We wanted to check in with you guys and THANK YOU so much for your amazing support and feedback in the past year. We appreciate you. ❤️ Buzzsprout kindly informed us that we were in the top 25% of all of their podcasts and we’ve got only you guys to thank for that!
Our newest ep - where we wrapped up s2 and did some VERY fun (😏) rankings and whatnot - premiered just before Christmas but in case you somehow missed it, below you’ll find the link. It’s under 60 mins so it’s not a massive one to tackle. Also, we hope you’ll share our laughs. 😉
We don’t exactly know when we can begin recording our REFORGED series for season 2 but we can promise you they will come… when they do. We’ll keep you posted for sure.
We’ve got 50 minutes worth of podcast for you! That is: premiering tomorrow (Monday, Dec 23rd) at 1pm UK time. Just in time for the holidays so you can either listen to it while wrapping the presents, or walking the dog, or doing just about anything. 😉
We did some rankings: fave ep to ‘least’ fave, top 5 characters and honorable mentions, as well. There were plenty of laughs and we genuinely had such a total blast recording this episode of our little podcast.
As hard as it is to find time to record sometimes, we are committed to tackling the reforge part sometime soon. Or at least starting the process because it’ll be a while till we have new material so we might as well drag it out a bit. We also want to do a special kind of episode responding to some of the messages or questions posed in them because it’s easier to just discuss it between the two of us while recording than typing the responses, especially when it’s usually just one of us doing the social media. We hope you understand!
We’ll be back with the links once it is live tomorrow!
We have a surprise pod ep ready for your enjoyment. Hiatus what? Haha. No but in truth we have been resting and quietly 'reforging' our season 2 thoughts. We did, however, sit down with Rotem Rusak (Editor in Chief at Nerdist) a while ago to record this ep on our (and everyone else's!) favourite anti-hero (or hero-hero, right?) ADAR.
From Joseph Mawle to Sam Hazeldine, from unknown villain to tortured father. We've all been on a journey with this character, and it's a journey that has (in the show, at least) come to an end. So what better time to reflect?
We talk with Rotem, resident Adar expert, about her anticipation for TROP before Adar was a known entity, her fears over the recast, and the highs and lows of the character.
Then we all return to a the Hall of Lore to choose our favourite Adar quote, musical moment, scene and...Adar's personal MVP.
It was an absolute pleasure chatting with Rotem, and you can find her here: @Moondancer1626
Also, we have received quite a volume of questions/theories/stuff to ponder and we would like you all to know we will get back to everything once we start reforging. :) Thank you for flooding our messages on here!
Well, we are ALL IN OUR FEELINGS after an incredible finale...which hurt us in many ways. We did have some criticisms, and decided to tackle those first before ending on a high. So, if you want to jump around, timestamps follow!
We start with our thoughts on the big Sauron and Galadriel scene (00:04:09) before concluding that much of our anxiety over how this was handled is to do with our disappointment over Galadriel's place in the show and her character arc (00:26:37). Our critique carries through as we talk through everything Rhun (00:43:32).
Our positivity bursts back into being, possibly surprisingly, when we get to Pelargir (00:49:51) and then Numenor (01:00:05). We get emotional over Durin III (01:10:30) and then tackle all the 'little elfy bits' (01:15:19). Finally, we discuss Adar with a slice of mental health + fandom (01:24:48) before finishing with our farewell to Celebrimbor (01:35:55).
We're aware that we started running out of time at the end, but if you're disappointed that we skipped any details...THE REFORGING IS COMING. Keep an eye on our socials, and we'll be back soon. Thank you all for coming on this ride with us.
This week, we learned how hard it is to discuss an episode the day after - especially one as good as this - because, coherent thoughts how? Doomed to Die was spectacular, and we are flailing.
We kick off with Kissgate (00:03:38) so if you're tired of talking about it by now, you can jump ahead. From there, we're a little bit all over the place, so timestamps were difficult, but it goes something like this...
We love on Celebrimbor breaking free and being a badass (00:21:27) before a quick talk on death and Mirdania (00:28:58). We then talk about the incredible scene with Brimby and Galadriel (00:34:54) before a quick dip into ARONDIR IS ALIVE (00:40:51). We then ask WILL HE COME and cry a bit (00:43:03) before discussing our guy Adar (00:47:59). Finally, we wrap up some bits and bobs (00:50:04) before tackling deathwatch and some finale speculation (00:56:40).
Friends. Less than 48 hours left now. *deep breaths* *SCREAMS*
Also. Just to let everyone know: we will be discussing season finale Friday morning. Expect it to be as full of flailing and only slightly coherent as this one then, lol. Therefore, you should get First Thoughts on it beginning of next week similarly to this ep. ;)
Coming on here to just quickly let everyone know - in case you don’t follow us on Insta or Twitter - NEW POD EP IS GOING LIVE TOMORROW (MONDAY) EVENING!!! ❤️🔥💍
We’re promptly going to share the links but just a reminder, following the pod on a podcast platform of your choosing ensures getting a notification that a new ep has been added.
Follow us on Twitter (where most of our daily content happens, it’s also most unhinged on there lol): @RingsReforged
Till tomorrow and may we make it to Thursday without seeing anymore unwanted spoilery promo content (someone teach Amazon!!!).
So. We literally sat down this morning, hit record on our Zoom call, later Nat did her magic with some editing for a few hours and voila, we have a new pod ep ALREADY out!
If you follow us on Spotify and any other podcast platform of your choosing, you've probably received a notification on the new release from us. It's a very handy tool, that 'follow' button. ;)
This week, we take a slightly different approach because we're already so close to the next episode, picking THREE topics each to surprise the other with. There was a little bit of crossover, but we still managed to cover a good chunk of WHERE IS HE?
After introductions, we kick off with thoughts on Earien (00:02:47), how she's being presented on the show, and her relationship with Elendil. We then jump to discussing Durin's grief (00:16:22) before pivoting to love for Disa (00:20:23) and...well...fear for Disa.
Next, we appreciate the Adar/Galadriel scenes (00:25:41) before diving specifically into the fun framing of Adar/Sauron against Sauron/Galadriel (00:41:23). Then we ponder Annatar's illusion (00:48:18) and go on a tirade about why it's important for evil to be nuanced in fiction (00:55:08).
Finally, we wrap up with DEATHWATCH (01:00:59). This isn't spoiler based, but if you want to avoid speculation, maybe skip this bit and come back to join us after episode 7!
We'll be back with a new pod on ep 7 probably sometime next week!
For now, please hit us up with anything! If there's anything you may want us to discuss that we haven't covered yet, please let us know.
This post made me revisit the scene once more and - unless I am in a state of copium fueled delusion and am imagining things - Sauron's expression slightly changed for a moment here as he stared at that couple. It was wistful and almost resembled longing. It's almost as if everything is going as per the plan but he something is missing. Or, rather someone. Someone precious who can take Sauron's vision of his ideal world to perfection.
If my suspicions are proven correct when the finale airs then it will add an entirely new meaning to every single crumb and every expression of theirs, however small they may seem now.
Imho there's no way this scene was random. This vision is entirely his creation. Sauron could have just left his mind palace and gone back to the real world as soon as Celebrimbor was back where he wanted him to be, but NO, he chose to linger here for a minute and create this.
Also let's not forget the earlier scene with Mirdania. The Rings are his poem, but it lacks Galadriel for them to be perfect, it lacks her Light.
Charles Edwards as Celebrimbor & Charlie Vickers as Annatar / Sauron
THE LORD OF THE RINGS: THE RINGS OF POWER (2022 - )
Season 2, Episode 6: Where is He?
Pau - When you read this later, let me know if you want me to move it to my personal account, yeah? If it even still exists...
I’m not really sure what this post is going to end up being. A defence of the show and the separation? In part! A critique of the show based off leak spoilers and my own gut feeling? For sure! A desperate ramble in an attempt to get my head in order? Absolutely!
I will say before we dive in that I’m absolutely a Haladriel shipper, but the way I ship isn’t always in line with fandom. I ship what I see as part of the narrative because it’s the narrative, and everything else is a bonus. I make this distinction because I think this is why I’m so okay with a lack of scenes when some others are not, and I don’t want to come across preachy. I don't think I'm in any way superior for this by the way. In fact, I wish I could be more *normal*!!!!
If you came to this show for Haladriel alone, and simply want to see them share scenes week to week – that’s your prerogative. I’m not trying to say you shouldn’t feel that way. What I might try to say is that I don’t think that makes the shows bad or suggests that the writers have baited with this relationship. I think that’s ultimately what I find frustrating…
But anyway, let’s get into whatever this is. A reflection on expectations, a five-season arc, and those STUPID spoiler leaks…
AND THERE WILL BE SPOILERS. STAY AWAY. HISS.
Alright, so this post is mostly brought to you by a sinking feeling I have that the leak spoilers are real. Because everything in that episode 7 promo matches up.
STOP READING if you don’t want to know the spoilers. And honestly? STOP READING IF YOU THINK YOU WANT TO KNOW because living with this knowledge has truly made this season less enjoyable for me (credit to it, then, because I still think it’s incredible). IF I’M MAKING YOU PANIC, STILL STOP READING because there very much is a world where these spoilers aren’t that bad in context…but I prefer to keep my expectations low…
Have you gone???
HAVE YOU GONE?????
SPOILER TALK
Okay.
So, the leak spoilers say that there is no kiss between Sauron and Galadriel (which, honestly, I have no great issue with – more to come on that later). Instead, the kiss is ELROND AND GALADRIEL, and I absolutely do take issue with this.
I can only hope and PRAY that it works in context, but I can’t get my head around it. And yet, the promo…it’s all falling into place. Elrond will be sent to discuss terms with the orcs before the battle. He’ll see Galadriel in chains, and he’ll ask for a moment to say goodbye. Adar will allow it because he’s a gent like that. This is where we get the chin touch with the thumb everyone speculated over and then…HE LEANS IN AND KISSES HER TO PUT A NEEDLE IN HER MOUTH? SO SHE CAN RELEASE HERSELF LATER??
To clarify, most of this is my spec, but THE KISS TO PASS HER A NEEDLE IS A REAL LEAKED SPOILER THAT NO LONGER SEEMS FAKE.
It's just…so convoluted and weird??? Does he store needles in his mouth like a squirrel? Why couldn’t he have slipped the needle into her hand??? WHY ARE YOU PUTTING ELROND’S LIPS ON GALADRIEL’S?
And look, maybe this spoiler IS still fake! But the details were so specific, and everything about the context seems to be accurate, so that feels like it would be a bonkers coincidence to me. Maybe when we actually see it play out, it will be fine.
But that does bring me back to the Haladriel of it all, just briefly. With my whole heart, I do not need them to kiss. After season 1, I didn’t think it would be possible, and I’m okay with that. But if you’re willing to let ELROND’S lips touch her, then MY GOD, you could have let Haladriel have ONE kiss where she’s trying to distract him or some shit. OOF.
My only relief is that it happens next week, so we can hopefully get it out of our systems and enjoy the finale.
That said, if these leaks are true then that also means the finale leaks are true. Now, I actually never wanted to see any of these spoilers (hence me making it VERY CLEAR what this post is about, because I wouldn’t inflict this stress on anyone unwillingly), so once I got the Elrond kiss details, I tried to get away without seeing much else. But there was some information on the big Haladriel scene.
I’m actually not going to detail it here, because – overall – I think we’ll still super enjoy it (just…lower those kiss expectations) AND because I don’t think all of it was spoiled. At the end of the day, there will be plenty to unpack, they’ll be back on our screens, it will be meaty, it will be layered. I’m really looking forward to it, in general.
My one fear is that it’s a season 1 finale repeat. And again, that won’t necessarily be bad per se, but it will feel a little bit underwhelming. Now, I’m not somebody that wants a true corruption arc for Galadriel. Normally, I love that shit, but not in this IP and not with this character. I want to see her explore her darkness, I want to see her face it and accept it, and I certainly want to see her be tempted…but I don’t expect or believe we'll ever actually get the whole ‘dark queen of Mordor’ vibe. Prisoner? Maybe. But not an actual dark queen.
That said…surely this scene doesn’t play out the EXACT same way as season 1? Sauron shows her a vision, she’s tempted, but ultimately resists and tells him she’ll never be at his side. I just don’t get why we’d repeat that, when there are so many other options that still keep Gal on the side of light.
I keep coming back to Galadriel’s line to Elrond in episode 4 – when it comes down to it, he has to choose to defeat Sauron and sacrifice her. I feel like if I hadn’t seen the leaks, then I would be 1000% expecting this to be the outcome. Especially with how Elrond’s theme comes in at the end of The Last Temptation track. He comes upon the confrontation but chooses to do the thing that will harm Sauron in the long run, rather than the thing that will save Galadriel.
I hope so badly for this, but I do worry that it will go the other way. What if it parallels Gandalfanger’s destiny/friend choice, and Elrond chooses her because THAT is how light wins or some shit? Not that this will be a bad scene by any stretch – I love their relationship and want to see their FRIENDSHIP (grrrr) reforged…but, again, the S1 finale! Sauron left her in the water, and Elrond was there to save her.
There’s also Galadriel’s conversation with Adar in the most recent episode – you succumbed, I resisted – but I guess this could go either way? He succumbed, so she resists. She insists she’s able to resist, so she succumbs. URGH. MY HEAD.
There MUST be a difference. SURELY??? Like, this season has been so well written…I just can’t comprehend the copy and paste.
Again, this isn’t anything close to a deal breaker for me. I firmly believe the showrunners when they say this relationship will remain the core of the show, but…hmmm. Okay, on that note…
DAMAGE CONTROL – MOVING ONTO THE DEFENCE OF THE SHOW
So, this is where I want to get into some stuff that I just…don’t agree with that I’ve seen being thrown at the show by shippers. And I’ll reiterate here that I’m truly not telling anybody what to feel. You can hate the show for its choices and feel how you feel. You can express yourself in your social media spaces, and if anybody doesn’t like it they can mute/block/unfollow. This chunk isn’t really aimed at you guys.
This is more for other people like me, because I’m cursed to be somebody that generally wants to just…enjoy things for what they are, while also being susceptible to the mood of others. I want to scroll tags and have a good time, rather than see negativity because it lowers my mood (this isn’t just ship related by the way, I really love this show overall…it’s just this tag that has been impacting my mood most this season). Regardless of the nonsense that might be in episode 7, and even if the finale scene is a repeat of S1, I’m still going to want to focus on enjoying what we get, enjoying the narrative being told etc. So, for those of you that have a little sinking feeling in your gut after the first half of this post, hopefully this second half will help.
This isn’t a ‘typical’ ship. This is a true ENEMIES ARE ENEMIES dynamic where the bad boy is ultimately going to be (is already) pure evil, and where our heroine is the embodiment of light. There are certain things that we just have to accept when it comes to loving this dynamic as part of the show – there will never be another season like season 1. Nor should there be?
Do I wish for s3 to have them in close proximity for at least a few episodes? Of course! Do I think it’s possible with or without finale spoilers? Absolutely (given how quickly characters travel from place to place on this show, they could end the season at opposite ends of Middle Earth and this would still be on the cards…). I’m also anticipating Season 4 as a good time for them to be in full MIND PALACE mode – where the rings are all ringing, but Galadriel hasn’t yet worked out how to shut him out yet. By season 5, there might just be one final scene before the final battle. But, again, I really do think there needs to be a little bit of acceptance of that. Or, at least, expectation of it.
Something I really want to push back against is this idea that Haladriel was baited or teased, but the writers don’t actually care for it. Honestly, that’s nonsense to me on a couple of levels.
First of all, almost EVERY dynamic this season has been reduced to a handful of scenes here and there. The most consistent relationships have probably been Annatar and Celebrimbor, and Durin+Durin+Disa (off the top of my head). Elrond and Durin (probably the other most popular dynamic of S1) have been apart all season, Elrond and Galadriel have too. Isildur popped up to say hello and we might not see him again.
When you actually stop and look at this season…Sauron and Galadriel had to be separated. She could not be anywhere near him while he’s working Celebrimbor, and there’s no world in which they were ever going to change that narrative. And yet, the Sauron and Galadriel dynamic has been consistent across the season. With Galadriel predominantly (and depending on how the finale goes, I may have thoughts on this), but it has also been easier with her because people have talked with her openly about Sauron. It’s been harder on his side, but the fact that Mirdania seems to have been cast to look like Galadriel honestly – right now – feels like it was done with the express purpose of giving Sauron a Galadriel reference.
Again, I’m not saying you have to like the lack of scenes, but it’s not bad writing to respect the overarching narrative of an ensemble show. Galadriel’s season has been all about him, and we’ve had countless insights to make that clear – building up to their final confrontation. If Sauron was running around mentioning Galadriel every five seconds with Celebrimbor or with the dwarves, it would be horrendously out of character.
This next comment is…somewhat dependent on the finale…but as somebody that loves Elendil and Miriel, everything in Numenor has been somewhat crammed in. I would firmly argue that the Galadriel/Sauron dynamic across this season has been treated with care and reverence, all building to a climax designed as the high point of the season. Will we be 100% satisfied? Who can say! But it IS what the season is building to.
I think this brings me around to a particular gripe I have, and maybe the people that believe this came to the show after S1 had fully aired or something…but there’s this idea floating around that the showrunners don’t like this dynamic and are just giving it crumbs to bait people into watching. This makes me want to scream.
These showrunners literally took a few lines about Galadriel being tempted by Sauron and PITCHED THE ENTIRE SHOW OFF OF THAT. The Tolkien estate wasn’t only pitched by Amazon BUT CHOSE THIS PITCH OVER ANYTHING ELSE. Season 1 was written pretty much like a prologue centred around GALADRIEL AND SAURON HAVING A PERSONAL CONNECTION WITH ROMANTIC UNDERTONES…and guess what?
They wrote all that…they filmed ALL THAT…before knowing anything about the audience reaction! That was ALL the showrunners, the writers, the directors, the actors. They ARE the narrative. They are not bait.
Does that mean the fundamentals of their dynamic will always please you, individually? No, of course not. Some people want outright romance, some people want soft Sauron, some people want Dark Galadriel. Will they kiss? I doubt it. Do I wish they would? Sure! Will they be separated again next season? Probably! Will I also wish that they could at least be stuck together for a run of episodes again? Absolutely!
But the idea that any of this is bait, or unimportant to the show drives me a little bit bonkers.
I guess my personal feeling of frustration comes from the fact that I feel so lucky they are exploring this show from the perspective of this dynamic, regardless of specific details/scenes. I’d bet my house (I don’t own a house) that every other pitch hinged on Elendil or Isildur as the protagonists of the show. Now, I love those dudes, but just IMAGINE? The fact that we’re on this path at all is still WILD to me.
ANYWAY, this is what happens when Paulina goes on holiday and I have nobody to ramble too. Sorry for the explosion, but I’ve been dreading the stupid kiss spoiler since I stumbled on it after EPISODE BLOODY 3 and so I needed to vent somewhere.
TL;DR: You are welcome to feel the way you feel, and if you hate everything you go right ahead, but maybe this makes sense to somebody. IDK. IDK.
Okay – SO – Paulina is still on holiday, and I’m obviously DYING OVER HERE (Natalie, in case you hadn’t guessed) so TUMBLR. I HAVE RETURNED.
Truly though, I don’t think I’ve done this since S4 of The 100 which probably aired 100 years ago at this point…what has this show done to me…
ANYWAY. My immediate thoughts on Season 2, Episode 6: WHERE IS HE???????
Paulina Voice: All opinions herein have nothing to do with me, so only judge Natalie for them.
Important Note: I have only watched once, in a haze of stress and emotion, so I reserve the right to delete all of this later if I change my mind on any of it.
Arondir – Hello! Nice to see you! Glad you’re joining us for the battle!
I did like the detail of confirming that not all the orcs are on board with Adar’s war, but I was mostly laughing that ‘running through the trees’ is how the show has reminded us a character exists for two weeks in a row.
Rhun – I think this was the first episode where I was like GO AWAY, RHUN, NOT NOW. Though, I want to stress that I am super excited to see the conclusion of this, probably in episode 8. The Dark Wizard, the Gaudrim, the fate of the Stoors (honestly, I’m assuming they’re all going to be massacred tbh…which…the optics…but we’ll worry about that later…). In today’s episode, it just felt a bit like ‘hey, these characters still exist.’
I did love the little snippet of Tom and the Stranger, though I felt like it could have just been included in their previous scenes. He is 1000% Gandalf, and I stand by my opinion that this isn’t supposed to be a twist or a surprise. It’s just the narrative telling the story. Destiny or friend is super intriguing to me. It’s very Luke and Yoda from Empire, but I do wonder if his destiny IS to choose his friend…and in so doing, THAT is how he finds his staff…
Nori talking with the Gund was very sweet, and her willingness to give herself up to protect everyone was super in character. Poppy and Merimac were cute (I pray to all the gods that THIS was the kiss Morfydd teased but I doubt it very much…), and Poppy wanting to fight for the Stranger made me pretty emotional. However, I have some bad news…
Guys…I think I’m adding Poppy to DEATH WATCH. And I HATE IT. BUT I CAN’T UNTHINK IT.
Moving on…
Numenor – This continues to be the choppiest of storylines this season, but I do think the broad elements are super on point. And, actually, where we end up makes the Eagle sequence make more sense in retrospect. Pharazon didn’t have things locked down, Miriel is very much still a player on the board, and Mr. Eyebrows is THE BIGGEST HYPOCRIT.
Then again, if you told me I’d see Halbrand in the Palantir I’d probably touch it too…
Ahem. Loved that detail by the way! Part of the reason I felt like Halbrand would be his Numenor form was the small scene he shared with Pharazon back in S1, while Galadriel was taking out the guards. A connection was formed then – perhaps his eyes even bored a hole – and if Halbrand rocks up as an enemy of the elves, that’ll only make him more appealing.
Everything with Miriel and Elendil was absolutely stunning. He was willing to give his life for her, she was willing to give hers for his. WHAT ABOUT MY HEART. Honestly, from the way Owen and Cynthia talked about this season, I felt like they weren’t going to get anything at all romance coded. But I’m just starting to think people in TV only see active kissing as romance, because HELLO?? THAT’S THE SCRIPT????? THAT IS ABSOLUTELY ROMANCE????
I’m very excited to watch the sequence with the sea worm again, and to really let it wash over me (heh), because I was starting to get time anxious at that point in the episode (my brain starts panicking ‘don’t end, don’t end.’ Honestly, my brain SUCKS). But it was incredible, the implications were wonderful, Elendil’s relief was beautiful, and so was Pharazon’s rage. Also, the whole sequence was UTTERLY STUNNING, WOW.
Note for the show overall, or maybe just for myself, though – PLEASE stop spoiling so much of the season through promotional material. My biggest gripe with this episode is that I felt like I’d already seen/put together 90% of it.
Anyway, I’ve left Earien until last because this was a MUCH better episode for her (though, not letting her have any reaction to Valandil’s death was CRIMINAL). To the point that I’m now reforging (heh) my thoughts on last week – who directed her to have such bratty energy last week? Weird.
Anyway, we saw much more of her conflict and fluidity in this episode. She isn’t Faithful, she believes the new order is the way to go, but she’s also struggling massively with it. Her desperate hug with her father broke my heart, I had instant tears in my eyes, but then I also cheered when she brought Miriel in! What a great surprise that was! I’m REALLY interested to see where she goes from here…I’m assuming in the finale? I was sure she was locked onto a super dark path, but she witnessed Miriel survive the Valar’s judgement…will that sway her back around?
I’m going to finish this section with something that’s maybe a bit controversial…Elendil sucks as Earien’s father!!! Now, I’m willing to put this on pacing/editing issues, because I don’t think the show really wants us to feel this way. But good god, man. HAVE A CONVERSATION WITH YOUR DAUGHTER. I really enjoyed their cell scene, but sweet lord baby jesus, these two needed a deep conversation in episode 3. Watching him turn to go when Miriel walked in, and just forget Earien was even there hurt me man…even though I enjoy the Miriel aspect VERY much…
Like, I know you’re mad at her, but you’re all she’s got left…and your pride might mean she watches you die…can you be a little kinder to her???
Dwarves being dwarves, AKA perfect – Flawless. No notes.
The initial sequence with the Durin’s and Annatar was PERFECT. Annatar being rejected (that Balrog glimpse was SO EVIL), and Baby Durin’s flicker of hope. But then the reveal that Daddy Durin is deep in the shit because he’s really just being greedy. My gooooodnesssssss. The show has done SUCH A GOOD JOB setting this up, because we know Daddy Durin isn’t this way! We feel Baby Durin’s pain!
Then Daddy Durin has his IT’S MINE moment with the ring and swats his son away. Anguish. And the anguish only anguished harder when we cut to Durin and Disa. Disa talking about her love for her father-in-law, and her own father, and then DURIN’S TEARS. UGH. UGH. UGH. I was weeping, honestly.
I feel like Durin being suss of the rings this early on is a pretty big change (don’t quote me on this) but I’m for it. Watching Disa turn back Narvi and the others (poor Narvi) was beautiful and then that I LOVE YOU. UGH. UGH. UGH. PERFECT, I SAY.
I doubt Disa has anymore bats to summon, though, so IDK how the heck they stop what’s coming next. Is Durin going to get drawn away by his desire to help Elrond, leaving Disa alone and vulnerable?
I REFUSE TO PUT DISA ON DEATH WATCH, SHOW. I REFUSE. DON’T YOU DARE.
Adar and Galadriel – I wish we’d gotten more, especially because they released a clip yesterday that I obviously couldn’t resist watching, but what we got was JUICY.
I felt that Adar knew Halbrand was Sauron back in the premiere, or at least suspected it. Getting that confirmation paints their scene with the talk of the wine, the tears, and the kneeling in such a different light. TASTY.
I’ve seen people question this, because why did Adar not try and kill him there and then? To my mind, that’s pretty straightforward. He killed him once and it didn’t stick. And last time he had the element of surprise. He knows that Sauron is powerful enough to get out of his chains/to not get caught by orcs, which means he’s here for a reason. If Adar tries to kill him, best case scenario Sauron is off the board for another few centuries, but he’ll likely take down some orcs with him on the way out. And for what? For him to just come back again?
I think Adar decided to play the long game. I think talk of Eregion and Galadriel let him know that something more was going on, and he was biding his time to act.
So, Sauron promised Adar children. Honestly, the Adar/Sauron/Galadriel dynamic that played across this episode was the stuff of my dreams. Adar is holding his own relationship with the fella up against hers, and there’s so much subtext for both dynamics. Was there romance between both? Was it solely manipulation for both? Is Adar what Galadriel might become if she succumbs?
Galadriel definitely wasn’t being entirely truthful with Adar when she mentioned that Sauron promised an army, because that was more what she thought she could get out of Halbrand. And yes, sure, Sauron might have nudged her that way. But Sauron’s true offer came later on the raft, after the army had been delivered. Adar even acknowledges that she’s not being truthful, that she needs to let go of her pride. I feel like we’ll see that play out over the last two episodes for sure…
The line that really stuck with me from a Hal&Gal perspective was Galadriel finishing Adar’s line about the world with Sauron being full of colour, and without him it’s a dull grey. It fits with how Galadriel has come across to me this season. Since Elrond shut her out, she hadn’t had anybody to open up to, and she’s certainly not being fully honest with herself yet. That dull grey speaks to how she’s mostly been…quite contained? The only moments where she’s truly come alive were with Nenya, and when she was fighting.
Later in the episode, she DOES put aside her pride. She calls Adar Uruk!!! She opens up and sees the possibility of an alliance. And I think this goes back to Sauron too. She’s had a taste of darkness and the temptation of it, she knows she’s not secure from succumbing, and so her perspective of Adar – who was once an elf – has massively shifted. However, when he asks if he and his children will be able to return to their home…we all know the answer to that.
I actually never stopped to consider that Adar would be the one manipulating/tricking Galadriel, which is silly in retrospect. Because this much better explains how she ends up in a cage facing the elves (sorry guys, I don’t think she’s bait for Sauron…she’s facing the wrong way…). I’m looking forward to watching this bit again, as I feel it was a bit rushed on first watch. I would have liked to see these two chat for a good two scenes more, honestly.
Adar is falling into the trap, which is pretty devastating, and Galadriel is the one seeing through it. Honestly, I really don’t know how things roll out in the finale. I flip from it making no sense for it to be a S1 rehash, to being sure she’ll defiantly resist, to being sure the show is setting her up to not be able to. I JUST DON’T KNOW. I wish I’d never seen those stupid leak spoilers…the promo makes me think they are real, but then we MUST be missing full context.
Adar is still on DEATH WATCH but like…a little bit less than before, honestly? Mostly because I don’t see how we have time to get ALL the confrontations into the last two episodes. When Adar goes out – and he will – he deserves the biggest death.
Random aside: I am pondering sharing something of a Haladriel ramble/rant but I’m also like…IDK if I want the hassle, so we’ll see.
Celebrimbor and Annatar
Oh, Brimby. My heart aches. The sequence with him forgetting Mirdania’s name was so heartbreaking and watching Annatar isolate him so completely was chilling. First, by taking away the other smiths, then with the illusion.
I actually don’t think I have a lot to say on this section, because it’s been rumbling along all season and we’re just about to reach the climax. Sauron is Sauron’ing his hardest in this episode.
I am now quite convinced that Mirdania is not Celebrian (I already didn’t really believe it, but it’s firmer now) and I do think she’ll die. I think she’ll either be killed by Sauron himself, or she’ll be caught in the crossfire of the siege, and as she dies she’ll make eye contact with him and he’ll just coldly leave her. I feel like there has to be some sort of climax to the whole…you look like Galadriel thing, but I’m not really sure what that could be?? I don’t think there’s going to be a lot of time next episode, so maybe that really was a one and done so the viewer understood he’s thinking about her…
Celebrimbor trying to snap on Annatar, and that flash of true rage in Annatar’s face…oh god, next week is going to be soul destroying. I honestly can’t wait and dread it at the same time. Celebrimbor has fought so hard but then comes the illusion, then comes the lure – more talk of the Valar, of his work, of Feanor and the Silmarils. CELEBRIMBOR. GET OUT, PLEASE. GET OUT.
Sauron was then absolutely buzzing at the end there, as war came, and I wonder if there are more twists to come or if things play out fairly straightforward from here. We know the elves will charge the orcs. Does that happen straight away? Is there any communication? Because it’s complicated, isn’t it? On one hand, let Adar and the orcs try to take our Sauron…but then, you know innocents are being killed. You have to save them, surely?
And that’s that, I think? PHEW.
I must say, it’s harder to get through this season being in fandom because I KNOW SO MUCH MORE and I WANT SO MUCH MORE and people STRESS ME OUT. But, at the same time, it feels nice to love something this hard again?
Let’s get episode 7 and [redacted] out of the way fast, though, yeah?
gonna be bold and burst a couple bubbles and say this: Sauron isn't *in love* with Galadriel... he's just unheathily obsessed with her like Morgoth was obsessed with the Silmarils... because they were literally inspired by Galadriel's hair....
Honestly I think most shippers understand that, except maybe for those who see Sauron with pink tainted glasses. Shipping is all fun, and even I will often joke that he's "in loooove", but it's just the simplest way to describe what I see him express. A verbal shortcut, if you want.
Sauron is not human, he doesn't feel things the way humans do. Being "in love" is probably not something he can be, and he's way too deep into darkness to love someone in a way that isn't entirely selfish anyway.
I disagree he doesn't have any feeling close to love to Galadriel though : they have a strong cosmic connection, they bonded when he was still Halbrand and he felt things for her he never felt for anybody else. Same for Galadriel. It's not only the shippers that say that, but the actors and the writers as well. He deceived her because he was in disguise when he expressed these feelings, but they were nonetheless genuine feelings.
That said, if he 'loves' Galadriel, it's indeed in an obsessive way, and it's entirely selfish : he doesn't want what's good her, only what's good for him. If she had agreed to become his queen, he would have tried to make her his slave as well. It's definitely not healthy, and it's not supposed to end with a happy ending !
Do I eat that shit up anyway?
Guilty as charged. We won't see Sauron crippled with doubts, and he has no chance to be redeemed, which is very fine by me because I'm honestly fed up of these stories with tortured villains "who are not that bad", who get "fixed by a girl" but drop dead at the end anyway because "he's done too much evil to live". Give me a remorseless, ruthless, manipulative Sauron who keeps getting worse, thank you very much.
Surprise! It turns out that a combination of an incredible episode and the two of us (sort of) having a free morning means...podcast time (small note: we did have some issues with Paulina's audio, but we think we fixed it up well enough)!
Episode 5 of season 2 was incredible, and we simply couldn't resist hopping on to give our quick thoughts. Unsurprisingly, those thoughts weren't actually quick...
We kick off with our overall emotions (00:01:00) then head over to Numenor (00:05:00) where we say goodbye AGAINST OUR WILL (00:25:00). We swing back to the Durins and Disa (00:37:00) for a sample of dread before devouring an entire meal of it with Celebrimbor + Annatar (00:49:00). After we talk Silvergifting, we of course have a Haladriel meltdown and Natalie goes on a passionate rant defending 'dark ships' (01:02:00) before we consider Mirdania's role in the narrative (01:17:00). And then we wrap up with a few bits and bobs (01.25.00) before we sink back into a meditative state.
WAKE US UP WHEN EPISODE SIX IS HERE.
(Also, this is Natalie here briefly taking over social media duties because Pau is sunning it up on holiday, so forgive me if I do this ALL WRONG it has been 500 years since I posted on tumblr...)
Popping in quick to let y’all know new episode of our podcast premieres TOMORROW (that is Wednesday) at noon GMT! 🎉
Nat did her magic but if you hear a bit of crackling of audio, please excuse. We were having minor technical difficulties that should not occur again. It is not very noticeable if you’re not looking for it. 😅
Like we said in announcement post previously, we did brief thoughts (without notes! so it’s a lot of vibing 😂) on the first four (still can’t believe we are halfway through, whaaat) episodes of season 2. The idea was to be brief but some sections were longer than anticipated. No idea why we thought we could ever be brief.
We promise to give you long-winded gushing and dissecting in REFORGED episodes that will start coming once the season is done.
As always, we appreciate your love and sharing of the podcast to all RoP enthusiasts. ❤️
Coming to you fresh from recording to say we HAD SO MUCH FUN and talked for longer than planned, ahaha.
Terrific to be back, even if our schedule will be irregular.
Yes, the ep will probably be up sometime next week, fingers crossed. Next one we’ll be sitting down for will be post season finale so we’re looking at more than a month away.
Keep in mind, we’ll be releasing deep dive REFORGED episodes later, once the season is fully out and we have time to do it.
Please share the podcast to everyone who may be interested. ❤️🔥💍
