I think that the whole 'servant wei wuxian' thing being thrown around was mostly due to the fact that his father was a servant and when wwx actively went against the cultivation world they constantly said that "he's just the son of a servant" as a way to remind him of his place/birth status. it's similar to how despite jin guangyao being a war hero and war criminal people still remind him he's just the "son of a whore".
i personally don't think that wwx was a servant, he slept in the same bedroom as the heir for a while, ate at the jiang family table, was the head disciple, got to go with the sect heir to gusu lan for studies, had the daughter of the clan leader dote on him etc i think some people really wanted the whole cinderella backstory for him but that just wasn't the case, if they want that whole rags to riches story luo binghe is a better example tbh.
Exactly! Wwx isnt a servant. He's the head disciple. I'm not really sure how it might work in mdzs, but presumably he is the most senior in their generation aside from jfm and any elders, even jc (when it comes to being disciples) He probably would have become a teacher in the jiang clan himself, but that is without mentioning jc wanting to make wwx his second in command. It is only yzy (and jinzhou & yinzhou.) Who treated wwx as lesser than the other disciples and did not like him being around her children, but she still saw him as one of them (a disciple) even the other disciples look up to him. They don't treat him any lesser.
It is only after the war, character begin to bring up that he is a son of a servant. It's just that one part of the fandom over uses that bit and see wwx being raised in Lotus Cove as this terrible miserable time. He definitely wasn't treated the best, but he wasn't being locked away or starved like mxy. He wasn't constantly being beaten and looked down on.
I also think an ending portraying wwx is better off cutting all ties with Lotus Cove is a sad one because of it. Even if he and jc might be on bad terms. It's still his childhood home. Only three people there really mistreated him growing up. His father is from there. His shijie is from there. It's sad to think about him never coming back. And I think it's a bit of an exaggeration to say wwx 'cutting ties' with Lotus Cove was because it held such bad memories of a childhood for him. It was mainly his fight with jc that caused his split from yunmeng at the end and even then I don't think it's as bad as people make it seem (it was still definitely not good of course)
Thats mainly what I meant about that side of things. And the other side does also over play his place. While he was a head disciple and shared a room with the clan heir and was raised with the family's children. He's not a part of the main family and he is not jyl and jc's brother. Its not like what happened for lsz in the Lan sect. Hes not a 'relative' so he's not as privileged as the clan heirs while hes outside the jiang sect (and even in it) but he's definitely not a servant.
I also agree with the jgy comparison. I think it's also similar to the part I'm currently at in the book with the Mo's. They were dismissive of the second daughter who was the child of a servant. Then kind to her when jgs would visit them to see her. Then looked down on her when he stopped. Then once again treated her better when mxy was sent to live with the jins (and of course mistreated again when he was sent back) a lot of the book repeats that plot and it does show the hypocrisy of the clans and sects.
So the thing is, WWX is a Schrodinger's Jiang: he's treated and loved like a sibling, but never actually adopted so he won't compete with JC for heir role. He's loved equally to JYL and JC and even spoiled by JFG [if you consider being held after dissociative episode for a day spoiling from a man who hugged JC twice in his life], until Wen attack and he's told to protect them of die trying because they have always been above him. Always a sect member, never the clan member. WWX knows this and plays by the rules - JC doesn't. It's why JC's happy ending is legging go of WWX in the end, because he can't keep trying to have his cake and eat it in the end.
Jiang sect is also special sect in that they allow anyone to become a disciple, including servants [how WWX's father could become Jiang cultivator]. So servants can cultivate there - people definitely confuse that with WWX being called son of a servant.
Also, WWX canonically has permanent scars from YZY whipping him and it was such common occurrence that even when she does it with Zidian and WWX actually asks why is only he punished while JC and younger disciples [also involved] are not, JC and disciples just laugh about him taking it so much better than them.
Family Discipline being used - and being a whip specifically - is common, but it clear YZY overused it on WWX and she sought him out even when he was not the one at fault.
I completely agree with these things! I know that discipline was harsher when it came to disciples and even to just sometimes children. But I did also always thought yzy was harsher and unfair. And the scene you mentioned of the other disciples laughing at him and saying he can handle it better was one that stuck out to me. Especially because there's a back and forth if yzy did whip him (I suppose later in the book wwx says she didn't? Or at least that she was good to him? I will really have to read on my own to see) but this scene goes against that. She clearly did punish him more and even he noticed.
And wwx’s place with the jiang family really is so interesting. Especially what you brought up, of jfm only telling wwx to protect the jiang siblings in the end. I do dislike yzy's way of raising her children, but I also dislike jfm for the similar reasoning. Even if he's not as bad as her. The ending felt as if wwx while at Lotus Cove was something to make jfm feel better about himself. He never outright spoiled wwx. Feeding a child and giving him a room to stay in or holding him once, is really the bare minimum. (I do stand with jc about the dog thing. That was cold and unfair)
But yes. He rarely held jc (maybe even jyl) and he felt a lot more dismissive around his own children. At the same time in the end he also knows his children are 'worth more'. Now that the fun is over and seeing wwx as just an extention of us parents so he could maybe fix what he felt was wrong before they left and died, wwx really is just an outsider (not blood) the safely of his children mean more to him and knowing wwx was going to protect them was all he needed to know. I do think he favored wwx while he was alive, but I think it was more over the bitterness of the family he did have and what he could have had being right in front of him, had he married cssr.
And I also agree with jc's ending and all the rest. For jc, leaving wwx in the end not only was him letting go of his hate but just moving on from something (someone) he can never have. He didn't do that with his father (and his father couldn't fully let go/move on himself) he was bitter about his treatment by him till the very end. This time, he and wwx could at least part on (not perfect) good enough terms.
But, selfishly and personally, I wish wwx will return to Lotus Cove at some point. I wish they could be friends or brothers again. Becuase they aren't like jfm and wcz. Or jfm and cssr. So I don't like the thought of them completely cutting ties and never seeing eachother again 'for the better'. Somewhat like their parents.
I agree with so much.<3 It's getting publish in a bit in my country so I cannot wait to read it properly too!
There is a version of WWX in fandom that has like, no self-esteem [mostly born from Untamed adaptation] and what fascinating to me is that in contrast, the book version of him has almost no self-worth when Jiang comes to play.
He sees Jiang as his saviors, for taking him off the streets [and then even getting rid of the dogs for him and the JYL and JC going after him when he run]. Anything they ask, he's gonna do - server them, protect them, take on the heat of punishments, deal wit their tempers and issues, give up his golden core. He doesn't see his life as worthless, but as worth less than JYL and JC and himself as indebted to JGM and YZY.
So of course he says YZY was good to him - she whipped him and left him scars, but she allowed him to stay and fed him and even let him cultivate, despite the rumors! He would've been competing with feral dogs for scraps on the street otherwise. He'd be another XY otherwise.
The only time he puts them aside is when he sees injustice done - when WX attack MM in the turtle cave, or when he's defending Wen remnants. Because WWX still plays by the rules, being just a disciple and putting righteousness even above his personal debt to Jiang. Not a family who should put Jiang above all and be filial.
And you can truly feel how much it never happened before, because JC lashes out immediately as if family member betrayed him - not just cutting ties with WWX, but casting him out and making him enemy of the sect, never speaking up about either WN and WQ risking their lives for them, nor the Wen remnants not being cultivators, and then leading siedge against Burial Mounds.
It's not 'an errant disciple turned evil' - it's 'my kin turned against me'. I do like to think they are able to reconnect after the ending, without the impossible trap of hierarchy suffocating them. The story is first and foremost a romance, so a lot of other fascinating things get lot let screen-time one might want them too. xD
I can't wait to hear what you think of some of those scenes. JC is amazing character, but also the plot's stress-ball.
