, I will return tomorrow if you care to debate.

@alunafort please.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

LOL. Don’t call for backup. If you can’t argue your own point, don’t bother engaging.

If you are incapable of making that decision, again, that is a problem. A fully formed woman has bonded, has ties and people who love her, loves people, has thoughts and emotions. A fetus has none. I am taking about a less than 8 week “old” fetus. Not a baby. If you have to think about that choice THAT is a massive problem.

It is the mothers’ choice, and it always will be.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Thé pRoLiFe woman who went up there and said there were “plenty of facilities for unwanted children!” really got me. 10/10 for the person who told her 53,000 kids were in foster care right now. She didn’t know how to respond, lmao.

You care about kids? Great! GO ON BRUH. Take jr home with you. No, no… not that fresh baked Jr; it’ll be easy to find them a placement. I’m talking about the neurodivergent 12 year old who has frustration induced screaming fits; that knows every curse word in the English language and loves to use them liberally.

O-Oh. You don’t want him? Why not… I thought you cared about kids?

Oh… I get it. You only care about “normal” kids.

Alright, well… I guess I’ll keep him in my office until we find a place for that’s willing to take him in… sure hope we have enough gogurt in the fridge… not sure our budget will let us get another box so soon. It’s alright. I have a few extra bucks in my purse. I’ll grab him a Happy Meal and make sure he eats well even though I make $14 an hour. He’s had a crappy day.

[crystallineknight]

....Your advice is to kill the neurodivergent 12 year old who has frustration-induced screaming fits.

Your solution is to make sure the 12 year old never lives anywhere. Never sleeps anywhere, never eats anything, never has a conversation, never speaks their first word, never grows old or makes a friend or falls in love or ever does anything other than die.

While pretending to care about him.

If you had your way, if the value of life should only be respected when it is wanted, then all 53,000 of those children would be dead.

You are using sympathy for people you want to murder....to argue why it is good to murder them.

[locked-keye]

“I’m going to commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe, and educate my potential victims”.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Hi! How many LIVING children have you helped? How many unwanted living children have you adopted? Fostered? I trust you’re making a real conscious effort to care for all the kiddos we already have before you bring new ones on board, so I look forward to hearing your plan!

[locked-keye]

I appreciate the admission of guilt.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Bro you can just say you’ve done nothing, lol. It’s okay, we already knew.

[foreversaes-deactivated20230903]

“I’m going to commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe, and educate my potential victims”

yeah!! it’s not technically even murder- they aren’t alive but that!s a conversation for another day-

I’m gonna commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe and educate the CHILDREN THAT I’D BE RAISING

yeah. “murder” the fetus if you can’t ensure that it’ll be alive, happy and healthy. THAT INCLUDES HOUSING, FOOD, CLOTHING AND EDUCATION.

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

And here you once again blissfully ignore the actions that HAVE been taken....

[knowbetterdobetter2]

You don’t get it. The things that aren’t being done aren’t enough, not even close. 400k + kids are in foster care, and you want to add 600k+ on top of that? Your good intentions are misguided and incredibly dangerous. Tell me, if a living toddler was about to get shot right in front of you, and a pregnant woman was about to get kicked in the stomach, which would you save? What is your gut reaction?

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

There's a difference there - one is more likely to cause harm than the other. Both are obviously still dangerous, but different. I would save both, obviously.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

You missed the point of the exercise; you don’t get to save both. Only one.

And Are you saying a toddler is more likely to cause harm than a fetus?

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

Sorry, I meant 'one action' rather than one person or another.

Situations are never that simple.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

My bro,

Both the fetus and toddler are going to die if they get struck, pick.

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

Situations are never like that.

And how many times do we have to remind you all that it's a baby - that fetus is a medical term used for stages of development?

[knowbetterdobetter2]

There is no situation in which both will die and you’ll have to make a choice??? Do you live in Disney Land? LOL. One very pertinent example of this is letting a mother die because you don’t want to perform an abortion - you choose.

A fetus is not a baby. They are distinctly different. According to… the dictionary

You SAY baby to manipulate emotions. A fetus and a baby are not the same. No matter how upset that makes you. A whole ass baby, crying in your arms, is not the same as this:

This is a FETUS at 6 weeks, when the vast majority of abortions are performed. Stop manipulating people by saying baby. THAT is what gets aborted. You have some weird vision in your head of a whole ass developed baby in a human lmao. You are wrong.

A fetus can NOT bond. A fetus has NOT experienced life. So if you genuinely think for a second that ^ is more important than the life of the person who made it, or the life of living, breathing children, something is deeply wrong with your ability to feel empathy.

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

Abortions are different to cleaning up after miscarriages. It is vanishingly rare that a woman is genuinely going to die if she continues to carry the baby, if it still lives.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

Vanishingly rare. Lol. As I thought. Something is deeply wrong with you. Amazing how you carefully select when you want to rely on data and reason. I’m sure the families of the 700 women who die yearly in the US from pregnancy would love to hear that.

So you skirted over the fact that a fetus is not a baby.

Cited “rareness” as a reason to deny women their right to choose

And conveniently avoided the wrongness of your statement that “situations like that don’t exist.”

I’m sure you also don’t care that %5 of rape victims get pregnant, and I’m sure you also don’t think it matters that the vast majority of sexual assaults are not officially reported.

I’m sure you don’t care about the 400k+ kids in foster care in the US, and that 50% of homeless people were in foster care

I’m sure you don’t care that the vast majority of perpetrators of Child abuse were abused themselves (read that carefully) meaning they likely went through the DCS system

And I’m sure you don’t care that 42% of teens in foster care live in group homes.

I’m sure you don’t care about substance abuse, or trauma, or any of the other things that being a foster kid increases the likelihood of. After all, they are fetuses, so why would you care about them?

You’re gross. :)

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Thé pRoLiFe woman who went up there and said there were “plenty of facilities for unwanted children!” really got me. 10/10 for the person who told her 53,000 kids were in foster care right now. She didn’t know how to respond, lmao.

You care about kids? Great! GO ON BRUH. Take jr home with you. No, no… not that fresh baked Jr; it’ll be easy to find them a placement. I’m talking about the neurodivergent 12 year old who has frustration induced screaming fits; that knows every curse word in the English language and loves to use them liberally.

O-Oh. You don’t want him? Why not… I thought you cared about kids?

Oh… I get it. You only care about “normal” kids.

Alright, well… I guess I’ll keep him in my office until we find a place for that’s willing to take him in… sure hope we have enough gogurt in the fridge… not sure our budget will let us get another box so soon. It’s alright. I have a few extra bucks in my purse. I’ll grab him a Happy Meal and make sure he eats well even though I make $14 an hour. He’s had a crappy day.

[crystallineknight]

....Your advice is to kill the neurodivergent 12 year old who has frustration-induced screaming fits.

Your solution is to make sure the 12 year old never lives anywhere. Never sleeps anywhere, never eats anything, never has a conversation, never speaks their first word, never grows old or makes a friend or falls in love or ever does anything other than die.

While pretending to care about him.

If you had your way, if the value of life should only be respected when it is wanted, then all 53,000 of those children would be dead.

You are using sympathy for people you want to murder....to argue why it is good to murder them.

[locked-keye]

“I’m going to commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe, and educate my potential victims”.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Hi! How many LIVING children have you helped? How many unwanted living children have you adopted? Fostered? I trust you’re making a real conscious effort to care for all the kiddos we already have before you bring new ones on board, so I look forward to hearing your plan!

[locked-keye]

I appreciate the admission of guilt.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Bro you can just say you’ve done nothing, lol. It’s okay, we already knew.

[foreversaes-deactivated20230903]

“I’m going to commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe, and educate my potential victims”

yeah!! it’s not technically even murder- they aren’t alive but that!s a conversation for another day-

I’m gonna commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe and educate the CHILDREN THAT I’D BE RAISING

yeah. “murder” the fetus if you can’t ensure that it’ll be alive, happy and healthy. THAT INCLUDES HOUSING, FOOD, CLOTHING AND EDUCATION.

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

And here you once again blissfully ignore the actions that HAVE been taken....

[knowbetterdobetter2]

You don’t get it. The things that aren’t being done aren’t enough, not even close. 400k + kids are in foster care, and you want to add 600k+ on top of that? Your good intentions are misguided and incredibly dangerous. Tell me, if a living toddler was about to get shot right in front of you, and a pregnant woman was about to get kicked in the stomach, which would you save? What is your gut reaction?

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

There's a difference there - one is more likely to cause harm than the other. Both are obviously still dangerous, but different. I would save both, obviously.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

You missed the point of the exercise; you don’t get to save both. Only one.

And Are you saying a toddler is more likely to cause harm than a fetus?

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

Sorry, I meant 'one action' rather than one person or another.

Situations are never that simple.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

My bro,

Both the fetus and toddler are going to die if they get struck, pick.

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

Situations are never like that.

And how many times do we have to remind you all that it's a baby - that fetus is a medical term used for stages of development?

[knowbetterdobetter2]

There is no situation in which both will die and you’ll have to make a choice??? Do you live in Disney Land? LOL. One very pertinent example of this is letting a mother die because you don’t want to perform an abortion - you choose.

A fetus is not a baby. They are distinctly different. According to… the dictionary

You SAY baby to manipulate emotions. A fetus and a baby are not the same. No matter how upset that makes you. A whole ass baby, crying in your arms, is not the same as this:

This is a FETUS at 6 weeks, when the vast majority of abortions are performed. Stop manipulating people by saying baby. THAT is what gets aborted. You have some weird vision in your head of a whole ass developed baby in a human lmao. You are wrong.

A fetus can NOT bond. A fetus has NOT experienced life. So if you genuinely think for a second that ^ is more important than the life of the person who made it, or the life of living, breathing children, something is deeply wrong with your ability to feel empathy.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Thé pRoLiFe woman who went up there and said there were “plenty of facilities for unwanted children!” really got me. 10/10 for the person who told her 53,000 kids were in foster care right now. She didn’t know how to respond, lmao.

You care about kids? Great! GO ON BRUH. Take jr home with you. No, no… not that fresh baked Jr; it’ll be easy to find them a placement. I’m talking about the neurodivergent 12 year old who has frustration induced screaming fits; that knows every curse word in the English language and loves to use them liberally.

O-Oh. You don’t want him? Why not… I thought you cared about kids?

Oh… I get it. You only care about “normal” kids.

Alright, well… I guess I’ll keep him in my office until we find a place for that’s willing to take him in… sure hope we have enough gogurt in the fridge… not sure our budget will let us get another box so soon. It’s alright. I have a few extra bucks in my purse. I’ll grab him a Happy Meal and make sure he eats well even though I make $14 an hour. He’s had a crappy day.

[crystallineknight]

....Your advice is to kill the neurodivergent 12 year old who has frustration-induced screaming fits.

Your solution is to make sure the 12 year old never lives anywhere. Never sleeps anywhere, never eats anything, never has a conversation, never speaks their first word, never grows old or makes a friend or falls in love or ever does anything other than die.

While pretending to care about him.

If you had your way, if the value of life should only be respected when it is wanted, then all 53,000 of those children would be dead.

You are using sympathy for people you want to murder....to argue why it is good to murder them.

[locked-keye]

“I’m going to commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe, and educate my potential victims”.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Hi! How many LIVING children have you helped? How many unwanted living children have you adopted? Fostered? I trust you’re making a real conscious effort to care for all the kiddos we already have before you bring new ones on board, so I look forward to hearing your plan!

[locked-keye]

I appreciate the admission of guilt.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Bro you can just say you’ve done nothing, lol. It’s okay, we already knew.

[foreversaes-deactivated20230903]

“I’m going to commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe, and educate my potential victims”

yeah!! it’s not technically even murder- they aren’t alive but that!s a conversation for another day-

I’m gonna commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe and educate the CHILDREN THAT I’D BE RAISING

yeah. “murder” the fetus if you can’t ensure that it’ll be alive, happy and healthy. THAT INCLUDES HOUSING, FOOD, CLOTHING AND EDUCATION.

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

And here you once again blissfully ignore the actions that HAVE been taken....

[knowbetterdobetter2]

You don’t get it. The things that aren’t being done aren’t enough, not even close. 400k + kids are in foster care, and you want to add 600k+ on top of that? Your good intentions are misguided and incredibly dangerous. Tell me, if a living toddler was about to get shot right in front of you, and a pregnant woman was about to get kicked in the stomach, which would you save? What is your gut reaction?

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

There's a difference there - one is more likely to cause harm than the other. Both are obviously still dangerous, but different. I would save both, obviously.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

You missed the point of the exercise; you don’t get to save both. Only one.

And Are you saying a toddler is more likely to cause harm than a fetus?

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

Sorry, I meant 'one action' rather than one person or another.

Situations are never that simple.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

My bro,

Both the fetus and toddler are going to die if they get struck, pick.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Thé pRoLiFe woman who went up there and said there were “plenty of facilities for unwanted children!” really got me. 10/10 for the person who told her 53,000 kids were in foster care right now. She didn’t know how to respond, lmao.

You care about kids? Great! GO ON BRUH. Take jr home with you. No, no… not that fresh baked Jr; it’ll be easy to find them a placement. I’m talking about the neurodivergent 12 year old who has frustration induced screaming fits; that knows every curse word in the English language and loves to use them liberally.

O-Oh. You don’t want him? Why not… I thought you cared about kids?

Oh… I get it. You only care about “normal” kids.

Alright, well… I guess I’ll keep him in my office until we find a place for that’s willing to take him in… sure hope we have enough gogurt in the fridge… not sure our budget will let us get another box so soon. It’s alright. I have a few extra bucks in my purse. I’ll grab him a Happy Meal and make sure he eats well even though I make $14 an hour. He’s had a crappy day.

[crystallineknight]

....Your advice is to kill the neurodivergent 12 year old who has frustration-induced screaming fits.

Your solution is to make sure the 12 year old never lives anywhere. Never sleeps anywhere, never eats anything, never has a conversation, never speaks their first word, never grows old or makes a friend or falls in love or ever does anything other than die.

While pretending to care about him.

If you had your way, if the value of life should only be respected when it is wanted, then all 53,000 of those children would be dead.

You are using sympathy for people you want to murder....to argue why it is good to murder them.

[locked-keye]

“I’m going to commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe, and educate my potential victims”.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Hi! How many LIVING children have you helped? How many unwanted living children have you adopted? Fostered? I trust you’re making a real conscious effort to care for all the kiddos we already have before you bring new ones on board, so I look forward to hearing your plan!

[locked-keye]

I appreciate the admission of guilt.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Bro you can just say you’ve done nothing, lol. It’s okay, we already knew.

[foreversaes-deactivated20230903]

“I’m going to commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe, and educate my potential victims”

yeah!! it’s not technically even murder- they aren’t alive but that!s a conversation for another day-

I’m gonna commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe and educate the CHILDREN THAT I’D BE RAISING

yeah. “murder” the fetus if you can’t ensure that it’ll be alive, happy and healthy. THAT INCLUDES HOUSING, FOOD, CLOTHING AND EDUCATION.

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

And here you once again blissfully ignore the actions that HAVE been taken....

[knowbetterdobetter2]

You don’t get it. The things that aren’t being done aren’t enough, not even close. 400k + kids are in foster care, and you want to add 600k+ on top of that? Your good intentions are misguided and incredibly dangerous. Tell me, if a living toddler was about to get shot right in front of you, and a pregnant woman was about to get kicked in the stomach, which would you save? What is your gut reaction?

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

There's a difference there - one is more likely to cause harm than the other. Both are obviously still dangerous, but different. I would save both, obviously.

[knowbetterdobetter2]

You missed the point of the exercise; you don’t get to save both. Only one.

And Are you saying a toddler is more likely to cause harm than a fetus?

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Thé pRoLiFe woman who went up there and said there were “plenty of facilities for unwanted children!” really got me. 10/10 for the person who told her 53,000 kids were in foster care right now. She didn’t know how to respond, lmao.

You care about kids? Great! GO ON BRUH. Take jr home with you. No, no… not that fresh baked Jr; it’ll be easy to find them a placement. I’m talking about the neurodivergent 12 year old who has frustration induced screaming fits; that knows every curse word in the English language and loves to use them liberally.

O-Oh. You don’t want him? Why not… I thought you cared about kids?

Oh… I get it. You only care about “normal” kids.

Alright, well… I guess I’ll keep him in my office until we find a place for that’s willing to take him in… sure hope we have enough gogurt in the fridge… not sure our budget will let us get another box so soon. It’s alright. I have a few extra bucks in my purse. I’ll grab him a Happy Meal and make sure he eats well even though I make $14 an hour. He’s had a crappy day.

[crystallineknight]

....Your advice is to kill the neurodivergent 12 year old who has frustration-induced screaming fits.

Your solution is to make sure the 12 year old never lives anywhere. Never sleeps anywhere, never eats anything, never has a conversation, never speaks their first word, never grows old or makes a friend or falls in love or ever does anything other than die.

While pretending to care about him.

If you had your way, if the value of life should only be respected when it is wanted, then all 53,000 of those children would be dead.

You are using sympathy for people you want to murder....to argue why it is good to murder them.

[locked-keye]

“I’m going to commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe, and educate my potential victims”.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Hi! How many LIVING children have you helped? How many unwanted living children have you adopted? Fostered? I trust you’re making a real conscious effort to care for all the kiddos we already have before you bring new ones on board, so I look forward to hearing your plan!

[locked-keye]

I appreciate the admission of guilt.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Bro you can just say you’ve done nothing, lol. It’s okay, we already knew.

[foreversaes-deactivated20230903]

“I’m going to commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe, and educate my potential victims”

yeah!! it’s not technically even murder- they aren’t alive but that!s a conversation for another day-

I’m gonna commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe and educate the CHILDREN THAT I’D BE RAISING

yeah. “murder” the fetus if you can’t ensure that it’ll be alive, happy and healthy. THAT INCLUDES HOUSING, FOOD, CLOTHING AND EDUCATION.

[catkin-morgs-kookaburralover]

And here you once again blissfully ignore the actions that HAVE been taken....

[knowbetterdobetter2]

You don’t get it. The things that aren’t being done aren’t enough, not even close. 400k + kids are in foster care, and you want to add 600k+ on top of that? Your good intentions are misguided and incredibly dangerous. Tell me, if a living toddler was about to get shot right in front of you, and a pregnant woman was about to get kicked in the stomach, which would you save? What is your gut reaction?

[knowbetterdobetter2]

This is the saddest part of my job (and I’m lucky, because I don’t have to witness it directly)

Sometimes we have to draft up record summaries to take to court to justify the need for services for a child. That requires going through and looking at the parent’s history within the system.

Far too often, that history something like this:

1/1/2001 Victim, physical abuse.

2/8/2002 Victim, sexual abuse

2/15/2002 Victim, neglect

Insert many, many more instances here… Until finally:

5/2/2015 Perpetrator, neglect

7/10/2015 Perpetrator, sexual abuse

And in those few lines, I’ve watched a child grow from an innocent victim, to a perpetrator. I’ve watched the abused become the abuser.

More often than not, perpetrators have a history of being abused. That does NOT mean that most abused people end up as abusers; please read that carefully.

We don’t know enough about nature vs nurture and the human condition to definitively state how much free will plays into our behaviors - biblical claims aside. Honestly, “they made their choice,” feels more often like a phrase meant to self-soothe than a reality. It’s too painful to acknowledge that WE might have had something to do with how people turned out.

Three more important facts:

Sexually abused perpetrators don’t end up sexually abusing in most cases. They actually end up getting substantiated with neglect due to using drugs to cope.

Most perps had kids when they were under 20 years old

Nearly all sexual abuse perps were sexually abused

[odinsblog]

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Thé pRoLiFe woman who went up there and said there were “plenty of facilities for unwanted children!” really got me. 10/10 for the person who told her 53,000 kids were in foster care right now. She didn’t know how to respond, lmao.

You care about kids? Great! GO ON BRUH. Take jr home with you. No, no… not that fresh baked Jr; it’ll be easy to find them a placement. I’m talking about the neurodivergent 12 year old who has frustration induced screaming fits; that knows every curse word in the English language and loves to use them liberally.

O-Oh. You don’t want him? Why not… I thought you cared about kids?

Oh… I get it. You only care about “normal” kids.

Alright, well… I guess I’ll keep him in my office until we find a place for that’s willing to take him in… sure hope we have enough gogurt in the fridge… not sure our budget will let us get another box so soon. It’s alright. I have a few extra bucks in my purse. I’ll grab him a Happy Meal and make sure he eats well even though I make $14 an hour. He’s had a crappy day.

[crystallineknight]

....Your advice is to kill the neurodivergent 12 year old who has frustration-induced screaming fits.

Your solution is to make sure the 12 year old never lives anywhere. Never sleeps anywhere, never eats anything, never has a conversation, never speaks their first word, never grows old or makes a friend or falls in love or ever does anything other than die.

While pretending to care about him.

If you had your way, if the value of life should only be respected when it is wanted, then all 53,000 of those children would be dead.

You are using sympathy for people you want to murder....to argue why it is good to murder them.

[locked-keye]

“I’m going to commit murder unless you pay to house, feed, clothe, and educate my potential victims”.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Hi! How many LIVING children have you helped? How many unwanted living children have you adopted? Fostered? I trust you’re making a real conscious effort to care for all the kiddos we already have before you bring new ones on board, so I look forward to hearing your plan!

[locked-keye]

I appreciate the admission of guilt.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Bro you can just say you’ve done nothing, lol. It’s okay, we already knew.

[locked-keye]

“You need to pay to save my victims lol” is not the argument you think it is.

You’re just a psychopath.

[lemonlordleah-deactivated202212]

Ok, ok, you win. I’m converted. No more abortion. It’s bad and wrong and liberal and all that other spooky stuff. IM PRO-LIFE NOW!

I’m ready to dive in! So, what’s our plan my fellow righteous dudes? My fellow caring individuals? Give me the pamphlet, I wanna get started.

Tell me how to take care of them and I’ll get right on it! I know no one would be so stupid as to bring 600k plus new kids into the world without knowing how to care for them! Especially not big fold-y brain smarties like you.