8.08 - Hunteri Heroici
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Mike Driver
he wasn't even looking at me and he found me

tannertan36
almost home
Not today Justin

bliss lane
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The Bowery Presents
Cosmic Funnies

Product Placement
noise dept.

ellievsbear
h
NASA
let's talk about Bridgerton tea, my ask is open
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Xuebing Du
★

roma★
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@livefreebutwisely
8.08 - Hunteri Heroici
castiel. hunteri heroici
GODDAMN
You are so pretty, Charles. That’s not my name. Oh! You look so much like my third husband.
8.08 Hunteri Heroici
#this was the angel equivalent of instastalking your crush
This wasn’t scripted, Misha just went for it
In the audio commentary for this episode Dabb was like “I don’t know what I like better, that Cas decides to go through Dean’s stuff or that Dean lets him”
I feel the need to add that In Cas’ first episode, the barn scene, Bobby and Dean had left some books open while they were painting all those sigils and at one point Cas wanders over and flips through them
It’s a *blink and you’ll miss it* scene, but Cas has been rifling through Dean’s stuff since the literal moment he first met him after inhabiting a vessel
AND the scene where hes just reading John’s journal (I think he compliments his handwriting) and Dean doesn’t stop him.
8x08/15x09
DESTIEL IN EVERY EPISODE → 8x08 hunteri heroici
didn't hear the strength within your words and what they mean you were watchin' over me
“Lily Sunder Has Some Regrets” really is the thesis for how to write Sam’s POV in Destiel fics. He is not constantly thinking about or shipping them. In fact, he would rather never have to think about them. He is exhausted by them. He understands how both of them are and he gets it, but there are literally people dying and he really doesn’t have the time nor the energy for it. And he knows the day Dean and Cas finally use their words will only be one brief moment of rest before they become a whole new brand of unbearable.
I think the reason why I like this episode so much is because even if they are being bitchy assholes to each other, they're still communicating? And it does cultivate into something constructive, Dean admitting that his anger is born from fear and Cas acknowledging that he loves them so much he will sacrifice himself for them. Most times they've never gotten to the point where even if they disagree they know the other has truly heard them and respects what they're trying to say, they're not just yelling at brick walls they're communicating, it's hilarious and then it's beautiful
lily sunder dean is so!! he almost crushes his beloved car because cas made a passive aggressive comment mentioning another man. he can't let cas out of his sight for more than 30 seconds. basically sits in cas' lap. he's been acting like an asshole for days, but the moment someone else is mean to cas, he turns into an overprotective husband who's ready to throw hands. "why do you let him talk to you like that? ☹️" also, the script says he's supposed to move sits with sam, but he not only stays next to cas, he also pretends not to notice sam moving to sit across from them. words of affirmation hello?? "you're not weak, cas. you know that, right?" "I'm not mad, I'm worried" !! not to mention the lingering touches... and the hand clenching after bro patting cas on the shoulder.......
Castiel: vessel, body, woman, (best) friend.
This title comes from a previous post of mine where I talked about Yockey’s episodes in s12 and how they all deal with the theme of interconnection between motherhood/fatherhood and human vessels vs demons, angels and other humans. Ultimately, the post was about Kelly Kline, the final “doll”, the real one, true vessel used to pour angelic grace in, give birth to a Nephilim and be discarded once her “job” is done.
However, since I’ve been thinking about the mothers of gods and monsters and how they all, in some way or another, end up being associated with Castiel, I’ve found an interesting discovery about “Lily Sunder Has Some Regrets” (the linked post about mothers and this one seem to be disconnected now but it will all make sense with later posts, I promise).
I’ll quote myself from my initial post in order to explain my theory:
Cas: Benjamin is always very careful. Long ago, he found a powerfully devout vessel in Madrid, and her faith, it… she gave him everything – her trust and her body. Dean: Wait. So Benjamin’s a woman. Cas: Benjamin is an angel. His vessel is a woman. But it – it’s – it’s more than that. She’s not just his vessel. Sam: She’s… She’s his friend. Cas: Yeah. Benjamin would never put her in unnecessary danger. So Lily killed Benjamin, the angel AND the “powerfully devout from Madrid” who’s first described as a vessel, a body, then as a woman, then again as “more than that/not just a vessel” and ultimately as a friend (with a romantic undertone to the word). So we GOTTA ask: when is a human being just a body? And when a vessel? Are there “vessels” and “not just [some angel’s]vessel”?
I’ve always interpreted this dialogue as an interesting lesson on “Angels and Gender Politics”, and it is, but maybe there’s something less intellectual and more mundane about it. Maybe it's just the same-old SPN parallels technique. But more fun.
“Vessel, body, woman, friend” is how the powerfully devout woman in Madrid is described. But in this episode, “vessel, body, woman, friend” is also Castiel. Castiel is the powerfully devout woman in Madrid and Dean’s… her Benjamin. There’s a complete reversal of roles here where Cas is paralleld to a human and Dean’s his angel which I find very interesting.
The comparison between Dean and Benjamin starts even before the Castiel-woman-in-Madrid one:
CAS: It was, um... Look, Benjamin wouldn't call for help lightly. And he wouldn't put himself in harm's way if he could help it. DEAN: Wow, this Benjamin seems like he's pretty cool, you know. Like he wouldn't make any half-cocked, knee-jerk choices. CAS: Yeah, you know what I like about him? Is that he's sarcastic, but he's thoughtful and appreciative, too. DEAN: Now what is that supposed to mean?
What Dean is saying here is that Benjamin is not Cas because Benjamin sounds like a cool type who wouldn’t make reckless decisions (while Cas is not this type of person). But what Cas is saying is that Benjamin’s like Dean because they’re both sarcastic but Benjamin is better than Dean because he’s also thoughtful and appreciative (while Dean’s not).
Let’s see if I’m right about this.
Vessel.
The moment Cas meets Ishim and Mirabel he just has to open his mouth and say it: “Kept your vessels all this time. I'm impressed”. Ishim and Mirabel say that they were not careless with their vessels like Cas was. Which, of course, means that they’ve known Cas in is “old him”, his old vessel.
Body.
Whether they like it or not (and Ishim doesn’t like it because he thinks humans are apes, monkeys and primates which, to be fair with Ishim, is not technically not true however he does throw shade at us) angels on earth are incarnated beings, meaning that to live on Earth they need to take… a body. Specifically, a human body (no cat angels for us). Human bodies, however, are, from an angel’s pov, weak. Ishim might have been careful with his vessel but this doesn’t mean he can’t get hurt. Lily doesn’t manage to kill him in the alley but she hurts him a great deal because his wound is deep and healing it will be painful. Bodies suck, huh? But maybe also… not so much after all.
Woman.
The big reveal of this episode is that Cas’ old vessel was a woman. We don’t know anything else but the fact that she was a woman. We don’t even know if Sam and Dean know about it because we see the backstory through a flashback while obviously they don’t. They must have wondered because they know for sure that Castiel took Jimmy Novak as his vessel after resurrecting Dean. Whatever the case may be, though, what we know is that that was the first time Castiel possessed a person to visit Earth.
Friend.
Friendship is one of the episode’s themes. It’s not the central one but they do bring up friendship a lot. Benjamin and the devout woman were "friends". Benjamin and Castiel were friends. The angels in Ishim’s garrison were friends. Sam and Dean are friends with Castiel. Dean and Castiel are best friends. Since Benjamin and the devout woman were established as “friends”, meaning that they were a little more than that, then where does it leave us? Well, frankly the usual: Cas and Dean are more than friends. Woah, what a surprise, I absolutely did not see that one coming.
The scene that confirms that my theory is correct is when Ishim dares Dean to finalize the sigil and blast every angel in the room. You see, “Benjamin would never put her in unnecessary danger”. Neither does Dean with Cas.
The scene also pretty much sums up the whole episode as far as the theme of “vessel, body, woman, friend” is concerned. Cas has healed Ishim who’s now fully recovered and brimming health from every pore. Cas, on the other hand? Not so much.
ISHIM: I used to envy you, Castiel. You believe that? ISHIM: You survived Hell. You were chosen by God. But now look at you. You're just sad and pathetically weak. ISHIM: So now... I'm gonna help you. I'm gonna cure you of your human weakness same way I cured my own– ISHIM: – by cutting it out. DEAN: Don't move. ISHIM: Do it. You blast me away, you'll blast away every angel in the room. I'll survive. Castiel, on the other hand, he's hurt. He might live or he might just end up a bloody smear on the wall. Roll the dice.
Castiel’s “bodiness” is exposed in this scene, but there is a… ahem… “positive” side? Unlike the poor guy that Ishim is wearing as his meatsuit (ugh), Cas doesn’t have to worry about his vessel’s safety but his own. He is his own vessel now (well, he kinda still stole the looks from Jimmy Novak, nevertheless his vessel has become his body. An angel with his own body, crazy, I know. Maybe this is really why Ishim is jealous of him). Which, to be honest, is still concerning because Cas is reckless as fuck. Thank God Dean is not.
Dean doesn’t roll the dice, he doesn’t endanger his powerfully devout friend, he doesn’t bet on the odds of having to scoop up Cas’ remains from the wall.
So cool, right? Do you think that Cas has learnt the value of life, the value of his own life and will be less reckless with it? Of course not!
By the end of the episode Cas still says (re Billie’s murder)that he doesn’t regret his actions even if they cost him his life. He also says, after all he’s been through with Lily Sunder, that he doesn’t know if he’s capable of killing an innocent baby or not.
SAM: But, Cas, at the end of the day, it's a mom and her kid. I mean, do you – do you think you'll be able to... CAS: There was a time when I wouldn't have hesitated. But now, I don't know.
I don’t know if the show ever answers this question. He does bring Kelly to the “sandbox” but then Dagon shows up and then Joshua gets killed and then Kelly takes his hand and then Jack shows him “the future”… And then, and then, and then. Stuff happened, life happened, you know? I mean, it’s complicated but this is what makes it more interesting!
Dean: Well this Benjamin seems pretty cool. You know, like he wouldn't make any half-cocked, knee-jerk choices
Cas: Yeah, you know what I like about him is that he's sarcastic, but he's thoughtful and appreciative too
Dean: *literally swerving into oncoming traffic* And what is that supposed to mean?!
Sam: Okay, okay, the road, *faintly* road.
STACKEDNATURAL ⇉ 181/327 (part 2)
12.10 Lily Sunder Has Some Regrets Written by Steve Yockey Directed by Thomas J. Wright Original Air Date: February 2, 2017
STACKEDNATURAL ⇉ 181/327 (part 1)
12.10 Lily Sunder Has Some Regrets Written by Steve Yockey Directed by Thomas J. Wright Original Air Date: February 2, 2017
cas: you kill an angel, its vessel dies too.
dean: think i don’t know that? if i don’t end sam and [gadreel] burns him out…
dean: god, i was so damn stupid.
cas: you were stupid for the right reasons.
dean: yeah, like that matters.
cas: it does. sometimes, that’s all that matters. listen to me — sam is strong. if he knew an angel was possessing him, he could fight.
—
god i love this moment. it reminds me of dean’s worst fear — j-hn telling him before he died that dean would potentially have to kill sam before he became truly “evil.” but also how much cas can relate to making decisions via deception and out of desperation because he only wants to do the right thing, and how void of judgment his response is when dean goes and makes the same mistake. i’m so glad we’re back at the threshold of team free will mending whatever fracture they were forced to deal with so far.