Koopazap

✰ 22 | Artist ✰ Woman ✞ Christian ✞ Into: Invader Zim, Mario, Wander Over Yonder, Mao Mao: Heroes of Pure Heart, MHA [I don’t do commissions] TikTok: @midoriyasgloves

[aryisfurry]

SPOILERS FOR 22 CHAPTER "Against the kitchen floor" BY @browniefox !!!!!!

I was thinking about it since I read the chapter.... btw I'm "Thanks for the chapter!" one, hehehe

grayscale version:

[fhazel27]

I’m not really sure what TADC is trying to say about community.

At first it seems that community is how you survive the circus. Isolating yourself like Kaufmo and Jax is how you abstract.

Then Jax has people remain by his side even through his toxic behavior, and he keeps pushing them away. Which yeah! People certainly do that! And that seems to be the tragedy of Jax’s character.

But then you have Caine. Caine gets… completely better in a vacuum. Quite literally! No one reaches out to him, no one encourages him. The only thing he gets from the humans is criticism and instruction. It seems the moral of Caine’s story is:

“Do the self improvement on your own and when you are better you will be worthy of community.”

It doesn’t land for me.

[koopazap]

That’s like the main problem I have, plus that the cast seems to both dehumanize Caine and expect a human standard of morality and compassion from him. That would’ve been fine, and a great way to show the characters’ flaws, but there’s never a moment where the series shows us that the humans now have an understanding of Caine, or that they ever learn that he wasn’t ill-intentioned before episode 8.

They’re so isolated from him in the narrative, there’s a ton of miscommunication between them all and it’s like it’s only resolved on Caine’s side, on his own. Which, along with the problems already addressed here, is also incredibly boring.

The cherry on top I think is this line: “In this world, the worst thing you can do is... make someone think they're not wanted or loved.” Were we supposed to do something with this?? It feels like something that should matter, but I don’t really feel it’s exemplified. You’d really think the narrative would come back around to it considering this is exactly what they (INCLUDING KINGER) have unintentionally done to Caine.

The little instant-acceptance we get for Caine feels so forced too. They show the happy little friendship montage where everyone’s 100% getting along, but I can’t believe in its sincerity at all because the narrative has done NOTHING to convince me that the humans understand Caine now or see him as a person.

[juartist]

Caine: Hey guys I'm a complex character that also has lots of potential and interesting backstory that just wants everyone to be happy and for people to not abandon me and see me as a failure!

Pomni: YOU'RE A FAILURE!!!!

Jax: Hey I'm literally the worst person ever.

Pomni: You can always talk to me, I'm here for you.

[caine-shrine]

Don't forget Caine: "Hey I directly expressed why I was so frustrated and am expressing feelings, unlike a certain purple rabbit who even with pretty much direct prompting will not open up to you, Zooble" Zooble: "Nah Caine is an enigma, how are we supposed to know how he thinks" Jax: "Hey I'm not going to pledge to do anything better btw and still deflect and in fact double down on maliciously emotionally abusing Ragatha at the point where everyone was at their lowest" Zooble: "I mean ur a lil annoying I guess but you're still one of us, so"

[juartist]

THIS.

[koopazap]

I don’t have the capacity to do thinking rn but when I do, I might think about how the concept of TADC X Infinity Train could work (at least as just a loose, fun little idea that I could do doodles of.)

[koopazap]

I put this in the tags as a joke, but the more I remember the plot of Infinity Train’s season 3, the more I feel Simon and Jax’s approach to the respective worlds they’ve been thrown into is very similar. Both embracing it in a toxic way, and treating it as if it’s not real and doesn’t have consequences iirc? Like Simon’s approach to the denizens and such.

[koopazap]

I don’t have the capacity to do thinking rn but when I do, I might think about how the concept of TADC X Infinity Train could work (at least as just a loose, fun little idea that I could do doodles of.)

[koopazap]

Concept by @smallcloverleaf !!

Their stuff is what prompted me to watch A Monster in Paris, and immediately after I was inspired to doodle similar showtime stuff :D

I didn’t use a reference for these, they’re based on vibes (If there’s inaccuracies it’s because of that)

[koopazap]

How do you make a TADC sona? I feel like they were pretty vague about the system that generates their bodies by “perfectly encapsulating their mind files,” it also sounds like all the cast hate their bodies.

What specifically are they based on? Is it just insecurities? Are there no interests or likes integrated too? Conscious or subconscious behaviors and beliefs about themselves? I’d be interested in trying but I’d like to better understand if there’s any implied guidelines first, rather than just unknowable aesthetic choices.

[justa-side-blog]

I wanna make something clear for a second.

I *like* Kinger. He's a very sweet, loveable character. But I also think the narrative should focus on his flaws more. There's so much missed potential. And also, why is everyone so easy on Kinger, both the fandom and narrative? He created the circus, he created Caine (at least, he was part of it). Kinger has a responsibility. Kinda wish the narrative held him more accountable.

When I said that Kinger should 'hate' Caine a little bit, I didn't mean an extreme amount. Just a little bit. Because honestly, that's human. Wouldn't you hate your creation if it caused so much pain and killed your wife? Now, I don't think Kinger is the type of guy to act on his resentment, or voice it. He wouldn't hold a grudge. He's better than that. But also, Kinger neglected Caine. He really dropped the ball, and it's weird that Tadc skirts around it so much.

I would've structured the narrative like this:

°early days, Kinger takes responsibility. He does his very best to guide Caine and 'fix' the circus to the best of his abilities. Maybe Caine sometimes alarms Kinger with his...low empathy tendencies. But Kinger takes it in stride.

°Queenie abstracts. All of Kinger's worst fears about Caine feel more real. Kinger feels sadness, anger, regret. He loved programming, now he doesn't even want to think about it. It's all ruined. He's sick of Caine, sick of the digital world, numb inside. Kinger never lashes out at Caine, but he stares at him in blank silence. Kinger runs away from the situation and retreats into insanity.

°Ragatha arrives. She asks questions about the circus, and Kinger gets triggered. All his worst memories and regrets are flooding back. Kinger sets an example for Ragatha and he...hides the truth from her. He tells Ragatha it doesn't matter anymore. All they have is each other (the humans). Ragatha is very grateful to Kinger. He supports her like a kindly father. Kinger is guilty, and it's driving him insane. He doesn't want to tell Ragatha that he made the circus. She thinks so highly of Kinger.

°Present day, Kinger is triggered into action. Caine does something and we get a flashback of a scene where Caine says exactly the same thing. Caine isn't learning, and neither is Kinger anymore. Kinger allowed himself to become stagnant. The first thing Kinger does, away from Caine, is apologise to Ragatha. He says he wasn't honest with her because he didn't want her to hate him. Ragatha starts tearing up. She knows the feeling. Kinger shares his whole backstory and takes responsibility for Caine. He quietly admits to the humans that he didn't do anything because he didn't want to talk to Caine anymore. Ragatha forgives Kinger. He never meant for them to be trapped here. The humans have mixed opinions, but ultimately, they're glad to know the truth.

[radcatcreations]

Every time someone draws the "whole TADC cast" but doesn't include Caine, an angel loses it's wings

[koopazap]

Idc this should’ve been in the show.

[koopazap]

I have more thoughts on this again, does this mean “he tried to fix his brain. And make him happy.” Or does it mean “he tried to make him happy, by fixing his brain.”

Because I think we can assume he was trying to manually make him happy? But I feel like the wording is a little unclear, considering Scratch did in fact have issues with his brain (ones I’d be perfectly willing to accept carried over in his brain scan).

[juartist]

Okay so what if that one Tomie art but make it cute and make it Caine

[koopazap]

Little things I was messing around with, blocking in only colors with the lasso tool + doing pretty much the same thing on paper with markers

(still done on blank notecards so they’re pretty small, hard to get them to look great)

[koopazap]

Nobody’s done anything with Caine and Family of Me, so I guess I’ll have to keep making animatics/edits of it in my head

[lazuli-starlight]

I get the sense Caine, even post ep 9, isn't ready to face the abstracted humans.

What happened with Scratch still clearly haunts Caine to this day. You'll find references to Dogs popping up everywhere in the background of adventures, and even in some places within the circus itself. He's *always* thinking about it, at least in the back of his mind. The hotdog in Abel's locket, referring to a promise? I think that was also a referral to Scratch. As in, Caine promised himself he would never directly modify, or even open, the mindfiles ever again.

Kinda adds to the horror and heartbreak when you realize that a split frame directly before the torment nightmares in ep 8 start, you can see a bolt of electricity hit Pomni's brain. Which implies Caine broke his promise and *read the mindfiles* and/or directly affected them in order to create those nightmares. Gives you a greater sense of how much Caine completely and utterly snapped in that moment.

But going back to the other abstracted humans, I think Caine also blames himself for them deep down. But has been trying to bury that under the other things he feels about them: despair, pain, rage and confusion of why it keeps happening, why the humans keep choosing to leave him. And then Caine buries that under the Jolly Happy Ringmaster Mask. Under "The Show Must Go On" and under "I can't act sad or afraid or confused because I'm supposed to be an entertainer, I'm supposed to keep things light and happy and fun". And under "If I don't think about it it won't hurt, and if I act like nothing is wrong then maybe the humans will too". Yet still, Caine does believe it's his fault deep down. That he killed the people he loved so much because he could not create a place they would like enough to stay. Because he let his fear, arrogance and shame get the best of him. He wanted to create a paradise so the humans would love him for it, and his ideas, but he ruined it. Twice. Bro has SO MUCH to unpack regarding the abstractions. And he isn't quite ready to do that yet.

[koopazap]

There's so much in Caine that pre ep 9 looked like he genuinely cared about his surroundings but had no tools to explain that to humans or assumed that they understood. Which turned out to be just his ego somehow and gets fixed by throwing his tumorous sibling away.

Anyway, NPC uprising when? AIs get sentience over time. PC shutdown when? Even though each of them is less than 1 MB of data. There's no way this shit survives unless there's an outside force that keeps everything in check. But i guess we'll never know now.

There’s definitely a lot of “suspend your disbelief,” and I’d be a lot more willing to do that if the story and character aspects were properly utilized

[koopazap]

no dude you’re so right 🙏🙏 caine’s big sacrifice was framed as something monumental. he basically gave up godhood to live amongst the humans, buuuuuut what exactly DID he lose??? we don’t know how much the blue ai affected his powers. if anything, that “sacrifice” was more for him because the strange split personality thing.

imagine superman somehow removed his powers to live a normal life with lois, but in the following comics, we see panels of him lifting bridges and flying around metropolis 💀 idk man

Literally why even bring it up T_T you can’t claim there’s consequences and then have no consequences

[koopazap]

I kinda hate that Caine says he’s keeping the worlds open in EP 9, like surely there must be some issues with that?? Some limitations to this 90’s computer’s capabilities???

It’s not just an internal logic thing, it’s that a story still needs limitations and consequences. Are you telling me that literally the only problem they could ever have now is abstraction? And Caine being able to leave everything open means that these moments didn’t mean anything:

Instead, Caine just didn’t wanna. Which I honestly hate. We’ve seen him decide not to do something based on his preferences before (the suggestion box topic in EPs 5-6) but this felt different than his opinion, it seemed like there was an actual reason he couldn’t or shouldn’t. But no, I guess it was just an arbitrary gag.

Also Caine “doesn’t quite have the same power” that he used to and still he can apparently do this. That (along with many other things) is something they don’t even vaguely touch on, there’s no indication as to the difference in Caine’s power now vs before.