#bastardry

[shit-enmu-says]

Nice train you’ve got there. It would be a terrible misfortune if someone were to steal it

[horizon-verizon]

Before HOTD, I never knew people could dehumanize children born out of wedlock to such extend, with their absolutely excessive, obsessional and vitriolic hatred. They rarely even let anyone compliment Jace, Luke, or Joffrey without telling people they’re bastards, as if that nullifies their good traits. It’s almost like they don’t see them as normal human beings who deserve to live and have the same opportunities others do. It’s genuinely frightening to see them espousing such views and sentiments; and they don’t spring out of nowhere, either. 

Therefore, I think it goes beyond merely looking at the story through a medieval lens. I even remarked upon it myself, that it sure seemed to me like there was a very high probability that such fanatical disgust could bleed over into their real world views of, say.... children born out of wedlock, children of adoption, women who have children with different men, and so on. Yes, it’s a fictional world but when people are that much passionate about conservative values, it just feels disturbing.

I am sure, too, some try to use the "it's a fictional world" thing to justify it. Problem is, if you have that much of an issue with fictional bastards having any sort of "undeserving" privilege or just safety so much that you can't even acknowledge GRRM is not trying to subject illegitimate people to the same fates or conditions of degradation you're trying to justify, then you're probably just projecting your own "values" about who deserves what. The text doesn't support your ideas upon not-so-past deep inspection and when you recognize it writes these things as tragic instead of "neutrally" and cynically deserved.

When I say that Jaehaerys and Alysanne loved each other, I am saying so bc the TEXT clearly and unambiguously shows me that. Despite me knowing they are siblings. That's not me saying royals or anyone SHOULD be with their siblings in real life nor me ever encountering siblings/incestuous couplings (TikTok is a wild place) in real life and thinking that is cute. Those people want to reinforce what is already present in them, justify how they think safely under the guise of "it's fiction, bro", bc incest itself as a phenomenon is not a principle. But believing that illegitimate people shouldn't be treated as human and have rights definitely is a political and (a)moral idea specifically meant to uphold conservative, patriarchal structures.

[minervacasterly]

The ambiguity of Bastardry

Monarchy is by definition a family affair. The principle of heredity prevents conflict in the selection process. Illegitimacy confuses this event and causes uncertainty as occurred in the case of Edward V disqualified by his uncle Richard III.

Monarchs and their families are governed by the same laws of physics and biology as everyone else, but what sets them apart is the notice taken of what they do and what they might do next. This intense and prolonged scrutiny can be clouded by the human desire to be ‘in the know’ and not to be thought unaware of what is happening. For this reason royal gossip and speculation has always been magnified compared to other gossip. In the distant past bastard children were acknowledged and promoted as an extension of royal power.

Queen Victoria, influenced by Prince Albert was determined to change this attitude, leading, some would say, to a more hypocritical age.

It is easy to disapprove of the reckless way that Charles II shamed his barren wife by producing so many illegitimate children by so many different mothers. However it is difficult to regret it if you discover, as I did, that you are descended from several of them!

It was George III, who against all advice, insisted on the passing of the Royal Marriage Act, to give him greater control of his dynasty, and its potential for marriages of foreign policy advantage. He created the successions crisis of 1817, when Princess Charlotte died and in spite of having 14 children there was no eligible grand child to take the throne, for all his male children had chosen brides for themselves and married morganatically. The Duke of Kent rose to the challenge and produced Queen Victoria in time to solve the problem.

Bastard has come to be a term of abuse, as if anyone, who suffered the uncertainties of illegitimacy, was bound to have warped their morals and behaviour. Peter Beauclerk-Dewar and Roger S. Powell have covered five centuries of alleged bastards, including those acknowledged by the father, as well as those merely speculated, and tried to examine the claims and counter claims dispassionately. Some were ignored by their putative fathers, others supported openly or discretely. If all of them were touched by a sense of importance and destiny, I would like to believe it would encourage them to feel that they should contribute to the nation’s good rather than claim its benefits for themselves.

~ Foreword by HRH The Duke of Gloucester from Royal Bastards: Illegitimate Children of the British Royal Family by Peter Beauclerk-Dewar and Roger Powell

[shmegmilton]

According to Wikipedia Burr had another kid called Sydney Owens Burr and there's literally no information on him and I wondered if you could supply any more information.

Aaron Burr & Child Legitimacy: Where Did All These Kids Come From?

Oh, man—you sent me down a rabbit hole, Anon!

I will say that, as often as I check Burr’s Wiki page, unless my eyesight is worse than I thought, I don’t believe this name was there the last time I checked—so this could be new information. Possibly.

I found one Sydney Burr connected to the Connecticut branch of his family on Ancestry.com (born the same year as Theo, funny enough!) which is also verified in the [Burr Genealogy by Charles Burr Todd], But that’s the extent of it.

There are several Sydney in the book, but none of them are a Sydney Owens or seem connected to Aaron Burr at all.

Since I can’t find any follow up information/records, my researcher’s brain would normally tell you to be skeptical about it, but in Burr’s case, this is actually kind of normal that we don’t know a lot. Another child that I haven’t been able to find much info on is Henry Oscar Taylor. He is mentioned in Margaret Oppenheimer’s book about Eliza Jumel (The Remarkable Rise of Eliza Jumel) as living with Burr around May 1833 (when he was about 15) as his ward and ‘probably another illegitimate child.’ Though, she does say ‘probably,’ so this may not be a child of his, it could be another of his proteges: (as you see below, there’s a citation attached to it, but I haven’t had the chance to follow up on it yet.)

This boy is mentioned in [Aaron Burr’s Will] specifically names him as an inheritor of several of Burr’s things, strangely enough, he was a signed legal witness for the will—some times signed as Henry Oscar Taylor, sometimes as H. O. Taylor. Other than that, there’s no information that I can currently find—but, like I said, that’s normal for Burr, and for the time period. The fact is that Burr had so many illegitimate kids and he, being the lifelong feminist that he was, knew that a woman having a child out-of-wedlock would essentially ruin her reputation—so he was intentionally very secretive of who he slept with or where a child came from.

As funny as I think it is to tell people that Burr was still sexually active at 77 (he also claims two daughters born in ’27 & ’33 in his will), I’ve realize recently that probably wasn’t the case. We know for a fact that, at least some of the children, were not biologically, nor did he go out of his way to adopt them. There’s a quote of his that gets referenced a lot, but for added context:

Part of Burr’s reputation for profligacy was due, no doubt, to that vanity respecting women of which Davis himself speaks. He never refused to accept the parentage of a child.

“Why do you allow this woman to saddle you with her child when you KNOW you are not the father of it?” said a friend to him a few months before his death.

“Sir,” he replied, “when a lady does me the honor to name me the father of her child I trust I shall always be too gallant to show myself ungrateful for the favor.”

Since having a child out-of-wedlock was quite literally illegal (see: Bastardy Laws), oftentimes the women (if she was accused) would be encouraged to name the father so it could be determined who’d take care of the child—so this is what I believe he is referencing. Hypothetically: Burr is summoned to the court after being named the father of a woman’s child and, rather than dispute it (the man was one of the best lawyers in NY—he could have if he wanted to) he said: “yes, of course! It was me! I will care for the child.” Most likely regardless if he knew the women or not. Burr being, well, Burr, it was probably pretty easy for people to believe it anyway.

I imagine it was also to protect the children, because bastardy was not only literally illegal, the term illegitimate child comes from the fact that they were “illegitimate” to society. This is why it’s played up so much in Hamilton and stuff like Game of Thrones—you had no right to family inheritance because in the eyes of the law you literally did not exist, and it reflected back on you because family lineage is everything and your existence proves that your parents were ‘sinful’ and ‘unsavory’ and yada yada. Also, since you didn’t exist, you could literally be abandoned on the spot if your parents chose. He most likely wanted to pay extra close attention to the children to ensure that they could at least get an education and were safe & cared for.

---

This was probably not the answer you were looking for (it feels more like a tangent on my part, sorry) but, TL;DR, I didn’t find any information on my initial search (ie. everything that wasn’t behind a paywall), but I’ll keep the name in mind for my future research.

[jonsnowloversunite]

Jon Snow’s Bastard Complex

The trauma can be traced back to Jon’s childhood. In what is commonly known as a flashback, painful, suppressed memories surface from the unconscious.

He was almost ready to lower his blade and call a halt when Emmett feinted low and came in over his shield with a savage forehand slash that caught Jon on the temple. He staggered, his helm and head both ringing from the force of the blow. For half a heartbeat the world beyond his eyeslit was a blur.

And then the years were gone, and he was back at Winterfell once more, wearing a quilted leather coat in place of mail and plate. His sword was made of wood, and it was Robb who stood facing him, not Iron Emmett.

Every morning they had trained together, since they were big enough to walk; Snow and Stark, spinning and slashing about the wards of Winterfell, shouting and laughing, sometimes crying when there was no one else to see. They were not little boys when they fought, but knights and mighty heroes. "I'm Prince Aemon the Dragonknight," Jon would call out, and Robb would shout back, "Well, I'm Florian the Fool." Or Robb would say, "I'm the Young Dragon," and Jon would reply, "I'm Ser Ryam Redwyne." That morning he called it first. "I'm Lord of Winterfell!" he cried, as he had a hundred times before. Only this time, this time, Robb had answered, "You can't be Lord of Winterfell, you're bastard-born. My lady mother says you can't ever be the Lord of Winterfell.”

I thought I had forgotten that. Jon could taste blood in his mouth, from the blow he'd taken.

In the end Halder and Horse had to pull him away from Iron Emmett, one man on either arm. The ranger sat on the ground dazed, his shield half in splinters, the visor of his helm knocked askew, and his sword six yards away. "Jon, enough," Halder was shouting, "he's down, you disarmed him. Enough!" (ASOS, Jon XII)

The social stigma of being a bastard was an emotionally traumatic experience for him and caused a splintering of his psyche. He had spent his entire life suppressing his desire for Winterfell because it was viewed as not only unattainable, but also unacceptable. The complex is readily personified through dreams as the psyche’s attempt at integration.

The castle is always empty. Even the ravens are gone from the rookery, and the stables are full of bones. That always scares me. I start to run then, throwing open doors, climbing the tower three steps at a time, screaming for someone, for anyone. And then I find myself in front of the door to the crypts. It's black inside, and I can see the steps spiraling down. Somehow I know I have to go down there, but I don't want to. I'm afraid of what might be waiting for me. The old Kings of Winter are down there, sitting on their thrones with stone wolves at their feet and iron swords across their laps, but it's not them I'm afraid of. I scream that I'm not a Stark, that this isn't my place, but it's no good, I have to go anyway, so I start down, feeling the walls as I descend, with no torch to light the way. It gets darker and darker, until I want to scream. That's when I always wake."

The fracture of Jon’s psyche is maintained through fear and resistance. By not accepting that his feelings are valid, this piece of him remains underdeveloped, thus becoming shadow material.

He wanted it, Jon knew then. He wanted it as much as he had ever wanted anything. I have always wanted it, he thought, guiltily. May the gods forgive me. It was a hunger inside him, sharp as a dragonglass blade. A hunger . . . he could feel it. It was food he needed, prey, a red deer that stank of fear or a great elk proud and defiant. He needed to kill and fill his belly with fresh meat and hot dark blood. His mouth began to water with the thought. (ASOS, Jon XII)

Even when presented with the opportunity to be legitimized and awarded Winterfell, Jon refuses, saying that he doesn’t want to take away Sansa’s claim. But I think it goes much deeper than that as he is operating out of a place of trauma rooted in a classist society.

[feralaloe]

Peaked bastardcore last night by getting horrendously drunk, chainsmoking and listening to Creep by Radio head on repeat last night in my concrete garden wearing nothing but my red silk kimono

[5499h]

i wanna be the kinda person that u lose at the Big Stores with the too many Florescent Lights (the like, 1 big ass room divvied up by bunch of aisles kind) and you think “where did the bastard go”

[andthentheywilleatthestars]

You can be soft and also a bastard